Here's the latest on the Yu Darvish sweepstakes…
- Talking to MLBTR's Tim Dierkes (Twitter link), an unnamed agent believes Darvish's posting fee will reach $50MM, and the right-hander will then sign a five-year, $75MM contract with the winning team.
- Brian Cashman told Wallace Matthews of ESPN New York that the Yankees scouted Darvish last season in Japan, but unsurprisingly didn't comment about whether or not the team would be interested in bidding for the right-hander.
- Yankee management is unlikely to pay an expensive posting fee for Darvish given the club's spotty history with Japanese pitchers, reports Joel Sherman of the New York Post (Twitter link). For what's it worth, the "Yankees' scouts love Darvish."
- In another tweet, Sherman lists the Rangers, Blue Jays, Nationals, Mariners and Royals as the favorites to land Darvish this winter, in that order.
- The Mariners have scouted Darvish but, in the opinion of Larry Stone of the Seattle Times, the M's shouldn't make a bid since the team has so much young pitching coming up from the minors. Stone also points out that "the Mariners have not become the haven for Japanese players that was predicted by some" when Hiroshi Yamauchi became the club's principal owner.
Rangers will let C.J. walk & sign Darvish.
please let’em do!
Texas is the perfect place for a minority, newly landed immigrant to be welcomed to the country!
LMAO THATS FUNNY
WTF?! NO it i… wait… uh… oh… nvm… lol
Better than Alabama, Arizona and Georgia still.
Way to set your standard high
Have you been to Texas? There are many immigrants in Texas. We have far better Japanese, Iranian, and Vietnamese food than Canada.
have I been to texas, yes many times…
and cuisine wasn’t exactly what we were talking about
Come to the Big apple Yu, come taste the definition of victory.
that was super lame dude.
I’m sorry my comment wasn’t up to your standards, just speaking my mind.
i think that makes it worse.
I think your making it worse by negatively responding to my responses.
taste the definition of obnoxious
Troll haha
*you’re
Definition of victory = 1 ring in 10 years?
I’m so happy I was alive to witness the Yankees being pathetic also-rans, 82-93 never forget.
So, by your logic, nobody is victorious?
Come to the Big Apple to taste victory, don’t go to Texas (whos in the WS). And your logic is?
You’ve also been alive to witness them:
1# Win 3 consecutive titles.
2# Make the postseason in basically every season.
3# Be hated because they “WIN TOO MUCH”.
P.S I’m pretty sure they’ve amassed most wins than any other team over the last decade or so, just letting you know.
no body hates the yankees because they win.. people hate the yankees because sometimes some of their fans say things like ‘come taste the definition of victory’
lol. you have the same hair cut as paully d don’t you, don’t lie.
People hate the Yankees because they believe that the Yankees excessively use their resources in order to win. The only problem with that is that every other team would do the same if their owners were willing.
while I wont deny the fact that some owners don’t reinvest in to their teams.. the idea that all teams have the same resources as the yankees, even with revenue sharing, its ridiculous.
yankees make the most money, so they spend it. most people don’t have a problem with it, its what makes baseball such a great game, that money doesn’t = winning..
You, yourself are not any cooler because you’re a yankee fan, and when you say things like ‘taste the definition of victory’ you just come across as a huge dbag.
Agreed.
As a Yankee fan, I want to apologize on behalf of all nitwits like that guy. They make the whole fan base look like that. Even though I do love that everyone hates the Yankees I’m not going to go rub it in their faces that we benefit from the biggest market, and spend the most money. Although I think Red Sox, Phillies, Mets, Dodgers, and Cubs fans cannot say anything about the Yankees spending.
And yes the fact that the Cardinals and the Rangers have the 11th and 13th highest pay rolls makes me happy, it’s good to see other teams win once in awhile…as long as it’s not Boston.
You are absolutely owning this guy, but take it easy on him, he’s just another one of those soulless robots who thinks it’s the Yankee’s God given right to have an all-star at every position and win the WS every year.
No, we’ve always hated the Yankees. There isn’t a more hate-able team in pro sports.
And what is your source for this? If you want I can probably counter (although I also don’t have a source) that they have more fans than any other team in professional sports, if not, then certainly in MLB.
Oh my God you people are obnoxious.
