White Sox first baseman José Abreu is on the verge of reaching free agency again, heading back to the open market once the offseason begins in November. He spoke to the media today and answered questions about his future, including one about whether he plans on returning to the field in 2023. “Of course, I love baseball,” Abreu said, as relayed by James Fegan of The Athletic. Abreu goes on to say that talks with the Chicago front office about a new contract have not taken place and that he will take some time to think about his next steps.
The fact that Abreu doesn’t want to rush this decision is fairly sensible, given that his previous foray into free agency was very brief. He was given a $17.8MM qualifying offer by the White Sox at the conclusion of the 2019 season and eventually accepted. One week later, he and the club agreed to a three-year, $50MM deal which replaced that QO. Instead, Abreu received a $5MM signing bonus, $11MM salary in 2020, $16MM in 2021 and $18MM in 2022.
That deal could hardly have gone much better for the club, with Abreu continuing to be an excellent hitter in that time. In the shortened 2020 season, he hit 19 home runs and produced an overall batting line of .317/.370/.617. That production was 64% better than league average by measure of wRC+ and Abreu earned American League MVP honors while helping the club make the postseason for the first time since 2008.
He couldn’t quite maintain that torrid pace over an entire season, but still had a great campaign in 2021. He launched another 30 long balls and slashed .261/.351/.481, wRC+ of 125. He sacrificed some power for average here in 2022 but still with great results overall. He’s gone over the fence 15 times so far while hitting .304/.378/.445 for a wRC+ of 137.
Given his continued production and strong reputation off the field as a clubhouse leader, it would be fairly logical for the Sox to want him back. However, there might also be a couple of factors working against that course of action. For one thing, there’s the team’s budget. The White Sox set a franchise record by running out an Opening Day payroll of $129MM in 2021, according to Cot’s Baseball Contracts, but then vaulted way past that here in 2022 by getting to $193MM.
There’s already about $121MM committed to next year’s team, in the estimation of Jason Martinez of Roster Resource, but with some key expenses not yet factored in. Tim Anderson’s $12.5MM option is a lock to be exercised while Lucas Giolito will get a raise via arbitration. He made $7.45MM this year and will likely get above eight figures for 2023. Those two contracts will get the club into the $145MM range while still not including arbitration salaries for Dylan Cease, Michael Kopech and others. If they’re willing to spend at a similar level this year, they could certainly fit in a contract for Abreu, though that would leave them with fewer resources to address other areas of need such as the pitching staff. Yesterday, general manager Rick Hahn told Daryl Van Schouwen of the Chicago Sun-Times that the club was likely to be more active in the trade market than in free agency, seemingly a reflection of the club’s payroll situation.
There’s also the fact that the Sox have a potential in-house replacement for Abreu already on the roster in the form of Andrew Vaughn. He is in just his second season in the majors and has hit .273/.323/.433, producing a wRC+ of 115. That’s a bit below what Abreu has done in recent years, though Vaughn is still just 24 years old and could potentially still have room to grow.
There’s a big problem with Vaughn’s current role on the team, however, which is his glove. A first baseman in college and in the minors, Vaughn moved to the outfield due to Abreu already being entrenched as the team’s everyday option at first. The move has not suited Vaughn at all, as he’s produced -16 Outs Above Average on the grass in 2022, the lowest mark of any outfielder in the league this year. His -10.4 Ultimate Zone Rating is also the lowest for an MLB outfielder on the season while his -14 Defensive Runs Saved is among the bottom five.
Due to that horrid work in the field, Vaughn is giving back all of his offensive production and then some. Despite being an above-average hitter, he’s actually been a sub-replacement level player this year, according to the calculations of FanGraphs. They say that Vaughn’s fWAR for the season is -0.4, while Baseball Reference has him at an even zero. Perhaps it’s worth it for the Sox to consider letting Abreu walk and moving Vaughn back to his natural position, as that would both allow Vaughn to become a more productive member of the team and also free up resources to address other areas of the roster.
Of course, the club could also consider re-signing Abreu and then trading Vaughn, though that path is a little less smooth. MLBTR’s Anthony Franco recently took a look at this year’s crop of free agent first basemen, with Abreu coming in at the top of the class alongside Josh Bell. Although Abreu is turning 36 in January, his continued success at the plate will surely lead to multi-year deals with a significant salary. Supposing Chicago does re-sign Abreu, they would then have to find a trade partner willing to give up cheap pitching for a first baseman, which may not be easy.
However it plays out, keeping the same arrangement in 2023 seems like something the Sox should avoid. Despite a roster loaded with talent, the club disappointed this year by slumping to an 80-80 record so far and missing the playoffs for the first time since 2019. Defense was likely a big factor, as the team-wide DRS of -32 is one of the five worst in the league, their -16 OAA one of the ten worst and their -41.1 UZR dead last.
