The Indians’ season ended Wednesday with a loss to the Yankees in the first round of the playoffs, and that may have been the last time superstar shortstop Francisco Lindor ever suits up for the team. Even though he’s still under control for one more season – his final year of arbitration eligibility – Lindor could prove to be too expensive for the low-budget Indians to keep for the long haul, so he figures to pop up in plenty of offseason trade rumors. Lindor, already a four-time All-Star who’s soon to turn 27, spoke about his future with Zack Meisel of The Athletic and other reporters after the Indians’ elimination.
While Lindor called the Indians “a class-act organization” and made clear he loves the franchise, the city and its fan base, that doesn’t mean the club will be able to retain him. Lindor could price himself out of Cleveland’s range if he’s still a member of the team a year from now, though when asked if the Indians would be able to afford him, he said: “Of course. It’s a billion-dollar team. Of course. Of course. Of course. Yeah. That’s all I can say.”
Lindor’s right that cash isn’t in short supply for the Indians or any other team; however, in the wake of a coronavirus-shortened season, the Indians may be less willing than ever about giving up huge money for a single player. Lindor could command a long-term deal upward of $300MM in guarantees, so it’s difficult to envision the Indians keeping him for years to come. It may even be hard to imagine that Lindor will stick around next season, considering the tantalizing trade offers that could come in for him.
The 2020 campaign was not enormously successful for Lindor, who put up his worst-ever batting line (.258/.335/.415 with eight home runs and six steals) across 266 trips to the plate. It was a relatively small sample of work, though, and there’s no debating that Lindor has been a premier player – not just an elite shortstop – since he debuted in 2015. The question now is whether the Indians will retain Lindor to begin 2021, in which he’ll receive a raise over his $17.5MM salary. As good as Lindor is, that could prove too rich for the Indians’ blood if they’re not confident they can extend him.
I think we saw Frankie’s last game as an Indians player yesterday. I have been a Tribe fan for 30 years. I’m okay with this. They won’t be able to replace him, that’s for sure, but if they can use the savings to actually field an OF that was above replacement level, I’d shudder less.
Cohen go get him
My sentiments exactly
Other than Conforto, Degrom and Alonso, I’ll trade anybody for Lindor
I’d offer up Conforto OR Alonso. Lindor is a one of kind player than can change the Mets franchise. Everyone is available for that except DeGrom
Did you see his Slash line this year?
Lol
Like Lindor, Conforto is a free agent after the 2021 season, and I’d have the think the Indians would want more controllable pieces in return. He also wouldn’t be super cheap in his own right, being in his last year of arbitration, though Cleveland would still stand to gain a fair savings on a deal. I’d think a Nimmo-based package would inspire more enthusiasm, but they’d likely need more young pieces. Either way, if I were the Mets, I wouldn’t let those two guys go anywhere.
Lindor’s or Alonso’s? Both were weak.
It’s interesting how we’ve all decided that the slash lines from 60 games equals a baseball year. I’m not a Tribe fan but I’d have to say if Lindor had 102 more games to play in a season that end of year slash line would be a lot closer to his career numbers
Commonsenseslapsyou
So you’re going to base it off a 60 game season? Ask Christian Yelich or boy Cody Bellinger what their slash lines were
Lindor is one of the best players in the game entering his prime
And you realize the slash line numbers are percentages and not cumulative numbers? Having 60 games is a fair enough sample, so regardless if it’s 162 games or not he had a down year based on his usual seasons.
Have to add McNeil & possibly Smith to that list.
You think you could get Lindor for any of the rest of that slop that’s on the Mets? The conversation would have to start with one of those players you mentioned. Afterall he’s better than anyone on the Mets.
If it’s slop the Indians are after, the Jays could put together a hearty platter of it!
He’s had a bad year by his standards and worse playoff, he seems to have checked out. There’s no way they can afford him and put a competitive lineup around him, so I hope they do trade him for a haul that can plug numerous holes.
60 games
The Indians can expect a maximum of what the Dodgers got for Betts in return for Lindor. Possibly less.
