The White Sox went hard after Manny Machado last year and came up empty. But they’re back after the market with an even stronger mandate to improve this time around. Club president Kenny Williams said as much in brief comments to reporters, including Daryl Van Schouwen of the Chicago Sun-Times (Twitter link). What started as a cliche resulted in a promise of something greater from Williams. “We’re here to do business as usual,” he said before catching himself. “Well, not usual. More than usual.”
So what’s on tap for the South Siders? Pitching, among other things. GM Rick Hahn says he’s looking for two new rotation pieces this winter, as Van Schouwen tweets. Carlos Rodon underwent Tommy John surgery earlier this year, while uber-prospect Michael Kopech will be returning from his own Tommy John procedure (performed late in the 2018 season). The White Sox have Lucas Giolito, Dylan Cease and Reynaldo Lopez as rotation options in addition to the returning Kopech, Carson Fulmer and Dylan Covey. Hahn was unsurprisingly not worried about the potential to eventually have more arms than rotation spots.
Here’s more on the South Siders…
- Despite Williams’ vow to be more active, Hahn made clear that the Sox aren’t aiming for the dubious honor of “winning the offseason” (subscription link via James Fegan of The Athletic). “You know, we’ve taken home the offseason champion belt a few times,” said Hahn. “…In reality, none of that matters come September if we’re not in the thick of things.” Hahn addressed last winter’s failed pursuit of Manny Machado as well, noting that while the organization would rather have “converted” in its courtship of Machado, the public nature of the pursuit was also in some ways a “response to the general narrative that we weren’t legitimate players for such talent.”
- Hahn isn’t the only one who views the White Sox as a viable landing spot for premium free agents. Scott Boras told reporters at the GM Meetings today that he agreed with Hahn’s assessment of the team’s situation (link via Van Schouwen). “They have a lot of great young talent,” said Boras. “It’s a great city. Certainly players look at the White Sox in a very different way than they did two years ago, no question.”
- The ChiSox have a lengthy offseason wish list, of course, and they’re not likely to do all of their shopping on the free-agent market alone. Trades will surely be a part of the winter calculus, though Hahn downplayed the possibility of adding any pieces who would be a one-year rental before reaching free agency next winter (Twitter link via Fegan). Hahn was “resistant” to parting with notable young assets for such pieces. While the likes of Mookie Betts, Robbie Ray, Ken Giles and perhaps old friend Jose Quintana could all conceivably see their names kicked around the rumor mill this winter, it doesn’t sound as though the White Sox are a particularly likely landing spot for that type of veteran.
i’ve been thinking Jake Odorizzi for the White Sox would be a great fit
I too want Sox to sign two pitchers. Maybe one ace and one other like Odorizzi or Pineda. need to get the Staff some depth. I hope this isn’t just talk.
How about Ben Zobrist as a veteran presence?
James Shields and?
My laugh
of the
day!
Basketcase Ben is too busy being undecided. He is a Cub type player. Run to Joe, BIg Baby Ben, run to Joe
This makes sense. Joe Maddon can utilize Ben Zobrist in RF until uber prospect Jo Adell is deemed ready for prime time. Zobrist is also a better defensive 2B than Tommy La Stella who could see more time at 3B. Zobrist’s versatility would also allow him to cover for other Angel players who will likely hit the IL at some point including LF Justin Upton.
Another bonus Zobrist could provide would be his ability to be the ideal #2 hitter in the Angels lineup which could then see Mike Trout hitting third where he belongs. Of course, the ‘genius’ manager also had that opportunity with the Cubs but instead decided that Kris Bryant was better suited for that role.
Signing either Pineda or Odorizzi for pitching depth makes sense plus could hurt rival Twins Pitching issues !!
Cobb, you crack me up. You do know Rieinsdorf has never paid a player more than a $69M contract, right. So now you think he’s gonna sign a couple top pitchers.
They’ll still need to resign Abreu, a catcher or two, a DH and an OF and a 2B. Oh yeah, about 4 relief pitchers.
If you consider Odorizzi or Pineda a top pitcher then yes, I believe Sox will put the money up. I got them down for Bumgarner and a lower cost less years pitcher like Pineda. Cease is going to the bullpen and maybe Kopech and or Rodon get some work from the pen. The time is now, the pitchers are out there. Just have to out bid the other interested teams. I like the idea of Treinen also, a-a-ron11
Cease isn’t going to the bullpen unless they sign 3+ top end starting pitchers.
