The Many Faces Of Manny

Wow. you go nomah

well, lets just not forget he pushed to the ground a red sox employee and almost got into a fist fight with youkilis. publicly thanked scott boras for getting him to LA, which means they engineered the huge mess he made to get the trade. lets just put aside all that stuff, based on the word of a possible other disgruntled ex-superstar

I love this bit

"Boras described the ugly end of Ramírez's days in Boston as an inevitable breakdown between a star who repeatedly informed team executives that he wanted to play elsewhere and a front office that had yet to grant his request."

As if the RS should be obligated to trade him. Manny signed a contract to play for boston for at least 8 and up to 10 years.

First off, when Manny thanked Scott (he did not say Boras), he pointed at the traveling secretary who happened to be named Scott when he said that.

Second off, if a guy like Nomar will vouch for you, and then the Bill Mueller story, it sounds to me like Manny really is misunderstood.

I am a Dodger fan, but if Manny goes elsewhere, i will still appreciate everything Manny did for us this year.

Manny and Nomar are both on the piece of garbage train.

Site: Nomar sitting out of games and watching the sox win sitting on the bench with his arms crossed while his teammates are up in the dugout cheering. I believe in fact it was Manny that hit the home run in the incident i was talking about.

the sox dont have a habit of making players look bad. Players have a habit of trying to haggle more money out of the sox because they know the money is there. However, theo epstein even moreso then previous gms does not believe in overspending for past dated talent. Look what nomar's done since leaving the sox. He's had 2 good years out of what 5? He's been plagued with injuries and the dodgers at one point i believe i heard were ready to dfa him. so nomar is not exactly the best example. there have been periods in the last 3 years where he hasn't even been a starter. I love what nomar did in a boston uniform, but you have to call theo a genious for not overpaying to have him come back.

As far as manny goes. Boras wanted to get paid, and i'm sure he told manny when he took him on as a client, that he wouldn't take him unless he found a way out of his 2 option years.

When Manny approached the sox they simply told him that he had to continue to perform and if he did that he wouldn't have to worry about his option years, however they are not signing anything right now. Worry about whats going on on the field during the season. thats always been theo's policy and its not mannys place to come in and try to change that.

I think Manny will succeed the next 2 years wherever he goes. However, I think if you want max production from manny you must sign him to a 2 year contract with 2 more club option years if you hope to have him be manny for those years. boras will make sure he continues to perform only if it affects his pay. He influenced manny once. He will strike again. Manny is still however, a piece of garbage not for wanting out of boston but for the way the situation was handled. As usual boston handled the situation with class and brought in a great player to replace manny. I dont think anyone would have been a better fit for boston than jason bay. I look forward to his contract extention after the '09 season (pending he continues to perform) he's younger, he's got plenty of talent, and reminds me of a more powerful dustin pedroia. A hitting coaches nightmare that gets the job done.

Santana/Beckett FTW

perfect! couldnt even say it better myself

not only that but they gave him the world series bonus cut he deserved of 2/3. which was what?
200-300,000 bux? yea what jerks those red sox are.

and he'd still be a shortstop!

I remember when Youklis got in fight with Manny, everyone said it was Youklis' fault and how everyone in the clubhouse was getting tired of Youklis' antics after outs.. but that was when Manny was the 'good guy'... now Manny's the bad guy.. I dont know what the whole story of pushing the employee in the clubhouse.. but seeing as there was no reprimand from the boston organization.. either the whole story is not out.. or Boston as an organization has no standards..

The history is there as Boston mudraking leaving players.. and the history is there for Manny being an eccentric diva..

Reading Bill Simmons' article on the issue is interesting to read seeing as he is a diehard redsox fan..

People shouldn't be so quick to drink the Koolaid. I can't cosign on everything that Man-NY has done in Boston, but how do we know if the picture that the Sucks and Boston media painted was absolutely true? What was Garci's gripe with them? I never heard anything bad about him as a person but he obviously had issues with Boston. Is he a bad guy too? WHo has more power to sway public perception a baseball team w/ it's on tv/media lackeys or one single player? If some "unnamed" team official for the Yanks said that Bobby Abreu was a jerk and did this and that who, other than Abreu or maybe an ex-teamate on another team would say anything? Some might say "oh he was cool with me" but no one on the team is going to speak out against management probably.

I always thought it was the media's way of describing his offbeat personality but towards the end it really had more of a negative connotation to it.

This is similar to what Bill Simmons wrote about a few weeks ago.
I live in Boston and after having watched the PR comments that came out in the papers, it completely turned the fans against Manny. When you control the media, you control the perception. Especially over the weak minded. That's what Theo and Co. did to the fan base in Boston against Manny.
True Manny wasn't a perfect angel, but he wasn't the clubhouse cancer he was made out to be.

