THURSDAY, 10:31pm: Damon and Scott Boras are seeking a two-year commitment from the Tigers, according to Lynn Henning of The Detroit News. Detroit is pushing for a one-year deal and will have to pay $7MM "or more" for his services in 2010.
WEDNESDAY, 9:35am: Jon Paul Morosi of FOX Sports, formerly of the Tigers beat, believes Boras is trying to appeal to owner Mike Ilitch as he did for Ivan Rodriguez and Magglio Ordonez in the past. Morosi believes a Damon deal with the Tigers "is a distinct possibility."
TUESDAY, 6:25pm: Johnny Damon would play in Detroit, but the Tigers haven't spoken with agent Scott Boras and their level of interest in the left fielder remains unclear. This week Boras told the Detroit News and the Detroit Free Press that Damon would play in the Motor City, citing his client's will to win and fondness for manager Jim Leyland.
They should do a Damon sign-and-trade with the Yankees
For?
Nick Johnson? Sergio Mitre? Chad Gaudin? Brett Gardner? 3-Team Deal?
Mitre has 0 value.
Questionable.
Why would the Yankees even sign Nick Johnson if their intent was to turn around and trade him for Damon when they could have just signed Damon? Besides, I think there’s some rule about trading recently signed FA’s.
Well, I think that the Nick Johnson was unnecessary. The Yankees could have just waited out the market until Damon had lowered his price and then signed him then. Maybe not Nick Johnson. But a Brett Gardner or Mark Melancon deal should do it.
can’t trade Nick until June 1st I believe.
Granderson, it’s reverse entropy.
Curtis Granderson
The Tigers should stand pat with that offer. They don’t want to commit to two years when a great bunch of outfielders will be on the market next off-season.
makes no sense………
The Yankees would most likely what ? sit him on the bench?
Granderson in Left, Gardner in center, Swisher in right?
I’m assuming sarcasm.
Or at least hoping.
No not sarcasim at all…Carl Crawford, Jayson Werth, Brad Hawpe, Jose Guillen, David DeJesus, and Adam Dunn are all on the market next hot stove league.
What Damon means is: “Just pay me the most money”.
I don’t see how Damon is an upgrade over Raburn.
Are you serious?
Better defense
Can play CF and RF as well as LF
More power
Similar OBP
Only less contact and SB ability
you have no idea what you are talking about.
Actually, I agree. Damon at this point in his career is not an upgrade over Raburn.
He does know what he’s talking about. Below is each players UZR and UZR/150 in the outfield last year. You make the choice as to who is who.
-7.8 -36.1
2.9 8.4
In case you don’t know, Damon was the top two. So defensively, Raburn appears to be better. And, like bbxxj said, can play all three of the outfield positions.
Power, they are close to the same along with OBP. Damon hit 24 HRs, 3 3B, 36 2B in 143 games OBP .365. Raburn hit 16 HRs, 2 3B, 11 2B in 113 games. Damon has a minor edge of Raburn OBP .359. Let us also keep in mind though that 19 of Damons 24 HRs came in the new Yankee Stadium, which has become overly talked about being VERY hitter friendly for LH batters.
The only thing Damon has over Raburn is his experience. I completely disagree with you saying his doesn’t know what he’s talking about when in fact he’s way right.
Not at all…Damon has a higher avg w/RISP and is proven…Simple as that. Raburn is quite streaky and All of his Yankee Stadium homers could turn in to doubles at Comerica. I wouldnt take Raburn over Damon for a second and if you would, it’s your opinion.
Alright I’m sorry for the rude comment.
UZR FTW! It is a great argument stopper, and you played that ace at the right time. And remember that Raburn had WAY less ABs to hit his 16 bombs, because of low PT in the first half of the year.
Damon is 37 years old, so it is reasonable to expect his production to decline. Only in the steroid ERA did a players numbers improve in there late 30`s. I like what the Yankees have done. Damon may have priced himself out of a job and he will need to come down in his salary demands.
Damon is not 37.
17 of his 24, actually. =P.
But the guy does know what he is talking about. For a little bit less production in a few areas of offense, you get a significantly better player overall.
A “Significantly better player” who provides “a little bit less production”?
classic!
the little bit less production was in terms of his offense. Significantly better in terms of his ability to actually play defense.
You asked for it:
Outside of Yankee stadium, where both players would be playing in this scenario:
Damon:
UZR/150 in LF: -12.1
.284/.349/.446/.795
308 PA
18 2B
3 3B
7 HR
6 SB
Raburn
UZR/150 in LF: +5.6
.290/.357/.531/.888
292 PA
11 2B
2 3B
16 HR
5 SB
So in nearly the exact same amount of PA Raburn had a higher BA, OBP, SLG, OPS, HR, and better UZR by 17.7 units. Damon on the other hand had more 2B and one more steal. Oh, and Raburn will be 28 and Damon will be 36.
So I have no idea what I am talking about.
No, Damon is extremely clutch and UZR doesnt matter in this case because Damon is primarily a DH. Ryan Raburn was very streaky and for all of the home runs that Damon wont hit anywhere else will turn in to doubles.
1. Gona sell me on clutchieness? Ok…
2. Every game Damon plays at DH, both Guillen’s -12.7 UZR/150 in LF and Ordonez’s -5.4 UZR/150 in RF will be out there instead of replacing one with Raburns positive UZR/150. So yeah, Damon’s UZR/150 does matter.
3. HR are better than doubles.
Listen, I wasn’t trying to be mean at all I was just stating my opinion. What you are not getting, is that I think that Damon could still be a Tiger…As can Raburn…In the same lineup everyday. It’s for Jim Leyland to decide but I’m just saying I don’t think it’s fair to say that the Tigers should not sign Damon based on UZR/150. If Raburn was that good, I don’t think there would be any statement from Dave talking about a new left fielder.
Actually, You being a Braves fan…I think that Raburn would be good on the Braves.
my apologies for the rude comment.
Flawless victory.
and if Raburn was this good, he would have played all 162 last year.
You forget about Carlos Guillen.
While Raburn had good numbers this year, he is arguably the worst fielding outfielder in the game. Damon may have a bad arm, but he is a much better LF than Raburn or Guillen is. So he would be obviously be a huge defensive upgrade over our current situation.
