4:01pm: The Rockies and Blue Jays are still discussing Guthrie, Renck reports (Twitter links). There's a potential fit, but the Rockies would like someone other than McDade. As many as four clubs are interested, Renck reports.
MONDAY, 7:57am: The Rockies are looking to move Guthrie's salary for one prospect, Troy Renck of the Denver Post reports (on Twitter). Renck confirms that the Rockies and Blue Jays have discussed a possible deal.
SUNDAY: The Rockies are ready to part ways with Jeremy Guthrie and have informed the rest of the league that the right-hander is available immediately, tweets Buster Olney of ESPN.com. Count the Blue Jays as one of Guthrie's potential suitors as Toronto has contacted Colorado to discuss the framework of a possible deal, report Ken Rosenthal and Jon Paul Morosi of FOX Sports. One trade scenario would have the Jays assuming a major portion of Guthrie's contract as the Rockies would receive only a lower-tier prospect such as Double-A first baseman Mike McDade.
The former Orioles ace has struggled both on and off the mound since arriving in Colorado during the offseason. Known for his propensity to ride his bicycle to the ballpark, Guthrie landed on the disabled list in April when the chain on his bike popped, causing him to fall on his pitching shoulder. After pitching to a 4.12 ERA in five seasons with the O's, Guthrie has been prone to the home run in Denver as he's posted a 6.91 ERA with 4.5 K/9 and 3.4 BB/9 in 10 starts.
If it only costs McDade , then do it.
I think having Guthrie on your team can also be considered a cost
So is having Cecil , Guthrie at least had decent numbers when he was in Baltimore.
cecil has a career FIP of 4.72… Guthrie.. 4.79..
add to the fact that Guthrie costs more money (a lot more) and requires a “prospect” he is really not an upgrade over cecil.
Sure, but Guthrie wouldn’t be replacing Cecil. Even with Cecil in the rotation, the Jays still need two more starting pitchers.
I’m not keen on Guthrie either, but with 60% of the Jays starting rotation on the DL, times are desperate.
Its too much money for a spot starter.
I’d rather give Perez or Villanueva a few starts then trade for a guy who may give us a marginally better performance.
Morrow wont be gone too long and early tests on Hutchinson have shown no structural damage.
If all 3 were gone for a long while then sure.
This.
The rotation looks pretty messed up right now, but Morrow shouldn’t be gone for too long, and the Jays have the same awful internal options as Guthrie represents.
A big help would be Santos returning and moving Villanueva into the rotation. Any news about his shoulder since his setback?
he’s still not throwing off a mound, so he’s a ways away… seems a bit weird for just a shoulder strain.
That’s ridiculously optimistic.
where am i optimistic?
There’s the number 2 starter AA was looking for lol, yikes! God forbid this isnt true. 15HR/56IP/77hits/$8M, enough said.
No. Just no. Guthrie will just end up getting run over by some numpty cab driver in Toronto if he insists on biking to the park. It’s a monthly thing here it seems.
Well, I’ve biked to the park for the past three seasons and the worst thing that’s happened to me has been an idiot backing into me in front of the dome and denting my back tire. There are better reasons to think that Guthrie wouldn’t work in Toronto…like the fact that he’s just not a good pitcher.
I’m surprised O’Dowd isn’t trying to get a 4th OFer type player for Guthrie. He seems to have some sick fetish for them.
That’s because 4th outfielder types become Babe Ruth at Coors Field. (see Dante Bichette)
Really? You must be joking. See Ryan Spilborghs, Jeff Baker, Seth Smith, Matt Murton, Cory Sullivan.
Get back to sea level, get back to having a useful 2-seamer = back to mild success.
Very valid point. First thing that came to me, when I first heard of the trade. He wasn’t all that great in the AL East, pitching in that thin air in Denver, he’s going to get clobbered!
yup 4.23 road era. ideally Colorado should stock mainly flame throwers or large speed differential guys, not movement pitchers.
your first thought was that now he’s leaving the AL EAST for the NL WEST he’s going to get clobbered?
Absolutely. You put a flyball pitcher in Denver and bad things happen to him. I have no idea why Colorado thought this would work.
If O’Dowd keeps his job after this season’s debacle, something is wrong. This team has no semblance of major league pitching and a stars and scrubs roster alongside Cargo and Tulo.
Preaching to the choir, the entire city of Denver is confused as to why O’Dowd still has his job.
How about Jim Tracy!!!! He quickly ruied them championship atmoshpere that Clint Hurdle built. Jim Tracy is a big problem with the Rockies
You all are right! They need a major overhaul of the roster and of the folks that put that monstrosity together. Start at the top.
