Crasnick: Cubs Make Offer To Lugo

A rumor from yesterday that I neglected to mention: ESPN's Jerry Crasnick reported that the Cubs have made Julio Lugo a multi-year offer.

We all know how Lou Piniella loves Lugo, and that he'd be willing to play center field now that the market for shortstops is shrinking.  Today's Chicago newspapers - the Tribune, Sun-Times, Daily Herald, and Southtown - made no mention of an offer to Lugo.

Comments

[pinetarhand]

Please tell me this wouldn't mean that Murton would be relegated to the bench.

[RotoAuthority]

Maybe they'd trade him or Jacque.

[pinetarhand]

I hope it's Jones. I know he produced last year, but he doesn't help that OBP problem we have. You predict much out of Murton in a full-time gig next year?

[integr96]

any thoughts on the cubs picking up lugo and then deciding during spring training that pie is ready to play center field which means that the cubs could then move izturis or lugo??

[pinetarhand]

The Cubs can't move Izturis thinking that Lugo's going to take his spot at SS. His defense is awful. He's got 65 errors there in the past 2 1/2 years. Everything I've heard has said that Pie's not ready yet. He'll only be 22 at the start of the next season so there's no rush. We don't want him to come in & be another Milledge after all.

[bcaine]

If the Cubs were to sign Lugo the idea is to have him play center, if Pie is ready by then which I highly doubt then they would move Lugo to short and trade Izturis hopefully for some more pitching. I agree they should get rid of Joke Jones and move Murton to right.

[bcaine]

Felix Pie reminds me of Corey Ptterson. They both have a lot of talent but can they produce big numbers in the majors? As a Cubs spring training season ticket holder , and living in Mesa, Ive seen plenty of Pie. He has some major speed but he also strikes out way too much, sound familiar? I know hes still young, but he hasnt even played one year at triple A . I think he'll be ready by 08.

[mrcoach00]

If Lugo is signed, Jones will be sure to stay and Murton will only get Jones' at-bats versus lefties.
Everyone seems to forget how right-hand dominated this line-up is turning out to be. Jones and Izturis are the only ones that can bat from the left side. I'm not a big fan of either player, but every line-up should have a little variety, and they are it.

[DunkinDonuts]

I wasn't enamored of Lugo for the Red Sox until the Cubs bid on him. Now I want him.

[pinetarhand]

Double D, you sound like a high school drama queen. You can have Lugo. If the Cubs are looking for a 1 year CF until Pie is ready, they're better off signing someone like Roberts for CF. Better OBP. Much better CS%. His defense isn't great, but who knows how Lugo will be in CF. Only downfall is that you have to have a decent player to give Roberts a good rest every once in a while. I'm not sure if the Cubs have that.

[nickjs21]

I absolutely agree with the Corey Patterson comparison. Another reason not to rush Pie.

[cubsfan1654]

AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI TB BB SO SB CS OBP SLG AVG
595 89 180 25 5 20 76 275 61 84 7 3 .370 .462 .303

That's Matt Murton, how could u not play this guy over Lugo or Jones, hes going to be awesome and is no doubt the 2nd best outfielder we have even with Lugo, i would hope the outfield would be Murton Lugo Soriano, and trade Jones for pitching, or even play Murton Soriano Jones, and have Lugo at short at get rid of the POS Izturis

[pinetarhand]

cubsfan1654, do you remember Cedeno at SS last year? All of those errors? That is the same defence you'll get from Lugo. Just say no to Lugo at SS, or in CF, or as a Cub period. The more I look at him, the less I like him for the 3 or 4 yr at $8 - $10 per year. His .765 OPS from 2005 (not sure what his combined 2006 OPS was) was barely above league average for last year at CF. Izturis may be a POS in the mold of Neife Perez, but he's at least a POS that can play defense.

[integr96]

if the cubs are looking to put soriano in right and matt murton would still be the preferable option for left, then what about moving jones and trying to go after carl crawford to play center. that way you dont lose your left handed bat at all. from the looks of their depth chart, the devil rays are definite need of starting pitching. trade marmol or guzman along with marshall. then you could always move crawford back to left whenever it is that pie will be ready. thoughts?