Also, Damon is a lefty bat. Of which Detroit is in desperately short supply.
He also has a history of playing every day, which Raburn does not.
He has a proven history of being able to hit at the top of the order. At this moment, there is no reason to assume that either Jackson or Sizemore and his ankle are ready to hit at the top of the order. Say what you want about Damon, but he’ll be on base more than a few times when Miguel Cabrera is at the plate.
An incentive laden 1 yr or 2 yr deal makes a lot of sense. Hope we land Damon.
The damon who hasnt played more then 143 games the last three years or over 149 the last 5 seasons has “a history of playing every day”? Really?
“While Raburn had good numbers this year, he is arguably the worst fielding outfielder in the game”
Based off the career +5.6 UZR/150 in Left and +7.9 UZR/150 in center? That equals “the worst” now?
Seriously though, what Damon brings to the table is only arguably equal to what Raburn should be able to provide based off recent showing. When the 8 year age gap and roughly 7 MM (per year if they must do 2) cost difference is factored, you have Damon as being nothing but a big waste of money for a Tigers team that has recently shed pieces to save the money they would be straight blowing here.
You see Suzys…typically when a major league baseball player has more than 600 plate appearance, he is considered an “every day player.” It’s a term those in baseball use to distinguish between those who play pretty much every single game and those who don’t.
And yes…Statistically speaking (as well as to the naked eye), Ryan Raburn is arguably the worst fielding outfielder in the game. Of all American League LF in 2009 (with at least 20 starts), Raburn placed dead last in fielding percentage…by a mile. He had the same amount of errors as Damon did, in barely one-third of the innings!
He was drafted and came up as a 3b, and later as a 2b, not an outfielder. He just doesn’t look good out there…Who can forget when he let the ball get by him against the Twins last year in game 163? Bottom of the 10th, Tigers up one run, 3 outs from the division. Cuddyer hit a sinking liner into left and instead of fielding it on one hop and holding Cuddyer to a single, Raburn made a horrendous half-dive/half-stumble effort at it and the ball got by him and rolled all the way to the wall. Cuddyer went all the way to third and later scored the tying run. Twins won it later…bye bye division.
That being said, I actually like Raburn. Especially his pop against LHP> But I like him more in the role he played last year, not as–here it is again Suzys–an “every day player.”
…
Did you really just say Raburn is arguably one of the worst fielding outfielders in the game…and that Damon is better than him….?
My god, I pray you were being super-sarcastic.
Ummm…have you ever watched Raburn play the OF? Obviously not. He had the worst fielding percentage for any American League left fielder (with at least 20 starts) and the 2nd worst in all of baseball (behind only Alphonso Soriano).
Damon has a career .990 fielding percentage and has led the AL in put outs three times.
God I hate being right all the time.
LOL. You’re quoting fielding percentage as your argument.
You sir are bad at trolling.
fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=2218&posit…
have fun with those left field numbers.
Here is something no one is considering… If Damon signs with the Tigers (or just away from the Yankees), will he go back to his caveman look? It could effect negotiations!
Damon had his fully grown beard because it hurt too much to shave it while he was having post concussion symptoms with the Red Sox.
Source: Yankee Years
Zero. That should be the Tigers interest in Damon. Dudes desperate and just trying to milk someone for money.
Tigers22, that really is not the case. This is a guy who goes all out everyday he takes the field and it would be a fantastic insurance option for injuries (Ordonez and Guillen) and also if Austin Jackson isn’t quite ready for the big time. Why would we not give him a 1-year deal? It really makes no sense. Dave D and Scott Boras need to get together and make this happen before Spring training, he will fit nicely into the lead off or #2 spot in the order and score atleast 100 runs hitting in front of Cabby and Ordonez.
Tigers22, that is not the case at all! This guy is a proven winner and he is the LH bat with some pop that Detroit needs in that order. We cannot go into the year relying on 2 rookies (Jackson and Sizemore) to get on base consistantly for Miggy and Maggs to drive in. He hits for average, has decent speed and can be a mentor to Austin Jackson, and he also will be a good insurance policy for injuries and if Jackson proves not ready for the bigs. Being a Tigers fan, I also don’t feel terribly comfortable going into the year with Clete “strike out or pop up” Thomas as our extra outfielder. Dave D, if you are listening, MAKE THIS HAPPEN!
Lol yeah right dude… all along he’s been holding out for more money, and now he’s taking this “I can help you win approach”. He’s desperate. And considering he wants to get paid I don’t think he wants to be a 4th outfielder. He also isn’t insurance for Jackson because there is NO way he’s playing center anymore, especially not in Comerica. I’ve said it before we already have enough aging corner outfielders, and they won’t sign him as a full time DH. And yeah I would rather let Clete/Casper Wells/Wilkin Ramirez battle in out in the spring… let one of these guys step up and play up to their full potential. They only way I’d ever like this is if it came VERY cheaply, but if he was going to sign cheap he would’ve went back to NY. I just really don’t want them to spend their money on him.
You just beat me to the punch…
I completely agree. I think Ramirez has some major potential and has the speed to be able to let Jackson play more Right-Center to make up for the speed Maggs is losing.
Oops, look at it twice! It makes more sense the more you read it!!! LOL
It’s different though…
In asked how Damon’s bat would profile in Comerica Park super agent Scott Boras had the following to say, “Johnny Damon’s .363 batting average .412 on base % and .961 on base + slugging speaks for itself. We fully believe those numbers could be sustained throughout the season. He has also stolen 30+ bases as recently as 2003.”
When asked about one year deals he replied with the following, “That’s something we now realize we need to take into consideration. Let the bidding begin at $12,999,999.99.”
Yeah, and those stats are also from the 40 games below .500 Tiger teams too…
As i said before damon screwed himself by not resigning with the yanks and now he is desperate to play for anyone hint the term i would love to play with them , i love damon as a person and player but it wouldnt bother me if he had to sit out for a while and you cant blame it all on boras because damon could have stepped in like arod did
If we can get Damon at 2 years 12MM I’d take him. 1) He is the leadoff/2-hole hitter they need that can steal bases. 2) Has ample playoff experience 3) Sells tickets 4) Is a good replacement for Magglio when he leaves after this season. 5) He insures Magglio leaves this season. (Guillen and Magglio will most likely platoon. 6) Detroit doesnt lure a ton of free agents. By grabbing Valverde for 7MM Damon for 6MM, they still have 37MM of next years 50MM to spend. They need a left-fielder (Crawford 20MM), ss (Everett 2MM), 3b (resign Inge-8MM), and maybe a veteran starting pitcher (7MM). Assuming one of those is filled with a prospect, they still have plenty of money and a vastly improved team.
