11:12am: The Pirates have announced the signing of Fleming and also confirmed their previously reported one-year deal with veteran catcher Yasmani Grandal. In order to create roster space, right-hander Johan Oviedo and catcher Endy Rodriguez were both placed on the 60-day injured list. Both are expected to miss the 2024 season after requiring surgery to repair the ulnar collateral ligament in their respective throwing elbows.
8:45am: The Pirates and lefty Josh Fleming are in agreement on a split major league contract, reports Robert Murray of FanSided. The Republik Sports client will earn $850K if he’s in the big leagues. Pittsburgh will need to open a spot on the 40-man roster for Fleming to make the contract official.
While Fleming’s deal is a split contract, meaning it comes with different rates of pay in the big leagues and in Triple-A, he’s out of minor league options as well. The minor league salary will only come into play in the event that the Pirates remove him from the 40-man roster and pass him through waivers. At that point, Fleming could reject an outright assignment in favor of free agency, but doing so would require forfeiting the rates of pay on his deal with the Pirates, and he’d be no lock to secure more favorable terms in free agency. As such, he’d likely accept a minor league assignment if that scenario presents itself.
The 27-year-old Fleming pitched for the Rays in each of the past four seasons, working out of both the bullpen and the starting rotation at times. He also operated as a bulk reliever following an opener in Tampa Bay at times. The southpaw has just 2.144 years of Major League service time and can thus be controlled for another four seasons.
Fleming has, at times, looked like a quality fifth starter or swingman. He pitched 51 2/3 innings with the Rays in 2023 and logged a 4.70 ERA with a career-low 11.8% strikeout rate with an 8.6% walk rate while dealing with elbow inflammation. Back in 2020, he made his MLB debut with 32 1/3 innings of 2.78 ERA ball. Overall, Fleming has 223 1/3 innings in the big leagues with a 4.88 ERA, 14.9% strikeout rate, 7.1% ground-ball rate and a huge 59% grounder rate. The Pirates, per Murray, view him as a long reliever and occasional spot starter.
Although he’s split his time fairly evenly between the bullpen and rotation in the big leagues, Fleming has been far more effective as a reliever (3.73 ERA) than as a starter (6.10 ERA). Right-handed opponents have been a challenge in particular; he’s yielded a .288/.351/.451 slash to opponents who hold the platoon advantage over him.
By the Pirates’ standards, it’s been an active season in free agency. They haven’t handed out any multi-year deals — a common theme throughout Ben Cherington’s time as general manager — but have agreed to one-year pacts with Aroldis Chapman ($10.5MM), Martin Perez ($8MM), Andrew McCutchen ($5MM), Rowdy Tellez ($3.2MM) and Yasmani Grandal ($2.5MM). Pittsburgh also picked up veteran lefty Marco Gonzales in a trade, and he’ll join Perez in filling out the rotation behind Mitch Keller. Pittsburgh has been seeking additional rotation arms, and while Fleming gives them a potential spot starter, he’s unlikely to be penciled in as a full-time rotation member from day one. Further additions to the starting staff, whether via trade or free agency, still seem likely for the Bucs.
I’m assuming as long relief/spot starter?
I’m assuming you didn’t read the article?
Mostlytoasty made this comment right after the initial article was put up. At that time, all it said was what is in the 1st paragraph, that Fleming was signed and a 40-man roster spots would have to be created…then it said “more to come”. I saw it then, too, and assumed the same…that he would be competing with Falter for a LHP, long relief/spot starter spot on the roster. fre5hwind obviously didn’t see the article until after they added in more details.
Makes sense
Bill Murray views him as a long reliever, occasional spot starter, and gopher in Caddyshack III.
One look at his numbers, yuck.
Cherington is in dumpster diving mode since he was unable to sign a significant free agent pitcher who could actually contribute to the team this season
You don’t know what numbers to look at then.
I followed him living in Tampa for years. Not overpowering obviously but when he’s on, and following heat, he can do the job. Like most lefty soft tossers, he needs to keep the ball down. Otherwise not pretty.
As a reliever his numbers are better. That’s why you dont just look at overall stats for a minute.
Exactly. Lights out 1 inning, a torch the next
Good value pickup, The only time he didn’t place in the 98th or higher percentile for Ground Balls was 2021, and he still was in the 93rd percentile. Pair that GB% with Ke’Bryan Hayes in the hot corner and you got a stew going, baby.
Nice pickup, he’ll have a role with pirates guaranteed!
Another attempt to catch lightning in a bottle without spending any money. The usual Pirate M.O.
Would it be better if they signed him to a multi year million dollar contract? Ignore what they’re paying, pay attention to the possible value. We’ll see.
