With the Giants enduring their roughest season in recent memory, executive VP of baseball operations Brian Sabean discussed the team’s deadline plans in an interview with Andrew Baggarly of the Bay Area News Group. Though a rebuild isn’t being contemplated, Sabean did acknowledge a need to “be lot more open minded to [possibly trading] more names than we have been in the past.”
To be sure, San Francisco will keep its inner core players. Sabean said it’s reasonable to presume, as has been suggested, that the team won’t be interested in entertaining offers for Madison Bumgarner, Buster Posey, and Brandon Crawford. (“Those three animals are divine,” he said.)
Otherwise, though, the veteran executive suggested that the club will at least consider moves involving the remainder of the roster. “I think needless to say, we’re open for business,” said Sabean, who also said that it’s “embarrassing” for the team to be performing so poorly while carrying such a large payroll.
While salary considerations will obviously play a role, it doesn’t seem as if the Giants are looking to pare down their future commitments above all else. Baggarly explains that the sense is the organization will prioritize the acquisition of near-MLB talent over far-off youngsters; “unless they get those kinds of players in return,” he writes, “they are not eager to pay down money just to get rid of core pieces” — a reference not to the holy trinity cited above, but to the club’s other veteran regulars.
That stance certainly could complicate matters. After all, as the club’s record would suggest, not many of the team’s expensive veterans are really playing up to their salaries. And, as ever, legitimate prospects who are ready to contribute at the major league level are generally harder to come by than those who are a few years off.
All said, the organization remains in a tricky spot with the deadline closing in. Among the costly veterans that aren’t considered untouchable, perhaps only Brandon Belt clearly brings surplus value when weighing his future salary guarantees. Second baseman Joe Panik would surely be of interest to rivals, but he’s also just the sort of sturdy, affordable option the Giants need to retain.
Those sorts of difficult tradeoffs are just as present in the pitching staff. Bumgarner is set to return, which will finally bump struggling veteran Matt Cain out of the rotation, as a report from NBC Sports Bay Area indicates. But the latter has not thrown well enough to be of real interest at the deadline. Plenty of teams would take a shot on Matt Moore, but would likely only do so for pennies on the conceptual dollar the Giants gave to get him last summer. While Jeff Samardzija has sparkling peripherals, his ERA remains inflated and the Giants no doubt envision him on their staff next year. Indeed, Sabean even says that he’d like to see Johnny Cueto pitching for San Francisco next year; his trade status is clouded by a pending opt-out clause.
More broadly, Sabean said “there’s a lot of soul searching going on” — particularly given that the team’s struggles stretch back into the second half of the 2016 season. Charting a path forward will obviously involve the upper reaches of the organization. While GM Bobby Evans has control of the day to day baseball ops decisionmaking process, Sabean indicated that he remains “responsible for the quality control throughout the organization” and will still “be involved in how we map this out.”
Defiantly not buyers- but appears not to be sellers. I hope they make some move
Stuck in the middle is worse than being a seller
Agreed. The Yankees showed last year how a team could quickly reload the farm by trading movable pieces. Giants, with the state of their minors, would be wise to at least consider similar moves.
“Giants, with the state of their minors”
⬆︎THIS⬆︎
The Giants look like the Phillies in 2012. The Phillies played better in the second half and finished 81 – 81 which just gave them a worse draft pick and then they dragged their rear end in 2013 lying to the fans about a rebuild they had embarked on in October 2011.
That lying to keep the seats filled in 2013 cost the Phillies Kris Bryant and they still weren’t done lying and that cost them Kyle Tucker.
The Giants need to sell Posey and Bumgarner and take their lumps tanking for five years. Unless they do so they’ll be looking up at the Dodgers for a long time.
agreed
“Defiantly”
Giants management better not lie to the self
Management would like to competitor 2018
No way Giants are old and injury
I say two to three years rebuild minimum
Maybe the Yanks should look into Belt?
the Yankees should be looking into trading a bunch of prospects for Bumgarner.. HE would make a big difference for the team.for this season and the two next ones.
a temporary fix at 1B is not nearly as significant.
Giants aren’t moving bumgarner
Old Yankees would have traded the farm for Madison, no matter how much of a mismatch the Yankees and MadBum appear to be.
Current Yankees have been smart though and wouldn’t trade their prospects for him.
Old Yankees never traded away anyone they ended up missing later.
Jay Buhner sends his regards.
Bumgardner is untouchable. Giants would never deal him as he is their franchise and still young.
Will if price is right for mad bum would you???
