“The Giants have discussed” signing Trevor Bauer, John Shea of the San Francisco Chronicle reports, though this isn’t necessarily indicative of a full-fledged pursuit since “they discuss the top free agents every year.” There are many reasons Bauer would make sense for the Giants, as Shea illustrates in his pros and cons piece, including the point that Bauer might represent a better upgrade than any of the pitching options available in the 2021-22 free agent market.
However, Shea ultimately opines that Bauer wouldn’t be an ideal fit “for a team that’s not close to championship caliber and is waiting for its top prospects to emerge over the next couple of years.” The Giants certainly face an uphill battle in going against the Dodgers and the Padres in their division alone, though since San Francisco has to some extent overachieved over the last two seasons even while overhauling the roster, I would argue that the Giants could position themselves more firmly into the wild card hunt with some pitching upgrades, and Bauer would certainly qualify in that regard. For what it’s worth, Bauer’s most recent YouTube video listed Giants fans fourth on his list of the fanbases that have done the best job of trying to sell him on joining their team.
More from the NL West…
- The bulk of the Diamondbacks’ talks with other teams has focused on pitching, with rival clubs showing interest in Arizona’s starters. The D’Backs have something of a surplus of rotation options on paper, with a projected starting five of Madison Bumgarner, Zac Gallen, Luke Weaver, Caleb Smith, Merrill Kelly ahead of other potential depth arms like Taylor Clarke, Alex Young or prospect Corbin Martin. Speaking to MLB.com’s Steve Gilbert and other reporters, D’Backs general manager Mike Hazen said “I think we have to be in a position to listen to what people have to say” in terms of trade offers, though “I think we’re somewhat reluctant to talk about pitching, just because of our feeling on the amount of pitching we’re going to need.” Kelly is the most obvious question mark since he underwent thoracic outlet syndrome surgery in September, though the right-hander was very pleased with his recovery process as of November. Beyond Kelly, Bumgarner and Weaver each struggled last season, and while the Diamondbacks are hopeful both can bounce back, the club would surely like to have more depth on hand just in case.
- What would Nolan Arenado earn if he was a free agent this winter? ESPN.com’s Buster Olney (subscription required) floated the question to some evaluators in the wake of Arenado’s disappointing 2020 season, and the results were still pretty strong — a deal worth somewhere between $100MM-$125MM. This offers some idea that Arenado’s 2020 numbers “will likely be treated as an outlier by any interested teams” in trade talks, but also of how much of Arenado’s actual contract (six years and $199MM remaining, with an opt-out after the 2021 season) the Rockies could be asked to cover to accommodate a deal. It just adds another layer of difficulty to any possibility that Arenado could be traded this offseason, since it seems unlikely that the Rox would be okay with eating that much money to move a player they surely consider a prize trade asset.
Get rid of the softball players
Woe to be a rockies fan.
Only two assets(story,marquez) to help this epic rebuild.
Poor farm system.
Arrenado contract is an anvil around team’s neck.going to be a while just to get back to the surface.
Bauer going to Angels if not they should just trade Trout because they are not trying to win for him.
I wouldn’t hold my breath waiting for the Angels to sign Bauer…
Angels biggest problem has always been not opening the wallet for some pitchers
The owner is a poor judge of talent and his GMs have to beg to spend money. He wanted Pujols, Hamilton and Matthews among others. They will not sign Bauer or any other other “A” free agent. He also will not work with Scott Boras because he thinks that Boras duped him 10+ yrs ago over Texiera. I think that with Dombrowski running the Phils he will build for Trout and Trout will demand to be traded there within 3 years.
Maybe we can finally see Harper and Trout in the same team!
Chief Two Hands
Is that something we are supposed to care about? Harper is heavily overrated.
And 25 other players at major league minimum to stay to payroll.
Another myopic Phillie fan
@old ranger. Wow! you definitely have the inside scoop on the Angels huh. You know soo much. You know the owner’s personality, you know the GM’s tactics (they sure had to beg to get that Rendon or Upton contract), you can predict the future, you know the feud with Boras & Moreno. And you also know the Phillies & Dombrowski’s future moves. I’m surprised some front office hasn’t hired you yet with all that knowledge you have. Surely some team in the AL West could use your expertise on the Angels. Hahahhaha the Trolls that hop on the comments to bash on the Angels never cease to amaze me on the stupidity of their comments. They literally do not follow the team one bit yet they are “experts” on what’s going on behind the scenes lolol.
