April 29: The Athletic’s Zach Buchanan spoke with PBL president Michael Shapiro about the league’s new rules for the 2021 season. It’s an interesting look at the reasoning behind the radical adoption of the “Knock Out” tactic, which was engineered without running the idea by Major League Baseball. “We didn’t get MLB approval, nor did we ask for it,” Shapiro tells Buchanan.
Shapiro details some of the challenges that lengthy extra-innings affairs present to an independent league: the cost of keeping a park staffed and lit late into the night, the difficulty of teams finding professional quality players able to report to Montana, Idaho and other less-populated areas on short notice to lessen the toll on an overtaxed bullpen, etc.
Buchanan and other Athletic writers surveyed players and staffers around MLB for their own reaction to the changes. Hunter Pence, Willie Calhoun, David Bell, Paul Goldschmidt and Terry Francona all weighed in. The column is a terrific read and well worth a look for those who are interested in the motivation behind the changes and some reaction from those within the sport.
April 27: The Pioneer Baseball League, one of several independent leagues designated this past offseason as an official “Partner League” of Major League Baseball, announced this morning that it will install a series of rule changes for the upcoming 2021 season. The PBL will test out the usage of designated pinch-hitters and pinch-runners, and on a larger scale, the use of a sudden-death “Knock Out” format to resolve games that end in nine-inning ties (i.e., a home run derby format supplanting the traditional extra-inning format). They’ll also change the appeal process on check swings.
Per the PBL’s release, the “Knock Out” format is being implemented “to avoid excessive strain” on pitching staffs. In this new format, each team would designate one player to receive five pitches in a “sudden death home run duel.” (The release does not specify who would be throwing the pitches.) If the initial “Knock Out” round ends in a tie, each team would then designate a second hitter to compete in a five-pitch showdown. This will continue until a winner can be declared.
The designated pinch-hitter and pinch-runner function in identical fashion to one another. A bench player who has not previously entered the game can either pinch-hit or pinch-run for “an eligible roster player who may then return to his defensive position for the remainder of the game, until otherwise substituted for.” Any player used as a designated pinch-hitter or pinch-runner is “thereafter ineligible to return to the game.” Both measures can be utilized only once per game, per team.
The PBL is also implementing a new “Check Swing” rule which allows the hitter to appeal to a base umpire on a check-swing decision made by the home plate umpire. Previously, that right has only been granted to the home plate ump or the catcher.
As with all experimental rule changes, be they in the minor leagues or in one of MLB’s newly designated “Partner Leagues,” the fact that such measures are being tested out does not make it a foregone conclusion that we’ll see them in Major League Baseball anytime soon — or ever at all. The current runner-on-second rule for extra-inning play is still a polarizing one, at best, and it’s not yet clear whether it’ll be implemented for the long haul or go down as a short-lived relic of the seasons which were directly impacted by the pandemic.
The Atlantic League, another new Partner League of MLB, is also planning to experiment with some changes during the 2021 season, including a “double hook” designated hitter rule and a move of the pitching rubber to a distance of 61 feet, six inches. (You can read more about those experiments and see how MLBTR readers voted in a poll on their merits here.) Those changes, unlike today’s PBL changes, were formally announced by Major League Baseball, indicating that they’re under more immediate consideration. MLB will surely keep a close eye on how things play out in the PBL, of course, but the distinction between the manner in which the two announcements came out ought to be noted.
As with the Atlantic League experiments, I’ll include a poll for each of the new rules so readers and commenters can weigh in on whether they’re in favor of the new formats.
(Link to Knock Out poll for iOS/Android app users) (Link to poll) (Link to poll) (Link to poll)
Interesting how the votes are turning out and dramatically one-sided. It’s actually surprising to me that so many fans prefer a more traditional style to the game.
Perhaps that’s an indication that fans are becoming frustrated with the constant tweaking of a product that, quite frankly, doesn’t need it.
I think the game needs to evolve a bit but these rules are the most gimmicky things I ever heard.
Completely with you, Joe. Sure, we need more balls in play, less Ks & HRs, but the rules mentioned in this article are absurd gimmicks that turn the game into a pinball joke. I already hate the HR Derby and refuse to watch it. Putting that and some of the other rules mentioned above into the game will push me away from MLB permanently.
Why do you hate home runs? The single hardest thing to do in any team sport is to hit a round ball going 90+ mph with a round bat a long way. You’d rather they hit the ball a…shorter way? Weirdo.
That is a loaded question. No one hates home runs. What they hate is 150 strikeouts a year being accepted as the new normal with a .230 batting average just to get extra home runs. If Jeter came up playing today no one would care he could hit over .300 if he only hit 15 home runs.
Emphasis on home runs leads to more strikeouts, fewer total hits, and less team play..
A’sfaninUK,
Your view of baseball appears to be somewhat unsophisticated, and lacks any appreciation for the nuances of the game. That’s a shame.
Yeah it’s a tough situation. Baseball is boring at its core and needs help I think. But I don’t think this is the answer.
It’s all males over 40, who are the last people MLB needs to listen to to get itself back on track.
I think you may never have tuned in to the beauty of balls in play, whereby you can see defensive players making incredible plays, where runners are in motion, and there are split second plays on the bases and home plate. I don’t “hate” home runs, but as BlackAce57 states, many of us are sick of seeing strikeouts, HRs and walks as the three likely outcomes. Baseball is so much more than that.
Well stated. I 100% agree.
Why are you such an ageist? Why are you so against experience and wisdom? In the comments above, I saw you claiming someone was attacking you and resorting to personal attacks, but looking at the comments it is you who engages in that behavior. Accept that people have opinions different than yours and their opinion may be as valid, if not more so, as yours..
Crybully….it’s a common tactic. Dude is either a perfect stereotype or a pretty good troll.
