The Indians banished right-handers Mike Clevinger and Zach Plesac to their alternate site a week ago after the two broke coronavirus protocols on the road. Clevinger and Plesac have each thrown five-inning sim games over the past couple days as they hope to work their way back, per Zack Meisel of The Athletic.
The Indians will be able to recall either or both of the beleaguered hurlers Monday, though it’s anyone’s guess if that will happen. If it does, there’s a possibility it will cause friction in Cleveland’s locker room. Back when Clevinger and Plesac were caught, some Indians reportedly considered opting out if they immediately rejoined the team, while right-hander Adam Plutko publicly expressed his displeasure with his rotation mates.
Speaking Friday regarding Clevinger and Plesac, president Chris Antonetti said (full statement here, via Meisel), “The team’s readiness to accept them back into the environment is something that we’ll consider.” At the same time, though, Antonetti noted the Indians’ focus is on “how to build the best team and how do we have the best group of guys at the major league level that give us the best chance to win and win a World Series?” He went on to express hope that Clevinger and Plesac have spent the past week “reflecting” on their mistakes and focusing on how to “earn the trust back of the team.”
Looking solely at on-field impact, it’s hard to argue the Indians aren’t a better team with Clevinger and Plesac in the mix. Clevinger has largely offered front-line production since he broke out in 2017, while Plesac – after a decent but unspectacular rookie year – dominated in three starts and 21 innings this season before the Indians demoted him. Among all pitchers who have thrown at least 20 frames, Plesac ranks first in K/BB ratio (12.00), third in BB/9 (0.86) and fourth in ERA (1.29).
Considering Shane Bieber’s status as the best pitcher in the American League and the emergence of Aaron Civale, the contending Indians may be tempted to recall Clevinger and Plesac in hopes of building a super-rotation and making a World Series run. They’re a couple days away from having that option. In the meantime, Triston McKenzie will fill out the Indians’ starting staff after Bieber, Civale, Carlos Carrasco and Plutko, who owns a 6.88 ERA for the season after the Tigers shelled him Friday.
One way or another, Adam Plutko cannot continue to be there. Plutko has been roughly a replacement level pitcher his entire career. They have a lot of talented arms in the player pool. Even if you aren’t ready to bring back one of them, they probably have better starters than Plutko.
Eli Morgan, Scott Moss, and Jean Carlos Mejia are all talented and in the player pool with recent success at high levels. Sam Hentges and Jefry Rodriguez have had more struggles but are on the 40. They have a really strong program of getting the most out of young pitchers like them. I don’t know why they’re continuing to waste time on someone like Adam Plutko.
Be nice to see a lefty in the rotation.
Easy fix. DFA Plutko. He probably made the comments out of jealousy. He’s not near the pitcher even Plesac is.
You can think that Plutko isn’t a great pitcher, but his comments pretty clearly came from a place of camaraderie, not jealousy. They have a teammate in Carrasco who is a recent leukemia survivor, and as such is very high risk for COVID. It’s really selfish to potentially endanger your teammate’s life, going against team protocol along the way, in order to party on the town. They deserved to be publicly scolded, I just wish it was from someone with a little more gravitas than Plutko.
I agree those comments were on behalf of his teammates. Probably also, on a subconscious level, fueled by the fact that he sees these guys who get all these opportunities and so casually blow them. While he feels like he’s had to fight for everything.
They should have DFA’d him in the offseason. Doing so now after those comments, in order to bring back one of those guys… would not be the best look I don’t think. Especially when the team had multiple people threatening to opt out. It’s a precarious situation.
The optics of DFA’ing Plutko at this moment in time are not great. Double so if he is DFA’d for either Clevinger and Plesac. I have no idea what the right call here is and I agree with aspects of both posts above.
Either you put him in the bullpen or you look for a trade because he is out of options. His performance won’t net you much in return…but agree, something has got to give.
The thought of the Indians bringing them back terrifies me as a Twins fan. Falvey has to do something about our pitching.
can you imagine a team with the indians pitching and the twins hitting? unstoppable lol
I’d rather not.
yes. the dodgers.
40% of the Dodgers rotation has a -1.0 WAR. They’re not on Cleveland’s level right now.
