Earlier this morning, reports indicated that the Mariners are interested in, if not prioritizing Victor Martinez (as well as Hanley Ramirez), which meshes with previous reports that the team will likely show interest. As one of the top free agents on the market, Martinez will likely find his name swirling about the rumor mill, and we’ll keep track of today’s V-Mart talk here…
- The Blue Jays are now among the teams interested in Martinez, reports Jon Heyman of CBS Sports. Though the team perhaps has a greater need in the infield, Heyman writes that the trade of Adam Lind has opened a door for Martinez to fit into the picture in Toronto. Heyman hears that the Tigers and Mariners are the other two primary suitors in the early stages, noting that Martinez is high on Seattle GM Jack Zduriencik’s wish list.
AA is “interested” in any good player…
Rogers is NOT “interested” in paying them and Beeston is not “interested” in going over five years.
Move on folks. Nothing to see here!
They’re signing someone this year, they have too. They would’ve sold out the stadium had they done anything at all last off-season, I mean they were in first place for 2 months and nobody cared enough to buy a ticket because we all felt it was inevitable the team would collapse one way or another, the team was relatively the same as the one in 2013 minus the super productive month of Juan Fransisco.
But because of the poor off-season, fans instead bought into the team during the declining month of August when the team tanked. The difference could’ve been a astronomical gain for T.V ratings and attendance.
I’ve seen too many photos of Bautista with Martinez over the years to know the two are obvious good friends. I believe his son is also a huge fan of Bautista’s with a few impersonating instagrams videos posted by Joeybats.
So for what it’s worth if Bautista doesn’t give Martinez a few calls during the negotiation period I will be very displeased.
Since he came to Detroit, I’ve seen Victor talk with everyone and his son is almost always right there with him talking to players and sometimes playing with players. I wouldn’t read too much into a friendship with Bautista being a key in negotiations.
I’ve seen pictures of them golfing together.
Like I said, he has friends on every team. Much like Cubans wanting to play on teams with Cubans, people tend to overstate how much effect being friends with somebody plays into negotiations.
Victor has been a leader and fan favorite in Detroit since 2011. I’d be willing to bet that he has more friends in Detroit than Toronto.
yep Jack
so?
You don’t go golfing with just anyone.
Or any friendship of any player entering into the equation significantly when it comes to free agents choosing locations.
V-Mart is a popular man. During the Home Run Derby, I thought it was interesting to see him be close to Yoenis Cespedes as the A’s/Tigers have a bit of a rivalry there.
And Bautista is also a popular man too. I can see Bautista trying to lure V-Mart to Toronto.
I’m sure Bautista will give him a call, but so will players from a dozen different teams.
Yeah, V-Mart has a lot of connections throughout the Majors.
I would lol if he went to the ChiSox though after the whole binocular incident with Chris Sale.
BUT, V-Mart did come to the Tigers after the whole Ricky P incident when he beaned V-Mart and then got charged by Youkilis.
THAT would be uproarious DK
Agreed, same could have been said about Oritz and Bautista and it made no difference… money then opportunity to win, are all that matters (in most cases)
yep
Can we just make a deal for Saunders already?
He’d be a nice add, if we’re hoping for him to put us over the top and finally make the playoffs I think we might as well start the fire sale. We don’t have a potent #5 bat or #4 bat depending if Cabrera resigns or not.
Not to put us over the top… we could actually USE HIM. He’ll be cheaper then Melky, can play all three OF spots and platoon with Mayberry Jr hitting against lefties. Save that money to upgrade the other areas of need.
Yeah, I’m not saying he’s not a bad addition. He’s a 2WAR player though, he’d hit where? 5th, 6th? Your priorities are wrong if you think Sanders is more than what he’s proven to be in Seattle so far. He’s injury prone and that in Toronto spells disaster.
You don’t have a potent #4 or #5 bat? you’re kidding right? Bautista and Encarnacion are both those things. Teams would kill to have both on the same team.