Why?
Pretty sure, A’sfaninUK, I’m in my mid 20s not my 40s. Don’t see what age has to do with anything. If you can’t make a logical argument and have to do ad hominem attacks on long time fans not having “valid” opinions due to their age then your stance isn’t that good in the first place.
I think it’s time with all these constant changes and new rules that the MLB just go all the way and change the game from baseball to blernsball like in Futurama. It’s a joke what they are doing to one of the oldest sports in America.
Or, they could change it to BASEketball, like the movie. I sadly feel that in many ways, that’s the direction that the game is headed with some of these rules.
I am. Traditional is best.. hate all the crap they are doing and ditch instant replay
Every other sport has instant replay.
It could also be that MLBTR visitors are mostly traditionalists. I only watch games on DVR and I buzz through them. Watching a full game bores me.
It mostly has to do with how old the average person who views this site is.
Want to ‘fix’ the length of time for the game?
-Do not let the batter wander around to collect their thoughts and re-tighten their gloves for 4 hours between at bats.
-Stop the pitcher from wandering the mound after each pitch and running through signs for four hours between pitches (this actually may help pitchers also stay healthier if they are pitching at a more frequent rate during a game).
-Limit the number of foul contacts by a batter in an at bat to 4 (In other words you foul off a fifth pitch and you are out, Like when you bunt foul with two strikes)
Seriously, just screw this commissioner.
Commissioner has nothing to do with these rule changes. These are independently created by the Pioneer league
Not true at all. PBL is now a partner league of MLB. No way they’re making changes without the suggestion of even demands of MLB.
ESPN article I read literally said that while the league is partnered the the MLB, these rule changes are not tied to the MLB.
The partnership agreement literally said that the PBL would test out new rule changes for MLB. I don’t know what article you read, but that’s flat out wrong. The reason PBL is making changes like this is specifically to test them out and see how they impact the game.
Can’t upvote this enough. Rob Manfred is worse for baseball then the ’94 Strike.
Not my type…
I have a good idea. How about we just leave it as is? I understand that MLB is trying new stuff to try and appeal to a younger audience, but someone who isn’t interested in baseball because they think it’s boring or too long will never be interested in baseball unless you cut down like a half hour plus off of game time. Little tweaks like the pitch clock are fine, but if these polls are an indication of anything, it’s that the vast majority of fans do not like the extra inning rules.
The polls show what people who read articles on a baseball site think. That’s a small minority of people MLB needs to target to make enough money. They need all the people who used to like baseball and are bored and young people who never got into it because it’s boring. If they don’t solve that, in just a few decades MLB will have 8 teams.
Stop messing with the game. This is a joke now. HR derby’s in a game. I’ll take runner on second over that any day.
I remember joking with people that games should end in a HR derby like soccer ends in a shoot out. It was a joke then, but Poe’s Law is universal.
I used to hate the idea of “Designated Fielders” but now its my #1 want as a fan who wants more excitement – imagine having all gold-gloves, all the time? Instead of some out-of-position, unathletic player diving and missing the ball by miles? Or worse, Eloy Jimenez and Aaron Judge-types ruining their careers by getting injured on defense?
Putting Aaron Judge in the same defensive category as Eloy Jimenez is pretty ignorant.
You misunderstand: The only “category” I put them in was “outfielder who gets hurt from outfielding”.
I hate the one-dimension players, you have to earn your at-bats at the field.
I wouldn’t mind the runner on second rule, but don’t implement it in the 10th. Allow, say, the 10th and 11th to play out, and see if we get a winner. If not, implement the runner on second in the 12th. Thoughts anyone?
I actually like that as a best of both worlds compromise. Take it 1 step further and they could do normal 10-11, runner on 2nd, 12-14, and if a game ever gets to 15 do the knockout rule.
That’s what they were talking about on Houston radio yesterday. Said start in the 11th or 12th to keep from 5 hour games.
I don’t mind it in the 10th, but I also see the logic of implementing in the 12th. I’m all for action and 15 inning games where there’s no scoring from 10th – 15th inning is good for nobody (except maybe pitcher ERAs).
Nah, I love it how it is, 9 innings is enough, we dont need THAT much more baseball. It also been making the 10th innings way more exciting and also are not guaranteed to end the game either. If you have a long bullpen it could still get the precious “more baseball” many fans love. I hated it at first but I also hate extra innings and rarely watched them – baseball, you get me for 9 – no more, no less (until this new rule, that is).
if you only want 9 innings you can turn off the TV after 9.
Agreed. If he has have MLB.TV, then he can save time and watch the condensed game afterwards and save time.
i dont get why people are so resistant to ties.
Breaking News: MLB ratings suddenly drop, Rob Manfred doesn’t know why
Other changes they should implement:
-Automatic Strike Zones
-No shifts
-universal DH
-expand rosters 25/26 up to 31
-ability to trade draft picks
-remove pseudo salary cap that is the luxury tax complications
-institute a minimum salary (for all those cheap skate baseball owners)
-change service years to all arbitration and reduce FA by 1 year
-incentivize winning by adding two rounds (1st between 2&3 for playoff teams + rounds 5&6 starting with top seed get best pick)
-institute a IFA draft, set up similarly with playoff teams getting an extra round or two
– 1 amnesty clause every 4 years where teams can cut player (but still have to pay) and it doesn’t count against salary cap.
Pretty sure there already is a minimum salary is there not? Thought it was like 500k
I think he means a floor for overall team spending.
indeed, I meant team salary floor. We don’t need owners who are spending bare minimum for extended period of time. It’s one thing to go through a rebuild, it’s another thing where teams can abuse that lower team spending for long haul. They could even curve it to say a 2/3 year floor average.