Youre right. You have no clue who I am but I live in Newport Beach and have been an Angels fan and season ticket holder for many many years. Now I’m associated with the Angels on a much different capacity. You should recognize that you’re the troll and have just made a total ass of yourself. .
There are other options besides Bauer.
If it were me I’d trade for a Marquez or Carrasco type then sign a tier 2 FA starter like Odorizzi to a 3 year deal. Sign another RP like Treinen and a C like Casali or Ramos.
Bauer has publicly said that he wants to be a Dodger. He’s from LA, so I imagine he is going to play in California somewhere, probably for whichever west coast team is willing to open its wallet.
And Patrick Corbin will sign with the Yankees cuz he’s from NY. And Zack Wheeler will sign with the Braves cuz he’s from Georgia. And Gerrit Cole will sign with the Angels cuz he’s from OC. And Stephen Strasburg will sign with the Padres cuz he’s from San Diego. Oh wait…
Don’t forget that Rendon is from Texas lmao.
To be fair, a lot of these players probably would have signed with these teams if the price was right. I know that both the Angels and the Padres were unwilling to match contracts with what Strasburg and Cole got from their teams. Players usually just go to whomever offers them the most money.
@dan55 so will Bauer
So what you’re saying is they will sign with the team paying the most money.
Hopefully, Bauer will sign with the LAA, SFG, or AZ. He’s fun to watch and it would be nice if the West is more competitive-either NL or AL. I just hope LAD doesn’t sign him. As good as he has been in ‘18 $ ‘20, LAD don’t need SP depth and his personality is too much of a wild card to add to the clubhouse. Re-sign JT,Kike, and McGee and move forward with what they have.
Bauer started in AZ and they ran him out with overspin. He drove them nuts.
the guy has proven himself to be disruptive and a distraction. a lot of teams don’t want that, even with a 1.73 ERA…
After the Pujols anvil contract is over—- if the Angles aren’t going to obtain some other impact players such as Bauer, plus enough other impact players to make a strong World Series run—- they should trade Trout. Both for his benefit and theirs.
But who knows——-Maybe Trout isn’t interest in being traded. Maybe he’s perfectly happy with the Angles. Happy enough that a definite shot at a World Series ring isn’t as important as staying with the Angels.
Trout isn’t interested in being traded. He already knew or should have known that the team was hosed when he signed his second extension two years ago. Nothing has changed since then.
Arenado isn’t their best position player and Marquez isn’t their best pitcher, and since both make big money neither are their best assets. There’s more there than you think. They have to deal with a huge, unique handicap, and have an incompetent front office. But the talent is real (90 wins just a couple years ago).
Marquez is easily their best pitcher and might be their best trade chip. Super underrated since he plays in Coors. 86 ERA- and 84 FIP- since 2017 which is compareable to Lance Lynn, Sonny Gray, Eduardo Rodriguez. He isn’t making big money either. He’s guarenteed less than $35 million across the next three seasons. He also averages about 3.3 fWAR/150 innings pitched. If he can get out of Coors Field, he’ll pitch like an ace. He honestly could be one of the most valuable trade chips on the market.
Marquez is a great trade chip. Contract comparable to Snell’s but more consistent in total innings. If available he’s 1A on the market.
I’d love for the Angels to snag him.
Marquez for Marsh or Detmers + another top 6-15 ranked Angel prospect?
He’s not a trade chip. You can tell you guys aren’t rockies fans. The one thing the Rockies ALWAYS needs is pitching can’t trade Marquez now
Do you really think they are capable of anything close to 90 wins? Why even mention it?
They’d need 2 guys to have massive rebounds and to find a bullpen. They got too married to their core, overextended themselves when paired with bad FA deals, and now are really in a bind. They probably need to eat money to move most guys and idk how this FO will do with that
Hard to win 90 given the improvement in that division by certain teams. Good time for Colorado to reset.
Trading for Nolan Arenaldo could be the only move the Cardinals could make which would make the Cardinals a World Series contender in 2021. ( Of course—- that is providing Molina and Wainwright are resigned).
That contract will be an albatross within 2 seasons
You’re hilarious. Who’s your team?
