Most guys don't get to retire on their own terms. The decision is made for them. Of course they can keep playing in independent leagues for as long as they want, but how many of you are aware that Mat Latos is still pitching somewhere this year (i.e. Southern Maryland Crabs of the Atlantic League)?
with the Covid protocols, it means we will see Vince take a rotation slot..Just what I want to see..He'll have 67 pitches in the 3rd inning..it will be 4 walks a wild pitch, and one hit resulting in 3 runs..When I see him on the mound, I get the same feeling in my stomach I get when Hector Scare-us comes into a tight game..
Not really. Every hitter rakes in Mexican League and every pitcher struggles. It doesn't prove anything. Plus, Puig has nothing to prove on-the-fieldt. He's clearly getting blacklisted for off-the-field reason.
He tried to turn things around while with the Reds. But everyone saw through him and realize he’s still that immature kid. His ego was way to big and allowed that to ruin his career. Heck, he may have been extended by the Dodgers if his off field issues never happened. Puig was definitely a star before everything came crashing down.
The Rangers are reportedly chomping at the bit next off season to sign Story and make him their cornerstone player. He's from DFW and grew up a Rangers fan. They have only 33 million committed to salaries next year.
Enjoy your retirement. He was definitely a good player especially with the Pirates. Seeing him play in the other side as a Cardinals fan I really like him. The Pirates had a great team not that long ago.
Almost wasn’t a Neil walker. His dad was supposed to be on the plane that Roberto Clemente died on. I think that’s pretty well known, but maybe some people don’t know. Solid career for Neil
He was not being signed BEFORE the case hit the news. It certinaly seems like there is something going on below the surface that no one wants to talk about. Its also unique that some historically media adverse players have had things to say about him as a teammate and person. Id love for a burner account from a team or actual player to come on and talk about what the league perception is on Puig that clearly is keeping him out of all orgs.
If a player is vaccinated, would they be exempt from going on the COVID list? Do they have to be fully vaccinated?
I'm strongly for getting vaccinated for many, many reasons but wouldn't players want to get vaccinated for the primary reason of keeping them in the lineup and helping their team win games?
Congrats Neil Walker. Hometown star and well loved/respected player for the city of Pittsburgh. You seen the good and bad years in Pittsburgh. I know when you left Pittsburgh, you wanted a WS for the city. Your role in Pittsburgh was top notch and very proud of watching you play in the Pirates uniform. Enjoy the next chapter in your life Neil! You’ll always be a Pirate in my eyes.
Wasn't he a Scott Boras client? He thought he deserved 5 year 75 million, but instead he had to sign for 2 million during spring training. Then he stunk up the joint due to no spring training (just like Stephen Drew and Kendry Morales years ago) and was never the same. Another guy whose career was ruined by greed. Funny thing is the Mets gave him a 17 million qualifying offer the year before because they were so scared to lose his mediocre production.
I, for one, am glad the era of overpaying Neil Walker, Jason Heyward, Dexter Fowler, Ian Desmond, Pablo Sandoval, Nick Markakis is finally over.
I know. I’m just raising this as an example of where the new policy needs to be clarified. Should it matter if it’s civil versus criminal, or an accusation? If transactions are connected to the original case, should posts be closed?
Just simply pointing out potential issues with policy.
Puig is one pallet short of a load. He refuses to conform, and except he hits .280 or above no one is going to pay him millions to play. His jerseys were hot once, but spousal abuse, DUI’s , etc. drive down the demand.
Can we have a post at the beginning of the season featuring unsigned players? We'll just assume if we don't hear anything from them regarding continued interest in playing (let alone interest) that they're automatically retired.
He’s a lot better than Delmon Young and perfectly good enough to be an everyday player. Young washing out at a young age had nothing to do with his off-the-field issue, but for being a replacement-level slap hitter (empty batting average, doesn’t take walks), defensively-challenged fat arse, and liability on the basepath.