Scott Boras, is that you??? These proposed changes are extremely pro-player and without revenue sharing will result in even more teams to tank. You’ll have a handful of super big market teams and the rest AAAA teams.
And why would the owners EVER agree to this?
Insert Billy Madison, “Everyone is now dumber” quote here.
Expanding rosters is the worst idea. All that will do will add even more pitchers that don’t belong in the majors. They need to reduce roster sizes to get rid of the pitchers that just aren’t good enough to be in the majors. I know that will never happen because of the union, but expanded rosters just brings up unqualified players. Teams are running 8-9 man bullpens with 30 teams that is approximately 250 relievers in the majors at any one time. And that doesn’t include injured players. I don’t think anyone can argue that there are that many big league worthy relievers around.
The roster size was 25 from at least 1976 on. Teams usually had a 6-7 man bullpen. And in 1976 there were only 24 teams in the league. Even at the max of 7 per team, that is 168 big league relief pitchers. I know the game has changed, but that is basically a 50% increase in the number of players in a relatively short two generation time frame. And in 1976, there were far more American children choosing baseball than now. The game has gone global, but the increase in the number of unqualified pitchers is killing the game.
Who are you to decide who “belongs” in the majors or not?
Who are you to question my decision making ability? See what I did there?
The check swing revision makes sense to me, but I don’t like any of the others.
The home run derby concept sounds similar to the shootout in hockey. But with hockey, it’s because “time ran out”. In baseball, it’s not time based. You go until one team scores more runs. The check swing rule sounds fine. And even the pinch hitter/runner rule, I’m not crazy about it, but I see the idea. But the home run derby concept sounds ridiculous, and doesn’t fit into the style of baseball.
Ban the shift!!! The ML home run leader bunted last night.
I didn’t see Rhys Hoskins bunting for a hit last night. I did see him hit 2 HR’s though.
Manfred is a joke!!
Thanks, I hate it.. I don’t necessarily have a problem with the check swing change, but base umpires are not going to overrule the crew chief.
Crew chief isn’t always the HP umpire. CC is just the most senior umpire. Since they rotate, the CC is more likely to be on the bases on any given night.
I like the runner on second rule, my suggestion would leave that rule in place. I cannot remember many extra inning games going beyond the 10th last year.
I really think moving the mound back is a mistake, it’s going to lead to more injuries (IMO) due to pitchers feeling like they need to throw harder. I also am a bit concerned about the quality of pitching due to the ball breaking more. Pitchers have poor control as is, if their ball is now breaking a couple extra inches outside it’s going to lead to more walks.
I think it’s great that Manfred is trying to be proactive but he is missing the entire point. People do not care about “pace of play” The “pace” is fine, this is a distracted nation thats always on their smartphones anyway. The problem is, as in person game watching is concerned, is that they text and hear the hit and miss the play. Baseball needs to make a league wide effort to add more video screens and replay every play.
Second, it’s the quality that annoys people. I hate seeing pitchers who cannot throw a dang strike. It creates a boring game when the relievers come in and cannot challenge hitters.
Anyway, long story short, baseball’s problem is quality, the quality of play, the quality of the experience in the park. Hey baseball, develop an app that has food and merchandise delivered to the seat and also allow fans to reserve bathroom time… Those are two very simple ideas that would greatly improve the fan experience at the game.
I was fine with the mound changes and DH “hook” rule. I think this is too far. I’m in favor of changing the game to include more balls put in play, and shorter delays of action, but an extra inning game is not the problem, and designated pinch hitters and pinch runners just ruins the whole point of pinch running and pinch hitting
Tradition. I’d rather see Bonds in the HOF than implement these cartoon rules changes (the check swing change seems fine)
That’s a great poll question. Would you rather see the most successful cheater in the history of sports honored by being enshrined in the hall of fame or these ridiculous rule changes.
Too close to call.
For me, Bonds for sure. I think it’s safe to assume that at least some of the pitchers he was facing were also cheating and that we already have cheaters in the HOF, so I have some understanding there. These rule changes (minus the check swing one, I don’t care there) would annoy me way more.
@Halo11Fan Ty Cobb is in the HOF and he beat up innocent Black people while yelling slurs at them, literal hate crimes. Bonds > Cobb, all day.
Also literally every player from the 1940s-1990s took actual amphetamines during games. All of them. That’s cheating too. You can’t be out there in the 14th after rain delays completely wide awake like a normal person. That’s 100% drug cheating, even worse than Bonds because Bonds never took anything that was actually illegal outside of MLB.
Much, much exaggerated. Al Stump was a lying hack and much of Cobb is based on his writings.
He didnt?? Thats news to me, and probably him too
Small tweaks are fine in my book, but moving the pitching mound back is not a small tweak. I don’t like changes that affect the actual structure of the game. Yes they’ve moved it before but that’s not the current answer to having less walks and strikeouts. Defensive shifts have basically killed the base hit, so players are trying to launch the ball as a result. Limit the shifts and you’ll see more balls in play.
I think it is a small tweak. ML Batting averages are approximately 235, Strikeouts are through the roof. Action and sustained rallies are at an all time low.
I would prefer getting rid of the shift where contact is valued, but something needs to be done.
Controlling shifts is a very bad idea. If a team wants to shift or have a 4-man outfield, let them. They should be allowed to be creative on defense and they should be allowed to be creative on offense. Let them play.
Again? Why? It’s bad for the game. It’s not remotely debatable. What’s the reason behind it?
This isn’t golf. Players only have one club in their bag and don’t have multiple swings in their equipment bag.
It seems some players are able to adjust to the shift or aren’t even heavily shifted against in the first place. I’d be hesitant to limit defensive arrangements because some players can’t hit out of it. I’d need to see what the actual rule was before making a decision one way or the other, but I also think rushing to do something like that isn’t the best idea.
