The Dodgers have been linked to several superstar players in both free agency and potential trades this winter, though with so many of the big free agents already signed elsewhere, the trade market might be Los Angeles’ best avenue to land a major roster upgrade. To this end, the Dodgers have continued to explore the possibility of acquiring Mookie Betts from the Red Sox, according to MLB.com’s Jon Paul Morosi.
The deal could potentially be expanded to involve multiple players heading from Boston to Chavez Ravine, as Morosi suggests that David Price might be a fit as the veteran arm the Dodgers are looking to add to their rotation. With the Red Sox looking to cut payroll and ideally get under the luxury tax threshold, rumors have swirled all winter about Price, Betts, and other high-priced Boston names being floated as trade chips. Betts is projected for a hefty $27.7MM salary in his final year of arbitration, though that’s certainly a reasonable price to pay (especially for a big-market team like the Dodgers) for one of the sport’s very best players.
As game-changing as the idea of a Betts trade may be, the Sox aren’t actively trying to deal him, since the club would naturally prefer to explore other cost-saving options before parting ways with the 2018 AL MVP. Moving Price and the $96MM owed to the southpaw through 2022 would be one of those preferred options. While the Sox have drummed up some trade interest in Price, however, it still seems unlikely that a suitor would take on most of that contract given Price’s age (34) and recent injury concerns.
Moving Betts along with Price would definitely make a trade suitors more willing to absorb perhaps even all of Price’s contract, though obviously the Red Sox aren’t willing to move Betts just for the sake of a salary dump. Indeed, Sox chief baseball officer Chaim Bloom recently downplayed the idea of giving away any sort of younger talent along with Price, saying “so much of what we’re always going to be trying to accomplish, but certainly now, is to make sure we have as strong a farm system as possible.”
Morosi opines that the Red Sox would want one of the Dodgers’ top young pitchers (i.e. Dustin May or Tony Gonsolin) as part of a trade, though “Boston appears less insistent on” including infielder Gavin Lux as part of a trade package. It could be for this reason that L.A. is perhaps currently more focused on Betts than on Indians shortstop Francisco Lindor, another All-Star who has been heavily rumored to be on the Dodgers’ list of targets. The Lindor talks appear to be in something of a stalemate — Cleveland has continued to demand Lux in any deal for Lindor, while the Dodgers think so highly of Lux’s potential that they “have refused to include him in any offer for Lindor alone.” The Dodgers are also known to be pursuing Cleveland righty Mike Clevinger, so it’s safe to assume that some multi-player offers have been floated in the Tribe’s direction.
I’ve been interested in a trade for Joc P. and a prospect for Mookie. Not sure how realistic that is.
It’s hard to tell if you’re serious but if you are the answer is no, even if that prospect is Lux.
I think the Red Sox would jump all over Lux and Joc for Betts, as they should.
So do I. People seem to forget that Betts is a one year rental. What possible reason would the Dodgers have for trading Lux for a mercenary, albeit a great one.
To win the World Series
The Dodgers don’t need another bat. Pitching wins Championships. They really don’t need Betts. Why give up Lux &Joc. Doesn’t make sense. If you’re going to trade the two, better get a rotation piece. Kershaw isn’t going to get them over the hump. He’s already proven that
Price WOULD help LA
I agree. Their biggest area for improvement is in the BP. They have position player depth excess that should be utilized to get a RP or a SP and utilize May as a shut down reliever this year.
Hey Randy—if Price WOULD help the Dodgers then why WOULDNT he help your lowly Red Sox?
Here are the answers:
-the Dodgers need a pitcher who is willing and able to face the strong teams.
-Price avoids strong teams with convenient ailments. Just look at last season against the Yankees and see how many series Cora skipped him over. This wasn’t the first season either.
-The reason is simple: PRICE no longer posses the stuff to sustain himself in a game against a good hitting team without blowing out his elbow.
BOTTOM line: Price has too many hi stress innings on his arm and shoulder. He is damaged goods.
BONUS: what team wants a guy in their rotation that ducks the big series.
So Randy-enjoy watching him—against the Yankees it will be PRICELESS.
You’re a tool fits
I second this!
Betts, and Price for Lux and May…and the RS pay $7Myr/$21 total towards Price’s contract
Dodgers response…Bye Felicia!
TedYaz…counteroffer: Joc, Gonsolin, and a 2B/SS prospect in our 11-20 range (Estevez or Mann) for Betts, Price, and $10M/yr. That’s a lot of money the Dodgers are relieving the Sox of, and might as well get something for Betts instead of nothing.
Joc, Gonsolin, and a 2B/SS prospect in our 11-20 range (Estevez or Mann) for Betts, Price, and $10M/yr.
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Make it Downs instead of Estevez/Mann, and i would do that.
I don’t disagree with your comments on Price vs the Yankees at all. He SUCKS vs them but I think he can still be an effective REGULAR SEASON NL #4 SP. Then you move him to the BP in the post season where his velocity picks up and he has been effective. Price is DONE in Boston –question is where and to who can we dump him to. But the Dodgers are not { at least till he hits FA} getting Mookie with the type of trades Dodgers fans are promoting on here so go back to Cleveland and offer them Joc Peterson for Lindor.
Yes to finally win a World Series
Dodgers wouldn’t trade Lux straight up for Mookie let alone w Joc P. Clearly a sawx guy
I think it’s funny how many dodgers fans think Joc has any trade value, Corey Dickerson is a better player and was making less money the last few years and was traded for nothing…yet somehow a platoon bat making 8 million for 1 year before free agency is goin to net the dodgers a chris sale like return, preposterous, there are infinite joc pedersons in the majors, there is 1 mookie betts
You’re absolutely right. The reason why Joc has put up even close to the stats he put up last year was because of the depth that the Dodgers have. Not every team can plug in a decent LH bat to platoon with Pederson. The Dodgers have Hernandez, Taylor, and Pollick as capable RH OF bats. The Red Sox have Jose Peraza I guess.