LOL
All White Sox.
All the time.
I would sure love for the Angels to get Anderson and cement Fletch in at 2nd.
TrumboJumbo;
Careful what you wish for.
A SS has to be a consistent, baseball smart, level-headed defender to anchor a D in the middle of the field. And as a team leader (to which he espouses) has to be have a consistent, workable personality.
Watch some White Sox games. While not a perfect comp, think about how Javier Baez has worked out with the Tigers so far.
How has he been bad for the tigers besides his numbers and the slider lol
Anderson is a good hitter, but not that great of a defender for a shortstop…
I suspect they resign Andrus for SS and move Anderson to 2B
Anderson is going to play SS on a team friendly option, could be traded but I doubt it.
Sox have Leury at second and a few good prospects coming up next season, could even move Moncada back to second and start Burger at third.
Anderson could probably also be an outfielder.
There’s long been questions about him manning SS. He didn’t play baseball til his senior year of HS. Pretty remarkable
No, Moncada provides smooth and at times elite defense. Burger would be a disaster. Move Burger to second if you must- otherwise he’s another trade candidate.
He is a good hitter, if no one is on base.. I saw him constantly failing to drive runners home this past season.
The elephant in the room is…Shohei Ohtani!
The Angels can have their All-Star SS in Tim Anderson. They can replace Ohtani with local SP and sometimes ace Lucas Giolito. They can also have their pick of 1B Andrew Vaughn or LF Eloy Jimenez with the latter potentially replacing Ohtani as the Angels full time DH. A trade can be tweaked with prospects or one of the ChiSox hard throwing relievers were they have some depth.
Ohtani gives the White Sox their coveted lefty power bat AND an ace SP. He also gives owner Jerry Reinsdorf MLB’s most unique talent who can add value to his franchise ahead of a sale that will happen sooner rather than later. JR can go all-in this winter for one more baseball championship and then ride off into the sunset with 8 overall titles between the Bulls and White Sox. The front office will also have plenty of FA options to replace Anderson at SS this winter ranging from elite leadoff hitter Trey Turner to a much cheaper Elvis Andrus. Either would provide a better glove than TA. Including Vaughn or Jimenez in a deal also makes it easier for the front office to re-sign franchise fave Jose Abreu to one final contract before he assumes the ambassador role previously filled by his late mentor, friend and countryman Minnie Minoso.
Note: Elvis Andrus has a $15MM 2023 vesting option which is guaranteed with 550 plate appearances in 2022 or 1,100 PAs in 2021-22 combined. He met those requirements with the White Sox in the past week. He likely returns to the southside in 2023 as their starting SS or perhaps at 2B.
Old contract, not in force. He was waived and the Sox picked him up.
In this pipe dream, it would be more like Cease as the headliner for rental of Ohtani. Giolito’s bad season and 1yr left on deal makes little sense for Angels orgz that needs rotation solutions with more contract control. Not sure DH types appealing either since that’s a good spot for giving Trout/Rendon an occasional breather. That said, also no reason for Ohtani to extend with WSox when the Cubs could make him a near 400mil marketing face or other large market club like LAD/Yanks/Mets/RSox.
Andrus is in the final year of an eight-year, $120 million contract he signed while a member of the Rangers. Chicago is paying him the prorated league minimum the rest of this season, while the A’s will pay what’s left of his 2022 $14 million salary. As for the 2023 $15MM vesting option, why would that be discarded since Andrus met the PA requirements between the A’s and White Sox over the past 2 seasons? It’s my understanding that once the PA’s were met the option then becomes a player option, one that Andrus is likely to accept given his age and offensive production. A primary reason the A’s released Andrus why also pissing him off was to get out of that vesting option and (perhaps?) leave it the responsibility of his next team. The A’s had already cut into Andrus’ playing time before releasing him. He was on pace to fall well short of the vesting requirements. That all changed when the White Sox signed him to be their everyday SS to replace injured Tim Anderson down the stretch. Do you have a source article stating that his release and subsequent signing by the White Sox voids that 2023 vesting/player option?
OK. I found one on this very site after Andrus was released by the A’s in August: mlbtraderumors.com/2022/08/athletics-release-elvis…
A deadline trade of Andrus would have required his new team to assume the vesting option. His release and subsequent signing voided the option.
Of course… otherwise, the Sox would not have played Elvis so much. Especially once the Sox were eliminated from playoffs.
Rizzo
I doubt the Yankees try to move him this offseason.
Rizzo has an opt-out and therefore can choose to move himself in this offseason.
I hope they don’t trade Vaughn, nice to have that depth at first. Have to resign Abreu, have to play Eloy in the outfield.
Need all three for a run at the title.
They’ve had all three——with no run at a title. It’s time not to have Vaughn at depth—-he needs to move to first base—-what about the article labeling him, by far, the worst defensive outfielder don’t the Sox get.