The ONLY reason Nolan’s contract is an “anvil” is the opt-out possibility after this coming season.
Absolutely. The opt-out means the contract is guaranteed to be underwater after the opt-out date.
Holy hell Jim stop with the bs claims. There’s no way ANYTHING is GUARANTEED about value of a contract for the next 5 years, because an opt out decision was made
And especially when your logic is “look at the past guys!!!”
You have NO WAY OF KNOWING THIS. Stop pretending you can see the future. Your logic is flawed. Stop repeating this bs like it’s fact and calling others wrong in the process.
No. Not James Shields Not Jaimie Moyer not JDM not Stanton not Andrus. None of them. They have ZERO bearing on what 31-35 year old Nolan Arenado will produce.
Further NONE of them had the public front office issues that are a factor with Nolan. They ONLY decided based on their playing talent at the time. Just stop with your messiah crap
I don’t think that’s the *only* reason it’s an anvil.
He’s about to turn 30 and still owed 200 million. No way he opts out, he’ll never get that money again. No thanks. Bad contract.
No he’s not Cosmo. Rest of the deal is 32M aav for 5 years at time of the opt out. He has to top about 160M at the time of the opt out. The deal was front loaded at least in part because he didn’t trust the Rockies FO
Apparently you think Arenado makes 40m a year
Do facts even matter to people anymore? Or just narrative?
Trevor Bauer teased fans yet again last night on his Youtube channel and I find it hilarious: youtube.com/watch?v=I7Fzpx_8Xm8
He is probably my favorite player in the entire game right now because of just how energetic and creative he is at marketing the game.
And tbh, I either want him to go to the Mets or Giants. I’d love either one.
(Yes, I’d love him to come to Texas… but it won’t happen lmao)
My gut told me to choose him for SF in the contest.
The Jays got framed by multiple teams in his top 5 hahahah. He likes those ones.
You must have read this SI feature on him? If not, enjoy:
Man, I haven’t read that, but I have watched his channel for years and I’ve seen all of his endeavors on a first hand account.
I will bookmark the article and read it tomorrow for sure because I’d like to read more about him, but that is an awfully long article lol. Trust me, I will read it though.
No way the Rangers would sign him. Good pitcher tho.
The Angels don’t need Bauer. He would definitely improve the team, but the cost might be too much. They would be much better off devoting their resources to fixing the bullpen and bringing in lower-cost starters as depth options.
While a rotation of Bundy, Heaney, Canning, Barria and potentially Ohtani isn’t bad, getting a rotation anchor like Bauer would really help them. Maybe sign Bauer then get another relief pitcher or two. Iglesiaes was a step in the right direction.
Hey mlb1225, what are your favorite stats to use for pitchers and hitters?
For pitchers, I like looking at the base line ERA/FIP/WHIP which for me is like a pitcher triple-slash line. Kind of gives you an idea of what the pitcher is good at and not good at on the surface. But really anything like SIERA, xFIP, DRA on baseball prospectus are also good to look to me. I also like any of the stats on Baseball Savant.
For hitters, aside from the traditional triple-slash, definitley OPS, wRC+ and wOBA. Other stats on Savant like their expected stats, exit velocity and hard hit rate are good.
In a ranking system I would put for pitchers, DRA, SIERA, Savant’s expected stats, batted ball data (hard hit rate, exit velo, GB/FB rates), xFIP, FIP, WHIP and ERA as the most important to me to least important. For batters, wRC+, wOBA, expected stats, batted ball data, then the classic triple-slash as my most important to least important on stats I put weight in.
Then ovbisosuly, for more historic trends or enviroments that heavily affect outcomes, especially for pitchers, stuff like ERA+, ERA- and FIP- are my go to stats for that. Like when I was talking about Marquez earlier. He might not have the prettiest ERA on the surface, but has a solid ERA+ (119) and ERA- (86).
Cool, thanks. These are all the stats that I am at least looking at for my write-ups (pitchers): WPA, all the per 9’s, LD%, FIP. xFIP, SIERA, and then savant data. I’m essentially trying to find out if the pitcher has control, gets strikeouts, or gives up hard contact.
BTW, I was looking at Jose Urquidy’s stats as maybe I guy I could include in my write-up about predicting good performances of 2021. Let’s just say that almost all the stats hate him lmao. Stats don’t seem to like the soft contact, no strikeout type pitchers.