Detroit 2011 team
LF Carl Crawford
RF Johnny Damon
1b MCab
C Avila (I can only dream)
DH Carlos Guillen
3b Inge
CF A-Jax
2b Sizemore
SS Everett
With the money we’re freeing up they can field a much better team then just adding Damon and Crawford next year. I’d be all for the Crawford idea but Damon isn’t the answer for this team. And Avila as the cleanup hitter in his 2nd year is pretty ambitious, even if it is just you dreaming
I agree, the only thing is Carlos Guillen is guaranteed to be here in 2011. I can’t justify them playing him in the OF. How about…..
LF Carl Crawford 18MM
RF Damon/Rayburn 6MM(so what, he’s the one weak spot in the defense, jackson will cover some of his ground)
DH Miguel Cabrera
1b Carlos Pena 12MM
3b Carlos Guillen (he can play infield and they have to pay him 11MM. Inge is a free agent)
CF A-Jax
2b Scott Sizemore
C Avila
SS Everett/Iorg/Santiago
P Verlander (Remaining $$ spent on extension)
P Scherzer
P Porcello
P Crosby
P Turner/Gallaraga
Closer Valverde
Bullpen
Coke
Schelereth
Perry
Zumaya
Miner
Yeah man Damon in right just won’t work. He throws like my little sister. That lineup is a bit more realistic but I’d like to see them add another bat than just Crawford. Maybe a shortstop. And Turner probably won’t be around next year. They say hes not taking the Porcello track and will need more time. I think they sign a veteran starter for a year or 2 to pitch in the 4 slot and have Crosby at 5.
Damon in Right Field? Guys would be scoring from first on singles to right field. Laughable at best.
I was at Fenway during a Yankee/Sox game last year and I saw the best shirt ever! It said: “Looks like Jesus, Acts like Judas, Throws like Mary!” If that doesn’t sum up Johnny D, I don’t know what does!
Wow. You can’t seriously be considering playing Damon in RF. That might be the outfield with the weakest set of throwing arms in the history of baseball.
You may want to add to that lineup. The Tigers have ALOT of money coming off the books.
im also factoring in that they will have extended verlander which will take up alot more money.
lmao wow. Damon in right? a 300 pound man could score on damons little girl arm..keep dreaming with this lineup
your talking about the damon who said he wont take a paycut? lol but the yankees offered him 2 for 14 and he still didnt take it
With the numbers that he put up last year he WOULD help this team win!! What is he saying that is not true?? He would make this team drastically different. Do you feel comfortable with Austin Jackson leading off when he hasn’t even taken a major league at bat? How about Scott Sizemore hitting in the 2 hole in the same situation, never even looking at a big league pitch?? And if he signed, he would not be a 4th outfielder. Carlos Guillen would be the near full time DH and also would be extremely valuable as a part time infielder. Let’s not forget that Scott Sizemore broke his ankle not too long ago in the AFL and Brandon Inge will only get about 2 weeks of Spring Training after knee surgery so he will be starting slow in April. You cannot argue with the numbers that this guy has put up, and he is healthy, which is a huge plus at 36 years old. I do agree with you Tigers22 b/c I want to see what Wilkin Ramirez and Casper Wells can do, but if the Tigers are going to win, you CANNOT fully count on all of your youth to gel at the same time. Atleast one or two of these guys are going to struggle and need more seasoning in the minors, its just the way it goes. If Austin Jackson and Scott Sizemore are the Tigers #1 and #2 hitters in the lineup, you can count on the fact that Miguel Cabrera’s streak of 100+ RBI seasons is over and so is the Tigers chances of a division winner this year. Let Jackson bat in the 6 hole and get comfortable in his new surroundings and sign Damon for 1 year at $6 mil with incentives and a club option for 2011. With all the $$$ coming off the books next year, this way the club can decide whether he played good enough to stay or tell him to use the heal-toe express out of Detroit. What do they have to lose? We have spent a TON of dumber $$$ in the past 5 years (Willis, Robertson, Sheffield, Bonderman, etc, etc, etc) than it would take to get this done!
Dude, there’s no way Jackson and Sizemore will hit 1-2. These guys aren’t Granderson and Polanco. We can see it and Leylands even said it probably won’t happen. They are smart enough not to rely on 2 rookies at the top of the order. IF they both start I’d see them trying Jackson at leadoff, and Sizemore at 7 or 8.
“Johnny Damon would play in Detroit”
At this point, Damon will play anywhere that pays him enough money. I wonder, based on past history, whether it was Damon’s ego that led him to turn down the Yankees offer, or Boras telling him that he was worth more and that he’d get more somewhere else. Another case of an agent misreading the market.
The only logical reasons to NOT sign Damon has ZERO to do with his ability to hit. With Damon you are getting a legit leadoff hitter and professional hitter. The ONLY reason why the Tigers SHOULDN’T sign Damon is because of where they are this year. Obviously thru the trades of Grandy and Jackson they are not going all out to win this year. Identify what 2010 should be….a transition year. And if that is what they are committed to them it makes no sense to dedicate 500 + AB to Damon when you have talented players like Rayburn, Ramirez and Thomas who need at bats to grow and show what they have. 2010 should be a “re-tooling” year for the Tigers in preperation for the exodus of horrible contracts that will come of the books at the end of the year. Figure out what you have in your mlb ready talent and then supplement what’s missing with smart acquisitions and signings next winter and the Tigers can be on top once again.
I would do this if I were Detroit:
1. Jackson CF
2. Sizemore 2B
3. Ordonez RF/DH
4. Cabrera 1B
5. Guillen LF/DH
6. Inge 3B
7. Raburn LF/RF
8. Laird C
9. Everett SS
Pitch, play defense and don’t be afraid to go young when the talent is there (like I believe it is in Sizemore and Jackson)
99% agree with this. I’d like to see an Avila/Laird platoon at C so Avila can get the experience in and work his way to being an everyday catch. Other than that, perfect.
