9:59am: While no offer has been made, the Yankees indeed "like Kuroda very much," according to Jon Heyman of MLB Network (Twitter link).
8:55am: The Yankees haven't made Kuroda an offer, tweets MLB.com's Bryan Hoch.
8:13am: The Yankees have offered Hiroki Kuroda a one-year contract worth approximately $12MM in U.S. dollars, reports Japanese news outlet Sponichi (passed on by Mike Axisa of River Ave Blues). The Yankees were one of several teams known to have an interest in Kuroda and as Axisa points out, the presence of Kuroda's old battery-mate Russell Martin could be a factor that only the Yankees could offer the right-hander.
If signed, Kuroda would join a rotation that features C.C. Sabathia and four relative question marks in Phil Hughes, Ivan Nova, Freddy Garcia and A.J. Burnett. On paper, Kuroda would be the No. 2 starter, though it remains to be seen how the 36-year-old would fare pitching in the AL East as opposed to pitcher-friendly Dodger Stadium.
How is Ivan Nova a question mark? Sure hes not the obvious number 2 but a lot more dependable going into the season then everybody else.
strikeout rate, it’s not a big deal though i also think he had a higher k rate after he used the slider
from 5.0 per 9 to 5.7 per 9
From a 4.98, 4.18, 5.79, 6.75, to a 6.55, and a 4.54 the last month may cast doubts on the change but that’s still something to be encouraged about.
maybe, but it’s not usually a good idea to pick and choose like that. the 6.75 comes from 12 innings and essentially 1 game against baltimore
True it is a tiny sample and in that regard he should be viewed as a question mark but he still has shown some ability it’s like hes a scrub like he is often portrayed.
I guess they see what happen to Hughes after winning 18 games. There is not sure thing in the rotation besides CC if you think about it.
I totally agree that if he were playing on a team besides the Yankees (or some other high powered offense) he would be average at best.
But because of all that run support he’s good enough.
His offense affects, his era,fip, xfip?
His sabermetric numbers were not that great.
than neither were kuroda’s. A .03 difference in fip and era is not a big difference at all. Especially since his fip and xfip probably improved once he used his slider.
adjusted for league and park factors, nova’s FIP was actually 5% better than kuroda’s (96 to 101)
his ERA (87 to 83) and SIERA (4.28 to 3.66) were worse, but i think it’s largely the lack of a track record or strong scouting reputation that makes people question him and not kuroda
His FIP (4.01) & xFIP (4.16) weren’t great in the first place.
For a rookie it’s pretty good, besides it’s not like kuroda’s 3.78, fip is that great in the nl west. Also out of curiosity are you worried about clay whose saber stats were considerably worse?
You need clarify who you’re referring to as Clay?
Aiken, duh!
buchholz prob
Buchholz
He’s always been a pretty high% flyball pitcher. Which is why fangraphs rates his numbers so high. Its just that those balls have never really gone out.
I’m not sure what you’re even saying is clay’s saber stats not a big deal for because you say those balls dont go out? Besides they go out 10% of the time thats a lot.
I’m looking at his 2010 season because it was his best one, while he only had 14 starts in 2011.
His HR% was 5.6% which is very low. I’m not saying they don’t matter but that he was luckier than normal according to fangraphs.
that’s what they said about AJ
The offense has no bearing on his pitching. You can win a lot of games with a horrible ERA/FIP because of the runs scored but it’s not going to make the pitchers numbers (other wins) look any better.
That being said, I’m one of the fans that thinks we need to take it easy with our expectations with Nova. I definetly think he CAN turn into a solid #2 or #3 but I’m not ready to say he’s going to be that in 2012.
What I do like about the kid is that he has a great arm, induces a ton of GB’s and from June on lowered his walks, raised his K’s, continued to induce GB’s and went further thru games. I think he definitely got better as the season went on.
walk-rate went from 3.7 per 9 to 2.5, k-rate from 5.0 to 5.7, but gb/fb went from 1.33 to 1.02
i definitely agree it’s important not to ask him to be a front-end starter. i don’t think he should be trying to strike guys out, but limiting walks and drawing bad contact. as we saw in 2011, if he can keep his team in games, he can have plenty of success
So they’re worried he’ll get hurt like hughes did?
