Posted something like this in the chat, but got no response:
I find it disingenuous to minimize the decision of whether to stick with a pitcher, especially if his spot is due up next inning, or burn a reliever, or pinch-hit for him, when it’s not clear whether he’s fading or not, as just grist for the second-guessing fan mill.
This will never happen and I will absolutely get crushed for even mentioning it, but what if baseball became a seven inning game. Pretty much everyone on MLBTR will hate the idea, but it would speed up the game, place less reliance on BPs, get very interesting earlier in the game (say 3rd inn vs 5th inn) and, most importantly, draw in new/younger fans.
The 162 game season would remain, but MLB would need to find a way to replace two innings of ad revenue, beer sales etc. No easy task.
Again, it will never happen and most on this app will disapprove, but it may be a way to help attract a new wave of baseball fans that will keep MLBTR humming long after we are gone.
I also agree. I like Mark Polishuk’s idea. Normal 10th, GR on first in the 11th, GR on 2nd in the 12th. I have no problem with the 12-14 inning game, as long as it goes no longer. 18 or more innings is absurd.
Heck yeah, fever! I love long extra inning games. Every pitch/play is important and keeps you on the edge of your seat. It’s like getting a playoff game in the middle of the season.
My dislike for 18 inning games has nothing to do with my viewing preferences. I’m fully aware I can stop watching at any time, which I won’t because, I too like watching as much baseball as I can. For me it’s more about the negative impact it has on the teams.
There’s nothing worse than going into and important series against a division rival on the heals of a bunch of extra innings. 18 inning games puts tremendous stress on the bullpen, and the next days SP. An 18 inning game during a playoff push could cost a team a division title.
tad – I respect your opinion on long games, and my comments weren’t directed at you personally.
Yes in certain situations it could negatively impact a team’s playoff chances. However it would depend on many factors, including scheduled days off and the opponent and whether it happens in the first game of a series or the last game.
But here’s the thing, games of 18 or more innings are extremely rare.
During the last normal season (2019) there were only FOUR in all of MLB.
In fact, there were only EIGHT games of more than 15 innings in 2019.
In fact, only 59 of 208 extra inning games went longer than 11 innings.
And only 37 of 208 extra inning games went longer than 12 innings.
With 14-man pitching staffs these days, it shouldn’t be very taxing on any team. If a team chooses to burn a pitcher by using them as a 1-inning or 2-inning “Opener”, or using them for just one or two batters, that’s on them.
And here’s another angle to look at: The reason why games sometimes do go many extra innings is because of a lack of scoring, right? Well that’s what happens when you have just a 3-man bench and one of them is the backup catcher. Scoring doesn’t happen in extra innings because there’s so few, if any, bench players who are available for pinch hitting duties with or without RISP.
It’s yet another reason why 14-man pitching staffs are detrimental.
I took no exception to your post, sorry if I appeared to. You make good points. Again I have no problem watching an 18 inning game, And my main point was, if you’re going to have the ghost-runner rule, at least play a normal inning, and then bring the GR along more gradually.
As to the lack of scoring, this is going to sound counter-intuitive, but I think the DH is a factor of that. Not only does it encourage the 14 man pitching staff. but with the DH, pinch-hitting will be less employed. There won’t be guys getting 3, 4, 5 pinch-hit ABs a week. Asking a guy that’s been riding the bench, and hasn’t had an AB in a week is much less likely to be able to deliver when asked.
tad – I agree with you, if the GR must be used (and it seems like MLB is intent on having it) then Mark’s proposal of gradually utilizing (not in the 10th, 1B in the 11th, 2B in the 12th on) would be my preference. I strongly believe there should be no GR in the 10th.
It’s absolutely absurd that a great game thru 9 innings can end with the first batter in the bottom of the 10th hitting a ground ball to the right side of the infield and the second batter hitting a SF. A game-ending run scored without any hits, to me that’s boring and anti-climactic.
I also think it’s absurd that there will be different rules between regular season games and postseason games.
I don’t really see how the DH encourages a 14-man staff. With a DH you’re required to have 9 non-pitchers in the game at all times, without the DH you’re required to have only 8 non-pitchers in the game at all times.
FYI – in 2019 there was 208 extra inning games, 112 of which were in NL parks with NL rules.