Why would any rotation strike fear in Twins fans?
Because great pitching beats great hitting. See ‘95 World Series.
Not necessarily. See every other Braves team in the 90s.
We would be happy to give you Plutko.
Ok Indians its time to try and win again. Message received by Clevinger and Plesac. Lindors departure is fast approaching.
I was watching the game today. Plutko’s second time thru the Tigers lineup went just like the last time he faced them — disaster. I actually turned it off. I can only take so much punishment.
There’s no way this team can continue to run him out there every 5 days. Free Clevinger and Plesac from Lake County nothingness now!
They are playing a dangerous game trying to make a statement by leaving them there. I know they can’t bring them back until Monday, but even thinking of keeping them there longer than necessary is a joke if they want to win.
6-1 without them. Are you watching the same team?
Did you see the mood in the dugout change when Plutko got lit up today?
They appeared to lose all motivation after that.
Now why, just why would they lose it after one pitcher got lit? They are gonna be babies about it despite the fact that a lot of players voiced their opinion about bringing them back?
How should I know? I’m not a psychologist.
Yea, Plutko is a middle reliever right now. He has made his last start this year. One of them will make his next turn in the rotation.
You have to bring them back. Do you want to win or do you wanna make a statement? Oliver perez said he will sit out if they bring them back.. see ya Oliver. They need to work on winning. And if they don’t bring them back up, then I wouldn’t blame them at all if they demand a trade or refuse to sign back with the team when their contract is up.
The team is 6-1 without them. What are you talking about?
Think big picture…..Playoff rotation of Bieber, Clevinger, Civale, Pleasac/Cookie or Bieber, Civale, Cookie, Pluto/McKenzie?? I will take the first group. Lesson learned, if they are serious about winning and contending they must bring them back. If they are more serious about making a statement then they aren’t the group who will be successful leading this team
What if Lindor opts our of the rest of the season because you bring them back?
I give it a 50/50 chance that neither return to the Indians rotation this season. As good as both of them are the team is playing well without them.
Team moral and continuity is part of building a team.
I don’t believe he would opt out, intact I believe he would welcome them back. Because he isn’t a grudge holding type of person. I give it a 90% chance at least one will be activated before Plutko would start again. The other depends on McKenzie’s start. Cleveland may decide to try and trade one to break them up, but it won’t be for a discount. At worst they will want a quality corner outfielder to headline the package.
I give it a 100% chance the Indians don’t get to a World Series this year or next.
They have as good a chance as anyone in baseball, but I see the children want to come run their mouths now. Still jealous that you can’t get either of these 2 for your pathetic rotation? I know you want to pretend you don’t want them but you are obsessed with them and the Indians. You spend your worthless time trolling and dreaming up ridiculous trades, fantasizing they will sign with your team as free agents.
You are assuming those other pitchers are not among those opting out if they are brought back. If Bieber, Santana, and Ramirez opt out (yes, a hypothetical extreme), would Cleveland’s chances be better or worse?
Omg, here we go with the extreme fantasy scenarios. Not one of those guys has said anything publicly or indicated such. The only one that threatened to opt out is Pérez. Plutko has been vocal and Lindor said he was disappointed and had to think about the situation more. The team knows everyone’s feelings, we are guessing. I believe they will accept them back to work towards a World Series because most people want what’s best for the team. Winning cures hurt feelings more than apologies. All the fans from other teams coming up with these end of the world fantasy type situation are either afraid of this pitching staff or trying to deflect from their own teams weaknesses. If they have done what they asked since being sent down, you give them the opportunity to try and make it up to their teammates, you can’t do that if you aren’t playing.
And there it is…
Lindor opts out and I’m sure he loses the year closer to free agency. Plus, he loves the game too much.
Sign back with the team. Good one. It’s either sign a team friendly extension or get traded. Maybe get a qualifying offer.
With all the teams making the playoffs this year and a weak Division, all you need to is be hot by the playoffs. I get that everyone wants to see wins but look at the 2016 indians. They had enough wins to make it in and got hot when it mattered.
Can’t wait to see Plesac’s new YouTube video blasting the organization and demanding a trade if he’s not called up Monday.
Get your popcorn ready.
And of course said video will take place while he’s driving without his seatbelt on again.