Cease will air it out in the bullpen before too long. I don’t dislike Cease. I just think he will do better there and we need him there. This is if Sox sign two SP like I think and hope they will
It might happen eventually with Cease, but we are nowhere near that point.
tycobb, I agree. Cease might be an elite starter if he figures out his command issues. However, he throws a 100 mph fastball. Which mean he could close right away for any team in the league.
You could be right about the timing Priggs89. Rodon Kopech coming back from injuries. My thinking has the Sox doing a possible time share between Rodon Kopech and Cease in and out of the bullpen and rotation. And Sox let the dust settle as it will. That’s if Sox sign Bumgarner and Pineda. Any way it plays out, good times are around the corner.
What the hell are you talking about? You think Cease is going to be in the bullpen? Hahaha.
Yeah let’s take one of the top pitching prospects in baseball and because he had a high ERA in his first go around in the majors and shove him in the bullpen.
Also Rodon won’t be back until mid season or later. The one pitcher who could move to the bullpen in Lopez. I expect for a majority of the season you’ll see Giolito, Cease, Kopech with two other guys they sign of someone and Lopez. Plus Dane Dunning will return and start in the minors as he returns from TJS. But Hahn said he was very close before his injury. But Cease will definitely be in the pen.
Cease definitely won’t be in the pen.
Dogbone: If any team needs to find “an OF and a 2B. Oh yeah, about 4 relief pitchers” that might be the Cubbies.
Both Chicago teams will be looking for an OF this offseason. The White Sox will be in good “Gold Glove” hands at 2B with Nick Madrigal taking the baton from Yolmer Sanchez while the former adds plus hitting and SB’s into their lineup. Nico Hoerner may do likewise on the northside of town.
We both know that the White Sox bullpen is superior to the Cubs as we post not that Rick Hahn wouldn’t mind adding another arm or two to the mix. As for the Cubs, It’s pretty much Craig Kimbrel and Tyler Chatwood with most everyone else from their 2019 pen hitting free agency this offseason.
Dogbone you crack me up. Sox don’t need two catchers, they could use grandal otherwise opt to try and see a full season of zack Collins backing up James McCann. Outfield they need to address right field specifically. Nick madrigal will be at second so Leary Garcia or Carlos Sanchez can hold that down until he arrives. Two starters seems like a good idea, and bullpen wise the white Sox may only need a couple not 4. As far as your cubbies they need about 8 bullpen arms, 2 new outfielders to replace almora and schwarber. Need to find a catcher since Wilson Contreras is as good as gone. Will need a second basemen with zobrist out the door and bote isn’t the answer. Oh yeah will also need 3 starting pitchers. Should be easy enough to do for the cubs with the payroll already at $160MM
wsox05- please calm down. you will see the Sox will baby the pitchers coming back from injury, as they should and this will include periods of time where they all, at one time or another, pitch out of the bullpen. Cease will be a rotation piece and also pitch out of the bullpen during the season. And Cease will end up in the bullpen as the closer. He will get a crack at closing because in my opinion that is where he belongs. I could be wrong. But that is what I would do. All this is based on signing an ace type and another pitcher. If Sox sit on their hands, Cease will start all year long I suppose.
wsox05- please calm down. you will see the Sox will baby the pitchers coming back from injury, as they should and this will include periods of time where they all, at one time or another, pitch out of the bullpen. Cease will also pitch out of the bullpen during the season. And Cease will end up in the bullpen as the closer. He will get a crack at closing because in my opinion that is where he belongs. This is based on Sox signing an ace and another SP. If the Sox sit on the hands Cease will start all season long i suppose. I could be wrong but that’s what I would do.
unlikely. They hate the fans and will pursue guys like Nova
Well I’m glad you’re not in charge of things because that is the dumbest thing ever. Name me another team that does this good young pitchers? Also why haven’t they done this with Giolito or Lopez? Cease has no business pitching out of the bullpen at this point, nor will he at all this season. I’d bet you anything.
(the very public nature of the pursuit was also in some ways a “response to the general narrative that we weren’t legitimate players for such talent.” The “eye-level has changed” for the White Sox, per Hahn, who considers his team a legitimate destination for high-end free agents.)
Excellent segment. A well written piece.
