Giants GM Brian Sabean is searching for a bat, reports Jeff Fletcher of AOL FanHouse. But here's Sabean explaining his limitation:
"We are not interested in free agents. We don't want to rent players. That doesn't make sense for us. We've got to find someone we can control, much like the Freddy Sanchez deal, and hope that presents itself."
Sanchez could only loosely be called a controllable player, as he had an $8.1MM club option that was considered a fallback. The Giants instead extended him at two years and $12MM in October. Sabean also told Fletcher money is not an issue, though clarified to MLB.com's Chris Haft that "it's not a bottomless pit."
As Fletcher notes, Sabean's statement means Adam Dunn, Jose Guillen, Derrek Lee, Paul Konerko, and Ty Wigginton are out. We also have to forget Russell Branyan, Adam LaRoche, Austin Kearns, Lyle Overbay, and Xavier Nady. On Monday, Bob Dutton of the Kansas City Star had suggested the Giants had interest in Guillen if the Royals picked up the tab.
Fletcher feels that an outfielder makes more sense for the Giants than a first baseman, unless it's Prince Fielder. Corey Hart, David DeJesus, and Josh Willingham are three other controllable names. I'll toss in Jose Bautista and Luke Scott as well. The Giants reportedly have interest in DeJesus.
The Giants may also scour the market for a setup man and even a starting pitcher, suggests Fletcher. Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports wrote yesterday that "the Giants believe their bullpen is in need of more stability, particularly from the left side."
The Giants wont get anyone, they love their well below average offense. Have fun finishing in 4th place…
It ‘s a shame to see the building of good pitching followed up by that offense.
Unfortunately Sabean only adds “non-factor” players. Garko / Sanchez aren’t exactly game changers.
Not only do they need to add a bat, but we need Pablo (not calling him panda anymore) to start hitting and stop making idiot base running blunders.
I never liked the nickname “panda,” who wants a nickname from some corny kids movie which flopped 3 years ago. (kung fu panda) I used call him pablo slamtheball but even that has lost its ring of recent. 🙁
Dude, that movie rules
PW – The average National League team hits .257/.327/.401 for an OPS+ of 95. The Giants as a team are hitting .262/.328/.402 for an OPS+ of 92. (Source: http://www.mccoveychronicles.com/). So the statement that they have a “well-below average offense” is erroneous. I would love to see Corey Hart in the outfield in the longterm, but Burrell and Huff (while water buffaloes on defense) have been welcomed surprises so far. Huff is leading the team in average and HR, and Burrell has been a shot in the arm with a .330 average in 60 at-bats. Both have been great for clubhouse chemistry too (so I hear)
Sandoval isn’t hitting well right now, the Giants put too many balls on the ground which leads to an exceptionally high number of double plays, and Rowand is barely hitting his weight (and he’s NOT a big guy). Those are the three biggest issues.
With the pitching SF has (Lincecum and Cain, pray for rain), the Giants are almost always in the game. An additional set-up guy, and perhaps a power bat off the bench, will probably be sufficient to make the playoffs.
Corey Hart could be added if the Giants have balls to DFA Bengie. Put Buster behind the plate and Huff at first full time.
I’d also wouldn’t mind Willingham or Dejesus.
Only Giants fans would think that Posey’s .136/.152/.136/.289 batting line in the past 3 weeks would improve the Giants lineup. He has the worse batting line by far of any of the 10 hitters who have been regularly starting in the past three weeks. Molina has been scuffling too but even he has double the batting line that Posey has.
Posey has been exposed, he will have to adjust, but meanwhile, every game he’s in the lineup, he is hitting worse than what the pitchers are hitting, in a RBI spot no less (Pitchers this season are hitting .137/.155/.137/.292, just slightly better, but still, no regular starter should be hitting worse than the pitchers as a whole).
hes in a slump that molina has been in all year.
Only a hater would say that the .345/.420/.460/.880 Molina hit to May 12 is a slump. Around then, he took a foul ball off his arm that affected him so badly that he eventually needed a cortisone shot to help it heal faster, and which appears to have affected his hitting for the next month plus.
he sure has been exposed… it’s painful to watch him up there at the dish…. if you’re on the opposing team, that is.