And “have to play Eloy in the outfield”……
It took me a little bit but you are a sarcastic Guardians, Twins troll aren’t you?
I don’t know how you can say that, they were in contention in September.
They cashed it in after the Guardians series.
Have to play Eloy in the outfield and DH Vaughn. Need both their bats in the lineup, Vaughn should play some first, play some outfield.
Probably sign Abreu to a two year deal unless he wants a longer deal, then you have to sign him to a longer deal, lol. Two year window, and depending on how our prospects come along, possibly longer. Sox have a good team.
C’mon man – yes, by the grace of a horrible division the Sox were technically “in contention” in September. But realistically if you watched this team since AS break ‘21 you knew this team wasn’t contending for anything. Bad defense, bad pitching, historically bad base running, poor overall effort, a clown manager and a revolving door injury list. They are farther away from contending than they look.
That’s not true, they were four games out with twenty to play, that’s facts, what you say is somewhat arbitrary, fact is they were in the playoff race in September, there were fifteen teams that weren’t.
bw—I don’t want to be argumentative—but look at your initial words “make a run at a title.” Making a run at a title and being four games out with 20 to play in the worst division in baseball are complete polar opposites.
To make a run at the title the Guardians are not the object. When it comes down to it the White Sox are clearly not as good as: the Astros, Mariners, Yankees, Guardians, Blue Jays or Rays. They are probably not as good as the Orioles and much closer to a team like the Red Sox.
At the very best they are number 7 in the league—and that can stretch to even the 9-10 range if you wish to pull the Twins/Rangers into play.
To put it in perspective they finished 11 games worse than the Guardians and 13 games better than the Rockies.
If you wish to think this is a team than can make a run at the title, you might wish to see that they aren’t too much better than the real also rans.
I do agree with a lot of your points (keep Abreu)—but they have to unclog the four or five DHs that they have and get “baseball players” in the corners of the outfield and behind the plate. You just can’t keep allowing teams (for years) to keep going from base to base to base with no yield signs.
When you get to the playoffs, if you have a top three, and a bullpen, you have a shot to win it all.
Lance Lynn was pitching well in September and Cueto I’d say would of been our three and he pitched well all season. Our Ace could have been good for two wins in a series so it could break our way, have a shot at a title, that’s all you can ask,
You talk like you can put together a team that is undeniably going to win, hands down favorites, that’s the only way to win the WS. There are ten teams in the playoffs, all of them can win if they get the breaks.
That’s the goal at the beginning of the season, to make the playoffs, and if you do, you have a shot at the title, that’s all you can hope for, to be playing in October.
Keep the team together, rely on the farm, sign a SP, two year window.
Here’s my point (counter to that)…..could the Sox beat the Mariners in a three game series? yes. Can they beat the Yankees in a five game series? yes. Can they beat the Astros in a seven game series? yes. Can the beat the Braves/Dodgers in a seven game series? yes
But so could the Cubs, the Rockies, the Rangers.
The question is with the team the currently have, can the Sox beat the Mariners, Yankees, Astros, Dodgers/Braves in back to back to back to back series. The talent level and make up of the team say NO CHANCE.
I guess the Guardians, the current longshot to win it all at 33-1 have a chance—so there’s your argument.
Your last statement of “keep the team together”—-that’s the problem, they kept it together for a couple of year, “rely on the farm”—-what farm? and “sign a SP”—with what money? They aren’t signing deGrom or Rodon…….(Cueto isn’t the type you need to sign).
I’m trying to give you the benefit of the doubt as a homer—but there are no other posters high fiving or supporting your side.
Get out of the forest so you can see the trees. Please. You will sleep better at night.
You have Cease, Lynn, Kopech, TA, Eloy, Robert, Grandal, Moncada, Vaughn, Sheets, Leury, Hendriks, Crochett, all signed through 2024,
This is the team that is set to make a run at the playoffs,
That’s the team that has a two year window, Pollock off the books in 2023 unless he has a big year and signs for less to stick around.
Sign Jose, keep Vaughn around, and possibly deal Sheets and Burger for a Trevor Rogers type, that’s not too far off in terms of being a good trade.
Haseley and Rutherford were both top 100 AAA players in fangraphs power rankings, Haseley had a nice year, 15 homers / 20 steals, he has a little speed, Jose Rodriguez hit .280 with a little power and had a .340 OBP with 40 steals, not bad for a young second baseman, Bryan Ramos had a good season, Norge Vera looks like he will be an effective bullpen arm when he gets back on track, and Romy Gonzalez has a big body at 6’4 240 built like a power hitter. Colas and Cespedes have potential, both could be attractive in a potential trade in adding a bullpen arm at the deadline.
Good enough to plug any holes in what looks like a two year window with the current team. Or tear it all down and perpetually rebuild, I’d stick it out with the team that is in place and see if they can’t put it together.
