Much of the focus on the White Sox’ trade efforts this offseason will center around Garrett Crochet, and with good reason — he’s the top starting pitcher who’s readily available on the market. However, heading into the 2024 campaign, it was Luis Robert Jr. who was seen as Chicago’s potential top prize at the deadline. Another slate of injuries ruined the talented but fragile center fielder’s ’24 campaign and further added to his reputation as an injury-prone player. The Sox are still hoping to move Robert, writes Bob Nightengale of USA Today, but one rival general manager tells Nightengale that Chicago’s asking price is simply unrealistic, given all of the health concerns surrounding Robert.
“You’ve got to hope he finally stays healthy and can be the player everyone envisioned all along,” that GM said. “But the White Sox are acting like he’s some big star center fielder and are asking for your top prospects.”
It’s understandable that the Sox would be reluctant to sell low on Robert. He’s among the most talented players in the sport when healthy — he just simply hasn’t been healthy for the majority of his career. Robert has had six IL placements dating back to the 2021 season, many of which sidelined him for significant periods of time. A hip flexor strain in 2021 sidelined him for more than three months. He missed more than two months this past season owing to the same injury. Robert has also been shelved for a wrist sprain, an MCL sprain, and a more ominous viral infection in 2022 that resulted in blurred vision, dizziness and lightheadedness.
That massive slate of injuries looked to have taken its toll on Robert this past season. He landed on the injured list just a week into the season and returned in June but never really found his footing. Robert hit five homers in his first 36 plate appearances upon activation — but he only collected one other hit in that time. He tallied 396 plate appearances post-injury in 2024 and slashed just .225/.281/.370 with a 32% strikeout rate.
Clearly, that’s not the type of production that’s going to generate interest in a player who’s owed a $15MM salary next season. However, from 2021-23, Robert slashed a combined .287/.331/.511 with 63 homers and 37 steals in just 1292 plate appearances. He played plus-plus defense in center field along the way; despite playing only 301 games in that three-year span, Robert tallied 21 Outs Above Average — good for 12th among all major league outfielders. That strong run was headlined by a 2023 campaign — Robert’s age-25 season — during which he hit .264/.315/.542 and popped 38 home runs in a career-high 595 trips to the plate. Robert made the All-Star team, won a Silver Slugger, and drew some downballot MVP votes.
That’s the type of upside any team would be hoping to land when acquiring Robert. Unfortunately, while his per-game and per-inning performance in 2021-23 was excellent, that 2023 season is the only one in which Robert has exceeded 425 plate appearances. He’s appeared in only 65.9% of possible games in his five-year run with the White Sox.
Robert’s 2024 season wasn’t without its silver linings. His average sprint speed, per Statcast, ticked up to 28.8 feet per second — the second-best mark of his career. He’d been down at a still-strong but not-elite 27.9 ft/sec the first time he dealt with a hip flexor strain. His speed bounced back more this time around. And while his defensive grades dipped, that was largely due to some errant throws. Statcast still rated Robert’s range quite strongly. He also sat in the 84th percentile of MLB hitters in bat speed and typically hit the ball hard (90.1 mph average exit velocity, 40.6% hard-hit rate) when he made contact. He just didn’t make contact enough (career-worst 32.8% strikeout rate).
Robert’s contract pays him $15MM next year. There are a pair of matching $20MM club options for the 2026 and 2027 seasons on the deal. Getting the 2021-23 version of Robert for the next three seasons at a combined $55MM would be a steal, even if he spent about one-third of that time on the injured list, as he did in ’21-’23. (Both Baseball-Reference and FanGraphs agree Robert was worth about 10.5 WAR during that run, even with the missed time.)
The problem for interested teams, of course, is that there’s no guarantee he’ll get back to that level of play. Taking a one-year, $15MM flier is probably appealing to many outfield-needy clubs, particularly with the pair of club options looming. Taking on that salary and surrendering top-tier prospects is another story entirely. From the White Sox’ vantage point, trading Robert to simply clear $15MM in guaranteed money would be foolhardy. They barely have any money on the books, with an estimated payroll in the $75MM range, per RosterResource. That’s half their 2024 payroll. Selling low on Robert and watching him bounce back to stardom elsewhere would be agonizing for the Sox and their fans.
It all makes Robert a very difficult player to trade this winter. The Sox have no urgency to shed the relatively small amount that remains on his contract. Other clubs surely feel there’s little sense in trading top-tier prospects for an oft-injured player coming off a 100-game season that was the least-productive stint of his career.
The likeliest outcome would seem to be a midseason trade. If Robert bounces back, the Sox can put him back on the block and effectively market two-plus years of his services. If he continues to struggle, they could move him for a light return, knowing the eventual likelihood was that his option would be bought out anyhow. Perhaps a team could throw caution to the wind and make a surprisingly strong offer for him in the near future, but that seems unlikely. The Sox did move Dylan Cease in spring training when his Cactus League performance quieted some concerns about a pedestrian 2023 season, so it’s possible a big spring from Robert could garner some attention. In all likelihood, though, he seems ticketed to remain on the Sox to open the season, and clubs around the game will keep a close eye on his early performance. If he shows well in April, Chicago GM Chris Getz could follow in Miami counterpart Peter Bendix’s footsteps and make Robert available in late April/early May — as the Marlins did with Luis Arraez.
We’ll give you a middle-innings relief pitcher, and nothing more.
As a Sox fan I can tell you that this guy would be a superstar with any good franchise. The Sox should definitely hold out for a big return.
