Being a good manager is a lot more than tactical moves. Roberts has built a culture and connection to his players that make it really hard to fire him. All 8 of the teams that need a manager would love to hire him espically those Padres. In the Dodgers case they just need to let Friedmans ipad call the shots in crucial October games.
This is a very big misconception. The computer certainly wouldn’t tell you to use an out of his prime Kershaw as a setup man, pitch Kelly for 2 innings, or not use Kolarek to face soto TWICE.
amk3510 is absolutely correct. Doc’s decisions in game 5 (Kershaw in the 8th and Kelly in the 10th) were clearly his own and contradicted both analytic and common sense.
They managed to lose by star stud Bellinger Not hitting at all. That team is good but didn’t show up to play. Runs were at an all time high throughout the season, not in the playoffs. They gambled with a weak bullpen in hopes the offense would give them enough. Shore up a pin next year they may win it all.
Yes, the Braves failed. They took no step forward this year and lost to a much inferior team. The team will likely fill their many holes with the wrong talent and finish in 4th.
Bum… That sounds identical to what every analyst said last year… And the year before. The Braves won the division both of the last 2 times they were supposed to “finish 4th.” I’ll take that as a good luck sign if not an all around endorsement of the Braves winning the division. They may not win it all next year and that will disappoint a lot of Braves fans. In recent history, the more people that pick the Braves to finish 4th there are, the more likely the Braves are to win the division outright. AA has been open and steadfast in his tactic of making this a marathon and not a race. He is hoping that the more division championships we get long term, the higher statistically we are of winning it all at least once. It may not work but I would rather do that then blow all the future on one single season when we might not win it anyway. The Braves could have front loaded their payroll by over $100 million and spent like the Dodgers this year so they could be favored like the Dodgers were. What would have happened then? They would have been eliminated just like the Dodgers were. Then we would have been outbid it for half a decade because we would have less payroll to spend for the next few years. Build the right core and team so it lasts every year and then add the free agent signees and trades to push one of the several high potential teams over the top.
That is because all these “analysts” are no different from most fans. The team with the biggest offseason is picked to be the favorites. They are as clueless as most fans because baseball is hard to predict.
With that being said, the Braves may not be the same team from 2019 headed to 2020. The Phillies, Mets, and Nationals will not be the same team either (for better or for worse). The Braves need to do work this offseason to allow the core to peak. Acuna, Soroka, and Albies are very young but three players will not win you a championship. They have to build around these players and waiting arbitrarily for it will not help them either. The Braves have major holes to fill and unless they do, there is absolutely no reason to believe they will win the division again. It is still mind-numbing that people are still content with division titles and first-round exits. Trust me, missing the playoffs is no worse than getting embarrassed in the first round every year as the Braves do.
“Build the right core and team so it lasts every year and then add the free agent signees and trades to push one of the several high potential teams over the top.”
This is literally the same **** people say every year. Well, the Braves do have the “right core” so why wait again? All I remember hearing is literally that from management. Well, here we are. One. of the best pitchers in baseball in available in the off season but of course he is to expensive. When a top pitcher is available in a trade, they are too expenisive in terms of prospects. This is preesily the problem with the Braves and your answer why they get embarrassed every year.
No step forward. Did they win more games? Same rhetoric as usual. Want to place a wager that they don’t finish in 4th place. Division was supposed to be much tougher and they had winning records against everyone but the Phillies.
Please tell me you arent one of those Braves fans that’s pinning away for Madison Bumgarner because even though he has shown he isnt the same pitcher he was 3 years ago you some how think he WILL be the same post season pitcher?
Look, I get it, you are still angry. Maybe at some point you will move beyond your emotions and come to more of a position of rationality.
If I told you the Braves should trade/sign for Wainwright, you would have told me exactly the same thing. He is not the same pitcher he was. Some guys perform at a big stage, some don’t. I’m 1000% in favor of the Braves to go get Bumgarner. In fact, he is my priority over Donaldson, whom I already said I’m indifferent to whether he is back or not.
