Links for Tuesday on a night that NL hitters have to face Roy Halladay, Josh Johnson and Ubaldo Jimenez…
- Geoff Baker of the Seattle Times says the Mariners aren't going to trade Felix Hernandez this summer, even though they won’t be in contention. They probably won’t be contenders in 2012, either so Baker wonders if GM Jack Zduriencik will consider trading his ace next summer.
- Erick Almonte of the Brewers is one of many MLB players to graduate from independent leagues to the majors, as MLB.com’s Doug Miller explains. I took a look at the path from Indy ball to the majors last summer.
- MLB and the MLBPA say they are set to announce an agreement regarding former players and Ronald Blum of the AP reports that the sides have agreed to increase pensions for older retired players (via the Miami Herald).
Given how much Felix’s contract balloons in the next year, any guesses on what it’d take to land him?
theo epstein: bag of peanuts and jd lowrie will do it
theo’s actual offer was any five of:
Clay Buchholz
Daniel Bard
Michael Bowden
Justin Masterson
Nick Hagadone
Josh Reddick
Yamaico Navarro
Felix Doubront
Clay and Bard are good but that is about three players short of even a contemplation.
not really. it was offered before felix signed his extension
Not sure exactly what it would take, but it would probably take enough to cripple a minor league system as deep as the Royals.
Then only one team could possibly get him… more likely to be one MLB ready player (preferibly a starter) two high prospects, and a two or three average to below average prospects.
It will take something great, but when everyone holds out and Seattle is forced to deal him as his contract nears end, they won’t get what they SHOULD get. It happens all the time. He’s going to command one of the biggest packages we’ve seen in a while.
Poor Felix. Such an awesome pitcher stuck on a horrible team during some prime years… He must be miserable. Seattle would be doing him a huge favor trading him asap.
It’s not like they forced him to sign his contract. He signed a mega deal, so obviously he either loves Seattle, loves money, or is confident they will improve. I think its a combination of the three, and despite the want to win, I wouldn’t say he’s miserable.
It’s pretty hard to be miserable when you’re getting paid close to 20m a year.
EDIT: sorry, that was for the first guy.
I am pretty sure Felix LOVES Safeco.
Yeah, poor Felix, and poor Josh Johnson, man we need to make a petition for those lousy teams to just give up already and bow out of the major leagues and give the teams only we care about their star players.
Stupid comment. I am sorry you don’t care about the mariners, because I always will, as I am sure millions of marlins fans do as well.
psst, sarcasm.
I hope any ways, cause I thought that was humorous.
Yes, that was surly humor, I love the Mariners.
The Mariners could probably get an unbelievable haul for him if they traded him this summer. But the morale of the city and team would plummet even more. That would be heartbreaking.
HE WOULD DEFINITLY GARNER A HUGE DEAL. THE ONLY TRADE I WOULD ACCEPT WOULD BE A PACKAGE FOR TROY TULOWISKI AND SOME OF THIER MINOR LEAGUE PLAYERS. YEAH, MY MARINERS SUCK RIGHT NOW. BUT WE ARE YOUNG, WE ARE GOING TO GET BETTER AND WE HAVE PINIEDA AND FELIX .. TWO OF MAYBE THE BEST ARMS IN THE LEAQUE..
I understand you said maybe but saying Pineda already can be considered one of the best arms in the league is jumping the gun quite a bit. He’s looked outstanding through three starts and for the M’s sake, I hope he works out. But you might want to temper expectations until the kid makes at least 30 starts on the ML level.
And there’s no way Jack Z would ask for any caliber every day player like Tulo in return for Felix. Building the Minor League system and getting high ceiling players with little to no ML service time would do Seattle much better in the long term than bringing on a contract like Tulo’s to a rebuilding club.
LOUD NOISES
WHAT?!
come on, all caps?
I HAVE BLOOD COMING OUT OF MY EYES JUST TRYING TO READ THIS!!!!
Tulowiski? Sure he may be young, but the only difference between him and ARod’s horrid contract is the ARod makes 10M more during the 10 year term some inept GM gave him and Tulo will “only” be making 160M over the next 10 seasons.