Who’s hitting in our #2 hole? As things stand today, Bautista’s going to be hitting there if Cabrera doesn’t resign. Before writing something you should use your head to figure out what you’re responding to.
Hahaha the fact that Bautista is in your #2 spot is semantics, btw he only had 88 appearances there last year. He is a traditional #4 or #5 bat. You are dillusional if you think all these teams have the bats you guys have. Sure, Melky is going to be gone if you dont bring him back, but why vmart? He provides you nothing other than a DH. Spend your limited resources on things you need (Pitching and Defense) rather than things you would like to have.
He batted there once Cabrera got hurt.. IE: Last month of the season. I have no disillusion about our great top of the order, however excusing the fact that none of our sluggers ever stay healthy our depth has been exposed in back to back years. Bautista, Encarnacion, Reyes and Lawrie are guaranteed injuries at this point. Lind is also injury prone so in one way, I’m glad he’s gone. However, how does having a great offense that can’t stay healthy help late in the season (IE: August) when our team only scores 85 runs in a month because everyone is hurt?
Unless baseball has changed, teams win games by scoring more runs than the other team. Also, run prevention in a homer friendly environment is never a good strategy.
You’ve also changed your argument 100 times in this thread, first it was “bad pitching” than it was “mediocre division” than it’s “bad defense”. Make up your mind.
Because he’s Canadian?
and an upgrade
BTW, Gibbons mentioned Victor on the radio last week, as a player that AA wants to chase. I thought it should have been newsworthy at that time. I doubt AA wanted Gibbons to leak that.
…Maybe the Blue Jays should allocate their resources to add a starting pitcher, rather than another bat in the lineup.
R.A Dickey, Buerhle, and Stroman need some help!
Why? Hutchinson’s first year back from Tommy John had him perform adequately, J.A Happ is also throwing 95mph as a lefty now both guys provided 1WAR+. We’re fine with starting pitching. We lost our lead last year because we had zero depth once Bautista or Edwin got hurt.
Happ, Hutchison, Sanchez, Norris, and Graveman will fight it out for spots. Unless they move Buerhle AND Dickey I don’t see a big need for more pitching right now.
A 4.48 ERA for Hutchison is not adequate. Happ has had his ups and downs and rookies can’t be counted on either. Relying on another good year from Beuhrle is a huge risk. I am not sure most contenders would agree. I’d be more worried about retaining Melky and adding some starting pitching pieces than overpaying Vmart.
I’m sorry but a ERA under 4.50 in the AL East is more than adequate, perhaps you don’t pay attention to the AL East ERA average specifically in Toronto.
Rogers Centre is far from a pitchers paradise and anyone who’s gotten the memo on that probably shouldn’t be talking about ERA’s on the team.
Hutchison was a top 40 starter by WAR last year. Seems pretty good for a 4th or 5th starter.
4 of your 5 spots have a war of 1.4-2.5. The exception being buehrle and his miraculous 2014 (3.6). I’m not saying all of your starters are terrible but you could definitely use an upgrade. Especially knowing Beuhrle is most likely going to come back to earth and be more of a 1.5-2.5 level player for 2015.
And the giants have no SP other than Bum over 1.7 WAR.
The orioles’ best SP was 2.6 WAR, everyone else 2.5 or less.
Great pitching is a lot more rare than you seem to believe.
You gave 2 examples. How about the Pirates, Cards, Nationals, Detroit, A’s, hell even teams that were on the cusp Reds, Mariners, Angels (until injuries killed them). Even the Royals, where the pitching put them over the top (shields, ventura).
Haha, the mediocre AL East? You might be able to use that argument a few years ago but last year definitely not.
The A.L East had the most wins versus every other division in baseball, even last year…. Do you even watch baseball?
Haha, thats great. Still can’t seem to win when it matters. How does this relate to the Blue Jays poor rotation?