Is that everyone’s favorite word here now? lol
They may call themselves fans but half of them cant name a player past Jeter and A-Rod…
Half? Come on now! lol
I hate to say it as it’s a borderline ridiculous assertation, but the number is disproportionately high. I had an acquaintance for a while who was an alleged die-hard, born and raised Yankee fan (Whom I met in early 2009) who tried to pull the argument of “when was the last time the Yankees even missed the postseason, huh (No, seriously, she tried it)?” when I first met her.
Of course, when I congratulated her (Albeit, slightly sardonically considering her ineptitude) later that year, she was completely oblivious to what I was talking about. Took me ages to find out she pretty much stopped actively following the Yankees after 2004.
(In the end, this really has nothing to do with anything, it just crossed my mind and god that woman drives me nuts on so many levels)
There are almost certainly a bunch of FCs with larger global followings than the yankees, but you are probably right regarding the MLB.
Manchester United and then the Dallas Cowboys to be exact.
My body hates the yankees. I only think they are really annoying, but my body sure detests them.
(haha, just kidding Lunchbox. I do appreciate most of your posts).
Yeah but it was great when they sucked. I can’t wait til they fall over again. It’s going to happen eventually.
Oh by the way, thanks for writing “just letting you know”, I don’t follow baseball at all and don’t even know how I ended up on this page. I had absolutely no idea the Yankees won a lot in the last 10 years. Cool story bro.
“Yeah but it was great when they sucked. I can’t wait til they fall over again”
“I don’t follow baseball at all and don’t even know how I ended up on this page”
If you don’t like or follow baseball, then why do you have interest in the Yankees losing? lol
And if you ended up on the page by mistake, why are you commenting on it? Especially if it’s something you don’t follow.
hahha, sarcasm…so tricky to pick up on…
Sometimes it can be (Sorry I got a headache and have had a very long day both good and bad things, time for me to hit the sack very soon).
I hear you on both counts. Bed sounds amazing right. I’ll follow that incentive.
However then in the end, I take it he’s just a bitter Mets fan livin in good ol Brooklyn NY.
However I agree with everyone else, what Titans In Baseball is something a lot of Yankee fans would say. Bragging about the championships, something I don’t do.
Come on, man! You are so better than that. I’m awful at internet sarcasm and even I managed to pick this one up!
lol as I said to Jon Stark, I was pooped that night after a long day and my head thinking back and forth after watching an amazing ball game. I didn’t start from top down to read the comments anyway. Give me a break for once!
Want a medal?
a whole 9 years? how horrible
Its the same amount of rings as every other World Series champion team (but the Red Sox) in the last 10 years.
Does the ‘definition of victory’ taste like dentures, girdles and bengay? I heard Alex Rodriguez recently turned 56 years old.
Wrong he’s 66
I wanna pitch!
Come to the Big Apple Yu, and have the tigers beat you in the first round.
So, based on the failure of Igawa, they’re going to pass on Darvish? Flawed logic.
not flawed logic, flawed reading comprehension
what they said is that they will not pay an expensive posting fee for him. If the yankees get him for the posting fee they have in mind, they will gladly take him.
Well of course if he is in their price range they’d sign him.
What I meant was that, because the article mentions “”given spotty history with Japanese pitchers”, that means they are allowing Igawa to come into the equation.
If it simply said that they Yankees wouldn’t pay an expensive posting fee without mentioning the past Japanese signings, I’d have no problem. Obviously if the posting fee is ridiculously high, they pass on a pitcher with no MLB experience.
Not really, they are going to be more financially cautious because they have been burned in the past. It makes perfect sense.
It is relatively flawed logic in the sense that Igawa was a bonehead move to begin with. Sure, there were a couple of holdouts who claimed he’d be just as good as Matsuzaka (Which, depressingly enough considering how much of a bust Matsuzaka was, Igawa wasn’t even close), but by and large anyone who knew what they were talking about was wondering what the heck the Yankees were thinking with that move.
Which gets me wondering. Any Yankees fans ever know whether it was the Steinbrenners pushing Cashman into that move or if he pulled that nonsense of his own volition?
Irabu?
Obtained through trade through the Padres, but I get what you’re getting at: He’s (part) Japanese.
Darvish is going to be a Blue Jay.
that will be the revenge for vernon wells.
