Over the weekend, Marc Topkin of the Tampa Bay Times reported that the Giants had some level of interest in Rays third baseman Evan Longoria, and following up on that report, USA Today’s Bob Nightengale tweets that the Giants have “keen interest” in swinging a deal for the Tampa Bay cornerstone. However, in order for any deal to work, Nightengale notes that the Giants would need the Rays to take the contract of either Hunter Pence or Denard Span back from the Giants in addition to whatever prospects San Francisco would send.
Taking on either of those contracts would be a fairly tall order for the cost-conscious Rays. Pence is entering the final season of a five-year, $90MM contract and is owed $18.5MM in 2018 — more than the $13.5MM that Longoria is set to take home this coming season. Obviously, taking on Pence’s deal would still provide the Rays with long-term cost savings — Longoria is owed $86MM over the next five years — but the short-term complications in that scenario are readily apparent.
Taking on Span’s deal would be closer to a cash-neutral proposition. He’s owed a $9MM salary plus a $4MM buyout in the coming year, though he will also reportedly be paid a deferred $3MM from his signing bonus come Jan. 20, 2018 as well, so even that scenario could require the Rays to take on some additional 2018 dollars.
Of course, if the Rays are to take on any salary in return, even a portion of one of those two deals, that’d give GM Erik Neander, senior VP Chaim Bloom and the rest of the front office greater cause to increase their ask in terms of prospects from a Giants system that is thin on upper-tier talent. At his current price tag of five years and $86MM, the 32-year-old Longoria isn’t exactly teeming with surplus value, though he remains a quality regular option at the hot corner.
Longoria hit .261/.313/.424 with 20 homers last season — the weakest offensive output of his career — but delivered excellent defensive marks at third base, leading to a season that was worth roughly three wins above replacement. The ever-durable Longoria has only missed 12 games since the start of the 2013 season and hasn’t been on the DL since 2012, though the downturn in his offensive profile in 2017 could create some cause for trepidation. Longoria’s ground-ball rate skyrocketed to 43.4 percent as his line-drive, fly-ball and hard-contact rates all fell. His infield-fly rate, meanwhile, trended upward for a fourth straight season.
Whether Longoria’s 2017 downturn was an aberration or the beginning of a decline remains to be seen but may also be a moot point in this instance. The Rays likely don’t relish the idea of taking on a negative-value asset in order to trade a player that has been the face of their franchise for nearly a decade, but the Giants can’t take on the $16.7MM luxury tax hit would accompany Longoria’s contract without pushing perilously close to the $197MM tax barrier.
San Francisco wants to avoid paying that tax for a fourth straight season and would love to reset its tax penalty — they’re currently set to pay a 50 percent tax on every dollar over that point this offseason and in subsequent years — making the Longoria scenario seem to be something of a reach.
If the Rays plan to trade Longoria at all, however, this would be the offseason to do it. He’ll gain 10-and-5 rights early in the 2018 season, which would provide him full veto power over any proposed trade.
Laughing out loud!
Rays take on bad contracts to trade Longo
A little unclear on the long range aspects of the contracts huh?
Tad, lol
If they take back salary they are getting a couple of high quality prospects.
High quality prospects… San Francisco Giants… pick one.
They got Ramos and that’s about it
Stick to commenting about your outrageously bad history of horrible contracts. That’s what you’re good at. That and choking in the playoffs.
There is no denying The Giants have one of the weaker farm systems in The MLB. They don’t have any prospects that stand out.
Dodgers have a better history of big contracts then the giants do lol. And a much smarter front office that knows how to use their resources. Until the giants front office goes new school and stops calling the modern analytics “computers” they wont compete any time soon
the beauty of winning a couple (3) world series championships, we can afford to tank while “showing” the fanbase they are trying to compete in an effort to keep ticket sales up without a loss in revenue.
not that you would know, you guys are only used to choking in the playoffs with no championships to show for it. your “smarter” front office does not have any rings to support their “intelligence.” move along now, little kid. keep overrating your prospects.
