The Red Sox and Royals discussed outfielder David DeJesus about ten days ago and agreed to stay in contact, according to Ken Rosenthal and Jon Paul Morosi of FOX Sports. They add, "The Royals are scouting the Red Sox’s minor-league system, but the teams have yet to exchange names." Scott Lauber of the Boston Herald first reported the Red Sox' interest in DeJesus on June 26th. The Padres and Giants seem like good fits for the Royals outfielder as well, though their level of interest is not known.
The Red Sox are not likely to deal for DeJesus unless his price drops, a source tells Alex Speier of WEEI.com. The Royals are currently asking for a lot in return for their right fielder.
As Rosenthal and Morosi note, the Red Sox have dealt with injuries to Jacoby Ellsbury and Mike Cameron this season and could use the versatile DeJesus. Given his $6MM club option, the Sox would have DeJesus, Ellsbury, Cameron, and J.D. Drew under control for 2011. Such depth could prompt a trade of Ellsbury, but let's not get ahead of ourselves. This year, DeJesus is owed an additional $2.12MM.
DeJesus is having a career year so far at age 30, with a .326/.395/.460 line in 370 plate appearances. He's also playing above-average defense. The Royals will wait until closer to the July 31st deadline to decide whether to trade DeJesus, reported ESPN's Buster Olney three days ago.
If I see Jose Iglesias come up one time, your argument will be invalid.
if they make the trade, it better be worth our best hitter. (royals fan here)
I just don’t think this is happening…the Red Sox have dealt with outfield injuries the entire season, and now they make a deal with Ellsbury and Hermida coming back, along with Cameron playing the best baseball he’s played all year (even if he’s battling through injuries). I just think the Red Sox have more pressing needs, mainly to the bullpen. I think the Red Sox need to expect Jacoby to come back, and then Hermida to fill in for Cameron when he needs a blow. As long as Pedroia and Martinez come back healthy, their offense is fine.
That’s all true but beside what they’ve been going through in the OF NOW they have to deal with the loss of Pedroia, Martinez & Varitek. It’s not just about a body in the OF now…thay also need bats. If their only problem was what was going on in the OF you’d have a point but with what has happened to them over the past 2 weeks and how their standing in the rankings have suffered this is not that far fetched. Especially considering they’d control him next season too.
I agree they can use him, and with the state of the offense they absolutely need an upgrade. I understand why they would be talking, I wouldn’t be shocked if it gets done, I’m just saying it’s more likely that he doesn’t get dealt to Boston. I just don’t think the Red Sox are going to commit the cost in prospects that it will take to get Dejesus, and then go out and spend more to aquire legit bullpen help. Even if they plan on bringing Bowden up to help in the pen, that is a serious unknown. At this point, imo, you have to gamble on Nava and McDonald to continue playing over their head for another two weeks or so until they start to get more healthy. By all accounts Pedroia, Martinez, Hermida, and Jacoby (although who knows with his situation) are all fairly close on coming back. I’d prefer for Theo to weather the storm of injuries for two weeks and reinforce the pen. The Red Sox have the means within the organization to eventually stabilize the lineup…the same cannot be said for the bullpen.
I totally agree with you. I also think it’s unlikely BUT would not rule it out if only for the fact that he wouldn’t be a rental player and they would be able to retain him next season a’ la Jason Bay in 2008 & V-Mart in 2009. Cameron is hurt and frankly could be shut down for the season at any time. A Nava/McDonald/Hermida (depending on who stays when Ellsbury comes back) OF is not what the RED SOX should be fielding and bullpen help will be so much more expensive in terms of prospects this season…I just don’t know which type of trade would hurt less or cost more at this point!
I think they’d like to use Cameron sparingly down the stretch. He’s a big risk with that injury for the next few months. You can tell it’s still bothering him in CF (not so much at the plate).
I really hope this deal happens. The sox could really use him in LF/CF through the second half. I could see the Royals holding onto him and then declining his option next year to offer arb in hopes of a first rounder/supplemental next year – draft is supposedly very stacked. But I think it’d be smarter of them to get 2-3 good prospects now for him.