[cubsfan1654]

u know what im sorta agreeing with u, besides lee, we have an awful defensive club, so i guess if having a .260 #8 hitter is the sacrifice of having a GG short stop so good points, i honestly have not watched lugo at all so i was just going by izzy stats vs lugo stats, but if he really is cedeno like def at short then ill pass, honestly i wouldnt count on a first year outfielder to be our ground covering guy in the outfield so good points all around, id rather see pie out there. but since i dont want to repeat corey i hope they wait til pie is ready, and personally unless they can get Wells, i say stick with JJ as our CF, and dont even think about manny, think about our outfield with 3 LFrs, ouch. Murton Sori Man Ram would be a disaster.

[pinetarhand]

No way in hell Tampa Bay would accept that. They've already said that the first thing they would want for Crawford would be a ML ready frontline SP, then they'd want 2 more top notch prospects to back that SP up. So, basically, they'd want Hill, Pie, & Gallager/Veal because other than Hill, the Cubs don't have any frontline SP that are ML ready. Maybe they'd let Baldelli go cheaper, but I don't know about that.

[cubsfan1654]

Integr sure id love Crawford but that would end up blocking murton or pie, and id like to see Pie Murton Sori patrolling the outfield for many many years

[nrmax88]

Not if u had crawford you wouldnt.

[integr96]

but dont you think that the cubs could work something out considering the d rays already have 4 quality outfielders. i.e. you wouldnt have to give up pie. and someone in the d rays outfield has to move at some point. theres no point in having 4 really good outfielders when you can only play 3. and pinella was the manager down there so he could pressure hendry into doing something.

[sudansensation]

I really hope they dont get lugo. hes a great player, but there is no need for him. Use this money on pitching

[nrmax88]

What money, I thought the cubs had an unlimited supply of money. You mean they are actually on a budget spending all this money, I thought they just had trillions to do with as they pleased. If they keep spending like this, I would like to see how they go about addressing their need after 07 with a 150million dollar plus payroll. What is it up to now about 120?

[pinetarhand]

Actually, they're somewhere between $90 - $100 right now. Getting Maddux & Wood off the books after last year did give the Cubs a whole lot of money to play with anyways. Then they said they're going to up the payroll to the $120 - $130 range so there is plenty to go around still for 2 FA pitchers & whatever it takes to round out the roster.

[pinetarhand]

All the same, it would be a shame to waste some of that money on Lugo.

[cubsfan1654]

Nrmax i guess ur right id love Pie Murton Sori, but id also love Crawford, Sori, Murton/Pie, so despite the fact that i have thought u were a bit annoying in another thread about how bad u thought the cubs are (which they actually arent), that is a good point. nice NRMAX - 1 point

[pinetarhand]

cubsfan1654, what you did just there was much more annoying that anything nrmaxx has done so far. Plus, nrmaxx never made any kind of point about getting Crawford. Crawford is actually amazingly cheap & signed through 2010.

[nrmax88]

I really dont think the cubs are horrible. I think their expectations from a fans point of view, are unrealistically high. This team just had soooooo many problems and holes in 06. I understand that they are getting guys back, but this kind of process usually takes more then 1 off season. When i start to get attacked by like 10 cub fans, then i just say things to annoy people, because it amuses me. I think the cubs can be a legit, serious contender come 08. Pinetar my point was that cubsfan said he would love an OF of Pie Murton and SOri, my point was that he wouldnt love it as much if the cubbies all the sudden land Carl crawford

[greenbaydude1232]

pinetarhand-

The cubs front office has not come out with any difintive payroll for 2007. The 120 mm - 130 mm were just estimates made by bloggers like rotoauthority. They are probably actually a little over 100 million right now. They were at about 90 after the ramirez signing and they then signed derosa for 4 mm and soriano for 9 mm so that puts them a little over 100 million. The sign lugo and they are at about 110 mm so that still leaves 10-20 mm (guesstimated) to get 2 good starters. I would hope schmidt (for 13 or 14 and another for 7 or 8)

[kbrooks2LA]

All NL teams beware of Lugo.