Yeah, I don’t get the question-mark-narrative with Yankee pitching, either. Would we be calling Ivan Nova a question mark if he were a Minnesota Twin? The idea that his BABIP and K/9 suggest some reversion-to-mean in 2012 does *not* qualify him as a question mark. AJ Burnett is a question mark; that’s why they’re trying to unload him by eating some of his salary. Ivan Nova and Phil Hughes are *not* question marks. They will be in the rotation. That sentence does not end with a question mark; it ends with a period.
Right i mean let’s take doug fister, for instance sure he can regress back to what he was doing before ins eattle but no one even wants to say that. Instead fister is being portrayed as two different pitchers. The one in seattle and the one in det as if their is any difference. Certainly any pitcher can regress and have a bad sophomore season or what not it’s just said a lot more when you’re in ny or any large media market.
Hughes and Nova were on the Verducci list, maybe that’s what they are referring too.
Nova is a question mark in that he’s a 2nd year player. Hughes is a question mark because he was injured last year and hasn’t exactly been as good as he was in the 1st half of 2010. That’s not to say that either of them shouldn’t be locked in as starters next year though. I think both have enough potential and are young enough that we should try and continue to develop the.
you kidding me Cashman? Picking from the garbage pile again? Nova is not a question mark , he proved himself. It is Burnett that is the huge question mark. I have more confedience in Hughes being the 2010 Hughes, than Burnett being anything but a major disappointment and sick headache.
Smart move considering the commitments they’ve already got. The guy’s been remarkably consistent throughout his career.
I’d like for the Sox to get in on him and I wouldn’t be surprised to see the Rangers make a move here either.
I wouldnt mind a one year deal for kuroda but nothing more. I wouldnt mind going it to the season with the rotation how it is. Though i can see the rangers getting desperate and out bidding them for him.
AJ Burnett isn’t a question mark as to whether or not he’s rotation worthy, it’s a question mark as to whether or not he’s anything above the 4 or 5 spot.
Good 1 year hold over until Betances and Banuelos are ready for the Bronx.
At the end of the day Kuroda will sign for 1 year with another year as a player’s option(but I still don’t know for which team).
Yea I don’t get that. How is Nova a question mark? He put up great numbers and can only get better.
Looking at his peripherals it was clear he had success by being on the Yankees, a lot of run support.
Huh? i’m not sure how you are connecting the two looking at kuroda’s peripherals kuroda was clearly helped by the dodgers lack of run support right? Putting up a fip of 4 as a rookie is very good, and chances are nova has abetter year next year than kuroda.
I never said anything about Kuroda, very questionable if he can pitch in that ballpark or in the AL East. I’m saying that Nova’s numbers are slightly worse when looking at the saber numbers.
All pitching is questionable, name 10 starters that have had 5 good seasons in a row. It’s hard to do.
Not sure but what was his era.
3.74
3.70 but it was much higher at Yankee Stadium than away, which makes sense. His ERA+ was 118
You’re focusing on wins and losses. I think his ERA/FIP speak better towards what he did last year as a rookie.
Ask Rick Porcello about this. He had a very solid first season but has fallen off in seasons 2 and 3. The league could figure out Nova, he could get less run support, etc. He’s a safe bet to be at least decent, though, sure.
Nova pitched his best with low run support. A matter of fact, the Yankees scored 6 or more runs for him in 11 games, his ERA in those games was 4.50.
His ERA when they scored 0-2 runs for him was 1.83 (however that was only in 3 games). With 3-5 runs scored for him, his ERA was 3.39
That’s only because the ease of mind he got from those great yankee bats!!!
No wonder the Yanks didn’t do much at the winter meetings…All makes sense now.