I think this is more likely than the Werth deal, but I still don’t think it’s very likely. Dejesus would have to be in the team’s plans for next year leaving Cameron the odd man out. Although, it might not be a bad idea to have him replace Cameron and have either Ellsbury or Dejesus in LF/CF. I just don’t see the Sox giving up anybody good for a half year rental.
I think what you are not seeing is that Ellsbury may be tradded…
This is from CBS for what its worth…
“The report notes that Ellsbury made the comments to reporters with a torn-out notebook pages scribbled with the chronology of the incidents. Ellsbury explained that were several discrepancies in the statements of the team’s medical staff and his own account. Given this outright show of disdain and recent comments made by teammate Kevin Youkilis questioning his distance from the team, Ellsbury and the Red Sox are clearly at ends.”
0% chance Theo trades Ellsbury with his value at its lowest. He could definitely be shopped in the offseason, but there is no way he gets dealt at this point.
He’s on the DL, so I don’t think they can trade him anyway.
I dont think he would either…
But as a Royals fan and an Ellsbury fan; here is my pipe dream….
DeJesus, Farnsworth and maybe another prospect for Ellsbury…
I know I am dreaming but damn let this poor Royals fan have a moment… LOL
Ellsbury and a propect for Dejesus and Soria.
lol
Here is what ther Sox need…..
two healthy starting pitchers… Beckett and Bucholz
one healthy relief pitcher…….. Delcarmon
two healthy catchers…………. Martinez and Veritek
A healthy 2nd baseman………. Pedroia
add…a second relief pitcher capable of getting people out, consistently, in the 7 & 8th inning….I do not care what his name is.
add…a right handed SP, who recently signed an $85M contract, who is capable of holding the opposition to 3.5 runs or less per 9 innings . Jettison the guy with a 4.9 ERA
who pretends to be worth $85M…
add a Japanese, righthanded SP, who sometimes shows up at the ballpark, and who sometimes does not… on days when scheduled to pitch.
subtract… a 37-year old center fielder who is injured more often than not
subtract… a utility inf/of’er who has trouble maintaining a BA above .220
subtract .. a left fielder who, when healthy, hits about .230 and cannot play left field at
Fenway Park worth a tinker’s damn.
Satisfy these needs and the Red Sox make the playoffs…
Fail to do so…. hello 4th place in the AL east..
I’d rather see Kalish get a cup of coffee for the next few weeks until Ellsbury and Hermida are back with the kind of year he’s having between Portland and Pawtucket than give up anything of value for DeJesus.
KC fans are right to expect something good. So as a RS fan I’m not particularly interested in doing the deal (and giving up young P). Unless of course there’s stuff we don’t know (Ellsbury isn’t coming back untill Sept., Cameron can’t do this much longer) and you absolutely have to get a CF He’s better than MCDonald, Nava ,Hermida but is he going to make a difference?. They can probably get Fukudome for nothing and he’s a better OF than DeJesus, at least in RF with a plus-arm. I like DeJesus but if you’re really going to give up prospects, I think you can do better. I’d see what Indians want for Choo (currently inj.)
For Choo ( who will be back shortly ) I don’t see a fit there for a Indians and Red Sox deal The Indians would ask for Casey Kelly + to start then the Red Sox would offer a bunch of guys that they are not interested in like Kalish, Reddick and Anderson they would pass on all because they are Left Handed.
The Indians are looking for a Right Handed power bat for 3rd or Corner Outfield or 1st base then they would move LaPorta back to the outfield.
We need bullpen help! Can we be sure Dejesus will hit as effectively in the AL East? I think Nava, McDonald, Hermida (back soon) and possibly Kalish (although not on 40 man) are enough to to cover the OF until Elsbury comes back. The OF hasn’t been the problem. The Sox would have the best record in baseball if their bullpen was more effective. Lets see what Dubront and Bowden can do in the pen before trading away prospects. Still a few more weeks to evaluate needs before deadline.
There is absolutely zero evidence to suggest that a hitters numbers will decline because they come into the AL East, that is just nonsense. In fact, there nothing that suggests that switching from the NL to the AL has any effect on a hitters performance, and I am slightly annoyed that people continue to come up with that idea.