Is this supposed to be satire?
Huh? Why would they need depth at 1b? They have 5 1b/dh players, the 3 you mentioned plus sheets and grandal (who unfortunately still catches but not great defensively anymore. They need depth other places, and mostlikely will need to use the 1b depth to get it.
No talks?
Well, what about Smoke Signals??
Don’t let the face of the franchise walk, give him 2/30. Maybe another team in need of a DH will swap Vaughn for a middle reliever and mediocre prospect
Let the 36 year old walk. Extend the 24 year old and play him at first base.
Vaughn will be lucky if his best offensive season is as good as Abreu’s worst
Maybe true, but no WS was won during his time in Chicago. He is now old. Less productive. Start planning to win a WS now by investing in younger league level talent like a Vaughn … and prospects.
Mets desperately need a DH.
That’s exactly what underachieving teams should do. White play in the easiest division and still can’t make the playoffs consistently with a bloated payroll. It’s embarrassing.
He just made $18M this season – why in the world would he take less money? If he gives the hometown discount after out-performing that last very team-friendly contract he’s a damn fool. He’ll get more in FA.
Nelson Cruz, an aged full time DH, took less and less money on one year deals all while “outperforming”
It’s not surprising the White Sox haven’t approached Abreu yet as they evaluate what went wrong this season. Abeu’s power has literally been cut in half but the multitude of different batting orders probably didn’t help that. I think the Sox should re-sign him but probably not for more than 3 years, maybe a deal similar to the one he is just completing. Free agency has not been kind to 1B/DH types in recent years and he is the face of the franchise
There you go, Marlins. You want better hitters in your lineup, start with this guy. Quality hitter and Cuban to boot. Perfect fit…
Like Soler! Load up on the Cubans!
Congrats Judge! 62!!
Brewers need a big bat. Should offer 2/38.
To listen to Hahn yesterday at the TLR presser, it sure sounded as if Abreu is as good as gone.
I guess it depends what Abreu is looking for in a new deal but you’d have to say that he’s earned a fair shake on this one, loyal to the team, team captain, heart and soul of the team. Be a real let down for the whole team if you burn him, might as well tear it all down if you’re not going to sign Abreu.
Sox are in a tough spot but it’s an easy decision, pay him market value on a three year deal, he’s been the third best 1B in MLB behind Goldschmidt and Freeman, he’s probably looking for a deal between 20 and 25 M per and he’s earned it.
Agree, keep Abreu and then make a decision between Sheets and Vaughn as the heir apparent. Given Sheets lefty bat and penchant for the dramatic, think it’s time to find a buyer for Vaughn- who has hit the ground running but may have hit his ceiling. Both years he’s slowed down late in the year. Classic high floor, limited ceiling guy
It also has to do with Payroll! Abreu may be the better player, but he’s not the best bang for the buck. Vaughn is. Abreu is becoming too costly, and older players tend to decline. Vaughn is likely to get better.
But it has less to do with what Abreu has earned and more to do with the fact that the Sox have too many DH types on their ball club.
Anthony Rizzo will probably opt out and seek a multi year deal elsewhere. Yankees should scoop this guy up, one of the most underrated players in the last decade. Will be in HOF talks if he puts up another 2 to 3 monster seasons
Why don’t fans understand the value in a balance lineup? The Yankees for years have been too RH heavy and you’re suggesting they replace one of the few quality LH bats they have with yet another RH DH type?
I think it is more likely the Yankees re-sign Matt Carpenter to be their primary first baseman if Rizzo opts out. Carpenter’s LH swing is perfectly suited for Yankee Stadium – 1.605 OPS in 63 PA – and he is a fan favorite in New York. The Yankees need more LH hitters in their lineup – not another RH hitters.
Abreu isn’t sniffing the hall of fame… the guy would have to tack on another 15 WAR to even be close.
Yeah let’s just assess whether a player should he in the Hall based off their WAR. This has almost become a trend where trolls just say that on here just because it’s cool and they want to be noticed. Oh wait there’s a mute button…
Ok, based on his black ink hall of fame statistics, he isn’t close to sniffing the hall of fame.
He doesn’t have the career numbers, he doesn’t have a period of dominance nor does he have the longevity to be in the hall of fame.
Abreu has only been good, not great. He had a great rookie year and a great 60 games in 2020. Outside of that he’s only been good.
What were his stats in Cuba? Is it the MLB HOF or the baseball HOF? He was a 27 year old rookie like Ichiro, and in generally good health so he could play another 4 to 5 years, especially as a DH and part time 1B.
Hey, even the ‘27 Yankees had Tony Lazzeri. You need guys who get on base and can, ya know, run the bases.