It would be better if they actually signed a starter of some worth, even on a one year contract
The usual MO of most of the league not located in a giant market with huge local TV revenues. There I fixed it for you.
When you finish the last 2 months of the season with exactly two viable and traditional starting pitchers, it’s clear you need depth, and that’s what this is.
He’s an upgrade with a better track record than Falter. Both are out of options. Falter becomes more expendable as late spring trade piece when teams without good depth suffer injuries. It allows the Pirates to start Hernandez in the minors to start the season. Fleming also fetches you more at the trade deadline if the season gets untracked and he’s doing well. Some of those ugly numbers are going to improve at PNC, given the advantage lefties have pitching here.
Rather than complain and an iterate the unoriginal line that the Pirates are being cheap, you might want to actually become a fan and student of baseball and understand that this was a smart signing for a club that’s hamstrung by revenue inequity and needs to grab every opportunity they can to find value.
Pirates where in the top 10 of average viewership as far as tv ratings go in 2024 pretty amazing. Shame their TV deal went belly up, this new deal was expected to be a significant drop in TV revenue the last I looked. But does look good for fans
The other side of that coin, from an optimistic view, is that the Pirates were not alone in regional sports deals turning into disasters. It’s a bit of a nice tailwind toward the discussion that local revenues should be shared equally. When the Rangers win the World Series and have their own deal cut by several million dollars it’s a strong indicator that the league needs to address the situation — as a league and not as individual franchises.
It won’t happen without some hard-fought battles, but the next CBA could either insure the MLB’s future or doom it to irrelevance within a decade or two. True revenue sharing, service time rules, floor and caps – it all needs to be on the table. The on-field product will fix itself when we can start seeing 20-year-old phenoms again and more balanced rosters that give every team a chance.
I’m not a fan of the revenue sharing as it is for sure.. pretty sure they are shared equally as a percentage paying in. and equal in total when paying out. which ends up being horrible for those on the top of the heap but great for those on the bottom.
If it was fully used as intended it wouldn’t be too bad for the league. but since much of it isn’t used for on the field mlb talent, from a fans point of view it doesn’t look like it is helping and when the owners dare to turn a profit at the same time some accuse them of pocketing the money.
making those rules more firm would be huge.
Pundit-Constant negativity is somewhat common among some Pirates fans but I think that both of us can understand why with 27 losing seasons in 31 years.
That is not pretty and can put fans in a negative trance.
That being said I think that your retort was eloquentlywritten and deserved a well earned thumbs up.
Thank you. The losing seasons would be a little more palatable if people made an effort to understand the economic situation the Pirates (and several other franchises) face.
The Pirates have not always made the smartest decisions with development or personnel, and when combined with just not having the money to spend, you get 27 of 31 losing years. I get that, and I don’t hold the Pirates blameless for the losing.
To me, “the Pirates are cheap”, or any variant of it, is essentially a die-hard Steelers’ fan looking up from their team for a moment when they see a Pirates’ headline, and — knowing almost nothing about baseball’s inner workings or their hometown team’s system beyond a few names — just figure everyone will sing along with the same tired and patently false chorus.
When you finish with two pitchers and your owner states that they plan to be competitive then you need notable starters. Most of what they have is depth. Even though they have good prospects coming they need a couple of good starters now!
Pirates pundit – couldn’t agree more. Excellent post
We loaded on 5th starters!
We’re certainly in better shape going into this season than last, when I pointed out that the team was a few injuries away from looking off the cliff at the end of their starting pitching depth and seeing Osvaldo Bido waving back up at them.
Perez is getting an unfair shake in respect to his numbers last season, his game log tracks very similar to Keller’s, and he was replaced in the Rangers rotation by Max Scherzer. He actually pitched like a 3 or 4 outside of like 4 bad games. Gonzales was hurt last year, and is also a solid #3 or #4 on any team if he’s back to form.
And one of Priester, Ortiz or Contreras, should they learn to harness their stuff and actually learn to pitch (sequencing, location, etc), would certainly reach a ceiling higher than a #5 guy.
Fleming and Falter are #5 guys. I think of Jeff Karstens or Josh Fogg when I think of #5 guys, and those two fit that profile. The rest do not.
I agree with a good bit of what you write. I like Keller and Perez! The rest of the rotation not so much! Bunch of 5th starters! Gonzalez stinks! He’s a depth pitcher at best! I do agree Roansy needs to bounce back or Priester needs to learn how to be effective! Those are the upside arms! No rookies will start with the Pirates or that would be exciting.