I think the DH encourages 14 man pitching staffs, because it reduces the need for pinch-hitters. Without the DH, NL clubs had 2-3 guys on the bench that got several pinch-hitting ABs a week.. There’s less need, with the DH, to pinch hit as often.
In 2021, teams in the AL with the DH, had a combined 1,225 PH ABs. In the NL without it, teams had a combined 3,866 PH ABs. Teams in the AL used a pinch-hitter less than 1/3 of the time. With less need for pinch-hitters, teams can carry more pitchers.
I really don’t see 112 games, out of 208, 54%, as being beyond normal variation. I would need to see that same outcome over several seasons to believe there was a clear correlation.
Tad and Fever, my understanding is that teams are limited to 13 pitchers effective May 1 when the rosters are reduced to 26. I thought that was the case last year, as well. I may have “mis-remembered.” Can anyone confirm the number of pitchers allowed on the 26 man roster this year?
I actually think fewer games makes more sense. And MLB was not wrong in wanting more post season. Casual fans like playoffs. But that should have come with fewer regular season games.
How many teams are using the pitch communication system? It seems like hitters are being caught off guard and pitchers are using it to quick pitch guys and set the rhythm at a faster pace than hitters are comfortable with. It could become a competitive advantage for teams that are good at using it to keep hitters off balance
#Bobselltheteam
He sells, Pirates ship out of town. I 100% believe that. Be careful what you ask for.
Posted something like this in the chat, but got no response:
I find it disingenuous to minimize the decision of whether to stick with a pitcher, especially if his spot is due up next inning, or burn a reliever, or pinch-hit for him, when it’s not clear whether he’s fading or not, as just grist for the second-guessing fan mill.
This will never happen and I will absolutely get crushed for even mentioning it, but what if baseball became a seven inning game. Pretty much everyone on MLBTR will hate the idea, but it would speed up the game, place less reliance on BPs, get very interesting earlier in the game (say 3rd inn vs 5th inn) and, most importantly, draw in new/younger fans.
The 162 game season would remain, but MLB would need to find a way to replace two innings of ad revenue, beer sales etc. No easy task.
Again, it will never happen and most on this app will disapprove, but it may be a way to help attract a new wave of baseball fans that will keep MLBTR humming long after we are gone.
I like the ghoat runner rule. Games dragging on are so boring.
I’m not a fan of the ghost runner rule. They could have at least waited to implement it after the 11th inning.
I agree. Should be a couple normal extra innings before implementing the ghost runner rule. its a better compromise.
I also agree. I like Mark Polishuk’s idea. Normal 10th, GR on first in the 11th, GR on 2nd in the 12th. I have no problem with the 12-14 inning game, as long as it goes no longer. 18 or more innings is absurd.
Here’s the thing about 18-inning games:
1) Nobody forces you to watch all 18 innings
2) You’re not entitled to see one of the teams win
Consider them a reward for real baseball fans who appreciate extra innings.
Why should MLB cater more to the casual fan than the real fans who generate the majority of revenue?
Don’t we cater to the minority enough already in so many other aspects of life these days?
amen, fever!
Heck yeah, fever! I love long extra inning games. Every pitch/play is important and keeps you on the edge of your seat. It’s like getting a playoff game in the middle of the season.
Fever:
My dislike for 18 inning games has nothing to do with my viewing preferences. I’m fully aware I can stop watching at any time, which I won’t because, I too like watching as much baseball as I can. For me it’s more about the negative impact it has on the teams.
There’s nothing worse than going into and important series against a division rival on the heals of a bunch of extra innings. 18 inning games puts tremendous stress on the bullpen, and the next days SP. An 18 inning game during a playoff push could cost a team a division title.
tad – I respect your opinion on long games, and my comments weren’t directed at you personally.
Yes in certain situations it could negatively impact a team’s playoff chances. However it would depend on many factors, including scheduled days off and the opponent and whether it happens in the first game of a series or the last game.
But here’s the thing, games of 18 or more innings are extremely rare.
During the last normal season (2019) there were only FOUR in all of MLB.
In fact, there were only EIGHT games of more than 15 innings in 2019.
In fact, only 59 of 208 extra inning games went longer than 11 innings.
And only 37 of 208 extra inning games went longer than 12 innings.