.136/.152/.136/.289 pretty much means that he was horribly exposed. Anybody hitting worse than a pitcher over a three week period is very exposed, nobody will last long in the majors hitting that.
If you would have read more carefully, that was 2 weeks ago, and he obviously made an adjustment that allowed him to blast the pitchers again. Good for him.
Still, at that point, there was no reason to determine what he would do in the future, at least from the fans viewpoint. The Orioles have been waiting for over a year now for Weiters to adjust against the pitchers. The Giants, being closer to the situation, has the most and best information related to judging this than any fan.
Still, fans think they “know” that Posey will be good. B.S. Everyone thought Weiters would be good. And maybe he will be eventually, but for now, at over a year of major league pension under his belt, and that much closer to arbitration, he looks just as lost, if not more so, than last season. Andy Marte was suppose to be good. Sean Burroughs was suppose to be good. Van Poppel was suppose to be great. Brien Taylor? #1 pick overall, got $1M from the Yankees, never made the majors.
And I’ve been supporting Sabean’s moves with the Giants, expressing my agreement with the Giants giving him a two year extension, both times, and I believe and have believed that he had the Giants in the right direction. He is laying the groundwork for a strong dynastic playoff contending team that I believe will finally get us that elusive first World Series in SF, doing it with great pitching rotation, great bullpen, and just enough offense to get us there. Pablo and Posey will be the heart of the offense, and other complementary players will complete the offense. I will welcome all who want to join me on the bandwagon that I’ve rode mostly alone for the past 5-6 years.
I saw that it was posted during his slump, but that doesn’t change the comment’s intent. Saying that he ‘has been exposed’ doesn’t imply that he’s just going through a rookie slump, but something larger about his ability.
If you look at his professional career, there was and is every reason to think that he will excel. He has adjusted at every level, very quickly, and dominated against the pitching. Nobody ‘knows’ how he is going to turn out, but there is no reason to think that he won’t be solid.
The way I understand it, players get exposed until they figure it out, then it is back on the pitchers to figure him out again, going back and forth, until you reach his talent level in the league.
Again, .136/.152/.136/.289 over three weeks doesn’t scream exposed to you? It is great that he figured it out soon afterward, but Gordon Beckham has been struggling with it since the season began and only recently began hitting again like he did last season. And Weiters is still trying to figure it out, he was considered an even better hitter than Posey by the experts, and now, over a year later, he is still struggling.
So there are plenty of reasons to think that maybe he might not be solid. Many prospects who had adjusted at every level, very quickly, and dominated, then could not do it at the major league level. It was not just a mild bump in the road, it was .136/.152/.136/.289 for three weeks. Bad luck could have been influencing that greatly, but as I showed with the examples, the “bad luck” could continue and threaten to be their new performance level.
Your saying that the Giants have an above average offense?? Because well…they dont and I never said a “below average national league offense”… but still even for the national league those stats look wrong.
I apologize. Though I said your statement was incorrect, I did not mean to refer to the Giants offense as “above average.” I solely meant to clarify that, compared to their National League competitors (comparing MLB total isn’t fair – too many differences in park sizes, DH, pitchers, etc between AL and NL), the Giants have been strictly average. It is what many people expected – Exceptional pitching, marginal hitting. If Sandoval was hitting .310 or higher, with a higher OPS, it would probably equate to 2-3 more wins, which would put the Giants 1 back of the leader. Instead, they are 4 back, and I’m comfortable with that.
You had it right, Crash, P W is the one who got it wrong.
People forget that to get you have to give, and the other teams will be offering “good’ hitters like the ones listed (they are not that good, except for Fielder, when you include defense) only if we give up one of our truly good starters, like Sanchez or Cain or Bumgarner. No way!
That’s the only way they will get a significant hitter, by trading a significant pitcher. I would rather keep the pitching.
People are crying now but this is just part of the ups and downs of a major league season. Man up, they have been streaky this season, going good then bad and alternating. They are also still rebuilding, the Braves when they were in year 6 of their rebuilding was still losing hand over fist, the Giants are working on their second year of competing for the division title. It takes time to put all the pieces together, yet all anybody wants to do is trade away those pieces just in the desperate hope to win this season.