If he does that, he is dumber than he has appeared thus far. These players need to realize that NO ONE is irreplaceable. If Clevinger and Plesac never play another big league game, the Indians will continue. The only thing that would be significantly different would be their personal bank accounts. The Indians might struggle for a bit, but they were going to anyway after Lindor leaves for greener pastures. It’s time for those guys to grow up and realize they are nothing but cogs in the machines, they are not the machine.
Cleveland was (reportedly) getting multiple offers for Clevinger before the season started. Could this friction make the FO listen a bit harder? I would not expect them to trade Clev for nothing, but if one of the offers was very close BEFORE this incident … ?
It would have to be a huge deal, likely an overpay though. Fans would be very upset if someone of his talent is dealt for less Than a huge haul.
Those deals are no longer on the table. Aside from teams can only deal from the 60 player pool.
Cleveland is in a lose-lose situation.
They keep them two things happen: you keep them down…..and make them disgruntled…..or you call them up and get to deal with locker room questions with them back til end of the season.
Team’s knowing the indians are in a pickle will offer lesser deals hoping they’ll accept to avoid the situation altogether.
If they deal them for a lesser deal then I’m done. Most of the locker room issue was raise by Oliver perez.. With all due respect, who cares. He’s an average reliever vs calling up two aces. As somone else pointed out lindor is gonna be gone soon, so it’s now or never if they want to try and go for it all.
Winning will cure everything. I bet they won’t be questioning it if they win the central and make a deep playoff push or win it all.
As somone who has grown up living in Cleveland and Texas, I’m tired of them not winning and after the fiasco that was the Rangers off-season, I think I’ll just be done with baseball for awhile if they deal clev just to get rid of him.
I think you might be missing a bit of the point here. It doesn’t have to do with talent, but about players who are being responsible and taking ownership of their actions (which neither of those two did). Perez and Plutko might be lesser talents, they might not even be MLB talent at this point, but they are on the team and are following the guidelines so that the team and league can stay as healthy as possible. I understand that these are, for the most part, dumb kids, but there are plenty of “dumb” kids acting accordingly. If you chose Clevinger and Plesac over Perez and Plutko without first getting the locker room situation under control then you are making a bad decision (for the team and for the league). I am not a Cleveland fan, but I am a fan of how they have so far handled this situation.
Very well said.
I have trust in Indian team president Chris Antonetti to handle the situation in the correct way. I am sure that their will be continued discussions with the team and with Clevinger and Plesac. People due learn from their mistakes. We will see what happens in the next 9-10 days.
Yeah.
But, no.
Look. If I’m putting a team together I could care less if they’re dudes I’d take to a church picnic, or whatever.
These are good players. You *have* to play them.
So you in fact do care if they are good guests at a church picnic or whatever? I am confused. In this time, you have to be concerned about more than pure talent. We are seeing this daily in all sports and in life in general.
@adamontheshore you think players are more upset about a guy who went to dinner vs the return of wife beaters?
THEY ARE NOT GOING ANYWHERE! If you go back and look at the track record of trades (when they traded a player, what they got in return) you will see that they are going absolutely nowhere.
Concentrated winning injected directly into the bloodstream is being tested as a Covid cure.
I don’t agree with the lose lose idea, They are better if both Clevinger and Plesac show remorse and act like the teammates that they pledged to be at the start of the season. If not, there are teams all over the league craving pitching. Teams will try to low bid, but with many teams bidding a good package will be had. I honestly don’t see Plesac traded and Clevinger will only go if it can help the team in 2020 and beyond like the Bauer trade did.
A good package will be had.
A great package would have been had before this fiasco.
Imagine what the Indians could have received for Bauer if he had a better attitude and didn’t show up his manager by chucking the ball over the fence.
Now imagine what Indians could have realistically asked for Clevinger and Plesac before they became PR nightmares.
Them rejoining the big league club will be the ONLY thing the media talks about.
Did you see Brian Kenny grill Antonetti on yesterday’s segment?
Now imagine that happening every day. Players, coaches, and front office being asked that non stop. It’s a PR nightmare.
Any team acquiring them has the “change of scenery” excuse and can promise they will behave better. And if they do behave better the story goes away.
