FRIDAY: Sources that spoke with Ken Rosenthal and Katie Strang of The Athletic painted quite a different picture than did Bosio. Whereas Bosio asserted that he was making a comment to others that was overheard and taken out of context by a team employee, this new report indicates that a racial epithet was directed from Bosio to the employee. Multiple sources specifically disputed Bosio’s account of what occurred, per The Athletic.
THURSDAY: Bosio has given his version of events to Bob Nightengale of USA Today, asserting that the situation arose from a misunderstanding and claiming he was unfairly dismissed. Anthony Fenech of the Detroit Free Press provides additional information regarding a key aspect of Bosio’s account (see here and here).
Avila again declined to go into specifics, but generally disputed that the team was wrong to react as it did. “We know what we did, and why we did it,” he said, “and we’ll see where it goes from there. The action we took was appropriate. There were things involved. But I can’t comment any further.”
WEDNESDAY, 3:02pm: Rick Anderson will move from bullpen coach to pitching coach for the remainder of the season, Avila says (via Anthony Fenech of the Detroit Free Press, on Twitter).
2:49pm: The Tigers announced today that they have fired pitching coach Chris Bosio. Per a club announcement, the decision was due to “insensitive comments.” The full statement reads as follows:
“Effective immediately, the Detroit Tigers have terminated the contract of pitching coach Chris Bosio for his insensitive comments that violated Club policy and his Uniform Employee Contract. The organization holds all of our personnel to the highest standards of personal conduct both on and off the field. We have zero tolerance for this type of behavior. The Club will have no further comment on this matter.”
It is not entirely apparent at this time precisely what led to the termination, but general manager Al Avila tells reporters that the comments in question were made by Bosio to a team employee (Twitter link via MLB.com’s Jason Beck).
Bosio was in his first year with the organization after spending five seasons in the same role with the Cubs. The 55-year-old pitched in the majors for eleven years, from 1986 through 1996.
Um woah
What the hell? Insensitive comments must have been more than just insensitive.
Probably said “MAGA” and someone complained.
Most baseball owners are conservatives. Mike and his wife donated lots to Republican candidates in the 2012 election.
“Detroit Tigers: Mike Ilitch and his wife, Marian, gave $184,000 to federal candidates in 2012, mostly to Republicans.”
Would link it here but you can just google it.
It was a joke Jaysfans.
I’m sure Bosio said something offensive. I’m going to guess he treated the conversation as locker room talk. Anyone that’s ever heard of the clubhouse culture in any sport know heads would explode if some of the discussions and drama were to ever be made public.
is 184K a lot to Mike Illitch?
Nothing yo do with insensitive comment
Not from the family net worth, but with restrictions on how much can be donated to a candidate by an individual, it’s a lot.
True. You can donate a hell of a lot more to the Super PAC’s though. I’m not familiar with illitch’s campaign funding nor do I care to be so I can’t really comment on how he spent that 184K.
And anyone who has ever heard of “clubhouse culture” knows that it stays in the clubhouse and doesn’t cross over to the business side of the team. If the employee on the receiving end of these comments is from the business side of the organization, then it’s a terribly unprofessional—and ultimately, inexcusable—act by Bosio.
Based on what has been reported, I’d say he pretty clearly didn’t do anything unprofessional or inexcusable. I’d love to hear someone else besides Bosio talk about what happened.
What’s been reported is only one side. The Tigers have been run rather professionally for quite some time. I can’t see any company, let alone a MLB team, taking the action they did without a thorough investigation. Someone doesn’t get fired over a “he said/she said” accusation. The team, or any business, is being legally responsible by not publicly parading Mr. Bosio’s laundry to the tabloids. If you were terminated, I am sure you would not be happy with your former employer providing the details to the public.
Hence me saying, “I’d love to hear someone else besides Bosio talk about what happened.”
And it certainly wouldn’t be the first time someone has been fired from a he said/she said situation.
Like the black guy he called a monkey?
Please provide an example.
