A person familiar with the talks between the Brewers and Prince Fielder suggests that the eight year, $180MM+ contracts signed by Joe Mauer and Mark Teixeira are viewed as just a starting point by the first baseman's people, says SI.com's Jon Heyman. Another suggested that Fielder is seeking to join Alex Rodriguez in the $200MM club.
Owner Mark Attanasio remains hopefully that they'll be able to keep their star first baseman, but he and Scott Boras "appear to have taken a vow of silence regarding the most important player negotiations in the Brewers' history." One player told Heyman that he thinks the team's chances of retaining Fielder are "very slim," and a team official conceded that even though he enjoys Milwaukee, the team doesn't sense that he'll take a discount to remain there.
"When you evaluate players at the major league level, those who have done certain things by age 25 are extraordinary, and two of those things are 40 home runs and 125 RBIs. You certainly can count the number of players who have done that,'' said Boras. "Extraordinary performance at a young age gives you totally different career indices."
There's no denying that Fielder has been immensely productive in his young career, but such production at first base isn't the same as getting from a catcher or shortstop/third baseman. Teixeira, another Boras client and first baseman, is viewed as a better bet to remain productive into his 30's because there are no concerns about his size going forward.
Fielder, 26 in May, has hit .288/.393/.575 over the last three seasons, averaging 43 homers per year. He'll make $10.5MM this season, and will be eligible for arbitration in 2011 before becoming a free agent after that season. Ryan Howard, Albert Pujols, and Adrian Gonzalez can all potentially be part of the same free agent class, so if a team doesn't want to meet Fielder's demands, they'll have plenty of alternatives.
he deserves more than texeira and everybody think that because hes overweight hes going to have a shorter carrer than tex but hes not a catcher hes a firstbaseman and if a team wants in his 30s(the best its to trade him in his early 30s)he can be traded to an al team to part time DH abd play some first base.
Dude, you need one of those fancy keyboards that have the punctuation keys.
h.a.h.a
i really need it….
he wont get more solely due to the difference in defense…tex is a much better defensive first basemen than price…price will more than likely be a Dh sooner than later
The defense is part of it, but the bigger issue is the “athleticism”. He’s a better defender because he’s more mobile and projects to stay more mobile longer.
(E’s-hay ot-nay eally-ray at-fay.)
No suprise here. That said, I dont think he gets or deserves Mauer or Texiera money, but he’ll get his. If the crew falls out of it( which im sure they will with that crappy pitching) the smart thing would be to trade him for some good young pitching at the deadline. Still plenty of good, young players ( Braun, Escobar, Weeks, Gallardo, Mcghee, Gomez) to build around, but that pitching has to be improved by people not named Bush, Davis, Suppan, Vargas, etc.
Mo Vaughn II? Seems possible if not necessarily likely. Caveat Emptor.
He wont get either Mauer or Tex money…
1) Tex is much better on the defensive side and hits for a better average with the same amount of power…
2) Mauer… Yes Mauer did take a discount, because I’m pretty sure he could have had A-Rod money… However once again, he plays a much more demanding position and he plays it very well, and hes a batting champion who hits in big time situations, and can get in the upper 20’s in HRs…
Fielder will most likely get what Holliday got, even tho STL over paid for Holliday… that seems about right for Fielder… 6-7years 100-120mil… To me he doesnt break the 20Mil a year mark
If Fielder is going to make this about money, then yes — someone will give him $20MM, but only on a short contract. The risk of him turning into a Mo Vaughn (nice call, pageian) or even his Dad. Cecil had several great years, signed the big contract, then slowly declined after the trade to the Yankees. That’s too much money to spend on a guy who is average defensively, has a weight problem and has yet to show maturity as a leader on or off the field.
I’d like to see him stay with the Brewers, but because his agent is Scott Boras, I don’t see it happening.
I really hope the brewers don’t sign him. Lock up weeks and bush and still have 10 mill a year left over.
