March 15: Fulmer further discussed the shut down with McCosky, stating that he’s not sure how long it’ll take to build back up. As McCosky explains in greater detail, the right-hander had been wearing a brace on his surgically repaired knee that has since been swapped out for a compression sleeve.
“Maybe it was a little restrictive,” said Fulmer in reference to the brace. “Today was a step in the right direction as far as using my lower body and trying to drive toward home plate, as opposed to basically not using my lower body at all.”
Fulmer’s fastball velocity this spring had been hovering in the 90 to 92 mph range, per McCosky, which is a far cry from the 95.5 mph he’s averaged throughout his career. At present, there’s no defined timetable for Fulmer to be up to full strength, but it seems likely he’ll open the season on the injured list.
March 14: The Tigers have shut down righty Michael Fulmer, Chris McCosky of the Detroit News reports (Twitter links). Manager Ron Gardenhire says that Fulmer “took a step back to refine his lower body mechanics.”
Typically, pitchers only hit the shelf in mid-March if they are dealing with an arm problem or other injury. That doesn’t seem to be the case here, though it could be that the team sees some risk in allowing Fulmer to keep throwing. He underwent knee surgery last fall and has shown reduced velocity thus far this spring.
Fulmer, who’s slated to earn $2.8MM after losing an arbitration hearing, is a key asset for the rebuilding Detroit organization. While the team’s outlook for the coming season is poor regardless, the hope had been that Fulmer would get back on track after a rough 2018 season.
There’s still time for Fulmer to re-discover his established ceiling. He turns 26 tomorrow and has three more arb-eligible seasons beyond 2019. First, he’ll need to work through the issues that the club has identified.
As things stand, says Gardenhire, there’s “no timetable on when [Fulmer is] going to get back on the mound.” That leaves the door open for Daniel Norris or another hurler to earn a shot. Matt Hall, Ryan Carpenter, and Spencer Turnbull are among the other potential candidates with some MLB experience and 40-man spots.
Wow remember all the armchair Yankee GM’s that were clamoring to trade for this stud.
Yankees liked him; had an interest in him and JA Happ
Either way you slice it; asset mismanagement by Avila, unless he returns back to ace-form, teams were lucky (Cashman included) they didn’t break the bank for him.
No one was gonna pay that ridiculous asking price for someone with such limited success.
Disagree. He had significant value following his ROY season and into the first half of 2017. He was a high ceiling starter with 5 years of control left. It would have been a competitive bidding process that would have net the tigers a nice return. Only in hindsight can one say the return would be low.
Just goes to show you that the two factors of 1. High Ceiling and 2. Control and in his case 5 years of it, are factors that should be less than top considerations when considering a trade for such a pitcher. Too many metrics these days and too much emphasis on CONTROL when top teams are printing money.
Nothing replaces success that can be seen with your eyes and not measured in some type of statistics created to make a pig look like a panther!
Great point. I’m sure lots of Sabre-nerds scoffed at the Stros trading for an old fart like Verlander or Cubs getting Hamels but which was the better strategy? Control or Proven?
The Tigers trading Fulmer would have been like the Yankees trading Judge, or Severino, after their first cup of coffee. You build with the young players. You don’t trade them. White Sox moved Sale and Eaton and Quintana and Sieman while all were young and cheap. That hasn’t worked out so well for them.
The white Sox havent had 75% of the players they traded for hit the big leagues yet.
A while back they Rays asked for Severino and Judge for Price.
Hung up the phone.
That’s not a good analogy. The white Sox got a ton of young talent who should hit the bigs in a couple years. As a Tigers fan, it’s scary how much talent they have. A bit premature to judge their trades while the players are still in the minors
Not really, there’s about 8-10 teams with scarier minor league and prospect talent and about 15 teams with much scarier major league talent so where does that leave DET?
Where’s this young talent? They’ve been saying it for years. If they were any good they would be up by now. Don’t give me crap about them “taking time developing” blah blah blah. White Sox traded away top talent for what 12 year olds? As a Tigers fan, I’m only scared of the White Sox because our farm system is so bad. I’ll believe the White Sox hype when I see it.
Quintana deal, they were aware the Chisox going nowhere fast back when the deal was made and it was made with the future in mind. Scratch that one and this season should see a cpl from that deal.
The Sale deal has given them a regular in Moncada and hopefully, future front line pitcher in Kopech when he returns from TJ. The Eaton deal has given them a former decent prospect in Gioloto that has some issues to fix and a back end starter in Lopez so far.