Don’t get me wrong, I don’t Marco is a great pitcher, but the Pirates are a great situation for him in terms of pitching in a place that can play to his strengths. He could be a legit #3 guy for the Pirates, but not necessarily another team, due to fly balls into the notch being outs here and HRs elsewhere. He’d have to be a Matt Morris-style disaster to not return value to the Pirates based on his current salary structure.
Obviously Skenes, but beyond him there are some arms worth watching. I saw Bubba Chandler in person at Greensboro this past summer and I’d say that if he continues to grow into a pitcher, he’ll be in the upper half of the rotation a few years down the road. But he’s far from ready, and honestly, I 100% get why Skenes wouldn’t start on the big club from Day 1 with the service time thing. People can say the Pirates are cheap, but they would be utter buffoons to blow a year of service time of him on a few months this spring.
Perez has had two ‘good’ seasons in his 12 year career and a bunch of okay for a bottom of the rotation pitcher.
Gonzales had a string of some pretty good seasons but has declined dramatically for whatever reason.
both have a reasonable chance to be bottom rotation types and a less reasonable midrotation types. with a pretty darn unlikely of being better than that.. baseball is wierd though.. they might catch lightning in a bottle or they might not even be in the MLB in May.
Depending who the PTBNL will determine if the trade was worth it. Hopefully it isn’t someone near in the top 10ish of the prospect rankings.
So instead of finishing 8 games back of the final wildcard spot, us fans are supposed to feel good about finishing 3-6 games back this year?
I, for one, look at the Pirates offseason as an abject failure to do what was required to make most fans believe they are indeed trying to compete for the postseason.
The only thing that BC secured this winter was profitability in 2024, and a good place to begin the fiscal ‘24/‘25 year next November by not signing any multi-year FA deals.
Yea they said they were going after Starting pitching and was prepared to offer years! So we thrift store shopping again!
You’re right, it’s short of making “most fans believe believe they are indeed trying to compete for the postseason”. That’s because most fans think fancy names and just having a roster full of expensive players means you’re competing for the post-season. If you actually believe that, the 2023 Mets and Padres say hold their respective beers.
The odds of surviving a 162-game season with the same 26 guys on your roster all season are longer than winning a Powerball drawing. Teams compete for the postseason through their depth and when a player or two overachieves.
What the Pirates have done this offseason is given themselves depth they did not have last year (with some admitted weak spots at 1B and SP). Few teams can survive major injuries to their stars, but the 2024 Pirates are better positioned to absorb, say, losing Reynolds for 3 months, than last year’s team.
And since the rest of the NL Central’s teams have an equal amount of flaws to the Pirates do (with their currently-assembled 2024 roster), most fans might not believe they can’t compete for the postseason, but that’s because most fans don’t really read up enough on the competition to understand that the NL Central is a race to around 86 wins, and the Pirates are definitely within reach of that.
Yes they added Quantity over Quality! However downgrade at 1B. RF is a question mark but I do like Olivares for when Suwinski goes cold for a month!
SP Keller then you have a bunch of guys that you’re hoping someone does well! Not really how contending teams do business! Yes though we have more options than last season!
If Cabrera trade happens and if the Pirates would shock the world and sign Clevinger then I can see it!
Keller
Clevinger
Cabrera
Perez
Roansy, Priester, Gonzalez etc!
That’s still not great but you add Skenes and all of a sudden you have a chance to start the window!
What’s MUCH more exciting is a recent rumor that the Pirates have a chance to acquire RHP Edward Cabrera from the Marlins. Florida M’s beat writers are on this right now….
I like what the pirates have done this off-season. They have tweeked the roster without committing a lot of money to do so, while also allowing space for the young players to get a opportunity to play.
What they have done is what they always do: Sign castoffs, knowing that they’ll only have to pay half that amount, since they’ll be shipped out at the deadline in exchange for another prospect who’ll turn into another suspect, then tell us how they put money into the team.
That’s what all rebuilding teams do. I like it, and I like the guys they have brought in. Decent bounce back candidates and veterans.
If they end the offseason by getting him then I will be satisfied. As long as they don’t trade Skenes, Johnson, or Henry Davis who I still have some hope in.
Cabrera wouldn’t fetch any of those three. The Marlins wouldn’t ask for any of them and the Pirates wouldn’t trade any of them for someone of Cabrera’s caliber.
He’s probably going to fetch a pitching prospect from the tier of Ashcraft/Harrington/Priester/Barco, an MLB ready young position player (Bae/Gonzales/Peguero/Triolo/etc.), and a lower level prospect or MLB depth.
If the Pirates decide to give up someone like Jones or Solometo, then the rest of the package would be insignificant and comprised of either MLB depth or lower level guys.
