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SI.com's Jon Heyman wrote yesterday:
The contending Cardinals might even consider parting with top outfield prospect Colby Rasmus, a major surprise. If so, it may put them in line to land Pittsburgh's Xavier Nady, or even Jason Bay.
Cardinals fans can rest easy about their top prospect, however. Joe Strauss asked team chairman Bill DeWitt Jr. if there is any chance Rasmus could play his first MLB game in another uniform. DeWitt's reply: "I don't anticipate that. No." In a recent updated Top 100 Prospects list from Baseball America, Rasmus ranked #4.
DeWitt also indicated that the Cardinals would be able to add another $1.5-2MM in payroll this year if need be.
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Phew. No offense but the Cardinals trading Colby Rasmus to try and win this year would be silly. He's their next position player star, the guy who can be Robin to Pujols' Batman. They have nobody else coming up like that. Brett Wallace? Nobody knows where he's going to play. Pete Kozma? Yeah, right. Rasmus should be off limits.
Posted by: scribbletone | July 17, 2008 at 11:33 AM
"DeWitt also indicated that the Cardinals would be able to add another $1.5-2MM in payroll this year if need be."
What a d-bag! 2 mil at most?? The Cards are 3rd in the league in attendence last time I checked. The fans are coming more than ever. I don't understand why in the world ownership keeps trying to nickel and dime with the payroll. I have a lot of respect for the Cards, but not their owners. I think Larussa is even getting irked by this. If not at the deadline, they better bring in a real impact player in the offseason. They owe it to the fans, and have for awhile now. The days of Kennedy and Izturis need to stop.
Posted by: Aduncaroo | July 17, 2008 at 11:40 AM
If I were the Cards, there is only one player I would trade Rasmus for. Hanley Ramirez.
Also, the Cards are already under by around $5-10 million, plus so $2 million more is not quite so bad. Plus, they should be able to get rid of some dead weight with all the pitchers who are currently on payroll. Remember, they have 3 former pitching All-Stars on their DL.
Posted by: CraveCase | July 17, 2008 at 11:46 AM
"If I were the Cards, there is only one player I would trade Rasmus for. Hanley Ramirez."
Well there are a few others. But Hanley is definately one of them. David Wright, Justin Upton, King Felix, Jay Bruce, etc.
Posted by: scribbletone | July 17, 2008 at 11:54 AM
To be fair, this is how the Q&A went:
P-D: If an opportunity arose that would allow you to trade for a player or players that would add $1.5 million-$2 million in pro-rated payroll, could you digest it?
DeWitt: Something like that would be very achievable.
So the 1.5-2 figure was posed to him, he didn't bring it up. And they were talking about a pro-rated salary, so that's more like a $5 million dollar per year guy.
They would be crazy to trade Rasmus, and they know that. It won't happen.
Posted by: cards228 | July 17, 2008 at 12:28 PM
You have to read the article. DeWitt didn't bring up the $1.5-2MM figure, it was part of the question from Strauss.
Posted by: Tim Dierkes | July 17, 2008 at 12:29 PM
OT: Can someone with a sub tell me what Travis Snider is ranked in the new rankings?
Posted by: juiced | July 17, 2008 at 12:34 PM
Can somebody just copy and paste the whole new top 25 or something I've been wanting to know so damn bad but I havent doled out the cash for a subscription?
Posted by: scribbletone | July 17, 2008 at 12:42 PM
Thanks, Stevo. I was wondering what that list looked like.
Also, Dunc, the Cardinals have the 4th highest payroll in the NL. It's hard to complain too much.
Also, my phone died, but that weekend is going to be sick. No one's going to survive.
Posted by: plh903 | July 17, 2008 at 01:42 PM
The Cards are 3rd in attendance, and almost always top 5 in merchandise sold, but 11th in payroll.
I do realize that his comments weren't saying he will ONLY add 2 mil...but living in St. Louis and not being a cardinals fan...I just know I'd be frustrated year after year watching all the best free agents go somewhere else time after time. I just think they owe the fans more. The fact is that they won a WS, but there was a LOT of luck involved in that. They were the team with the worst regular season record to ever win it...
All that being said...I like the Cards...I just think their ownership needs to sack up and go out and get somebody to help this team. Its time.
Posted by: Aduncaroo | July 17, 2008 at 03:17 PM
Can't paste the Baseball America list here, guys.
Posted by: Tim Dierkes | July 17, 2008 at 03:31 PM
Trading Rasmus would be akin to the Lou Brock trade that saw Lou Brock become a Cardinal!
When the rosters expand this guy will have JUST turned 22. He's just over a year younger than Evan Longoria and it looks like he'll be a similar player. In fact, their AA seasons are very comparable with Longoria hitting about .25 points higher whilst at the AA level and Rasmus hitting for slightly more power and extra base hits. Defensively they're also comparable, Rasmus is well acknowledged as being a gifted center fielder, Longoria is staking his claim for a gold glove. This trend repeats itself at all the minor league levels. So, let me ask you this, if you were the Tampa Bay Devil Rays, would you trade Longoria? Of course not, so if you're the Saint Louis Cardinals, do you trade Colby Rasmus? Of course not.