Montero – Betances – Heathcott – Brackman – Nova – Nunez
Montero – Heathcott – Nova – Hughes – Nunez
Yeah, Felix is having a blast right now..Nothing like putting the issues of entire organization on the back of a single 25 yr old. Perhaps they just want to deflate him even more. Whatever it is, it’s just a flat out bad idea. The business side of holding on to Felix makes absolutely zero sense and frankly even the people writing these articles can’t even validate a reason for keeping him other than attendance? yeah right..
The comments I read from fans on other sites have been selfish at best. Claiming their own interest in this all the while watching a losing team. Yeah let’s rob potentially one of the greatest pitchers of this generation with the support of complete team and for him to compete for a championship.
You think anyone will remember Zack Grienke in 10 years. I going with no. Hate to see the same fate with Felix?
Do anyone find it interesting some teams, a lot of teams, actually do well after trading one of their prized players? The Mariners have shown success several times with this..
Yeah, dumping him into the lap of the Post and the Daily News would be much better for his ego and self esteem than carrying a team out in Seattle.
Reread your post and you might understand why Yankees fans are the most detestable and self absorbed fans on the planet. I smile every time I read of a player with a No-Trade-To-The-Yankees clause. At least Seattle fans appreciate him.
It’s not easy playing in ny, but he wouldn’t be “carrying” the team. This town’s not for everyone, and everyone knows that. But the burden is shared between stars, unlike other places where one or two superstars shoulder the most of it. I think that’s what Century’s point was. But your point is still true, it would be a lot more pressure playing in ny, even with a strong supporting staff.
And btw, that no-trade-to-the-yankees clause is almost always just so they can squeeze a few more million when they ultimately do go to the yanks, because it’s semi-against their will or something. It won’t surprise me if the no trade clauses just happen to be to the Yankees, Red Sox, Mets, Cubs, Phillies, and other teams that have the $ to “convince” the player otherwise.
Just for the record, I’m part of the minority who wishes we don’t give away Montero and the killer Bs, for any pitcher, royalty or not.
OMFG….the posters here just kill me…….
Pineda gets brought up and a poster above says dont get excited until he makes 30 ML starts….but when the Yankee prospects are brought up…one who is the same age as Felix with no MLB experience, one a year younger with no MLB experience, and one who has never pitched above AA….we should just take it for granted that they are going to be AT LEAST solid #2 in the rotation.
Then we have the genius who uses the argument that we are cheating Felix by keeping one of this generations best arms on a bad team……and then theres the whole Zack Grienke comment…
Guys, I understand the comments are for fun and speculation, but seriously! Felix isnt going anywhere unless the Mariners are blown away. Jack has been in charge for just over a year, and is still working around some bad contracts, but has already improved the system ten fold. Felix, Pineda, Smoak, Ackley, the second pick in the draft….this team is headed in the right direction, and can be competitive in 3 years, no problem.
Thank you for saying some common sense, problem with this site is it is full of Yankee and Red Sox fans who only come on this site to post who they think their team can get and it boils my blood at what they think Felix is worth, you think the Phillies would trade Halladay for that garbage package? No? Why do you think it sounds too good to be true of a deal for New York to get Felix for that package of players? Because it is too good to be true Yankee fans.
While I would hate for the Yankees to get him, I think that bottom offer might be able to get it done.
They have better luck getting Halladay from the Phillies than they do in getting Felix with that package.
Further the Mariners currently have nothing outside of Smoak that is semi-proven. Pineda? Perhaps..who else? Ackley? good prospect, but jury still seems out on him. Yeah 2013 seems like a real shot..Please..and then what is 2014 with Felix facing free agency? What if he gets injured? So many questions, with very little time and no team outside a few guys..
This team is so SO far off from having “it” that it does require a full fledged tear it down rebuild, like Rosenthal wrote about. His article a few weeks ago was dead on perfect and very true. Anyone who doesn’t see this is blind or has the same business savy as two 4 years old swapping fries for onion rings at burger king – I like burger king
If you’re hoping for a real debate, conversation, argument even, all grounded in reality, I want to let you know that you’re not going to get it. Instead, what you’ll get is a bunch of haters spewing anti-Yankees garbage, because you know, that’s all they can do.
