Bowden On Padres, Tigers, Indians, Royals, Pirates

Here's the latest from around the league, courtesy of ESPN's Jim Bowden

  • The Padres have fielded offers for both Huston Street and Carlos Quentin, but they've yet to seriously debate any of them internally.
  • The Tigers are seeking a second base upgrade and would like to acquire Darwin Barney from the Cubs for a mid-level prospect.
  • The Indians are looking all over to acquire an outfield bat, but they are unable to take back a significant contract and are unwilling to move their best prospects.
  • Meanwhile, the Royals are trying to convince the Indians or Reds to take Jeff Francoeur so they can promote Wil Myers from Triple-A.
  • The Pirates are aggressively trying to land a middle of the order bat while the Orioles are seeking starting pitching and a third base upgrade.
  • There have been rumors of a Mike Morse for B.J. Upton trade, according to Bowden. The Nationals are also looking to add a starter with Stephen Strasburg's innings limit approaching.
  • The Giants have no plans of making a deal similar to the one they made last year, when they traded Zack Wheeler for a rental (Carlos Beltran). They are looking for a bat or two, however.


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46 Comments on "Bowden On Padres, Tigers, Indians, Royals, Pirates"


forkball27
3 years 1 month ago

Would love to see the Tigers get Barney for a mid-level prospect, but I doubt that happens.

snapcase8p
3 years 1 month ago

Barney for McCann/Collins

3 years 1 month ago

Seems reasonable.

snapcase8p
3 years 1 month ago

I thought so lol. Cubs need a catcher but I don’t think Barney is worth Brantley but probably worth a little more than McCann. Personally, I think I’d rather trade Brantley for Infante than acquiring Barney.

3 years 1 month ago

Oh yea hands down. I’m with you there Barney is good and him and Infante are on pretty level ground as far as defense but Infante is the much better hitter.

EightMileCats
3 years 1 month ago

Yes please. Infante for Brantly would be fantastic

YODA777
3 years 1 month ago

Tampa needs a catcher, and Shields is up for grabs. I would save Brantley if it meant I could use him to get Shields to Detroit.

jammin502
3 years 1 month ago

Why would the Cubs trade a cheap controlled second baseman that will probably win the gold glove for a mid level prospect? I could see maybe including him in a deal with Garza to command better high level prospects.

leachim2
3 years 1 month ago

Phillips will win the Gold Glove because he is flashier

3 years 1 month ago

His range is easily the best when it comes to 2B in the league. BP gets to many balls that most wouldn’t.

sdsuphilip
3 years 1 month ago

His range maybe the best if you ignore Kendrick.

3 years 1 month ago

I was referring to the National League. Sorry if I wasn’t clear enough.

3 years 1 month ago

Gold gloves go to one guy in each league. Kendrik is in the AL.

cubs223425
3 years 1 month ago

Gold Gloves are determined by hitting and popularity, not defensive prowess.
Since the Cubs aren’t close to contention, I’d rather try to improve the farm and use someone else at second for a bit. I mean, Barney’s good on defense, but he’s not a good hitter or base stealer. He doesn’t hit for power. He doesn’t hit for a high average.

Basically, you’re getting a mediocre average (.260-.270), single-digit home runs, and maybe single-digit steals as well. All he offers is defense, so he shouldn’t command a whole lot, but it’s fine with me if others want to jack up his price based on UZR alone.

3 years 1 month ago

Gold Gloves are very overrated. Many times they do not go to the right guy. Hopefully one day in the future they will genuinely go to the best defender.

IHateJoeBuck
3 years 1 month ago

I cringe any time I hear someone say “he doesn’t hit well enough to earn a Gold Glove”. For once I’d like to hear “he doesn’t field well enough to earn a Silver Slugger”.

ctownboy
3 years 1 month ago

“Basically, you’re getting a mediocre average (.260-.270), single-digit
home runs, and maybe single-digit steals as well. All he offers is
defense…”

This is the problem with baseball today and the young people who are watching it and posting about it. What you just described is EXACTLY what you would have expected from a middle infielder before the Steroid Era.

Go look at the stats from before 1987 (before steroids and juiced baseballs) and see how many Runs a team would score during a year and then look at the offensive stats of the middle infielders.

Run scoring is down now not only because hitters can’t artificially pump up their stats but also because they have forgotten (or weren’t taught) to do the little things, things that players before the Steroid Era HAD to know and do because, if they didn’t, they wouldn’t have a job.

When players, especially little guys, have men on base and get two strikes on them, do they choke up ion the bat, shorten their swing and just try to make contact? No, they keep their hands in their usual spot on the bat and swing as hard as they can.