*RH bat to platoon with Pederson*
This was intended for joparx. My bad
Cmon man…How many dodger fans are asking for a Chris sale like return?
Dickerson(age 30) was in the middle of a 0.8bWAR season
vs
Pederson(age 27) is coming off a 36 HR & 3.3 bWAR season in only 450 platoon AB’s.
Are you seriously saying Joc has no value as the dominant side of a platoon?
Dickerson was injured for a big chunk of the season. And in those 450 platoon AB’s most of it was against RH pitching. Pederson only had a .505 OPS vs. LH pitching. Not every team has ideal platoon bats for Pederson.
Sox need SP. not Lux. Price and Mookie for your top SP prospect and either Pederson or Seager. It is up to the Dodgers to extend Mookie. Sox are NOT giving him to you for NOTHING !!! And Price will do just fine as an NL pitcher. Just keep him away from the Yankees. BTW–Sox will eat 10 million year if you add Seager but only 7 million per for Pedreson who is a head case.
“And in those 450 platoon AB’s most of it was against RH pitching.”
That’s exactly why I called them “platoon” AB’s.
And yes…not every team has a righty to pair with him…which does narrow the list of teams that would be interested in him a bit I guess but he’s only on a 1yr deal so most teams interested in him would be teams in win now mode and most of those teams will have the depth to accommodate that.
Verdugo and a pitcher might be more of what the Sox need.
Sox have ZERO interest in the HEADCASE Joc Pederson.
May and Verdugo for Price and Mookie and the Sox kick in 7.5 per year on the Price deal.
Dodgers have the $$$ to sign Mookie to an extension.
An ability to pay someone has no effect on the return. At all.
Pederson not a head case.
It does if they want the player this year as compared to next.
Wait can you explain the Pederson is a headcase thing?
10 WAR for one year or nothing from Lux in 2020? Guess it depends if the Dodgers want to be also rans every year and not win a WS.
It’s funny how Baseball Trade Values calculates Pederson’s contract at a surplus value at $12M. Funny, because it’s true?
Betts surplus value was $33 million last season. If he repeats last season it will be double his salary in 2020. If he plays as well as he did in 2018 then it will be $55-56 million in surplus value. That is how good Betts is.
I’ve seen those insane numbers for his surplus value and am not convinced that anybody is worth more than twice as much as anyone has ever been paid to play the game.
Lol. Cmon guy. Seriously?
Are you really talking loud when your team is trying to sell an in his prime Betts?
The guy who won an mvp and a World Series in Boston?
Are you sure you wanna call another team “also rans” in this exact moment?
Think about that one. Really think about it.
How does this happen in a market like Boston?
Why are your fans ok with this?
This isn’t Kansas City we’re talking about. Or Tampa bay. It’s Boston.
But don’t trip. Someone will give you a Lux if the dodgers don’t…right? Especially if the dodgers…and their fans are foolish for not doing so?
I guess we’ll have to wait see but I wouldn’t hold your breath if I was you…
So you believe Pederson’s surplus value but not Betts’?
How many WS winners were based on having the most “surplus value”? Intangibles can’t be measured and what about the opposite, diminishing returns? I’ve been saying if for a while, championships are won on the field, not in a computer.
Wasn’t the Dodger’s RF better in every offensive category than Betts was last year? Oh sorry, Betts had 1 more SB. Other than that, he was blown out of the water. GG? Bellinger won one last year. He has a better arm than Betts too. Yet somehow they will never win a World Series without Betts? Please. They have a better Betts already.
I didn’t think so either but i looked him up. He had an OPS over 900 last year.
I have seen some of his hot dog antics and I’m not impressed
You don’t get how good Betts really is….and he has a cannon arm fool.
I think the Red Sox would still have to eat more of Price’s salary than that, like 11-12mm per year.
Head case? LOL! That’s reaching a little, well actually a LOT
Because the Dodgers philosophy is built around depth and longer-term.. Betts will command way too much money for the Dodgers to sign him. So, they essentially know (99.9% chance) he’s a one-year rental. They believe that Lux is a done deal all-star. Would you give him up for a one-year run at the WS? I’m not sure if Betts alone gets the Dodgers a WS but obviously much closer. They need a SP to take the #2 slot, whether that is internal or external. Friedman is a longer-term guy not a short-term guy. Dodger fans as you would expect only care about now.
Fair enough so I guess there is no deal to be had since LA fans seem to think it should be centered on Joc Pederson.
@dodger2015
Pretty spot on comment.
The only part I might disagree with is that I think the dodgers would try to resign him. I think they’ll go outside the model or philosophy for a Betts type of talent that’s in his prime. They offered Cole 8 for 300 if the rumors are to be believed. I think they’d make a competitive offer for Mookie but…I could certainly be wrong.
How does this happen in a market like Boston?
Why are your fans ok with this?
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As a RS fan, I think this is a no-brainer.
1-We need to get under the payroll cap. At this point, it is starting to affect our draft position and international spending.
2-Our farm is pretty weak. The NYY can spend just as much and more than us. If our farm is not at least as good as theirs, and it isn’t, how are we going to keep up?
3-Even with Betts, what are the chances of us beating out the NYY? I still think we’re good, but they beat us by 19(?) games last year, and just added Cole. If we’re going to finish 2nd, and (maybe not), I’d prefer to get something more for Betts than a 4th round pick.
IMO, this is the opportunity of the decade to remake our team.
@JoeB
I can certainly appreciate this position and I actually agree with it.
I think my main point was that any large market team looking to move a Betts isn’t necessarily in a position of strength like kolamalu keeps claiming.
Yes they will get value. Of course. They just don’t have the luxury of being extremely picky about the type of value when the list of teams in a position to bid on Betts is so small. That’s not to say teams won’t want him. It’s to say the cost will be real and most teams won’t have the ability or the desire to pay that price for a 1 yr rental.