The Braves, Nationals and Marlins have all looked into Sanchez, whose last bullpen session was truncated by a laceration on his middle finger that ought to have healed up by now. There’s interest from a couple of AL clubs as well, per Rosenthal.
Serious question. Doesn’t his case involve a domestic violence situation? As such, shouldn’t this particular thread be closed for comments? If not, where does sexual violence fall?
Not saying this thread should be closed, but I think you all need to establish a clear line.
Osuna isn't blackballed. He's attempting to pitch with torn UCL and teams don't think he would be effective. He should just get Tommy John out of the way and sign a Ken Giles-type contract.
Clearly there's something we're not privy to with the guy. On a pure talent basis, there is no reason why he shouldn't have been signed a long time ago.
He's productive enough to play everyday, so he's absolutely worth the trouble if he's willing to take a cheap contract. Millionaires get sued all the time for all sorts of things and most of them settle out of court, including plenty of MLB players. Puig is not charged criminally.
I think Osuna is recovering from TJS, isn't he? Hard to say he was blackballed.. dude played 2.5 years after he served his suspension for domestic violence and the Houston Astros traded for him.
I'm sure all teams are taking the allegations against Puig seriously.. but even if he is cleared of any wrongdoing, there is a lot more going on. He is just a constant distraction and doesn't produce on the field. He isnt worth the trouble.
It's a civil suit, not a criminal one. Any of us can file suit against Puig for sexual assault in a civil case today. What this proves is that even if he didn't do it, he probably should've just paid her off instead of being cheap. One spiteful ex or money-grubbing groupie is enough to ruin your career despite no criminal charges in this day and age.
I think you know. Only one of the guys Steve named ever killed anybody (well... Randy Johnson killed that bird in 2001 Spring Training, but that's a different story).
Steve said in a live chat about a year ago that the Red Sox are hoping JDM opts out. The only way a player opts out is if he is producing at a level where his team is begging him not to opt out.
Greene has been pitching better than the metrics for a couple years at least. Maybe he's lucky or maybe the metrics are off but nobody is meeting his asking price. So don't just point a finger at Braves. I also don't know the asking price but main point is that he hasn't drawn takers across the board. That's my read of the situation.
They don't want Tucker on the Big Club unless he gets regular action. He will get that at alternative training site. Based on very limited look-see last year, Tucker needs more development, which he is more likely to get below the big club.
He's claiming that he was unjustly accused and that the matter was consensual, in a recent statement he prepared with his lawyers. He seems like he's not backing down and that he's willing to fight to prove - correctly or incorrectly depending on your point of view - his innocence.
It is because of the sexual assault case, which is still unresolved. Even if Puig is cleared of any wrongdoing.. the guy just seems like way more of a headache than his on-field production is worth.
@Samuel
That's fine, but that does nothing for this team this year? Again, with you being the GM and forced to stay under the Luxury Tax. How would you fix the team?
Fully agree, there's close to zero chance of the A's picking up Correa. He's also a cheating punk, and even though he's talented, I wouldn't even want him on the team.. plus we have to save $ for Olson, Chappy, Laureano, etc.. we'll be lucky if we keep one or two.
Pug's career reminds me a lot of Delmon Young's. A guy with huge potention and could shine at times but never found consistency. Both had off field issues which cut short their MLB careers at a young age.
To me, it's clear that as the younger player Correa gets more total dollars while Story gets a higher AAV. As for performance over the next seven years, it depends on whether you want to bet on Correa's upside or Story's consistency. Personally, I'd choose Correa if he can stay healthy, which is a pretty big if.
It shouldn't be surprising, he's been kinda out-of-control since his rookie year when he got busted doing 110MPH in Alligator Alley. When you lack discipline and maturity, most teams will view you as a detriment. I saw this coming a mile away.
I'd have talked to the owner. Tell him that a WS appearance with an aging, oft-injured roster of one-dimensional, overpaid and unmovable players would not be a reality in the next few years. It was time to take a few steps back and totally revamp the organization from top to bottom. Specifically, learn to draft and develop pitchers.