He’s the type of guy that would really thrive on a good team where he isn’t expected to shoulder the load of the offense and he has a more professional organization around him. He’s gonna be great for somebody.
Then you will be holding out for awhile.
Robert reminds me of Justin Upton.
Lot of raw talent but lacks the consistency and approach
Robert is one of the best CFs in baseball when healthy. But so is Buxton. If they really want off of their present teams they’ll suck it up and play and prove it. The injuries are definitely part of it, But maybe their preparation and commitment to the game are what’s needed. All I know they’re of no use on the IL to anyone.
Justin Upton? He would probably love to have that guys career. More like BJ Upton.
As a baseball fan I can tell you this guy is nowhere near a superstar. He’s had one superstar year, the rest were ravaged with injuries or simply average. They should have traded him last year, he would not have made a difference. Huge missed opportunity
Eloy and Roberts have to be two of the most over-hyped prospects of all time. Eloy got shipped off for nothing and Roberts is heading that way.
Roberts? The Dodger manager?
Robert’s best season was 5.0 WAR in 2023. By way of comparison Ha-Seong Kim’s 2023 was a 5.8 WAR. Kim is not a superstar. A good defensive player, but not a superstar.
U have to be careful when comparing dissimilar players by war though. Kim stole nearly twice as many bases as Robert that season whereas Robert hit over twice as many home runs as Kim and was significantly better overall offensively. Kim’s above average but not spectacular offensive line also benefited more from positional adjustment from a war calculation perspective. A premium defender in center who also hits for the kind of power Robert showed that year with an overall 5 tool profile is the type of player who can be a star. Kim’s profile isn’t a star profile as valuable as it is when he’s at his best.
That is the whole purpose of WAR, to be able to compare players contributions to their team winning.
Kim contributed more. 16% more. Kim is not a superstar. Neither is Robert.
But if you look at bbr’s definition of war they’re the first to tell you that war needs to be taken in context and ultimately is based on a lot of subjective, albeit informed judgments.
War is a very useful Stat but is literally not intended to a be a single determining factor for player evaluation. I agree that neither Robert nor Kim is a superstar at present btw, but surely you understand that a label like that is about more than just war right?
Ben zobrist was a war darling and a really great player for any team to have, but he was never really considered or paid like a star. Jack of all trades performers like zobrist and Kim who don’t have any loud tools just don’t have the same star power and appeal, especially given the mid power. Way of the world.
Robert has not been as good at his peak as Kim.
Over the last 3 seasons their OPS+ is remarkably similar with both being just slightly above average. Because he has played more games, health is a valuable asset, Kim has a higher oWAR.
Their defensive positions and play has buoyed their WAR for both of them. If Robert doesn’t have a 6 DRS and 13 OAA at a premium position he doesn’t have a 5 WAR in 2023. Same goes for Kim. Without a plus DRS and OAA at 4 different positions in 2023, even his 4.4 oWAR would not have been enough to propel him to a 5.8 WAR.
Just having more power is not enough to make Robert a superstar. Especially when Robert has struck out more than 30% of the time over the past 2 seasons. 313 So in 1020 PA.
Robert is not a superstar. He has not shown yet he has the upside to be a superstar.
Between 2009 and 2013 when he was a “war darling” Zobrist had a 125 OPS+ (peaking at 150) and played plus defense at 2B, his primary position, RF, and SS. He was not even arbitration eligible until 2011 when his salary jumped from MLB minimum to $4.7 million. His 2016-2019 contract was the 10th highest AAV for a 2B ever. In 2017-2018 when he was 36-37 years old Zobrist was paid $16.5 million to be a utility player. That was 6 seasons ago and Kim would be lucky to get paid that as an AAV if he was healthy today. Zobrist got paid. He was a star.
roob
All of what you say depends on his staying healthy, something he’s never been able to do.
I think Robert needs someone to remind him that being a MLB player takes work, its not just that you show up and magically win. It takes effort. When you have these guys the White Sox had getting far more money that they have ever seen in their life with the idea they will get better, you need to constantly enforce that ideal in the player, and not coddling them like the Sox have done. They need to know what it takes to be great. Robert needs that guy or org, whether in the White Sox org, or somewhere else. To get into his face, to show him the guys that failed before him, to impress upon him that he needs to put the effort in. Both health and skill wise
I just cannot imagine being very motivated when you are in a clown show org like the White Sox have been.
Stroman fits that bill.
Per Caddyshack…”Well, then you ain’t getting no Coke…”
No ticky no tacky
Not 1 washing machine but 2 and a fax machine should close the deal.
If a team gives up any mid level prospects for this guy it will result in PAIN.
They’re only on the hook for $15M next season + $2M buyout. ’25 and ’26 are team option years.
*’26 and ’27
It doesn’t matter what the Sox bring in with their org. You could give them 5 Baseball America Top 100 prospects they won’t develop them. The organization is a clown show.
Black Ace: Very true. getz won’t be getting anything of value for Crochet or Robert. He asks high and settles for very low. Look what he got for Kopech, Fedde and Pham. Fleeced again.
Compared to what they were supposed to be they couldn’t even develop Kopech, Jimenez, Robert, Moncada, etc to their potential.
Look Im not a fan of Getz and his ‘my first GM’ playbook, however, these are bad examples…
Im sorry, but what were the Sox going to get for those three exactly?
Kopech was washed out of this org.. with good leadership he MAY be something still, but its another ‘maybe’.