Because we called him out when he said the Mariners and Felix Hernandez were stupid for not taking whatever offer the Yankees threw at them? Because he said that Zack Greinke would be a forgotten nobody in ten years because he refused to play in the Bronx? I’d say any hate generated by his post was well deserved.
I’m from Long Island and I would never want to deal with the New York media. What makes you think people from elsewhere would delight in it? I’m surprised more people don’t do what Cliff Lee did this winter.
“because he refused to play in the Bronx?”
I don’t see that in the sentence I wrote above.
“whatever offer the Yankees threw at them”
It’s not like my proposal was Kei Igawa and Francisco Cervelli for Felix.
I don’t think Montero, Heathcott, Nova, Hughes, Nunez is “throwing” That’s more like holy *** we should think about that..
I could go on about this so many different ways, but I made most of my point. You misinterpreted much of it and that’s a shame because there is a really good argument in there. Has nothing to do with the Post or Daily news. Has nothing to do with being absorbed or detested, as you stated. If you put your emotions aside for a moment and look at the business aspect of such a transaction it’s almost a perfect match. A championship player in Felix with 23 non championship or too young players, vs. 25 complete professional ball players. Where does he belong? There is nothing flawed in saying something like this and it shouldn’t be construed as being arrogant.
You’re incorrigible.
“A championship player in Felix with 23 non championship or too young players, vs. 25 complete professional ball players.”. Nothing arrogant there.
You must be too young to remember the 80s when the Yankees sucked. I can’t wait till the Yankees age their way into the basement in a few years and their fans are forced to learn humility. Next you’ll be talking about “your rings”. Please.
I take it you’re a Mariners fan..
and I don’t wear jewelry.
You’re just one great big ball of happy, aren’t you?
Oh its coming. The Yankees core is old expensive guys on the fringe of productivity… A-Hole, Jeter, Posada, Rivera. When that crew starts crumbling and that lineup and rotation start struggling……..this crowd will quiet way down.
Ya know, you talk a lot of smack for someone who supports a team with the worst record. EDIT: Oh, they won yesterday. Congrats for not being the worst team in the league…for now.
I can tell by your affectionate nicknames you really miss Alex. Aww, it’s cute, really.
Anyway, here’s how it works. A dose of reality in your otherwise void, if you will. When players get old, we thank them for their services and they get replaced. It’s not really brain surgery. Yes, the core is old, but there’s a top 5 hitting prospect in the minors and a few spectacular arms ready to be the new “core” for years to come. And you know what happens when they get old…? I know you can figure this out on your own.
Wow, Ok….so I guess I dont know much about baseball because my team has a bad record…. Did you work for the Bush Administration by chance?
Yes, I understand in theory that you replace players as they age….but unlike football, you still have to pay the idiotic sums of money you agreed to pay them.
hahaha you’re mixing the two points up. You don’t know much about baseball because, judging by your original comment, you don’t understand how teams replace aging players, even if they are/were a core group. But you seem to have backtracked, so yes, you still have to pay them idiotic sums… but the Yankees make enough money that they don’t have to worry about paying someone. Helps having business savvy minds leading an organization.
Anyway, what the hell does my political affiliation have to do with anything. Seriously, like anything at all? For the record, no. But still, left field.
Yeah, you never make it personal, and you are always civil… delusional is more like it.
The Bush comment was a reference to your ability to talk around an issue without really addressing it…in your typical condescending attitude. You make comments about how I call them the Wankees, that I attack you….and that you havent done the same….except that you do.
“but the Yankees make enough money that they don’t have to worry about paying someone. Helps having business savvy minds leading an organization.”
And the largest market in sports….and their own network…but yeah, its all about the brilliant minds running the organization, right? You Wankee fans mirror your obnoxious, whining, self absorbed, blowhard team owner.
Ehh, you’re taking it too personal. It’s merely a fact that we make a lot of money, yes, from marketing and the network and other stuff because the organization has quality minds running it. How is that a bad thing? Keep in mind that the Mets play in the same market. Big difference.
Also, what have I not addressed? You like to make up things, don’t you? Hmmm… List one thing I have talked around and I’ll address it now, or live with the fact that you make baseless claims for the sole purpose to slander others.