We have positional rule. The rubber is a certain length, you have to pitch from the rubber The catcher has to be his box. Runners have to run in their lanes. All defensive players have to start in fair territory. We have sliding rules, running rules. Why is infield positioning rules sacrosanct? There is no reason for it. .
You’re answering your own question in saying there is no reason for it, even if that’s not how you meant it. You’re essentially saying that we need to create a rule because some hitters aren’t good enough or don’t want to go the other way.
I’m pretty traditional and don’t love lots of change. But I actually like some of these and MLB should strongly consider. 1st – sudden death overtime rule is better than our current rule but both suck. Just play the game. 2nd a designated pitch hitter is dumb, especially if MLB implement the universal DH (which I support). So don’t even entertain that dumb idea.
That said, the designated runner and batters allowed to appeal check swings… YUP! Love it! Put that in the books yesterday, without question! Really good ideas to improve the game
New rules I would like to see:
1) If a runner is hit by a ball thrown by the catcher he is out. Applies to bunt attempts, steal attempts and rundowns. More fun for fans to watch and would possibly increase in game fights which fans also enjoy.
2) Batter gets 4 swings – if he cannot get the ball in play by the 4th swing it is a strikeout – no more of this time consuming 15 foul ball at bats.
3) Infielders have to begin the play with both feet on the dirt – play the shift all you want as long as everyone is not on the outfield grass
4) All teams must have cheerleaders on top of the dugout between innings.
5) Normal extra innings with the caveat that after the 10th inning each team plays with 2 outfielders. You get an outfielder back if opposing team scores 3 runs.
These are just as valid as the other crap proposed – and I think a poll should be taken to prove it lol.
New rule I’d like to see? Every time MLB proposes another stupid rule change, someone at MLB headquarters gets fired.
Okay this is funny and definitely for the betterment of the game.
These are all pretty good suggestions but I’d like to add a couple more well thought out ideas.
1) All infielders should have to wear poodle skirts. (Day games only)
2) Running around the bases backwards after a solo HR WITHOUT tripping would actually be worth 2 runs.
3) Any defensive replacement entering the game from the 7 inning on must wear big, floppy clown shoes
4) Once a team goes up by 3 runs or more their pitcher must now throw blindfolded from 2nd base until the opposing team ties the game or goes ahead
..And last but certainly not least, bring back dollar beers, that’ll add some excitement to the game. What a world!
May as well remove two players from each team each extra inning. By the 12th, there’s a lone CF behind the pitcher and catcher, and the other team is down to their catcher, DH, and one other fielder to hit.
I don’t understand the thinking of baseball’s “brain trust” (written with tongue firmly in cheek). Do they think these gimmicks will appeal to the video game crowd? Baseball grew into a worldwide sports phenomenon over a century with essentially the same rules. Why the continuous monkeying around? Play ball!
I wouldn’t want to see this as a rule in the MLB, but I actually think the idea is pretty cool. Reminds me of a hockey shootout to some extent. Not a rule for MLB, but I would still pay to see that in a lower league just for the entertainment value it could provide
Talking about the knockout rule btw^
Lovely… More stupid potential rules to ruin the best game on the planet…
I’m so tired of MLB trying all this BS without addressing the real issue.
I haven’t met anyone that complains about the length of game, or that MLB doesn’t allow ties, or anything these other “fixes” address, its always pace of play. Why has a pitch count not been implemented and enforced yet? Average time between pitches has been around 22-24 seconds which is a long time considering that on average 292 pitches are thrown in an MLB game. Allow for the use of wireless communication between pitcher and catcher, once the ball goes back to the pitcher the batter has 5 seconds to come set, and from that point on the pitcher has 15 seconds to throw the pitch. If a batter isn’t in the box set a pitch clock for idk, 14-15 seconds, enforce it by allowing the pitcher to throw the ball at any point after the 5 second set clock and if the pitcher fails to throw the pitch in his 15 second window a ball is assessed. (don’t beat up the numbers, they are just off the top of my head)
Its not the perfect answer but it also doesn’t change the fundamentals of the game while speeding up game play and in the process speeding up the game.
That should have said “pitch CLOCK” – Autocorrect can be a cold hearted b, she giveth and it taketh away.
I love the runner on second, there is action and pressure to win before the 10th,
I have a couple to add since they clearly want to be absurd.
1) Each team will designate one fan as their “10th man.” The “10th man” will play the bleachers and any ball caught in the air by that fan only results in an out (for their particular team only).
2) If a batter catches a pitched ball with his bare hand then he will be allowed to throw it and it will be treated just like a batted ball.
These are better ideas then that which are proposed by MLB.
I love rule 2. Let’s implement it.
In a word…..stupid.
I mean, the home run derby is at least an improvement over the AWFUL runner on 2nd rule. I’d prefer the old school version or just ties though. I’d much rather a game where both teams play well be called a tie then to go to this awful randomfest that doesn’t resemble baseball that we have currently.
most of these rules they are testing suck but appreciate them testing them outside of the Majors first and cant say that no change is important (though i dont think they really need to change that much about the game)
Billy Hamilton and Jarrod Dyson voted “yes” for the pinchrunner rule.
The counts are in and Roman Quinn did as well!
As did Terrance Gore
I’ve never felt the need to comment on any bit of news that has been posted before but this is stupid. No other way around it. Manfred has to go. 7 inning double headers, batter on 2nd in extra innings and now this. Nonsense. I hate what Manfred is doing to baseball.
Agreed. Manfred is a joke and he should take his ridiculous ideas to another continent far away from here.
People love extra-innings baseball, and MLB needs to leave it as it is.
In the small town I live in of about 8,000 people, after the 2018 WS game between the Red Sox and the Dodgers that went 18 innings, EVERYBODY in the town was talking about it. Not even just baseball fans either, everybody. That game was very well received and talked about, and it created one of the most exciting WS games of the past decade.