Ichiro had a stretch where he was great and he also had longevity…. He came in to the league at 27 and still played 18 seasons. He posted over 3000 career hits, in the mlb, 10 straight all star appearances, 10 straight gold gloves, 10 straight 200 hit seasons…
Abreu again simply has been good and Cuban stats do not count.
Even with 4-5 more seasons, Abreu would have to play better than his career averages to be a hall of fame player.
Lazzeri was 3rd in the league in HRS in ’27, behind Ruth and Gehrig. Both of them got on base more than Tony did. So what was your point?
Obviously, from your comment, you believe that he really was a 27 year old player when he came over…….4-5 years more of quality play may be a bit of a stretch even if he’s only 35.
I don’t know, Abreu plays three or four more seasons and hits .300 or better amongst the league leaders in hits and RBIs and he should be considered, only 11 players hit .300 or better this season, out of 300 MLB hitters, that’s in the top 3% of players in the league, if you can string together a few of those, that’s tough to do. He could add around a thousand hits and another 100 homers, he’d have respectable counting stats, if he keeps up the career BAA., the .OBP and .OPS he should have a shot at the hall. I think playing with one team your entire career should count for something too, let’s hope Abreu finishes his career with the White Sox.
Abreu will be considered for the HOF if those two to three monsters seasons are : 350/65/140 each. He’s only played nine seasons thus far.
If he hits 65 homers each of the next two seasons he’s still under 375 for a career.
Would love to have him on my team any time–but to think that he will get more than 5% just to stay on the ballot is a minor stretch. Feasible, but not a sure thing.
Abreu is a perfect fit in Miami.
You’re Pads Fans
I would love to see the Sox sign Trea Turner and then trade Tim Anderson for a young left handed power hitter. Wishful thinking I know as Turners salary will not fit in.
They have to let Abreu walk so Vaughn can play first. And Moncada should be banned from wearing bright pink or yellow shoes, unless he hits 270 or above!!
Ha ha, is this a joke? The Chisox are still trying to put the finishing touches on the offers they have been working on, for Barry Bonds and Manny Machado. Yeah sure, Reinsdorf is gonna pay Turner $35/yr. And Trea Turner just can’t wait to play with this hot mess.
Here is a guy that deserved a Kris Bryant – Jason Heyward 184 million dollar deal years ago. He probably wants to be paid now however not going to get a mega deal at this age. Probably best suited to move to DH in the near future. Looks like can play until at least 40. Excellent physical shape.
Abreu is a different story than either Bryant or Heyward. Abreu’s first trip through free agency was after his age-32 season while Heyward’s first trip was after his age-24 season and Bryant reached FA after his age-29 season. It’s because Abreu signed a six year deal out of Cuba after his age-26 season. So he was already older than Heyward when he played his first year in the US and only three years younger than Bryant when he made his way to the US.
I would let Abreu walk and trade Anderson to Arizona for a couple of athletic but not yet proven outfielders. People will laugh when I suggest this, but they should look into acquiring Edmundo Sosa to play short. They could get creative filling 2B, but I would target another young, versatile, athlete. Suddenly you would have a much different looking team that could provide the starting pitchers with improved defense and some payroll flexibility. By acquiring younger, more athletic players they would also keep their window of contention open a little longer.
Or they could just stay the course ……..
Why would they Not want this guy for a few more years
Payroll. To fill other needs, gotta cut somewhere.
For reasons listed in the article obviously.
Keep Abreu, he’s absolutely your most consistently on-the-field best hitting player. When he is done in 2 or 3 years then you have Sheets as the next logical choice at 1st. Which leaves Vaughn out….as much as I like him, he is just not a good fit for what the Sox need. Package up him and Giolito….who has 2023 and then he’s a FA……and get some useful return (such as Alec Bohm at 3rd base and move Moncada into the Leury Garcia role…mostly 2nd base). Re-sign Andrus and Cueto and dump all of Leury, Engel, and Josh Harrison.
Excellent!
Earlier today I noted that with the way he plays 3B Bohm would fit in perfectly with the Sox. And moving Moncada back to 2B where he played before evokes memories of Jorge Orta. With Anderson at SS and Abreu at 1B Sox fans would be talking about that infield even more than they do today.
Of course the Phillies don’t really need a 1B, but perhaps a 3 team trade could worked out. The Sox might even be able to pry Nick Castellanos away from the Phillies to platoon in RF with Gavin Sheets. With Eroy in LF all you need now is to see if it’s possible to get catcher James McCann back from the Mets!