How many teams out there are going to pay him $200+ million, or even “Teixeira/Mauer Money”? This seems eerily similar to when Boras was throwing out a $50 million figure for Stephen Strasburg, and ended up “settling” around $15 million. He’s done stuff like this time and again and the media keeps feeding the monster.
I was about to post the same thing, it reeks of Boras. . “300 Million” also comes to mind.
What is the suspense here?
Fielder is a Boras client. Boras clients have to fire their agent to sign an extension. This is absolutely not happening.
As Ron Shapiro recently pointed out, Boras clients are sacrificed on the altar of Boras’ highest priority: landing the next client. A fair market value extension that gives a client security at the expense of possible max dollars doesn’t wow potential new clients.
So Prince will become a Boras gypsy, and if he stays healthy and productive until he is very old he will do fine.
But the risk that he will regress is extreme. And that obvious risk will deter any sane GM from committing silly long term money.
Recent comparables include Mo Vaughn, Cecil Fielder, Carlos Delgado, David Ortiz, Frank Thomas, Jason Giambi, and a non-first baseman who should have played first base, Greg Luzinski.
Pass. You can replace that production at first base, or most of it, far less expensively.
Not a chance in hell he will get $200 million
180m for 5’11” 270+ lbs? ha yeah ok.
Really bad press for the Brewers. Not only does it hurt their chances of retaining him, but this seriously hurts his trade value. Even teams with money to spend don’t want to hear that the guy is going to push for top dollar.
A big-ish market team that needs the short term power boost (Mariners, Red Sox), could still trade for him.
Remember, it was well known that Matt Holliday wanted a HUGE contract, but he was still traded twice when close to FA—with elite prospects changing hands both times. Same with CC Sabathia. It will be the same with Fielder.
I just hope that Boston steers clear of this guy if/when he reaches free agency. he reeks of severe drop off from being far too huge all during his entire playing career, just like his dad and signing him to a large Tex/giambi like contract will be nothing but another mistake for the team, as well as feather in Boras’s cap and huge mistake for years to come.
He should get more than Mauer if production rather than other factors is the primary purpose of paying an employee. Why did Holliday get soo little in comparison to Mauer or Teixeira?
1) Yeah, wouldn’t want a power slugger to have any confidence…
2) Fielder has slimmed down considerably since earlier in his career and is not nearly as fat as people like to pretend. Plus, I would like to see one piece of analysis that supports the assertion that fat sluggers decline faster. Don’t give me 1-2 anecdotes with players who have completely different body types (e.g. Mo Vaughn)
3) Fielder is a deceptively good base runner. Fielder has 14 SB over the last four seasons, Teixeira has 6. Fielder has 8 triples and 2 inside-the-park HR, Teixeira has 6 and 0.
4) Fielder has been getting steadily better defensively as his career has progressed. UZR/150 last season for Fielder was +0.6, Teixeira was -4.1 (despite the New York myth that Teixeira is some defensive wonder).
He doesn’t deserve Teixeira/A-Rod money, but neither do Teixeira/A-Rod. Sorry to blow your ESPN-indoctrinated mind, but Fielder is a younger and better player than Mr. Yankee Mark Teixeira.
It is common knowledge that out-of-shape players break down faster than in-shape players. That really should not have to be explained to you.
“(despite the New York myth that Teixeira is some defensive wonder)”
Yeah 2010 was the first year he was praised for his defense; get real, his reputation as a top defensive 1B has been around for years. Leave the Yankee hate at home and talk about the facts. He’s 5’11 and 270 lbs, giving 180m to that body is a bad investment.