I thought having had to pay Vernon Wells’ salary for the first three years of his contract was already enough revenge for vernon wells :o
Year Age Team Salary
2005 26 Toronto Blue Jays $3,070,000
2006 27 Toronto Blue Jays $4,470,000
2007 28 Toronto Blue Jays $8,787,500
2008 29 Toronto Blue Jays $3,687,500
2009 30 Toronto Blue Jays $4,687,500
2010 31 Toronto Blue Jays $15,687,500
2011 32 $5M paid by Toronto Blue Jays, (21+ LAA)
2012 33 LAA $21,000,000
2013 34 LAA
$21,000,000
2014 35 LAA $21,000,000
Funny thing is, Vernon’s contract was back-loaded, and the Jays never paid him more than $15.6875MM (.273 .331 .515 .847, 31 HR, 44 2B, 125 OPS+)
The Angels took him for 4/84 minus Napoli’s $5.8MM and Rivera’s $5.25MM, so 4/73. Crazy thing is, it could still end up working out for them (in a very relative way).
They gave 8.5MM on march 1 of 08, 09 and 10 as part of his 25.5MM signing bonus too though.
Why are you subtracting player salaries? Does this mean the Jays were paying Frank Francisco and Rivera -$74M? I can understand treating a player like cash when they’re useless (like when the Jays took Teahen), but Wells was almost as bad as Rivera over the course of the season and Napoli obviously blew them both away. They only raised their payroll by $73M over 4 years, but they took him for 4/84 minus the cash they received.
The revenge for Vernon Wells was not having to pay Vernon Wells.
Why would Darvish go with the Jays!
#1 the team who wins the posting fee bid has exclusive rights, he has no control over who wins
#2 the reason he’s coming over in the first place, money
#3 stop being such a tool
He said he wants to come to a winning team, the Rangers! What about the tax on his money and the fact that the Jay don’t draw any fans!
Why would you want to pay that money for an unproven starter. $50 mil posting plus $75 mil for 5 years is $125 total averaging $25 million per year. Get real. You can sign CC ($24.2 mil per year) for that and he is a known commodity.
dude, I’m going to send you the latest edition of hooked on phonics.
Please, try to understand the difference between a question mark and an exclamation point. The former will make your previous two posts seem like genuine, legit questions, though still somewhat silly, while the latter make your posts sound crazy.
Although I imagine your penchant for hyperbole would still be intact.
Didn’t they end up being number two or three in the bidding for Matsuzaka?
yep, Rangers posted just over $20 million. I’m guessing they up it around $30 million for Darvish. Jays will be around the same number. Team you have to worry about is the Nationals. Only team on that list that would throw a $50 million price tag on Darvish. Days like this I wish they still played in Montreal.
Toronto has a very high Asian population.
Its probably a better place to be iranian as well
damn, your on fire tonight!!!
thank you.. but that wasn’t a joke, he really is iranian lol
im quite aware…..just enjoying the entertainment, heh
you’re*
Nope Canada is a terrible place to be Iranian. One hour outside of Toronto and Vancouver is pressing your luck. Far better off in New York.
If your posting otherwise you have never been a minority in Canada.
lol this is absolutely moronic..
brampton is 45 mins outside of the city and has the largest collection of east asian and middle eastern population, outside of their home countries..
1 hour is less than 45 minutes.
India does not equal Iran Lunchbox.
i think you are missing the point. toronto and surrounding area has the highest percentage of foreign born population in the world outside of miami, whose immigrant population is dominated by latin americans. so in terms of diversity, toronto has no equal. no matter what country darvish is from he could find a home here.
of course the surrounding rural areas are less diverse, but a) how is that different from anywhere else in north america and b) why the hell would darvish live in a rural area anyways? he’d take an apartment downtown like every other player, and then probably go back to japan in the offseason.
your grammar indicates that you’re a minority.
or just dumb.
You did not capitalize the start of both of your sentences. You also have no subject in your second “phrase” you posted.
Toronto got money, expected salaries for next season is 56 million, so they can pay the whole posting fee this season (and next if they want) and just pay him like 8 million the next few years. A young team with a great opportunity to play, huge asian population (trust me i live in Toronto), and did i forget to say they have money?