I would have too, if it actually happened. I doubt it. . No need to interject politics into sports. All jokes aside, he probably said something about a player that he shouldn’t have.
I bet the name Obama makes you crap your pants.
Heh.. It sends a tingle down some dolts legs does it not?
Remember when employees were judged by how well they did their job instead of how “sensitive” they were?
Sweet, only took 3 comments this time for someone to fall into the “PC CULTURE IS RUINING AMERICA” hole.
Yup…..
It’s true
We definitely need to hear more details before either one of you is right about this one.
deadspin.com/former-tigers-pitching-coach-claims-h…
Here is the alleged comment. He may have a case on his hands here.
We don’t know anything at all about the situation yet, except that Avila described the offending comments as “insensitive.”
But once you do, you’ll update right?
deadspin.com/former-tigers-pitching-coach-claims-h…
I’ll do it for him. Guarantee this is not what you or anyone else was expecting.
I wasn’t expecting anything, if that’s directed at me. The post on this site was and is completely neutral and fact-based.
And I had already updated our post to link to the information, so I’m not sure why you felt it necessary to do so.
Didn’t mean to imply that. It wasn’t directed at anyone. I appreciate that this article is fact based, I have a previous comment where I say we need to wait for the facts to come out.
Excellent job Jeff Todd. Great reporting great updates. Keep up the good work.
Yes and it was a horrible time to be anything but a white male, you probably are one of those!
Good bosses don’t allow for toxic environments. I don’t expect a Con troll to understand that.
I remember it. It was back when white males had all the jobs and women were routinely abused if they said something insensitive about those men.
I’ll take him. Unless those insensitive comments had to do with the Eagles or Chase Utley and were not done on his wife’s twitter account, there’s a good chance we wouldn’t care. As long as he did a good job.
That’s funny
Agreed
I lost all respect for him anyways when he decided to call out Thames and blindly accused him of PED’s because his pitchers couldn’t get him out.
Braun hasn’t been the same since being off PEDs
He’s also a lot older
Do you contribute anything useful to baseball conversations? What does Braun have to do with Bosio being a beeotch and accusing Thames of PED usage just because your Cubs couldn’t get him out and that he had massive guns for arms.
And then you turn it to a “homer” Brewer’s fan comment. Nice.
Haha ok there ace. Look up Bosio’s quotes directed to Thames and he says “his body has changed”. The ironic thing is that I was a huge fan of Bosio when he was the Brewers ace at one point in the 90’s.
It is going to be a long year and for who knows how long in the future with basically a AAA team playing every day.
I hope Gardy stays.
Me thinks they were just looking for an excuse…..
They didn’t need an excuse – they can fire the guy anyway.
And teams can let certain football players wallow away unsigned forever also can’t they?
Yes, they can.
They can fire him for their ERA
But firing him for this allows the team to avoid paying the remaining guaranteed salary.
Not that I agree with the accusation, but there’s definitely a merit to it.
After all the money that the team has eaten from bad contracts, do you seriously think they would make something up to save the equivalent of the major league minimum?
I lost a job because I didn’t invite entire office to a lunch cookout I had on my day off that I provided all the food for at my house. Was with company for fifteen years. They even sent a congratulation card for fifteen years of service two weeks later.
White males can be fired for any reason. Was even told by hr there that I had no rights.
Like some snowflake got offended and couldn’t find a safe space soon enough. Then blew it way out of proportion
Or maybe you lost the job because you’re a racist jerk
Enjoy that pitch-to-contact strategy that Anderson employs, Tigers fans.
Anderson is Gardy’s boy. He stepped right in. Bosio was just keeping the seat warm.
Does anybody remember sticks and stones may break my bones?
Don’t you think people should be held accountable for their words and actions?
Being held accountable and losing your job are two entirely different things. There are many levels of accountability. Apologies. Quietly getting him sensitivity training. Fine. Suspension. Then firing after all else fails. Who knows, maybe this wasn’t the first incident, but it seems a bit extreme for “insensitive comments.”