Sarcasm duly noted. An infield of Abreu, Moncada/Andrus, Anderson, and Bohm would be league average. in the field. Sheets mostly at DH and Abreu’s backup at 1B with an outfield of Eloy, Robert, and Pollock (who will exercise his player option for 2023 and won’t be tradeable at his option price) and, as always, that elusive left hand hitting right fielder (which Moncada could conceivably fill in the part time the Leury swing role). The Moncada, Grandal contracts means they aren’t going anywhere (unless JR wants to eat salary…that ain’t happening). So yeah, stuck with some bad contracts, leaving not alot of flexibility but not as bad as you cast it to be.. Hope springs eternal
This is some really poor logic. Why would you turn your best fielder, who plays one of the most critical positions into a utility player? Moncada has been s gold glove finalist and provides near elite defense, even when he was struggling with his timing due to Covid and a malady of injuries. If anything, they have the utility position down with Elvis if they resign him or Josh.
Look at Moncada’s career batting numbers.. 253 BA, 17 hrs a yr (and 60 RBI, both averages based on about 500 ABs a year. That screams 2nd base, definitely not 3rd base where, like 1st base you count on power and RBI production. And I was wrong about Alec Bohm, his defensive metrics are brutal. So I’m back to my original “pray that Nolan Arenado opts out of his last 5 years and offer him $42 mil per year for the next 5 0r 6 years.. Moncada now 27 yrs old on a really elite team is exactly suited for the Leury Garcia swingman infield/outfield role and nothing more.
Wonder if the Cubs could be an option on maybe a 2 year deal. They need a 1b/middle order guy w veteran leadership. Be an easier change than going elsewhere.
Exactly what I’ve been thinking since the Cubs added Franmil Reyes. I wouldn’t mind seeing them try to sign Abreu for 2 years around $35m. I know Mervis looks to be ready, but this way they can break him in a little more slowly and Mervis can also DH some too, as I’m sure Abreu is a better defender than Mervis. This would add more power to the middle of their lineup and give time for the rest of their power hitting prospects to develop, and best part, with no long term commitment, then they can better fill holes with free agent signings further down the line after they know what they really have with all their prospects.
The Cubs are going to non-tender Reyes so coming back isn’t a sure thing. I know the front office guys from Cleveland love him but there may be a team out there willing to give him more money. I’m not even sure the cubs would offer him a ML contract.
Abreu would be a decent fit in the Cubs line up depending on what they do at short stop and what that means for Nico. Do they target a short stop and move Nico to third? If so, what does that mean for Wisdom? I personally think the Cubs would like to keep Wisdom as a low cost power option/place holder depending on how aggressive they are with Mervis. Based on Ross’s comments, the Cubs are hoping Mervis will be in Chicago early next season…
Cubs need to do something about their middle of the order. Reyes is ok but he isnt what they need. I dont believe Mervis is really a significant prospect. Guys w his profile dont tend to be much more than AAA mashers. Bring in a guy who is established and if the prospects force their way, great.
As far as not believing in Mervis… thats exactly why I’d like a guy like Abreu so we actually have someone who’s worth a damn there in the middle of the order instead of thinking a rookie is gonna be “the guy.” Hence why I’d like to see them break him in slowly in good matchups. Maybe he actually can develop into a good DH or 1st baseman, but I’m not gonna hold my breath.
He’s coming to Seattle to be our DH.
Even though I think the Sox have made some poor decisions, I will say this: Rob Manfred kind of screwed them. This team was specifically built for 2019, the ball that was being used then, and the accompanying style of play. If the game was still glorified HR Derby the way it was in 2019, the outlook for the White Sox would be very different. It’s hard enough building a successful team, but it gets a lot harder when the league decision makers are insecure, thin skinned, yes men.
You are making the argument that Williams and Hahn built this team with the fore knowledge that a juiced ball would be used in 2019? Every team had a few players have career years in 2019, and were fooled into thinking they had a breakout player.
The front office has been terrible. The white sox are a poorly constructed roster and probably at max payroll. The one guy that can actually play defense and hit is constantly injured. They need a massive retool.
The DH logjam has to be addressed this off-season but someone will have to be traded or not resigned. If Abreu is resigned he should be DH only, then Vaughn can play 1B and the sox can try and trade Jimenez. Or if they don’t retain Abreu then could DH Jimenez and have Vaughn be 1B and Sheets could hopefully fake it in LF.
He deserves a ring. Not sure he’ll get one staying with the Sox.
The ChiSox must fix their defense. Maybe just let Jose Abreu walk and acquire a good defensive 2B. Addition by subtraction.
Both Gavin Sheets and Andrew Vaughn were 1B in MiLB. Neither were great fielders. Vaughn was rushed straight from A with little exposure there. Adam Engel, Luis Robert and AJ Pollock are good OFs but Eloy Jimenez is a DH.
Yoan Moncada was a very poor 2B so he must remain at 3B. Tim Anderson is a passable but underwhelming SS and he is no unifying team leader. Meanwhile Josh Harrison and Elvis Andrus looked like GG compared to the rest of the team.
Anderson to 2B could improve defense
Although there have been exceptions, poor defensive SS like Tim Anderson don’t become good defensively when they change positions at the MLB level.
