Viva El Birdos On Mulder

Viva El Birdos has an interesting take on the Mark Mulder signing, and I can't really argue with it.  I'll leave you with Larry's concluding quote; read his post on rotator cuff surgery survivors.  Says Larry:

"To my eye, it's 50-50 that Ryan Franklin outperforms Mark Mulder in 2007."

Comments

[bravesbeast]

all franklin has to do is not worry about mulder, just win 8 or 9 games with a 6 era and hell make 8 mill a year for two years in 2008 and 2009 with some team

[PeteRose]

""To my eye, it's 50-50 that Ryan Franklin outperforms Mark Mulder in 2007.""

Yikes....so what he's saying is the ball boy is just as viable an option.

[bran]

well the cardinals are desperate for pitching

i just dont see them repeating

[Aduncaroo]

Either do I, but I am a Cubs fan...so who knows. Keep in mind though...you never know what Walt is going to pull off. I do think that he has to do something besides Mulder though....that rotation is pretty bad..even for the central.

[cardinalred24]

Wow, Mulder has one bad year, where he was hurt and suddenly we all think that he isn't worthy of a cheap contract? C'mon now! I know he hasn't exactly been in Oakland form since coming over, but forgetting last year, he's at least been a #2 or #3 guy. And when was the last time that a surgery didn't help a guy? Let's not give up on Mulder just yet.

As far as Franklin goes, I think he's a stopgap until Mulder is ready, and a realization that if Looper is in the rotation we're screwed. I think Duncan can work his magic and at least get a Jason Marquis performance out of him. I also think this either points to the Cards thinking they're out on Weaver, or Wainwright staying in the 'pen.

The Central will be tougher for sure this year, but let's not count these guys out yet. Remember we just won the WS in the year where most fans thought we had no chance!

[Aduncaroo]

I'm not giving up on him, nor do I think he is not worthy of that contract, well, at least in this market. I do. The thing is that he can NOT be counted on the contribute anything in the first half, and it would be unwise to ask him to win you more than five or six games at the most in the second half. They need someone that is going to make their rotation better now. Franklin probably won't do it, but you never know, he might work out well.

I don't think we are saying that the Cardinals are definitely not going to win. I'm just saying its going to be a great year of baseball and good competition in the Central!

[kevmill21]

cardinalred, i know you're a birds fan, but people don't understand how awful of a pitching coach dave duncan is, he knows he's bad, thus we only get pitchers who are bad elsewhere then if they have the slightest success duncan looks like a god

mulder was great then came here and was not very good at all.

weaver made a point of it in the dispatch that he gave no credit to dave duncan, he just needed somewhere that would let him throw and stop trying to fix his peculiar mechanics

carpenter just needed a chance after surgery

that's why we don't bring in top pitchers, they will not have as much success here, we look off the scrap heap, too bad the scrap heap is 10 mill a year this year

[rawr]

Holy shit Kevmill. You are the dumbest person ever. Seriously, stop watching baseball, you are too unintelligent to comprehend it.

[nrmax88]

Agreed

[nrmax88]

anybody know where i can find fantasy position eligibility for a guy like iwamura?

[cardinalred24]

I'm not really sure how Duncan could be a pitching coach for the last decade and be that terrible. I mean, surely if he was that bad, he would've been fired by now, or tons of people would be calling for his head. And the Cards are normally at the top of the league in pitching, so you're saying that is all the pitchers and nothing at all from Dunc?

And all I heard in the playoffs is what a great job he's done with Weaver, and that his work with turning sub par guys into stars goes back to Oakland when he worked with Storm Davis and Dave Stewart.

If Weaver really did say that though, wow...maybe he is dumb enough to go to NY again

[plh903]

Kev, I mean this in a nice way: You're pretty dumb.

I agree with Larry, Mulder can't be counted on one bit. I like that he'll get a shot in 2008, and that there is a team option for 2009. No one is saying that Mulder will help the team next year.

Anyway, Walt said there would be a four-person competition for the fifth slot, if Franklin is lighting the world on fire (HAHAHA) he'll get the job. Whatver.

I Kip Wells wants to turn it around, that could be pretty scary.

Otherwise, I'm all about Carp, Reyes and Wainwright and the flexibility that Walt has left himself with after this offseason.

It's probably 60/40 that Mulder even throws a pitch in 2008. So I'm not sure why this is that noteworthy, I mean, I know there are a lot of Cubs fans around here...

Rotator cuff surgery=bad

$13 million gamble and tons of financial flexibility this year and next=good

[gatling]

"Wow, Mulder has one bad year, where he was hurt and suddenly we all think that he isn't worthy of a cheap contract?"

Mulder hasn't had one bad year, he's had three. Unless you're basing your opinion of him solely on his win total, he's not been the same guy since getting hurt in 2003 playoffs. His WHIP is rising, his K/9 and K/BB rates are plummeting, he's not a good pitcher right now. I wouldn't spend any where near the money the Cards or anyone else offered him for the next two seasons. Whether pitching is at a premium or not, a guy who's trending downward and has injury issues isn't a guy to invest $13 million in. A one year, $2 million deal with incentives and a team option for 2008 is what Mulder deserved, but due to the ridiculous market, he's overpaid. Unless Dave Duncan and Mulder can work together to regain his mechanics from 2003 and he's over his injury, he won't be worth the money.

[Aduncaroo]

Is he worth the money for the next two years? NO

Is he worth the money in the contract in the current market? Probably. The money isn't that much and its not going to hurt the Cards that much. They have spent almost nothing and have a lot more to work with than you think. They gained a TON of revenue last year that Walt can play with, and he hasn't done much of anything with it yet. I think he is hoping they stay competitive this year with the same "core", and they go after a really good #2 pitcher next offseason, either by trade or free agency. If they are in the race, but not winning, he may make a trade around the deadline this year giving up someone like Duncan and a young prospect. Either way I actually like this contract because they are fine financially if it doesn't work out...they just won't pick up the option. I do think that they need one more guy that they can count on....this year.

[bravesrule14]

kev u are a fucking idiot. besides Mazzone, Dunc is probably the best pitching coach in baseball. i think u should start watching another sport like backgammon or something

[Aduncaroo]

Who told you he was a bad pitching coach?? Weaver? I think that the Cardinals would not be even talking about signing him if that was the case. I think you have some wrong information. Duncan is a great pitching coach. The only knock on him is that he doesnt work well with younger pitchers....but that is even a stretch.

[stormstarter28]

kevmill- that was honestly the single dumbest post i have EVER seen on this site, and there are some grade-A retards on here.
" that's why we don't bring in top pitchers, they will not have as much success here, we look off the scrap heap"
let me get this straight-
A: We don't bring in top pitchers- we take the scraps instead
+B: We are consistently above average in pitching
=C: Dave Duncan sucks.
does that make sense at all? Mulder gets hurt and you blame Duncan for his downfall. That's ridiculous. Please, Please, don't ever post anything on this website again. It's in the best interest of everyone.

[kevmill21]

from someone who watches 150 cards games a year and knows how their organization works on the inside i hardly care what you all have to say im just laying the facts out there for you, but then again i am talking to a bunch of retards who religiously follow this random rumor site
dave duncan is a long time friend of larussa and will never leave just like isringhausen, mcgwire and all those damn a's

if we had any other pitching coach, even someone who just knew how to manage a game, knew when a pitcher was done for the day, knew when to go settle someone down or anything our pitching would be far better off