Switch Sizemore and Raburn and I agree. I think it will end up looking a lot like that.
This would be a terrific lineup for Detroit in 2011 – Just a thought1. RF – Carl Crawford2. DH – Johnny Damon3. 1B – Miguel Cabrera (Would have 150 RBI’s with these guys in front of him)4. LF – Ryan Strieby (You heard it here first, this kid will tear it up this year in AAA and is a STUD! Have seen him play and the sky is the limit)5. 2B – Scott Sizemore (This kid is the real deal)6. CF – Austin Jackson7. SS – Jhonny Peralta (2011 FA)8. 3B – Brandon Inge 9. C – Alex AvilaStarting Pitchers1. RHP – Justin Verlander2. LHP – Cliff Lee (2011 FA and we will have ALOT of extra $$$)3. RHP – Rick Porcello4. RHP – Max Scherzer5. LHP – Casey CrosbyBullpenRHP – Ryan Perry LHP – Daniel SchlerethRHP – Robbie Weinhardt (Future closer with filthy stuffRHP – Cody Satterwhite (Also filthy rotten stuff)RHP – Joel Zumaya (If healthy, BIG IF???)LHP – FuTe Ni (Had awesome rookie year in 09 and will get better)Closer RHP – Jose Valverde (For now)
Please tell me that’s not the lineup. Austin jackson batting 6th? Ryan Streiby batting 4th behind Cabrera? Damon at age 37 DH’ing? A better thought would be…
By position:
1B- Carlos Pena
2B- Scott Sizemore
SS- ????
3B- Pedro Feliz (Go cheap, go for defense)
C- Alex Avila
LF-Ryan Rayborn
RF- Miguel Ordonez (if option vests). Werth if it doesn’t.
CF-Austin Jackson
DH-Miguel Cabrera
Cliff Lee, Brandon Webb, Josh Beckett or Chein-Ming Wang if healthy (Add a #1 or #2 to the rotation).
I’m really hoping this is some sort of joke.
??? at SS made me laugh.
sounds good.
I would sign him for 5 mill for 1 year; with a CLUB option for 2011 – but no more money or years.
If the Tigers stink by the all-star game; we could trade him, Maggs, Guillen etc to ditch payroll and play the kids – Wilkin & Casper until 2011.
Why would you pull Maggs from the lineup and DH Guillen? Career wise Maggs has better numbers than Guillen and Guillen has also spent more time on the DLMaggs:BA .312OBP .371OPS .884Guillen:BA.287OBS.308OPS.805Just trying to make sense of that. Obviously Ordonez is older, but Guillen is declining much more rapidly than Maggs. Lose Guillen. Keep Maggs. Something tells me he’s going to play well this year.
Maggs will play much better this year. He (hopefully) isn’t going to have all of the drama that surrounded him this past season. Guillen is washed up and needs to go. I will be happy when Guillen, Robertson and Willis are all gone next year and they resign Inge and Bondo to much smarter contracts.
I hear you on Robertson and Willis, but Guillen’s signed through 2011.
Is he? I was thinking he was gone to.. my bad!
I wish! But maybe he’ll surprise us and stay healthy?
That would be a miracle. If he could stay healthy for more than a quarter of the season, he could help us out a lot… but I’m really not counting on that.
I don’t see why Detroit would want to sign him because they seem to be in a rebuilding stage. Then again his presents might be good for the younger players and am sure they could learn a lot for him. Still think that if he drops to a reasonable number the Yankees might sign him at the last min.
I don’t think that the Tigers are necessarily in rebuilding stage. I mean, they signed Valverde as their closer for a lot of money. But Damon is probably not the right way to go anyway unless he’s $5M or less and it’s only for 1 year.
I don’t think they’re in a strictly rebuilding phase. I think they’re trying to retool while trying to contend at the same time.
This discussion is a joke, taking a guy in Carl Crawford who has been ranked the top left fielder in the league and moving him around to accommodate prospects makes no sense, as well as crazy lineup projections left and right.
Even though the AL Central will not be a powerhouse division I like bbxxj ideas the best as it would probably be wise to play their prospects to see what they have on a major league level before they shed all that salary next year and presumably make a big splash. Signing Damon may be a quick fix for the top of their order but would it really make that much sense considering 2 out of Damon, Guillen, or Singglio get pushed to everyday time in the outfield. Even without a powerhouse team in this division I don’t know its in the Tigers best interest to burn money for a free agent when they still have offensive holes / question marks at center, 2nd, short, catcher and as a result push aging veterans into playing the field everyday.
If Damon ends up signing with the Rays I would like to see the Tigers try and trade for Willy Aybar. Seems like with DH tied up and Zobrist most likely playing second he can be had cheaply. Can play 1st, 2nd and 3rd and give them some pop at DH and only makes just over a mill. Can spell Inge and Sizemore and his a switch hitter. Would trade young high upside reliever for him such as Jacobsen or Sborz. Batted .253 12 hr 41 rbi .331 OBP in 336 plate appearences.
1. Jackson CF
2. Aybar DH
3 Ordonez RF
4. Cabrera 1B
5. Guillen LF
6. Inge 3b
7. Sizemore 2b
8. Laird/Avila C
9. Everett/Santiago SS
Play Raburn in LF verse Left handers and can spell Ordonez and Guillen against righties.
I never said that the Tigers were going to DOMINATE by getting Damon, but we are never really gonna see what we have if we dont have some one at the top of the order to atleast set the table. Agreed, this year is going to be a year of transition and the Tigers will be able to see what they have with Ramirez, Casper Wells and Clete Thomas (not to mention Cale Iorg and Brent Clevlen – remember him!). All I am saying is that we need Damon for many reasons and without him at the top of that order, I see the offense being disastrous and abysmal, and a 80-95 loss season hurts the mentality of a young team. Not to mention that it will get extremely old very quickly for Miguel Cabrera coming to the plate with 2 out and none on constantly!! Thoughts??