This article is blasphemous to RSN. Take it down.

The only people who have the right to comment on how Manny acted are those who played in/watched those 8 years worth of games that he played.

Trying to say that Theo Epstein and the upper brass of the Red Sox organization manipulated the media into making Manny into a bad guy, you're either misinformed or just plain stupid. Manny Ramirez was being booed loooooooong before this year. And if you had actually watched all of the times he faked injuries and sat on the bench in big games, you wouldn't be singing Manny's praises. Great hitter, lousy person.

I hate the Dodgers and the Red Sox, but have to give my respect to Manny in this situation (and in general). It was so ridiculous how quickly Manny was demonized in the days leading up to his trade to the Dodgers. Weak-minded sheep gobbled it right up. The Red Sox would have repeated as World Series champs if they would have held on to Manny. Funny what removing a "clubhouse cancer" can do to a team. Way to turn on the face of your franchise RSN.

I just wanted to make it clear to people such as yankeefansince78 or whatever your name is. You must be a new face on MLBTR as I haven't really seen ya around much.

Making comments such as "the sucks" or vice versa for us sox fans really takes away from the point you are trying to make. When posting on MLBTR you are supposed to try to make intelligent remarks based on the post you are reading. not insult the other team, and doing so as start_wearing_purple said makes your opinion null and void.

*such a big mistake*
lol not shot. dont know where i got shot from.

"I love how people watch a guy for 2 months and can think he's the second coming when people who watched his act for 8 yrs. know the truth. Manny hits .299 for the sox then hits .400 for the dodgers! Manny jakes it down the line 2 first countless times at the end where even Angels players were shaking their heads in disgust! Manny making his fielding more of a circus on purpose, even rolling over on balls like the dog that he is! Big games missed! Try countless yankees games like when he purposely took 3 down the middle from Mariano without taking the bat off his shoulder once! Manny also sat out the last 5 weeks of the 06 season with a phony hammy injury and most of the last month of 07 with the same! He's a scumbag and anyone who lies with this dog WILL catch fleas. ps; Mannys wife was the reason for all his trade demands as he was caught repeatedly cheating on her on Newbury S.T. in Boston!"

As a Red Sox fan, how the fuckk can you complain about Manny Ramirez?

You guys wait like 80+ years to win a championship, and then this guy helps lead your team there in the most improbable way imaginable, and because he's sort of a jerk you completely hate him?

If I was a Red Sox fan, regardless of his issues with hustling and such, he'd still be a fuckingg god just for winning us a championship. And actually, make that two. There's no way the 2004 Red Sox win without Manny Ramirez, and you should appreciate that. I've been waiting 100 god damn years.

"I love how people watch a guy for 2 months and can think he's the second coming when people who watched his act for 8 yrs. know the truth. Manny hits .299 for the sox then hits .400 for the dodgers!"

Well, I've been living in Boston since '98. I've seen Manny from the beginning. And to claim that Manny hitting .400 for 2 months is what we would do if he just tried a littly harder is insane. Did Manny get hotter than hot for the Dodgers? Of course. Would he do that over a full season? Of course not. If you think Manny intentionally sucks as a fielder, I feel bad for you. Maybe he doesn't put in anytime working on his fielding, but I seriously doubt he attempts to misplay balls hit to him.

"well, lets just not forget he pushed to the ground a red sox employee and almost got into a fist fight with youkilis. "

Youklis isn't exactly known as the best teammate in the world. Then again, you probably blame Barry Bonds for starting the fight with Jeff Kent too.

As for the guy he pushed, you know you don't have the full story there. The guy was apparently bad mouthing him in a serious way. While getting physical isn't the right way to handle that, it is hardly an act of malice.

AA: Yeah but at the time people were saying that Youk was the bad guy. All about perception and how guys are colored. Again, noe defending him but now drinking the koolaid either.

"I've been waiting 100...damn years."

Waiting 100 years...you must be old.

Busting chops. I have been waiting for the Cubs to win something, too.

yankeefansince78, people are right. You (a 30 year old man, at least), calling teams "The Red Sucks", really just makes you look like a loser. If you were 14, it would still be kind of queer, but seeing how you are in your 30's (atleast), you really need to grow up man. I mean, taking a shot at a specific poster for something stupid is one thing, but the Red Sucks? Seriously? Do you realize how fruity that sounds?

Nrmax is a Mets fan. His argument was purely philosophical and had nothing to do with the teams mentioned.

I too am getting sick of people writing up comments on this site that include no facts, no evidence or even an argument. They just come on and say, "The Yanks are gonna win it all for the 100th time!! I wanna blow Jeter!! Red Sucks hahahahah!!"