For sure less.
Only due to so many moving pieces in that betts trade. If clev can’t fill several holes ina trade- might as well keep him and try to compete. They’ll get a good pick regardless
The Red Sox would have received a TON more for Betts if they didn’t insist that LA take that seriously over-PRICEd pitcher …..
Well, like Yankees late owner George Steinbrenner used to say “you have to pay good platers. I know we always want to”… Oh what a time that was, Georgie was not afraid to pull the check book. I’m sure Lindor that was the Indians…
*players…
If angels get dombrowski don’t be surprised to see angels make a trade for him. With simmons out the door and lindor only being 27 this seems like an arte Moreno move.
Indians get: jo adell, jermiah jackson/kyrin Paris, hector yan
Angels get: Francisco lindor
Angels lineup
Lindor
Trout
Rendon
Ohtani
Upton
Walsh
Pujols
Ward
Stassi
Angels could trade for Lindof and sign Realmuto and they still wouldn’t make the playoffs because they can’t pitch.
This all day long…..
Technically …. they can pitch. Just not very well.
Get off my lawn!! Nice call though.
@briffle nice mullet. Never did I state this was a good move or a move I would make but if they get dombrowski this is a move he would make. Angels pitching still isn’t that bad it’s the bullpen more so. Add in a Bauer’s and call up of detmers and angels rotation looks the same as if not better than Atlanta.
Just Add in a Bauer real quick huh
Dombrowski would sign a few FA starters and make trades for more.
In Detroit, Dombrowski traded for a young Scherzer, a young Anibal Sanchez, a young Doug Fister. a young Robbie Ray a fairly young David Price…Dombrowski’s track record for building rotations is very solid.
hold up.. no Fletcher? plus I think we gave to much, adell is fine with me. not jackson and Paris tho
Jackson or Paris hence the slash
Four players for a combined 120 mil. Wow
Wouldn’t make that trade. Angels need pitching mow than Linder.
Something that stands out still is that Pujols contract … it’s been considered a rough contract for a while, but the guy is making serious bank and needs to go in this roster. I feel like it would be simple enough to find someone cheap that can provide more value in his slot in the lineup than him, especially at that cost. I really like the angels, and love trout. Want to see his team succeed as he deserves it. But can’t win when the team keeps handicapping themselves like this.
And the Angels would still stink and be irrelevant…
Don’t let the door hit you in the ass on your way out the door, Frankie.
Good riddance, Mr Overrated.
Wow, sour grapes? He’s a generational talent and deserves to be paid as such. I’ve been a Cleveland fan all my life, but I know Dolan isn’t going to open his wallet for Frankie (or really anybody else). I wish he would, but it’s absurd to be mad at a guy for not putting up with less than he deserves. If you’re going to be mad, direct it at the billionaire miser.
I don’t find him overrated at all. He’s had a down year in this freak year, but when healthy he’s dynamic. Power, speed, glove, personality, and plays like he really enjoys the game. I’m not salty that he didn’t take a humongous hometown discount to stay around and wish him well. Even if they break the bank to sign him you can’t afford to put anybody around him and you’ll be paying his salary to play for the team you eventually trade him to (see Stanton in Miami or ARod in Texas).
@suffer nice choke against yankees yesterday but go ahead and blame lindor!
After watching the AL Central go 0-3 in the postseason along with not winning a postseason series since 2016 and overall being one of the weakest divisions in baseball consistently, you might be correct in Lindor being overrated.
But then Ramirez would be overrated and the pitching staff is overrated if Lindor is as overrated as you say. In fact, every team in the AL Central, evidently, is overrated by playing in an inferior division.
To be fair, a lot of that is on the Twins. And the Twins are far better than their weird anomaly playoff losing streak has shown.
Twins are what they are; big fish, small pond.