This is a prelude to the Yankees getting VERY VERY aggressive on bidding for Yu Darvish. Both pitchers are from Osaka, Japan…Kuroda (36) would mentor Yu (25) & ease his transition to America greatly!!! And 1yr/$12M contract for Kuroda isn’t a bad investment (for the NYY)…If it helps the Asian Ace become a dominate presence in the AL East.
And it probably makes signing the Japanese SS, a little more feasible. (even though he wants to be on the LeftCoast – SEA)
A Win-Win, IMO…if the Yanks get it done.
Interesting theory. Definitely makes sense.
Too thought out IMO.
it would be interesting if this could entice Nakajima to accept a utility role as well as the possible signing of Darvish if they win the bid.
Clearly the idea here must be to get Kuroda so he has a fellow Japanese speaker besides a translator in the clubhouse for when the Yankees get Darvish and either trade Burnett while eating a ton of salary or put Hughes in the pen depending how spring training goes. I believe the Yankees need to get Yu Darvish in order to win the world series next year. CC YU will rock. I also believe the financial impact in ticket sales and merchandising alone will make Yu Darvish profitable within the 1st year of him signing. He looks incredibly good and has a vibe and ego to fit NYC.
Darvish can speak English.
T-shirt idea: Yu Got Served! Okay, that’s horrible, sorry.
could be good
heres hoping they get him.
If Yu ever hits a HR during interleague play, that’s definitely a possibility for Jon Sterling’s HR call
Ha. Or he’ll go with “Yuuuuuuu betcha!”
See Yuuuuu later
That could be an adaptation for Michael Kay’s “See Ya!”
Maybe “Yu yu yu yu yu got what I need”?
If Yankees DO get Kuroda, they would have SP’s of CC/Kuroda/Nova/AJ/Freddy/Hughes/Noesi (as Cash did make clear that he really like Noesi and willing to give him shot at ST)… as much as there are question marks I’m not sure if getting Kuroda is the means to ‘faciliate’ getting Darvish, honestly. If anything, I think it kinda detracts them away from bidding aggressively
Nova is a question mark b/c this is only going to be his 2nd full season in the bigs. He could do worse, but I love the kid and expect him to grow as a player. The slider he picked up after he was called up is an extremely important pitch. If he builds on the success of last year the Yankees are going to be in good shape.
I love the Kuroda move, if he signs. Hes a very good, reliable pitcher, and its only for 1 year. I think if they sign him it pushes AJ out of the rotation, or makes him fight for a job with Phil Hughes during Spring Training.
Just because two guys are japanese doesnt mean they’ll get along this most probably has nothing to do with darvish, and considering how reluctant kuroda has been about pitching in the east, he’s probably not in the position to make anyone comfortable about pitching.
This would be a smart move by the Yanks, Kuroda not only solves the #2 problem, but is short term. With the killer bees only a year away and Noesi, Warren, and Mitchell ready, the Yanks pitching would be strong. Kuroda would bridge the gap without giving up prospects. I don’t think it’s a smart move to go after Darvish. He’s going to cost 120+ million and is not proven in the majors. Most teams would love to have those ?. They were 3rd in the AL last year in the toughest division.
I get it. But I am not a fan of this. Kuroda is going to get lit up in the AL east. Darvish does nothing for me either. Go with your guys and let Noesi pitch. I hate how the Yankees will talk about how good these young arms are but they never give them a shot at being Tim Lincecum or Josh Johnson. The Yankees treat young pitching the way your mom treats her fine china, they never use it. It just sits on the shelf and gets dusty.
You can’t afford to pitch too many young pitchers if you are always a contender. One young pitcher is the most you can have each year. The Yanks did a good job with Hughes and Nova the past few years, the problem is that they pitched too many innings because of the playoffs.
I wish the Rays would take your advice then wouldn’t have to deal with them every year.
Shields is the oldest at 30 of that homegrown starting rotation.
The Rays are a different animal, they were bad for years, and were able to draft at the top. Price was the first pick in the draft, the Yanks will never get the first pick in the draft. On the other hand you have to pick the right players, the O’s could have picked Lincecum, Cain, and Bumgartner ahead of the Giants.