It’s what they do…..
its nothing but lies. he and Darth Snake wont try to spend
What does everyone think the Cubs would want back in a trade for Quintana?
Mookie Betts.
(Just kidding. :))
Much More than he’s worth.
Quintana is overrated and not putting the White Sox over the edge
Raising the floor of the roster can be just as good as raising the ceiling. Q does that.
2 starters makes no sense unless they’re one year deals. Sox need a right fielder, 1 starter and a couple relievers.
You got names?
They need to focus on a guy that’s good and had an off year. Like Blake Trienen
I don’t think you can say that unless you know who the 2 starers are… What if they added Cole/Strasburg and Keuchel? Wheeler and MadBum? Those would make sense (on the field, not financially).
They cannot rely on Kopech bouncing back from TJS next year. Anything they get from him next year will be icing on the cake. Nobody should have high expectations for him until the 2021 season, assuming he can stay healthy.
But yes, they do need help in RF and the bullpen. I also wouldn’t be opposed to moving Robert to RF if a really good CF became available in a trade. Or just try to pry Haniger away from Seattle. Unfortunately he’s another righty, but he rakes against everybody if healthy.
I’d love to see them get haniger. I also saw a comment somewhere that suggested going after starling marte, who I think would also be an excellent trade option.
In terms of the starters, I agree we need two, but can’t see any of cole, stras, or madbum landing on the south side. Im really bummed odorizzi accepted the QO. And with him off the market, I think the price on wheeler will get too rich for my taste. That leaves, off the top of my head, Ryu, Kuechel, Hammels, and Alex Wood.
Signing Kuechel and Wood (to be a swing man) won’t move the needle from a PR standpoint, but it’s realistic and still a massive improvement over last season’s back of the rotation. Add a couple of veteran bats (Kendrick and Grandal would be nice) plus a high-leverage arm in the pen (betances?), and the team should be playing meaningful baseball in September. Who knows, maybe even October with a little luck and continued improvement from the young guys.
Can’t count on Kopech. Cease might take a few years to get going (wouldn’t be the first time). Lopez still hasn’t proven he wouldn’t be better in the bullpen.
You have one guy (Giolito) you can count on to be an above average starter and he’s never cracked 180 IP. So yes, at LEAST two starters.
“You know, we’ve taken home the offseason champion belt a few times,” said Hahn”
Go ahead and refresh my memory.
2014-15 offseason. Added Samardzija, Melky, Robertson, LaRoche, Duke, Jennings.
They were praised by many for those additions, and it turned out miserably (in many, many ways).
Who ‘praised them’? Was it you, Aaron Spolnik and the Merkins?
ESPN, Bleacher Report, other GM’s, etc.
I seem to recall getting monumental returns for Sale and Eaton that one year. Then there was the Quintana for Cease and Eloy, that’s right. And wasn’t there that little thing with the Yankees? Oh yeah, that was a blockbuster too.
Please, MLBTR, stop putting Covey in the starting rotation. If he starts a single game in 2020 for the Sox, they’re doomed.
Covey and Fulmer in the rotation? Better off bringing tough luck xFIP 4.30 Chris Volstad back as a starter.
Strasburg, Wheeler, and Puig. Let Kopech close when he returns.
Now that’s a splash for an off-season
You mean, let Cease close when Kopech returns.
Stop with the Cease to the bullpen stuff. It’s so dumb.
I guess this is new to you, but scouting reports had him pegged as an eventual elite closer from the get go. He had two pitches in college. The Sox told him to learn two more pitches if he wanted to start.
Oh so he was pegged to be a reliever when he was drafted so the Sox should move him there. They should disregard the fact that he developed into a legit top 20 prospect in baseball as a starter. Hmmm. I remember everyone saying the same thing about Chris Sale. Man why didn’t the Sox just put him in the pen for his entire White Sox career.
Come on man, be smarter. He showed over his final four starts that he was turning a corner, yeah the walks were a concern, but he can clean that up with some offseason work it will help him knowing he’s coming into the season as a part of the big league rotation.
I guess Kopech should go to the pen as well huh?
No need to get so emotional. I’d be happy they have Cease either way. He’s an amazing talent. But if he continues to struggle with his control next season, the Sox should at least consider moving him to a relief role for awhile. I’m rooting for him do be a starter, but club needs come first.