I’m in favor of signing Damon it makes no sense to try and rebuild when you play in the AL Central when 85 wins can win the division. We already have two rookies in the lineup as is. Let Ramirez and Wells prove they can hit Triple A hitting before they even sniff a starting job. Ramirez has to show he can hit off-speed pitching and Wells batted .260 in double AA. If Detroit thought so highly of them they wouldn’t have traded for Austin Jackson. While I like Ryan Raburn played mostly against left-handed pitching last year even though his carer splits arent that drastic. Would get plenty of at bats though spelling Damon, Guillen and Maggs (Maybe allowing option not to vest but believe Maggs will have a good year say .305 20 hrs 90 rbi thus leave no choice for option to vest). Can’t bank on a great off-season in 2011 just cause they have money because 29 other teams are going to be vying for the top free agents. Look at Detroit recent FA history it all aging vets or guys coming off injury Pudge, Maggs, Jones, Rogers. Everyone is penciling in Crawford but the Yankees are going to be looking for a left fielder next year and going to be tough to keep him away from them. Looking forward to seeing Strieby and Nunez in Detroit next year though.
I personally feel Johnny Damon would be a good signning. I think the Tigers should offer a two year deal: 5 million this year and 6 million next year which is a mutual option with a 1 mill buyout. Johnny Damon would be much better in left field then Guillen. I hate to tell us Tigers fans (which I am one) but we need Damon. He is definitely an upgrade defensive in left field. I really don’t want to see Guillen out there. DH the guy so he doesn’t get hurt again. We don’t have a 2 hitter unless we move Maggs to the two hole. I have two ideas I’d like to see the Tigers do line-up wise:
With Damon:
1) CF Austin Jackson (whether he is ready or not, he is starting in the leadoff)
2) LF Johnny Damon
3) 1B Miguel Cabrera
4) RF Maggilo Ordonez
5) DH Carlos Guillen
6) 3B Brandon Inge
7) C Gerald Laird/Alex Avila
8) SS Adam Everett/Ramon Santiago
9) 2B Scott Sizemore/Ramon Santiago
without Damon:
1) CF Austin Jackson
2) RF Maggilo Ordonez (we got no one else to hit there)
3) 1B Miguel Cabrera
4) LF Carlos Guillen
5) DH Jeff Larish/Ryan Raburn/Clete Thomas?
6) 3B Brandon Inge
7) C Gerald Laird/Alex Avila
8) SS Adam Everett/Ramon Santiago
9) 2B Scott Sizemore/Ramon Santiago
I really hate the line-up without Damon. I hope they find a way to bring him in. this team really needs either Hudson or Damon for the top of the line-up. If they can’t pull either it could be a long year. I’d also love to see them try to get Russell Branyon on the cheap too. Perfect 4/5 left handed power hitter who can play mulitple positions.
“I hate to tell us Tigers fans (which I am one) but we need Damon.”
haha I couldn’t disagree more. From one Tiger fan to another I do not hate telling you this… we don’t need him. Would be a waste.
It wouldn’t be a waste if he’s cheap and only for a year. I mean, he’s better than Clete Thomas. But yeah, we don’t NEED Damon.
I think a lot of people are overly sold on Raburn. Sure, he finished with some decent numbers, but he was TERRIBLE until August 20. Or at least entirely mediocre. He finished strong (unlike the Tigers), but he wasn’t an everyday player so it’s unclear how he’d do over 500-600 PAs. Whereas it’s entirely clear how Damon would do over that span.And let’s be honest — despite those fielding numbers (again, limited sample size), he’s a butcher with the glove (has a great arm, though). Did none of you watch the 10th inning of game 163? Or any of the other 162 games? I’m not saying Damon is any better, but Raburn is a bad left fielder. Period.I’m also not saying I want Damon on the team, but as a leadoff/#2 hitter who hits left-handed and has plenty of big game experience, he’d likely be more useful to the Tigers in 2010 than Ryan Raburn.But this isn’t a question of one or the other. If they sign Damon (which they should only do if it’s a one-year deal), Raburn will still get his 300 ABs, and more power to him (literally).The main reason to do a Damon signing, in my opinion, is that it would almost certainly mean less playing time for Magglio Ordonez. Preventing Magglio’s option from vesting would alone pay for however much a one-year Damon rental would cost. Not to mention that Damon could net some prospects in a trade at the deadline.
Ya know, I can’t completely argue with you. I didn’t find Raburn to be terrible (He was as high as .287 on July 6th, but as low as .243 July 26th so I see what you’re saying), disappointing at times I could agree with. And he did make the error in game 163, but who didn’t on that team?
I don’t, however, agree that he’d be more useful than Raburn. Even with those errors, I think that Raburn would have Damon beat any day out in the field. He has a way better arm and is getting the experience to play in LF, which means he will only get better the more he plays there.
I also do not agree with trying to push Maggs out of town. He had an off year as far as his power numbers and RBI’s were concerned, but I really think he’ll turn that around this year. His average was right there with his career average as was his OBP. If you compare is UZR and UZR/150 from ’08 to ’09, he was even a better fielder (albeit, not a great one).
Anyhow, got a little off track. I just really don’t see Damon being a $6MM upgrade over Raburn at all and don’t think the Tigers should sign him.
I don’t think so man. Look at what Werth has done when given a full time spot. Not saying Raburn would be as good but I think as part time players they put up pretty similar numbers. Let him have this year full time to see if he can put up some impressive numbers. If not, just go address it next year. Like JerkyBoy said the cost of Damon would not be worth it to a team that already has Raburn just sitting around.
….There’s no effing way we’ll get Cliff Lee in 2011. It’ll be a huge regret if we do. He’s already 31, and we would still have to sign him to mega bajillion year deal.
man im so tired of hearing about old man damon! I swear, I think detroit would be dumb to sign damon when they have Austin Jackson in center. Detroit is def rebuilding and seeing what Jackson can do is def the best idea.
damon is getting old and signing him as a starter could be risky now signing him as a potential pinch hitter or as a back up could boost their bench but may i remind you this guy cannot throw the only place he could fit on the diamond is DH and that would put guillen out of the mix the if the tigers were to sign him it would have to be as a pinch htitter or back up
Even with all I have talked about Raburn being a better overall player than Damon, which I still believe, Damon could make the Tigers better if Damon takes playing time mainly away from Guillen. He doesn’t play LF very well and his .242/.339/.419/.757 lined definately doesn’t play there. If they reduced Guillen to a utility/spot start/PH role Where his switch hitting veteran bat could be valuable spelling the corners and PHing for Everett and Laird, they would be able to fill their need at leadoff by adding Damon without killing their defense.