Last I saw “Prince” couldn’t Switch-hit and struck out TWICE against a Cards no-named rook. Tex would have turned around and gave himself a fighting chance. Fielder is younger NOW, but Tex was young at some point??? lol I hate the Yanks with a Passion, but Texeira is a more accomplished player than Prince. Fielder is one dimensional. He’s a power hitter who strikes out a TON. Instead of paying him for his Homeruns lets de-duct for K’s? lol
I would still take Tex over Fielder in the long run
I would still take Tex over Fielder in the long run
Does that mean that you think Prince Fielder is in good shape? Really?
the redsox??? if they dont trade for agonz so let say baltimore.nats,i think they offer texeira big money last year so dont take him out of the talks
He’s a vegetarian.
Yes, he is in good shape. He’s not going to be running down any balls in centerfield, but he is a ridiculously strong and well-put together athlete, even if he is overweight. Just about every successful baseball player in history is technically overweight; it’s just that there’s a difference between letting yourself go and getting a flabby gut versus just being a big dude. This isn’t Rich Garces or Sidney Ponson we’re talking about.
And the reason you can’t provide any evidence that players with builds like Fielder’s inherently decline faster, except a snippy comment, is because there is no such evidence. It’s just not a well-supported fact.
He was also still a professional athlete into his 40s, if you want to make that comparison.
It’s ridiculous that you expect me to go find an article that explains why big players decline faster.
Here’s a little bit of common sense for you. Even if Fielder isn’t out of shape, which is absolutely absurd when talking about a player whose 5’11” and nearly 300 lbs, that is still a ton of weight that will be wearing on his body for a long time. More wear and tear = faster decline.
Don’t you know that Red Sox are a shoe in for A-Gon, while somehow keeping Buccholz and Bard
Yah, why should you be forced to go find data for your assertions? That’s crazy talk! Blasphemy!
Seriously. When I have trouble figuring out why I believe something, I go look it up. Try it. Open the Google. Ask it a question. Click articles until one matches what you are looking for. Read said article. Report back. 10 points extra credit for being honest about the level of confidence of the information, rather than just cherry picking facts to make a point.
For example, as a counterpoint, Fielder’s father Cecil played for 13 years and retired at age 34. Given the increased focus on conditioning since that time and Prince’s superior baseball skills, we might expect Prince to have a longer career than that. Not to say he will, but there’s one data point. Similarly, PECOTA puts one of Prince’s highest comparables as Boog Powell (or so I am told). Powell played for 17 seasons, until age 35, and was very good up until the last two.
So then, it seems reasonable to state that Fielder will be a solid major league player until around age 34, after which things become hazier. Which is true of most players, honestly. Very few power guys of any build are hitting at that age. Tex was signed at 28 to an 8 year deal. Prince will be hitting the market at 27. I assume Tex was signed to a deal that will turn out to be at least 1 year too long. Assuming the same happens to Prince, that would also be an 8 year deal by these figures.
If such an article exists and is so easy to find then maybe you should have taken the time you used to be a smart ass and found it yourself.
It is ridiculous to expect me to find an article about such a particular thing. I highly doubt there has been a study about this subject. If there has, I can’t find it. There are plenty of articles that say weight problems = unhealthy, but that doesn’t exactly apply to baseball. I wouldn’t want to cherry pick facts from those articles to make my point, would I?
Your counterpoint is completely meaningless. You just named two players out of millions who have played the game. Someone arguing either side could do that all day and prove nothing. The two players you did mention don’t even really apply. Both were much smaller and leaner in their playing days than Prince is. A career decline beginning in the early 30’s for both examples isn’t exactly helping your point either. I will say that one thing Prince has going for him is that he his hitting free agency relatively early, although he will be 28 for the majority of his first free agency season, not 27.
Since you think it is so easy, maybe you should take the time and look for an article that proves my point, and the general consensus, wrong. I suggest following your own guidance. In case you forgot, here it is:
“Yah, why should you be forced to go find data for your assertions? That’s crazy talk! Blasphemy!
Seriously. When I have trouble figuring out why I believe something, I go look it up. Try it. Open the Google. Ask it a question. Click articles until one matches what you are looking for. Read said article. Report back. 10 points extra credit for being honest about the level of confidence of the information, rather than just cherry picking facts to make a point.”