The Braves need to improve the rotation and the two biggest options in the free-agent market are Bumgarner and Wheeler (excluding Cole). I live in NY. I watch Wheeler enough to know the guy is not worth the investment.
Also, with all the knock Bumgarner keeps garnering, statistically Bumgarner would have been the second-best starting pitcher for the Braves this year. That is even more of a reason to want the guy. He is not brought in to be the best, but to anchor the rotation with Soroka and bring postseason experience and fortitude.
What is Faulty’s #1 achillies heel? His mental fortitude. I don’t think he will ever overcome this nor do I care if he does. The more he struggles, the less likely he remains on this team. The Braves are better off without him (and Teheran).
You can’t teach heart and mental strength. Bumgarner brings exactly that. He even said he prefers the Braves as a destination.
I would love to see you post any link that actually quotes MadBum as saying he “prefers the Braves as a destination.” I don’t believe for a second he said that anywhere at anytime. He is from Georgia, so people have speculated he may want to play for the Braves. I would love to have him in Atlanta but I don’t think he would push us over the top. He is a lower 2nd tier pitcher at best at this point in his career.
You would never have caught me telling anyone that the Braves shouldn’t sign Wainwright last off season. He was a 1 year deal with tremendous talent. However, MadBum doesn’t come with the lack of long term risk that Wainwright, Donaldson or even Keuchel did. MadBum will cost a high draft pick plus at least $80 million. 3 years from now he will have an ERA of around 5.00. He won’t be worth his contract then and he will be overcompensated in the meantime. I get what your saying though. BTW… Please stop changing your screename AOGHAU. It seems like you go out of your way to make people angry sometimes and then remember you want to have baseball conversations on this site so you change your name over and over and over again so hopefully people won’t realize you are the sane guy that said what you said before.
I live civil discourse and I will always be here to have a conversation with you no matter what your name is. Unless I suddenly die of a heart attack or something but let’s knock on wood and hope that doesn’t happen. Talk to you tomorrow. Going to bed. Goodnight brother.
First, I couldn’t care less about what anybody thinks of me and two, I’m not trying to hide my identity.
Anyways, why do you assume he will have an era of over 5 suddenly? Are you telling me you are content heading into next year with Soroka, Faulty, Fried, Teheran, and Wright as the rotation next season? That is a very bad rotation but then again, most of the fans are once again okay with getting embarrassed in the post season so their opinions don’t matter.
As for the quote, I’ve read a tweet from Morosi saying that Bum prefers Atlanta as one of his destinations.
I don’t think it will happen suddenly. I said 3 years down the line and the Braves will have to give MadBum at least 4 years. MadBum will likely get $2O mill a year for 4 years. He will be a solid #2 for the first 2 years of that but still well overpaid. In the last year or 2 of the contract I would not be the least bit surprised if his ERA hovers around the 4.90+ vicinity. Paying a 4.90+ ERA pitcher $20+ million a year is just bad business. Keuchel was the oldest pitcher in our rotation this season and by the time MadBums deal will be over he is going to be years older than Keuchel is now. MadBum is historically a great pitcher but even at the age of 30 his best years are behind him. The Braves will have to give up $80 mill or so plus a top draft pick for the right to squeeze the last 2 or 3 productive years MadBum has left out of him. He is past his peak and his addition alone is definitely not equal to an NLCS appearance for any team. Maybe as the #4 pitcher for either the Dodgers or the Nats but those are the only 2 teams that might reach such a level of benefit from a Bumgarner acquisition alone.