You know why right? It’s an A’s/Rays front office in LA
Funny because under the new dodgers front office the giants have yet to have a better season then the dodgers. Oh yeah Cody Bellinger and Corey Seager were such over rated prospects. Bellinger is already better than Belt after 5 months at age 21 then belt is his whole career. Farm system keeps producing but ok call it over rated. Im sure Christan Arroyo and Tyler Beede will be elite mlb players
You just aren’t very smart 🙂
The Giants “tank” with a $180M+ payroll….
LOL
Let’s see, buster Posey, Brandon Crawford, Brandon belt, Madison bumgarner, Tim lincecum, Matt cain… all recent examples of top tier home frown players. Meaning the giants drafted them. Meanwhile the Dodgers are taking on hundreds in millions of debt for payroll they cannot afford, in order to build a brand. And you’re so pathetic that you think winning a division is somehow a better accomplishment than winning 3 world series in 5 years. The giants will continue to-do what has worked in the past, while the Dodgers will keep throwing money at their choke artist roster, and fail over and over. Also, prospect rankings are basically meaningless. When was trout drafted again?
What are you trying to say? The giants drafted good players 10 years ago. Yes i know congratulations not hard to hit on top 10 picks . Matt cain and Lincecum both had terrible contracts after. And if you really think the dodgers dont have “top tier” home grown players you really have no clue what your talking about. But yet again your citing trout to say prospect rankings are meaningless despite trout being the #1 prospect in baseball. You are all over the place and having a clueless argument
3 World Series in 5 years. What have the Dodgers won in the last 30 years?
No one talks about the past more than giant fans. The Red Sox who basically had the same success this cuentry dont even talk about their past 3 rings. Their fans at least talk about being good again in the future. Heck even Astro fans who won it all 2 months ago dont even talk about their championship as much as the giants do. 2014 is getting farther in the past everyday folks. 2018 will be no different for the giants then 2015 or 2017 was
There’s a reason why Dodger fans don’t like hearing about the recent past. Like it or not the Giants are the team of the decade. Had the Red Sox won 3 WS titles in 5 years instead of 3 in 10, they would have undoubtedly been more vocal. History is something Dodger fans hate because they need to go back as far as they do to when they actually had something to talk about other than division titles, and a pennant.
Giants have 3 in 8 now. Its not 2015 anymore. Realistically its going to become 3 in 10 by the end of 2019 season. Winning division titles and a pennant is a lot better than a 98 loss season. Dont hear Royals fans talking about their success which was more recent than the giants either. Yall live in the past.
Game 7 still has you on the skids, eh ?
They won 3 over span of 5 years. But okay, you want to look at it as 3 in 8? Fine. That makes the Dodgers 1 in 30 now.
Division titles with no WS wins isn’t much to brag about. Dodgers have 8 division titles, 1 pennant, and zero WS tiitles in this century. The Giants have 4 division titles, 4 pennants, and 3 WS wins this century.
And I love how Dodger fans regard the current decade as ancient history. Had the Dodgers won 3 over a span of 5 Dodger fans would be signing a different tune.
And i guarantee if the dodgers won game 7 you would be dismissing it because it wasn’t 3 in 5. NL is wide open again and the Dodgers are once again going to be a contender. Cant say the same for the Giants
I feel like this is a very bad argument. First off they aren’t taking on debt they can’t afford, but hey facts. Sure they took on 400M, as a result of McCourt. But under the debt agreement such debts was earmarked in their tv contract. But you know Billionaires, why pay money out of your own pocket up front when you don’t have to especially when it’ll get paid off by the duration of the tv contract. Beyond that the plan was always to take on big money short term contracts to get out of long term arrangements. When the team was sold it was in absolute disarray. The farm had been pillaged, because McCourt couldn’t afford to take salary. The draft was penny pinched. The roster was stars and scrubs. And contracts re-upped to appease fans. Have to love it now though right, rival fans weren’t complaining when McCourt was funneling money but yet when new ownership prioritizes winning and now there is a major problem.
Secondly, if you want a legitimate argument you really have to compare new ownership v old ownership. You also have to compare the dead duck Colletti (which was somewhat unfair) vs the new FO.
Congrats the Giants won 3 WS, honestly much respect. They hit on top 10 draft picks which is essentially what bad teams have to do to compete. Otherwise you’re spinning you’re wheels like the Pirates did for so long. They were a great team. That said it’s funny that Dodgers just throw money at everything yet you don’t once credit Dodgers developmental staff. It’s kind of comical quite honestly. I mean if the definition of throwing money is anything beyond let’s say the early int market or the Red Sox’s trade then it’s a little biased, but I digress.