People will find time to watch an extra-innings game if they want to, and if an outside fan sees a team they don’t like in the midst of a 15 inning affair, they’ll tune in too.
Don’t mess this one up MLB.
I’d have to agree here. Different sport, but I remember the Flyers and Maple Leafs Game 4 in 2003 going to triple OT. It’s been 18 years and fans of BOTH teams still talk about that game (and the excellent series as whole as all but two games went to OT).
Baseball is one of the only sports that 1.) does not have a time clock and 2.) there must be a clear winner.
Baseball was a simple game, and there were strategies that came about from its rules. Designated PR and PH sounds a little complicated and I’m an engineer. So Prince Fielder could have been Designated Pinch Ran for but return to the game as a DH?
Any other Cubs fans remember that 18-game that Scott Sanderson basically pitched a Shutout the back half? I can’t remember the result, either Sundberg won it or they lost in 18 but that was one of the more memorable games for me. I LOVED extra innings because it meant MORE BASEBALL!
Non-baseball fans are not going to watch a 2-hour game any different than a 3, 4, or 5 hour game, nor will they become a fan of the sport because the game is short.
Lies, baseball was never “a simple game”. Stop lying. Extra innings are miserable.
Maybe not for you, most 5 year olds pick it up pretty quickly. Go watch Cricket.
1986. Danny Heep collapsing at the wall when the Astros pitcher hit a game tying home run in the 18th inning. Or something like that. Classic. And a precursor to a great playoff series.
Wrong. 1985. Atlanta. Rick Camp hits a home run in the bottom of the 18th to tie the game. Heep stands at the wall and just sits on the ground. Good times.
And it was 3 in the morning at least, then the mets won and then they had the fireworks go off for the faithful that stood until 430 in the a.m.
And ppl living nearby thought they were being attacked by hails of gunfire..
Darling was the pitcher at the back end..cpl of rain delays too,..i fell asleep,woke up around 2 and didnt realize it was live for awhile..
The runner on second has to run straight home over the pitchers mound but he can be tackled by the first baseman. If he is tackled he goes back to second while the batter is likely safe at first. If it’s first and second, both runners run across the pitchers mound to third and home respectively but now the third baseman can tackle the runner from second and the catcher can tackle the runner from first. Any runner who gets tackled three times is out. All this can only happen on balls in play, and regular base running rules apply on fly balls (tagging up). Fielders are allowed to peg runners with their throws, but they are not automatically out if they get pegged. The pegging is designed to help the tacklers.
if players can’t hit enough off of pitchers to win a game how will a home run derby solve the problem? just hit the home runs DURING the game
better than a home run derby. how about a single to the opposite field contest?
Isn’t there something like that in Korea, as an alternative to our HR Derby?
Or a bunt against the shift.
If you didn’t vote yes for all, please reply to this so I can mute you. THESE are the changes the game has long-needed! Hockey style eliminations, not Football style overtimes!
Designated Fielders next, please. So sick of seeing Eloy Jimenez-types wreck their careers because the team is trying to shoehorn hitters into athletic positions. MLB needs NFL-sized rosters like YESTERDAY.
What you just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I’ve ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points and may God have mercy on your soul.
Says the single dumbest person ever to exist. I’m happy with you hating me. Catch this mute
Just came here to say I voted no to all. Please don’t block me though, replying to your schizophrenic ramblings bring me indescribable joy 🙂
**insert princess bride gif** You keep saying that word, but I dont think it means what you think it means.. He can still see you, you cant see him…
I think you can still reply to his nonsense even if he blocks you, he just won’t see it. But let’s be real, it’s not like anything you say would get through to him anyway, so moot point.
I know, i think it’s just hilarious that he’s throwing mutes out as a weapon like he’s blocking them from seeing his posts. He doesn’t understand how they work.
no offense man, but reading your comments as I go down the comment section reads like a descent into madness.
What’s bad is he’s making a mockery out of the O.G A’sfaninLondonUK who actually has smart, coherent thoughts. Plus, the O.G has a badge on his profile, this one doesn’t.
having someone make a troll account to mock you, while terrible, is a badge of honor id say.
I can deal with most of the dumb changes. Designated Fielders happen and I am gone.
I know you’re trolling, but a designated fielder is actually something I’ve been pondering recently.
What if MLB banned the shift (so they’d have two infielders on each side of 2B and one OFer on each side of second base. BUT in a corresponding move, MLB would allows teams to carry a designated fielder.
The DF would be like a queen on a chess board. He could move all across the field, to any place in fair territory. While all the other players would stay in their traditional positions, this guy could be sitting on the warning track in left-center or standing right behind 2B.
He would by FAR be the most athletic guy on the field. He wouldn’t hit whatsoever, he would just field.
If the shift was completely taken away (which it should be), I think this would be a great trade-off.
How do you ban a shift?..
How about learning to hit the other way
Whats next, no more jump over the wall to rob a hr?
It’s not “banning” the shift – per se – but rather minimizing it.
I won’t repeat what I said above because you can easily re-read it if you don’t quite understand, but what you said just isn’t very logical.
Hitters can’t just “hit the other way” when you tell them to. If a hitter has strictly been hitting up the middle or to the pull-side for his career, him “hitting the other way” will only be accomplished by bunts. That may be the single worst way to grow the game: Bunts.
A’s fan: it seems that you do not like baseball. The rest of us actually enjoy the sport. Maybe find yourself a new hobby, one that you don’t have to radically alter in order to enjoy.
You would have your own pitcher or coach pitching those 5 balls while 8 fielders stand along the fence to Griffey JR back the HR. (Catcher behind home plate.)
Great idea too! Combine defense and homers, my two fave things about the game!