Dozens of teams the last 2-3 years if I look it up. Which I won't bother doing.
The White Sox. Royals. Rays. Dodgers. Padres. Cardinals. Red Sox. Indians. Braves. Astros. A's. My goodness, at least half the teams in MLB. Just about all of the contenders....not sure there's a contender that hasn't brought up at least 3 solid, productive players in one year of the past 2-3.
I think Story gets more per year on a shorter deal. Not having to play in Colorado should make his offensive value more consistent with less adjusting to high altitude and better hitters around him.
Oh he might especially if DH is in both leagues and he has a typical JD year. With more teams needing a DH his value could be greatly raised and with Boras as his agent he will jump all over that.
Baltimore expressed an interest in Puig as recently as January. He'd rather play in the Mexican League? Does that say something about him or the Orioles?
I'll give you the cheating and durability issues. But attitude problems? He is considered a leader and that will be attractive to other teams. I'm not aware of any attitude problems. Sounds like you're a hater.
Tim, didn't you ever hear that the boss isn't supposed to work so hard? A lot of fine work here my man, kudos to you. In the end, my opinion is Correa is younger and there is doubt surrounding Story's numbers due to the Coors effect. So, despite durability concerns, I think Carlos has more earning power. But it's very close.
When Puig came up in 2013, finished 2nd in Rookie of the Year voting and made the All-Star game in 2014, I never would have guessed he would have went an entire season without a contract and then would have to settle for a deal with the Mexican League with little to no interest from other MLB teams. Yeah I know he had that domestic violence case, but aside from that, almost no other news has been surrounding Puig.
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Most guys don't get to retire on their own terms. The decision is made for them. Of course they can keep playing in independent leagues for as long as they want, but how many of you are aware that Mat Latos is still pitching somewhere this year (i.e. Southern Maryland Crabs of the Atlantic League)?
For a sec I thought this was saying that Sixto was the 37 year old Sanchez, not Anibal.
What is it with the Phillies center fielders? Non of them can hit anything..
with the Covid protocols, it means we will see Vince take a rotation slot..Just what I want to see..He'll have 67 pitches in the 3rd inning..it will be 4 walks a wild pitch, and one hit resulting in 3 runs..When I see him on the mound, I get the same feeling in my stomach I get when Hector Scare-us comes into a tight game..
Not really. Every hitter rakes in Mexican League and every pitcher struggles. It doesn't prove anything. Plus, Puig has nothing to prove on-the-fieldt. He's clearly getting blacklisted for off-the-field reason.
He tried to turn things around while with the Reds. But everyone saw through him and realize he’s still that immature kid. His ego was way to big and allowed that to ruin his career. Heck, he may have been extended by the Dodgers if his off field issues never happened. Puig was definitely a star before everything came crashing down.
The Rangers are reportedly chomping at the bit next off season to sign Story and make him their cornerstone player. He's from DFW and grew up a Rangers fan. They have only 33 million committed to salaries next year.
Enjoy your retirement. He was definitely a good player especially with the Pirates. Seeing him play in the other side as a Cardinals fan I really like him. The Pirates had a great team not that long ago.
Could've made a lot more on a long-term deal back in 2017-2018, but he got greedy. He could've been the infield version of Dexter Fowler right now.
Almost wasn’t a Neil walker. His dad was supposed to be on the plane that Roberto Clemente died on. I think that’s pretty well known, but maybe some people don’t know. Solid career for Neil
He was not being signed BEFORE the case hit the news. It certinaly seems like there is something going on below the surface that no one wants to talk about. Its also unique that some historically media adverse players have had things to say about him as a teammate and person. Id love for a burner account from a team or actual player to come on and talk about what the league perception is on Puig that clearly is keeping him out of all orgs.
Question about the covid rules.
If a player is vaccinated, would they be exempt from going on the COVID list? Do they have to be fully vaccinated?