With 14-man pitching staffs these days, it shouldn’t be very taxing on any team. If a team chooses to burn a pitcher by using them as a 1-inning or 2-inning “Opener”, or using them for just one or two batters, that’s on them.
And here’s another angle to look at: The reason why games sometimes do go many extra innings is because of a lack of scoring, right? Well that’s what happens when you have just a 3-man bench and one of them is the backup catcher. Scoring doesn’t happen in extra innings because there’s so few, if any, bench players who are available for pinch hitting duties with or without RISP.
It’s yet another reason why 14-man pitching staffs are detrimental.
Fever:
I took no exception to your post, sorry if I appeared to. You make good points. Again I have no problem watching an 18 inning game, And my main point was, if you’re going to have the ghost-runner rule, at least play a normal inning, and then bring the GR along more gradually.
As to the lack of scoring, this is going to sound counter-intuitive, but I think the DH is a factor of that. Not only does it encourage the 14 man pitching staff. but with the DH, pinch-hitting will be less employed. There won’t be guys getting 3, 4, 5 pinch-hit ABs a week. Asking a guy that’s been riding the bench, and hasn’t had an AB in a week is much less likely to be able to deliver when asked.
tad – I agree with you, if the GR must be used (and it seems like MLB is intent on having it) then Mark’s proposal of gradually utilizing (not in the 10th, 1B in the 11th, 2B in the 12th on) would be my preference. I strongly believe there should be no GR in the 10th.
It’s absolutely absurd that a great game thru 9 innings can end with the first batter in the bottom of the 10th hitting a ground ball to the right side of the infield and the second batter hitting a SF. A game-ending run scored without any hits, to me that’s boring and anti-climactic.
I also think it’s absurd that there will be different rules between regular season games and postseason games.
I don’t really see how the DH encourages a 14-man staff. With a DH you’re required to have 9 non-pitchers in the game at all times, without the DH you’re required to have only 8 non-pitchers in the game at all times.
FYI – in 2019 there was 208 extra inning games, 112 of which were in NL parks with NL rules.
Fever:
I agree with a lot of your points.
I think the DH encourages 14 man pitching staffs, because it reduces the need for pinch-hitters. Without the DH, NL clubs had 2-3 guys on the bench that got several pinch-hitting ABs a week.. There’s less need, with the DH, to pinch hit as often.
In 2021, teams in the AL with the DH, had a combined 1,225 PH ABs. In the NL without it, teams had a combined 3,866 PH ABs. Teams in the AL used a pinch-hitter less than 1/3 of the time. With less need for pinch-hitters, teams can carry more pitchers.
I really don’t see 112 games, out of 208, 54%, as being beyond normal variation. I would need to see that same outcome over several seasons to believe there was a clear correlation.
Tad and Fever, my understanding is that teams are limited to 13 pitchers effective May 1 when the rosters are reduced to 26. I thought that was the case last year, as well. I may have “mis-remembered.” Can anyone confirm the number of pitchers allowed on the 26 man roster this year?
Personally, I don’t know if the issue is the length of the game as much as it is the lack of action today, given the three true outcomes?
The actual amount of action in an NFL game is 11 minutes on average.
Claiming baseball doesn’t have as much action as other sports is 100% myth.
I actually think fewer games makes more sense. And MLB was not wrong in wanting more post season. Casual fans like playoffs. But that should have come with fewer regular season games.
Agree. 154 game seasons was what was used for decades. I would have liked to see them go back to that with the expanded playoffs.
you’d lose countless fans and likely not gain any with such a plan.
Angels and amp, please do not ever repeat your post on seven inning games.
Springers 150m contract and how well hes performed minus being injured sure making Judges extension rejection even worse. Anyone agree?
it’s actually great for the yanks.
Donkey wasn’t there to tell Shrek to sign on the line
I think Judge is going to be disappointed about his market but maybe I’m wrong
How many teams are using the pitch communication system? It seems like hitters are being caught off guard and pitchers are using it to quick pitch guys and set the rhythm at a faster pace than hitters are comfortable with. It could become a competitive advantage for teams that are good at using it to keep hitters off balance
I can’t take these questions about so and so struggling after 3 games.
Yeah, maybe the Brewers should start trading off all their veterans and start the rebuild.