He was a quality AL player, but he really struggled after moving from TB to LA.

In time, once his knowlege of NL pitchers increases, he should be able to adjust...but the Dodgers waited about 81 games and it never happened

[pinetarhand]

I actually missed that post up there. Oops. Geez, now I'm annoying. Crawford is better than Murton or Pie will be. So, yeah, that'd be great, but improbable.

[pinetarhand]

How did the Ramirez signing put them at $90? I looked at Cot's baseball contracts to get the numbers I got. I also added in Sori's signing bonus & $10 for Big Z (hard to tell what he'll get). It was a rough estimate, but they were definitely not over $90 with Ramirez.

[pinetarhand]

C - Michael Barrett - $3MM
C - Henry Blanco - $1.8MM
1B - Derrek Lee - $13MM
2B - Mark DeRosa - $4.33MM
SS - Cesar Izturis - $4.15MM
3B - Aramis Ramirez - $13MM
IF - Ryan Theriot - $0.38MM
LF - Matt Murton - $0.38MM
CF - Alfonso Soriano - $17MM
RF - Jacque Jones - $4MM
OF - Angel Pagan - $0.38MM

SP - Carlos Zambrano - $6.5MM
SP -
SP - Rich Hill - $0.38MM
SP -
SP - Wade Miller - $1.5MM
SP - Mark Prior - $3.65MM
SP - Sean Marshall - $0.38MM

RP - Ryan Dempster - $5MM
RP - Bob Howry - $4MM
RP - Scott Eyre - $3.5MM
RP - Will Ohman - $0.61MM
RP - Mike Wuertz - $0.38MM
RP - Kerry Wood - $1.75MM
RP - Roberto Novova - $0.38MM

Buyouts:

RP - Kerry Wood - $3MM

Injured players:

RP - Glendon Rusch - $3.25MM

Puts them at $91.7MM. Roto guessed about $6MM in raises so that'll put them at $97.7MM right now & that's only if you add in signing bonuses to the first year contract. If not, then it goes down to $84.7MM. So they have anywhere from $23MM to $35MM left depending on a $120MM or $130MM payroll & if the bonuses count. $23MM will be just enough to sign 2 FA SP's & fill out the roster while $35 will get us much more. Either way, I'll stick to my guns & say Lugo's not worth any of that money.

[greenbaydude1232]

There were additional raises not noted by cotts that were noted in the writeup on mlbtraderumors and in other posts ive seen.

[greenbaydude1232]

Maybe I'm wrong but thats just what i remember. You could very likely be right in which case all the better for the cubs!

[greenbaydude1232]

The reason I think that we should trade jones or murton is because they will be key trade bait in order to get a guy like westbrook or lee or jennings, who are all on the block. Eyre + Murton may be able to get either of the indians pitchers.

[pinetarhand]

I actually forgot Cotts, but he only made $.4MM last year.

[tinathemetsgrl]

So bascially, the Cubs want everyone? Sory, Schmidt, now Lugo. I would think Lugo would be a better fit with the Red Sox, but I'm sure the Cubbie bears will overpay and get JL.

[cubsfan1654]

lol pine max actually did say that about Crawford, and id love to have him, but realistically, not gonna happen

[nickjs21]

Speaking from Cleveland, I would absolutely give you Westbrook for Eyre/Murton. Cotts/Murton, too. Howry/Murton. Any BP arm and Murton, really. You'll love him-- Lots of ground balls (and fields his position well), cool head, keeps it in the park, absolute innings eater, can give you 5 CGs a year, and you can hang your hat on 15 wins. We've got Adam Miller ready to join the rotation by July, and I love Murton. I would absolutely make that deal.

But do you guys want Dellucci, too? We kind of just got a LF.

[greenbaydude1232]

The cubs wouldnt need Dellucci and a murton/dellucci platoon wouldnt look to bad. Has Dellucci ever played Center?