Now this lineup would be an upgrade:
1. Damon DH (sometimes LF)
2. Sizemore 2B
3. Ordonez RF (sometimes DH)
4. Cabrera 1B
5. Inge 3B
6. Raburn LF/RF
7. Jackson CF
8. Laird/Avila C
9. Everett SS
…with Guillen getting the most PHs and spot starts.
Good points. I am definitely not 100 percent in favor of signing Damon. But I do think Damon would help the team if it was just for one season — this Tigers squad needs a proven lefty bat at the top of the lineup.
Ideally, if they sign Damon, then he, Raburn, Ordonez and Guillen could rotate between the 2 corner OF spots and DH — about 450 ABs apiece. (Damon would also protect against the inevitable Guillen injury.) And it wouldn’t be that he’s a $5M upgrade over Raburn — it would be that he’s a $5M upgrade over Clete Thomas, because Raburn’s going to get his streaky 300+ ABs either way. And again, if they’re out of contention around July 31, trading Damon at the deadline could bring in a decent prospect or two — at which point you can audition Raburn full-time or trot Clete out there more regularly.
But it would also be totally fine with me if they choose not to sign Damon and instead audition some younger players for 2011. The Tigers can probably compete this year in that division as-is.
Personally, I don’t want Maggs on the team in 2011 at $15M — no matter how decent his numbers have been, he’s just not worth $15M. The Tigers could use that money to sign someone like Jayson Werth or Carl Crawford. Maggs can still play 134 games in 2010 and get 539 PAs without the option vesting — that’s plenty enough for any of us. And then the Tigers can always re-sign him to a much more fair deal…
I think you’ve said the key words that make it very difficult to argue… “proven lefty bat.” We really are lacking in that area. I also really like the point about trading him at the deadline (I forgot to mention that in my last posting), assuming he is going to be wanted somewhere. And again I agree that they can compete in this division as is. Realistically all you really need is pretty good pitching OR pretty good hitting to win this division.
Maggs at $15M is a pretty steep price for his age. I can definitely see the point made there. I would, again, agree with that. They should look to resigning him to a $5M-$6M contract ASSUMING he does pretty good this year and stick him in at DH. From there it would allow for the Tigers to move Raburn (or stick in Ramirez or Thomas or even Casper Wells if he looks really good) in RF and sign Crawford (we REALLY need his speed on this team). From there I’d also like to see them resign Inge to a MUCH lower contract and Bondo. From there we could look to getting a SP or two (I’d like to see a Duchscherer, Cain, Harden and/or Lilly come in).
I really think we should look internally for the SS of the future. The only pretty good SS I’m seeing is Reyes, but we all know the Mets won’t (and shouldn’t) let him go.
It would be so huge if Bonderman actually bounced back this year. But if you consider that Verlander, Porcello and Scherzer are set in the rotation for a few years (assuming JV gets an extension), and Crosby and Turner should be up in the MLB by 2012, his days as a Tiger have to be numbered. (If only we still had Jurrjens!)
Then again, maybe they could re-sign Bondo cheap and use Crosby or Turner to net a stud hitter — kind of like trading Maybin and Miller for Miguel Cabrera. I could see Dumbo going after Adrian Gonzalez — he did draft him for the Marlins, after all. Put Miguel Cabrera at DH and Gonzalez at 1B (sign to long-term deal) and that’s some serious firepower for years to come.
That Nunez guy will maybe be the Tigers SS of the future? I don’t want Reyes — he’s a goof-off. I’d rather see them be defensive-minded up the middle and add power at 3B or one of the corner OFs.
If they just stick with Verlander/Porcello/Scherzer and hope either Turner or Crosby are ready, and go with Galarraga or Coke or whoever as a fifth starter in 2011, they’ll be able to add about $60M worth of FA hitters next offseason — that’s a lot of lumber. Carl Crawford at $20M/year? Adrian Gonzalez at $15M/year? They’d still have $25M to spend on a RF, 3B and SS, assuming a $120M payroll. Amazing. I really hope Dumbo doesn’t mess this up!
Oh yeah, without a doubt. That’s a heck of a 1-4 SP rotation. And there are a number of players that they could fill in for that 5 spot.
That’s exactly what I was thinking. I’d rather not see Reyes in a Tigers uniform. I’ve seen Dlugach play in Spring Training. I don’t want to say I’m super impressed, but I think he would also be a decent short-term answer for the SS position. I really wish Inge would get the stick going… he’s so good defensively but can’t hit the ball for nothing.
Excellent point on Adrian Gonzalez. I didn’t even think of that. That indeed would be an amazing lineup. We’d be scary for a long time. Not to mention Cabrera could hit 3rd in the lineup, like he prefers and we could stick Gonzalez in the 4 spot.
The only reason I even suggested a pitcher was because of how many different 4th and 5th starters we had. If there would have been one of them that was even remotely consistent or healthy for an entire season I would have no issues with where we are at with the rotation. Let us look at the lineup as you have put it..
1. Carl Crawford LF
2. Austin Jackson CF
3. Miguel Cabrera DH
4. Adrian Gonzalez 1B
5. Brad Hawpe? RF (He will potentially be a FA)
6. Brent Dlugach/Nunez SS
7. Gerald Laird/Alex Avila/Others C
8. Brandon Inge 3B (assuming he goes cheaper)
9. Scott Sizemore 2B
That’s powerful….
its disturbing that so many of the “dream/future” lineups everyone is posting still feature inge at 3rd.
anyway, i think tigers22 is right – we really don’t NEED damon. like he said, it’d be nice to have him if he were gonna be cheap, but if he was gonna be cheap then the yankees would’ve signed him. i DO think we need more left-handed bats, but a 36 yr old left fielder who can’t throw and is only gonna get worse is not what i had in mind.
to that end, we should make a trade. lets see, who can they trade for? who’s that guy that plays for the yankees… whats his name… anderson? first name …otis? otis anderson? he plays center and bat left-handed… AHH, WHAT is his NAME???
sounds like the owner is whipped with scott and does what ever boras wants
Why the hate on Inge? I don’t care what he hits…. as long as he keeps turning doubles down the line into a double play ball. And he might have hit 40 bombs last year if he would have stayed healthy.