I'm strongly for getting vaccinated for many, many reasons but wouldn't players want to get vaccinated for the primary reason of keeping them in the lineup and helping their team win games?
Congrats Neil Walker. Hometown star and well loved/respected player for the city of Pittsburgh. You seen the good and bad years in Pittsburgh. I know when you left Pittsburgh, you wanted a WS for the city. Your role in Pittsburgh was top notch and very proud of watching you play in the Pirates uniform. Enjoy the next chapter in your life Neil! You’ll always be a Pirate in my eyes.
Wasn't he a Scott Boras client? He thought he deserved 5 year 75 million, but instead he had to sign for 2 million during spring training. Then he stunk up the joint due to no spring training (just like Stephen Drew and Kendry Morales years ago) and was never the same. Another guy whose career was ruined by greed. Funny thing is the Mets gave him a 17 million qualifying offer the year before because they were so scared to lose his mediocre production.
I, for one, am glad the era of overpaying Neil Walker, Jason Heyward, Dexter Fowler, Ian Desmond, Pablo Sandoval, Nick Markakis is finally over.
Fried has nasty stuff. I think he rebounds.
They didn't need to pass any protocol, they just had side effects from the second vaccine.
I know. I’m just raising this as an example of where the new policy needs to be clarified. Should it matter if it’s civil versus criminal, or an accusation? If transactions are connected to the original case, should posts be closed?
Just simply pointing out potential issues with policy.
Those who go by sabermetrics and algorithms call him Elmon Young since there was no D(efense) in his game.
How about licking his bat? Does that qualify?
Kind of sad to see a fringe hall of fame career end like this. Hopefully he'll get into Cooperstown but I'm not sure.
@metsfan22
I hope so man, btw Taijuan Walker and Stroman look like studs so far. Hopefully Max Fried returns to at least 2019 form when he's healthy.
Puig is one pallet short of a load. He refuses to conform, and except he hits .280 or above no one is going to pay him millions to play. His jerseys were hot once, but spousal abuse, DUI’s , etc. drive down the demand.
Plenty of players have gone to Mexico, completely mashed the ball, and made it back to the Major Leagues. Puig wouldn't be the first.
It's a civil case. He's not charged criminally. Anybody can sue you civilly, even someone you never met.
That’s funny, but they’re his last team and the one he wore out his welcome with. They wanted no part of bringing him back.
Since Gott was DFA guess Zaidi hoping to pull off a deal for minor league player.
Can we have a post at the beginning of the season featuring unsigned players? We'll just assume if we don't hear anything from them regarding continued interest in playing (let alone interest) that they're automatically retired.
He’s a lot better than Delmon Young and perfectly good enough to be an everyday player. Young washing out at a young age had nothing to do with his off-the-field issue, but for being a replacement-level slap hitter (empty batting average, doesn’t take walks), defensively-challenged fat arse, and liability on the basepath.
I guess he wanted a trip to Mexico that didn’t require assistance from the cartels like his previous defections.
The Braves, Nationals and Marlins have all looked into Sanchez, whose last bullpen session was truncated by a laceration on his middle finger that ought to have healed up by now. There’s interest from a couple of AL clubs as well, per Rosenthal.
Isn't three plus a couple equal to five?
No, but he purposefully chose not to take a preventative measure that almost everyone else did. So that part is on him.
Lacks maturity and drive. Natural talent can only get you so far
Serious question. Doesn’t his case involve a domestic violence situation? As such, shouldn’t this particular thread be closed for comments? If not, where does sexual violence fall?
Not saying this thread should be closed, but I think you all need to establish a clear line.
Osuna isn't blackballed. He's attempting to pitch with torn UCL and teams don't think he would be effective. He should just get Tommy John out of the way and sign a Ken Giles-type contract.
Clearly there's something we're not privy to with the guy. On a pure talent basis, there is no reason why he shouldn't have been signed a long time ago.