Team winning bid has to pay the posting fee when they sign him, can’t spread it out (55-75mil). And I dont think you’ll get away with 8mil per yr, more like 12-14mil per. So some quik math gives us 13×6=78+62=140mil. Jays can swing it, but they going have to tie up alot of money in him.
I don’t see it getting to $12-14. They’ll use Matsuzaka as the precedent. If the Sox could get Matsuzaka, with all the hype surrounding him, for 6 years at roughly eight per with Boras as his agent in an up economy, I have to imagine the Jays could get an equivelant rate at worst for Darvish, especially with so many people hesitant on Japanese pitchers after the Matsuzaka fiasco.
In the end, if Darvish walks, he goes back to Japan disgraced for one more year. A lot of people forget, but that was a HUGE part of the negotiations with Matsuzaka, Boras was content to walk away, but Matsuzaka basically told him to take a long walk off a short pier over the disgrace that would be involved in Japanese culture had Matsuzaka walked, ironic considering all he did was walk for the next three years). For the Jays (Or whoever wins the bidding), should he walkk they just explain to their fanbase “look at what happened with Matszaka and Igawa, did you really want us to lock up so much payroll on a guy who’s never pitched in the MLB?”
A lot of people don’t look at it, but Matsuzaka did a lot of damage to the Asian baseball market, especially with his lack of accountability.
Ask yourself this is Darvish worth 120 million!
I’d like to request a dollar for every grammatical error you make.
…it would be worth about a quarter of Darvish’s posting fee.
Get a life, people come to comment about baseball. Not to to be taught an English lesson.
since we’re correcting others’ writing and while i may be mistaken, i’d like to point out that i am fairly certain that it is a syntactical error.
You are aware that Chinese make up the largest portion of Toronto asian population and the Chinese can’t stand the Japanese.
you forgot the question mark, but your question is so dumb that its not surprising you mistook it for something else.
why haven’t you learned the basic skill of punctuation?
I hope the Jays dont win just to calm down these cocky fans…
If the Jays win he will become another Vernon Wells!
Because clearly the Blue Jays are the fanbase in this division with a cockiness problem.
Seriously, even O’s fans on this site are by and large cockier than Jays fans a lot of the time. Don’t worry, Jays fans, I still love our quiet, friendly neighbors to the north.
Sherman’s formula for determining a favourite
a) Do they/ Will they maybe spend money
b) Do they need starting pitching
c) Add royals & mariners to the list to make it look like you didn’t make this up.
You’re right; throw in the port city; a team owned by a Japanese business man, in a city with a large Japanese population, and the best Japanese position player to ever grace the states, while probably knowing that the Mariners could use another efficient starter (ie NOT Vazquez or Beaven).
Seems like he made it up to me too!1!11!111!111!!1!1!
yes, exactly what the mariners need, more pitching…
don’t worry about, you know, scoring runs or anything. The team has far greater holes to fill.
That’s such a poor logic. The Mariners pitchers prospects aren’t right there knocking on the door. They’d be stupid to let Hultzen come up right away and burn a year of service time. Paxton isn’t without his flaws, and could be very well be brought up by the end of the year. Walker is a year or two away. Felix is closing in on free agency. Vargas is a soft tossing lefty. And Pineda has arm injury in his past, already, and should be cautiously used going forward.
You’re right, there’s probably not room for another elite arm in the organization.
Plus, why would you settle for throwing a less talented fifth starter when Darvish could slot in at the 2? A run not allowed is just as valuable as a run scored. You don’t need to average five runs a game to win a lot of games. You just need to prevent runs as well, and that strategy has worked in the past. If you’re advocating throwing your money at poor, long-term investments [ala Richie Sexson, Adrian Beltre, Jose Vidro] in the name of scoring runs, you’d be neglecting run prevention as well.
Also a Mariners fan, I respectfully disagree. The Mariners would be better off to trade for a young catcher like Grandal, sign a stopgap 3B like Betemit, and let Paxton and Hultzen both battle for a spot in the rotation (and maybe sign a Bedard or trade a Figgins for a Zito and split the cost difference). And then see what their younger guys could do with the bat over the course of a season, hope that Gutierrez and Ichiro can bounce back, hope that Wells’ vertigo goes away, and hope that Justin Smoak stays healthy. If they’re going to be spending a huge wad of cash, I’d rather see it go to someone like Reyes or Wilson than someone like Darvish. Darvish is an unknown quantity, and costly at that. Unknown quantities shouldn’t have a lot of money invested into them on a rebuilding team.