Why the hate on Inge??? Me and my twin brother have been fighting over this since 2006!! You CANNOT bat at or just above the Mendoza line and be a starting 3rd baseman in this league. Yes, Inge is a terrific fielder and has been in Detroit for the good times and the bad. But we are all arguing over what NOT to pay a guy that hit .282/24 HR/82 RBI/12 SB (Damon) and also walked 71 times and had 98 strikeouts. Lets compare these numbers with Brandon “The whiff” Inge’s line of .230/27 HR/84 RBI/2 SB and 170 strikeouts (THATS RIGHT, 170 WHIFFS!!!!). We won’t give Damon $6 million plus incentives but we can pay Inge $8 million to stikeout twice as much. Listen, I was at Game 4 of the 2006 ALCS and love the Tigers as much as all of you other Dtown fans, but it is time to let some of these guys go and not rebuild, but remodel. Inge, Ordonez, Guillen, Bonderman, Robertson, and even Zumaya if he can’t stay healthy need to go either after this year or soon after if the production doesn’t get ALOT better! I hear alot of you guys talking about Wilkin Ramirez, Casper Wells, Cale Iorg, Ryan Strieby, etc etc. I want to see what these kids can do as well and as long as these overprised vets are around taking up a spot on the roster, we will be waiting just long enough to see them traded and blossom for someone else! Thoughts??
I’m with you. If you want to see a team win the division DD will find a way to bring in Damon. We signed Jose Valverde. That signing tells me DD thinks we can win the division. I think with Hudson going to Minnesota we will see something soon. Call it a hunch. Tigers really lost out by not signning Thome with as cheap as he went.
I agree with you on some points. Inge was a complete bum the last three months, he had 96 K! But that was when he was playing injured. Before that, he was actually shortening his swing and making solid contact with the ball. Also, Zumaya needs to be shipped out now. For anything. Dombrowski needs to entice some GM, any GM, to get ANYTHING for him. Before he has another arm injury and loses any value he has left.
//Inge was a complete bum the last three months, he had 96 K! But that was when he was playing injured.//
Some people might even think he’s a bum for playing injured and not taking himself out of the lineup.
Personally I think Inge is kept in the lineup for his defense. He’s never been a big bat, ever. I know he made a few errors at third, in his defense his knees were really jacked up( NO I am NOT an INGE lover… trust me) he will never be a .300 hitter. What gets me is all the people who think he’s a god. because I’ll tell ya, there a lot of 3rd basemen out there that have stellar defense and a bat to go with it. I’ll be really surprised if they offer him a new contract after 2k10. He’ll be 33 in May and there are better, younger options out there, even if they come from within, similar to what the organization is doing with Sizemore.
And yes, he should have gone on the DL because he didn’t help anyone by staying on the roster.
Agreed on both counts. Especially the second one. Just can’t imagine who they would’ve put in there in his place, though.
Well, we all know what happened when Raburn was at 3rd, something I could go without ever seeing again. You’re right we don’t have a sufficient back-up for Inge, this is why i am not thrilled about adding Damon to the OF, Tigers need to look for an option for the IF, a big bat Lefty would be nice, but those aren’t exactly running a muck this off season. I am ambivalent about Damon, if they sign him, fine If not I am ok with that too. I think we’ll see more issues with the IF than the OF this season, that and the lack of offense. Can’t depend on 2 or 3 decent bats in the lineup to get the job done. That’s why I hope our pitching is going to be all they think it is. We will need it.
As long as he hits 30 plus homers and gives us a 250-260 batting average with gold glove defense, I’ll take that from my third baseman. I also think he’ll be batting 6th too this year. He had a great first half but got hampered by the injury. I hope he turns it around this year.
I’m Curious. Do you happen to know what Inge is hitting in those plate appearances where he doesn’t put one over the wall?
Try
2007 – .215/.295/.273
2008 – .179/.284/.250
2009 – .191/.284/.224
Last 3 – .196/.288/.248
Career – .210/.285/.274
Players like Inge, Branyan, Beltre, Jacobs (and others) who provide solely the HR or nothing outcome hold very little value at the plate. They might gain popularity because of the HR totals, but they are so bad otherwise that those HR values become extremely misleading. So bad in fact that if you are confident he wont hit a HR off the specific pitcher or in the specific park or whatever, you might as well pinch hit for them with someone like Aaron Miles.
Now, Inge does provide really good defense making him a fine placeholder overall. But he really should be thought of only in that way.
I completely agree about Maggs. I saw him at Tigerfest and he is looking buff and ready to go. He didn’t whine when everyone called him “Singlio” he went out and did something about it. I look for him to do good things at the plate. He said he worked out with the University of Florida football draft picks, he’s been riding a mountain bike and he got a personal trainer, sounds like a gut ready to rock and roll in 2k10 to me.
Here’s how Johnny Damon winds up being a Tiger…
In a dark conference room sit two men, Dave Dombrowski and Scott Boras. Dave begins
“Scott, I just don’t see how I can fit Johnny in our lineup, we already have to aging corner infielders on top of two good defensive ones.”
“Dave, Dave, Dave, can’t you see? Johnny Damon GUARANTEES you a world series. Look at all his success in Boston and New York. He’s a proven winner.”
“But Scott, by signing Johnny, we have to bench Magglio sometimes. We can’t have them both in the OF defensively. And you threatened to sue us if we don’t let Magglio reach his incentive last year. What’s to stop you from doing that this year?”
“Listen, Dave (tears begin to stroll down Boras’ face) I’m desperate right now. I turned down the Yanks 2/14 offer and I haven’t seen half that since. I screwed up. PLEASEE! I NEED THIS RIGHT NOW. I SWEAR TO GOD I WON’T SUE YOU for MAGGLIO if you please just do 2/12MM!!!”
(hesitance)…”Alright, Scott. You have brought us a lot of quality players in the past. I am gonna give you the benefit of the doubt….”
“THANK YOU SO MUCH DAVE!!! You won’t regret it! When Prince Fielder hits the open market, I will make sure I put in a good word for you ;).”