Big Dummy
He's productive enough to play everyday, so he's absolutely worth the trouble if he's willing to take a cheap contract. Millionaires get sued all the time for all sorts of things and most of them settle out of court, including plenty of MLB players. Puig is not charged criminally.
As a Met fan I am grateful for his performance in 2016. Have a great next stage of your life, Neil!
Baseball isn't a chemistry sport and frankly most MLB players are no choir boys either.
Good player and a class act. That trade for Niese was a good one for the Mets.
Like if you were here before all the "congrats" comments.
It was announced today that ESPN will stream some LMB games. I think the Bartolo Colon starts will be likely targets. Colon facing Puog is enticing.
$52 million aint bad, best of luck to Neil in retirement!
I think Osuna is recovering from TJS, isn't he? Hard to say he was blackballed.. dude played 2.5 years after he served his suspension for domestic violence and the Houston Astros traded for him.
I'm sure all teams are taking the allegations against Puig seriously.. but even if he is cleared of any wrongdoing, there is a lot more going on. He is just a constant distraction and doesn't produce on the field. He isnt worth the trouble.
It's a civil suit, not a criminal one. Any of us can file suit against Puig for sexual assault in a civil case today. What this proves is that even if he didn't do it, he probably should've just paid her off instead of being cheap. One spiteful ex or money-grubbing groupie is enough to ruin your career despite no criminal charges in this day and age.
93 Home Runs!
I think you know. Only one of the guys Steve named ever killed anybody (well... Randy Johnson killed that bird in 2001 Spring Training, but that's a different story).
He didn’t purposely get Covid
They were never interested. Puig's agent leaked that to drive up interest.
Steve said in a live chat about a year ago that the Red Sox are hoping JDM opts out. The only way a player opts out is if he is producing at a level where his team is begging him not to opt out.
Overrated.
Who is the murderer?
Greene has been pitching better than the metrics for a couple years at least. Maybe he's lucky or maybe the metrics are off but nobody is meeting his asking price. So don't just point a finger at Braves. I also don't know the asking price but main point is that he hasn't drawn takers across the board. That's my read of the situation.
They don't want Tucker on the Big Club unless he gets regular action. He will get that at alternative training site. Based on very limited look-see last year, Tucker needs more development, which he is more likely to get below the big club.
This is not unexpected. The Giants were simply waiting till McGee and Webb passed Covid protocols. Selman will be back. Gott, maybe not.
He's claiming that he was unjustly accused and that the matter was consensual, in a recent statement he prepared with his lawyers. He seems like he's not backing down and that he's willing to fight to prove - correctly or incorrectly depending on your point of view - his innocence.
Simmons tested positive like a week ago
It is because of the sexual assault case, which is still unresolved. Even if Puig is cleared of any wrongdoing.. the guy just seems like way more of a headache than his on-field production is worth.
Turner would have been a better defender in CF than SS in my opinion.
@Samuel
That's fine, but that does nothing for this team this year? Again, with you being the GM and forced to stay under the Luxury Tax. How would you fix the team?
Fully agree, there's close to zero chance of the A's picking up Correa. He's also a cheating punk, and even though he's talented, I wouldn't even want him on the team.. plus we have to save $ for Olson, Chappy, Laureano, etc.. we'll be lucky if we keep one or two.
Pug's career reminds me a lot of Delmon Young's. A guy with huge potention and could shine at times but never found consistency. Both had off field issues which cut short their MLB careers at a young age.
Chief called for you, Egon. He said this take ain't it.
So Osuna and Puig get blackballed, but Chapman gets to stay?
And Pedroia was often seen in the dugout prior to his retirement.
To me, it's clear that as the younger player Correa gets more total dollars while Story gets a higher AAV. As for performance over the next seven years, it depends on whether you want to bet on Correa's upside or Story's consistency. Personally, I'd choose Correa if he can stay healthy, which is a pretty big if.
Bob Watson didn’t develop those teams! Watson inherited those teams.