Say three top prospect???
Trade Nunez, cueto, span, shark, maybe belt they still would have a good team next year and could bolster in free agency with younger better players.
“we’re not trading our core”
ask Ruben Amaro how that works out.
The Giants core is actually talented right now. The 2013-2015 Phillies were brutal
“giants core is actually talented”
exactly. trade them and get moving on the rebuild. stars and scrubs with no farm is a terrible place to be.
The core is still reasonably aged and worth building around.. Posey especially will be needed if you are planning on bringing in a young core of players.the issues with the giants are that the pen still isn’t solidified,the starting pitching is underperforming and the outfield and corner infield positions need more offense
Posey could possibly return a young core type player. Those pieces above the Giants are willing to deal will bring back stars of Carson Cistulli’s Fringe Five at FanGraphs.
With each passing year the return for Posey and Bumgarner shrinks.
posey brings a lot more value to the giants than a gamble on a young core player. If you lose posey you need a LOT in return because you are talking about defensive numbers, offensive output and the ability to add a bat in the lineup that normally doesn’t produce. You also need to take into consideration the fact that a kris bryant type doesn’t really help a team @ AT&T as much as it does @ wrigley because of park effect, AT&T is immune form the power boost both by home and visiting teams that you see happening around baseball right now so you are really looking at general production, pitching and defense rather than a big bat, even though you do need more young power in general in the lineup and that is something you can get without giving up a posey or bumgarner.
“ask Ruben Amaro how that works out.”
Your question should be put to John Middleton, not his public scapegoat Amaro.
They have been awful for a full year and have a luxury tax level payroll. So by all means stand pat. Sabean needs a harsh reality check and a quick glance at the standings should be just the smelling salts he needs. Reality check time…
I have a feeling he’s aware of the standings, but I don’t know what makes me think so.
Matt moore & Brandon belt to yankees
They would ask for a lot in return.
Matt Moore I think would be good option for Yankees for sure just because he’s finally healthy again and he has pitched in AL East. His contract is about 9mil over next 2 years, def worth a shot, I feel.
“Matt moore & Brandon belt”
Those two aren’t worth much. Posey hates Belt and everyone knows that. 1B guys aren’t worth much unless they are Paul Goldschmidt.
I have never heard anything close to Posey hating Belt. Don’t make things up without something to prove your claims
Watched it live on a nationally televised game. Announcers were talking about it. The Nationals series where Harper charged the mound.
What are you talking about? Belt and Posey have no issues, that was Strickland not Belt that hit Harper.
Posey was staring down Belt at 1B signaling him to hold the runner on better. Posey did this repeatedly. I’ve never seen a catcher show that much anger and disgust at his first baseman and Belt looked back at Posey like
“I don’t give a fu…. we’re not going anywhere”
I think Posey would welcome a trade to a contender.
You’re right. Posey yelled at Belt during a nationally televised game. That doesn’t mean they hate each other though.
I can’t see moore getting traded he’s been bad this year I honestly wanna see him in the bullpen when mad bum returns over Cain. At least at home Cain can get us to the bullpen.
I think they’re in denial about how bad their situation is and they should be more proactive about it. They don’t seem to have a long term plan. All the other teams in their division are getting younger and better and they’re getting older and worse. A really thin farm system and a luxury tax payroll is not a good mix. I could see them hanging out in the cellar of the NL west for a while.
I get that they don’t want to do a full rebuild because of their core, but they won’t compete again until they fix the OF mess and that means dumping Pence and Span. They’re going to be 34 and 35 next year and making a combined $33 Million. They don’t hit and they’re also the worst defensive OF in the league, which especially hurts in AT&T park. They need to start trimming salary somewhere.
They most certainly need to so something, I think re tooling more so then a rebuild is the way to go, Posey, MadBum and Crawford would only untouchables, I wouldn’t move Panik or Blach but be open minded. Span and Shark most likely will stay, no one wants Cain, Melancon or Moore, happy to trade Belt, Cueto and Nunez and maybe some bullpen arms, Kontos Strickland Gearrin
Finally! Someone demonstrating some smart reasoning instead of throw out the baby with the dirty bathwater. Thank you AussieGiants! I’ll bet some of these people dump their cars if a fan belt breaks or completely rebuild their houses if .the water heater fails. I suspect Sabean is on the right course though he might have to do more than he wants if a good offer comes in for Panik or Belt. They finally have a LF for next year (Slater), Beede and Crick will be ready, setting the key component to winning it all in place (pitching). Hitting comes in a close second, but pitching wins seasons (ask the Rockies about all hit, no pitch).