Since you’re not privy to any information, anything you say is beyond idiotic.
Okay so you are suggesting just shutting down this site since none of us are privy to any information?
BTW, thank you for showing me the type of comment that is right in the middle of idiotic. In the future I will try not to go beyond it.
Yes but come on words only hurt if you allow them. It’s like bullying. I think yes bullying needs to stop but at the same time we need to start getting some thick skin. Bosio is just old school. I remember when Harvey Kuenn was managing the Brewers they would want to call for a delay of game when he went to the pitching mound. With the way things are now he wouldn’t be allowed to manage because people would be so sensitive lol. Back then they said a lot worse.
“Does anybody remember sticks and stones may break my bones?”
Yup. Also remember the next line, “but names will never hurt me.” Unfortunately names sometimes do hurt people. Particularly when used by someone with some measure of power against someone with less or no power. Perhaps relying on nursery rhymes for employment norms isn’t the best approach.
Too bad, he had done a great job with the pitching staff since they hired him. But what you say has consequences as he just found out
Most unfortunate. I’m sure this is all just a big misunderstanding.
Dumb. Bosio should know better. And for all the whining here about PC, the comments had to be pretty bad for him to get canned. And such comments are no longer tolerated in the work place today.
Being reported by local Detroit TV that the comments were racial in nature. Not sure if that is true or not, but certainly you can’t work in an industry as racially diverse as baseball and make racially insensitive comments.
Doesn’t apply to just baseball. Should be the case on any job. Tired of people thinking they can say WTF they want, without repercussions.
I couldn’t have said this any better myself. In a sport that’s as diverse as baseball, which might be one of the most diverse sports if not the most diverse sport in the world, there is no place for a racially insensitive comment and if you make one, you’re breaching contract.
If someone is a racist, keep it to yourself. People in society don’t want to hear racist stuff.
Ever hear of a suspension?
This is one…the permanent variety.
He pissed off the wrong person. Was Pillar fired?
Pillar was suspended. Maybe Bosio said something worse. Obviously he said something bad enough to get fired. Why are so many people defending him when they literally have no idea what he said?
Because “saying” something should not ever be grounds for taking food off his kids plate! There is other forms of punishment. Obviously they didn’t care to use those forms. There was probably problems to begin with and they used this as a out.
That’s not true, there is many times you can say something that warrants dismissal. I’d assume that the company you work for has a Code of Conduct that you have to follow, and if you don’t could lead to a firing.
But we don’t know what was said …. silly to assume it was “horrible”
I am a nurse. If I were caring for a relative of yours and decided to go on an F-bomb laced tirade calling her every name in the book, would you expect me to be fired?
No place jumps to conclusions like the comment section of MLBTR.
I’d argue a better example would be a doctor talking to you that way. He didn’t go off on a patient/customer, so your situation is much, much different.
Its closer to the Richie Incognito issue.
Same reason you’re defending him getting fired. It’s the internet and people form opinions based on half the story.
Or maybe the pitching coach is easier to replace than your starting Cf…..No one knows until the comments come out.
Tigers need a pitching coach bad. Bosio was a good one. Eh I don’t care tigers are going nowhere anyway. Sucks for Bosio but he should watch what he says
All the people crying about PC culture, liberal snowflakes and MAGA would cry to HR in a second if their boss tore them a new one.
The Cubs 86’d him last year. There was some scuttlebutt, that remained vague, beyond the Cubs getting beat by LA & Hickey being available.
This discussion thread, MLBTR staff, is why I almost never bother with the discussion section anymore.
It’s just a microcosm of the Internet, though. Lots of gutless choads braying about things they’d never say in public.
The not-internet (aka real life) is the same way too. The real problem is that most people are truly stupid. No website can really do much to change that.
Yep. It’s worth it to just ignore comments sections all together. Enlightenment and improvement in life won’t be found in them.