Not if you trade those said players for Felix though right? Because I know your talking about Montero and his awesome DH ability and I assume you are talking about Banuelos and Betances and Co as your young core right? Well, which is it, are you going to have your core or are you going to have Felix? I sure hope you answer core because I can tell you Felix isn’t happening.
Read above for my reply to JaySchu
Just for the record, I’m part of the minority who wishes we don’t give away Montero and the killer Bs, for any pitcher, royalty or not.
Another thing, I always got the impression that you were a red sox fan. my bad?
I grew up in Seattle and was always a Mariners fan, only problem is they are one of the dumbest teams when it comes to operating a team, they dropped the ball on so many star players it is ridiculous, but they have always been my team to root for.
Hey bud… it all starts somewhere….and theres no ploace better to start than around a stud young pitcher under team control for multiple years.
If the Mariners should trade anyone it should be Ichiro….an aging star toward the end of his career with some value and a large salary.
Never ever say trade Ichiro….If he stays the same he could be the first Mariners player to get 3000 hits, I mean he already has 3000 professional hits but this guy could very well get the hit record or damn close. He is a true Seattle treasure.
I love Ichiro, I really do….but for a guy in the twilight of his career he deserves better than this, and I think he is the type of guy that could make a real difference on a contending team while clearing salary and bringing the Mariners a solid prospect or two.
Its a tough decision, but its the kind of decision that makes the difference between a team trying to rebuild into a competitor and a team simply treading water…which the Mariners were doing under Bavasi.
Bavasi screwed this team more than anyone could of ever imagined, he drafted so poorly, and he saw something in garbage players that no one else saw, this year is the final year of the Bavasi era, the final year and it is so sweet to feel that relief, trust in Jack Z, he knows what he is doing and watch as he drafts good players especially with the 2nd overall draft pick.
I bet Jack Z secretly reads this site and is still laughing at this, why does this make sense for Felix but wouldn’t for Josh Johnson? JJ is pitching fantastic, already showing his straight dominance, and you want to think about owners that are smart and trade when the time is right? How come the Marlins wouldn’t jump on that proposal or even consider it? Think about that for just a minute as you realize that is the same team that traded MCab for Cameron Maybin and a bag of balls, how come you don’t read about the Marlins mulling an offer of Banuelos, Nova,Betances or whoever Heathcott is for Josh Johnson, or just two or three of those guys? Because as much as you think they are stellar players, the FACT is they aren’t, they have a good future, but then you talk about well what if Felix gets injured? Well, what if one of those PROSPECTS gets injured? See? injury argument is dumb, so keep your players and just stop, stop this stupid pipe dream that the Mariners are so dumb not to trade their ace for prospects.
Good lord, give it a rest.
speak of the devil… here for your nightly haterade session?
I am six hours late because i had to go to that thing called a job, but my argument is Felix is a good guy to build around and how about you guys watch your own team and let the Mariners at least attempt to play the 2011 season before you go off on them, you have to understand we had a joke of a GM and some jokes of a manager and truth is we have a joke of an owner, but Jack Z is driving the car and it seems like it is going to be a fun ride and I don’t need Yankee rumor speed bumps on my trip.
Better late than never! And that’s not really an argument. Everyone knows Felix is a top 3 (top 5 at worst) pitcher in the league. I guess the argument is that by the time all the contracts are done with, and the Ackley’s and Pineda’s are ready for the big leagues, and Jack Z has brought in enough talent for them to contend, Felix will be in his last year, if not gone already.
Then they resign him with the proof the are intent on contending, it is one thing to be a player on a team and you know they are not even trying, but if Jack Z is going to have his way, Felix and the rest of baseball will see he is going to steer them in the right direction, and throwing Felix overboard puts them back 5 to 6 years.
Well… that makes sense. If they can field a winning team by his walk year, they can perhaps offer a market value extension which he signs. Or he goes for the big(ger) money and elects free agency. Either way, too early to speculate right now though.
You probably disagree, but I feel it’s a lot harder to build around a great pitcher than it is around a great hitter.
I don’t know how old you are, but I grew up during the Griffey Jr. era, so it would be nice to see the Ms contending again. Well, best of luck to you and your team.