Hanley Ramirez and Carlos Guillen were poor defensive SS and didn’t perform well in other positions. Jose Offerman was a poor defensive SS and did improve at 2B for just one season before turning into a poor defensive 2B too. Jorge Polanco is a poor defensive SS and only slightly better 2B.
Conversely, Marcus Semien and Jean Segura were good defensive SS and even better defensive 2B. Ernie Banks was a rangy SS. He gets my GG in 1955 and 1959. An old knee injury from his Army days reduced his mobility and was move off SS to LF then to 1B.
Simmons is and was an elite defender at short stop but was unwatchable playing second base. Same with Addison Russel.
A lot of people think if you have enough athleticism to play short you can play second but that obviously isn’t always the case. Reads are different, turns are different. If you’ve been plying shortstop for your entire career, trying to train your body mechanics to mirror things on the other side of the bag isn’t an easy task.
Why would they?
I really want the guards to sign abreu. Get rid of miller and DH Naylor.
Tim Anderson is going to make $12MM. Has proven he can hit .300 and plays just below average SS. Most of his errors are throwing errors to a less than average fielding 1B. If Tim Anderson was asking Lindor or Seager money I’d pass…bit he’s not and is still a bargain.
Word on the streets in Bridgeport is that Tom Paciorek is in negotiations to come out of retirement to take over at first . Stay tuned
The Sox starting point for 2023 is not good. Moncada, Grandal, Pollock, and Lynn are essentially untradeable due to their contracts/options for 2023. So for 3 hitters who can’t hit .250 and a #3 (at best) starter the Sox have tied up about 64 million in payroll for 2023. Add in players who don’t play more that about 2/3 of the season, Kopech, Jimenez, and Robert and together the Sox have 7 key players who they can only trade if they sell low (injury prone), or pick up most of their 2023 salary…..JR won’t do that. Add in Giolito who is one year from hitting FA….and determined to do so . So that’s where we are starting from in 2023….so yeah let’s focus on letting Abreu walk.
I thought AJ Pollock was out too?
I think Tim Anderson should be traded early in the off season before any free agent SS goes off the market.
Andrew Vaughn, Yoan Moncada and Gavin Sheets (bats LH) should not be traded.
Gary;
You have great points and perspective.
Tim Anderson would fit well in Miami. They’re pretty much lost. He’d get them going as a lead-off man with Jazz hitting behind him. The fans would eat up his hotdogging; along with Jazz running the bases would give them something – finally – to get excited over.
Sox could get a decent starting pitcher out of the deal. Marlins would want to extend Anderson to do the deal, but that could probably be worked out – he’s not getting $30m-plus. His D will limit them of course, but that team’s not going to compete against the Braves, Mets, and Phillies in for foreseeable future.
Cease and Vaughn are not going anywhere.
I’ve had a soft spot in my heart for Jose ever since I picked him up in 2014 for my fantasy team and he helped me win the league.
I too have always liked Jose Abreu , been one of my favourites, but going forward , as 1B DH who can’t run anymore , and dwindled power (15 doesn’t cut it ) , his big payday long gone.
Abreu has gotten too many people pregnant to remain in Chicago. If Seattle doesn’t offer him a 5yr/25 mil per deal, I see him returning to Japan or outright retiring to continue his faith based leadership service. Former Sox Paul Konerko compared him to Ray Charles saying that he doesn’t see too well but gives a lot of his money to underprivileged youth
Slider, TA has the pregnant problem. That’s why he continues to have groin pulls.
Off topic … Rob Mackowiak is the front runner to take over LaRussa’s spot. Sitting in Connie’s pizza and Kenny Williams walked in. Asked him about who is likely to take over and surprise surprise.
Lmfao. And exactly what major league managerial experience does Rob have? Hahn told us the new manager will have recently managed in MLB. The only was Girardi isn’t hired is if he decides to go elsewhere.
For a guy who’s dropped off like Abreu has, he still maintains an impressive WAR number, indicating what production he still creates is very valuable- his hits count, his home runs count, his defensive and running issues aren’t a terrible detriment.
I think he’d be in line for a 1 year/$12.5M deal- similar to the kinds of deals that Nelson Cruz was worth and could command for a while there.
How is Giolito going to get a raise? He was the most under performing starter way way below his 2021 numbers he went from a 3.53 to a 4.90 era… 17 less innings pitched.. blew soo many games.