I would rather they keep the long term view, like they have been, and not be desperate fools, trading away good pitchers for OK position players.
And people complain about the Sanchez/Garko trade, but they got a good major league secondbaseman for two pitching prospects who are scuffling in AA this season. I think that is a great deal.
I apologize. Though I said your statement was incorrect, I did not mean to refer to the Giants offense as “above average.” I solely meant to clarify that, compared to their National League competitors (comparing MLB total isn’t fair – too many differences in park sizes, DH, pitchers, etc between AL and NL), the Giants have been strictly average. It is what many people expected – Exceptional pitching, marginal hitting. If Sandoval was hitting .310 or higher, with a higher OPS, it would probably equate to 2-3 more wins, which would put the Giants 1 back of the leader. Instead, they are 4 back, and I’m comfortable with that.
they have the 2nd highest team batting average in the majors. i’m not saying they’re above average, because they’re not. the only thing they haven’t been doing lately is getting hits with runners in scoring position.
While I agree with most of your points, I disagree about “Lincecum and Cain, pray for rain”. Zito and Sanchez have been very good this season, the only time we really had to pray for rain was Wellemeyer on the road (he was incredibly good at home). Sanchez even has a better ERA than Lincecum (not saying that he’s better, but still, he has a better ERA right now, so there is no need to pray for rain when Sanchez starts).
I’m sorry, I should have better portrayed what I was meaning to say. “When Lincecum and Cain are pitching, pray for rain” (as if spoken by the opposing team). A rip-off/reinterpretation on the old Spahn and Sain and pray for rain saying.
Watching Sanchez can be agonizing at times (inconsistencies in his approach and focus), but as an old A’s fan and converted Giants fan, I’m more than happy with Zito this year. He’s been impressive, and there’s little stigma to the days he pitches anymore.
I did understand your historical reference and that you were paraphrasing it, but you got it wrong on both counts, now that you bring it up.
The phrase was said not by the opposing team but the fans of the team, because the phrase basically says that you only have two good pitchers so after they pitch, you pray for rainouts so that your other pitchers don’t pitch.
Well, I think the rest of the rotation – Zito, Sanchez, Bumgarner – is pretty good. Sanchez may agonize, but with such a low ERA, he does pretty well on the whole that you take the bad with the good. We agree about Zito, and I think Bumgarner will prove to be the best legit 5th starter in the majors (what I mean by “legit” is that sometimes team places their young starters in the back of the rotation to ease them into the majors but in terms of talent they probably should already be 2nd or 3rd on the team, if not 1st. Bumgarner is good but when he was put in, he was the true 5th starter and even with these good outings, he maybe moves up to 4th, but for most other teams, he would be their 2nd or 3rd best starter already).
Those numbers really don’t say much, check out their numbers with RiSP and Molina has scored only 2 runs since May 16th, the lack of speed, the abundance of singles, and the lack to get a runner in when there’s a guy on 3rd with 1 out is awful
If they don’t want rental players, then I guess they don’t want to help their team win this year.
I wonder what Giants would give up for Bautista?
absolutley nothing. Sabean is an idiot but not even he (worst GM in baseball…sorry kenny W) would give up anything of value for a one deminsional player in the midst of a career year.
One dimensional player? Please explain.
A player with 20 HR’s but strikes out once every 4 ab’s approaching his 30’s and batting 230 isnt going to get you any prospect you have ever heard of via trade. Bautista is having a nice Power hitting year but he isnt a difference maker at the deadline.
Uhm most power hitters strike out a lot – Howard? You mention his BA but forget to mention his like .360 OBP which is not easy to do when your BA is .230 so he’s doing a great job getting on-base. He’s leading AL in HR, which is not that easy to do.
Power hitters are the difference maker at the deadline, especially considering Giants don’t really have a good offense. He’s also versatile and plays above average offense at 3B or any outfield position. It’s not just this year, he sort of just got it ‘clicked’ last year on September and has been incredible since then, through spring training and up to now.