Fedde is a journeyman who spend his last few years in another country playing ball before coming back with a cheapo deal with the Sox, and who happened to have a good season
Pham was a year rental and has a tendency to come back down to earth stat wise when he is not reportedly a cancer in the locker room.
Anything you get for those guys is going to be a rough prospect you hope you can develop. The real main thing to take from that is the Sox cannot develop guys aside from some pitching.
Bottom dollar Jerry-atric needs to go and maybe the next guy realizes that you need to invest in the minors so you CAN develop those guys, and not just have to rely on high profile trades to hope you get at least one ‘cant miss’ prospect in exchange for a good player
If he was consistently putting up 2023 numbers, I could understand the asking price, but health is obviously the issue. Teams aren’t going to meet the asking price for a guy who hasn’t played in 66% of games over 5 years.
Yep. Staying on the field is at issue here. That said; Orioles Santander was injury prone too … that is until age 27. 3 years in a row of full season play from Anthony. Case of body getting use to the grind? Orioles FO should consider getting this Robert cat.
Probably finally figured out that to stay on the field it takes 365 day preparation. Not just drinking all winter and showing up. Robert and Buxton may or not fall into this category. But after enough years of the same crap you sit down and have a nice talk with yourself and ask ” Am I doing enough prep”? Maybe ask the trainers although in the White Sox case that may be a complete waste of time.
The Sox org relies on fealty to ‘the Chairman’ and nothing else. No accountability means you have guys who do not put in the effort, and maybe do not even know how. The Sox org strikes me as ‘throw money at them and they will figure it out’.
I think they actually did have a guy that would teach the players and impress that it takes work, but that was Renteria and this org stabbed him in the back for a half retired manager whose game left him behind about 5-10 years ago.. Big wonder the Sox players barely put in any effort.. Sure sure I hear the stories about how supposedly these guys were working before games to get better, but check the results on the field for evidence. as for the talent question, you need guys who have the will and the knowledge of the game and things typically work out Ok for them.
Take the Guardians for example, not many of those guys look to be world beaters, but they show up every day and do the little things to win. That is the culture this Sox org has desperately needed since 05, if not longer.
There was an interesting article about Santander’s changes in diet when the team added a nutritionist to the staff. He almost entirely cut out sugar in 2022.
The article talked about excess sugars causing inflammation. I have no idea if that is even a contributing factor for him because I don’t know what injuries he had that kept him off the field. He is doing something differently or better because he has played 150+ games in 3 straight seasons. Maybe Robert should talk to him.
Pads: Robert, Buxton, Rendon, deGrom, Verlander, Scherzer, Sale, Trout…
Pads Fans – Santander’s issues were generally in his legs. I don’t recall the specifics but there were at least two hip issues and I think a knee problem in there too.
Orioles should concentrate on needs, like starting pitching, and not worry about CF, which they have covered.
Agreed to all of these comments. The best ability is availability. There’s been a few examples, Sale comes to mind, of players having injury spells, then turning it around. Would teams still be willing to pay a moderate to high-ish price for Robert on the assumption they could get/keep him healthy? Sure. Most teams wouldn’t say no to that sort of potential output.
But I agree with the one year, prove it. Sox should have traded him when he had team control and was coming off a big year. They would have gotten a haul.
Using Sale as an example was a poor choice. One mostly healthy season, where he was out for the playoffs, is not an example of a player remaining healthy.
He still has team control and the rest of the league ain’t as dumb as the Sox org. One good year from Robert was not going to get them a haul.
I know (and like) that Robert would not go to a team like the mariners but having Julio and Randy and Luis would be a cool outfield
Robert for Jonny farmelo and either logan Evans or tai peete
If tai Peete could be the second piece, it would be a steal to the Ms.
Not sure why people are big on Arozarena. His batting average has declined EVERY year since his rookie campaign. Aren’t players supposed to get better into their prime years?
Not trading him last season when his value was at its absolute peak along with 4 years of team control is a firable offense. Prob THE worst baseball move of the decade and that’s not an understatement. They could have got a Soto type deal for him at that time yet he was “untouchable” on a team going no where. Complete incompetence and no vision by white Sox execs
Par for the course for the Sox.
Agreed. If they want top prospects for him now, I can’t imagine what they were asking for in 2023.
@Big
think about it. this is their prized prospect. the face of the latest rebuild. he finally has a healthy- breakthrough season and gives you a glimmer of his potential, and you, a team, bereft of talent, souths trade him away, likely for another prospect? they have him signed to a team friendly deal. Yes, his click may not coincide with the teams because of their struggles but you have to at least take another full season to see what he is, could be, and how does he fit into your 4 year plan. if other prospect hit in 23 or 24 them maybe their’s a playoff contender in the near future like the Tigers and a Royals this year. Would’ve been tough to trade him in winter ’23 and he then hands in another above average season while you hope and pray some A/AA develops right.
That was a big swing and a miss.
Doesn’t matter if it was Ohtani, Reinsdorf doesn’t pay $15M to players anymore. And no way is he going to pick up the option and pay $20M to Robert in 2026 even if he wins MVP.
If he had stayed healthy and performed again in 2024 his value would have gone up even with less team control. I thought they should have traded him last offseason too but it doesn’t mean it was the wrong decision except with hindsight.