Like I honestly don't care who you root for, and most people don't either. Go on a team-based site if you want to hype your team to yourself.

And please let's all be real. The only people who know who the REAL Man-NY is are those that were in the clubhouse and on the team. I'm not defending Man-NY just stating that there are ways to smear someones persona in the media. If half of what they say Man-NY did is true then he WOULD STILL be in the wrong, but 100% is probably not accurate, that's all.

Life is too short. I have a business that's truggling (maybe I should spend less time on here, right), I house that's depreciating and two little divas who could care less if we're in a recession. This is my escape. The Sucks referrences are all in fun. Relax and smoke 'em if you got 'em.

Wow....only a redsucks fan would make a joke about 2 minors dancing on a stripper pole. I wonder if anybody will be as adamant about what RedSucksDynasty just said as they were about me calling "them" RedSucks. Probably not..people are too stupid to get upset about that.

We aren't complaining about what you say. you can say what you wish. just making those comments makes people not take your posts seriously hence why everything you say is null and void.

As far as Manny goes yes, i'm disappointed in a .299 average when he leaves his bat on his shoulder against mo. Yes i'm disappointed in his .299 average when he's rolling over balls in the outfield making a spectacle of himself. Yes i'm disappointed when he throws players to the floor and no it wasn't Youk's fault. Youk works hard every day and his improvement in the last year has proven it as he won the Hank Aaron award for the AL. Youk wasn't going to put up with Manny being Manny. Neither is Curt Schilling.

With Youk playing like a superstar and Pedroia playing like hes huge instead of a little 5'9" second basemen along with adding a player like jason bay? Manny who? Once Papi's wrist is fixed next year you are going to have 3 of the top hitters in the AL along with Jason Bay who could easily squeeze his way into that category. Add JD drew, Jacoby (he will get better, has a great swing), mike lowell, you have a team that is scary.

"Youklis isn't exactly known as the best teammate in the world. Then again, you probably blame Barry Bonds for starting the fight with Jeff Kent too."

Are you kidding me? Show me who said that Kevin Youkilis was a bad teammate? Please stop pretending as though you understand that clubhouse, because you quite clearly do not. Youkilis is one of the team leaders and one of the most beloved players on that team by both the fans and his teammates. The fight with Manny was over one thing and one thing only: Manny became angry because Youkilis has a habit of throwing his equipment after failing in a big spot/striking out etc. Thats what the fight was about, nothing more, nothing less.

"As for the guy he pushed, you know you don't have the full story there. The guy was apparently bad mouthing him in a serious way. While getting physical isn't the right way to handle that, it is hardly an act of malice."

Have you been huffing gasoline? Or are you just insane? Where is this evidence of trash talking by a SIXTY YEAR OLD MAN? Did he rattle his cane at Manny and tell him to get off his lawn or something terrible like that? I don't care if the man was telling the entire city of Boston that he was banging Manny's wife, it takes a serious form of low-life to push an elderly man to the ground. What's the guy going to do to Manny? Whimper and beg for mercy? That's a fair fight for sure.

Utterly f'n ridiculious that you're trying to defend those actions. You gonna tell us next that Barry Bonds has been framed for steroid use as well?

"Or are you just insane? Where is this evidence of trash talking by a SIXTY YEAR OLD MAN? Did he rattle his cane at Manny and tell him to get off his lawn or something terrible like that? I don't care if the man was telling the entire city of Boston that he was banging Manny's wife, it takes a serious form of low-life to push an elderly man to the ground. What's the guy going to do to Manny? Whimper and beg for mercy? That's a fair fight for sure."

Um, my 61 year old father can probably still win a fight with most guys half his age. If that "elderly" man who isn't even eligible for Social Security yet did say something about Manny's wife, how would you not understand Manny reacting in that way? Further, Manny apologized to him for the incident shortly afterward, so it is obvious he realized the error in judgment.

"The fight with Manny was over one thing and one thing only: Manny became angry because Youkilis has a habit of throwing his equipment after failing in a big spot/striking out etc. Thats what the fight was about, nothing more, nothing less."

So, Youkilis behaves constantly in an unprofessional manner and you fault Manny for getting in his face about it?

And I beg to differ. Pedroia will be the best offensive second basemen for years to come, and has a great glove. Youk is in the top 3 AL 1b in both offense and defense. They may not be Manny, but with them, we dont need manny. And i'd take jason bay who comes out and plays hard every day over not knowing what manny you are going to get.

"The fight with Manny was over one thing and one thing only: Manny became angry because Youkilis has a habit of throwing his equipment after failing in a big spot/striking out etc. Thats what the fight was about, nothing more, nothing less."

"So, Youkilis behaves constantly in an unprofessional manner and you fault Manny for getting in his face about it?"