If you told me last year deadline that Bautista wouldn’t get you anything, I would have believed you but he’s a completely different player.
Fluke season, so we would be buying high. No thanks unless it is a prospect we don’t care about (and it usually is when the Giants trade).
We’ll have to agree to disagree. Have watched him all season and don’t see him as a difference maker on Offense. If you acquire him thinking thats what you are getting, you will be disapointed. Toronto would be smart to move him for ANYTHING…once Snider gets back he needs to develop in RF. Bautista isnt a everyday 3rd baseman (defensivley)….if they can get a 18 year old Single A arm…I would jump at the oppertunity…eventually all 29 year old 8 year vets regress to their career mean.
Bautista is fine defensively at 3B and there have been a lot of players in the past that find it late in their careers and simply are late bloomers.
If you have really watched Bautista, then you would know his bat speed is incredible which is why he is hitting so many HR, he is prepared to hit that fast early and hard. He is showing great vision and discipline leading to many more walks which is why his OBP is so high.
Although I will say, Hart is a better option than Bautista – that should not even be an argument but to say Bautista is essentially worthless is not true.
Giants have Juan Uribe who has basically produced the same run production numbers, wtih a higher avg. He is the same age as Bautista. Only real difference between the two is at least Uribe has had seasons early in his career along the lines of what he is producing this year (and last). Yet if the Giants put him on the block, they would get close to nothing for him as well. 30 Year old Players in the midst of career streaks don’t have a ton of value.
One dimensional player? Please explain.
absolutley nothing. Sabean is an idiot but not even he (worst GM in baseball…sorry kenny W) would give up anything of value for a one deminsional player in the midst of a career year.
Hopefully NOTHING
I wonder what Giants would give up for Bautista?
The Giants have scored 316 runs, good for 12th best out of 16 National League teams. The sole purpose of an offense is to score runs, so regardless of what their fancy metrics might look like it is fair to say that they have a pretty bad offense.
True, the Giants don’t score many runs, don’t hit many homeruns, and hit into way too many double plays. Lucky for them that the team leading the NL West have scored the exact same number of runs (Padres, 316). Good thing they are third in ERA, first in saves, first in TB allowed, first in BAA, and have allowed the third fewest runs. Ah, and don’t forget – The offensive players also play defense, and the Giants have only made 31 errors on the season.
I’m not arguing that their offensive is GOOD. I’m simply stating that there is more to success than simply hitting the ball out of the park.
And back to the original point of this posting –
I’d rather have Hart than Bautista, for two major reasons –
1) Bautista hasn’t proven the ability to sustain success
2) Though Bautista plays a passable outfield, he’s primarily an infielder. The Giants don’t need that. Hart’s defense is better, steals more bases, and is a better overall hitter. Hart’s line is .278/18HR/60RBI, Bautista is .232/20HR/50RBI.
Most likely, the Giants will be able to obtain a middle setup guy (hey, has anyone thought of using Prior, whom I know is auditioning again for teams, as a setup guy?) and a guy like a Giambi – strong bat off the bench, not much else. I’d prefer a Willingham and DeJesus.
The sole purpose of the offense is not to score runs, it is to score enough runs so that your team wins more often than they loses. People forget that dynamic ying-yang with defense (pitching and fielding).
They are 40-36, so their offense is working well enough most of the time.
Yes, their offense is bad compared to other teams, but that ultimately is not what matters. Milwaukee leads the NL in offense and yet they are 35-42. What matters is winning, period.
People get all weepy when a well pitched game is lost but not when the offense is wasted. Why is that? Most Giants fans point to Game 6 when Ortiz gave the ball to Dusty as the turning point of the series, but to me it was always Game 2 when the Giants pitcher (Ortiz ironically) gave up all those runs early on, putting us in a deep, deep hole (5-0 after 1, 7-4 after 2), yet the offense actually fought back and took the lead 9-7, before the relievers gave it away one run at a time until we lost.
Had the Giants won that game, if things stayed the same, the Giants would have won the World Series in five games, with no Game 6 meltdown to worry about. And after taking two from the Angels in their home park, I wouldn’t bet against a sweep happening. Instead, it was 1-1 and ultimately helped the Angels win.