Being the wrong decision is exactly what it means ! They just drastically underperform in 23 and were already selling off quality players. Their 24 results was probable as was Robert not staying healthy. Plus Robert value could not have been any higher coming off a career year and his contract value was much more friendly last season. They had to not just trade him, but trade him for quality return like what Preller gave up for Soto. Epic fail !
His current contract was signed in 2020. If he was traded last year he’d still be owed the remainder of his contract unless Sox ate a portion of it, which is still the case. He just had a lower AAV last season.
His value absolutely could have went up as well. Had he stayed healthy and played all season for back to back years it would have bolstered his value. There was no reason to think he could not stay healthy as he did not go out due to a known chronic issue. So that’s judging in hindsight which anyone can easily claim what should ve been done after the fact.
There is no way he’d have or will command a return like Soto either. Even with the extra years of team control. He has proven a fraction of what Soto has at the MLB level. He also is owed a fairly significant amount of # which weighs against the yrs of team control. He can not simply be non tendered and become a free agent without being owed $ as isbthe case with most players with equal service time.
Even after his big 2023 he was still a big injury risk. If he had even a healthy first half of 2024 his value would have been higher because he was proving he could stay healthy which obviously he couldn’t do.
He was never going to get back what Soto got back in trade.
Hindsight.
Why was he an injury risk? What in particular pointed to hip suffering a hip flexor strain rounding the bases during the season??
Unless you can point to something that made that particular injury foreseeable backed by fact, any notion that he was a risk was an assumption. Now had he suffered a wrist injury, that would have been something that he’s had issues with on multiple occasions.
@Tigers
What you could point to was his injury history. Some people are prone to injury. Its not necessarily a chronic injury. The injuries will vary. But the injuries will keep coming. And teams will continue to sign these players to long contracts. Robert is one of them.
@stymeed I agree there, but I’d call that a concern opposed to an injury risk. Now if a pitcher had been dealing with a forearm strain or issues I’d view that as a clear injury risk.
With Robert I’d be concerned about his durability yes. But he hasn’t been hampered by any chronic issues and one could have easily said he just had a rather healthy 2023 prior to last season. Passing judgement in hindsight is easy.
I do question Sox strength and conditioning. Not sure if it’s coach or particular system they ve laid out. But they seem to have alot of position players missing time and many of them for strains, pulls, and the like. Maybe a different approach could benefit them. Or they simply could have had the wrong group of players.
What hindsight bro !? I said this all last offseason. You don’t need hindsight to see a player at their peak value like Robert. It’s obvious and probable. And an incredibly poor move by incompetent leadership to keep him. Competent leadership gets trades done like Preller does. Incompetent leadership cannot identify a player at their peak value, identify proper value, nor execute a high profile trade.
EPIC FAIL and been saying it for a year ! So kindly apologize for judging me ?!
No it was not obvious that his value was at a high. Again had he not missed many games in 2024 that alone would ve bolstered his value.
And yes you are absolutely being critical in hindsight unless you predicted a hip flexor strain in prior to last season.
Anything you are assuming as probable is correlation not causation.
It seems you re a Sox fan and I get your frustration. But as mentioned elsewhere here teams were reluctant to move top prospects last year. They very well could have not heard anything that remotely interested them. And regardless if a team has stated publicly a player is on the block, they re almost certainly at least hearing out any offers or interest in players, it cost nothing doing so.
Stop judging bro lol. Not a Sox fan but actually a huge Luis Robert fan and baseball fan. Part of being a gm is selling players at their peak value. The Braves were terrible at this when they consistently had 5/6 top 50 prospects in their organization for several years running. They would have won another 2 championships if they would have traded those guys at peak value, instead Fried panned out and the rest of them rotted away in minors and toggling between minors and majors while never sticking long term. They could have netted quality proven big leaguers that put their team in a position to win championships
Robert had his best season by far, finally reaching his potential
4 years of control left with 2024 being very reasonable in price
Their team vastly underachieved and where selling off major pieces
Robert has a history of injuries
All that equals peak value and any quality GM is paid millions to acknowledge the undeniable reality of that ! It has nothing to do with hindsight
Do you still deny it ??
Are you saying the Braves were terrible at managing young talent?? They have locked in the core of their position players into what would have been free agent years. They are literally the model for how to develop and retain a young team.
Which major pieces had they sold off prior to 2024? They traded one player, Giolito. They let Anderson walk who had absolutely imploded and replaced by signing Dejong. They let Lynn who was horrible walk. Grandal a 35 yr old catcher they let walk. Andrus who went on to retire after a Minor League deal elsewhere they let walk.
They acquired Lopez then signed Pham, Grossman, and Pillar. Grossman was coming off a decent season in TEX and Pham showed life late in 2023. Can’t remember how Pillar played in 2023 and I’m not looking it up.
As for the rotation, Lynn who after a horrible 2023 seemed like addition by subtraction alone. The big hit was trading away Giolito. He was replaced and rotation was rounded out with Flexen, Fedde, and Soroka.
Those moves were cheap and absolutely bargain shopping. But they only traded away one big piece. They let Anderson walk as well as a handful of aged veterans. They filled the roster with a mix of complementary type veterans, but they did not embrace a youth movement or tear it all the way down. They appear to have tried to plug holes with veterans and banked on Moncada and Jimenez.
No, bc that has absolutely nothing to do with what we are talking about !
I’m saying if you have the prospect capital to acquire top mlb level talent – identity that many of these guys are at their peak value and trade them! Just like Luis Robert was at his peak value last year. Not hindsight, blatantly obvious !