9 Months later. The Tigers have finished a season, with a winning record, but just didn’t have enough pop to make it past first round of the playoffs. They are ok with the finish however, because now they are loaded going into the winter meetings with 50MM to spend in the offseason (18MM of it from Magglio not reaching his incentive), and will surely be a favorite going into the 2011 season. However, Damon’s 2/12 contract subtracts 7MM and Valverde another 7MM. they still have 36MM left though, plenty to sign a top tier player like Carl Crawford. However, less than 5 minutes into the winter meetings, Dave Dombrowski receives a letter. He is being sued by Scott Boras, for not allowing Magglio to reach his incentive. The pay-off 36MM.
HAHAHAHA thats awesome. I don’t see it going down like that. I also need some of you guys to wake up. Barring from offering a guy like Carl Crawford 15 mill per year, he will not be coming here. I don’t see it happening.
then offer him 15MM per!!! haha. I would pay him more like 20! He’s a younger better version of Alfonso Sorian and look at what he makes. He’s the leadoff, defensive LF the TIGERS NEED!! If it means overpaying, do it. The most years he would get would be like 8, and that would finish when he’s 36-7 years old. Even good ole Johnny Damon stole 12 bases and hit .280 with 24 homers at that age.
Boras sounds kind of desperate now.
That Henning article is just speculation, it’s not reporting any information from sources.
He probably has just talked to guys in the inside. I find it very possible Boras went to the Tigers with Damon much like he did Magglio and Pudge. There is a working relationship there. When theres smoke, there’s fire. Just my thought.
1 year at 7 million is even too much at this point… and greedy little Boras is pushing for 2? Cmon now. Get lost man.
Ok I think alot of us Tiger fans are losing site of whats important. If the team doesn’t sign Damon and they suck, none of you will go out to games. I think the Tigers should sign Damon if DD thinks his team really is a division contender. He has no choice. As it stands we will have two rookies at CF and 2B. We currently have no DH. Carlos Guillen is brutal in left field defensively. You also have to consider we have no legit number two hitter. A big factor that might help the cause is we have no left handed bat in our starting line-up. Only 8 righties and a switch hitter. I really want you guys to think the last time you saw a team with rookies who have never played at the majors hit 1 and 2 and get to the playoffs. I can’t think of it. I’d like to be informed if you figure it out. We really need Johnny Damon. He hit .282 with 24 home runs, 82 RBIs, and 12 stolen bases. His slugging percentage was solid at .489 for Damon. Plus when you look at his walk to strikeouts. He had 71 walks to 98 strike outs. If something that was a problem for the Tigers last year it was getting on base. He’s not the free swinger like a guy like Inge or Thames is. I feel Damon would be a good signing for the range of 4.5 to 5 million plus incentives. You add in a team option for 2010 with a buyout that I think the Tigers would be getting a steal. Please don’t tell me your gonna run out Clete Thomas everyday. I’ll just laugh. I’m not a big Damon fan but with the signning the Twins made, we really need the guy. Simply put but not to overpay him.
Dude what are you even talking about? As a Tigers fan I’ll go to just as many games regardless of their record. Damon isn’t going to sway me going to games or not, because I’m a fan of this team as it is. And what are you even trying to say “don’t tell me we’re going to run Clete out there everyday”… who in there right mind HAS said that? If he does make the squad, it’d be as a reserve outfielder. I just don’t understand where that came from. As of right now it’ll be Guillen-Jackson-Mags, with Raburn rotated in to give Guillen and Mags a rest at DH. I’d rather save that money and pick someone from within rather than invest it in Damon.
According to the win projector that the system that they use to tell players values is he’ll add another 4 wins or so. I mean he’s definitely worth the signing for the right price. I think if we sign him for the right amount its a good move. Don’t sell me on Raburn as an everyday player. He’s a good utility player with some power. Johnny Damon is a far superior player. Can you argue that this line-up isn’t better with him then without for the right price? Hudson just signed for 5 mill if we can get Damon for 4.5 then we gotta do it. We are already committed to two rookies in the line-up. We can’t do 3. Please tell me who bats two in this line-up if we don’t sign Damon. If you say Sizemore then i’ll laugh.
Please stop saying you’ll laugh at stuff. I think anyone who is worried about Jackson and Sizemore batting 1-2 this year is crazy. If we can see the potential problems with that, of course Leyland can too. They’ll be broken up. Probably Jackson at the top and Sizemore 7 or 8.
And how do you know Raburn isn’t an everyday player? Guys never got the chance. This is the perfect opportunity this year to see what kind of numbers he can put up in a year full of plate appearances. There’s no way in the world Damon signs for 4 1/2. Just last night that post said the Tigers were lookin at 7M if not MORE for this year. Not worth it. If he was going to sign cheaply, he wouldve went right back to the Yanks.
Also, who is this 3rd rookie you’re saying we “can’t do”? I mean, you’re right but that’s just not even logical. There isn’t another rookie that’d be up for a starting spot right now.
“According to the win projector that the system that they use to tell players values is he’ll add another 4 wins or so.”
How in the world do you figure that?
Damon hasnt been worth but about 3 wins the last three seasons, and his playing time would likely be at the expense of Raburn who is projected to provide about 1.5-2.0 Wins in about half a season worth of PA. If Raburn is given a full season at his projections, he will be providing 3-4 Wins – equal to better then the 3 Wins Damon has averaged.
So really, Damon is expected to provide (-)1 to 0 Wins if he replaced Raburn.
Thank you. Somebody bringing some logical sense to this argument
A good case for Damon. I admit that I would like to see someone take a walk on the Tigers. At the same time, his defense is utter crap now… a huge downgrade from Raburn even.
I’ll go to games regardless of whether or not they sign Damon.
I Will always support the Old English D. I was there in 2k3 and I’ll be at Comerica in 2k10.
Maybe Damon would help ticket sales to get the club some cash? I don’t know just a thought
This is not really related to anything……………
I would pay a small sum of money to watch Johnny Damon and Juan-Pierre have an impromptu baseball-distance-throwing contest with eachother. The most I would pay to watch this event is like 6$ or so.
LOL. That’s awesome.
I’d pay $8.
So Damon has no teams interested besides the Tigers now and he still is aking demands? Not only that, he is asking for more than 7MM for 2yrs. So all this is to get an extra 2MM over the Yanks offer. Right now I can’t stand him. Tigers have no obligation to offer him more than 5MM for a year. Why would they?