So yes the Giants once were the gold standard of draft and develop, but teams eventually adapt or die.
Win a title this century, then you get to talk. Until then your prospects and ROY trophies mean nothing. Winning 100 games a year and having an amazing regular season with no trophies is awesome- right Dan Marino?
When you win a trophy in the last 25 years then you get to talk all you want- until then it’s hollow, and really renders the Giants’ poor record immaterial in context.
Giants have a much better history of winning World Series than the Dodgers do.
If the Rays could not finish a deal with prospect rich cardinals then its likely Longo sticks around yet another season.
As a Rays fan I wish we clean house and add to the already two minor league champions we have down at Durham.
1 you have to support and bring up kids together and hope you get lucky in AL East.
2 I don’t want to want Longo to reach 10/5 then hold Rays hostage when it’s time to move on. It hurts but it’s MLB economics
3 getting rid fat contracts keeps my ticket prices down so let’s go young Rays!
And people complain about the Yanks. In which world the Rays take a bad contract or 2 and trade Longoria?
Is it just me or is Nightengale the worst of these “insiders”. The guy seems to make stuff up as he goes along and a lot of it makes no sense.
Absolutely. He tweets made up “reports” to get likes and retweets and a spot on this site. This trade proposition makes 0 sense at all
not a credible source at all. been wrong on many occasions.
This is where the Mets could step in and take on the salary since they have roughly $30M to play with this off-season. Fills a need at 3B, leadership they could use, good defense and a little pop left in the bat. Granted he’s on the wrong side of the fence in his career most likely, but the alternatives (Walker/Moustakis) come with some concerns as well. I don’t think much would be needed in return to Tampa if the Mets took on the salary.
Yes. Much would be needed in return this wouldn’t be a salary dump of the greatest ray of all time. It would be talent based
If that were the case, the Mets would be better off signing Walker and keeping their prospects. $85M for the next 5 years for a player on a decline is a salary dump – especially a team that resides in Florida and can’t afford to keep their players.
You have no idea what you’re talking about. The Rays will gladly hold on to their all time leader in everything on a team friendly deal to retire him as the first ray for life. This was a rebuild move for prospects.
Yeah gentlemen the BS is getting deep
Simpsons did it! Simpsons did it!
Bobby “The Brain” Evans must’ve seen too may Star Wars movies. The Jedi mind trick isn’t a real negotiating tactic.
As a Giants fan, I would love Longo for Pence or Span. But having a brain…there is no way the Rays do this. Giants are in for a world of hurt unless they can pull off some pretty slick moves this offseason. Don’t see it happening with the farm we have. But our farm has been pretty thin for a while. So that begs the question, why all the change with the MLB coaching staff…but what about scouting/player development? Seems like SF is seriously lacking in that department.
The Giants completely overhauled their minor league coaching staff on Friday and announced as much (which we’ve mentioned a couple times on MLBTR).
As for the trade scenario, of course it wouldn’t just be Span for Longoria or something to that end. The Giants would need to add significant minor league talent — all the truer if they’re trying to pawn off a bad contract — though generally speaking I agree that the scenario is far fetched.
Hadn’t read about the minor league staff…playing catchup on the weekend. That is good news. Agree that they would need to package top minor league talent. They have enough to get one deal done…but they need more than one deal to get back into contention.
Then don’t comment until you can do so intelligently.
The Giants need young cost controlled players, not another aging contract. Why not sell MadBum, Posey, Panik and / or Crawford and load up on prospects?
They need to get below the luxury tax limit and they are more than one player away from competing in the NL West. Sound like time a quick rebuild.
Because they won 3 championships with those guys. The fan base would lose their minds if this roster is stripped down after one bad year.