Waters, a catcher, another CF, Anderson, soroko, wright, allard and the other pitcher they gave away with that trade to Texas I think. If I went back and looked, I bet there’s 3 or 4 prospects that made it into the top 50 lists that were worth 10s of millions of dollars in prospect capital. The Braves kept all of those guys way too long instead of identifying their peak value as highly touted minor leaguers and it cost them dearly.
Pretty sure they could have had Max Scherzer in his prime but instead kept guys like Anderson and waters til they were rendered useless. Other super stars were traded at that time too. And just like the Braves should have unloaded those prospects for proven big leaguers, which isn’t hindsight bc most prospects don’t pan out, the white sox blew it by keeping Robert past last offseason. He has peak value wrote all over him !
Ready to acknowledge that I know what I’m talking about and not speaking in hindsight ?
In 21, Pache Anderson waters were all top 35, lang…was 73. The dodgers, who do understand peak value, gave an inferior rated package to nationals for Scherzer and Turner. If the Braves would have trade those 4 for the two all stars, they would have sold 4 prospects at their peak value and most likely won more World Series bc of it
Understand my point now ? Ready to acknowledge I know what I’m talking about with Robert ? Blatantly obvious! Worst GM move of the decade holding onto him !
Soroka got hurt near the beginning of his 3rd season. They were planning for him to be at front of rotation for years to come.
Allard was traded after only pitching in part of 1 season for Chris Martin a solid RP who helped bolster a bullpen that won World Series in 2021.
Wright somewhat broke out at age 27 and had a quite suspect record in MLB in the 4 or 4 seasons he had been called up at some point. His stats were kind of skewed in 2023 by a ton of Ws. But was pitching less than a K per inning and a WHIP over 1.200. So you might want to get a bit more familiar with him prior to try and fault Braves there.
You obviously don’t want to mention trading Grissom for Sale….
Trying to fault the Braves and discredit them is quite laughable dude. You are grasping at straws. You can choose any team and there are players they missed on.
Speak of missing on… You ve missed o. Braves, contract with Robert, Sox trading away MULTIPLE key pieces(they traded away 1 prior to 2024 Giolito).
You are throwing s@$# at the wall and hoping it sticks . You are trying to judge a team in hindsight for what they should ve done in the future that you claim to have clearly known. Funny thing though, you don’t even know the past and it’s already happened…..
You know what you re talking about??? You have said numerous false things above, yet you claim to know what you re talking about.
Sox traded away only Giolito and Cease prior to 2024 season. They let a few aged veterans and an imploded Anderson walk. Anderson went on to be released by MIA and Andrus went on to retire after not seeing MLB on Minor League deal.
They seemed to still be hanging on to hope for Vaughn, Moncada, and Jiminez. That’s 1/3 of their lineup. They had signed Beneditti the yr prior and still had Robert. They acquired dejong and Lopez to round out IF and a handful of veterans to help with 3rd OF spot.
They failed bringing in a 36 yr old catcher Maldonado to work with a rotation they did not adequately retool. But they were not a team ready to tear it all done yet going into 2024.
It’s laughable that you are trying to cherrypick prospects the Braves missed on. MLB prospects have the highest failure rate of prospects in any of the major pro sports in America.
You could go through any team and cherrypick as you re trying to do with the Braves. They are the model for how you build and retain young talent. It is mind boggling that you are trying to justify the foolish statement regarding them.
Man you have no clue what WE are talking about ! The conversation you tried to discredit me over is being able to acknowledge when a player is at their peak value, then trading them for a max return. All of this other stuff you are talking about is not relevant to our conversation
OR in sale case, buying a player at his lowest point. Which is the same thing showing the Braves learned from their mistakes !
Focus bro, or are you too proud ??
One more time –
Robert had his career
4 years left with 2024 at an great rate
A history of injuries
The team was already trading off other top talent
They massively underachieved in 2023.
Not trading Robert prior to last season was the worst gm move of the decade. It’s not hindsight to say it and I couldn’t make that point any clearer.
Do you still deny it ??
You are judging after the fact that is hindsight.
And just so I can help you cherrpick. Since the Dodgers who you say clearly understand peak value, we shouldn’t mention players like Bellinger right?? That wouldn’t be peak value releasing a player who you could ve traded after winning both ROY and MVP, right??
I could easily say Dodgers should ve traded Bellinger after 2019. In his 3rd yr he had won MVP. Nowhere to go but up. But the reality is much like the Braves they were and still are a contending team. You don’t trade away young controllable talebt.
As for Robert the only injury he had more than once was his wrist. Feel free to take a stab out how those wrist injuries made him straining a hip in April of a different season forseeable. Get your last word in as well, it’s what you so crave…
Naw bro. I owned you in this dialogue but instead of giving me credit for something I have spent more than a decade developing an understanding of- you have to discredit me out of your own pride and ego
Nice talkin to ya ! Peace out
Owning? Discrediting? AGAIN Robert could have had a healthy season and his value would ve increased. Do you grasp that?? You are saying in hindsight what should have been done with the benefit of knowing the outcome. Do you grasp how knowing the outcome benefits one while passing judgement??
You have made repeated false statements trying to back an OPINION you have formed in HINDSIGHT. You think someone should credit you for an opinion AFTER THE FACT that you backed with numerous false statements you tried to talk around and gloss over….. LMFAO
I said it all last offseason
What showed the white sox were going to improve ? You need quality players around you !
What showed the franchise is moving in a positive direction? The complete opposite
What is his injury history ?