Not the Indians because it’s well documented how what they did impacted the locker room and caused such an issue they had to be optioned with guys threatening to opt out if they were to still be on the team.
But, if they Indians want to let this derail their season go for it.
The Indians knocked the Bauer trade out of the park according to the national media last summer. They received 5 years of a power hitter in Framil Reyes, two lefty pitching prospects, a lotto ticket, and the rental in Puig for a year and a half of Trevor Bauer. That was a great deal for the Indians.
Teams can only deal from 60 man pool? Stros made a trade last week and Cincy got PTBNL. Don’t think he’s in 60 man pool.
The 60 man thing is not really as relevant as it seems because teams can add anyone they want to the 60 man if there is room. All they have to do is add Prospect A, B, & C to the pool and release Lesser Guy A, B, & C from the pool if they need room.
plesac was in total denial of doing anything wrong
He didn’t do anything wrong. There’s nothing wrong with going out to dinner.
Except that every single player on the team had made a commitment to not go out to dinner or engage in other activities leaving you in a situation to be potentially exposed. They both broke their words.
Yea But you have to remember this isn’t the 21st of September in 2017, this is during a pandemic on a shortened season where the rules are different.
Beyond the virus and what you believe about it personally, the team, their employer, and mlb have made rules and guidelines for this season. Both guys violated those guidelines and one lied about it. They absolutely did something wrong. They did something tang jeopardizes their seasons and everyone’s season on the team.
If they went out and one person got exposed, besides the fact that they could have exposed people on their team that are very high risk like cookie or Francona, we have seen how quickly this virus has spread through the card and marlins staff and this could have led to the Indians being shut down for 2 weeks. So you can say they did absolutely nothing wrong by going to dinner, but that is just not the case.
It was wrong. He knew it was wrong. Then he whined when he got caught.
Plesac is as dumb as a rock.
release them!
Yea, Because that makes total sense. Do you want a huge chunk of the fans to abandon the team. Let’s just release two of the best players we have and get nothing back in return for them. Please think about what you say
no fans in seats
Not this year no. But I think alot of fans won’t be as supportive of a team that isn’t trying to put the best team on the field at all times.
At worst you need to trade them but I think even that is stupid. Not to mention clev is a fan favorite.
Meh. Most fans are fans of the team, not of Clevinger or Plesac. The uniform matters far more to most people than the person occupying it. That’s why you can spend years booing a player for one team, but you cheer him if he joins your team.
States the fan from another team!
LAC – Launch Angle Clinic
White Sox
The one thing missing in this whole conversation? No mention of forgiveness, what it really means, and how it can help to move this situation to a conclusion.
No mention of remorse or apology either. So far Plesac has shown the opposite but I have no idea about Clev.
People make mistakes. Mature people own them, apologize, and learn from them. Have these two?
I hope their apologies are better performance than what the trashtros gave.
There’s no reason to apologize for going to dinner
@DTD
You must be working for the Ruskies. Americans protect those around them. Carrasco is high risk.
@DTD_ATL
A willful distortion of the situation.
How do you know what’s gone on behind closed doors, what’s been said to their teammates? Do you have privy to inside locker room info?
I actually do (players/coaches DO live in the area and have friends) have some inside info. MCKenzie was brought up to see if he was ready to be a #4 starter…so they can deal Clev & Plesac. He obviously passed with flying colors.
The problem with this fantasy is he can only fill one spot, not 2. Plutko is done. Antonetti already implied one of the 2 will make the next start. But pretend you know stuff.
Pretend? Haha! Antonetti did NOT say who is starting on Weds. They think that Bieber, Civale, Cookie and McKenzie are four guys they can ride. Although, Cookie is t looking so reliable. They are also looking at other starters (Musgrave is one) to trade for to fill the 5th spot. Nobody said that Plutko isn’t done. I simply stated that my front office friend said that they are more than willing to move them both if the right deal presents itself. Let me ask you this?
Do you think coaches, players and front office guys don’t live normal lives? They have friends and family and talk just like anyone else does. It’s kind of like a teacher, when students see them outside the building, they act like they have no business leading a normal life.