Any team in on Betts has to be a serious contender for the title. They have to have payroll flexibility. They have to have enough prospect or mlb value(a haul!) to offer in trade. And they have to be willing and able to trade that value for a 1 yr rental.
How many teams would qualify for that list? 3? 5? Not many.
So in summary I do agree that this is a great opportunity. I just don’t think the Red Sox will be able to ask for as much as kolamalu claims because there won’t be any teams willing to give a package filled with the Lux, May and the Verdugo’s of the world to get him…but I do think there will be plenty of teams willing to give great value…just in a different form.
Yes they will get value. Of course. They just don’t have the luxury of being extremely picky about the type of value when the list of teams in a position to bid on Betts is so small. That’s not to say teams won’t want him. It’s to say the cost will be real and most teams won’t have the ability or the desire to pay that price for a 1 yr rental.
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What the RS can do is to pay down some of Betts’ salary. They might not do it directly, because the commissioner would think it absurd, But suppose SD throws in Myers? Now Betts is only costing SD ~ $6M, and they just got rid of $46M in future obligations. How much is that worth to SD in terms of prospects?
For the RS, even if SD did not chip in a dime, Myers AAV is $13.8M. That might be a savings of $14M. If we were to get Margot as part of the return, we can trade JBJ for another savings of ~ $7M.
We’re busting the bubble, but it is too late to stop it.
Red Sox have zero interest in Will Myers. Either Chavis or Dalbec will play 1B for minimum wage
@joeB
That’s a great point.
I do think allowing a team to dump a bad contract would help them overcome the issue of moving all that prospect value for a 1 yr rental but not necessarily if they had to actually pay for dumping the contract(with prospect value) on top of paying for Betts with prospect value.
Meaning…if the Red Sox said give us the correct value for Betts(whatever that is) AND we’ll also take Myers bad contract off your hands…then I think a lot more teams would be in on Betts
But if the Red Sox are expecting a team to pay for Betts and then pay more for dumping the contract…then I’m not so sure it would help all that much.
There may be some other bad contracts the Sox could take to offset Mookie’s salary but NOT Myers. We have NO use for him and he’s not even that good. Maybe find a pitcher with a bad contract and that would make more sense.
Only way the Red Sox take Myers is if the Padres take David Price
Padres can have Price for free. Sox DO NOT want Myers.
@jim
I can appreciate that.
But If true…that will severely limit the number of teams that will be in on Betts at his cost.
Nothing to do with a teams desire to add Betts. Obviously 29 teams would love to have him but very few can afford to pay a huge price in prospects for only 1 yr of him.
I really don’t expect Mookie to get traded anyway. RSN will go ape if he is moved for less than at least one top prospect. Sox will focus on trying to dump Price and JBJ instead
I agree with you. Betts will never get the return all us fans expect, because he’s a 1 year rental. So Red Sox management will not trade him and I think we’re right to keep him for the upcoming season. Salary savings should come from elsewhere, i.e. Price, LBJ, Eovaldi.
We can take anyone we want, for the right price. A lot of people don’t realize that, in the three seasons before last year, Myers averaged a 2.6 WAR. Folks look at his terrible contract, and forget that he is still a player.
In any case, it is all about the return value. Hosmer’s contract is worse than Myers, but if Gore++ was coming back, I’d be okay with picking up Hosmer.
@JoeBrady Myers is completely useless. He wouldn’t even get a major league contract if he were a free agent this offseason.
@itsgood2betheking The Red Sox certainly don’t have to take Myers to get the Padres to take Betts. Unless they are also shedding Price that would be pointless for Boston. And even then the Padres would still have to include some serious prospect capital to make that happen.
@itsgood2betheking The Red Sox don’t have to take back any bad contracts to get someone to take Betts. And certainly not an overpaid 4-A clubhouse cancer like Wil Myers.
@Randy Red Sox RSN will go equally ape, if not even more, when Betts leaves as a FA next offseason and the Red Sox get nothing but an extra fourth rounder.
Verdugo +Gonsolin is close enough. Or Gray instead of Gonsolin.
@jim
Agreed on your Myers point but
I think you missed my point from a big picture perspective.
I think the market for Betts is extremely limited and it has nothing to do with people wanting or not wanting Betts. It has everything to do with the cost in prospects and the lack of control that comes with him.
You won’t see me saying Betts isn’t valuable. The guy is an absolute beast.
That’s not the problem. The problem is the cost and a teams ability to pay it without crippling themselves if Betts doesn’t resign.
Plenty of teams have the prospects but how many of them can sell them for 1 yrs worth of value without also crippling themselves if Betts walks?
Realistically…3-5 teams?
Once again…I’m not saying that the Red Sox won’t get value. I’m just saying the limited market might dictate that they compromise on the type of value.
@JoeB
Verdugo is a very good ask but I just don’t see the dodgers moving him for only 1 yr of Betts.
Verdugo put up a 3.1 bWAR in only 343 non platoon AB’s in his age 23 season. He’s that good & he still has 5 years of cheap control left.
Call me crazy but I think the dodgers will prefer 5 yrs of Verdugo in CF or RF next to Bellinger over 1 yr of Betts next to Bellinger.
Or more precisely…I think the dodgers will prefer to pay that value in other ways so they can have both Verdugo and Betts next to Bellinger next yr.
But…I certainly could be wrong.
Sure just give the Sox Pederson and be done with it right?? And when he walks at the end of 2020 we will get a 6th round pick.
There is not going to be a Mookie trade. He is staying in Boston and the Sox will miss the playoffs and the Dodgers will fail to win the WS again !!! But hey maybe you can out-bid the Yankees for Mookie next off season.
Mookie is really only a realistic option for a team who think they are a WS contender so honestly the only 2 teams I see in the category are the Dodgers and Braves { and Yankees of course} and both those teams do have the $$$ to sign him as a FA. However it seems the Dodgers expect to get Mookie WITHOUT giving up ANY of their top 4 prospects. Not gonna happen.