History says otherwise. During that weird extended losing streak to the Yankees from 04-19 the Yankees lost to the Indians and Tigers repeatedly including in 06 when the twins were much better than the tigers… but just choked again. Their playoff ineptitude is some weird statistical anomaly, not a real indication of how bad they were
Count the number of titles won by the AL Central versus the AL East since 1995. And the number of times which division represented the AL in the World Series.
Yankees were knocked out of the playoffs by the Tigers multiple times(Verlander) and by the Astros (Verlander)
Count the payroll with cities like NY and Boston and compare them to Cleveland and Minnesota…
Try to see the Forrest not just a tree. A sample of 60 games is just what most mlb players need, just to get in shape, and get the proper batting timing. Maybe they just opt out in their mind, but didn’t say it out loud…
J.D. Martinez
Cody Bellinger
Christian Yelich
Javy Baez
Mike Trout
Marcus Semien
Kris Bryant
Anthony Rizzo
Etc.
Check Mr. OVERRATED:
Watch “Francisco Lindor | 2019 Highlights
https://youtu.be/-Oi5bpIPgT0
https://youtu.be/vBUAWrnrR7U
Bryce Harper was and is overrated. Obviously over paid.
Doubt they trade him til deadline to see where they stand and how he’s performing.
Disagree. A year of Lindor carries much more value than a playoff rental … Only issue is trying find a clear buyer as most of the playoff teams either have good-to-great shortstops already in place … Perhaps the Dodgers move Seager to third or something … Maybe Atlanta decides a year of Lindor is worth more than two of Swanson … It’ll be interesting to see how his market develops.
Personally, I’d rather pay a steeper price to poach Boagerts from Boston if they embrace the rebuild even more.
I could see the Tigers going after him. They have the slot, they have the need, they have drive, and they have $$$$$.
Judge, Sanchez and Torres for Lindor. Yankees desperately need a legitimate lead off hitter with speed. Lindor the missing piece.
I hope you’re joking because that trade proposal is horrendous. Judge alone is a far better player than Lindor and Torres has higher long term offensive upside than Lindor plus he’s controlled cheaply for 4 more years
@ronk
Unfortunately, I don’t think he is.
He seems to perseverate on “speedy lead off hitters” & the Yankees “lack” of LH batters.
The dude thinks trading Judge for Hosmer (!!) is a good idea lol.
Man.
The absolute insanity.
Uh?
No and no. I don’t think Judge is a better player if for no other reason (and to me there are) because he cannot stay on the field; but no that trade is still not worth it imho. Too much young talent to let go for one year of Lindor. Too much impact for one player.
No…please no. The Tigers will be much better off giving Willi Castro the job. The guy they got from Cleveland because Lindor blocked his path to the majors. I would not give Lindor $200-300 million dollars. No….no….no.
The Tigers should throw gobs of money at…….TREVOR BAUER. That guy will be good for a long time. His attitude and training are as good as you can get. Going back to college he has had a plan. Bauer would become the anchor of the Tiger rotation and be the “new Verlander” or “Scherzer”. 6 years, $200 million. Next year they will be in the middle of the pack. By ’22 they can compete for the playoffs. By ’23 to ’26 the Tigers will be the “new Astros”.
SIGN TREVOR BAUER!!!!!!!
Except Bauer has always maintained he will play his entire career on one year deals.
I’d make him an offer he cannot refuse.
He’s already financially set for life. Now it’s time to establish a legacy. Earn some rings.
Tigers need to hire A.J. Hinch to replace Gardy. Sign Bauer for 5-6 years. Develop some bats (Greene and Torkelson). In 2 years they could be a contendah!
And there we have it, GM warnbeeb of the local fantasy baseball league will do what no GM in the real world has or will accomplish…
Detroit Free Press made argument for Hinch as well.
History will show, that whatever the FREEP thinks, doesn’t happen.
Tigers have a loaded top 5 farm system and will be picking #3 in the MLB draft this year. Not seeing the Tigers spending young p[ayers and 300M on a SS when they have Willie Castro and many other young studs backed up in the minors to play SS.