You’ve correctly identified the sole objective of a baseball game. But an offense is just responsible for the runs part. Pitching and defense are also important, but are not a part of offense. I don’t see how what you’re sayin in any way contradicts what I wrote.
I was clarifying for those like you who are missing the point.
Sure they have a bad offense, but the point of the game is not to have a good offense but to win the most games. If the team has juggled its resources to develop a winning team, which it has been since Pablo Sandoval was added to the team (22-20 in 2008 after he was promoted, 88-74 last season, 50-42 this season), that seems to me to be the main point, which I’ve found most Giants fans don’t appreciate.
Again, yes, the offense needs to be improved. Every team has some aspect that is not particularly good or perhaps even bad. We all know where the Giants are deficient in. So what is the point of your comment then?
The Giants have scored 316 runs, good for 12th best out of 16 National League teams. The sole purpose of an offense is to score runs, so regardless of what their fancy metrics might look like it is fair to say that they have a pretty bad offense.
Agree with malcolmec, and disagree respectfully with Crash. While some of those stats may portray the Giants as a somewhat average offense, they are woefully deficient in scoring runs and leaving men on base. They are also about to set a ML record for hitting into DPs. The group of Renteria, Rowand, Molina, and yes Pablo are killing this team offensively. And with Uribe playing so much, his numbers and productivity are heading south now as well. A steady, middle-of-the-order hitter is what’s needed, but if it’s not going to be a rental, then it’ll cost the Giants something they may not want to give up, especially now that they’ve dithered long enough to fall out of contention for the division given the schedule ahead of them.
Sabean has mismanaged this well enough once again to waste another season. This team won’t be buyers after the break, they’ll be sellers because they’ll barely be a .500 team at the break.
You know what we could REALLY use? Jeff Conine, circa 1996 😉
Obviously, the Giants have done pretty well since this was posted. That’s why I hate statements like this on general on these boards, some people come on and grouse when the team is not doing well and make pronouncements like “mismanagement” but then don’t come on the boards and admit that they got it at least a bit wrong.Enjoy the season as it progresses towards the finish line. Grouse about GM mismanagement when time is running out on a team, and that invariably is sometime in August for teams that within 10 games of first place. And certainly not while the team has been over .500 for the whole season and it isn’t even the ASB yet. The complexity of the standings can and do change greatly within a couple of weeks, there can be higher highs and lower lows. Keeping an even keel will help you enjoy a baseball season more plus you’ll feel like committing hari-kari less and will hold a more realistic view of the talent level of the team and not just wallowing in the lows.
Maybe worry about mismanagement earlier, but to say “Sabean has mismanaged this well enough once again to waste another season.” is obviously premature conciliation of the season’s prospects.
Dan Uggla. If the Giants dont pick him up, Colorado might. Do we really want that? There is going to be lots of interest in Uggla as the 31st approaches and I think it makes the most sense for the Giants to make a move to bring him in. Give up pitching, get a legitimate bat. The defensive arrangement is interchangeable enough to make it work. Should have made this move before the season started, rather than signing yet ANOTHER aging vet like DeRosa. Plain and simple Giants…either make a move now, or watch the season slip away.
Hmmmm, I hadn’t thought of this until the Poll was posted – Jermaine Dye (aging but useful)? Rocco Baldelli (May not be okay to play yet…)? Elijah Dukes (he’s a punk with off-the-field problems, but maybe he’s ready to change)?
I don’t know if Uggla will truly be available but if we get him it’ll be hard to play him since we have Sanchez,Rent and Uribe. I’m reluctant about getting Hart because lets face it yes he has a lot of value but how do we know it isn’t a career year? he also hits in a hitter’s ballpark with no more than 24 homers in his career, last time we got someone with those similar numbers hitting in a hitter’s ballpark we got Aaron Rowand, you really want to risk getting another Rowand? If I’m Sabean I’d bring in Fielder cause he has legitimate power for one and also he’s shown he can hit in AT&T park he has a water shot in is resume. I think if the brewers are out by the deadline Fielder and Hart are out hopefully Fielder comes to SF.