How many years of control ?
Was he coming off a career year ?
What is his salary?
ZERO hindsight bro. You are trigger and pride hurt lol. And owned. Your pride just won’t allow you to accept.
It was THE worst gm move of the decade !
@big whiffa: Many things are true that conflict. Getz is unqualified having failed upward. WSox will limit or ruin any position player potential b/c they have no core philosophies or clue what/how to teach them to succeed.
One pushback is tired narrative thru press is he and sellers in general are asking for too much. No club was willing to trade an elite prospect to anyone (not just them) the entire last offseason and this past deadline. “Rival execs” are whining b/c they have a death grip on top tier prospects no matter who the player they ask about is……and those buyer execs want to find a clever loophole by trading rather than paying serious $ to mediocre FAs.
You can bet any offers for LRJ were underwhelming last go around …..and now of course bad timing for all involved unless a buyer takes leap of faith to pay capital between ’23/’24 performance on an oft-injured guy.
Better test will be Crochet. If no one will cough up an elite prospect headliner for 2 dirt cheap years and knowing he wants to extend, we know the rival GMs are continuing to lowball as if their prospects are “sure stars” and the player they seek should be available for a return that doesn’t sting at all.
Overhaul: I don’t blame Getz for taking the job tbh, even if the qualifications were to be against him. You’re also correct that the Wsox have a hard time developing hitters.
Reds made a loaded offer for cease last offseason that white sox turned down. Then ended up taking a lesser package several weeks later from padres.
Lowder and collier and 2 more legit prospects. Something like that. It can be found w a quick internet search.
That wasn’t true as far as Lowder or a specific perceived big haul official offer getting rejected. Getz (rightly by surprise) put out the framework of a high ask in Nov b/c clubs were trying to avoid the early offseason high prices on FAs like Lynn and soon after Giolito/Stroman, etc. That’s when Cincy saw trade route was going to sting and chose to roll dice fast on paying PED Montas a lot for 1yr. They checked a box and kept its prospects. Cease at least helped SD be a strong WC before Dodgers lit him up……lot of other options turned out to be predictably underwhelming or lighting money on fire.
Lowder was certainly offered as a centerpiece of a cease deal. Getz refusal to come together in that situation shows his inability to orchestrate high value trades as he took a lesser package from pads and also by the contents of this article. Dude is out of his league
One good year of Robert was not going to get any team to swoon and come in with a cart of prospects for him. They saw what everyone else saw. A guy trying to figure it out health wise and performance wise and had one good year out of many. Also I seriously doubt he was untouchable.
The Sox were not going to get a load of top prospects for him. Anyone thinking otherwise is just wishful thinking.
So Getz is waiting for a windfall that’s never gonna happen, and a year from now he’ll be faced with the decision of whether to pick up Roberts’ $20M option for ‘26. That will be the true test of exactly how great Getz really believes Robert is.
Correct. Its a mess where really the only thing the White Sox can hope for is he plays amazingly well in 2025 and they are forced to pick up his option and then plays well again in 2026, at least rnough to generate interest from a playoff hungry team, and maybe MAYBE he gets something of value, but by then he’ll only be available for the rest of 2026 and then another option year.. Its possible the Sox can pull it off, but at this point he’s “in for the penny, in for the pound”.
Its just like the other bad extensions the Sox have had. They will either need to hope he performs well to get something of value, or they paid all that money for nothing (like Moncada) .
White Sox doing more dumb stuff. Check.
A guy coming off an OPS+ year of 87. Brendan Rodgers just got non-tendered and he had a better year than Robert. (Before anyone piles on, I’m not comparing the two as players, just making an observation on Robert’s company in 2024) The White Sox waited too long to trade him. They should have sold him last offseason. Instead they waited and got burned. They waited too long with Dylan Cease also and got a big pile of garbage from San Diego. Robert is in a free agent year. If they don’t find a deal they want now, they might as well keep him and hope for a bounceback that they could flip at the deadline.
you meant “not a FA” right?
No I meant 2025 will be the last year of control for LuBob and he will be a FA next offseason.. Well potentially anyway. There are two expensive team options for 2026 and 2027 that are not guaranteed to be exercised.
so technically, he’s not in a FA this year. he had two more years of control. so coming off of his breakthrough season in 2023 I don’t see them trading him signed to s team friendly deal with 3 years left.
Team friendly? A pair of $20 million a year options for a CF coming off a year of an OPS of .657 is NOT “team friendly” at all. Unless he sees MAJOR progression in 2025, his options will not be picked up.
at the time it was signed it was team friendly. Team “friendly” is dependent on future production.
At the time it was signed, it was a pure speculative gamble. He was a 100% completely unproven player and Cuban players had a long history of underperforming at the MLB level. Even the semi-successful ones like Yasiel Puig and Yoenis Cespedes, didn’t really last that long. The lone exception seems to have been Jose Abreu. It was a gamble that seemingly worked out for Chicago, but as I said the chances for a steep drop off remain.
I would not be against the Orioles acquiring Luis R
That would be awesome. Block more Orioles young players with White Sox castoffs.
Can’t be blocked if they are used in a trade.
High price? That’s funny. Robert has averaged 2.8 WAR and 93 games played in 4 seasons. Not exactly a high value trade piece.
He has a high ceiling which he demonstrated in 2023 when he had a career high 5.0 WAR but an equally low floor. Ha-seong Kim and Tommy Edman have been as good the last 4 years and neither of them are high value trade targets.