Have to give Evans props for trying to get creative, but the likelihood of TB taking on any kind of bad contract is slim to none. Giants are up against the luxury tax threshold which will prevent them from making the necessary additions to keep pace with the other teams in the NL West, and no team wants Pence or Span. Rays could just as easily send Longoria to ATL, take on Markakis’ contract, and receive much better prospects in the deal. Try as they might, SF is squarely in a “damned if they do, and damned if they don’t” situation.
makes no sense to sell posey, he is worth building around – bum it all depends in the future on what he wants in a contract as to whether you keep him – he is an inexpensive contract for an ace right now and there isn’t anyone in the system to replace him so you would end up going out and spending 3 times his salary to replace him. Panik could net you a decent return though and I know his name has been floated as well as belt’s.
Trade Belt to them.
Four years at $17.2 mil? Hard pass
The writing is on the wall even though they aren’t saying it. They will field a relatively competitive team in 2018 and 19, but the plan is a subtle rebuild. I think the only veteran players they will keep over this span is Crawford and Posey. They will make the trades to acquire more prospects at the trade deadline.
they may keep bum too – it all depends on what is in the system and how much of a contract he wants – everyone else though I agree could easily be jettisoned (even as much as I like panik and belt).
Only reason I didn’t say MadBum is because he would most likely bring back the best return at the deadline. Proven postseason horse, minimal contract, etc. If, and this is a BIG if, MadBum likes SF he can come back during the offseason in free agency.
This is ridiculous. The Giants need to focus on outfield and pitching, yet they’re wasting all this energy (and potentially money) on third base—despite the fact that they’ve been high on Christian Arroyo since drafting him in 2013.
But now they’re apparently panicking because Arroyo didn’t set the world on fire in his first major league stint. He was 21 years old when they called him up (turned 22 while with the big club). If he’s not ready, okay, give him a little more seasoning. But he’s at an age when rapid improvement often happens, particularly once a player gets his first dose of the big leagues and thus has the opportunity to make adjustments.
It’s hard to imagine Maikel Franco, who is three years older than Arroyo and still scuffling, would be a better option, or that Longoria, who has had one strong season in the past four, would be worth the money while derailing Arroyo’s progress. If they’re that concerned about Arroyo at this time, then lean on Panda in the interim until they think Arroyo is ready. Or sign someone like Trevor Plouffe or Yunel Escobar on the cheap, to keep the seat warm.
totally agree that they should just ride the cheap panda contract and use it to give arroyo a chance, there are enough vets in the lineup to bring along young guys right now and the focus ought to be on getting the farm that you can on the field, getting rid of the non performing large contract like pence and span and not looking to compete in 2018 but to think of 2019 and beyond. They are actually getting a good start on focusing on player development and starting to collect int’l money but it doesn’t elp if you follow that up by emptying the farm for an aging vet.
I understand your logic, I just don’t want to hear the words Panda, and starting third baseman. At all.
The jury is still out on Arroyo. He saw far too little time at the MLB level for anyone to know if he ‘s a viable contributor or not. Maybe some neophyte Giant’s fans are panicking over Arroyo’s less than auspicious start, but rest assured the Giants are not.
Span is the best bet. Even money for one year then Rays are freed up on the payroll.
Would be a win for Span. He lives there and just had a baby.
Rays should NOT have to take on any bad contract. Longoria has had 3+ WAR each of the past four years.
It’s not about what Longoria brings, it’s about getting out from under the $86m obligation.
nothing to see here except filler for readers. Rays aren’t eating money w/o a big return.
Nooo! Stay away from Longo. Don’t give prospects for a guy trending in the wrong direction. Try to get Duffy back on the cheap and see if we can’t get him healthy.
Rays aren’t trading Duffy, or anyone one else that’s cheap and controllable for the next few years, and certainly not cheaply, They’re open to trading away financial obligations only
THe Cardinals need to quit trying to get Manny and go after Longo and Colome for a better return than the giants can offer. As a cardinals fan longo and posey and Crawford that could be a scary lineup to face not to mention belt a good hitter also.
All this talk about The Giants having a bad system and crap players and The Rays having a talented system and never spending the money to go for it… Leads me to one conclusion: Here come The Phillies lol watch out everyone..Dodgers and Giants and Cubs for that matter will be losing some big games while the Phils win a few championships in the coming years 🙂
they will if they can get some pitching, they need to add at least 2 starters this offseason
The Giants will be like the Phillies the past 7-8 years. Hang on to your veterans too long, instead of selling high and rebuilding. Why tease the fan base into thinking they are competitive?