The name change thing you do doesn’t bother me in particular but I don’t really understand the reason behind it. I know you say its easy. I believe you but that is not a reason to do anything. It would be easy for me to walk across the street right now but I am not going to do it because there is no point. The only thing I can figure is that you feel very passionate about a particular opinion and you want to make sure other people have to read/acknowledge it just by reading your name. It’s fine with me but you should understand a lot of people will find it annoying. People like to know who they’re conversing with. It’s kind of like talking to someone in real life that magically uses a different face frequently and doesn’t bother to bring up that they are the same person you spoke to yesterday buut with a different face. When people don’t hear a legitimate reason for wanting to change your name they are going to assume you did it to either cover up the identity they felt about you at first impression or just for the attention you want to receive by loudly pointing out your opinion in every post via your name. Do what you want. There is nothing wrong with changing your name 5 times but there is nothing wrong with walking across the street either. If somebody just walked across the street back and forth all day for no apparent reason it would start to put people off and everyone would assume something is wrong with that. Like I said before, I don’t care at all personally but it always seems like there might be some sort of alterior motive. It kind of seems like you do it just to confuse/frustrate other people and you want them to have animosity (or something like that) towards you every time you post which would make it an attention seeking thing. Like it is either an effort to conceal your own identity from your last posts or an effort to get attention. Either way, people tend to look down on folks that use either of those motives. Either way, I’m not going to bother you about it again. You know that people like to know who they are talking to so it kinda seems like you change your name all the time just to make them mad because you frequently want negative discourse or something. In the grand scheme it matters nil though. You do you and if that’s what you like to do then keep doing it. It might help a little if you could make some sense out of it though. Maybe a genuine positive reason you put repeated effort into bothering to do it all might make people respect your opinions and stuff more. I will listen to you regardless but there are clearly a lot of people on this site that are vocally irritated with you and that’s not generally a positive thing unless your main goal is to have that happen everyday for some weird psychological reason or something.
Interesting take how kids of star players probably don’t even really care about money, because their and their kids futures have been spoken for their entire lives.
This is just a speculative point on my part, since I don’t know how Vlad Jr, Bichette, Biggio all feel on the subject. But for many young players who take early-career extensions, they often say that a big factor was being able to lock in that life-changing money to be able to take care of their families, and in some cases lift them out of poverty. That wouldn’t necessarily loom as large in the minds of players coming from wealthier families.
I think the 2nd gen players actually will be more expensive. They are already rich so they can wait out to get the big $. They won’t have to mortgage their future salaries to get their families out of less than desirable situation like Acuna and Albies did. I didn’t know that No Bichette was a 2nd generation player. Who was his Dad in the MLB and who did he play for? Was he good? Between Bichette, Biggio, and Vlad Jr. that has to be some kind of all time record with 3 very impactful 2nd gen rookies on the same team.
Managers put players in position to execute and win. How is it their fault when the reverse happens? 106 wins this year, 7 consecutive division championships, previous “Manager of the Year”, and suddenly he’s incompetent? Get a grip Dodger fans.
Phillies need three Bumgarners; two Rendons (One for 3B and one for 1B) and four Will Smiths.
There ya go. Instant WS winner. Getting back to reality, Klentak will probably sign a bunch of stiffs who are already past their primes and augment those with the usual trashy pickups from other teams’ dumpsters.
With Klentak in charge, I may have more fun if I became a Marlins fan!
Yeah. I was surprised by that as well. Stanton is overpaid but still way better then Hosmer. That would be like the Yankees spending money to get worse. Doesn’t make sense. Maybe Hosmer+$+prospects to any team that would take him. Im sure Baltimore would do it for Chris Davis or maybe even Detroit for Miggy. Stanton? Why would the Yankees do that? Does San Diego all of a sudden have significantly more payroll then the Yanks of all teams? Doubt it.
Sorry but I don’t believe the Dodgers needed Roberts to win 106 games this year, love Roberts but he managed that series terribly!
Dodger fans have high expectations. They expect to win a World Championship every year. There are no guarantees in baseball.
Like the spoiled Red Sox fans…..
7 divisions in a row, you’d think they’d luck into one.
Atlanta says hi.
Not sure why Dodgers fans would expect championships. They have not won one in over 30 years
“But that said, Roberts is obviously a good manager.”
I don’t hate Roberts, but how is he “obviously” a good manager? With that roster all he could really do was not screw things up and he did.