Yeah, no pressures in hitting/pitching/fielding in the AL East, you’re absolutely right.
Not like the best 3 teams in baseball reside there. Not like they all see each other 18 times a year. Not like NY and Boston are playoff atmospheres every home game. So you don’t think that there is an effect on hitters or pitchers when they face a higher concentration of good pitching or good hitters?
So when they say that the AL East is the toughest division in baseball, that’s just nonsense? Not like one of these team could win 95 games and miss out on the playoffs. Ok, gotcha…go smoke another one 420…
“Yeah, no pressures in hitting/pitching/fielding in the AL East, you’re absolutely right.”
Please tell me where in my comment I said that there was no pressure, go ahead, I’ll wait.
“Not like the best 3 teams in baseball reside there. Not like they all see each other 18 times a year. Not like NY and Boston are playoff atmospheres every home game”
Again, nowhere in my comment did I say anything that suggests that I think otherwise, and that 2nd sentence is just a fact that no one could debate, so I don’t understand why you brought that up.
“So you don’t think that there is an effect on hitters or pitchers when they face a higher concentration of good pitching or good hitters?”
So now you’re bringing an entirely new element into the argument by including pitchers, hmm, interesting. (FWIW, I do believe that it is harder to be a pitcher in the AL East, and the AL in general, so yeah….) As for there being a higher concentration of good pitchers in our division, I don’t think that is necessarily true, there are excellent pitchers in every division, and as far as I’m concerned the AL East isn’t even home to any of the top 5 pitchers in baseball.
“So when they say that the AL East is the toughest division in baseball, that’s just nonsense? Not like one of these team could win 95 games and miss out on the playoffs”
You continue to make assumptions about my argument that are nonsense, as yet again I haven’t said anything contrary to this.
“Ok, gotcha…go smoke another one 420…”
Ah, yes, you’ve run out of things to say in your straw man argument, so you must resort to attempting to insult me based on 3 numbers in my handle, very very mature.
It seems to me that 95% of your response is nothing but a straw man argument, so I stick by what I said, there is no evidence that a HITTERS numbers will decrease just because they move into the AL East, in fact Fenway, NYS, and Camden Yards are all hitter friendly, so it might actually be easier to hit in than other divisions.
“Yeah, no pressures in hitting/pitching/fielding in the AL East, you’re absolutely right.”
Please tell me where in my comment I said that there was no pressure, go ahead, I’ll wait.
“Not like the best 3 teams in baseball reside there. Not like they all see each other 18 times a year. Not like NY and Boston are playoff atmospheres every home game”
Again, nowhere in my comment did I say anything that suggests that I think otherwise, and that 2nd sentence is just a fact that no one could debate, so I don’t understand why you brought that up.
“So you don’t think that there is an effect on hitters or pitchers when they face a higher concentration of good pitching or good hitters?”
So now you’re bringing an entirely new element into the argument by including pitchers, hmm, interesting. (FWIW, I do believe that it is harder to be a pitcher in the AL East, and the AL in general, so yeah….) As for there being a higher concentration of good pitchers in our division, I don’t think that is necessarily true, there are excellent pitchers in every division, and as far as I’m concerned the AL East isn’t even home to any of the top 5 pitchers in baseball.
“So when they say that the AL East is the toughest division in baseball, that’s just nonsense? Not like one of these team could win 95 games and miss out on the playoffs”
You continue to make assumptions about my argument that are nonsense, as yet again I haven’t said anything contrary to this.
“Ok, gotcha…go smoke another one 420…”
Ah, yes, you’ve run out of things to say in your straw man argument, so you must resort to attempting to insult me based on 3 numbers in my handle, very very mature.
It seems to me that 95% of your response is nothing but a straw man argument, so I stick by what I said, there is no evidence that a HITTERS numbers will decrease just because they move into the AL East, in fact Fenway, NYS, and Camden Yards are all hitter friendly, so it might actually be easier to hit in than other divisions.
There is absolutely zero evidence to suggest that a hitters numbers will decline because they come into the AL East, that is just nonsense. In fact, there nothing that suggests that switching from the NL to the AL has any effect on a hitters performance, and I am slightly annoyed that people continue to come up with that idea.