I’ve noticed that as well. Many stats like the high-strikeout pitchers, but that makes sense. No ball in play=no room for error. If you are projecting players, I have found that Baseball Savant’s expected stats are the best for low-strikeout, soft contact type pitchers. They take batted ball data into account more than any other stats. Also can you link one of your write-ups? I’d like to read one.
I’m still writing the first one. I’ve got the list of the guys I’ll include on it, but over this past week between school and the work I’ve been doing, I’ve gotten minimal work done on it. Our semester ends next week so after that I’ll probably finish it.
Though trust me, I’ll send it to you once I finish it. It’s gonna be yuuuge.
BTW, Sixto Sanchez is 1000% gonna feature on my list, here’s a link to a really insightful video on Sanchez that also talks about his… umm… tell…. He doesn’t tip his pitches, but he does several things differently between off-speed and fastballs that can be uncovered if you look close enough.
The link: youtube.com/watch?v=ZUqO_Xqr4rc
mlb1225: I’m sort of in agreement with you re the rotation. I believe that Barria’s got some untapped potential and could be a solid #2 starter.
They need a really good pitcher at the top of that rotation.
So continue doing what they’ve done for the last 10 years? Lol. Not saying Bauer is the solution but the Angels haven’t spent any money on pitching other than Ohtani and they’ve made the playoffs one time in Trout’s career… time to spend some money on that rotation
yeah they already have so many elite starters right?
I’m not saying that the Angels would be better off without Bauer. Obviously, Bauer would make the rotation a lot better, and it would be great if he could start a playoff game. However, this Angels roster has a lot of holes to fill, and the Angels reportedly only have around $25 million left in their budget(based on comments made by their owner at the start of free agency). Blowing the rest of their budget on Bauer isn’t going to help them if they still need a catcher, a third outfielder, and more bullpen arms.
If the Angels could sign Bauer and still have money to address the rest of their needs then I would be all for that option. However, I don’t think they will have the budget to do that.
I’m with you Dan. Bauer significantly increases the chances of winning once through the rotation. IF the bullpen holds his leads.
But let’s say the Angels take that same money and get 2 starters and 2 bullpen pieces and we increase the odds of winning every night.
I think realistically we could get Carrasco out of Cleveland, sign a Happ type, and add 2 solid bullpen arms on the Melancon/O’day/Wilson level.
No true ace but good enough to compete every night and hold leads consistently.
For position players, I think that the Angels will sign a backup catcher like Suzuki/Castro, and a third outfielder like Schwarber to serve as a bridge until Adell/Marsh are ready or could potentially play first if Walsh’s breakout was just a 32 game fluke.
On the pitcher side, I think they need another top-end reliever to pair with Iglesias like Hand or Rosenthal, and maybe a couple of lower-end guys like Melancon/O’day. And then they would need a couple starters. Carrasco would be nice, but I don’t know what his price is and the Angels don’t have a great farm system. I agree they will probably target Happ, and maybe have a reunion with Garrett Richards.
Well then it looks like arte should open the budget even more if he wants to win. You can absolutely get anyone out of Cleveland, they have shown time and time again that for the right package they will trade almost anyone. Yet, He won’t go over a self imposed budget to get what he needs most? Won’t release some decent prospects? When’s the last time arte made a blockbuster, I mean massive, huge, trade? Where he actually gave something of value up? You can’t give away peanuts and expect a Gem. Makes no sense. He might have to cross the threshold if he wants to win, after this year 30mm comes off the books, so why be cheap over one year of tax?
Sign at least one started(2 better obviously) and some pen help. The pen help will be far cheaper this year than seasons past.
Screw it, he throws dumb money at everyone that plays a position, what’s the difference?
For the record I actually like arte, as moronic as his choices may be at times, he has good intentions, most teams would love to have an owner who spends. Spare me the he doesn’t spend wisely comments, we already know. However, it doesn’t change the fact he always pumps out a decent payroll and has good intentions. If you live in Baltimore, Oakland, Pittsburg, etc, you would love to have an owner like that.
Rockies with no leverage. Imagine that. It didn’t take long for some to doubt if Arenado really is the best 3B in baseball. If he is, this is a no-brainer for several teams with money needing a 3B.