Being a good manager is a lot more than tactical moves. Roberts has built a culture and connection to his players that make it really hard to fire him. All 8 of the teams that need a manager would love to hire him espically those Padres. In the Dodgers case they just need to let Friedmans ipad call the shots in crucial October games.
The ipad already does call the shots, that’s the problem.
This is a very big misconception. The computer certainly wouldn’t tell you to use an out of his prime Kershaw as a setup man, pitch Kelly for 2 innings, or not use Kolarek to face soto TWICE.
amk3510 is absolutely correct. Doc’s decisions in game 5 (Kershaw in the 8th and Kelly in the 10th) were clearly his own and contradicted both analytic and common sense.
They managed to lose by star stud Bellinger Not hitting at all. That team is good but didn’t show up to play. Runs were at an all time high throughout the season, not in the playoffs. They gambled with a weak bullpen in hopes the offense would give them enough. Shore up a pin next year they may win it all.
Josiah Gray for Ken Giles? Dave Dombrowski a Friedman replacement? Whoever thought of these doesn’t follow the Dodgers.
Yes, the Braves failed. They took no step forward this year and lost to a much inferior team. The team will likely fill their many holes with the wrong talent and finish in 4th.
Still jealous I see…
Yes he is.
I like how he says a much Inferior team…lol the cardinals are by no means an inferior team to the braves…point in case they lost the cardinals won
Bum… That sounds identical to what every analyst said last year… And the year before. The Braves won the division both of the last 2 times they were supposed to “finish 4th.” I’ll take that as a good luck sign if not an all around endorsement of the Braves winning the division. They may not win it all next year and that will disappoint a lot of Braves fans. In recent history, the more people that pick the Braves to finish 4th there are, the more likely the Braves are to win the division outright. AA has been open and steadfast in his tactic of making this a marathon and not a race. He is hoping that the more division championships we get long term, the higher statistically we are of winning it all at least once. It may not work but I would rather do that then blow all the future on one single season when we might not win it anyway. The Braves could have front loaded their payroll by over $100 million and spent like the Dodgers this year so they could be favored like the Dodgers were. What would have happened then? They would have been eliminated just like the Dodgers were. Then we would have been outbid it for half a decade because we would have less payroll to spend for the next few years. Build the right core and team so it lasts every year and then add the free agent signees and trades to push one of the several high potential teams over the top.
That is because all these “analysts” are no different from most fans. The team with the biggest offseason is picked to be the favorites. They are as clueless as most fans because baseball is hard to predict.
With that being said, the Braves may not be the same team from 2019 headed to 2020. The Phillies, Mets, and Nationals will not be the same team either (for better or for worse). The Braves need to do work this offseason to allow the core to peak. Acuna, Soroka, and Albies are very young but three players will not win you a championship. They have to build around these players and waiting arbitrarily for it will not help them either. The Braves have major holes to fill and unless they do, there is absolutely no reason to believe they will win the division again. It is still mind-numbing that people are still content with division titles and first-round exits. Trust me, missing the playoffs is no worse than getting embarrassed in the first round every year as the Braves do.
“Build the right core and team so it lasts every year and then add the free agent signees and trades to push one of the several high potential teams over the top.”
This is literally the same **** people say every year. Well, the Braves do have the “right core” so why wait again? All I remember hearing is literally that from management. Well, here we are. One. of the best pitchers in baseball in available in the off season but of course he is to expensive. When a top pitcher is available in a trade, they are too expenisive in terms of prospects. This is preesily the problem with the Braves and your answer why they get embarrassed every year.
Kinda like how clueless you are…
No step forward. Did they win more games? Same rhetoric as usual. Want to place a wager that they don’t finish in 4th place. Division was supposed to be much tougher and they had winning records against everyone but the Phillies.
Please tell me you arent one of those Braves fans that’s pinning away for Madison Bumgarner because even though he has shown he isnt the same pitcher he was 3 years ago you some how think he WILL be the same post season pitcher?
Look, I get it, you are still angry. Maybe at some point you will move beyond your emotions and come to more of a position of rationality.