We need bullpen help! Can we be sure Dejesus will hit as effectively in the AL East? I think Nava, McDonald, Hermida (back soon) and possibly Kalish (although not on 40 man) are enough to to cover the OF until Elsbury comes back. The OF hasn’t been the problem. The Sox would have the best record in baseball if their bullpen was more effective. Lets see what Dubront and Bowden can do in the pen before trading away prospects. Still a few more weeks to evaluate needs before deadline.
As a BoSox fan I’d hate to see them trade any of their top-of-the-line prospects for Dejesus. Kalish is a prospect that has a very bright future and with Dejesus being 30 years old and under contract for considerably less time than any Red Sox prospect, I wouldnt trade for him unless they didnt have to give up much. I’d rather see the Red Sox give their prospects a chance to play at the major league level. And besides there is no guarantee that Dejesus would do well in Fenway Park playing in a pressure division, so for me its too much to give up for him. I’d rather see those prospects going to Philly for Werth or to Milwaukee for Hart.
Keep in mind Werth is a FA at the end of the year.
True, but let me ask you this. If the Red Sox have a chance to win the world series this year, and they do since they’ve played so well with injuries, who do you think would give the Sox a better chance at winning a championship, Dejesus or Werth? And it did cross my mind that Werth would be a free agent after this year but so is Carl Crawford and the Red Sox are bound to end up with one or the other.
I’d rather have Dejesus right now, but I’d rather have Werth in the future. I’m not sure the Red Sox will end up with Crawford or Werth at all. Werth is the better bet, though.
I’d rather have Dejesus right now, but I’d rather have Werth in the future. I’m not sure the Red Sox will end up with Crawford or Werth at all. Werth is the better bet, though.
True, but let me ask you this. If the Red Sox have a chance to win the world series this year, and they do since they’ve played so well with injuries, who do you think would give the Sox a better chance at winning a championship, Dejesus or Werth? And it did cross my mind that Werth would be a free agent after this year but so is Carl Crawford and the Red Sox are bound to end up with one or the other.
As a BoSox fan I’d hate to see them trade any of their top-of-the-line prospects for Dejesus. Kalish is a prospect that has a very bright future and with Dejesus being 30 years old and under contract for considerably less time than any Red Sox prospect, I wouldnt trade for him unless they didnt have to give up much. I’d rather see the Red Sox give their prospects a chance to play at the major league level. And besides there is no guarantee that Dejesus would do well in Fenway Park playing in a pressure division, so for me its too much to give up for him. I’d rather see those prospects going to Philly for Werth or to Milwaukee for Hart.
Here is the deal:
The Royals cannot let DeJesus go for less than a few really solid prospects (1 high, 2 mid-range). The reasons are plenty: 1) he will qualify as a type A either this year or next (his great year this year will also count in the 2011 Elias rankings); 2) he is providing value well over his contract; 3) you can get another year of him for cheap (6 mil.) on a club option — making him very attractive for a team that wants to make a run for 2 years; 4) he plays really solid (read average CF and above average corner OF) defense at all 3 outfield positions, making him really useful to a lot of teams — it expands the market for him; 5) the guy is as steady as they come — no major splits against different types of pitchers, takes walks, gets on base, has consistent gap power (good double and triple #s), and has a really stable career batting average. People can only put two knocks on DDJ that keeps him from being an elite player — he does not hit 20+ HR per season and does not steal bases. That’s it. He also gets super high marks for being a good clubhouse guy, whatever that is worth.
The Royals, if they never trade him, will get good draft compensation when he leaves in free agency. If you want to rent a player that will qualify as a Type A and will produce for 1.5 years on a club-friendly contract, then you have to pay MORE than what the Royals would get by keeping him and just taking the picks. This is NOT a salary dump deal; the Royals can easily fit him in the budget, as they have a reasonable payroll limit for their market.
So BoSox fans, it is OK if you do not want him, but someone will. This is not 10 years ago; the Royals will not just give up a player to keep from paying league minimum prices. Sucks for you, but you have to pay market value. When you make these types of trades, you are giving up the future to be competitive in the present. Often, If you don’t think your team ought to take a shot at the division and should plan for the future, then no way should Boston trade for DDJ. But if you want to make a run for it, then you have to make it worth it for the Royals.