That said I think the Blue Jays should test the waters and leak to the media that they are interested. They are off their pace from last week.
Nolan’s numbers will drop quite a bit if he left the hitter friendly park
Like how DJ LeMahieu’s did?
Different style hitter. Lemahieu has always been a line drive hitter.
DJ is helped immensely by Yankee Stadium too. Not sure if it’s natural or he took advantage of it.
I big time disagree Schwarber, he’s still be 300 hitter anywhere else. Yankee stadium hurts his avg if anything cause it’s tiny. As for Power? For sure he’s helped, he hits some real short home runs that wouldn’t leave most other parks. I will give you that. But when it comes to average he won a batting title in two leagues bro, let that sink in a second…..,.
His avg was sick in the East which have small parks besides Toronto. NY, Balt, Bos, all small stadiums with smaller gaps. So he hit better if anything. Was actually a handicap imo.
To your defense, yes his power was helped a lot. I agree there, but not on BA.
There are a number of stats that adjust a player’s numbers for a variety of factors, including park factors, and all of them say that Arenado is a great hitter.
Regarding wRC+, he was 11th best 3B in MLB in 2019 and 18th best 3B in 2020. Not elite at all, and not worth the contract. Rockies will have to eat at least half the contract if they want anything in for return.
@mlbdodgerfan2015 – that’s not fair. Arenado is the best defensive third baseman in the entire league. His offensive ability is really good, but his main accomplishment is his defense. His contract might be a slight overpay at this point in time, but the Rockies don’t need to eat half the contract.
It’s in response to the comment above him.
Did you see what MLB execs said he’d make? That’s about 1/2 what he’s signed for.
Matt Chapman is the best defensive 3rd baseman. Year in and out he beats Arenado in most measurements at 3rd. But yeah Arenado is still great defensively. Regardless, I don’t see anyway he’s dealt this offseason unless the Rox eat $50 million minimum, and they wouldn’t do that.
Bush I agree …. to your point, I think Chapman may have a slight edge on defense. I still think Arenado is the best or 2nd best defensive third out there. I didn’t look it up but I’d think Nolan has more attempts since the pitching is that poor. As for Chapman, I think his ceiling is higher than Nolan’s on that side of the ball. Seems a bit quicker on his feet. Chapman’s the only guy I can even put in the same sentence. My knock on Chapman isn’t his defense, it’s his junk bat. Too bad chapman never hit 30 til they juiced the ball and he can’t hit year in and year out.
Imo Chapman has one good season on offense which is an outlier. His defense is all world though. I always give it to him on that front, you have to. Crazy to think they went to the same high school. That coach either got super lucky, or he knows something about fielding nobody else on the planet knows.
Yeah offensively Arenado for sure wins, but I don’t even think it’s that close if you study the metrics between the two. Chapman’s range is so much greater, and he’s better at every other aspect as well. Chapman is probably the best defender in all of baseball though. Just compare their WAR numbers in recent years. Chapman buries him.
*between the 2 defensively
Nolan’s splits away from Coors are concerning. I’d want no part of him because his contract is an albatross AND the Rockies would want some talent coming back bc they’ll already be crucified by the fanbase for moving him. Gray or Marquez are better values for the team to consider trading. They need a rebuild, but I’m not sure they will readily admit that because they want to continue to pretend that if everything breaks in their favor they could have a shot at a WC. They won’t, but that is what the team has been pushing the last few years.
I think 125 is low. Just like most trade teams would look at 2020 has an outlier, most freezing teams would as well
I think once Springer JTR and Bauer sign, that number would be higher. Stars will still be paid imo. And Arenado is a star
I do think that the D-backs should try to package one or two of their many young starters for a decent offensive player. Obviously they will use their surplus of starters to fill out the bullpen but they have Corbin Smith, Alex Young, Jon Duplantier, Taylor Clarke, Taylor Widener, Riley Smith, among others in the high minors.
Arenado and Colorado are going to have to live with one another. With the opt out and his horrible 2020, there are just too many variables.
That depends on how bad Arenado wants to leave and how bad Colorado wants to clear some of his salary off the books. If Arenado agrees to amend his contract to remove the Opt out (he’d obviously would have to fully agree on location in order to waive his opt out) and Colorado eats enough of his salary, they could easily move him.