I normally never post comments in non-Padres articles for this exact reason, but I wanted to comment here because I wholeheartedly agree with you. I honestly feel like userbase of this site has slowly gone down the toilet over the past few years with all the trolls that have settled here and the toxic garbage that is spewed in so many comment sections. The fact that certain accounts on here (I won’t name any specifics) have still not been permanently banned after all they’ve done just baffles me.
quotev.com/story/10157436/Baseball-articles (something less toxic)
We do our best, but it’s hard to draw clear lines in many cases. I try to weigh in sometimes when there are assumptions or misinformation, but certainly those are made in all directions and it’s hard to moderate for that except in egregious cases. Ultimately, we can enforce our rules but can’t hover over every aspect of a discussion.
Right, so at the end of the dribble and crap I just read, we are no closer to figuring out what happened?? Stay close to the topic people…
What I’ve heard is that the comments were of a racist nature.
He recited Fight The Power by Public Enemy
race baiters below
He’ll be picked up by another team in need of a good pitching coach. This will only backfire on the Detroit team.
unfounded.
Always with the friggin politics. Idiot liberal this, idiot conservative that. The wonders of opinions and internet anonymity.
He yelled profanities at a player for saying Domino’s makes good pizza.
how do I like this comment
I know our pitchers suck but sorry Chris u are fired….makes sense….
We all know Garden did not like the layout of the bull pen and words and sentences had been exchanged.. Despite flowers, asparagus and even tomatoes, players thought the Garden Hire’s gardening techniques over the top. Boscio went down fighting but he used the wrong words instead of just singing.
I hope your not driving anytime soon.
So his story is that he called pitcher Daniel Stumpf, a white pitcher, “Spider Monkey,” the man’s actual nickname. An African American not involved in the conversation overheard the comment and assumed he was the one being called “monkey” and despite Bosio explaining the situation to the employee, Bosio got fired.
If this is true, I hope Chris Bosio wins MILLIONS in a lawsuit against the Tigers This is beyond ridiculous. It’s getting to the point when people are learning vocabulary in school, white boys will be separated in order to learn the words they are not allowed to say.
I have to agree. If this was the context used and is a nickname for the player, then he should be reinstated. Probably no way that happens but to ruin his reputation over this, again if this is the true version.
Why would he want to be reinstated? He’d be better off getting his millions from them and finding somewhere else to work.
If you read the links, the Free Press was unable to confirm that “spider monkey” is Stumpf’s nickname. I wouldn’t think it would be difficult to confirm, if true.
Allegedly used “Monkey”
According to Bosio, he was talking about some skinny white pitcher they call “spider monkey” for the faces he makes while lifting weights and a locker room attendant overheard it and thought it was directed at him.
Incredible!
Do you really believe an attendant saying this, without credible substantiation, would be enough for any company to fire someone, especially if the person accused denied it happened? There is more to this, but we just dont know what. Seriously, unless Bosio sues, it is information that should not be made public.
In the time of ultra sensitivity I absolutely believe it could happen.
So according to Bosio, they were talking about someone else, a kid walks by and assumes they were talking about him. People these days!
Key words: “according to Bosio”.
Im tired of this over sensitivity crap. I get being a respectful human being but this is beyond stupid
But you don’t even know what happened….
Bosio has money. This is what lawyers are for.
It’s about time one of these incidents was given due process. I hope Bosio flies a suit against DET so the actual facts can be debated in court for a change.
Bosio’s interpretation sounds like an episode of Seinfeld or Curb Your Enthusiasm, he’s totally acting like he’s George Costanza.
Pulp can move baby!
Hope he takes them for every last hot and ready.
He’ll catch on elsewhere where others aren’t so sensitive.
So reading what actually may have happened, I stand by what I said. This is ridiculous and I hope Bosio gets every penny he is owed from Detroit plus a new job somewhere else. And the dude who falsely accused him is fired himself
So what is this proof you have that he was falsely accused?
I said reading what actually happened. Can you read?
Yes, I can. I did not read any “proof”. I read that he was fired. I read that he denies doing it. I did not read the incident report, because it is confidential and hasnt been made public. So again, I ask what proof you have that he has been falsely accused? His denial is not proof.