Kim is a free agent with a current injury. Edman was hurt at the time he was dealt in 2024. Those aren’t the best comps.
They are excellent comps because Roberts is hurt every season.
Kim is a free agent thats a dumb comp. Edman has 1 year of control left. Robert has 3.
This is why the White Sox are where they are right now. They don’t evaluate who they have very well at all, but watch a team like Seattle make a deal to get him because they’re so desperate for offense. Being a Mariners fan, I wouldn’t be surprised at all.
You already have him in Randy
I think most GMs wouldn’t love to have their prized prospect finally have a 38 hr -20 SB season while playing golf glove defense. Fans are enamored with looking beyond what they have. Robert’s coming into his prime years (27-30). It’s not unreasonable for them to want to see him play the next season to see if he’s finally put his injuries behind him and starts to fulfill upon his promise. They still have 3 years of control and if he refund and had a great 2025, then I imagine they could command the same prospect value that may have gotten back in winter 2023.
No matter the year he has, his injuries will always be a return factor. Hope is he can remain healthy AND another team with playoff aspirations has a HUGE hole to immediately fill. Otherwise, his value will not be there at the deadline.
@dewey
so you can see the future? ANY team that trades for him at doing so hoping he can stay healthy.
why thooo
Ewww…I mean, ok, I’d give up one can of alphabet soup…but I refuse to throw in a Slim Jim.
More of a quantity trade than top prospects right now. Maybe Sox get desperate to dump that salary. If not hope for a healthy good spring.
Honestly, Pittsburgh makes sense. Move Cruz to your big LF. Send Oviedo who’s got a bunch of control and looked great prior to TJS.
Injuries are a massive concern but the Reds have been begging for a right handed difference maker for years. They have been hoarding talent in the minor leagues, holding on to guys that are blocked by talent at the MLB level. I’m not saying ship the farm to the Sox for the guy, but someone with his talent level is worth a moderate risk. He’s a cheaper, faster, better defender than any free agent that’s out there when healthy. Massive if there, but for gods sake if you are going to ‘go for it’…. You need to take chances. Worst case scenario you hope for health in the next 2 years and trade him again to restock if not in contention. Bring him to Cincy.
What are they giving up for him? Collier would make sense maybe. Maybe him and Stewart both. What the White Sox really need is outfielders but the Reds don’t really have those.
Collier and petty are two quality prospects, then a 3rd piece like hector Rodriguez to give them some outfield depth and maybe a wild card. Thats a massive overpay ! Do that to cover reds payroll concerns and have the Sox throw in 20 mill of the 45 owed to him. Win/win
Robert hitting 3rd in this reds lineup with the addition of singer and Francona as manager is a really good team !
Robert is only owed a guaranteed 15 million the White Sox aren’t paying 20.
The Rockies pay arenado on those options that were exercised. If white Sox want a serious return then they are going to have to offset the risk with financial promises. And why not ?
Arenado had a large free agent contract he signed and then had a sub par 2020 season. Robert has a team option for 2026 and 2027 so if the team who gets him wants to they can just decline the options.
Right….but no one would give up an elite prospect package to cut him after 1 season or a 1/2 season
No they would just exercise the options because he has tremendous upside and is only 27 years old.
Hard pass for this Reds fans. Too much risk. If he doesn’t bounce back next year he has two team options and we’ll let him walk. Then we can watch Collier and Stewart have productive careers with someone else.
I highly doubt those options don’t get exercised.
Hey if the Reds want to stay in mediocrity forever so be it. Sometimes you have to take a chance.
I would say a package deal of Stewart, Petty, Rodriguez I would be comfortable with. If the Sox want higher end prospects (Arroyo), including Candelario in the trade would be a must. Their salaries would essentially be a swap and still give the Reds room to add bullpen help. All of this is probably dreaming based on the Reds history, but man would I be excited about this team if we could pull it off. I’d buy tickets immediately.
Most of the fans here view Mr. Robert by his stats.
If one watches the games, Robert regularly does some of the
dumbest things on the field that one will see in MLB games.
Multiple broadcasting crews can’t believe what they’re seeing
and point it out…..and I don’t watch a lot of White Sox games.
Until someone comes up with a “Runs costing his team by boneheaded and/or lazy play” stat just go ahead and talk
about the man’s numbers.
–
Meet the new front office
Same as the old front office
Pass on Robert. Bad attitude and overrated
Bad attitude when, just making stuff up. Is this Samuel’s burner account, with his unsusbtantiated bone headed and or lazy play rant?
Calm down. Its just his opinion.
Constantly injured is my issue with him. Why trade for someone who can’t play half the year?
Red Sox traded for Tyler ONeill last offseason. People said the same thing about him. That worked out well for the Red Sox.
You can’t predict injuries.
Oh and the Red Sox traded away always hurt Chris Sale. That didn’t work out for them…..
Yeah let’s be blunt – after 2023 was the perfect time to trade him. The Sox got greedy and it backfired.
Yes with hindsight after 2023 was the time to trade him.
I think Robert has about 30 million in surplus value at the moment. He’s not a super valuable asset but someone would give up something nice to get him. Phillies make some sense. Reds make some sense. He might be a center fielder but I like him on a team that has someone who could play there at least half the time. I think taking Robert out of center at least for part of the year could help him stay healthy.
Surplus value on a player who can’t stay on the field?
Superstar potential who won’t require a long term commitment or loss of draft pick.