If anything, I could see DD trading for one of the Tigers young SS prospects…Maybe Odel or Brandon Marsh going back to the Tigers etc…
Or the Angels trying to do a package deal for LHSP Boyd and a young SS.
The Tigers won’t need a shortstop for years after they stole Willi Castro from the Indians. The Indians didn’t want to part with some of their other garbage so they let go a fine talent that’s going to come back to haunt for years to come. Castro for Leonis Martin. A complete robbery.
Trading Lindor is the smart move for the Indians. He’s a low OBP guy and his power won’t translate as he ages. Whoever gives him a long term deal will be regretting it within a couple years
A career .346 OBP is low? Unless you’re talking about Olive-Backed Pipits, you might need to recalibrate.
.346 isn’t that high, especially for a guy who’s supposed to be a superstar
Is it low or not that high?
It is a good obp. And that with his power, defense, and speed he is a superstar.
You cannot say his power will decline then just assume the other stat you called him out on will remain the same. Players can find ways to adjust when a facet of their game falters. Especially someone as young as him.
Well according to Fangraphs he would be in the slightly above average category but still nowhere near “superstar” level. Also in his best season he had an OPS of .871 and OPS+ of 132, not exactly “superstar” production either. Lindor is good no doubt but far from a superstar and the Indians would be fools to sign him to a big long term contract
As a long time Indians fan, I can’t wait until they get rid of this guy. Just tired of his “I’ll play when I feel like it” attitude. Personally, I feel he’s the most overrated “superstar” in baseball. If he’s a superstar, what does that make Jose Ramirez? Jose is the real superstar. He plays hard 100 percent of the time and doesn’t choke when he sees a runner on base. Good bye Mr. Overrated.
He will be joining the Evil Empire!!!
I heard a rumor that he was gonna come to the Braves on a team friendly contract. Two problems with that, he’d never do it and my statement was a lie… so do with that whatcha want…
Royce Lewis, larnach, Duran, polanco, Rosario
For
Lindor and Bieber
Dream on.
Who exactly needs to dream on in that situation? The team providing salary relief for a rental but also getting a higher end starter or the team getting 3 top 100 prospects including a top 5, and more controllable/affordable guys that can contribute
I like the proposal and it makes sense using a strictly baseball lens. But, from a business standpoint you have Bieber and Lindor being traded like that would really upset fans. Also two top flight pitchers traded in one year would be a tough pill to swallow.
It’s one of those trades you instantly think it’s insane but if you stop and think it through then you get it. Most fans won’t stop and think it through.
Lewis is a consensus top 30 prospect with his highest ranking from pipeline at 5 before 2019. Others didn’t rank him so aggressively such as Baseball America and Prospectus but he is still obviously quite valuable. Similarly, Larnach is a consensus top 100 player and Jhoan Duran is too 100 with pipeline only.
Beyond the prospects including Rosario isn’t useless since he does check off the outfielder box but when I look at his stats, he is maybe just a tic above league average.
Polanco blurs the line between league average even more than Rosario does though he also has more control. You could argue for upside here though
The money really isn’t that significant between all the players involved so that doesn’t strike me as a significant contribution in this. I think the hang up point in this is Bieber. He has a LOOOOOOT of value right now because he has so much control and just pitched himself into the Cy Young title..probably.
Lewis, Rosario and Larnarch might get Lindor but then I wouldn’t be surprised if that didn’t move the Indians. There may also be others competing against your package pushing the price tag up.
I think if it were on the table and money WERE an issue, the twins wouldn’t blink at tossing some money to complete the deal. You’re right about Bieber though. Indians will try to get as much out of this small sample size season as they can. What he did this year isn’t sustainable but the Indians rightfully would absolutely use it in negotiations
If you use the site “Baseball Trade Values” player ratings the trade would not be balanced. The site gives a player a number based on talent, years of control, , salary, etc.
Bieber – 188.1 & Lindor 30.8 for a Cleveland total of 218.9
Duran 17.9 Larnach 30 Lewis 54, Polanco 51.9 and Rosario 0 for a Twins total of 153.8
I do not see the Indians trading Bieber, especially to a division rival.