Posted by: DaveyThrashmister | July 17, 2008 at 03:37 PM
Just to play Devil's advocate...If you are the Tampa Bay Rays and already have a guy who is a fan favorite and putting up an OPS of .880 playing a great CF...and are currently 5 games out in a race where the two teams you are competing with have just brought legit Aces in....what about then?
I actually think it would be dumb to trade him...they should put Ankiel in right and Ludwick in left...but just a hypothetical question for you.
Posted by: Aduncaroo | July 17, 2008 at 04:05 PM
Dan Uggla would be sweet but I don't think we have a chance.
Posted by: trooper2 | July 17, 2008 at 06:13 PM
Uggla for Rasmus would still be a dumb move by the Cards. The biggest advantage Rasmus gives the Cards is that he will be a very good to great player that will be cheap for 2-3 seasons and under market value for 3-4 more. That will help keep payroll low so we can actually be involved for some high level FA (like Furcal, Abreu, Dunn, Manny, Sabathia, Burnett...this offseason). Trading Rasmus for Uggla takes us out of the conversation for those players. So its Rasmus and one of the above guys, or Uggla. Seems like an easy decision.
Plus Uggla wouldn't be under control for nearly as long, and he's terrible at defense. He's a future 1B. Like someone else already said, a trade would only make sense for a select number of players (young, good, cheap, and under control). And the fact is, no one is trading those players.
Posted by: deeco3307 | July 17, 2008 at 09:07 PM
You people who want Dan Uggla (or Hanley Ramirez) as Cardinals are really not very savvy. Neither can play defense and neither has any range. That All-Star performance by Uggla was no fluke.
I once read a comment on Joe Strauss's Q&A from a guy who wanted to move Troy Glaus to shortstop. It's sad, really.
Pitching and defense win baseball games, people. Don't believe me? Consider the Texas Rangers for the last two or three decades.
Posted by: youngowens | July 17, 2008 at 10:07 PM
Ramirez could be turned into an average OF, ala BJ Upton. He's got the speed to cover a lot of ground, so thats very realistic. Long term, thats where he'll play if he doesn't start to show some improvement at SS.
The fact that you wouldn't want Ramirez means you are not very savvy, because he's probably the best overall player in the league, he's young, he's cheap, and he's locked up to a long contract.
Posted by: deeco3307 | July 17, 2008 at 10:20 PM
Hanley Ramirez will be the same exhibit the same quality defense in left field that he exhibits at shortstop. He will make a fine designated hitter.
The people demanding trades and complaining about money are the same people who have been complaining like that since forever. I'm curious: how do you explain 2006, 2005, 2004, and 2002? Dumb luck?
Posted by: youngowens | July 17, 2008 at 10:28 PM
No one is really demanding a trade. It's just that some of us feel betrayed by the Cards ownership. Not that we want the Cards to be the Yanks, Mets, or BoSox. One big free agent every now and then would be really nice. Especially a difference maker. The last difference making FA I can remember is....Isringhausen...
Posted by: trooper2 | July 17, 2008 at 11:35 PM
"The people demanding trades and complaining about money are the same people who have been complaining like that since forever."
Are you kidding? I live in St. Louis and haven't complained about this at all until the last couple of offseasons. People ripped on the Cubs after signing DeRosa to that contract after him having his best year...or what they called a "career" year. How has that contract looked so far? Now compare that to Kennedy...whom they got because they wanted to save a little money. Nice...
They have a great manager and great pitching coach...but there has been a lot of luck involved.
1. Pujols - luck they have him. Picked in round 40 something??
2. Ankiel - luck he is contributing offensively right now.
3. 2006 WS - luck they made the playoffs with 83 wins, and luck they won it. Honestly...Jeff Weaver??
Now...please hear what I'm saying. I respect the Cardinals, and I really like the way the organization is run for the most part. And 2004-2006 were teams that deserved to be where they were. They had talent on both sides of the ball and played awesome defense. Those teams don't field guys like Izturis at SS...
Posted by: Aduncaroo | July 18, 2008 at 12:18 AM
In 2004 and 2005 we won at least 100 games. We failed to win the World Series. Was that luck? Right now, our best two pitchers are on the DL. Is that luck? We made a bad trade with Oakland. Luck? You have to factor in the good with the bad.
The Cardinals need a solid reliever. That's it. It would be fine to get a decent starter, too, because that would move someone to the bullpen. This team does not need infielders who cannot play defense. It would be nice to get a power hitter but it would be stupid to give away the farm.
Posted by: youngowens | July 18, 2008 at 02:07 AM
youngowens,
I don't disagree with anything you said. I also agree that you have to factor in the good with the bad. I don't think they should trade Rasmus. I do think they should be trying to package Reyes, Duncan, and Brian Anderson to somebody, because those are all parts that have value to other teams, while the Cards wouldn't miss them much. Trading Rasmus probably doesn't make any sense unless they were able to bring back someone very, very good. I'm not sure anyone on the market is worth giving up the #4 prospect in the country for.