I’m all for letting the kids develop, but there are so many holes in this organization, and everybody knows that not all pitching prospects pan out. Paxton isn’t without his flaws, and who are you going to trade to acquire Grandal? You must have read Dave’s article at USSM about dealing Pineda, which would just open up another hole in the organization. Hultzen shouldn’t be in the MLB in 2012, in my opinion. There’s enough money staked in him that it would be wise to let him develop in AA or AAA in 2012. After those names, who is there? Walker and Campos? They’re years away.
Smoak can develop, I have full faith in him there. He was drafted towards the top for a reason. If you’re going to pay for Betemit, why not just let Seager have a crack at it? Plate discipline and gap power? He’s Dustin Ackley-lite.For what it’s worth, I never advocated shelling out untold amounts of money for Darvish, I was merely commenting towards Lunchbox’s inability to comprehend why the Mariners have been linked to Darvish.
I did read Dave’s article at USSM. But for just Grandal, I wouldn’t even think of dealing Pineda, and rightly so. For a one-on-one trade, there are only a couple guys in the Reds’ organization I’d be insterested in trading for Michael Pineda. Anyway, I was thinking more along the lines of a League, Robinson, and AAAA player (Saunders, Liddi, etc.) for Grandal sort of deal.
As for whether Hultzen and Paxton should be in the major leagues next year, we shouldn’t jump to conclusions one way or the other. But if they’re ready, they shouldn’t be held back due to service time when guys like Ackley, Pineda, Smoak, etc. are all ticking away and Ichiro gets closer to retirement and Felix gets closer to free agency. Besides, pitching is more volatile. Flame-outs happen whether you keep guys down or bring them up. Might as well let them go while they’re healthy.
Throw out the unknown quantity part. It’s irrelvant to this topic. C.C. Sabathia’s agent could come to Seattle and say “we’ll give you right of last refusal and sign here as long as you can pony up within $20 million of what the Yankees offer” and the Mariners should STILL walk away if it’s at all likely to interfere with their budget for bats.
Yes, I know, you can never have enough pitching, but you still need SOME offense to win games and the Mariners have none. There are about 25-28 other teams in the MLB that would kill to have the Mariners’ pitching, but there are another 25-28 teams that look at the Mariners’ offense and think “wow, that stinks for them.” With that level of pitching and how much easier it is to get offense over pitching, the Mariners aren’t nearly as far from competing as people make them out to be. If they signed Fielder and went after a solid outfield bat (Honestly, I think Sizemore might be a smart low risk, high reward signing if Cleveland doesn’t pick up his option), they could compete. They probably wouldn’t win their division, but they’d probably be in the race until late in the season and bring enough respectability back to the franchise to draw in a solid free agent or two next offseason.
Here’s the thing, though: the Mariners wouldn’t have the budget to sign CC even if they spent the entirety if this offseason’s money. If they non-tender Aardsma, they’ll have about 18 million to spend. Darvish would cost a big chunk of that. It would be better to spend it on CC or Wilson if we were looking for pitching. But in reality, we’re not. At the same time, there aren’t many high quality 3B out there in FA or readily available in trade except for David Wright, and he’d cost our entire budget and opt out of his contract after 2012. Left field we could spend on Sizemore like you suggested, but at the cost of playing time to a (hopefully healthy) Wells. Another option would be someone cheapish like Ortiz at DH, which would cost playing time to either Carp, Smoak, or Wells. At the end of the day, it’s just not easy to say, “Spend on offense!” when there aren’t a whole lot of good options where the team has holes.
“You don’t need to average five runs a game to win a lot of games. You just need to prevent runs as well, and that strategy has worked in the past.”
Felix Hernandez respectfully disagrees.
No, Felix Hernandez would probably agree. Because three or four runs, a lot of the time, is enough for him. You don’t need to average five runs a game.
You kind of went in the opposite direction of my point. I was responding to someone saying you just need to prevent runs and Felix Hernandez is the king of losing games despite only giving up a run or two across seven or eight innings.
You’re one smart lunch box.
The truth is nobody really know how good Darvish will be, but I’ll bet he isn’t a difference maker! If the Yanks want him they will make the best offer, and are in the best shape to cover the loss if he fails since they clear over 450 per year.