If I told you the Braves should trade/sign for Wainwright, you would have told me exactly the same thing. He is not the same pitcher he was. Some guys perform at a big stage, some don’t. I’m 1000% in favor of the Braves to go get Bumgarner. In fact, he is my priority over Donaldson, whom I already said I’m indifferent to whether he is back or not.
The Braves need to improve the rotation and the two biggest options in the free-agent market are Bumgarner and Wheeler (excluding Cole). I live in NY. I watch Wheeler enough to know the guy is not worth the investment.
Also, with all the knock Bumgarner keeps garnering, statistically Bumgarner would have been the second-best starting pitcher for the Braves this year. That is even more of a reason to want the guy. He is not brought in to be the best, but to anchor the rotation with Soroka and bring postseason experience and fortitude.
What is Faulty’s #1 achillies heel? His mental fortitude. I don’t think he will ever overcome this nor do I care if he does. The more he struggles, the less likely he remains on this team. The Braves are better off without him (and Teheran).
You can’t teach heart and mental strength. Bumgarner brings exactly that. He even said he prefers the Braves as a destination.
I would love to see you post any link that actually quotes MadBum as saying he “prefers the Braves as a destination.” I don’t believe for a second he said that anywhere at anytime. He is from Georgia, so people have speculated he may want to play for the Braves. I would love to have him in Atlanta but I don’t think he would push us over the top. He is a lower 2nd tier pitcher at best at this point in his career.
You would never have caught me telling anyone that the Braves shouldn’t sign Wainwright last off season. He was a 1 year deal with tremendous talent. However, MadBum doesn’t come with the lack of long term risk that Wainwright, Donaldson or even Keuchel did. MadBum will cost a high draft pick plus at least $80 million. 3 years from now he will have an ERA of around 5.00. He won’t be worth his contract then and he will be overcompensated in the meantime. I get what your saying though. BTW… Please stop changing your screename AOGHAU. It seems like you go out of your way to make people angry sometimes and then remember you want to have baseball conversations on this site so you change your name over and over and over again so hopefully people won’t realize you are the sane guy that said what you said before.
I live civil discourse and I will always be here to have a conversation with you no matter what your name is. Unless I suddenly die of a heart attack or something but let’s knock on wood and hope that doesn’t happen. Talk to you tomorrow. Going to bed. Goodnight brother.
First, I couldn’t care less about what anybody thinks of me and two, I’m not trying to hide my identity.
Anyways, why do you assume he will have an era of over 5 suddenly? Are you telling me you are content heading into next year with Soroka, Faulty, Fried, Teheran, and Wright as the rotation next season? That is a very bad rotation but then again, most of the fans are once again okay with getting embarrassed in the post season so their opinions don’t matter.
As for the quote, I’ve read a tweet from Morosi saying that Bum prefers Atlanta as one of his destinations.
I don’t think it will happen suddenly. I said 3 years down the line and the Braves will have to give MadBum at least 4 years. MadBum will likely get $2O mill a year for 4 years. He will be a solid #2 for the first 2 years of that but still well overpaid. In the last year or 2 of the contract I would not be the least bit surprised if his ERA hovers around the 4.90+ vicinity. Paying a 4.90+ ERA pitcher $20+ million a year is just bad business. Keuchel was the oldest pitcher in our rotation this season and by the time MadBums deal will be over he is going to be years older than Keuchel is now. MadBum is historically a great pitcher but even at the age of 30 his best years are behind him. The Braves will have to give up $80 mill or so plus a top draft pick for the right to squeeze the last 2 or 3 productive years MadBum has left out of him. He is past his peak and his addition alone is definitely not equal to an NLCS appearance for any team. Maybe as the #4 pitcher for either the Dodgers or the Nats but those are the only 2 teams that might reach such a level of benefit from a Bumgarner acquisition alone.