As a Royals fan, it is a nice situation for your team to be in…
“Often, If you don’t think your team ought to take a shot at the division and should plan for the future, then no way should Boston trade for DDJ.”
Are you implying that the Red Sox can’t win the division without Dejesus??? Because they have proven that they are capable of doing it without another just above average player, and the Red Sox would be running away with it right now if everyone had been healthy all year long and they will get almost everyone or everyone pretty soon so why trade for a player that isn’t necessary. If they traded for a Werth or a Hart they would be upgrading by a lot not just by the little upgrade that they would get with who would be the fourth outfielder for the Sox when everyone is healthy in Dejesus.
**forgot to add if they have to overpay for him.
**forgot to add if they have to overpay for him.
Here is the deal:
The Royals cannot let DeJesus go for less than a few really solid prospects (1 high, 2 mid-range). The reasons are plenty: 1) he will qualify as a type A either this year or next (his great year this year will also count in the 2011 Elias rankings); 2) he is providing value well over his contract; 3) you can get another year of him for cheap (6 mil.) on a club option — making him very attractive for a team that wants to make a run for 2 years; 4) he plays really solid (read average CF and above average corner OF) defense at all 3 outfield positions, making him really useful to a lot of teams — it expands the market for him; 5) the guy is as steady as they come — no major splits against different types of pitchers, takes walks, gets on base, has consistent gap power (good double and triple #s), and has a really stable career batting average. People can only put two knocks on DDJ that keeps him from being an elite player — he does not hit 20+ HR per season and does not steal bases. That’s it. He also gets super high marks for being a good clubhouse guy, whatever that is worth.
The Royals, if they never trade him, will get good draft compensation when he leaves in free agency. If you want to rent a player that will qualify as a Type A and will produce for 1.5 years on a club-friendly contract, then you have to pay MORE than what the Royals would get by keeping him and just taking the picks. This is NOT a salary dump deal; the Royals can easily fit him in the budget, as they have a reasonable payroll limit for their market.
So BoSox fans, it is OK if you do not want him, but someone will. This is not 10 years ago; the Royals will not just give up a player to keep from paying league minimum prices. Sucks for you, but you have to pay market value. When you make these types of trades, you are giving up the future to be competitive in the present. Often, If you don’t think your team ought to take a shot at the division and should plan for the future, then no way should Boston trade for DDJ. But if you want to make a run for it, then you have to make it worth it for the Royals.
As a Royals fan, it is a nice situation for your team to be in…
What about something like Reddick/Anderson/Doubront
as much as reddick isn’t doing anything and I think Lar’s ship has sailed i don’t know if you give that all up for a 1.5 year rental.
Doubrount alone brings back more than a Dejesus type ball player. LH 22 YO that throws 94-95, 2 other pitches and is that talented for a player that is having a career year? Got a feeling Doubront may figure into the Sox plans as a 5th starter next year and Matsuzaka moved to a NL team if he will waive his no-trade clause, or Doubrant moved as a piece in a trade for a big bat over the off season if he continues to improve like he has. The guy is one of the 10 youngest in the International league, yet has dominated in his sting so far and done an admirable job in his 2 big league starts, you don’t move him for a 4th OF type like Dejesus having a career season.
You know much more about Doubront than me, I was really just trying to come up with a pitching prospect that the Royals would like but who doesn’t neccesarily figure in to our long term plans. What about replacing Doubront with Weiland or Fife? Perhaps we could also interest the Royals in taking Navarro instead of Anderson since them seem to want a SS..
Besides DDJ’s numbers, versatility and reasonable salary, the Royals are asking for a lot because he projects as a Type A free agent after this year. If his team declines the 2011 option and offers arbitration, they would receive two high draft picks if he signs elsewhere. The same would be true after next season if the option was picked up and he has another good year. Even big spenders like the Red Sox value draft picks, so this is more than a this player for that player comparison.