As for Myers the Sox have both Chavis and Dalbec who could likely hold down 1B at least as well as Myers for MINIMUN wage so NO interest there. I fully expect Mookie to remain in Boston and then bolt as the top FA after 2020. Sox will look to trim their payroll by dumping 2 of these 3 –JBJ, Price, or Eovaldi. Mookie stays. Dodgers can go back and knock on Cleveland’s door for Lindor. Maybe the Indians will take Joc Pederson straight up.
That compromise won’t involve taking Myers unless it also involves San Diego taking Price
For a rental? That’s silly talk. If that’s the way the FO is thinking, that’s why they haven’t done a deal.
Both J Pop and Betts are rentals, with Bettes being far better, Lux/ J Pop would be bad for LAD. Maybe Price & Betts for J Pop, Gonsolin, Maeda, & Rios or Peters. Some cash would probably meet to go to Dodgers in that deal. Cartaya as possibly the 4th, but his ceiling has been rising.
Yup, great point, Mo.
Cartaya as a throw in and Rios/Peters as interchangeable trade pieces? The Dodgers would have to be some desperate A mother fathers to do a trade like that
It helps to read carefully.
Yes, it does
No deals yet primarily because they waited for the main free agents to first sign. Price was deemed to be untradeable before the pitchers signed.
Not a chance the Sox take that deal. Dream on !!
Stop with the Maeda and Pederson talk .
Lol 6 years of Lux wouldn’t get it done for 1 year of Mookie? Gimme a break the Dodgers wouldn’t even do that, if I were Boston and serious about clearing payroll I’d offer Mookie, JBJ, and Price for Joc, Verdugo, Mays, Gonsolin and Keibert. Than jus try to steal Mookie back next offseason and go back in the tax without the repeater penalty
That’s still crazy! Way to much for 1yr rental and a injured pitcher with $100 million contract! Think a lot lower my friend then process with with some commonsense!
@Rooted
Betts, JBJ & Price
For
Joc, Verdugo, May, Gonsolin & Ruiz
You might need to give yourself a break if you think the dodgers would come close to considering that.
You’re not getting Verdugo. He put up a 3.1 war in 343 non platoon AB’s last year in his age 23 season and still has 5 yrs of control.
You’re not getting May. He forced his way onto one of the best rosters in baseball in his age 21 season and put up a 115 era+ and 2.90 FIP in 34 innings. Still has 6 yrs of control.
Joc…of course he could be included.
Gonsolin…sure he could be in a deal.
Ruiz…I think there’s no chance if price is in the deal…unless the Red Sox eat a large chunk of that contract.
Adding Price to any deal lessens the return for Betts by a significant margin and JBJ hardly moves the needle.
You want a good return for Betts then you have to move him alone.
Even then…and I’m not saying you won’t get value…but I am saying it’s not gonna be a best prospect type of return because he’s a 1yr rental.
So bright boy what do the Dodgers give the Sox for Mookie alone ??
Bright boy? Lol…Fair enough. Just trying to add some dodger perspective to this conversation. I’ll try to do better.
That said…I certainly could be wrong but I think I’m a lot closer to reality than the things I’ve been on here disagreeing with.
As for a return in a Betts trade by himself? That’s a really tough question.
Personally…I think the dodgers would be more than willing to pay a steep price for him. I just think it would have to be the value of the dodgers choosing.
Meaning…if betts is worth a dollar then the dodgers would be willing to pay 1.50 in order for it to be the right kind of value that’s given in the return.
Or in even clearer terms…they’ll over pay so they don’t have to include Lux, May or Ruiz in the deal.
If I was the Red Sox…I wouldn’t let Price anywhere near this deal because I’d want full value in my return.
Then…
I’d ask for Maeda and his 4 yrs of cheap control which would be very valuable to a team trying to reshape their roster and get under the luxury tax while still competing.
I’d ask for Joc Pederson.
I’d ask for SS/2B Jeter Downs. (yes…he’s named after that jeter)
I’d ask for SP Josiah Gray.
I’d ask for C Diego Cartaya
Now…I’m biased…but In my biased opinion that’s an over pay in total overall value but it’s not super sexy because there’s no Lux, May or Ruiz and because you’ll only see Maeda & Joc on next yrs team.
But isn’t that what happens when your a Boston and you’re thinking of moving a Betts? Can they honestly expect to get the sexy return when their in this position?
Maybe I’m wrong and maybe they do but it’s hard for me to see someone top that offer. I’d love to see one that does…
I would like to start by saying that I am a die-hard Sox fan first and foremost but that the Dodgers are my favourite NL team so if we have to give up Mookie I would like him to go to LA.. Having said that if you think you are getting Mookie with out giving up any of May, Lux, Verdogo, or Ruiz then the conversation is OVER !! Take Trout out of the mix and Mookie is still one of the 3 BEST PLAYERS in MLB.
To trade Mookie the Sox MUST build up their farm system and as a result would have ZERO interest in Joc Pederson. We have our own OF prospect in Jared Duran who should be ready by 2021 hence the no interest in Pederson. I know little about the other names you are throwing out there and I am sure they are fine players but they ARE NOT getting you Mookie. You see the Red Sox already know they are not competing in 2020 but they are happy to be ab le to watch Mookie for one last year before he bolts in FA.
Now if you really want to be honest and fair in a trade Dodgers also need to consider adding David Price into the deal. Of course the Sox will be prepared to take on a portion of his $$ owed depending on the return coming back. David Price could be a very good # 4 SP in the NL ad could replace Rhyu and in the postseason he could be moved to the BP where he has been lights out in the past. As the Sox GM I would be willing to either of these 3 deals:
1} May and Seager for Price and Betts. Sox pay 10 million of Prices’s deal for 3 years.
2} May and Ruiz for Price and Betts and Sox eat 8.5 million of Prices’s deal.