[nrmax88]

nickjs good deal, i agree, both sides. I am very high on Matt murton, but seriously delucci and JW for N Cotts and murton makes every one happy. Murton is an obvious upgrade over last years Indian LF (was it michaels? I say he would be a definite upgrade assuming last years LF was Michaels, or else i take that statement back.), Indians get their BP help, Chitown gets their starter, and a good left handed hitter ( which i think the cubbies really need, being so righty heavy)

[integr96]

also speaking from cleveland, i think the indians are going to want more than 1 bullpen arm. but i have watched adam miller at AA Akron and agree that he will be a great pitcher but i doubt we see him this year. i think they would be better off leaving him in Buffalo for a full year.

[nickjs21]

Yes it was Michaels.

Well I was semi-kidding about Dellucci, but OK. For that and Westbrook you'd probably have to give us two arms (one mediocre, we don't care) or a defensive SS

[nickjs21]

Well it looks like we have this deal done then. One of you call Hendry, and I'll get on the horn with Shapiro. I'm sure they'll see it our way.

[pinetarhand]

Already on the phone, he actually gave me a good salary for getting the deal done, I'll share it with you.

[ptk420biatch]

Nrmax88 is the king of the cubs hating troll's on MLBtraderumors.com. Bow to him.

[greenbaydude1232]

Heres what I would do if I was Jim Hendry.

I'm not sure how all the salary would work out but I think we would be playoff shooins in 2008 if we follow these steps:

In 07:
1. Sign Kenny Lofton to a 1 year deal. He adds a left handed bat in our lineup that is greatly needed and then we can move Soriano to either the 2nd, 3rd, or 5th spot in the lineup where he can get more RBIs.

2. Sign Schmidt to a 4 year deal. I think as long as its a reasonable offer, a 4th year could really convince him to sign.

3. Trade Murton/Cotts for Westbrook. Lock up Westbrook for the next couple years

4. Give Big Z his much deserved raise and extension.

in 08:
5. After next season Jason Jennings will be a FA. Sign him for whatever it takes.

6. Assuming we get Jennings trade Prior and prospects (veal? Patterson?) for a very good SS and move Izturis to 2B and DeRosa (if he isnt part of the afformentioned deal in a util role).

7. Bring up F. Pie and play him in center, you bat him low in the lineup in a non-pressure type place like the 8th spot. It also provides speed at the end of the lineup. A la Figgins last year.

Projected 2008 Rotation:
1. Big Z
2. Schmidt
3. Jennings
4. Westbrook
5. Hill

Projected Lineup:
1. Soriano
2. Izturis
3. Lee
4. Ramirez
5. SS from prior trade (M. TEJADA?!?)
6. Jones
7. Barrett
8. Pie
9. Pitcher

I'm sure this is like a billion dollars over whatever the payroll limit is but thats what i would do. Let me know what u think?
HAHA

[greenbaydude1232]

Before I get ripped to pieces for that I just want to make it VERY CLEAR that I am not ignorant and I realize how impossible the above it. It was only for my own amusement.

[ptk420biatch]

You are looking at a lot of stress. That is a dream, and a good one. But a dream and I am a cubs fan.

[bsox21]

green bay,

i liek it brotha....

The only thing I would change is instead of signing Jennings and dealing Veal, I say deal Prior for the best u can get, insert Veal in the rotation, and get a great defensive SS with avg offense.

Aram, Sori and Lee don't need any help.

[bsox21]

Even if the lineup is:

Sori - RF
Jon Bon Jovi - LF
D Lee - 1B
Aram - 3B
My Mom - CF
Your Mom - C
Hillary Clinton - 2B
Rey Ordonez - SS
Pitcher

The offense will score enough runs to win for an avg rotation.

[ejruiz777]

I'm telling you, the Cubs should just go all out and sign Lugo, Schmidt AND Zito. Just take a look at the team those signings would produce:

CF - Julio Lugo
LF - Alfonso Soriano
1B - Derek Lee
3B - Aramis Ramirez
C - Michael Barrett
2B - Mark DeRosa
RF - Jones/Murton
SS - Cesar Izturis
P - Pitcher's Spot

C - Geovanny Soto
IF - Ronny Cedeno
IF - Ryan Theriot
OF - Murton/Jones

SP - Carlos Zambrano
SP - Jason Schmidt
SP - Barry Zito
SP - Rich Hill
SP - Prior/Miller

RP - Ryan Dempster
RP - Kerry Wood
RP - Bob Howry
RP - Scott Eyre
RP - Neil Cotts
RP - Willy Ohman
RP - Michael Wuertz

That's just sick... absolutely filthy. Sure, it would cost a ton of money over a million years, but a World Series would be priceless for this franchise. At worst, it would be fun for the fans of the other teams in MLB to watch that spectacular group of players somehow fail to win it all.