The name change thing you do doesn’t bother me in particular but I don’t really understand the reason behind it. I know you say its easy. I believe you but that is not a reason to do anything. It would be easy for me to walk across the street right now but I am not going to do it because there is no point. The only thing I can figure is that you feel very passionate about a particular opinion and you want to make sure other people have to read/acknowledge it just by reading your name. It’s fine with me but you should understand a lot of people will find it annoying. People like to know who they’re conversing with. It’s kind of like talking to someone in real life that magically uses a different face frequently and doesn’t bother to bring up that they are the same person you spoke to yesterday buut with a different face. When people don’t hear a legitimate reason for wanting to change your name they are going to assume you did it to either cover up the identity they felt about you at first impression or just for the attention you want to receive by loudly pointing out your opinion in every post via your name. Do what you want. There is nothing wrong with changing your name 5 times but there is nothing wrong with walking across the street either. If somebody just walked across the street back and forth all day for no apparent reason it would start to put people off and everyone would assume something is wrong with that. Like I said before, I don’t care at all personally but it always seems like there might be some sort of alterior motive. It kind of seems like you do it just to confuse/frustrate other people and you want them to have animosity (or something like that) towards you every time you post which would make it an attention seeking thing. Like it is either an effort to conceal your own identity from your last posts or an effort to get attention. Either way, people tend to look down on folks that use either of those motives. Either way, I’m not going to bother you about it again. You know that people like to know who they are talking to so it kinda seems like you change your name all the time just to make them mad because you frequently want negative discourse or something. In the grand scheme it matters nil though. You do you and if that’s what you like to do then keep doing it. It might help a little if you could make some sense out of it though. Maybe a genuine positive reason you put repeated effort into bothering to do it all might make people respect your opinions and stuff more. I will listen to you regardless but there are clearly a lot of people on this site that are vocally irritated with you and that’s not generally a positive thing unless your main goal is to have that happen everyday for some weird psychological reason or something.
How come the notice of a chat just got posted to the app 11
minutes ago? Long after the chat was over?
Conspiracy Theory?
Interesting take how kids of star players probably don’t even really care about money, because their and their kids futures have been spoken for their entire lives.
This is just a speculative point on my part, since I don’t know how Vlad Jr, Bichette, Biggio all feel on the subject. But for many young players who take early-career extensions, they often say that a big factor was being able to lock in that life-changing money to be able to take care of their families, and in some cases lift them out of poverty. That wouldn’t necessarily loom as large in the minds of players coming from wealthier families.
I think the 2nd gen players actually will be more expensive. They are already rich so they can wait out to get the big $. They won’t have to mortgage their future salaries to get their families out of less than desirable situation like Acuna and Albies did. I didn’t know that No Bichette was a 2nd generation player. Who was his Dad in the MLB and who did he play for? Was he good? Between Bichette, Biggio, and Vlad Jr. that has to be some kind of all time record with 3 very impactful 2nd gen rookies on the same team.
You’ll start seeing more and more owners and GM’s go after second generation players so they don’t have to pay them as much lol.
Managers put players in position to execute and win. How is it their fault when the reverse happens? 106 wins this year, 7 consecutive division championships, previous “Manager of the Year”, and suddenly he’s incompetent? Get a grip Dodger fans.
dodgers’ fate was written in stone when they were swept by the angels during the regular season.
Phillies need three Bumgarners; two Rendons (One for 3B and one for 1B) and four Will Smiths.
There ya go. Instant WS winner. Getting back to reality, Klentak will probably sign a bunch of stiffs who are already past their primes and augment those with the usual trashy pickups from other teams’ dumpsters.
With Klentak in charge, I may have more fun if I became a Marlins fan!
The Stanton plus cash for hosmer must have been a padres fan
Yeah. I was surprised by that as well. Stanton is overpaid but still way better then Hosmer. That would be like the Yankees spending money to get worse. Doesn’t make sense. Maybe Hosmer+$+prospects to any team that would take him. Im sure Baltimore would do it for Chris Davis or maybe even Detroit for Miggy. Stanton? Why would the Yankees do that? Does San Diego all of a sudden have significantly more payroll then the Yanks of all teams? Doubt it.