Can’t look at every deal bringing back 3-5 players as if they are all future MLB material, some will be longshot, or filler types. Hahn has done ok with the returns.
“Where’s this young talent? They’ve been saying it for years. If they were any good they would be up by now. ”
Lol you don’t follow the sox at all I’m guessing. Kopech looked like an ace last year but had TJ. Still has a bright future. You may have heard of Eloy. He is one of the biggest prospects right now and will be in the majors this year. I’d tell you about Cease but I doubt your knowledge of prospects goes deeper than Vlad or possibly Eloy.
The only real “miss” the sox have had so far is with Yoan and he’s only 22 years old.
(before you think I’m a homer defending my team, I’m a cubs fan)
No, its not too early to imagine how a team with Sale, Quintana, Eaton and Seiman might be doing in this weak division, right now. Sure, there is still time for something to come of their prospects. They won’t make a difference now, however. They should be ready just as Detroit, Minnesota, and even KC are ready to compete.
I agree the timelines for the ALC team rebuilds will likely align. Should be interesting in a couple years. The Tigers don’t have as many high ceiling prospects as the Sox or Twins. Tigers need a solid draft and international signing period because the cupboards are bare when it comes to trades. Castellanos and Fulmer are not going to net the return AA hoped for. The 2019 draft will be crucial for Detroit. No more Rey Riveras or Derek Hills
Draft good is not as important as development after draft. Cardinal, Oakland, Tampa, Indians, and Astro all have system that consistently get production out of promise. ChiSox and Tigers? Nope. Sure, Sale came from ChiSox system but he could be generational talent, almost impossible to screw up. Sure, Tigers develop JV but same as Sale. High drafts? Great prospect yield in trade? No matter near the Great Lakes, where we need crafty trades for major league ready guys who were developed by someone else.
The Yankees almost traded sevy and judge for andrelton Simmons a few years back when he was a member of the braves. I actually saw the article on trade rumors a while back
“Tigers trading Fulmer would have been like Yankees trading Judge”? Those are 2 completely different teams with completely opposite current trajectories. Yankees won’t trade Judge because they’re one of the best teams in the league, have plenty of prospect depth, and he’s the best player on the team. Tigers are one of the worst teams in the league, have zero prospect depth and now Fulmer’s on the shelf. Bad move by leadership not pulling the plug on him earlier when they WERE selling off pieces. And your argument that the White Sox prospects they’ve gotten in return haven’t panned out? Most of them haven’t even reached the Bigs yet, so you can’t really make that argument yet.
When Judge had his first cup of coffee, they were rebuilding.. Could have traded him for multiple prospects but didnt. Never heard the Yankee fans calling for them to do that is what my point was. Yet they want every other team to trade their young players.
You can’t tell the outcome from what the Sox gave up yet. They are just arriving in MLB.
Tigers now have a Top 10 Farm System, per MLB Pipeline.
Shopping Fulmner might have been an indication of just how long the Tigers think their rebuild will take…I.e. 5 years, not 2.
It’s not asset mismanagement. Michael Fulmer is still part of the Tigers future. Fulmer has a high asking price because he is not for sale. Certainly, 2019 is not that target future so shutting him down, even for the entire season makes sense.
I think most people realized there was major concerns with Fulmer in his sophomore season. His mechanics did not look good for his shoulder. He then paired up those injury concerns with poor numbers.
I dont know what armchair GMs you know of that wanted Fulmer (with the idea that he is a stud) past mid 2017 season.
A stud…. only people who think he’s a stud wear tigers gear
Stupid comment
The Tigers let Porcello and Price walk and traded Verlander because of this guy.
No, they let traded both, because they were rebuilding.
That is not accurate. They let those guys go, because now the three of them are making about 50 mil annually between the three of them.
Don’t listen to any of those a holes in the live chat jeff. They ruin it for the 99% that really enjoy them.
“Shut down” seems to be a hip phrase writers, fans, and tv people like to use a lot lately
Like as in, “the government is shut down”?
No, the government is up and running.
Well-oiled machine. 😉
I knew I must have disliked you so much for a reason
Then stop replying to me, and wish mlbtr enforced the dam comment policy.
You don’t know anything, impossible to tell.
Thanks! one less person, who hates my guts.
Why not just eliminate their ammo…
Cuz no matter what I say, folks get personal, and it’s condoned. But Thank you, Chinwood.