Yu darvish to Texas only if Wilson leaves if not he goes to Toronto the but remember netali feliz is an option to take wilson place in rotation so darvish will be intresting
What if the Wilson situation isn’t resolved by the time the posting fee for Darvish is due? The Matsuzaka posting was finalized by November 14. Considering Free Agency doesn’t start until two weeks after the World Series ends (Which could go as late as October 27, which means free agency could start as late as November 10)), if Wilson opts for free agency (Which he almost certainly will), the Rangers will have only have about a week or two to resolve the Wilson situation if they are planning on basing their plans for Darvish on him.
The Rangers said that if Wilson leaves, both Ogando and Feliz will be converted to starters. I think the Darvish rumors for the Rangers are pretty overrated, and they seem a lot like speculation than actual fact. I mean what free agent HASN’T been tied to the Rangers lately? Everybody is saying the Rangers are among the favorites to also land Fielder and Pujols. I think it’s just because of how good the team is, that it would be foolish to rule out any big name when it comes to the Rangers off season.
As a Nationals fan I’d be happy to sign either Wilson or Darvish
Looking at the past history of free agent pitchers I would think twice about signing either one of them. Lackey was better than either one of these pitchers at the time of his signing with the Sox.
Not clear that lackey was better than Darvish.
Not a the time he was a free agent!
So you don’t think that Wilson would benefit from moving from the A.L. to the N.L.?
Darvish has put up pretty damn good numbers, albeit in Japan.
Even with some of the money that get thrown around on the open market, I have a hard time believing a team would be willing to spend $125 million for 5 years of Yu Darvish.
Japanese league imports have had too spotty a track record to commit that much.
Maybe someone will prove me wrong, I guess!
that is quite a bit, but you have to think of all of the money coming in. The guy is a rockstar in Japan, and it would be a media frenzy if/when he comes to the MLB.
I read somewhere that the Red Sox re-cooped quite a bit of their posting fee for Dice-K with all the foreign merch, Japanese TV revenue, etc. If they market him right, Darvish’s posting fee could be mitigated quite a bit.
Those #s are way too high for Darvish. The Phillies committed 120m to Lee over 5 years. Any team that can afford the cost of Darvish (125m over 5 years) would be much better off giving the same $ to Sabathia or 40m less to Wilson.
if free agency was as simple as going to the store then your post is fine
but its not.. wilson/sabathia may not leave, want to play for your team, might get more money, might choose a different team
there for you need a few options
Darvish to Ms to take over Ichiro’s role as Super Japanese star. Ms can make more than 50M profit from him which covers his posting fee. It will be a win-win situation.
Then trade Pineda for a bat. There will be handful of teams interested in Pineda’s low salary and ace potential.
Posting fee gonna be more than 50mil, more like 60-70, maybe even 80 according to some websites. Matsusaka’s posting was 51mil, and Darvish better stuff at a younger age (also, factor in inflation).
yes but the 51 for dice k was an overpay.. and therefore it should probably be about the same..
many believeit might even be lower
Dice-K was the best pitcher in Japan after winning the World Baseball Tournament!
there certainly would be plenty of interested teams if Pineda became available. Not sure though that you want to give up that much cost-controlled talent.
Your better off getting Edwin Jackson for less money, owe wait, you had him on your team with Marcum, Dotel and Zip! Torondo was the main tool for the Cards to get into the playoffs!
hey! look at me! i don’t have a clue!
Sorry, the braves losing was.
I’d rather give Sabathia 5/125 than Darvish.
Good debate. We know they can both pitch, so it comes down more so to the variables. Sabathia’s weight, wear n tear and age Vs. Darvish’s cultural change and translation of talent to America.
How about both
I am not a mariners fan but it would be awesome if Ichiro can convince Darvish to join him in Seattle.
If not Mariners, then my Nationals can sign him please which is difficult because he will easily cost more than $100 million for less years than CC, CJ, etc. Posting fee itself is such a burden to signing Japanese players.
too bad it is not up to Darvish who wins the posting fee
I’m not so sure about my Yankees going after Yu Darvish. I’ve had my fill of Japanese pitchers in the AL East (For anyone who might say it, no, Chien-Ming Wang doesn’t count; he’s Taiwanese).
double post
so about yu darvish…