It’d take more than one player to get DeJesus.
add Yamaico Navarro and you are getting closer
That would never happen. The Red Sox won’t trade a player that will be better than Dejesus and will be under control for a number of years. At least they won’t trade him for a guy like Dejesus.
I thought the same – DeJesus for Kalish would make sense. I think it’d be good value for both sides.
You’re joking, right? Kalish is a potential 5 tool player. DeJesus is the outfield version of Jeff Frye.
Why would they trade Mcdonald or Nava? I think Nava can be optioned down again and I don’t think the Royals would want Mcdonald because he’s only good for a replacement. The deal would probably only revolve around prospects.
In year one of the contract his knees are fine…I don’t think the Red Sox doctors had any doubts the knees would hold up for a few years, it was the 4th and 5th years that scared them. Not saying the doctors are right, just that its unfair for you to put that on them in year one.
Yeah, they wouldn’t trade him just because of a medical fiasco. They would trade him because they feel there is better value on the market for him. Speed can be overrated sometimes.
Sox medical staff has also found problems other teams staff has missed, like Brad Penny for example. Gill is highly regarded, you can’t throw them under the bus for 1 misdiagnosis, if that is what even happened, this is Boras we are talking about, the king of the double talk and blame game.
As far as Jason Bay and his knees? it was over the course of the contract itself, not necessarily immediately that were worried about. Boston would still have signed him if he would have given them the injury option like lackey,Drew got, but he refused and he was not considered anywhere as important a piece like Beckett that was not required to sign a injury waiver.
Would expect many smart teams in the future to require players to give some kind of injury waiver terms out, it makes smart business sense.
Dejesus hasn’t exactly been great except for this year. He’s 30 and having a career year. Yes, it’s no guarantee that Kalish will ever be good in the majors, but the Sox can’t throw away the future. Youk, Lester, and Buchholz all had the chance to be traded early in their careers, and look how they turned out.
so you’re willing to take dejesus only if the red sox give up players who will likely be worse than him (or less than that). ok, where can we sign up?
he’s a cheap productive option. it’s going to cost SOMETHING
He’s having a career year now, so you’re not gonna get the same production as this year. Kalish profiles to be almost like JD Drew. With Drew probably retiring soon and Cameron being old, I’d easily take the younger player for the future. I wouldn’t want to trade arguably the organization’s best and most major league ready prospect for some guy that is going to be above average, and will only be there for a year and a half. Plus, he’s not guaranteed to do anything, just like Kalish isn’t guaranteed to do anything. He might go into a tailspin in the second half of his career year. What are they going to do when Dejesus, Cameron, and Drew are gone?
I’m trying to say that the Red Sox should trade some other players than Kalish. He’s too valuable to the team in the near future.
Completely agree. Dejesus is a career .290 hitter, so it isn’t like he just suddenly started putting the bat on the ball this season. Also, he is a tremendously underrated fielder. He’s proven. The prospects are not. So, it is completely reasonable that the Royals would expect at least a couple of good prospects in return.
Completely agree. Dejesus is a career .290 hitter, so it isn’t like he just suddenly started putting the bat on the ball this season. Also, he is a tremendously underrated fielder. He’s proven. The prospects are not. So, it is completely reasonable that the Royals would expect at least a couple of good prospects in return.
.His stats and defense in the minors mirror a JD Drew type player. Why would you trade a guy that could likely be better than Dejesus for many years for Dejesus for a year and a half?
.His stats and defense in the minors mirror a JD Drew type player. Why would you trade a guy that could likely be better than Dejesus for many years for Dejesus for a year and a half?
I’m saying his recent minor league numbers reflect Drew’s play today.
he is better than Werth or Hart????? have you looked at stats lately????? not to mention Werth and Harts swing are perfect for Fenway. Dejesus only hits for a better average and that just becuase he is having a career year but the other two hit for power and drive in tons or rbi’s and are better base runners than Dejesus, well at least Werth is, I’m not sure about Hart. Werth is a good fielder and if I’m not mistaken Hart is pretty good too. Dejesus is definitely no better than Werth on defense. So how is Dejesus better than them?
he is better than Werth or Hart????? have you looked at stats lately????? not to mention Werth and Harts swing are perfect for Fenway. Dejesus only hits for a better average and that just becuase he is having a career year but the other two hit for power and drive in tons or rbi’s and are better base runners than Dejesus, well at least Werth is, I’m not sure about Hart. Werth is a good fielder and if I’m not mistaken Hart is pretty good too. Dejesus is definitely no better than Werth on defense. So how is Dejesus better than them?