Only “ammo” they get is when you’re allowed to harass others, in the form of mlbtr seldom removing target harassment. (BasedBallGuru)
Really? I spend far too much time enforcing the policy surrounding your comments as it is.
It annoys me greatly to read this. You know that you bait people. We have bent over backwards and wasted tons of time deleting comments and banning commenters that don’t like you. I don’t condone their approach but they aren’t just picking targets at random, either.
You say the stupidest things, often intentionally stupid, then when people respond or tell you that you are stupid, you act wounded and cry “Ban this commenter!”
I find it very hard to believe you’d find another website who would even have given you this much attention. The downvote is gone but you’re still whining about something. I can’t fathom why you can’t let things go. I really cannot. You take the bait 10/10 times and that’s one of the biggest reasons you’re a target. It’s not fun to pick on someone who ignores you. Instead you scream ban this guy or complain about that. As long as you do that people will keep coming back at you. I guarantee that.
Jeff&Todd just went sicko mode oh my
(before anyone says “jEff ToDd is OnE pErSon itS noT jEff & ToDd!!”.. i know, its a reference to this one time someone referred to jeff todd as jeff & todd)
So now that you have made a reply to Xabial that he may not like – who bans you? Is it a seniority thing or is there an org chart with who reports to who? Is self banning possible?
Xabial has some good material. He knows his stuff. He also baits well and is a troll.
He’s a sophisticated troll.
We call them scrolls.
Just because Jeff Todd said something doesn’t mean it’s open season on an individual. Baseball, folks.
So how about that Michael Fulmer? I had him in mind for a fantasy sleeper. Pass on that…
+Ketch
Its been open season on the guy for i dont know how long now. This didnt just come about because of Jeff’s comment. This is more par of the course whenever xabial posts
I have Sonny Gray on my bench for SP depth in my league. I think he might be a sleeper. Reunited with his old pitching coach and he is out of the NY spotlight (two main possibilities for why he sucked with NYY). I also have Teheran on my bench too. Other sleepers include Madison Bumgarner (i was able to draft him in the 13th round in a 10 team league), Jon Lester (may not be a sleeper, since he is consistently good, but i was able to pick him up in the 18th round as my #5 starter. Maybe you can get that lucky), and Yusei Kikuchi (he went in the 17th round in my draft. I dont know how his spring is going but I know he made Votto look foolish)
if you ban xabial, which is all WE ask, then i wont comment again. thats my commitment to mlbtr.
So do the right thing and BAN him, he starts crap here all the time…The passive aggressive act gets old
A poll would work, thumbs up or thumbs down for Xabial…
Xabial getting served by the author! As Ken Singleton would say, “look out!” I think sometimes Xabial has good points, but he (or she) also like to bait folks.
Fulmer’s on my bench for cheap, so I’m going to ride this out and hope he can turn it around in the next 2 years. I have concerns about the combination of mechanics and prior injury, but the Tigers are in a full rebuild, so it isn’t like they need to rush him.
I’m glad the Braves didn’t end up pulling the trigger on him and giving a lot up to do it last year.
Not to say he isn’t capable of coming back and being his old self by the end of the year or anything, but there’s clearly some red flags with him now that weren’t around this time last year.
Not really. The Tigers are just being cautious and letting him get back to full strength. They tried having him pitch with a knee brace. It wasn’t working and probably introducing unwanted changes to his mechanics. They aren’t playing for anything so no reason to push. If he’s not pitching by June, that would be a problem.
Really. Saying Tiger games dont matter therefore him not throwing and losing major velocity when he tries, is okay, is flat out incorrect. Everyone involved needs him to play and play well and he cannot do that, even as the season begins. Sorry to burst any bubbles.
I’m saying he’s hurt and they are taking an abundance of caution to make sure he’s 100% before he plays. He had knee surgery & hasn’t recovered his leg strength yet which is why his velocity is down. Try to understand the difference between hurt & bad. Hurt gets better bad doesn’t.
norris is as healthy as ever. his opportunity to prove himself is now.
Norris didn’t look very good against the Yanks this spring. But still early.
I guess I was wrong on this one. I wanted the braves to get him but he’s looking more like a flop.
Maybe he needs to stop shaving and he’ll regain his strength
Turns out Cespedes for Fulmer was a fair trade….lame horse for lame horse. Each teased early but neither are likely to be heard from again
lol…I have Ces on my bench too, also for cheap. I figure Fulmer can at least be a back-end guy and has a coin flip chance of being useful. Ces…well…I have him for 2 years, but not much higher than league minimum, so I’m playing with house money between the two guys.