If the rule were in MLB, teams would start handing out million dollar contracts to batting practice pitchers who throw the best gopher balls.
The check swing rule is actually good, and should be implemented in MLB.
The HR derby thing is hilarious, and a great gimmick for a minor league. I’m okay with that for a minor league team where we’re worried about wear & tear/injury to guys making like 2k. MLB players make 600k minimum and the results of those games actually matter, so that farce should be nowhere near MLB.
I’d like to try ending games in a tie. See how that plays out and see what effect that has on reducing injuries.
Even with runner on second you can still get 10th, 11th, 12th innings.
I’d like to see if it has any impact on keeping pitchers healthier or more durable.
On that same note if you tie after 9 get rid of 7 inning double header. Two 9 inning games.
So you expect fans to go to games where there is no guaranteed result? No. Just, no.
that’s how Japan does it and they are probably the most passionate baseball fans in the world. It also bears mentioning that the world’s most popular spot, soccer, also has ties and few seem that angry about that.
Happens in soccer all the time. Fans don’t seem too concerned.
I don’t understand the push to reduce extra inning games, in a regular MLB season 2430 regular season games are scheduled to be played and on average 103 of those games go into extra innings. Is that really worth changing anything for? Would it have a measurable affect?
Instead of ending in a tie, how about we suspend games as a tie after 9? Then at the end of the season you resume all those games and play them to completion in the weeks following the regular schedule. As an incentive for MLB, they can sell separate tickets to these exciting sudden death games. They could all be played in a neutral location to speed it up and remove travel issues if necessary.
The CPBL does something similar with rainouts (due to having so many in a row during typhoon season), they’re all rescheduled to the end of the first or second half as “the makeup schedule” rather than being made up immediately. It does make some teams wait much longer than others for the playoffs, but that’s never been a problem in the CPBL.
Holy Brain Fart Batman.. who stinks up this crap… a mini home run derby.. Yikees have the stunk to a new low..
I want to see a point system similar to soccer in baseball. 3 points for a win and one for a tie.
The teams will play up to three extra frames (without runner on 2nd) before the tie is declared.
Another new rule: All pinch-runners will have jetpacks.
I would so watch a knock out home run derby.
Every extra innings game would be SO much more interesting and exciting, PERIOD.
Soon they’ll be experimenting with live animal acts. Basketball lost me years ago, baseball is getting closer to that end with each passing season.
No one cares/you arent missed/dont let the door hit you on the way out
oh the irony…
So they wanna make baseball like soccer or something? Lol
The most played and watched game with the highest paid players in the world? Yeah, I think baseball would love to be a part of that conversation.
Only 3 of the top 30 highest-paid athletes last year (endorsements included) were soccer players. Let’s face it, nobody cares about soccer outside of Western Europe and a couple densely-populated third-world countries. The only soccer games that end in PKs are tournament games in bracket, so people aren’t exactly showing up to the stadium hoping to see a shootout. Your entire premise about how this dumb HR derby rule would put baseball in the same “conversation” as soccer is completely asinine. The popularity of the sport has nothing to do with the way extra innings are handled.
yardbarker.com/nba/articles/the_30_highest_paid_at…
soccer is the most or second most popular sport in every country in the world other than the U.S. and maybe Canada.
You’re missing one major detail here. Soccer is the biggest international sport. It is nowhere near as big in the US or Canada, which is where all 30 MLB teams are located.
A ball will now be called a Rob, and a strike, a Manfred. You know, to speed up the game.
Literally everyone saying no changes are needed because it’s been fine for decades doesn’t pay attention to how far baseball has dropped in measurable metrics
Can I please see these measurable metrics you speak of?
for example, massively declining World Series TV ratings:
blogs.fangraphs.com/those-disastrous-world-series-…
and yet we ate still here. the question is if they are actually winning anyone back with changes, let alone these ones. for the most part i doubt it.
You can’t use the WS to measure baseball popularity, that would be a ridiculous measure in fact. It isn’t the Superbowl, the WS only appeals to the 2 markets in the WS. You have to consider the days of the week, the times of the games among other metrics.
Youth league signups, international camp attendance, local RSS TV ratings, streaming rates, and so on would be far superior tools.
Rule change: the batters should be allowed to tell the umps to f&ck off without retribution. Put a mic there to pick up the fun conversations and sell MLB Extra Innings Inside The Box. There’s your ADHD Millennial hook and some extra revenue Robby.
Nah, let players bring a phone to the plate and make actual tiktoks during a home run trot or while standing on the bag after a hit – BOOM PAY ME
JuJu Smith-Schuster is that you?
it proves manfraud and his devils are against baseball! if you want to shorten the game deaden the ball and raise the seams.
Get rid of the DH altogether. If you don’t want pitchers batting, just go to an 8 man lineup. Weak hitting catcher? 7 man lineup
heck, you can only have three guys on at once. Let teams bat only 4 players.
How are players and fans going to feel when a playoff spot is decided at the end of the season by a HR derby? Just like they do in the NHL with the shootout. Like you were robbed by gimmicky rules.
I have a better compromise. Dump the runner on 2nd nonsense. Make it a true “sudden death” game. Whoever scores first wins. Lead off the top of the 10th with a HR? Game over. No continuing the inning. If the home team can’t take advantage of their home field during regulation, they lose the advantage in extras. It doesn’t shorten every extra inning game, but it will take care of many of them.
I prefer to just end the game after the 10th and give both teams an L if they fail to win the game.
Having spent many a summer night at minor league ballparks, I love these ideas for minor leagues. There’s absolutely no need for low level minors games to go 16 innings. Let the fans have some fun watching a HR derby and go home.
That said, none of these need to happen at the MLB level.
yeah does kinds have an appeal in the Minors. then again, id leave that decision more to Minors fans.