All I’m saying is that if the Red Sox have to give up one of their best prospects in Rizzo, Kalish, Iglesias (even though I wouldn’t tarde him because he the the Red Sox SS of the future), and so on they should get someone in return who is good and not just a role player.
All I’m saying is that if the Red Sox have to give up one of their best prospects in Rizzo, Kalish, Iglesias (even though I wouldn’t tarde him because he the the Red Sox SS of the future), and so on they should get someone in return who is good and not just a role player.
I’m glad the BoSox front office has a better understanding of statistical data than its fans. DDJ DOES hit for high average, but he ALSO hits a lot of non HR XBH (plus is good for 10-15 HR per season), hits the gap quite a bit (lots of doubles), takes a really good amount of walks (and has always gotten on base about 4 times out of 10) and has no significant hitting splits. They also compile statistical information on defense, and DDJ is most certainly superior in that category. Hart and Werth look sexy hitting the ball hard (which will get them paid in the off-season, much more than they really deserve), but they do not hit as much, get on base at a higher rate, or play excellent defense (both Werth and Hart are barely passable).
DDJ is not a 4th OF, not even on your “stacked” IR team. People often perceive DDJ as a 4th OF because of his flexibility, but based upon his PRODUCTION, both offensively and defensively, he has been a well above average player every year, and great this year, which you cannot say about either Ellsbury or Hermida. Just do the statistical WAR comparison over at Fangraphs.
Look, you may not want DDJ, and that is fine. Right now, the BoSox could not win the division with their injuries, and they might not even if they get healthy. And yes, DDJ would help, because he IS an impact player. Impact players don’t just have long, sexy swings; they get on base, they extend innings, they score runs, and they also PREVENT runs. The BoSox front office understands that, but often, the BoSox fans do not.
BTW, as high as you think DDJs asking price is high, but Werth and Hart will cost more, and only Werth can even come close to claiming that his offensive production (which has not remained stable over the years) outweighs what you would lose defensively.
Precisely. The Royals have some OF prospects, but not enough of elite quality to justify shedding a good player with such a decent contract. This is a really good position for the Royals. You can either get a good deal, or continue to have a good player.
Bottom line: if the Royals do not get a package that is more than what they feel they would net with Type A draft compensation (which is a bit of a gamble), then they should not do the deal. I have really hated the recent development of teams getting low-balled on prospect returns for proven players, only to see teams like the BoSox flip those players for a ton of draft picks the next year. The Royals should pay attention, and demand that they get their fair share, or they should make the compensation system work for those that need it, not the teams flush with cash.
Precisely. The Royals have some OF prospects, but not enough of elite quality to justify shedding a good player with such a decent contract. This is a really good position for the Royals. You can either get a good deal, or continue to have a good player.
Bottom line: if the Royals do not get a package that is more than what they feel they would net with Type A draft compensation (which is a bit of a gamble), then they should not do the deal. I have really hated the recent development of teams getting low-balled on prospect returns for proven players, only to see teams like the BoSox flip those players for a ton of draft picks the next year. The Royals should pay attention, and demand that they get their fair share, or they should make the compensation system work for those that need it, not the teams flush with cash.
Corey Hart can claim that too since he is having one of the best offensive seasons in baseball. And like I said if the Red Sox outfield is healthy, who does Dejesus start over? And I understand that Werth and Hart would cost more but it would be worth it. And no they can’t win it right now with their injuries but when they finally come back healthy they can come back easily, and besides winning the wild card does almost as much for them. Also Werth has hit for more doubles and had more walks and Dejesus has only a few more in each category than Hart but all of Hart’s other numbers more than make up for it with being in the top 5 in the NL in HR and RBI’s. And you cant put Ellsbury into the conversation when you talk about whos been better this year becuase he has been injured in case you havent noticed, when he plays he is by far better than Dejesus and if you compare year by year Ellsbury has a higher WAR from 08 to 09 when he became a starter not like when he got called up during the 07 season even though he was an integral part of the world series that they won. And Hermida would be the fifth outfielder or be traded, I never said he was better than Dejesus. Oh and if you could take a poll of GM’s across the MLB I guarantee that they all would rather have Hart or Werth over Dejesus.