When hitters face junk ball pitchers like Bronson Arroyo and Mike Leake, do they move forward in the batters box so as to take away the breaking and off speed pitches while still being able to handle the slow fast ball? No, they stand at the back of the batters box, like they are facing Aroldis Chapman and then swing out in front of or over the top of the breaking pitches and change ups.

cubs223425
3 years 1 month ago

Umm…I think that you’re overstating something. There are SEVERAL second baseman who are capable of hitting the ball without being defensive butchers. Barney is currently 11th in second baseman WAR. Among those 12, Barney ranks:
–10th in AVG
–12th in OBP
–12th in SLG
–12th in HR
–9th in SB
–12th in R
–12th in RBI
–12th in ISO
–9th in BB%
–1st in K%
–12th in wOBA
–12th in wRC+
–2nd in UZR
Outside of fielding the position and not striking out, Barney doesn’t do much else. You’re talking about numbers expected based on the Steroid Era, but stats like wRC+ are weighted by your peers. He’s the only of those 12 batters who is rated as a below-average MLB hitter. In fact, Barney is 18th among the 23 “regular” second basemen in baseball (those who meet FanGraphs’ minimum plate appearances).
Sure, say it’s something wrong with “the young people.” I’m basing it on how Barney measures up against CURRENT batters in the league. All I said that he offers one true skill–defending the position. It’s a statistical fact that his offense is below-average, and by a pretty decent margin. It’s nothing to do with my age, it’s an issue with the hitter that Barney is.
I’m not calling the guy a worthless asset, I’m saying that if UZR doesn’t like him for one season, his WAR goes straight into the toilet because his offense is a drain on that.

Matt Mitchener
3 years 1 month ago

He’s only in his 2nd year of playing 2nd base and he’s making highlight plays every game. I doubt his fielding stats will go down. Right now BA has his defense as 2.8 WAR.

Barney is much better hitter than his results have shown. I was asking how a guy who only strikes out 8% of the time is hitting .260. It turns out Fangraphs believes he should be expected to have a .330 woba. link to fangraphs.com

IHateJoeBuck
3 years 1 month ago

There is little to no evidence that the “little things” have a meaningful impact the game. It’s an antiquated way to look at the game. Choking up on the bat does not improve contact rate. In most cases, bunting does not improve run scoring. There’s no reason to move up in the box against Bronson Arroyo. Take a look at his stats. Hitters do just fine against him.

cubs223425
3 years 1 month ago

There actually is a benefit to moving up in the box. It means less break on a looping curve and more velocity to turn into power on a fastball, but there is also the negative of adjusting to where you are standing in the box for different pitchers.
If you’re used to standing at the front against Arroyo all game, then Chapman enters? Well, you might be hosed adjusting to both the velocity of Chapman’s fastball and your overall timing of where the ball should be when you’re swinging.

IHateJoeBuck
3 years 1 month ago

There is some benefit, but probably no net benefit when considering all the factors you indicated above.

I acknowledge though that I may be completely wrong and hitters do adjust their position depending on the pitcher. However, as far as I’m aware, there’s no data in which to draw a logical conclusion as to the effect.

YODA777
3 years 1 month ago

I thought I was the only one who cant stand Joe Buck. The guy looks a little light in the loafers.

Njriv
3 years 1 month ago

I believe the only way the Tigers would get Barney would be in a package deal, I don’t see the Cubs trading Barney alone to Detroit.

cgriffith
3 years 1 month ago

Barney and Garza ???

Thomas Carrano
3 years 1 month ago

I feel that Street already costs to much so he’s wont be back so the pads will trade him and Quentin isn’t hitting like they thought in petco and they going to trade him too for some prospects.

johnsilver
3 years 1 month ago

Rizzo and his odd infatuation with BJ Upton…

OPS of .686 this year and has been steadily regressing for 3 and a half years. Strikes out nearly 30% of the time. Power numbers (XBH) % even going down. Are they just trying to move the contract of Morse or something? His contract thru next year is nearly a wash with what Upton is owed this year.

Seriously.. Why not just phone Cherrington and offer a nothing prospect for Pods.. he will cost league minimum and thru a tade less than 100AB with Boston before the OF roster crunch forced him being sent down, was far out producing Upton.

Keep Morse as a PH if they want. His bat will serve them better than Upton’s and Pods can play a decent CF and cost them nothing (nearly) in return.

popular_mechanics_for_pitchers
3 years 1 month ago

Why would the Nats want Pods? He hasn’t been an effective full time major leaguer in years.
The rays won’t make that deal (morse for upton)

senior52
3 years 1 month ago

Morse for Upton.Thats a joke.

sourbob
3 years 1 month ago

Barney is a two to three win player making the minimum who would single-handedly elevate the Tigers defense by about two levels…. and they figure that’s worth a mid level prospect?

cubs223425
3 years 1 month ago

One issue with that assessment is UZR. Not everyone picks it as their defensive metric of choice, and it has the potential for volatility in a single season. Since Barney cannot hit much, if his UZR sinks in a season, he quickly falls to replacement-level value.