Going back 3 or 4 years, Giolito has resisted all efforts by the Sox to sign him to a long term deal…..as they do with young players along way from free agency. So he’s all in for free agency and the Sox pretty much turned their back on him, even fighting him in arbitration over not much of a difference in his ask and their offer. So he’s gone and bet on himself which has blown up in his face with a miserable 2022. Will he have a career year in 2023?…..as there are millions on the line if he does or doesn’t. Doesn’t matter, he’s a FA for sure after next year. Trade him, some contender such as the Braves can take a shot on rent-a-starter. and perhaps retain him afterward. He’s done with the Sox
Yeah, maybe the Braves will trade you Marcell Ozuna for Giolito. Deal? Ask nicely and they might even throw Eddie Rosario in as a sweetener. That’s a nice 2 for 1 our trash for yours trade. Have Kenny call AA………
One of the most underappreciated players in Baseball Just getting too old for a lot of money. He signed at a late age. Too bad for him. I think he should give the Sox a real hometown discount.
You don’t need a lineup of .300 hitters just a few. You need RBI guys when the opportunity presents itself. Anyone who didn’t play 100 games this year is movable. You need durable players that avg. at least one hit per game. I much rather have a great defensive player that is on the field at least 150 games per season than so called .300 hitters that don’t play 100 games. The return of Mendick adds to the competition if healthy, he was hitting .280 with NO ERRORS before a stupid collision ended his season. He and Andrus are the mold for a reliable infield with Abreu on board. TA is not a leader by example, all hype with no seasonal longevity. TA to Angels and the pickup of Ohtani fills two Sox needs. 3B is a mess, Eloy and TA are DH material they can’t play defense, it showed while they were on the field. Two moves that worked Andrus and Cueto, the rest were very questionable. There will be no excuses for the paycheck collectors in the front office with a new manager. They created the mess , the players had no heart losing 8 in row at the end of the stretch drive showed that. Time for Hahn and KW to quit looking to be smooth, they need a lot of grit.
The only players worth keeping are Cease and Hendriks.
I disagree with that. If you’re starting a rebuild, Hendriks is expendable because he won’t be on the roster still by the time they’re ready to compete. If you’re not starting a rebuild, Eloy as a DH only (or maybe with spot starts at 1B) could be a monster. He’s hit very well whenever he’s healthy. Abreu’s consistent and it’s only his launch angle dropping to a career low that’s robbed him of his HR’s. If that reverts to career norms, his HR’s will be back in the upper 20’s to low 30’s and he’s become a solid defensive 1B. Kopech is still ramping up his workload, but had a solid season. Crochet lost a year due to TJS, but was pitching well until then. Luis Robert has averaged 5.5bWAR/162 in his career, and those numbers are dragged down by playing hurt the last month of this year. He’s had a hard time staying healthy, but when healthy, he provides solid All-Star level production. So the Sox have several worthwhile individual contributors, provided they’re not kicking off a rebuild, which I don’t think they will. If they disappoint again next season, then I think it’s something to seriously consider.
Flamerthrower being hurt hasnt hurt their buying a 12mil dollar mansion maybe the heavy wallet is the source of the injuries. If they can’t play 100 games out of 162 then tell the union to stuff it and get guys who know how to stay healthy. I would say they all really need Heart Surgery. Ticket prices are going up as well as the fans blood pressures. Sox fans demand credible play, if the players can’t provide it move them to the Cubs country club.
You’ll note that I left out certain players: chief among them Moncada and Giolito, who massively underperformed this year. As for the injuries, I blame the players for not taking their offseason workouts and stretching seriously enough (they have all been through an offseason before and should know what to do to keep in shape), the training staff, and in some cases, bad judgment, such as a head-first slide. It doesn’t get you in faster and it risks injury. There’s no good reason to do it.
That aside, you’re right, some of the players showed little to no heart. Most of them took plays off at one time or another. It was really Cease, Abreu, and Hendriks who always seemed to want to be out there, even on those relatively rare nights they were off their game. Moncada, though, just didn’t seem to care at all. If the Sox could buy him out of his remaining years, I’d love it.
I love Abreu, but time for a change. I do not care about what the numbers may try to show, I watched Abreu a lot and saw him miss a lot of pitches down the middle, and being late on fastballs. also… 15 homers all season….I think its also telling that Abreu sat out the last game as he wanted to have a ‘managers perspective’ on the game.
Who ever the manager is going to be they have to be able to make decisions that may make the FO wince if there are large contracts involved, like benching guys that make three errors in a game, guys that commit little league base running gaffes, guys that let a ball drop right out of their glove (or worse yet, bounce off of their head). Accountability has been lacking in the past few seasons and this is supposedly a team built to win it all. Time to hold the prima donnas accountable.. Also ensure these guys are adhering to a fitness regiment to ensure they stay healthy all season.. No more silly hamstring, quad, groin, and abdominal soft tissue injuries. Guys like Moncada, Jimenez, Anderson (if he is still on this team), and Robert have to decide how bad they want to win. Do they want to make lifestyle changes to ensure they are healthy and stay healthy all season. These guys have shown, in spurts, that they can perform well, time to see it consistently.
It’s Vaughn and Sheets time, and Jose need to got where he can actually win a ring. Dude only has a few years left.