[greenbaydude1232]

how can u possibly bat DeRosa ahead of J. Jones and put schmidt ahead of zito in a rotation? lol

[greenbaydude1232]

"So they have anywhere from $23MM to $35MM left depending on a $120MM or $130MM payroll & if the bonuses count. $23MM will be just enough to sign 2 FA SP's & fill out the roster while $35 will get us much more. Either way, I'll stick to my guns & say Lugo's not worth any of that money."

If that monetary prediction is correct then financially the Cubs probably could afford to sign zito, schmidt and lofton (although not lugo)

Zito will command atleast 15 million.
Schmidt will probably Command 12 or 13.
Lofton won't command more than 3.

Thats about 30 million. So financially maybe possible although far out of the realm of possibility in real life :)

[greenbaydude1232]

With that lineup...you have 3 potential 20 game winners in that rotation. hehe...

[ejruiz777]

How could I put Schmidt ahead of Zito in a potential Cubs rotation? How about because he posted a better WHIP (1.26 to 1.40), ERA (3.59 to 3.83) and K/BB numbers (180/80 to 151/99) in 2006.

I put DeRosa and his .296/.357/.456 line ahead of Jones' .285/.334/.499 numbers... haul me off to jail for this crime or hell for such blasphemy! I gave DeRosa the nod over the Jones/Murton platoon, but I guess I was wrong. Am I crazy for thinking that Jones won't be as good in 2007? My bad...

Seriously though, why do people on this board have a fascination with highlighting the most meaningless parts of a post in order to try and show themselves to be the paramount MLB experts? The main point of my post was that the Cubs should continue to spend like mad in order to try and buy a World Series championship. There are those that say it can't be done, but the Mets were well on their way last year before injuries decimated their starting pitching. The 2007 Cubs could be everything that the 2006 Mets were supposed to be and more. Thoughts?

[bsox21]

Schmidt shits on Zito.

[bsox21]

"Seriously though, why do people on this board have a fascination with highlighting the most meaningless parts of a post in order to try and show themselves to be the paramount MLB experts?"

THANK YOU!

[conorj]

Murton will be a wonderful hitter for the Pirates someday.....he has red hair and goes opposite field, in his best moments...but Lugo and one Marquee starter for the Cubs will do it. Planning without Prior, I understand it, but I don't agree with it. He is not done. And certainly, Marmol, Marshall, etc., will meet the MLB average of the 5th starter. It's not that hard to do that. Right now, our offense is built for the reg. season, but if we could throw big Z, Schmidt, Hill, and Prior in the pee-offs, we're good. When a team averages six runs per game during the season, at worst, they're going to suck down to 4.2 rpg in the playoffs, and that pitching staff has a better chance than not of winning a best of seven. We just want a shot at the World Series....Right? Plus, the Mets will suck next year.

[conorj]

Please tell me why the cubs need two starting pitchers???! They need one good one.

[greenbaydude1232]

You Can't Count On Prior! You Can't Count On Miller!

Do you really want 3 young guys in the rotation?

1. Big Z
2. Schmidt
3. Hill
4. Marshall
5. Marmol?

THATS WHY WE NEED 2!!!!

[conorj]

I'm not "counting" on Prior, I just think it's worth not risking some f-in' three year 25mm dollar deal to sign a second tier pitcher....hardly anyone's out there. And besides, I do have the opinion that prior will play this year. Stop trying to explain this simple concept that we can't plan on having him--i know pretty goddamned well. I watched the games last year and saw how messed up it was. but it was going to some greater good--it got some guys good experience to improve their games enough to eat some innings at the four or five spot. But, hey, way to lose faith in the guys in our system and instead put it all in the esteemed athletic prowess that is Gil Meche, Ted Lily, and Vinny Padillia. You should be a GM--instead you're just a greedy fan of the most unsuccessfully greedy organization that could possibly be.