IHateJoeBuck
3 years 1 month ago

As I Tigers fan, I’m amazed at how many Tigers fans are clamoring for Darwin Barney. After the interleague series earlier this year, you’d think he was Joe Morgan (as a player, not a broadcaster). Barney would represent an upgrade over the 2B wasteland trotted out this year, but he wouldn’t be an impact player at all.

cubs223425
3 years 1 month ago

I will disagree there. Tigers second basemen have totaled -2.2 wins on the season. Darwin Barney is sitting at 1.5 wins now, and was at 2.2 wins after 2011.
Based on 2012 production, Barwin Barney would be a 3.7-win improvement on the field for the Tigers, and over the course of the season, it could end up more like a 5-win difference for the conglomerate of losers Detroit’s running out there versus Barney.
Note: Barney is 3.7 wins better than what the Tigers have used so far and the Tigers are 3.5 wins behind the White Sox in the central.

IHateJoeBuck
3 years 1 month ago

He’s definitely an upgrade, but I hear many Tigers fans willing to sell the farm to get Barney, which I find ridiculous. I think Jamey Carroll or Marco Scutaro could provide similar production for a cheaper price.

cubs223425
3 years 1 month ago

I agree with the first two points, but disagree with the third. Scutaro’s almost a full win worse than Barney and Carroll’s half a win back. Then there is the matter of cost, as well as team control.
Scutaro is a FA after this season, and will cost probably about $2.5 million for the rest of 2012 (making $6 million total on the year). He will be 37 in October.
Carroll is getting $2.75 million this seaosn, so it would be maybe $1.25 million for the rest of the year. He then gets $3.75 million in 2013 and has a $2 million team option with a $250,000 buyout for 2014. So, in total, you’re guaranteeing about $5.25 million for 1.5 seasons of production to the multi-use infielder, but he is 38.
Now Barney, he is much different. He’s 27 in November, so he’s more than 10 years younger than both of these guys. He is also under team control through 2016 and doesn’t reach arbitration until after 2013. You’re getting 4.5 years of team control of a guy a decade younger thna the alternatives, and he’s already outperforming those guys.
I’d most definitely take Barney now and for the future, and I would say he is worth quite a bit more than Carroll or Scutaro, neither of whom I think it worth all that much in a trade.

Stuart Brown
3 years 1 month ago

Agreed. Infante or Scutaro are better options in my mind.

Walter Cook
3 years 1 month ago

The Giants can’t make a midseason trade like they did last year because they don’t have a prospect anywhere near as well-regarded as Wheeler. Their top high-level prospect, Gary Brown, is a B- prospect at best.

TheReturnOfMrBlanks
3 years 1 month ago

I have a feeling Brynes will address every need the Padres have with dealing several guys before the break. I know he says he doesn’t need to do “Anything” but he will. OF prospects would be my #1 and Starting pitching prospects #2, I’m actually very excited about the possibilities and honestly have not been excited about this team at all this year. (Besides Cabby stealing home, that was sick)

Beersy
3 years 1 month ago

I agree, this will be the most exciting time for Padres all season. Headley, Quentin, and Richard should go. Byrnes will be able to get good return for them and build up the farm system even more, while giving some young guys a shot. Do you notice that the Padres seem to do a lot better when the lineup is packed with kids who don’t concern themselves with Petco’s dimensions, but are just happy to be in the Bigs? It’s a shame so many of their pitching prospects got hurt this year, because this would have been a great time for them to get their feet wet.

TophersReds
3 years 1 month ago

Jeff Francoeur? You can have him Indians.

nathanalext
3 years 1 month ago

I was thinking if the Royals want to get rid of Francoeur that bad, why don’t they just DFA him? Nobody is going to trade for him if everyone knows they don’t actually want him.

Red_Line_9
3 years 1 month ago

There are reports that Wil Myers has been promoted to start Thursday’s game for the Royals

cubs223425
3 years 1 month ago

Prove that Darwin Barney WILL hit. In more than a year and a half, he hasn’t hit. What proof do you have that he will hit?

cubs223425
3 years 1 month ago

I have no obligation to prove anything because I made no claim that he WON’T hit, while you DID say he will hit. All I’ve stated so far is that he hasn’t been good on offense. Even in AAA, his wRC+ was below-average. He has not shown an ability to be an above-average hitter consistently yet, and I’ve used that as a point in determining his trade value.

cubs223425
3 years 1 month ago

I never suggested that they were. However, I think that they are looking at him for his defense, not his offense. That, and compared to what Detroit’s BEEN using, I think that a broom would be an upgrade in their eyes.

sourbob
3 years 1 month ago

He’s got a fairly average bat for a 2B. That is, nothing to write home about, but not awful. When paired with terrific defense though, you get a guy who’s worth 2 or so WAR a year. That’d be a huge upgrade for Detroit.

I wish I understood the urge to talk up a guy’s downside as though somehow that would drive down his price.