The yanks problem is not so much who their starters are but if a injury occurs they are in big trouble. The offense can score enough runs for a mediocre pitcher to get a win. If a injury does happen the prospects will be gone for a pitcher.
Except alot of their prospects are starters.
None close to be ready or they would be competing for a spot.
Who said noesi wasnt competing for a spot?
@ AAA- AGE-IP-ERA-FIP
They have Warren (24-152-3.60-4.05), Phelps (25-107-3.19-3.65), Mitchell (24-161-3.18-3.96) and Noesi (split time between AAA and majors).
They have plenty of #4/#5 option types.
Here’s the situation. You have CC, AJ, Nova and Hughes who are all either signed or pitchers who’ve already had MLB success. They added Garcia. They don’t have #1 or #2 caliber prospects other than Bets and Bans who are 1 year away at least. So, they have some interesting arms but just not obviously better options than what they have already.
Noesi, Warren, Mitchell, are all ready to start in the majors, the problem is they are all #5 starters . The Yanks are looking for a #2 starter.
could be a good signing to lure Darvish in.
Yes, I’m sure they do.
Kuroda — “bless you “
have
haven’t
have
haven’t
…… zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
absurdly ridiculous
Only the poor teams live with young pitchers. The Giants were a poor team when they drafted Lincecum, Cain, and Bumgartner. They brought them up gradually.
Cano was never supposed to have a high ceiling either what’s your point. A four fip isnt bad for a rookie i dont get how he wouldnt be dependable number 3.
No move has even been made.
How was he pitching over his head? Top 100 lists are great but please keep in mind that Cano, Gardner and Wang never appeared on any of them.
As for Nova, he’s never going to be a 7+ k per 9 IP type pitcher (unless he drastically improves his offspeed stuff) but what he is, is a pitcher that sits comfortably around 93-96 and induces 50% or better GB and will get 4 or 5 k’s a game. I certainly am not ready to call him a true #2 but he certainly has a ceiling higher than a #4.
The Yanks brought up Hughes and Nova when they thought they were ready. It turns out they were right. The killer bees are not ready. One of them will be in the rotation in 2013 and AJ will be traded next year when he is only owed 16 million. The Yanks will eat half his salary.
In fairness, they NEVER said that Kuroda was signed, they said that the Yankees offered him a contract and considering him being about the most reliable starter left on the market (I’d call it a coinflip between him and Oswalt based on Oswalt being better, but having a lengthy injury history recently), an offer of only one year is vastly different from a signing.
“Only the poor teams live with young pitchers.”
Cole Hamels, Felix Hernandez, Jon Lester, Clayton Kershaw, Jered Weaver. All young, FOR pitchers; all drafted, developed and rose to prominence on teams in large markets whose payroll has exceeded $100 million in the time they’ve been on their respective teams.
Just because the Yankees haven’t shown the patience or aptitude for developing FOR talent at the major league level recently doesn’t mean a large market team can’t or even shouldn’t do it.
Don’t forget Ian Kennedy. He was the most successful winning 21 games last year for the D-backs
if you actually saw him pitch last year he was solid/descent for 4/6 months. August, where he had a 11 ERA ballooned his ERA. He was actually pretty consitent during the year. would give us about 6 IP and 3 ER a game, id take that all considering. Call me insane, but if theres a game the yanks must win and its against a pitcher like Halladay, lincenculm, Lee, etc. I want AJ on the mound. He could pull out a gem… remeber he saved us in 2009 WS with that Game 2 performance, the guy wins big games (last years Game 4 against the tigers)
Oh really? When did he (Darvish) say that? I’d say Bobby V only increases the Red Sox’ chance to post a higher bid than they would with anyone else managing, but that doesn’t mean he would reject the Yankees if they won the bid.