Wouldn't have he tested positive also if that were the case?
Story no doubt. He's a classy player too (unlike the other player mentioned)
Thoughts and prayers for a speedy recovery.
Appreciate the in-depth comparison, Tim. Choosing between them is very difficult.
"Why use wRC+? It’s park-adjusted, so it neutralizes the fact that Story has played 50.7% of his games in Coors Field."
Doesn't OPS+ do this as well? OPS+ has Correa by a decent margin, but I'd go with Story because of durability issues.
Hayzee, this might draw some ugly attention but you have some writing skill.
It shouldn't be surprising, he's been kinda out-of-control since his rookie year when he got busted doing 110MPH in Alligator Alley. When you lack discipline and maturity, most teams will view you as a detriment. I saw this coming a mile away.
#MeToo is still a thing, so we have to wait until that blows over one way or another.
If he mashes down in Mexico, he'll be back.
I don't know if you'd want Taylor as your everyday SS in the long term, but he appeals to every team in some way.
@ Lamar Smith;
I'd have talked to the owner. Tell him that a WS appearance with an aging, oft-injured roster of one-dimensional, overpaid and unmovable players would not be a reality in the next few years. It was time to take a few steps back and totally revamp the organization from top to bottom. Specifically, learn to draft and develop pitchers.
Respectfully, it’s probably because of the whole raping someone thing.
What did he do?
@ Flyby;
Are you serious?
Dozens of teams the last 2-3 years if I look it up. Which I won't bother doing.
The White Sox. Royals. Rays. Dodgers. Padres. Cardinals. Red Sox. Indians. Braves. Astros. A's. My goodness, at least half the teams in MLB. Just about all of the contenders....not sure there's a contender that hasn't brought up at least 3 solid, productive players in one year of the past 2-3.
How many weeks have you been following MLB?
I think Story gets more per year on a shorter deal. Not having to play in Colorado should make his offensive value more consistent with less adjusting to high altitude and better hitters around him.
@Very
Fire Cashman? Ok, I will ask you as a GM what would you have done definitely knowing you had cash restraints because of the Luxury tax?
One would have to define "legitimate threat". I think they have already proven they are a "threat" to me a "threat": is different than a "contender"
Oh he might especially if DH is in both leagues and he has a typical JD year. With more teams needing a DH his value could be greatly raised and with Boras as his agent he will jump all over that.
Baltimore expressed an interest in Puig as recently as January. He'd rather play in the Mexican League? Does that say something about him or the Orioles?
Teams talk.
I'll give you the cheating and durability issues. But attitude problems? He is considered a leader and that will be attractive to other teams. I'm not aware of any attitude problems. Sounds like you're a hater.
Veracruz is also an obscure model from Hyundai. So, he's got that going for him.
Did his domestic violence case ever get resolved?
When he can't cut it in the Mexican League; he'll sign with Cleveland.
Tim, didn't you ever hear that the boss isn't supposed to work so hard? A lot of fine work here my man, kudos to you. In the end, my opinion is Correa is younger and there is doubt surrounding Story's numbers due to the Coors effect. So, despite durability concerns, I think Carlos has more earning power. But it's very close.
i think you know why...
Davis
Villar
Minor league prospect
Thank you Andrelton Simmons! Can't wait for him to be gone with his loony-tune conspiracy beliefs.
Why is this talented young man not on a major league team? Respectful dialogue only, please.
Lol at this article. Story all the way...
WTH? It’s amazing he couldn’t get a deal in the majors. Wow!
well im sure there will be interest if the case resolves in a matter that reflects less ill on him. but now...
He can only blame himself.
When Puig came up in 2013, finished 2nd in Rookie of the Year voting and made the All-Star game in 2014, I never would have guessed he would have went an entire season without a contract and then would have to settle for a deal with the Mexican League with little to no interest from other MLB teams. Yeah I know he had that domestic violence case, but aside from that, almost no other news has been surrounding Puig.