Where did Cease go to college? I thought he was drafted out of high school.
My bad, he did not attend college, but everything else I said applies. Here’s a decent scouting report: calltothepen.com/2018/11/15/chicago-white-sox-scou…
Vs minor leaguers. September stats are a farce
You come to the White Sox, you play hard and work hard. This ain’t no place for dudes making $100,000/hr sitting in a hot tub upset because their rubber-ducky has gone missing. Sorry.
What am I missing? $3MM for 30 HR’s? Sounds too good to be true. For that amount of money, find the guy’s darn rubber ducky!!!
Nice.
In that case, HR as opposed to hr, we might be able to work something out. Looking at Eloy and Moncada.
Huh?
I MEANT PER HOUR!! I CAN’T CHANGE IT NOW to adjust for people being annoying.
hahaha
Sign Abreu 2/28, sign Wheeler 5/100, trade for JD Martinez ( I know about the opt outs, but Vaughn should be ready by then in that scenario). Trade For Kyle Tucker, stros can pick any two from a pool of ( R. López, Collins, Rutherford, Basabe, Steiver, Adolfo, Dunning, Gonzalez, Sheets. Sign Betances, Jason Castro and Hamels 2/18 each.
What do the RSox get for JDM?
Cap space. Anything more is too much while Castellanos is still available.
Which brings me to my next point – just sign Castellanos.
Sign puig for rf, sign castellanos for dh, sign abreu to man 1st, sign wheeler and keuchel. Sox have more than enough money to add all and not be remotely close to the luxury tax.
Couple of mid level prospects, for a aging dh type of player
Astros aren’t trading Tucker.
While the Sox were slammed for not making a better offer to bring in Machado – especially in an article by Tim Dierkes on this site – everything worked out fine.
Yoán Moncada was uncomfortable at 2B in 2018 and was pretty much a butcher there, hurting the teams defense. He did much better at 3B, and was settled enough to hit .367 / .548 / .915 / 141 with a 4.6 WAR.
Meanwhile, Yolmer Sanchez moved over to 2B (a middle infield position far more important then 3B) and won the 2019 Gold Glove. The Sox defense since even before Ozzie left has cost them countless games, and made the team unwatchable at times.
Going forward, defense will be a major consideration as Tim Anderson – while breaking out as a hitter in 2019 – was continuing to boot balls and being out of position on plays as he seems to lose track of game situations between pitches. Add to that Jimenez in LF and Abreu at 1B (assuming he comes back) are arguably the worst defenders at their positions in all of MLB (and they appear to want to sign Nicholas Castellanos to play RF…..arguably the worst defensive RF in MLB in 2019).
Saving the money from the overrated, mercurial Machado, they have cash to go after pitching which is an obvious weakness that must be addressed if they are to become serious contenders in the next few years.
It appears Sox GM Rick Hahn did the right thing by attempting to get Machado at a reasonable cost, and pulled out when the price became so high that it would limit what they could do for 2020 and beyond. Dodged a bullet there.
Are you saying Tim Anderson is….. Starlin Castro?
Vandals, I think we need some chops in RF. We had it last year defensively with Ryan Cordell, a plus defender compared to Avisail, but Cordell can’t hit yet.
I’m all in for Yasiel. I still hold an ever-loosening hypothesis that we could trade for a better-fit pitcher than what’s realistically available in FA. Maybe a shorter term, but no way put all the work done to get us this far in jeopardy of one or two $190MM payroll years in the future. That’s for win now teams to mull over, or just fools gold.
Hahn didn’t pull out from machado, cheap skate JR deferred a lot of dough then he had Kenny williams their president propagandize us fans that it was the best offer! SPEND IT JERRY
My prediction is Abreu re-sign for 3/45 (which is fine because he will play 1B this season then move to DH once Vaughn comes up in 2021), they will be in the convo for Cole but he will sign elsewhere so they will come away with Wheeler (5/85) and a short term vet starter like Hill or Nova to fill in until Kopech or Rodon returns. To fill the OF hole, I feel like they are going to head to the trade market and pull off a surprise deal for Gregory Polanco, giving up Rutherford, Dahlquist and Bush in return.
Polonco is hurt, bum shoulder
He’s also only 28, and the injured shoulder he had last season is why the Sox could probably grab him for 3 mid level prospects. Would be worth a gamble instead of giving Castellanos a 5 year deal.