3} May and Pederson for Mookie and Price and Sox eat 3.5 million of Prices’s deal.
No May, Lux, Ruiz, or Vertigo included then don’t call us–we WON’t call you either.
itsgood2b….
I think you make some good points. Maeda is intriguing. If Red Sox took back some salary in Pollock and old friend Joe Kelly in return for Price, the trade could be expanded and make more sense for both teams, I would love to have May included and would be willing to sweeten the pot to get him. In any event, these teams seem to match up will and I think something big could happen here.
Fair enough
Pretty sure the Dodgers say…
No.
No.
And No.
And then they wish the Sox good luck.
I assume theyd then bring the brinks truck to Mookie s free agent meeting but who knows what happens between now and then…
I’m not saying a trade gets done but don’t kid yourself by basing decisions on one season. Some players end up being one year wonders and never come close to that first season’s production. This could especially be true for batting stats when 2019 was such a hitter’s season.
itsgood2b…
You drive a hard bargain, but I guess I’ll have to take it. Betts for Maeda, Pederson, Gray, Downs and Cartaya. But we’re coming hard after Betts next off-season.
Now, how am I going to get rid of Price?
@wrongway
Thanks. Pretty spot comment yourself.
If I were the Red Sox I would want everything you asked for as well.
I’d want May and I’d also want to swap contracts.
But as a dodger fan I’d say no to both if it were up to me.
Right or wrong…the dodgers view Buehler, May & Urias as the future core of the rotation and basically untouchable…and I tend to agree. So I don’t see them changing that plan for only 1 yr of Betts.
The reason I’d say no to a contract swap is because I don’t think the dodgers contracts are bad yet. They certainly underperformed in the first yr of their deals but after struggling to start the season they both figured it out and looked like the players the dodgers thought they were getting.
Kelley had an era over 8.00 thru June but he finished the season at 4.56
Pollock struggled through an elbow infection but once he came back he had a 2nd half ops+ of 130 in 205 AB’s.
Bad seasons on the whole but plenty of reason to think theyre not sunk yet.
Plus pollock(12m) and Kelley(8.33m) only cost 20.3m per vs price at 32m per so I’d much prefer to keep both and see what else I could do with the extra 12m I’d save as opposed to having price.
All of that said…I do think these teams match up well and I do think there is the potential for a big deal. Especially with the unique nature of our “GM’s” relationship. That’s actually why I’m most excited is because I’m hoping bloom is willing to get creative with the return value but who knows…
I’m pretty sure that May is just as untouchable as Lux & Ruiz. If they weren’t, a deal would have already been made.
The Dodgers do not need to make this trade, but the Red Sox do need to get under the Luxury Tax, so that makes puts the Dodgers in the drivers seat.
The Red Sox have no need to move Betts. They can get under the CBT threshold other ways. Remember, it’s not about dollars spent, it’s about CBT dollars. The Red Sox have the dollars.
@wrongway
That no, no & no comment was for randy! Not you. My bad…lol
Now about our deal…
Maeda, Pederson, Downs, Gray & Cartaya seems steep but…deal.
Pederson has became expendable with the emergence of Verdugo so as much as I like the guy he’s easy to say good bye to for a Betts.
Maeda is actually tough to give up because of his contract and because of his ability to move to the pen come playoff time but the emergence of May, Urias & Gonsolin(along with stripling) has also made him somewhat expendable.
Prospects are prospects so I’ll let them sell themselves for what they are but Downs screams all star 2nd basemen if he gets pushed to 2nd(by Seager, Lux or bogaerts) and I’d genuinely be sorry to see gray and cartaya go but obviously I’d be quite happy to see Betts in dodger blue so I think I’d be able to find a way to deal with it.
Now about price…lol
Ok what about Mookie, Price and $24mill for Pederson, Gonsolin and Ruiz?
The Dodgers are trying to win a championship. The Cubs could have said the same thing and still have Torres but no flag to display in Wrigley. The question to ask is Mookie and/or Price the difference between celebrating in October?
I think real the question to ask is…if the only way the dodgers win a WS is with Betts? And that’s a hard and easy no.
The dodgers lineup is plenty good enough. If the roster needs two things it’s a number 2 starter for the playoffs and a shutdown bullpen piece(doesn’t everyone?)
Then comes the Betts and Lindor’s of the world.
Not at all saying they’re not talented or that I don’t want them. Just saying our starting SS right now in seager is pretty dang good already and our OF is deep and talented…consisting of Bellinger, Verdugo, Pederson, Pollock, Taylor etc etc.
We don’t need to add Lindor or Betts at all. I’d love to add them and I’m willing to pay for them(as much as that matters) but this idea by Boston fans that the dodgers must pay this massive haul for 1 yr of Betts or they can’t win is pure comedy.
The market for Betts at the price being talked about(May, Verdugo, Ruiz) is non existent.
Which teams are in a position to compete and give that type of return for 1 yr of Betts?
I’d love to a list of teams and see some potential proposals if anyone’s interested…
it’s good.. you’d make a lousy GM.
@butch
Duly noted…LOL
First off we just signed our SS to a long term deal. If we trade Mookie it will be to build up our farm system OR a young cost controlled player. Maeda would get POUNDED in the AL East at least by the Yankees so NO to him. You guys are trying to dump Pederson and if Price in the deal then he can be included but believe me he’s not highly valued by the Sox. Sox would of course eat a bit of Prices’s $$$ but I think he would be a quality #4 SP in the NL and in the post season he can go the BP where he has done very well in the past. Personally I don’t care if we get Lux. I want SP so yes May would HAVE to be in the deal.
@Randy
Maeda has a career era of 3.83 over the 590 innings hes put up in the first 4 yrs of his contract.
He’s also proven he can move to bullpen come playoff time.
Maeda is 31.
Price is 34.
Maeda has 4 years of cheap control(3.125m base plus incentives…he’s avg 8m per year so far).
Price has 3 yrs at 32m per left on his deal.