ManFraud is a joke.
The ONLY solution I see is to form a new baseball like sport for the Under 40 crowd that encompasses the gimmicky changes that many of the bored and entitled WWE/Roller Derby/HR Derby/Tic-Tok generation requires….My biggest fear is a baseball continues to regress and devolve until it lands with a thud and burns like the NBA….No D and All Three Pointers.
baseball is already a dud. the game is slow and boring. They are losing fans at every age level. The NBA is increasing in popularity. MLB is decreasing. Of course, the NFL’s biggest up in popularity occurred while the league was actively making the game more boring. So it’s hard to predict what will work.
I will admit I no longer care about the NBA, so I don’t follow the news super closely, but I know in 2020 they had falling viewership as well. Have they righted that ship?
@ noah… basketball is at an all time low for ratings … PAYING customers are sick of the sjw crap
To be clear, ALL TV ratings are down. NBA’s ratings are down at a much lower rate compared to all TV and compared to all other sports except football. NBA’s ratings are down less than football too, but not by a wide margin.
I guess viewers are sick of all the “sjw crap” on Fox news which has among the largest declines in ratings in the past few years? Odd, from a right wing opinion peddler.
How about we encourage putting the ball in play instead of the dull 3 true outcomes approach. Ever heard the idiom “time flies when you’re having fun”? Well, a 3+ hour game is fun when there’s actually action for fans to follow and rally behind. I would wager it’s fun for players, too. You know what’s not fun? HRs, BBs, and Ks without anything else. To quote from Bull Durham, “Strikeouts are boring. Besides that, they’re fascist.” Home runs used to be interesting because of their relative rarity and the true power required to muscle it over the fence of a deep park. Now there are backup infielders who hit 30 homers playing part-time. Jedd Gyorko and Rougned Odor come to mind. The point is not that I dislike home runs, it’s that they’ve lost almost all their luster and awe when they’re hit.
Some suggestions:
-Move all fences back
-Ban the shift
-Raise the mound back to the pre-1969 height
-Restore normal extra innings
-Implement lofty penalties (1st rd draft picks, fines, etc.) for any tanking team
The current all-or-nothing game is unwatchable.
Banning the shift encourages MORE three true outcome hitting, so that’s counter-productive. The whole point of the shift is to combat that approach. It doesn’t work terribly well, but it would be worse with no shift. It is true that less shift would result in more slowly hit singles by guys who are only trying to hit HRs. I’m not sure that’s more exciting.
For moving the fences to help, you will have to make it nearly impossible to hit HRs. That would probably work but people would be mad at the massive decrease in HRs. People will probably be mad about any decrease in HRs.
Raising the mound makes it easier to strike hitters out, so it will encourage MORE strikeout focused pitching. Again, increase in the % of ABs that end in one of the three true outcomes.
Extra innings and tanking have nothing to do with the issues you raise. It’s also not clear what kind of taking you would ban. Not calling up players? Resting players? I’m not aware of any teams trying to lose *during a game.*
The runner on second rule really makes no sense when you think about it. All it really does is run up the score much like the college football overtime rules. Runs should be earned (other than because of defensive errors) in order for a team to win.
Did you know that you can actually throw a 10 inning perfect game and still lose? Road team gets no hits or walks in the first 9 innings, home team does not score. In the 10th inning, road team hits a ground out to second that moves the runner to third. Then, hits a sac fly for the second out which score the runner. Then make a 3rd out with the next batter. Then the home team does not score in the bottom of the 10th. You have a team that pitches a perfect game and loses. To me, if you can do that with the rule, it shouldn’t be there.
Agreed. The extra-innings rule is absolute garbage. An expansion team in Africa would make more sense…and it clearly doesn’t make sense.
re-define a perfect game to exclude games where you give up runs. Your problem, which is entirely based on words and not based at all on the game, is solved.
“To avoid excessive strain on pitching staffs”…, brought to you by the same folks who want to expand playoffs and promote extra baseball in the off season. I call BS!
Bring in the pitch clock!
I personally like the “shootout” style format.
Progressive-ism ruins everything it touches. Just another example. Baseball has been fine for 140 years. Leave it alone.
so we shoudl go back to the 1800s rules?
Great, now this idiot manfred will get the idea to do it too
This Manford nightmare just get worse and worse. Next up, Celebrity Finish! Where well known celebrities drawn randomly after the 9th inning of a tie game get to finished the game. One goes to 3rd base and another to the pitching mound and a randomly drawn fan from the stands gets to bat. to the plate. If the runner scores before the batter makes out, his team wins! If he doesn’t score the other team wins. What fun!
Like Rock N’ Jock softball?
Has anyone looked at how many extra inning games are played?
Going back to the full seasons from 2010 through 2019, 3.92% of regular season games have lasted 10 innings and 8.75% of them have lasted 10 innings or longer. And 70.0% of the extra-innings games lasted no longer than 11 innings.
—(Data from Statcast and Retrosheet Game Logs)
Maybe in 2022 they stand naked and whoever has the ” hardest bat” wins for his team
Morgana the kissing bandit can be the judge of it
It seems delusional to support the Knock Out rule when the rule hasn’t even been defined. Who is going to pitch? If it’s the other team, the games will literally go on forever. If it’s the same team, is it a player or a coach? Do we really want a system where a coach or roster spot is decided based on a pitcher’s ability to throw a good BP pitch?
The best solution for extra innings: No games go past 10 innings. Anything more is intolerably long unless there is almost no offense.
If it’s tied after 10 innings, both teams get a loss. If you can’t win a baseball game in 10 innings you don’t deserve half a win, and nobody in the US except hockey and tennis fans like “points” standings. Actually, a lot of hockey fans don’t like their standings either.