Interesting. Out of curiosity, how close does the average “blockbuster” trade come to being “equal” on that site. The Betts trade, for example… since that’s another one that was a payroll shed in a final year
Ah yes, interesting site. As you can see, HockeyJohn there didn’t exactly give that site a RINGING endorsement. Those of us that value sabremetrics are probably mostly not sold on it. It’s somewhat knew to a lot of us. I’ve been meaning to look into it more but if you take the sites word for it, Bieber right now is obnoxiously expensive but Lindor is very well within your teams grasp.
If you would like to poke around with the site I’ll give you the URL.
https://www.baseballtradevalues.com/
I use the site as a point of reference not as gospel or fact. As far as for recent Cleveland trades – The Bauer trade did not match their system as Cleveland received significantly more value back than Bauer was rated. The Kluber trade showed in Cleveland;s favor as they rated Delino DeShields to have more value than the other players in the trade although Emmanuel Clase was the main piece for the Indians. The Clevinger trade was close with the Padres favored by about 4 points so it was close.
Yeah, Bieber’s value on the site is absolutely absurd. And no doubt that his trade value would be high right now, especially after the season he just put up… but to match their value you’d have to add Kepler and then still throw in a couple other prospects. This thread is the first I’ve heard of that site, so thanks for pointing it out to me. Like you guys said, if nothing else it’s a fun little tool to play with
Indians have a long history of being cheap. So yes, good chance he is traded this off season. But if there ever was a player to break the Indians mold it is Lindor. They should make every attempt to extend him and give him a fair offer.
They already have and his team passed, it’s a given he will be elsewhere soon.
Lindor will get traded to someone before the trade deadline next year. He’ll become a FA. The Brinks truck is already getting packed with cash awaiting word on where to drop it off.
Look for the Mets, Reds and Giants in the NL to make a big effort to sign him. In the AL, never count out what the Yankees might do. Could also see Lindor finding a home in Anaheim now that Simmons is most likely headed out of town.
I wonder as to which top ten media market he will sign.
Too much hair dye and not enough game!
Who cares about the hair dye and he’s got plenty of game.
Lindor would be best suited for the Mets. Thinking Catcher Francisco Alvarez, shortstop Ronny Mauricio, and either third baseman Brett Baty, or pitcher Matt Allan should be enough to get that done, as well as a 7 year extension with Frankie. Let me know @hockeyjohn
Yank4Life, I usually believe that I have a solid grasp on what the Indians might do, but with Covid-19 financial losses, I don’t know how they will react. As far as your Mets proposal, it would be possible if the Indians decide to step back a year or two due to money and take an all prospect package in a Lindor return. That is not how they have acted in the recent Bauer, Kluber, and Clevinger trades which brought controllable MLB ready help and prospects. I hope that Cleveland will continue to act in this way as I see them as still a contender with their controllable starting pitching.
Alonso, Rosario and Alvarez for lindor and Ramirez?
Why would Cleveland trade Ramirez? He is controlled three more years on a team friendly deal.
I didn’t realize. Baseball reference has him as a free agent after next year. Are they option years? He would be a good fit for the Mets
Yes, he has two option years and he is a great option for the team that he is on, the Cleveland Indians. I don’t see him on the trade market.
Not sure who they have at 1b/Dh but obviously they would have Alonso under control for longer.
Framil Reyes is their DH. If they do not pick Carlos Santana’s option (they likely won’t), they can move Josh Naylor to first base or they have Bobby Bradley and Jake Bauers in the minors. They can also move their top overall prospect Nolan Jones to 1B. Lindor will likely be traded, but I seriously doubt Ramirez goes anywhere unless they enter a total rebuild (not likely) and totally alienate their fan base.
Considering Jones is a 3b, it kinda makes sense trading Ramirez for Alonso. Considering Alonso has better yearly control, he at the very worst a wash with Ramirez. It wouldn’t be a rebuild
The Indians won’t be trading Ramirez. Not a chance. He’s signed for exactly what they hope to get in return for any trade they make, a cheap controllable contract. Their offense was putrid, Ramirez was one of their lone bright spots in that lineups, so why would they jettison him off?
well then if he is that happy stay . take less for happiness and stay . lets see if his words mean anything!