People make mistakes and can grow from it. If they’re truly contrite and promise to not make the same mistake again, I’d welcome them back with open arms. Thus far, neither players have shown that at least publicly. Plesac thought he was in his deleted video but it was a complete fail.
“This isn’t going to be a `run to daddy’ kind of thing. We’re going to handle it in-house. This is a player discipline thing. Keep the coaches, front office kind of out of it,” he said on July 30. “It puts a little extra accountability, kind of. Just having that trust in your teammates is a big thing. It’s a big thing on the field. If you feel your teammate doesn’t trust you off the field how are you going to feel like he trusts you when you get between the lines?”
From Clevinger
So now put yourself in the shoes of one of his teammates would you ever trust this guy again?
Sometimes winning isn’t always the teams with the most talent- chemistry plays a big role.
I could see a deal with the Jays for Clevinger. The front office connections and the talent pool of the Jays in both the majors and minors make a deal possible.
Zero chance of this. Atkins and Shapiro have spent so much time talking about the players learning to become good teammates to trade for either of these Bozo’s would make them the biggest hypocrites ever and send the wrong message to the clubhouse . win at all costs Aka like the Astros.
If the Jays want to win AND build a culture where troubled players can come and straighten out, this is a great idea. Jays in the 90s brought on guys with questionable pasta and made it work. Back then they had a winning culture.
Clevinger’s stock has dropped. Jays need to test the waters. Clevinger is at-worst their #2 if he pitched in Toronto.
Is “questionable pasta” anything like gas station pasta?
Damn. Auto correct on the phone. Phone’s probably hungry. That’s funny. I will like your comment.
Teoscar would get a deal done!
“It’s hard to argue the Indians aren’t a better team with Clevinger and Plesac in the mix.”
What kind of convoluted nonsense is this?
I think a Clevinger desk matches up nicely with Atlanta I feel the rest of this year & 2 more years plus someone else coming back could get Pache and a young arm to go with him.
I think that is fair but I don’t think Brave’s fans would go for it. It does look like what a fair trade is supposed to look like though: both sides walk away unhappy.
As a Braves fan…
If Pache and Anderson could get Clevinger and Plesac I’m 100% on board! AA make the move…I would hate to see Pache go but the Braves still have Waters in the system…Adding Clevinger and Plesac solidifies the rotation with Fried for 2020. Then add Soroka back in 2021 and this 4 headed monster has a legit shot at a World Series.
I doubt Cleveland would trade both. And definitely not in the same package. You would maximize return by selling separately. The only way the front office trades either is if a. They get a great offer b. They believe splitting them up is the best way to go and they receive a decent offer or c. Triston McKenzie throws a gem and they receive a decent offer for one of them
The Braves also have Shewmake who could become Lindor’s replacement…The Braves have the pieces to fill the Indians holes long term and the Indians fill the Braves holes long term. WIN-WIN
Javia- Who really cares? The Indians will not sniff near a World Series this year despite having all these excellent starters and 2 that they’ll never be able to trade. Doesn’t the truth hurt?
Lmao because a 12 year old troll on the internet says so? Grow up!
@Indiansjoe- Lmao, 1948!!! We’re you even born yet?
Nope, but I root for my team. I don’t care about some little kid that can’t make friends so he spends his time on the internet day dreaming because reality is to hard. Don’t care how long it has been, or how long it will be. Every year every team has the same chance as any others. I doubt you were alive when the Yankees won there last. Based on the comments you make, I would say you were born a couple years after the last one. I’m guessing daddy left and all you have is a Yankees hat from him, you cling to it to make you feel loved. Come online and try to make up for it with ridiculous notions and childish come backs. I would feel sorry for you, but there are just to many of you annoying kids out there not being raised right for me to give a dang. But oh well, have a good day being who you pretend to be.
@Indiansjoe- really great comeback. Obviously it’s time to take a nap now, dreaming the Indians will win a World Series. I was there in 1996, 1998, 1999, and 2000 when the Yankees became a dynasty. Then again winning in 2009 and there was nothing like it. Hopefully you get to experience one day what that feels like. Now, I feel sorry for you. But I definitely like the Indians to win a Championship in 2048. lol
Yea, nice google search/ but no way a grown up talks or responds like you
@Yank4Life- I have said it before and you obviously did not understand so I will say it again: I AM NOT AN INDIANS FAN!