OBP is very valuable but some of the best players in the game that are having tremendous years actually have lower OBP’s than Dejesus, so it shows that power beats OBP when you are on a team that already has a high OBP like the Red Sox. The Sox could get either Hart or Werth and put them in a spot in the lineup where runners are going to be on for them so they can drive them in. The Red Sox have enough high OBP players, they need another player who can hit some homeruns. Even though they are second in the AL in homeruns its because of players who dont normally hit homeruns are hitting homeruns and they probably wont continue doing that.
I understand your point but what I’m saying is that I’d rather see the Sox trade their top prospects for players who are better than Dejesus. I think the Sox would be giving up to much if the trade someone like Kalish or Iglesias for Dejesus. I think the best trade i would offer to the Royals is Yamaico Navarro and either Josh Reddick or Daniel Nava. And I would only trade Navarro because he is going to be blocked by other prospects like Iglesias and Vitek in the future.
He’s a career .789 OPS with a higher than normal BABIP. Will he be better than Kalish this year and most likely next? Yes, but I’ll take Kalish for the next 6 years to be more valuable than DeJesus over the next year and a half. Not to mention Cameron, DeJesus, Drew, and Hermida would all be FA at the same time, with only Ellsbury there (Kalish would be gone).
Absolutely the Royals should expect a couple of good prospects. Also the Red Sox should absolutely not give up Kalish for a guy they don’t need (the outfield hasn’t been the problem, and neither has the offense until maybe recently, maybe). Dejesus may be WORTH Ryan Kalish, but he isn’t worth it to the Sox, I don’t think the Sox give up Kalish unless it is part of a deal for a guy who figures as a major part of the their future, in other words someone who has several years left on their contract or they are going to try to sign to an extension. Some one like a Jayson Werth (who personally I don’t really want to see on the Sox, but that’s another story).
when was he on the DL when he was traded; not attacking you and dis agreeing just trying to remember.
No its not absolute garbage. The med staff was saying that they saw something in the knee that would or could amount to wear and tear in the lifetime of the contract. You’re telling me that a trained eye can’t see that there is cartilage that is starting to wear or a ligament that is potentially going to be a problem down the road.
Its not like they told the Sox that if they signed Bay they would be sorry in year one. but it is not completely out of the question that a doctor can forsee a potential problem with a major joint either.
Yes, they were incorrect with Ellsbury, but you can’t say 85 games into a 810 game contract (potentially with the vesting option) that they were wrong about Bay.
Besides; who cares the guy’s got 6HR’s and 44RBIs and is hitting .265. Darnell McDonald is giving them that production and is playing better defense and can play all three OF spots.
But either way. It’s not garbage; its a medical opinion.
Lets back track a bit: I can remember when i was upset with the medical staff (which i’m sure is different now) when Pedro went to the Mets cuz theo wouldn’t give him a 4th year b/c of what the med staff thought. In year one,
2005 he was Pedro 208Ks in 217 innings with an 2.82 ERA
2006 was a different story but wasnt the end of the world: 137K’s in 132 innings, but was clearly not the same pitcher and went down for two seperate months.
From there on it was down hill in a hurry.
All i’m saying is, i thought Pedro not being brought back was the dumbest thing since letting Clemens go, turned out the staff knew what they were doing after all. Halfway thru 2005 you wouldn’t beleive what was going to happen to Pedro’s health in the next 3 seasons, but it did. Ultimately it was a good move for the Sox and a pisspoor investment for the Mets (the same team that ignored the potential for injury with Bay).
Don’t think this can’t happen again. just cuz they were wrong about Ellsbury doesn’t mean it’s garbage to try to forsee an 80million dollar mistake with Bay’s knees.