You could also stop watching after 9 innings and let those of us that enjoy extra innings watch extra innings
Designated PR and PH seems like a good idea. I would take it a step further and say baseball should join the rest of the major sports in allowing unlimited substitutions for a given player.
Nothing is gained by preventing exciting players from re-entering the game.
The extra innings rule is even worse than the other extra innings rule. Either come up with a real solution or just use ties.
Does anyone think the 1B umpire will ever over-rule his partner on a check swing when the batter appeals?
Know what’s better? Playing the game as is till someone scores.
When I think back on my favorite regular season games, many are tense extra innings affairs
After nine innings, Trial by Combat! Relieves pressure on pitching staff, and adds an element of fluidity to the roster. People will come!
I like it. If we’re going to try dumb ideas, let’s shoot for the moon
Gee will they use yellow balls?
the team that scores the first run(s), when the inning is over, continues to play defense until the other team ties the score, or goes ahead.
Sweet Jesus, I used to complain about NHL shootouts saying “this is like ending a baseball game with a home run derby” as if it were a laughably bad idea
this would be awesome
I think that they should end it in a brawl. People would like that. Send your best two fighters up there to duke it out. Extra Innings Odor vs Bautista!
Extra innings decided by a home run derby. The game has already become an all or nothing HR or K. Ghost runners on second. Does anyone remember things like a hit and run, hitting behind a runner, throwing over to 1B to keep a runner close, the suspense of an actual pitching dual when a runner advancing a base means something? Nowadays it’s just sit back and wait for the home run. The conversion to professional softball is nearly complete.
Quit trying to change baseball
This is an idiotic idea. So you’re going to play nine innings of competitive baseball, and if it’s tied decide the game by something vaguely (and that’s an optimistic stretch) resembling competitive baseball? Why? Just why? I don’t have the words for my disdain for this.
For the check swing rule, I’m ok with it provided you have to appeal to the other side from where you are; i.e., a right-handed hitter has to appeal to the 1B ump and a leftie has to appeal to 3B. It’s the only way they’ll have a good enough view.
I can live with the pinch-hitter and pinch-runner rules, though I’d prefer to not have them.
Hate the home run derby rule. I’d honestly rather have the runner on 2nd rule than that because that at least resembles baseball.
I wouldn’t mind it if I was attending an Indy league game. No interest in a MLB game. Even things I tolerated last year during the pandemic, such as the automatic runner on 2B to start the 10th, I absolutely do not like this year.
Yet another suggestion being made by people who don’t know or even like baseball.
Well, with the added explanation, the Knock Out Rule makes a little more sense. I still hate it, but I understand the reasoning a lot more. Shouldn’t change anything from the MLB perspective, though…
Not checking past comments but heres mibe.
Make pitchers hit in this stupid derby
Baseball at its finest is a chess match. Strategy as one team tries to beat the other. All these rule attempts are meant to dumb down the game even more by just having teams out mash the other. Its frustrating enough already watching the current three outcome game we have now but we don’t need Home Run derbies to decide winners
How about an inside the park home run derby?
Now that would be fun.
Couldn’t take more than a few hours.
Hey home run derby! What a great idea.
Why even the fans might participate. The online app states so clearly: “Home Run Derby is a cool baseball game by Silvergames.com that you can play online and for free. In this sports game you get to play as the batter of a professional mlb baseball team. But hitting the ball will not be enough for you. Your goal is to hit home run after home run to set the highest score possible. The further you hit the ball, the higher your score. So swing at the exact right moment to get the best out of each and every shot. Earn extra time for each home run and try to win trophies for your performance.”
Yay! Let’s get this going for MLB…every inning!
Just to show how agreeable I am, if two golfers in the Masters are tied after 72 holes, and the PGA goes to a long drive contest, then I will consider a long HR contest for MLB.
Past that, just going by the RS in 2019, they only played 8 games (5%) that lasted more than 4:09. and only 6 of those were extra innings. Going to a more pitching-oriented team and environment, less than 2% of the TBR games lasted 4:15.
Install a 20-second clock and you are probably done.
Have hitters keep a foot in the box at all times and stop changing baseballs whenever they touch the ground or a bat. The onus should not be on the pitchers to adhere to a clock an ump cannot enforce because hitters want to play with their batting gloves.
And umps need to stop rewarding time to hitters. Add those up and the game times will improve.
i’m generally a traditionalist and think the extra inning rule is an abomination but i love the designated pinch-hitter and pitch-runner idea
1) Put all fielders on segways
2) Have a 10 degree incline as you round the bases and then a big slide from third to home
3) Wild boars roaming the outfield keeping the outfielders on their toes
4) Fielders climb into the stands to get home runs, the batter keeps running around the bases and can keep scoring until they bring it in
The Manfred Manifesto
HRD – no.
To hell with the runner on 2nd base extra innings rule.
First,
I beliefe the whole idea of pinhc hitting or running for a player was to also punish a team for making a change for one reason or another. And limiting to 1once per game? Why do it at all then? I fail to see how making more complex rules will ‘speed up’ the game at all. We already have the ability to swap a hitter and a runner, so why are we trying to make it more difficult by tweaking it?
Second, want to ‘fix’ the length of time for the game without the absurd extra inning rules now in in place?
-Do not let the batter wander around to collect their thoughts and re-tighten their gloves for 4 hours between at bats.
-Stop the pitcher from wandering the mound after each pitch and running through signs for four hours between pitches (this actually may help pitchers also stay healthier if they are pitching at a more frequent rate during a game).
-Limit the number of foul contacts by a batter in an at bat to 4 (In other words you foul off a fifth pitch and you are out, Like when you bunt foul with two strikes)
The commissioner is an absolute idiot. Quit trying to ruin the game anymore then you already have.
Lets find ways to make the actual game shorter so we can take longer breaks to watch more TV commercials.