How does saying the Blue Jays having a poor rotation, when it’s not true, relate to you saying the A.L East is mediocre? 4 out of 5 teams play in hitter friendly ballparks.
ERA’s have always been high and will always continue being high over a full season. Now stop blurting out things that aren’t true and get your facts straight.
War (which equals this all out) still rate your starters as barely above replacement level.
Hutchinson provided 1.6WAR(bbref)2.6WAR(fangraphs). How is that barely above replacement level?
J.A Happ 1.4WAR(bbref) 1.3WAR(fangraphs). He’s in the reserve level for both and closer to the starter level.(2.0WAR)
None of our starters were close to the replacement level which is 0.0WAR. I’d love for a list of teams that have 5 starters providing 1.0WAR or more.
Once again, not debating you have a lot of 1.4-2.5 level starters. Having a bunch of #3 starters hasn’t been getting it done for you guys. Buehrle and Dickey allow people to put the ball in play an awful lot. You have poor defense. Clearly, it hasn’t gotten you anywhere. Allocating resources to run prevention rather than another bat seems like a better idea to me than adding more scoring.
Yes, you were debating that point. 2.5 WAR gets you into the top 50 starters in the league.
Using ERA (alone) to discuss a pitcher’s performance is inadequate
Thats a lot of question marks to bank on if you ask me, Buerhle looked out of gas during the 2nd half of the season. Dickeys no ace, Sanchez has never pitched 6 innings and Happ and Hutch are back end starters. Nothing to go crazy about. The best thing the Jays can do at this point is get a front end starter
Not aces? I guess they are totally worthless then. All the other teams have 5 aces starting right?
5 aces? How about 5 starters that can get you to the playoffs…those are two completely different things. If you think Dickey, Beuhrle, Stroman, Hutchison, and insert minor leaguer here are getting you to the playoffs. Good Luck.
The Giants won the world series with a similarly projected group.
The Orioles made it in from the AL East with an even worse group.
Haha, you act like the Giants don’t have good starters. Bumgarner is better than anyone the Blue Jays have to offer.
And if he pitched every game you would have an argument here. But their other starters are all much worse.
Great, but who are the Jay’s going to run out in the playoffs? RA Dickey?
Stroman, Sanchez, or whoever else looks better?
and Hutch, Sanchez, Happ, Norris….just a few decent options to round out the starting 5
Even got Redmond and Estrada who can make starts.
Being able to start and being able to give a quality start are two different things.
How many teams have 7-8 guys capable of making MLB quality starts on their teams in a hitter friendly environment such as the Rogers Centre or the A.L East? You’re arguing about something that no team has.
You need 5 guys first. I never said 7-8.
I don’t think you understand what you’re writing because guys who provide 1+WAR as #4/#5 starters are more than qualified to be pitching in any rotation.
Sure but when your rotation is littered with them you probably aren’t going to prevent many runs. 1.4-2.5 war level players for 4 out of your 5 spots isn’t going to get it done.
More food for thought. 5th in Runs Scored even with your injuries, and 20th in runs allowed. Yeah, I think you need another starter or 3.
….Or we can improve upon our horrendous infield defense that included the wonders of Juan Fransisco, Jose Reyes, Munenori Kawasaki and Adam Lind/Edwin Encarncion for about 3 months.
I would agree but Vmart doesn’t help you there either.
Don’t forget about Norris and Hutch. The rotation will be fine.
Well, yeah. I’d find it strange if a team said they weren’t interested in a guy like VMart.
The day the stooges at Rogers make a big play on a major FA is the day the earth stood still.
Ah, the standard Toronto Smokescreen, it shows up at the beginning of every offseason and fails to fool fans more often than the team fails to sign players.
Actually, only the agents think they are fooling anyone… most fans assume the Jays won’t be signing players of his stature.