You are the one who is blind, to say the Mariners won’t contend is stupid, you the same person who thought the Red Sox would win 100 games? hows the month of April going for them? It is baseball, how about you let the game be played before you go and run your fingers on how the Mariners won’t contend, the only one who was dead on perfect was the guy who wrote Jack Z had some bad contracts to work around, once they all fall off, the end of this season by the way, and they actually start to draft decent and trade well, which they have been, you will see a different team. Only thing I am worried about as of right now is Gutierrez’s stomach, because he was an awesome talent to have and its a shame this fluky stomach thing has him down, but other than that we are decent postion by position and can only get better.
And this is why everyone hates Yankee fans.
I think it’s safe to say that Felix will not be traded. Any team that can afford to trade for him, simply won’t give up what he’s worth.
Thats just factually incorrect….a player is only worth what someone is willing to give up for him.
Really?! You’re going to try to bait me into an argument about semantics? I’m not falling for it. Go get a hobby.
GAH damn it I’m a weak man.
It’s like saying if everyone else has $50 while I have $100, and a baseball bat costs $80. I can afford it, but I choose not to buy it because it isn’t worth me spending that much on. Simple, right?
Yeah….except you are talking about an inanimate object with a known value……as opposed to a human being who doesnt have a price tag dangling from his rear….other than that your point is valid.
Actually, he does.
2012 – 18.5m
2013 – 19.5m
2014 – 20m
haha
looks like someone needs another lesson…..
If there were 20 Felix Hernandez’s…all making the same money, same productivity, that would be true. (I know every pitcher in Yankee system is a Felix Hernandez, but humor me).
But there is only one, and his compensation is only part of the equation. If Felix was underperforming and paid above what people think his monetary worth, that would change things….as would his health, length of contract, age, etc.
As is, think of it as a unique classic, there is no set value for the piece…he’s only worth to each team what they are willing to pay, and compensation between teams is purely opinion. Thats the way pretty much every trade works.
How many times have you seen a star traded for prospects that never pan out? How many times have you seen a throw in prospect flourish?
Here’s the fact. No, not every pitcher in the Yankees farm is Felix Hernandez, or up to his caliber. Stop spouting BS. It’s getting annoying and childish. I’m not even reading the rest of it until you stop these straw man fallacies. I’ll respond when you tell me how you expect Felix to pitch and be the clean up hitter for the Ms? Go on, your turn to humor me.
EDIT: Actually, I get what you’re saying. No need to explain. I got it the first time. I was just being a jerk by posting what his monetary worth actually is hahaha
What would you give to aquire the 2003 version of Roy Halladay with multiple years of control left at slightly below market value?
BOTH of my kidneys!
You don’t want to know.
Montero, Brackman, Banuelos, Betances, Heathcott…
It’d probably be more along the lines of Cano, Hughes, Joba, Kennedy, and Gardner. Are you seriously going to tell me that’s not a good package to build around for the future? And before you mention Hughes, I’m guessing the new team would not have sent Joba and Hughes up and down from bullpen to rotation year to year to mess with their arms/psyche.
That is a great package, now take out Hughes because his arm is currently dead and he is showing his 2008 numbers, and Kennedy because he is along with Hughes and put in that DH Montero and one of the B’s probably Betances because he has more promise so yeah if they offered Cano, Gardener, Betances and Monetero and shoot Brackman then Jack Z would have a decision to make, but then ask yourself, would Brian Cashman even offer this?
Right now? No, never. That’s the point though. While teams like the Royals, Braves, Yanks, etc. can afford Felix through prospects, they just won’t be willing to offer what he’s worth. There’s no way to justify it. Too great of a risk putting all your eggs in one pitcher. Let the kids develop and let’s say 3/5 fall below expectation or get injured, you’re still left with good cheap options for the future.
Also, the names I mentioned… I was trying to equate to what would be offered for Doc Halladay a few years ago, not for Felix today. Back then, Cano, Hughes, Kennedy, Joba were the big names in the farm, similar to Montero, Killer Bs are today.
Also, Betances is good, but Banuelos is the guy you want. Trust me on this one. Kid looks like a young Johan on the mound! Pardon the excitement, but it’s the freaking Yankees… we haven’t had good prospects to be optimistic about in YEARS!
if ur sarcastic, then BOY am i stupid 🙁
Edit:Was meant below my previous comment!
Felix won’t be traded. Argument closed.