Well yeah, if they eat $50 million plus they may be able to deal him. But I can’t imagine they’d do that at this point. I don’t think his opt out is even a factor, as I can’t imagine him getting more money at his age, and all the wear he has playing in Col.
And actually if they did hold on to Nolan and he does opt out (only because he’s so unhappy on the Rox) in the future that would be better than sending massive money to another team.
I agree. I think him opting out would actually be a near best case scenario for the Rockies.
Right, everyone keeps assuming he opts out. I think it’s almost a certainty he doesn’t. I agree the Rockies would love it if he did opt out, because he certainly doesn’t have any trade value without major money eaten by the Rox.
I grew up in the 50’s and 60’s. I saw the best of that era, I love the Padres but they are missing one thing to pass the Dodgers, GUTS. They need to play with the Caminiti swagger.
Are you suggesting they use steroids?
As long as they dont get caught
Seems other teams have the steroid problem. Padres need the swagger, the attitude of a winner. Not the steroid losers.
I think right now unless Arenado has some sort of historical season and perhaps wins the MVP. That it would be a mistake to opt out considering long-term effects on the economic system of MLB from tye pandemic. And if we are still in a shut down it will still affect that market. Id say right now he may have one of the best contracts and situations along with Harper Machado and Gerrit Cole.
IMO there virtually no chance he opts out and if I’m a team wanting to make a trade but worried about the opt out I would still make the trade. Because I don’t see him doing better than 6 years and 199 million dollars with the current economics.
unless ARI can get someone to take MadBum off their hands or gets a strong healthy-caliber offer for Kelly then they shouldn’t move anyone.
how about we call them the New Amsterdam Yankees?
I think that Toronto should change its team name to the Seagulls in honor of the bird that Dave Winfield murdered.
(And yes, that’s sarcasm)
I’m still unsure what the infatuation is with Trevor Bauer. He’s like the girl in a small town who looks like a ten, but when she moves to the big city, she’s more of a 6.
Bauer, perhaps more than anyone, benefitted from a shortened season. His career splits on first half vs. second half are not friendly to him, as he has historically gotten worse (much worse) as the season goes on.
His 2019 1st vs. 2nd half splits were as yucky as they come, and his 2020 numbers put bauer high on the list of potential regression candidates.
Frankly, there are a lot of buyers beware issues with Bauer. I’d rather the Giants go for someone like Jake Odorizzi.
Surprised there isn’t a bigger buzz about Bauer possibly going to the Dodgers on a short-term/high annual value contract. (One year for $35M?) He has expressed his desire to play for LA and to accept a short-term deal. And Dodgers could move Price and/or Gonsolin to make room.
Rickey, this is a good point, although I will say it could be more likely that Zaidi does a short-term/high AAV deal with Bauer than the Dodgers. A lot of money drops off the Giants’ payroll after this year, including Cueto (if he isn’t moved sooner), and I could see Zaidi buying a short-term rotation while the farm system pitching comes aboard in ’23-24.
that doesn’t make sense though – SF would only sign bauer to a 3+ year deal – a 1 or 2 year deal doesn’t make sense as it helps this year but really helps to have someone at the top of the rotation in 2022 and beyond where you no longer have gausman, cueto and are going to be relying on signings and young guys that recently or haven’t yet come up. you can maybe project beede and webb along with hjele but it is really a lot of question marks
Wolf, understood. I never said a 1-2 year deal. I was thinking a 3-year deal to get them to 2023-2024. You’re right they have nothing for 2022-2023 now except the “maybe’s” of Webb and Beede, and whoever the next Pomeranz will be at that time. They do have several unknowns like Hjelle, Corry, Beck, and Harrison to name a few, but none of them could be counted on to log significant rotation innings for that timeframe until we see how they do in ’21.
Why do you assume Gausman will be gone in 2022? There is still plenty of time to tear up the QO contract and sign him to a longer deal. It’s something both sides have said they hope to make happen. I think it will, and he’ll be with the Giants for another 3 or 4 years.
The idea that so many think Arenados opt out is a problem is laughable. He’s NOT opting out. No one is giving a guy on the wrong side of 30 more money than he’s already owed. To think otherwise is a ridiculous delusion.
A 29 year old signing for more than 160M as the top player at his position in the market, and arguably at least top 5 in the game?
You’re delusional to think he cannot earn 160M after age 29 as a free agent