Narrative can be fun…but those are the actual facts that completely contradict your narrative on Maeda & Price.
I would trade Price for Maeta. That was not the point. For Mookie we need YOUNG cost controlled talent. He is one of the 3 best players in the game and is 27 years old. Made and Pederson are NOT getting you Mookie.
I’d ask for Joc Pederson.
I’d ask for SS/2B Jeter Downs. (yes…he’s named after that jeter)
I’d ask for SP Josiah Gray.
I’d ask for C Diego Cartaya
—————————————————–
If I were Bloom, I’d do that deal. And I think that LA would be amused that they got Downs/Gray for less than nothing, and then flipped them for a future HOF player in his prime.
For real. Why do people keep trying to push Joc Pederson in a Betts trade? If the Red Sox trade Betts they have no use for Pederson, who comes with the same amount of club control as Betts.
Pederson is mostly a platoon player, but he steps into RF in Betts’ place. He’s a perfect fit.
“Pederson is mostly a platoon player, but he steps into RF in Betts’ place.”
Only for one year in which the Red Sox aren’t going to contend anyway.
“He’s a perfect fit.”
Betts is a better fit.
@joebrady
Nailed it.
There are a million variations that could potentially make sense.
I’m thinking Bloom and Friedman are more than capable of making this deal work out for both sides.
Especially when the motivations of each side seem to match up so well.
The Red Sox want to turn Betts present value into future value(and/or salary relief).
The dodgers want Betts present value and they have both the prospect capital and money to pay for it.
It’s just agreeing on the cost and that’s why I said Im encouraged by the bloom & Friedman aspect of it.
If Mookie has to leave I’m ok with him going to LA but not without getting back a young stud prospect. Mookie is one of the 3-5 BEST players in MLB and in his prime plus the Dodgers have the $$$ to sign him in FA.
Exactly and he is a HUGE downgrade. It would strictly be about the $$$
LA is getting robbed. Gray,Downs & Cartaya is a good RS trade.
It depends on who else we get. We’d obviously get more than Pederson, but the downgrade from Betts to Pederson won’t kill us.
There are a million variations that could potentially make sense.
I’m thinking Bloom and Friedman are more than capable of making this deal work out for both sides.
————————————————-
I’m trying to apply the same logic I do when I consider SD. Both LA & SD have blocked prospects. LA has Smith, so Ruiz & Cartaya are blocked, though Cartaya is still years away. And they have Downs. Assuming that neither Lux nor Downs can play SS, then Lux blocks Downs at 2B.
If LA has no objection starting with Downs & Cartaya, we’re close enough that one more player can even it out. Betts for Downs, Cartaya + either Joc or Gonsolin works for me.
@ jim
Agreed.
It’s an overpay.
Probably too much of one but I did say that I’d overpay so we didn’t have to give up certain players(Lux, May, Ruiz, Verdugo or even Gonsolin because of the depth he provides).
The dodgers have the prospect depth to meet the asking price without ruining their future. I think adding Betts to this roster would be worth it after going to 2 World Series without coming away with a ring.
Seems like an incredible win now move that is worth the risk/cost.
@ jim
Downs, Cartaya & Pederson if you insist.
FWIW…I truly believe Downs will be a all star. I also believe both lux and Downs are capable of sticking at SS.
Sox just extended their SS last year for 5 years. His name is Xander Bogaerts in case you hadn’t heard of him. Sox have no interest in Joc Pederson. When he leaves after 2020 as a FA what would we get -a 6th round pick?? As for Cartaya he is 18 and not projected to be MLB ready till at least 2023. For this we are going to give up one of the top 3 players in MLB in his PRIME ?? Not a chance !!
You are NOT getting Mookie WITHOUT giving up one of those 4 prospects. Sox have no need for a shortstop or Joc Pederson and the catcher is 3-4 years away from MLB.
Really and for truly ??
You have to think of it as a formula. Betts-Pederson is a loss of ~ 4 WAR.
In return for 4 WAR, you get two pretty good prospects. One of them being someone who projects as a 2B, and we have none in the minors. The other is a catcher who was the #3 international prospect, and should be ready by the time Vazquez’ contract expires.
As a Red Sox, I always like to hear from the other team’s fan’s perspective.
I think that the Sox would love to get Lux or May and/or Ruiz, but Bloom would prefer several prospects over one guy.
I could see a Maeda, Pollack, Downs, Gray and Cartaya deal for Betts, Price and a little cash (3 MM per?).
The Dodgers keep their top 3 prospects and Verdugo. They add one of the top 3-5 players in baseball and improve their starting pitching. They also clear the deck (Pollack) to be able to afford a potential Betts extension.
This deal would play poorly in Boston (you couldn’t get ALL of their top prospects for Mookie? Bloom SUX!), but it is exactly what Boston needs.
Clear payroll and get well under the tax. Find replacements for the departed players and improve their barren farm system. Sign a few risk/reward players in FA with the new payrool room (Wood? Walker? Puig?) and stay under the luxury tax fp 2020. With some good health, they should be in playoff contention all season.
Where do I sign up for this deal?
If the Sox are downgrading from a WAR standpoint (which you admit they are) they wouldn’t want Joc. They’d tell LA to keep him and give them another prospect instead.
If you are downgrading in the outfield you have no use for Joc Pederson the one year rental.
@itsgood2btheking
The. Red. Sox. Would. Have. No. Interest. In. Joc. Pederson. If. They. Trade. Mookie. Betts. You. Stinky. Smelly. Moron.
@surefire
Great comment.
The easy assumption would be that the Red Sox first preference would be to extend Betts before he becomes a FA.
Failing that…the 2nd best option would be to trade him for a Wander Javier or Lux type of prospect.
Assuming no team is willing to do that…lol…it seems like the next best option is some combination of slightly lesser prospect(s) but with some future payroll relief as a kicker etc etc and so on down the line…
Now, in regards to this particular proposal, my only issue with including pollock in any swap of bad contracts is the fact that he was actually a very solid player last year once they figured out the issue with his elbow and fixed it(infection related to previous surgery).