No, youk was pissed that manny didn't care when he had a crappy at bat and just sat back down on the bench. Youk shows passion and is a young player. he will learn to calm down with time. Manny was entirely wrong and a veteran like him should know better. You never get physical with a team mate. especially when you are not playing hard yourself.

"And dont question theo. If A-rod threw jeter to the ground and then went and pushed someone in the front office i PROMISE you that they would figure out a trade even if it meant eating money."

I don't think Jeter would ever act like a petulant child, as Youk is want to do.

"No, youk was pissed that manny didn't care when he had a crappy at bat and just sat back down on the bench."

And that shows a huge difference in maturity.

It's hilarious that Pedroia did the same thing by trying to slap the glove. No one cared though. It was just a "gritty, hard-nosed" play. Gag me.

Wow...where were all of you hipocrites when the Sucks fans were disparaging the Yankees? Where were you when they were calling Arod names? Or when Larry Lucchino in a 2002 interview with the New York Times reffered to us as the "Evil Empire"? Look I didn't curse or make any personal attacks on anyone. I even went as far as to say the Sucks were one of the top 3 franchizes in baseball. Get a grup and relax. Or else, I would expect you to police every other poster who makes a negative remark about anyone or any team. If you don't get that Yankee fans and Red Sucks fan just despise each other then so be it. BUT I NEVER, EVER said anything improper towards another poster (unless they initiated). All in all this is all in fun and nothing personal, so please lighten up.

from the Boston Globe:

Multiple Red Sox players confirmed yesterday that Thursday night's dugout altercation between Manny Ramírez and Kevin Youkilis resulted from Ramírez objecting to what he believed was excessive - and chronic - complaining about the strike zone by Youkilis in the dugout, as well as the first baseman's penchant for throwing equipment after at-bats.

more stories like thisBoth Ramírez and Youkilis downplayed the incident.

"That was a misunderstanding," Ramírez said. "Even in the best family, you fight and stuff like that. But it's done, it's over with. We've got everything straightened out."

"The whole thing was basically a misunderstanding of words and stuff like that," Youkilis said. "To me, it's no big deal."

Before the fifth inning Thursday - and after the Red Sox-Rays punching session - Ramírez was caught on NESN cameras slapping Youkilis. The pair were also exchanging words, and had to be separated by teammates, coaches, and training staff. Youkilis headed out to the field still barking at Ramírez, while Ramírez was escorted into the tunnel leading to the clubhouse by bench coach Brad Mills and trainer Paul Lessard.

According to three sources, Ramírez had told Youkilis to "cut that [expletive] out." That was what provoked Youkilis and started the problem.

Neither player was in the clubhouse after Thursday's game.

The two hadn't spoken as of yesterday afternoon, though Youkilis indicated that was because Ramírez was getting treatment on the sore hamstring that had caused him to leave Thursday's game early.

"We'll talk, definitely," Youkilis said. "We've got 99 games left. It's a long season."

While sources had indicated that part of the problem was Youkilis's tossing of equipment in the dugout, the first baseman said, "I think it was a misunderstanding more than anything. I don't think it was because I threw something."

Youkilis did say, unequivocally, that the altercation had nothing to do with Ramírez's tardiness in getting involved in the second-inning brawl with the Rays, which occurred after James Shields hit Coco Crisp with a pitch. That fight led to suspensions for eight players. This one led to little more than other players downplaying both the issue and questions about team chemistry.

Ramírez did not want to speak about the reasons behind the altercation. He seemed to want to put it behind him, saying, "I think that's nobody's business. What happened happened, and we're going to move on. Like I said, don't worry about it. What happened happened. It's a new day. It's over."

The left fielder was out of the lineup last night, nursing a pulled hamstring. He said he didn't think it would cost him more than one game, though it did scare him at the moment.

Multiple players, as well as manager Terry Francona, emphasized that disagreements aren't unusual for a baseball team. With 25 players together constantly, there are bound to be issues. Often, though, the problems are tucked away in the clubhouse, out of sight of cameras. Those fights - or arguments - aren't broadcast for everyone to see

* sitting back eating popcorn and reading the Yanks/Sox punch fest go forth *

Btw, The comment about the guys daughters was below the belt. Deduct 2 points from Red Sox Nation.

"Thanks studio....haha. I thought it was really odd how people can get upset about a Yanks fan referring to that team in boston as the RedSucks, but the comment about my little girls as strippers goes unmentioned..kuddos to you."

Haha... the difference is that most of these people doing name calling are kids who are like 12. Judging by your name, you are a man in your 30's, getting into name calling battles with little kids. When people tell you what a loser you sound like, you say...."but they did it tooo!!"

You're awesome bro.