Can you give us deals about what happened? I doubt you can.
Someone heard a word they thought was racial while butting into a conversation that has nothing to do with him? Yeah that’s grounds for losing your job! Idiot
Sorry, dude, but some random internet commenter is not a credible source. Can you prove this in any way?
It’s in the story referenced above…
simschifan….you don’t find it odd that Strumpf said “”Spider Monkey is not a nickname I have been called or I’m familiar with,”?
Don’t you think that Avila and others interviewed the others involved in the conversation the attendant heard?
I find it odd that people automatically assume racism when you hear “spider monkey”. My brain didn’t go to race. It thought of a spider in a house that crawls and jumps really fast. Imagine your wife or girlfriend having to deal with a super spider like that?
If this is true, Bosio was unfairly dismissed and used as a poor example of locker room talk. Much worse has been said inside that room, and even out of it (Escobar, Yunel).
Reminds me of a Teacher friend who was having trouble getting her class to understand a math problem. She said “Even a blind monkey could solve this problem”. Got into lots of trouble for being racially insensitive, but eventually kept her job.
It’s not odd at all. “Monkey” is a long-established racial slur used to degrade African-Americans.
If he was talking to someone about Stumpf, what does that someone say about this?
Something seems odd…….
““That’s his nickname. He’s a skinny little white kid who makes all of these funny faces when he works out.” – Bosio
“Spider Monkey is not a nickname I have been called or I’m familiar with,” – Strumpf
I would hope that management also interviewed others who were involved in the conversation. To me it’s unfathomable that they didn’t conduct other interviews. If the others backed up Bosio canning him could be costly in many ways so it just seems odd.
Don’t think about it too hard. You’ll hurt your brain.
Oh gee…is that the best you have. It really hurt. Did you ask a 2nd grader for help? Sorry, I forgot that reasoning was out of your league. My comment was aimed at those with an IQ above that of a Ken doll so you can just move along.
Cat Mando – only thing I can think of is it was one of those nicknames you give a co-worker that they nothing about since it may be less than flattering. At a previous job I worked with a guy we nicknamed Mooby Dick.. because he had man boobs and a crap personality. He never knew about it – although spidermonkey seems like a cool nickname at least to me
How’s it feel to be you? It must be nice being so oblivious.
riffraff……It’s possible but off all the past and present teammates asked in the Detroit Free Press article only one said he ever heard the nickname, no one else.
Having spent my life in management and having to conduct investigations I can’t believe that the others involved in the conversation would not have been interviewed. If they backed up Bosio I find it hard to believe Aliva would fire him. That is the biggest sticking point to me. It’s also funny that Bosio used the generic ““Someone in our coaches’ room asked me (Monday afternoon) about Stumpf. And I said, “Oh, you mean, ‘Spider Monkey,’ ”. That “someone would have been interviewed by management.
redrooster….Talking to the mirror again I see.
I know it was a bit of a stretch but only thing I could think of. With only knowing his side and the actions taken by Detroit my gut tells me he got snagged saying something not as innocent as spidermonkey and is trying to spin it so its less reprehensible thus letting him have better chance at another job.
“ . . . my gut tells me he got snagged saying something not as innocent as spidermonkey and is trying to spin it . . . “
Were I a betting man that’s where I would place my money. Not finding a lotta examples of well-meaning white folks suffering consequences due to some misunderstanding or misinterpretation by a member of a protected class.
Of course the team interviewed all involved and all who witnessed. Had Bosio’s conduct been as innocent as he claims he would not have been fired. More will come out—and none of it will help him.
Wow, I remember the first time I heard that comeback! I haven’t been 4 in forever!
Try harder.
“Whereas Bosio asserted that he was making a comment to others that was overheard and taken out of context by a team employee, this new report indicates that a racial epithet was directed from Bosio to the employee directly. “
Well, that didn’t take long.
redrooster…..It seems others were interviewed and no one backed up his story. I guess like you he was oblivious to procedures.
majorflaw…I didn’t figure it would. Bosio’s version didn’t make sense when he said others were involved. .