After fixing the issue…he actually put up a 130 ops+ in his 205 second half AB’s which is great production for a player making 12m per year. So I don’t think the dodgers are ready to consider his contract bad yet(that doesn’t mean they wouldn’t move him just to make a deal for Betts happen)
Now…his contract does have 4 years left on it, as opposed to price only having 3 years, but those 4 yrs cover his age 31-34 seasons and that certainly seems like a much safer(& cheaper) bet than price’s 3 yrs that cover his age 34-36 seasons…especially when you consider the innings that he’s put on that arm and the fact that Price makes 32m per and pollock only makes 12m per.
Which leads me to my point that if pollock and price are in the deal…I would expect the Sox to eat much more of price’s contract to cover the difference in cost and the difference in expected production.
Pollock for price straight up would have to net the dodgers a really solid prospect…right? Even if I’m wrong on the expected production part that deal…the move would save the red Sox a total of 34m and probably more importantly it would save the Red Sox 20m per over the first 3 years and that would certainly require some value in return.
If the RS choose to downgrade, isn’t going from Betts to Joc a downgrade?
and no use for a 32 yr old CF either
They’re not gonna downgrade just to downgrade. They’ll do it to add years of control to their roster which Joc Pederson doesn’t do.
You do realize you worded that like Lux is a bad prospect. Maybe you meant “especially if…”
Lux and Perderson would get it done TOUTE SUITE
Not trading Lux.
So just stay with what you have. How has that worked out for you in past ?? Oh and BTW the Dodgers are WEAKER now than the team that ended 2019. Good luck to ya !!
Your crazy! The Dodgers are not trading Lux for a 1 year $30M Betts! Sox best bet would be to trade Betts and Price and have the Dodgers pay for price maybe get Striplin , Joc and a lower tier prospect like DJ Peters , only way they are getting Ruiz, Gonslin or May (no Lux ) is if the Sox are paying 50-60% of prices salary! Red Sox have nothing they can trade for Lux
keep Lux for all I care. Sox want May
What exactly has Lux accomplished???
We won’t get close to Joc + Lux. Joc makes some sense, but if we even got Ruiz + Joc, we’d be doing well.
If I’m the Red Sox and Joc is in the deal I would want May and Ruiz as well. It might seem like it’s too much, but if I’m in Bloom’s shoes I would need to be overwhelmed by a deal to pull the trigger.
I could see maybe one of those two. Definitely not both.
Maybe Ruiz.
May is not going anywhere…especially for a player with 1 yr control.
Is Ruiz the catcher??
Yes sir.
Fangraphs has him rated as the 11th best prospect in the game in their end of 19 rankings.
I am sure he is a good prospect but the Sox need SP. Dustin May needs to be in the deal.
I definitely don’t see that happening but I could be wrong.
The dodgers have Buehler, May & Urias pegged as the core of their future rotation. I just don’t see one yr of Betts as being enough to change that…
The Dodgers are to an extent getting like the pre-win Cubs teams in that if your 20/20 vision includes an immediate WS championship, you consider “overpaying” to get Mookie or a certain shortstop in Cleveland if that puts you over the top. The Dodgers may be loaded but the NL West might not be so easy to win in 2021 or thereafter.
Apparently Randy speaks for the Sox front office so I guess we’d better pay attention.
up to LA to re-sign Mookie. it is not like they don’t have the $$$
Red Sox would see Joc as a negative In a Betts trade
Not realistic at all. Betts will return more than the Yankees got for Chapman.
That trade was for Gleyber Torres, Billy McKinney, Adam Warren, and Rashad Crawford. #24, #77, MLB reliever, lottery pick.
The 1st thing the Red Sox get is a MLB OF with 4+ years of control. Verdugo.
Then a top 50 prospect. May.
Then a 2nd MLB player that can be a reliever or a MLB ready pitcher. Gonsolin
(or Kelly if you prefer. That sends some payroll back to the Red Sox.).
Then a lottery ticket type prospect. I will let you pick that one, figure someone in the 25-30 range of Dodgers prospects.
Now that is realistic for a season of a 7-10 WAR player.
Red Sox would be doing cartwheels if they got all that for one year of Betts
Betts is an exceptional player. Only one player in baseball has been better the last 3 seasons and Betts just turned 27.
The Red Sox are asking for and will get an extreme haul for him.
What the Yankees got for a 2 MONTH rental of Chapman is a baseline that the Red Sox will easily surpass for Betts.
I was realistic in my assessment of the return. The Red Sox have been asking for more than that so far.
The Red Sox will get whatever the highest bidder says they will get.
The Red Sox will get what they ask for or they will keep Betts and get his 8-10 WAR. What they are asking for is MORE than i have been saying. Do you understand that? They want much more than the Yankees got for Chapman and they are very willing to keep Betts if they don’t get it. They don’t WANT to trade Betts. They will have to absolutely be blown the F out of the water to trade the 2nd best player in the game.
Your platitudes are not what is happening. The Red Sox will get a huge haul that will make your head spin or they won’t trade him at all.
Then I hope they hit on that extra fourth rounder they get for him next year.
Bingo! And on top of that they can pay high taxes and go through this again next year,
One reason they will NEVER get a Chapamn haul? Because such a big deal was made of the Chapman haul. Didn’t Cashman get manager of the year for it? Who wants to be on the wrong side of that trade ever again? That haul will never be repeated unless it’s Mike effing Trout. Betts won’t get it.
Enjoy your 4th round draft pick, Red Sox.
Negative ghost rider.
No Verdugo.
No May.
You keep saying the red Sox will get a haul…
Ok I’ll play…From who?
How many teams are in a position to be competitive enough, have the payroll flexibility and the prospect capital…at the level you’re talking about…to trade for Betts at the trade deadline?