I find it notable how so many fans are so down on really exceptional players on their team.
How do you *not* like Lindor, man!?
Boggling.
He’s a complete player at a premium position.
Really don’t get why some Indian fans are ripping on him. I just don’t.
I guess that’s just how it goes. Scroll up and you’ll see a Yankee “fan” proposing Judge, Gleyber, & Gary Sanchez for Lindor.
Wow.
I guess the grass is always greener – uh? (until his first 0-5 game lol)
On Lindor to the Yankees, I’ll pass. Bring LeMahieu back. Add a legitimate backup shortstop (my current preference is Galvis) & focus on pitching. Yanks have at *least* one (but really two) openings in the rotation for next year.
Gotta do something in the pen, too. We’ve gone from the Bullpen of Doom to the Bullpen of Hold On To You Butt this year.
@Ducky what’s wrong with wanting Lindor on the Yankees. I love DJ but he’s better suited to bat second much like another famous DJ. Can you imagine him being in that lineup leading off. The Yankees were dominant when they had Damon or Knoblach leading off. Judge strikes out way too much to bat second.
Absolutely nothing with wanting him, @mlbnyyfan. At all.
He’s a fantastic player.
But why give up assets for him?
Uh?
Because he’s a “speedy lead off hitter”?
DJ is doing an *excellent* job leading off. I mean…MVP level of play from the top.
Speed just isn’t really that important in today’s game, man. (shrugs one shoulder)
Bro, I wouldn’t give up any *one* of Judge, Gleybae, or Sanchez for a single season of Lindor. I know a lot of Yankee fan would though! (“teh batting averages, Ducky”…”teh strike outs, Ducky”…”teh injuries, Ducky” – uh?)
That is – however – just simply not good asset management, bro. Quite the opposite. I guarantee you that Cashman feels the same.
Thank goodness.
😉
And, your fascination with speed in the lead off spot & adding left handed bats seems to lead you to some pretty…I dunno…let’s say; Bad Trade Suggestions. (I mean…bro… Judge for Hosmer, bro? Oh, dear.)
The Yankees need pitching.
*That* needs to be the off-season focus.
Best Options for Lindor trade based on farm systems: and areas of need:
Atlanta, New York Mets, NY Yankees,
LA Dodgers, Cincy Reds, Chicago Cubs, Blue Jays, Red Sox., Rays
Lindor would make up for Red Sox loss of Betts.
Dodgers have huge amounts of money coming off the books and the young players for a deal,
Mets have the players, need, money, new ownership and the need for a new face of the franchise
Yankees need a young, dynamic SS. Torres could move to 2B or 3B
Reds are one or two p[ayers away. Lindor makes them a lock for playoffs
Cubs Lindor opens a new window of contention and a new face of franchise
Blue Jays are loaded with young talent. Lindor makes them Elite like Rays
Rays have the deep farm system for a 1 year rental that may get them a WS Title
Braves: Lindor takes their offense to the next level.
Correa will be available as well at a lower number. How do Lindor/Correa compare moving forward?
Yes friends we’ve seen the last of the smiling mercenary and in some ways good riddance. Don’t get me wrong he’s one of the best,but I knew a long time ago when he had barely started to show the stardom to come that he had no intention of staying in Cleveland . He was offered 100 million dollars for 4 years and refused it. Now come on. Your barely 22 years old and you and have that kind of ego to turn that kind of money down. Wow he was really a factor in the playoffs against the yanks wasn’t he. I tell you what. Even though he’ll come back to haunt somehow I can’t wait till he’s gone. He played the later part of the shortened season like he didn’t want to be here anyway. Yes nothing but a smiling mercenary.
Lindor has never been the big time difference maker many think he is…..and he never will be. No need to throw away that much money for one guy.