“Doesn’t the truth hurt?” You are trying to take shots at someone who could not care less if the Indians ever win a World Series or not!
I am a third party. I have no personal stake in any of these trade outcomes. I am telling you as a neutral observer, YOUR TRADE PROPOSALS COME NOWHERE NEAR EQUAL VALUE OR MEETING THE INDIANS ACTUAL NEEDS! They don’t have any interest in Andujar! They don’t need him! They also do not want your failed prospects like Florial and Garcia.
If you notice the trade proposal made by steelerbravenation, you will see he suggested Pache and a young arm for Clevinger. That is the kind of deal that is in the neighborhood. Cleveland needs young, cheap OF with lots of control. They need high quality for a pitcher of Clevinger’s caliber. Pache is a top 15 prospect. I think Waters could also possibly work. He is a top 30 prospect. And a young arm. That is what Clevinger will cost. And you just keep saying that Jasson Dominguez, THE #57 PROSPECT (nowhere NEAR as good) is off limits? Now…can you see why people don’t have any interest in your trade proposals?
Well said javia
I’d trade 1 of Waters or Pache, 1 of Langaliers or Contreras and any 2 pitching prospects not named Ian Anderson for Clevinger.
Plesac’s track record is shorter, and I’m not a fan of how he’s handled the aftermath here. I wouldn’t send out Pache or Waters for him.
Pache isn’t going anywhere unless it’s for a once in a generation type of talent. Clevinger is really good but with his stock unnecessarily down, there’s no chance of getting a teams number one prospect.
Pache is a good talent but nothing screams at me generational. With that being said he fills a hole in Cleveland they have been looking to fill for quite awhile. Clevinger stock may be low because of his questionable decision but SP on a whole are in high demand. Somebody will bite.
Pache is a up and coming talent, but his offense leaves something to be desired. The Indians are looking for someone who can make contact. I’d want Waters before Pache, although that may be to steep for te Braves, and to that, I wouldn’t fault them.
I could see Waters being in a package before Pache.
Cole is better than Bieber.
Not this season, and it’s not even debatable. Did you look at Bieber’s stat line before you posted?
Cole is no where as consistent as Bieber is at similar stages of their careers.
it was stupid to demote clevinger in the first place good pitcher
Players get cut or suspended all the time for breaking various team rules. This one was a huge violation and the rest of the locker room was livid for good reason.
Clevinger was the one who lied about it and flew with the team even after Plesac got caught.
These guys are in a unique position having to be even more careful than most of us are because they travel regularly and spend time in close proximity. Any slip up can spread through the locker room quickly.
What is it about a pandemic that makes people dumber?
Will the Indians front office give the two knuckleheads a second chance?
Of course they will.
But it was the Indian’s players themselves who banished them to Lake County not just for breaking protocols ,but for breaking trust with them.
Once their teammates are ready to give them that second chance they’ll be back.
100% right. Saved me some typing. Thanks.
Some good thoughts and comments have been posted, but mostly about the fans desire to win at all cost. My solution is to trade both of them, with the hope of getting the best talent they can, and go forward. I’m pretty sure they get get some decent hitters which they desperately need right now, and that is their best chance. I also hope they could get a diamond in the rough starting pitcher by a trade. I have no specific players in mind, but I’m sure they are out there. Only don’t just give them away, but try their best for great and fair choices in return
if they go about this in a way that loses them all their leverage then they are doomed to get a terrible return. what’s the value in that? worst case scenario with keeping them you keep them down in the minors for a year. that actually gives you an extra year of Clev – an extra full year, and Plesac probably doesnt get super two. from the indians perspective you save a lot of money this way and still have the talented hurlers.
Some comments are obviously based on the assumption that the Indians’ front office values their rules over winning. I do not think this is true; Antonetti et al certainly want to win as well – their jobs even depend on it. So banishing Plesac & Clevinger to Lake County is perhaps a move designed to help Cleveland win.
Gruß,
BSHH
OK if yall wanna trade them, then how about call up Texas. Trade whichever player for Lance Lynn. He’s been lights out this year and is under control for cheap next year. Indians get rid of their “problem child”, and Rangers get a pitcher with more control.