My whole beef, if I were a Cardinal fan, would be ownership. They have been raking money in this decade, especially since the new stadium was built. Like I said earlier, they days of your starting SS being Casar Izturis need to be over. Actually, they never should have started.
Posted by: Aduncaroo | July 18, 2008 at 05:20 AM
Joelcards...
The fact is that Uggla will cost more than Ramsus for each of the next 3 seasons, plus any extension on top of that. Even if he isn't terribly expensive, it still takes money away from another position that is potentially an impact player. The difference between signing an above mentioned player this offseason and being that player second choice is going to be 2-3 million dollars. Uggla will easily make that next season.
Its more of a business decision. Young good players are simply too valuable to a team with a set payroll. If Uggla were to be traded for, the Cards would need to start thinking about a potential extension very soon. Currently the Cards have Rasmus for 6 years cheaply.
Posted by: deeco3307 | July 18, 2008 at 07:14 AM
Joel,
I know you don't agree...but from what you were saying...you almost sounded like you did.
"what sucks is that the stadium is selling out as it is so its harder for ownership to see the financial reward."
"of course im fairly certain they were raking it in after 06."
"50 bucks for a sweatshirt?"
Again...you have the 3rd highest attendence, top 5 in merchandise...and as a Cards fan, you are happy with being 11th in payroll? Really?
Posted by: Aduncaroo | July 18, 2008 at 04:15 PM
Not to mention the beer prices are out of control at Busch!
I guess thats because it gets shipped from...well...a block away.
Also Joel...I'll take Brian Roberts over Uggla right now if I'm the Cards. They could probably get him without giving up Rasmus...but then again maybe not because your next best prospect is a catcher, which is their biggest strenth.
Posted by: Aduncaroo | July 18, 2008 at 04:18 PM
Inherent in this 11th in payroll/third in attendance argument is the premise that ticket prices are the same. They're not.
The current average price of a ticket to see the Cardinals play is $29.32. The average price to see the Yankees play is $34.05. The Mets: $36.58. The Red Sox: $48.80. The Cubs: $42.49.
Therefore, it is a bogus argument, much like the idea that Dan Uggla can field.
Posted by: youngowens | July 18, 2008 at 05:19 PM
Its not even close to a bogus argument. Even with the whole ticket price "argument", they have to be higher than 11th. The owners are rolling in the revenue from this team and I don't think the ratio is as good as even those teams you list above. I'll see if I can find team revenue statistics and we can find out a little more...anybody know off the top of their heads where/if those are listed?
I do have to agree though...Uggla isn't and has never been good at fielding. He is still a good player...but I don't think you give up Rasmus for him when his price tag will skyrocket very shortly.
Posted by: Aduncaroo | July 18, 2008 at 05:30 PM
"They have a great manager and great pitching coach...but there has been a lot of luck involved.
1. Pujols - luck they have him. Picked in round 40 something??
2. Ankiel - luck he is contributing offensively right now.
3. 2006 WS - luck they made the playoffs with 83 wins, and luck they won it. Honestly...Jeff Weaver??"
For one thing, Pujols was taken in the 13th or 14th round, we arent talking about Mike Piazza here in the 64th round.
For another, Jeff Weaver was not a bad pitcher till he went to the AL West (which apparently is his cryptonite), sucked horribly, came to the Cardinals, did mediocre and then great in the playoffs, then like an idiot went back to the AL West and pretty much ruined his career.
In 05, this guy was the Dodgers ace, and he was actually really good.
Posted by: Ivdown | July 19, 2008 at 10:25 AM
Here is a really interesting article:
http://www.forbes.com/lists/2008/33/biz_baseball08_The-Business-Of-Baseball_Revenue.html
Shows the Cards as 9th in revenue...but there are also a lot of other factors to take in as well.
I also took a look at their payroll...and they have a huge offseason coming up.
Here are most of the major players that they have coming off the books.
Izzy - 8 mil
Juan Encarnacion - 6.5 mil
Mulder - 6.5 mil
Looper - 5.5 mil
Lohse - 4.25 mil
Springer - 3.5 mil
Izturis - 2.85 mil
Clement - 1.5 mil
Miles - 1.4 mil
By my calculations, thats about 35 mil coming off the books. They still have to account for raises for some of their guys...but they should have at LEAST 20 or 25 mil to play around with, assuming they don't raise payroll.
The whole point I'm making is I think the days of signing guys like Mulder, Clement, Izturis, Kennedy etc need to go. Seems like they are always trying to sign below the radar guys and are almost always unwilling to go market price for the big free agents. That works for them in a lot of cases (Lohse), but I think its time they went out and spent a little and got someone that shows the fan base that they want to keep winning.
Posted by: Aduncaroo | July 21, 2008 at 11:08 AM