Yeah…and how much will he ask for? Probably something ridiculous like $20M/year so I doubt the Jays will end up signing him. Still wondering how a guy who had never hit more than 25 homeruns (and that was 7 years ago) can hit a career-high 32, and also a career-best .335 BA at the age of 35. He’s always been a solid .300 hitter with decent power but his stats last year were off the charts. Not sure if he can repeat next year.
Let’s just all agree there’s no way in hell VMart, Sandoval or any other significant free agent (Jed Lowrie MAYBE… not that he falls into the “significant” category) signs with the Blue Jays under this regime. Although a lot has been made of the pros and cons to it… Beeston and AA’s 5 year policy is going to to exclude them from ever signing top-end talent. Why? Because top end talent doesnt sign 1-4 year Free Agency contracts very often unless they’re a) returning from injury, b) rebuilding their value, c) giving their team a discount (ala Bautista/Edwin), d) they’re bullpen pieces or aging stars past their prime or e) they’re buying out their arbitration years o make more money until they hit free agency. Signability of top free agents is directly attributed to fair market value and financial commitment. Great players arent going to sell themselves short on dollars or leave themselves in short contracts and be hampered by compensation being tied to them when they are tendered and have to deal with what Morales/Drew did last year. I know I wouldnt.The “policy” spits in the face of conventional wisdom. Its hard enough to convince ballplayers to come north to play baseball on turf as it is… but to limit your pool of talent by refusing to consider signing a player to a deal longer then 5 years is outright absurd and stubborn. Why do you think AA had to sell the farm to acquire Reyes, Dickey, Buehrle, etc? Because if management isnt willing to meet their $$$/terms then the only way to improve/upgrade is via trade. Its a vicious cycle and until it stops, get used to being snubbed by high end free agents and get used to the Justin Smoaks, Danny Valencias and John Mayberry Jrs of the world.
And dont misunderstand me… Im a die-hard jays fan through and through, but this leadership team is frustrating. I moved to Ohio in 2000, and i STILL don my jays gear all summer and winter long. My loyalty to the Jays will never waiver, but my loyalty to the way the team is run from ownership on down to player personnel is getting to be a little redundant. I want to to see meaningful September baseball… i just question whether the Ambiguously Vague Duo can get it accomplished before they’re run out of town.
I think you need to keep in mind how far the Jays have come in terms of the strength of the system in the last 3-4 years.
And that the Justin Smoaks, Danny Valencias and John Mayberry Jrs of the world are how the Jays got the Edwin Encarnacions and Jose Bautistas of the world.
If you connect the dots, it is obvious that his agent is trying to get the “smoke” going to compel Mike Ilitch (Tigers Owner) to give him what ever he wants.
We have seen this script before EIGHT times:
1. Pudge
2. Magglio
3 and 4. Verlander and then Verlander again.
5 and 6. Miggy and then Miggy again.
7. Anibal
8. Fielder
It would be a tough pick between Seattle and the Jays, I think the Mariners are closer to winning they have the pitching!
I can’t see the Jays both PAYING V-Mart what it will cost to sign him, AND forfeiting the 1st round draft pick they would have to give up. Given that he is no longer an every day fielder, I see his market as being the Astros, Rangers, Twins, Red Sox, White Sox, and of course Tigers, who I expect to resign him.
I agree 100%. The only team who loses nothing by signing him is Detroit. I dont see a team giving up a 1st round pick PLUS a severe overpay for VMart at this stage of his career.
I don’t see V-Mart making more than David Ortiz, since DH’s have never been paid much and he’s the closest precedent. You’d be looking at Martinez to make 4yrs/59M or 3yrs/45M.
Martinez would be something special with the Jays, I don’t see it personally but I hope they planned on replacing Lind with someone who’s good.
Stopppppp getting my hopes up.
Don’t see it happening unless the Jays get rid of Buerhle’s 20 million for next year
I hope the Jays deal him. He’s been decent, but he’s too expensive.
With the talk last year of players moving around salary just to potentially fit E.Santana, this just doesn’t seem realistic.
Victor stays in Detroit. Max is gone. End of discussion.