Haha thanks mate, we have some nice pieces there, I certainly think we need more from the OF but with Span and Pence having another year to go unless being traded, it’ll have to wait another year. Sabean I think will become a little more hands on in the 2nd half which is hopefully going to be a good thing
The Giants are in a tough situation, with 3 other teams in their division on the rise, They need to keep their core and make a lot of changes to win in the next few years. Both Cueto and Samardjaza could be moved with bad contract to bad contract. I could see the Yanks trading either Headley and Gardner for one of them or Ellsbury for Cueto. The Yanks could throw in a prospect as a kicker. Both have similar contracts and similar WARs . Ellsbury and Cueto have the same WAR this year with time missed due to injury. The Giants need quality postion players and the Yanks need a starting pitcher. The money is similar.
The Giants wouldn’t trade Cueto for Ellsbury because he has a chance to opt out. Ellsbury can’t and they’d be stick with him
Sorry, that’s insane. First off, nobody wants Ellsbury, and Cueto still has major upside.. Also, the Giants would want prospects, not tired, overpaid veterans in trades.
What happens when Posey needs to go to First, he has to turn into a pumpkin eventually
Apparently Giants fans and their owner like pumpkins.
I remember when Chase Utley turned into a pumpkin. His “Kashmir” walk up music worked like a bad comedy sketch.
Last I checked, Chase Utley never played for the Giants
Posey just turned 30, he can definitely still catch for a while longer.
by that time Aramis Garcia should be ready
Escobar, CJ Cron, Carlos Perez, Nolan Fontana, Tyler Skaggs Ben Revere and a couple of minor league relievers for Cueto, Belt and Panic. What do say Giants?
8 players with minimal value for three guys who are good? I doubt that.
I think they hang up and block the Angels
Ben Revere is rated 5th worst player in the MLB! http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2721096-mlb-metrics-101-mlbs-worst-players-of-the-1st-half?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_campaign=mlb
Gorky Hernandez is rated the 8th worst.
Cold comfort to know there are actually OFs worse than Gorkys.
What we see now is the result of the incessant trading away of young talent for veteran players in an effort to gain “one more year” of being competitive for the division title. Evans learned it from Sabean but neither learned that you can only go to the well so many times before the well is dry, Neither seems to be aware of the axiom ” ya gotta know when to hold ’em and know when to fold ’em. Instead of a continual influx of young talent to the 25 man roster, both Sabean and Evans have continued to trot out the same faces year after year and then trade away the foundation of youth for yet more veterans offering only short term viability. Then with the system barren, it is necessary to turn to spending big on free agents which , in turn, puts them in a tough financial situation in being up against/over the “tax” limit. Time to clean house – top to bottom.& start over.
Get what you can for Span, Pence and Nunez. Someone will want Cueto and Shark. Gut the bullpen except Dyson, who’s done well and Melancon who no one wants. And trade Panik, as Arroyo will step right in. He could bring back the most, hate to lose him but he would make the most sense to move.
None of those pieces will net much in the way of solid young talent youth is now a desired luxury around both leagues look even the Yankees are retooling with youth.
No one wants Shark. The other 29 teams had the option to pay him all that money a year and a half ago, they said “No thanks” and since then he hasn’t done anything to make those other teams look bad.
Problem with the Giants is they do not outside of those three have the trade pieces that team will desire. The salaries are also a factor of the remainder so the ole saying no gain without pain applies. If your farm system is weak then you have no alternative but free agency and the league is currently undergoing a changing of the Guard more young talent are being promoted and doing well and more on the way the Giants I see are in a similar fix as the Blue Jays and Tigers are that is aging and production numbers going down.
The Giants are at a cross-road but not in such a bad condition if the cards they hold are played right outside of Brent Strom the stros pitching coach one of the better teams at developing young pitchers and getting the most out of them are the Giants. Now as a stros fan I see on a daily basis the condition of the Astros both at the ML level and minors and the Astros are incredibly strong. Look Martes, Paulino (know that he is suspended for 80 games) and a Musgrove whom by the way has a unique problem has too much control with strikes needing to learn how to throw them (but rumored he could turn into another Keuchel in the near future) Derek Fisher was up and played a week straight in Left Field and had a what .289 BA started with an HR and ended with one. The point is outside of a Bumgarner doubt the astros would part with them in any trade with the giants get the point you have to give a little to get a little. also note Colin Moran, Perez and others they have a talented young core of depth currently bottle-necked.