Honestly I’d rather not trade either of them, but if they wanna be stupid then go for it.
I wanna hear how fast the locker room changes if their pitching starts to struggle. Look at last night… Have some more games like that and see if they change their mind.
And what happens if it happens in the playoffs… Then what. I understand the idea that you have to make the locker room happy, but if I’m a future free agent, I’m not sure I’d want to come a team that put “making a point” above putting the best possible team on the field
I know they’ve gone 6-1 without them, but I also saw last night, and you can’t tell me you’d rather him go out there vs clev or plesac. I’m just sayin, if they start to slide, then we will see.
Conversely, it’ll be interesting to see the reaction if the two are brought back to the team and then suck…
Bieber better than Cole?
His start has been better, Pedro Martinez good, Nolan Ryan in his prime good. No one is saying he has or will have a better career or season, but to this point he has been the best starting in the league. Only 2 guys in history have more strikeouts through first 6 starts.
No way. Nat King Cole was and is a MUCH better singer than Justin Bieber.
Nat King Cole was also a damn fine piano player.
@trouble- Lmao!!!
Look at a team Like Atalanta for clevinger, they have the pieces in the 60 player pool to get the deal done.
Braves get: Clevinger
Indians get: Drew Waters, William Contreras & a low level pitcher, like Freddy Tarnok or like lottery ticket.
Indians get a top 30 in all of baseball prospect in waters, and a catcher who has shown he can play at the big league level early in this season.
Waters can be your CF next year and Contreras share time with Perez next year. Good value for Clevinger who has 2 years of control left.
lol…no
Shoot, if that was offered, and I’m Antonetti, I’m jumping on that. But I don’t think Clev would fetch that much. I think the Braves would be reluctant to trade Waters straight up for Clev.
A top notch starter even up for a top 30 prospect? SP don’t grow on trees unless those trees are planted in the Indians farm system.
Sold!
They need to regain the teams trust and respect like Crewe had to with his prison friends or how the living legend Falco did. Pain heals.
It’s not as though Clevinger takes many public positions, especially ones concerning morals and ethics, and he doesn’t have much of a social media presence. It seems like he’s very introverted, so it’s a shame this has played out so publicly.
On the other hand, Plutko speaks out of turn often, injecting himself into inconsequential conversations from a position of moral authority, and hypocritically so it seems. I’m not sure why Plutko has so often publicly chastised others while falling so short of his own standards.
Well said. Plutko should talk like a marginal long reliever.
Everyone: What they did was wrong and foolish. They shouldn’t be back in the majors this year.
Also Everyone: Here’s a trade proposal for them for my team.
yep, everyone wants to capitalize on the situation. fine with them breaking protocal as long as they are on their team.
They made a mistake. Everybody does. I think people can learn and grow from those, though. The question is will they?
As for the trade proposals, that’s complex. This wasn’t just Indians management disciplining players for violating team rules. This was players on that team speaking out against these guys. So if you believe guys can learn and change, why not want them on your team? It’s also a good argument for Cleveland to keep them, too, if they can smooth over the chemistry.
I don’t think it’s hypocritical in all cases.
A fair point.
No way that Cleveland team is getting past the Twins with those guys or not. Go Twins!
Yet here they are, 1/2 game behind the twins..
@mattynokes- your 100% correct. Absolutely
If Im Cle Im waiting till the off-season when all this has dyed down-
The need for Sp in the league is at a level like none before-
Cle is one of the smartest FO out there
My prediction – Clevinger to the Angels for Marsh Abrams and Renigfro
Cle always has to re-load and they use Clev to do just that for the OF and Lindors replacement in Luis Renigfro – Its not fair but they excel in the role- Would love to see THIS Cle team with that same mid 90’s payroll
Yeah, let’s wait until the offseason instead of seizing the moment. That’s why Cleveland has not won a WS since 48.
You’re saying renigfro would be the same level of player as lindor? Or are you just saying he could fill in until somone else comes along?
Yall ready now? MacKenzie was brilliant but pluto got bombed again and now cookie gets drilled. Don’t play games call them back up
I will take them
I will give you Kyle blanks Dino little ninja vulnerable Sean Burroughs chase “head case” headley and Jobu