Tracy definitely isn’t getting off the hook, I completely agree with you.
to bee fair to o’dowd,,,, lots of unforeseen injuries/underperforamnce have hurts the rotation,,, it is not alls his fault
de la rosa
nicasio
pomeranz
white
guthrie
not all his faults
you can add Chacin to that as well. That said, you can’t build a solid rotation out of so many question marks. I said from the spring, if you have a competition with 7,8 “5th starters” the best you’re going to get is a bunch of “5th starters”. What did O’Dowd expect, that he would somehow find a diamond in the rough?
That stadium itself in Colorado needs to be stuck in a humidifier rather than the baseballs to stop all the blasts every Rockies SP that has pretty much every put on the uni there has been plagued by. Guthrie is not nearly as bad as he has shown and rotten luck he finally got to play in the NL and of all places? That stadium..
No offense to the fans there, but it’s just bad luck (as always) for Guthrie.. he got stuck with the horrible orioles offense and defense for years, then gets moved the very season they seem to finally compete and he’s exiled onto a losing Rockies franchise.. The story remains the same.
Jays have 3SP down and could do far worse with a pickup and AA knows it. If Morales hadn’t looked so decent tonight as a fillin for beckett, wouldn’t have been averse to Cherrington looking him over if the cost is only a mediocre prospect as it seems to be.
Speaking of Morales game vs the Cubs tonight.. He was still throwing 94, sometimes 95-6 60 pitches into the game and he only threw 70. morales has never thrown harder than 97mph that am aware of and that is almost never.. he works 93-96 almost always.. Bard threw 97-99 as a reliever, then started and dropped to 92-95mph… Hmmm.. Forget that SP role and Morales’s change was pretty decent. His curve maybe not that great, but Bard’s curve and change haven’t been worth anything since the beginning of the season and he lost 5mph off of his heater and hitters didn’t have to be ready for his blazing FB all the time..
If they are going to use one of those 2.. it’s pretty obvious that Morales can maintain velocity a whole heap better than Bard and they both need work on secondary pitches.. A blind person can make the choice on which to use as a starter.. lefty who throws 95mph over 5-6IP, or RH who can’t… Duh….
True all that, but just a reminder… The Cubs are awful!
Taken into account the Cubs are bad. Both Bard and Morales need to work on the secondary pitches if they are going to “sit” low 90’s like Bard has lived as a SP which he didn’t have to worry about as a upper 90’s reliever and am *not* saying Morales could be anything more than a back end SP, but he looked a lot like Doubrant out there.. FB a tad harder and his CB not quite the bite, but he DID throw the ball over the strike zone most of the time, even with his change, which is a “change” from what Bard was doing previously.
Didn’t mean to bust your baseballs, it’s Just I’m a bit surprised at your overly optimistic projections concerning Morales. Knowing his history as well as knowing that velocity isn’t everything, you made it sound as if his performance was a portent of things to come.
I would have had nothing to say if It had been against the Jays, Orioles,Tigers, Angels, Ranger, Brewers, or Reds, at least those are a bit more potent line-ups.As it is, his outting equates to something just under a 4.00 ERA, I think that where Bard’s been also. Until he does it against a better hitting team I remain skeptical.
Funny thing, Morales is the type of lefty that has success against the
Yanks. If he’s still in the rotation next time around, watch him shut out
my team and make me eat crow!
“Funny thing, Morales is the type of lefty that has success against the
Yanks.”
That is exactly what was thinking while was watching him pitch those 5IP against the Cubs.. Hard FB, not afraid to throw inside (and hard) to lefties.. Fair cb that would be much more effective against a LH lineup.
Nah, it was ok and got where you were coming from. he was getting stretched out probably just for these emergency starts and for teams with heavy LH lineups anyway. he’ll be back in the pen when/if beckett comes back and it gives some good news..Wave goodbye to Aaron Cook whenever he returns from the DL.. morales already showed he is a better option than Cook could ever hope to be as an emergency option.
There are 4 parks that give up more home runs than Coors Field, and that’s with the sorry pitchers the Rockies are starting. Plus if you give your team a chance you get a lot of run support most of the time. If you can pitch, you can be just fine in Denver.
If you’re hearing about it, it’s not happening.
– Alex Anthoupoulos
Sadly, yes. As much as Guthrie is sub-par… he’s better than Laffey.
I sorta want the orioles to get this guy back… I don’t know if the Rockies would be willing to deal him back to the team that robbed them earlier this year, but I really think that all he needs to be successful again is to get out of Coors Field. He’s an extreme fly ball pitcher. This was a disaster waiting to happen in Colorado. I think he would be fine once he got out of there, and he’s already also proven that he can have some success against the al east. The orioles, despite their great start, are still hurting for sp. If the price is only a minor prospect AND the Rockies are willing to give him back to the team that robbed them, I think it’s a very good fit.