Tear it down and load up on prospects. Imagine the return they could get for a guy like Crawford or MadBum…they could rebuild their whole minor league system in two trades.
Tha fuccccck? They could not get a huge return on crawford. I say that as a fan of his and the team. Clearly you have a strenuous grasp on baseball if you say trading Crawford can rebuild a farm and Giants are going to struggle like Philly for more than a half decade. Do you have any idea how much money this team generates? Have you ever drivin down 3rd and checked all of the developments? Clearly not. The Anchor Steam paradise they are building. The Warriors new arena is right there as well, but that’s besides the point. I’m talking about the properties they own. They are making money hand over fist. That doesn’t even include the private fully paid off stadium and merch. They were just about to take on a 295 million dollar contract. What part of any of this says slow bebuild? I don’t know.
Crawford’s contact has a full no-trade clause. He’s a San Jose kid, famously photographed at the ‘Stick in 1992 holding the “Don’t move to Tampa!” sign. He’s going nowhere, and that’s fine.
Bumgarner would clearly net the biggest return. The only other players who might get something useful back in trade are Belt and Samardzija, and it seems less likely they’ll move the latter after just trading Matt Moore. Panik is still young and cheap, doesn’t make sense to trade him IMO.
How much revenue a team generates doesn’t effect how much they can spend without being penalized. This isn’t like “Financial Fair Play” in UEFA that lets clubs like Manchester United who generate huge amounts of revenue from sponsorships, etc. sign more players. All the real estate revenues the Giants will earn could help pay for the luxury tax penalties, but that’s about it. They still have to develop and spend smarter than they have over the past few years.
Dude? That’s about it? That’s what it’s all about. That’s why their real estate ventures mean sooo much. By the way, Giants did just get Longoria. But gonna be like the phiLOLlies hu?
The Braves don’t need Longoria and want his contract. We have a prospect named Austin Riley coming up that they don’t want to block. He could come up to the club in 2018 sometime. The Braves will have a ton of money coming off the books after 2018 and are expecting to be buyers in the Free Agent market as it should be loaded with a lot of talent.
Yankees should trade for him. Good veteran leader and won’t have to pay machado and save money to pay upcoming players big pay day.
Pence has a no trade clause and has said he has no interest in waiving it. This could be his last season from the way he talks if he can’t resign with the Giants. It’s SF or nowhere based on what he and his wife have said.
It’s because he can play like crap and the fans still love him. That doesn’t happen in most other cities.
He helped us win 2 WS. And His speech in 2012 which rallied the roster and city is stuff Legends are made of. People outside of SF don’t need to understand. We do. That being said, I won’t boo him, but he should be in a backup role and off all the BS social media. And keep his wife his own private business. Us real fans don’t give a F about where you guys go. How about tryin to refocus on baseball and tryin to stay healthy. On the flip side he played hard AF for many years and his body may jus be breaking down a bit…
I mean that’s not nice words on a fan favorite. Will you offer words when he’s traded or dfa’d.
The Dodgers and several other teams were better than the Giants even in the Giants WS years. A little luck or a lotta luck goes a long way in the playoffs. Over a long season the better team usually has more wins and More All-stars etc. in the playoffs anyone can win.
Season = skill
Playoffs = luck
The best team doesn’t always win the WS. In fact it rarely does. Only the past couple seasons has the best team won the WS over the past decade or more. Cubs and Astros earned their titles and were well deserved. The Giants were underdogs in each playoff series in each of their 3 WS runs. Even after winning the WS in 2010 and 2012, they were underdogs in 2014. They got by with a great manager (who would have led the Phillies and Dodgers to 105 wins and WS titles instead of barely making the playoffs and or backing into playoffs on last day of season). The Giants were maybe a top 8 team (playoffs have 10 teams) but won with a ton of lucky hits by guys nobody else wanted. Yes they have 3 titles but it will be at least 10 years before they come close to another.
Oh and to stay on topic….I can see the Ray’s laughing at this….oh u want our best player and the face of our organization and u want to dump Pence or Span on us and give us your top prospect ego would rank outside of the top 8 in the Dodgers organization. Yeah okay. Lmao.
Who not ego*
Longo… always injured!