He’s 25 years old and it’s not like his arm is broken. You folks wanna just take him behind the woodshed and shoot him.
No one is saying he doesnt have talent. His mechanics were very violent though. His velocity was coming from him whipping his shoulder around (which probably caused his shoulder injuries). The way he found success was not sustainable. The fact that the Tigers are shutting him down specifically to try to fix his mechanics proves this. There is a lot of doubt, and reasonably so, that he can find the same level of success he did in his rookie campaign. Its not impossible to reinvent yourself and become dominant again, but it is very difficult. He should have ample opportunities to prove himself with the Tigers. Its not like he is blocking anyone or ruining their shot to be in the playoffs. For these reasons doubt anyone is wanting him to simply give up on him. Give up on the idea of trading top prospects for him, maybe.
The mechanics problem is because of the knee brace. They will work it out. When he was pitching well, there was never any comments about poor mechanics.
reddit.com/r/motorcitykitties/comments/6zkfth/an_i…
Here is a reddit link to a discussion of a video about Fulmers injury/mechanics in 2017. There have been concerns of poor mechanics for a while now.
There have been problems with his release mechanics his entire career. It has always been a well known issue.
No surprise. The Tigers have been talking about getting his mechanics right and repeatable all spring. That is first and foremost. If it is not there, it is wise that they do shut him down. And all that really means is he won’t pitch in games until they see progress with his daily throwing regimen. He was also slated to start a lot more work on his lower body so that may also be a factor.
I still wonder if the brace is hurting more than helping. Not natural thing to wear a knee brace and pitch.
Would be a great time for Brodie Van Woebegone to jump in on Fullm.er.
The Mets are all about the Scratch & Dent section, but I doubt DET will cut their losses right now. I’m guessing they’ll give him most/all of this year to get sorted and then re-evaluate.
I’d love if Brodie could steal Fulmer and have him work with Eiland and/or a guy like Frank Viola, who should still be kicking around the org. Al Leiter and Jon Franco are still with the org too, though I’m not sure how they are with fixing pitchers.
I really hate 90% of users here. Most comments are partially accurate, yet everyone trashes every comment completely. The odd thing is I really like the comments for reading purposes…
You are part of my 10%, jleve618. Congrats, on Harper. hope he retires in the HOF, in a Phillies’ uniform.
Much as ppl want it to be bad contract, few 26 yr old FA.
Agree, Jleve. I’ve only been on here a short time, but am a long-time viewer. Why can’t people just appreciate opposing opinions without being insulting? BYB has a lot of informed posters without the vitriol.
As a Tigers fan, I am happy to read what other Tiger fans think.
Now, I expect someone to take a shot at me for this post.
I agree. BYB is a great site for Tiger fans with a very cordial discussion board. They are just not as timely as providing information as MLBTR is.
Shutting down Fulmer gives Norris and Trumbull a shot at the rotation. I think Gardy is high on Trumbull. He looks good this spring
Who is Trumbull?
Autocorrect. It’s Spencer Turnbull
I like Spencer Turnbull, Jose Fernandez and Ryan Carpenter too. I fear that Tyson Ross is in the same category as Mike Pelfrey and Mark Lowe. What did the Tiger scouts see in him?
Thank god we traded for happ instead of fulmer. For a young pitcher so be losing this much velocity so soon in his career is alarming. Hopefully he bounces back !
And you can bet Rothschild wouldn’t have been able to get him straight.
As a Tiger Fan….Both Fulmer and Norris are busts…time too give up on these two….injuries and excuses…..Fullmer had 3 good months of pitching 3 years ago…Norris cant stay healthy…..I can only hope for Fulmer to give the tigers 2 good month this year so we can trade him somewhere……..
Fulmer may be lost to the Tigers for longer than just a few weeks into April. This is going to be a difficult puzzle to solve. It’s obvious that he needs to put a lot of torque on his drive leg in order to get the velocity he needs to be successful. It is also obvious that even though he’s throwing 90-92, he’s getting the velocity out of his arm, not his lower body. So, he was risking the health of his arm by continuing to throw the way he has. Now, with the brace off, they still must find a way for Fulmer to generate power without messing up that knee once again. This is going to be one long rehab assignment.
Let him get that knee right. It may take 4 months. Remember that Mark Fidrych ruined his arm when he tried to pitch on a hurt knee.