“Not finding a lotta examples of well-meaning white folks suffering consequences due to some misunderstanding or misinterpretation by a member of a protected class.”
Then you live in a bubble.
And yet you yourself used a terrible comeback.
Git gud.
I don’t need this sass go to the timeout corner!
According to the Athletic (also reported on Deadspin), four team sources said that Bosio referred to a white pitcher and added like this person, referring to the African=American clubhouse attendant. When given a chance to apologize, he declined.
I don’t know what is worse, Bosio’s actions or the number of people in this thread trying to justify them.
To be fair, most of the comments in this thread were made before this latest information came out. Quite a few were made before Bosio told his side; most of the rest were made after he gave his version of events but before other detailed reporting had been released.
“The Free Press reported Thursday that “multiple players and coaches” who have been around Stumpf during his two seasons in Detroit said they never heard him referred to directly as “Spider Monkey.” Tony Paul of the Detroit News said on Twitter, “If Bosio’s story *is* true, he’d have three or four assistant coaches backing him up and he would still have his job. But, nope.””
washingtonpost.com/news/early-lead/wp/2018/06/29/f…
Jeff….I waited to comment until more info was released. Once Bosio made his “““Someone in our coaches’ room asked me (Monday afternoon) about Stumpf. And I said, “Oh, you mean, ‘Spider Monkey,’ ”. statement, things just didn’t add up and seemed odd because I know management would interview that “someone” and others.
Firing him would have been trouble if that “someone” and the others present verified Bosio. As we know now they didn’t which is the only thing that made sense, hence my comment.
In hindsight I should have ignored redrooster but we all do stupid things when sleep deprived and tired of trolls.
I was actually just trying to respond to this portion of a comment from another user: “I don’t know what is worse, Bosio’s actions or the number of people in this thread trying to justify them.”
Just pointing out that some people were responding at a point at which there was incomplete information, so their comments at that time should be viewed in that light in retrospect. Just trying to make sure words/intentions aren’t potentially taken out of context, regardless of what perspective a given commenter is bringing to the discussion.
I understand and agreed with your statements. Too much was said when so little was known and even when the fist bits came out regarding Bosio’s statements there was still too much that didn’t add up.
I also used my response to you as a way of clarifying my original statement and an opportunity for a mea culpa.
Sadly there are some who live in denial even when more info comes out. They continue their childish acts despite facts. I just need to ignore them until they grow up.
So much for the “good ole boy” network. Glad to see some accountability still exists, given the toxic climate in this country.
100% on all accounts.
I worked in the Cubs’ baseball ops department during Bos’ tenure and let me tell you, he’s lying. He’s a massive jerk and tries to intimidate everyone so when he says about the clubhouse guy “playing jokes on him all camp” there is no way that’s true because he would never allow himself to be the butt of a joke which lines up with Stumf never having heard of that “spider monkey” nickname before.
What I will say in his defense though is that I would guess he wasn’t even aware he was using a racial insensitivity or it was a subconscious racial usage of it. While I wouldn’t put it past him being racist, he’s also very low on the EQ scale and may not have even realized the meaning behind calling him a monkey as he was saying it.
Welcome to Detroit Metro where a racist act is deemed as anything a white man over 50 says and does. Like much of America, minorities habitually lay blame for their own bad behavior and subsequent bad results on another race. If you’re white and proud to be what you are is considered racist.
Chris Bosio is better off.
I’m white.
This loser deserved to get canned and the Tigers are better off for it.
“ . . . minorities habitually lay blame for their own bad behavior and subsequent bad results on another race.”
Well, lookee here, an honest to goodness racist. Be glad this isn’t your place of employment, sphincter. Take your bright red dunce cap and crawl back under a rock.
White men, especially those over 50, control the vast majority of wealth and power in America. The fallacy they are somehow persecuted is disgusting. Propagating this myth is equally vile.
You’re probably considered racist because you’re actually, y’know, a racist