Ok, I’ll take you up on it- you’re crazy..my 8 year old has a better chance of making it thru 5 innings than AJ and the LAST frigging thing I’d want is him pitching against someone’s ace. AJ is a head case, needs a nice, calm Milwaukee or Seattle environment so he doesn’t have PMS symptoms.
I think the Yanks realize that they made a mistake with Joba and Kennedy bringing them up too quick. Both had arm problems and were ineffective.
By poor teams I meant their teams weren’t very good at the time they were drafted, not that they don’t spend money. The Mets were the top team when Hamels was drafted. The Dodgers weren’t that good when Kershaw was drafted. Most of the top players come in the first 10 picks of the draft, just look at past drafts. Verlander-2nd pick, Weaver-12th,Kershaw-7th, Greinke-6th,Price-1,Strasberg-1,Lincecum-10, Longoria-3.
There are always exceptions, the best being Mike Piazza and Beurhle. My point is that top teams won’t usually draft stars, but will obtain them through trades and free agency. If you gets players through free agency you are going to over pay like the Marlins and Angels.
You’re visibly altering your argument here. Your initial argument was about bringing up players gradually, nothing to do with drafting capable talent. You were arguing clearly that the Yankees and other big market teams are not in a position to bring up talent and give them a chance at the MLB level, when that is simply bunk.
As for the second half, wrong again. Phillies only missed the playoffs by two games the season prior to drafting Hamels and he was the seventeenth pick (Not first ten). Weaver was 12th and while the Angels performed poorly in 2003 (The year prior to his drafting), that was an anomaly as they won the WS the year before that and were perennial contenders from 04-09. While the Sox had a poor 2001 prior to drafting Lester, he was a second round pick, the 57th overall pick. Hernandez was an amateur signing, not a top pick, and he was signed in ’02, just after the Mariners won 116 games!
Kershaw was the only one of those pitchers I mentioned who fits your description. You. Are. Wrong.
“My point is that top teams won’t usually draft stars, but will obtain them through trades and free agency.”
Even more wrong than your last point.
Hamels, Trout, Weaver, Avila; all stars, all drafted and developed by a top team. ALBERT FREAKING PUJOLS.
Pedroia, Ellsbury, Youkilis, Papelbon, Lester and arguably Buchholz and Bard; all stars, all drafted and developed by a top team. ONE team.
W-r-o-n-g. You need to look outside the Yankees bubble and realize that most other top teams are capable of drafting and developing their own talent while continuing to win. Just because the Yankees by and large survive off of free agency and amateur signings doesn’t mean you can’t succeed in the draft while remaining competitive.
While a guy with that kind of GB rate can be extremely valuable, the issue with them is that their ceiling is dependent entirely upon the team behind them. Nova was good this year, but he was good with A-Rod having a career year defensively at third with Cano and Teixeira spotting him on the right. His numbers would take a drastic turn for the worse should A-Rod revert to type defensively or Teixeira start to show signs of aging.
He had a fairly normalized BAbip which shows his true capabilities make him a good pitcher overall, but a look at his monthly splits show what would be expected: when his BAbip gets up there (Which usually means defensive trouble behind him), his peripherals jump with them.
So yes, Nova’s a more than capable starter, but he’s someone who (Like Wang), will always be reliant upon his costars to a degree that means he’ll never be more than a mid-rotation starter.
Arod only played 11 games (some as a DH) in July/August when Nova had a 3.36 FIP and a 3.00 FIP. But still, I see him with a ceiling as a solid #3 more than a #2.
lmaooooo I say that because he has the best chance to throw a gem to compared to any guy in the Yankees rotation. And yes that includes CC. I love CC but his postseason performances arent very impressive. He seems to go out there and labor, but gives the Yankees a chance to win b/c of that offense. You cant afford more than 2-3 runs against a bonafide ace. AJ somehow figueres it out sometimes, and hes won huge games for us. Of course he can always go 2 innings and allow 7 ER and ruin it for us. AJ was actually around a low 4.00 ERA the entire year, until he imploded in August. I might be the only guy that still has faith in him, maybe its ill advised, but I do.