The Rox got fleeced on this Guthrie trade, he seems like a guy I’d like to hit against and I haven’t played in 7 years…
Well, what other choices have Jays got? They’re not gonna risk their star prospects’ arms, Villanueva / L Perez can get by in a pinch, but not 20 starts, AA’s got do some wheelin’ and dealin’ , prove he’s got somethin’ to offer fans
I would normally think the Cardinals would be players for him. But with the way they are playing not sure it is worth trading the prospect.
Orioles should trade for him. We’d welcome him back with open arms
Talk about a public relations nightmare for the Rockies. First you trade Hammel to the Orioles for Guthrie, then you ship Guthrie back to the Orioles for some extra part just to get rid of the salary.
Add a 7.00 era guy into the rotation. Past success is what it is, and so is Colorado, I don’t think that him coming back equals a return to form at all and for the money we’d have to pay him it makes 0 sense.
Joking right…Jeremy Guthrie….Arlo Guthrie would be a better choice
Jeremy Guthrie is funny… and that is where the positives end. The O’s certainly got the better end of that deal, oh yeah and Matt Lindstrom.
I dunno about this…
Romero – not a true number one, basically just a number two pitching slightly above slot.
Morrow – One day an ace, the next 3-4 starts not so much
Then you have three young guys, two of which have hit a wall, the other will shortly. And this is without the injuries if everyone is healthy as an ox. So even with everyone healthy, add Guthrie and this isnt a contending rotation.
Sure McDade isnt a top prospect, he projects as a career DH with a little 1B but he is a switch hitter with good numbers so to trade him for a guy having a rough year to come to “save the day” is kinda silly.
There are plenty of guys out there available right now on the cheap to come in and eat innings, thatd be a better idea rather than trotting up more prospects and young guys to develop in a poor situation or guys like Cecil and other guys with almost zero stuff to throw batting practice.
As an O’s fan would love to see Toronto get Guthrie so the O’s can tee off on him. I loved guts here in bmore but he serves up dingers way to often. Toronto would lose a prospect and get an expensive mediocre pitcher.
Just an FYI, but Cecil throws 88 – 89, the same way Beuhrle – 85mph, Moyer – 82, Schilling – 89, Glavine – 88, Greg Maddox – 86 – 89 throw fastballs that are lucky to hit 90mph and they have won over 200 games each in the majors.
Guthrie in Baltimore was snake-bit when he would watch his seasons end with 9 – 17 records, but look at his game lines. Six games in a row, he would throw 8 innings of 1 run ball and lose the games 1 – 0. Frustration with no support would then see him give up six runs in five innings, skyrocketing his ERA, which would then see him go another 5 games of 8 innings shutout ball, only to get no decisions or lose again through unearned runs.
That is the same Guthrie that was the ACE of the Orioles for years and could always be counted on to keep his team in over 80 percent of his starts. No one complains about Sabathia giving up 8 – 10 hits every game, because he is 8 – 3, but could easily be 3 – 8, if it wasn’t for the Yankees scoring 6 runs or more in the last inning he pitches to make him the pitcher of record. The offense leads to many of his wins, but again, fans see him as an important pitcher. Guthrie loses many games 1 – 0 and he is garbage in the eyes of many. Go figure.
If the Jays get him, he could very easily win 20 games every season, because his past proves it. In 2010, he was 9 – 17, but give him 1 or 2 runs and his record changes to 20 – 10 and his value goes through the roof. That is reality, but when did fans ever consider reality. They prefer living in a dream world, where they judge everything on the here and now, regardless of the circumstances.
I think Guthrie can still be a very capable pitcher for a lot of teams, but he is not in CC’s league. Over the past 5 years (07-11) Guthrie has gotten to and surpassed the 8th inning 16 times. In that same span of time (07-11) CC has done it 52 times, and AGAIN this is only in the past 5 years so thats not even including the 33 times he did it from 01-06 or the 4 times he has already done it this season. Guthrie would never win 20 games anywhere especially in Toronto. When CC gets hit its usually singles, when Guthrie gets lit up its for power and its not like Toronto is a pitchers park. 20 Wins is about tons of skill/dominance and a lot of luck. He doesn’t have that kind of skill/dominance and he would have to be one of the luckiest ever to make up for that. He would have to be 08 Daisuke Matsuzaka 18 wins lucky to get close. That just doesn’t happen often. I mean look at Romero he is a WAY better pitcher than Guthrie and he still can’t squeeze 20 wins out.
Youkilis for Guthrie!?
AA flat out denied this on a Toronto radio station, he was surprisingly candid.