I don’t think the top name is so much a sticking point as the second player in the trade. If it’s Johnson, that’s why it isn’t done for sure. I don’t think they’d ask for Skenes, at least not unless they wanted to hear Cherington laugh hysterically for the next minute on the phone.
My thought is that the Pirates would most rather part with Bae or Gonzales which is driving up the price on the second guy, and they’re balking at a Harrington, Jones, Solometo or Chandler ask.
Yeah, that’s what I was basically saying. If it’s one of Bae, Peguero, or Gonzales, then the second piece has to be someone like Ashcraft, Harrington, Priester, or Barco (whichever the Marlins prefer).
If the Marlins are asking for Jones or Solometo, if I’m the Pirates I would balk as well. They wouldn’t get any of the middle infielders if that’s the case and only a low level prospect or two. I would also laugh in their face if they asked for Chandler or Johnson, Cabrera isn’t worth either. If the Marlins refuse to relent on someone like Johnson or Chandler you just walk away if you’re the Pirates and call them back at the trade deadline lol.
That’s just a repeat article rumor on Rumbunter of a writer who really, really, really wants to see that happen.
“7.1% ground-ball rate and a huge 59% grounder rate” you say? That’s quite impressive.
Corresponding moves to open roster space will be transferring Rodriguez and Brubaker to 60 day DL to open spots for Fleming and Grandal.
Oviedo is out for the year. They could gamble Brubaker is back before 60 day expires but Oviedo is a no brainer for the 60 day DL.
Michael Burrows is another guarantee to be moved to the 60 day DL. I think they’ll move Rodriguez, Oviedo, and Burrows for now, and then at a later date Brubaker if necessary for 40 man space (or his return date is determined to be beyond 60 days).
Ovie and Endy hit the 60 today to make room for Fleming and Grandal. Burrows will be next, Brubaker if they have to. Assuming they’ll hold onto Brubaker’s designation for as long as they can to both figure out where he’s at and in case they want a spot for someone who gets crowded off another team’s roster.
I can see why the Rays didn’t want him. Low K% and high BB%? Wow! Combine that with his career high 90.7 average exit velocity and it doesn’t look good. His actual FRA in 2023 was 5.33, meaning he overachieved his ERA of 4.70. I guess for 850K, it’s not a terrible loss of money but this isn’t going to put the Pirates in any form of improving their season.
They didn’t sign him for his k rate.
@YourDreamGM
I guess you misread my post. It wasn’t just about K%.
I read it. They don’t care about walking rate or exit velocity either. They sign guys and get them to change pitch usage. Maybe decrease walks. Usually works out. He will automatically be better just pitching at PNC. Just a depth signing. They still might sign another arm and have 4 rotation spots locked down. Half a dozen guys will compete for last spot.
He did not pitch well last year, or really any year, but my first reaction and where I slot him on this roster, is that he’s a marginal improvement over Falter. It’s probably an “either/or” situation on the roster, both are out of options, so you see who is ready out of the gate and ditch the other guy. Once you’ve covered enough innings to get Brubaker, Burrows or Skenes into the mix, this is the guy who gets bumped out unless someone else pitches themselves off the roster.
You’re fooling yourself if you think this a “move the needle” kind of signing, the best we can hope for is circa 2010-12 Jeff Karstens – a few good games and lot of others where he just keeps you close. With the bullpen the way it is, that’s a better recipe than you’d think to win games.
@PiratesPundit51
I honestly think, from my experience with Pirates fans, that they are so jaded by their team’s lack of success over the decades that they almost become instantly defensive of anyone posting about their team or players. I gave my opinion on the signing but I don’t think I suggested it would “move the needle”.
Fleming is merely a body that can throw the ball, nothing more
And at the rock bottom price, if he flops, the amount of money spent, won’t break Nutting’s bank account
Fleming can be a shot in the arm for Pittsburgh.
That’s a pretty deep reference, one has to wonder if Sir Alexander had a good curve.
another nice pickup given his great minor league play when he first came into the league.
But not game changing that’s for sure. They need more proven signings. I guess Chapman does fit in that box but need that in a starter.
Given the possible end of year rotation being full of prospects they probably don’t want to put a lot of money into it.
Keller, Priester, Skenes, Jones, Solometo, Burrows, etc.. assuming health.
Burrows is recovering from TJ surgery and not expected to return until July or August, they aren’t going to bring up Skenes until August, same with Jones and Solometo
Priester is unproven and Keller can’t return to post 2023 AS form if they expect to be competitive
Another A+ signing. Cherington is having a off season worthy of the archives.
after signing Josh Van Meter a few years back, BC can’t get any worse , so it’s all uphill now