[greenbaydude1232]

I'm not sure if you noticed but at no point did I suggest signing a 2nd tier pitcher. I think spending money for Lily, Meche, or Padillia is a waste. The only suggestions I have ever made regarding signing pitchers has been to sign schmidt and trade for a pitcher. I have no interest in signing one of the 2nd tier pitchers that is going to be vastly overpaid. But I guess that makes me a greedy fan?

[integr96]

i wouldnt mind seeing the cubs sign schmidt to a 3 or 4 year deal and then trade him after this year to the angels or mariners. trade him to the angels you try and get brandon wood and ervin santana. trade him to the mariners you try and get yuniesky betancourt and a SP. then your new rotation would be
c. zambrano
r. hill
e. santana
j. westbrook or c. lee
m. prior
so you would have a young shortstop to take over for izturis and you would also replace your pitcher. and the angels would definitely need an ace to take the place of b. colon after his contract ends in 2007. i agree with trying to get lofton on the cheap for a year.

[integr96]

did anyone else see this? "Chicago Cubs right-handed pitcher Mark Prior, an Arizona neighbor of Jason Schmidt is trying to persuade the free-agent right-hander to sign with the Cubs."

[greenbaydude1232]

where'd u see that integr?

[integr96]

http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/mlb/article/0,2777,DRMN_23924_5182542,00.html

[greenbaydude1232]

hope he can do it :)

[RbCubsFan4Life]

Here's what you do, plain and simple. You trade Jones and some prospects (ala Eric Patterson) to Clev for Westbrook and maybe a bullpen arm (Carmona). And this is what the 08 lineup should look like:
1.Lugo SS
2.Theriot 2b (this kids gonna be a stud)
3.Soriano LF
4.Lee 1b
5.Ramirez 3b
6.Murton RF
7.Barrett C
8.Pie CF
9.Pitcher
B-Derosa(or try and trade his $8 mil over the next 2 years)
B-Pagan
B-Blanco
B-Bynum
B-Moore (keep him, he'll be good)
And the arms....
SP-Zambrano
SP-Schmidt
SP-Westbrook
SP-Hill
SP-Prior (screw Miller)
RP-Howry
RP-Eyre
RP-Ohman
RP-Wuertz
RP-Carmona
LR-Mateo
CL-Wood

[greenbaydude1232]

Why would CLE trade a bullpen arm when that is exactly what they are looking for in a trade? Wow...good call...not!

[Devil Ray Boy]

I am a Devil Rays fan, they should sign Julio Lugo and put him at short. They should get rid of Cesar Izturus; that guy stinks. Give Felix Pie a chance and Matt Murton is not an everyday LF. Why the Cubs get Jose Guillen and put him at right field. Why aren't the Cubs going after Zito? He is a perfect fit.

Here is my 2007 Cubs lineup

LF Soriano
SS Lugo
1B D Lee
3B Ramirez
C Barrett
RF J Guillen
2B DeRosa
CF Pie
Pitchers Spot
Bench
2B Theriot
OF Pagan
OF Murton
C Blanco
3B/1B Moore
SS Cedeno

Starters
SP Zambrano
SP Schmidt
SP Zito
SP Hill
SP Prior/Marshall

Relievers
RP Miller/Marmol
RP Howry
LP Eyre
LP Cotts
RP Wuertz
RP Dempster
CP Wood

[RbCubsFan4Life]

The Indians aren't so hot on Carmona after a bad 06. Notice how I put prospects... with an "s" in there. Throw in some B level prospect relievers. And if you are such a baseball genious GreenBay, why aren't you the GM of the Cubs?

[kevybo1]

The Cubs should sign Julio Lugo make Cesar Izturis a bench guy so Lugo could play shortstop then thy should sign Kenny Loftn to play center field then trade Jaque Jones and a prospect for Jake Westbrook. What do you guys think of this plan?