Yes surplus value fella
Why are you such an ass to people in the comments who have different (correct) opinions than you?
Think about that. Check under the hood Mr. Insecurity.
This guy reminds me of JD Drew
They should wait to see if he rebounds, but my guess is that Getz has an itchy trigger finger and just wants to do something now. They may be worried he has TA disease, won’t rebound, and they will cut him for nothing, like TA and Moncada, if they don’t move now.
He should not even be on the market with the terrible year he had, Bad move by Getz and the White Sox!!
After thinking about it thi
Why not ask big you might find a sucker
Pretty amazing how the standards required to be “Superstar” ballplayers has fallen so dramatically in the last 10+ years or so…..
only way he gets that high of asking price is if Crochet is involved… maybe throw in dejong and braves could possibly be in on it.
Pay heed to the “top” prospects the White Sox are targeting b/c they have the uncanny ability to identify your eventual underperformers/busts. There is little doubt that a competent organization would manage to keep Robert on the field at a much hire rate and perform closer to peak ability than the White Sox ever could. Any prospective acquiring team should keep talks open and pull the trigger before ST. The Sox will be selling low and the price tolerable.
Everybody talks about health but my real concern with this guy is the air he stirs up around the plate. For his career he has a high 27.0% strikeout rate, which is poor enough. But in 2024 the rate jumped to 33.2%, which is really bad. Even in the 2023 season that MLBTR gushes about, he whiffed at a 28.9% rate.
If he walked a lot this might be somewhat acceptable. But the subpar 5.6% walk rate for his career is also worrying. He’s starting to profile as an all-or-nothing guy with a low OBP and power that comes and goes. Those guys can be valuable when the homers start flying. But when you get 14 homers in 425 plate appearances – Robert’s numbers in 2024 – the value evaporates in a hurry.
But in 2024 the rate jumped to 33.2%, which is really bad.
=====================
I agree. The gambler in me wants the RS to take a flyer, but the Ks are a huge red flag. I like to look at Aug-Sept numbers to use as a predictor, and Robert had a 59/7 K/W. It’s almost impossible to succeed with that ratio.
TA used to carry around those ratios, and was successful for a while, but as the BABIP came down to earth, so did the OPS. I like the talent, but between the K/W and the injuries, I’d have to pass.
Package him with Crochet or Vaughn, article is right, Robert went soft long ago, has good upside potential, could be a great bargain for a team, but to expect a big return in trade is hard to fathom.
Vaughn has no value.
I’d agree to an extent although he could be an upgrade at DH for a lot of clubs, he hasnt been completely absent at the plate. My comment mostly stems from my wanting the Sox to trade Vaughn. As a Sox fan, I’d like to see them work in a new first baseman, although they already cut Sheets loose, who I liked for the job.
The White Sox are out of their minds man. Such an unserious organization.
I watched him closely last season when he played the Mariners knowing that he was a potential trade candidate for the offense starved M’s. I saw a gaudy gold chain wearing, flamboyant, .225 hitting free swinging pin head.
Overrated. Hasn’t played a whole season. Losing culture brings bad habits.
I would not give up too much for Luis Robert Jr – that’s asking for trouble.
Feels like the Sox missed the boat on trading this guy at peak value. Judging from the other comments, I’m not alone in that feeling.
Oh yes, at the end of 2023 he should have been traded. But it’s the White Sox…
At this point, Getz should just wait until the trade deadline, and hopefully Luis Robert is both healthy and productive, so he can ask for a better return.
THATS WHAT GETZ SHOULD DO, BUT REINSDORF WILL PROBABLY PRESSURE GETZ INTO DUMPING ROBERT .CAUSE HE DOESNT WANT TO PAY ROBERT 15 MILLION. . GETZ BEING THE GOOD LACKEY WILL OBLIGE, KEEPING HIS JOB IN TACT.
He’s supposed to be good, he might just be trying to do too much in that lineup. Would like to see what he could do on a better team, but nobody’s biting on that price…
It’s amusing that so many people think they know the value of a baseball player, by looking at numbers on a piece of paper.
Sox would be smart to hold on to him until trade deadline this summer, if he performs he will bring a ton of talent, if not they can trade him for garbage then
Which is why the Sox will be cellar dwellers forever.
Pretty obvious move. I’m sure teams are hitting the Braves up with terrible offers for Acuna after his down year as well.
Wow, I see a lot of hindsight here.
The Sox really do not lose anything keeping Robert at this point.. Money is money.. I know that kind of saying may give ‘the Chairman’ a heart attack (one can almost hope for), but its not like they traded Tatis for him (no that was a much worse trade).
You keep Robert, and hope Venable can work with him and get through to him that if he wants to be great, he has to work at it. That he is no longer a ‘phenom’, he is just another guy at this point unless he takes steps to be live healthier and work at everything in his game, and care. I mean really I cannot tell you how many times it looked like he just did not care out there, especially batting with runners in scoring position.
Maybe, just maybe, they get through to him.. If they do not, oh well, watch him go somewhere else with a manager and org that CAN do that and see if he takes off. I think Robert can be great, but someone is going to really have to work at getting him there whether its the Sox or another org.
Sox are right to keep a high price. Worst-case (and most likely) is that teams just say no. Sox can then hold him and hope he rebounds to be worth their price. If someone meets their price, so much the better. Probably won’t happen, but we’ve seen odd moves before.
Sox should 100 percent keep him. With Luis in lineup 60 wins easy