3 teams? LA, ATL, NY? Are you gonna trade Betts to the yankees? Lol
Show me what the Braves would have to offer and I’d love to hear their fans response to this haul that they’d be so willing to pay…
There would be a lot more teams on that list if it was a reasonable asking price but almost every mid market or smaller team with a stacked farm can’t/won’t make that type of deal.
So that mainly leaves big market teams.
Lots of teams have the prospects or MLB talent. But are they a team that can afford to pay that price for a rental and can they afford to trade from their roster while in a playoff race?
You see the problem? It’s a very select group of buyers and it becomes smaller as the free agents disappear and the season starts because teams can’t trade you that roster player you want and then go replace them with a FA anymore.
But enough of what I think.
Why don’t you list some teams that will meet an asking price of May, Verdugo, Gonsolin & that lottery ticket and see what their fans say…
that seems reasonable
Hahaha
cdr9er,
It’s not realistic at all. That wouldn’t even come close to 1/10 of a haul for Mookie. Boston will do what they can to shed salary. Hopefully Mookie stays and gets resigned. Players like him rarely come along in a franchises history. I would put him up there with Trout as the best 2 all around players in the game.
Can the Red Sox include Alex Cora to replace clueless Dave? Anyone remember that epic at bat Cora bad (I think vs Matt Clement) where he fouled off like 15 pitches and then hit a bomb. Wow!
Dave Roberts is terrible but Cora isn’t much better. Roberts made him look a lot smarter than he is during the 2018 World Series.
Um. Ok.
As they both have big league manager gigs and both you and Darren Dreifort’s bitter ex do not, they are supremely better than you and the rest of us(armchair managers).
I’m not saying “people who can’t,” should not share opinions; but when done so boldly, it is quite absurd.
He should be good at cheating so the question is the Red Sox title as well as Astros tainted.. very much so. Cora is trash.
And I suppose you think Boone is better them all in baseball?
Just guessing but I don’t think he’s a NYY fan so he’s probably not thinking Boone, pasha.
Cora’s probably getting a suspension for his involvement with the 2017 Astros cheating scandal
Um. OK.
Good input whyhayzee. Really.
The Astros manager (Hinch) and every coach should, because they all HAD to know, yet they let it go on for months.
“let it go on” implies they weren’t actively a part of it.
Good point.
Of course Hinch knew, as Cora knew, but Cora was small potatoes in Houston, he didn’t call anything.
It will be very hard for anyone to argue that any Astros players didn’t at least know about this. It’s a dugout with limited personnel and access and they all walk the tunnel. So, they were all a part of this, whether one wants to engage in semantics with “active“ or not.
Also, no matter how one argues it, EVERY hitter benefitted, because the cheaters changed pitch sequences, pitch counts, on-base considerations… basically the whole game, which is why the penalties will be and should be severe.
He was the bench coach. To whom does the manager usually confer with when making in-game decisions?
Good call. 5/12/2004 — 18 pitches. (and it was Clement).
I was there. It was cool
He had one good AB against maybe Matt Clement and you want him as the manager? Lol
Haha! No! Cora will prob be suspended & fired soon if our current idiot commissioner has any balls & honesty! I’m all in for Roberts being fired!
This is just another hoax perpetrated by Andy boy and his fellow Geek Squad needs in the LA front office to appease an otherwise posted off fan base. None of this will happen.
“…Pissed off fan base…”
Probably not because of the magnitude but did anyone foresee the dump involving AGon, Crawford and Beckett?
Imagine being so entitled as to be “pissed off” about winning 7 straight division titles and going to two World Series…
And a 200 million payroll every season but the fans claim thats not enough..
Exactly TampaGators. They get there every year and Friedman has them at 24th in salary. They are in position to bring in a big free agent or take over a big contract.. The Dodgers would love to have Mookie but I don’t see them giving up enough to make the Red Sox happy as they will not donate him to anybody.
Actually, reading Jon Paul Morosi here and then the comments under his rumors, is like eating way too much fudge.
Don’t think he’s has gotten anything right in years – but he gets paid by clicks, and this is his busy season.
As for the other 20 rumors posted here each day – doubt there’s much authenticity to them. Tens and hundreds of millions dollars are involved. The reps that don’t pay baseball or work for any teams stand to make millions. What’s being floated to the clickbait pimps by agents as well as FO’s that want to convince their fans that they’re onto something has everything to do with posturing, and nothing to do with reality.
In turn, the FO’s and agents that are actually doing anything don’t leak nonsense.
What makes a rumor “authentic?”
It’s authentic if there is a chance of it happening. I’m sure both LA and the RS would do a Betts trade. Everything else is up for speculation.
No it’s real.
I read some of your posts below.
If you’re thetruth……
P.S. And I thought ForestCobraAL and Strike Four were not of this planet.
Why not just move Price for anything and reallocate that money to Betts.
Because there’s not many teams that can afford to take a risk on a 34 year old with injury concerns that is still owed almost 100 million for the next 3 seasons. Obviously he’s not getting traded to the Yankees and the Dodgers don’t have a big need for starting pitching. They have no choice but to pay some of his salary to get rid of him.
Boston would need to pay at least 36 million 12 per year for three years.
Absolutely. That $12mm/year only brings his value up to zero in a potential trade.
You’d probably have to pony up a prospect to get a big market team to take Price’s contract. Even then I’d think that the Red Sox would have to eat some of that contract. Price’s market value right now is very low. Maybe they hope he performs well in the first half of 2020 and deal him at the deadline. Lots of hoping right now.
I think Prices market is higher now than it was 2yrs ago. Price is good, and he helped win the WS. His attitude sucks. But pitching is good.
His attitude is crappy with the media but he’s great in the locker room.
Spoken like a Red Sox fan. He has been injured two out of his last three seasons. Velocity is down and coming off one of his worst season in his career. If he’s so wanted why haven’t the Sox unloaded him by now. The Dodgers already have an expensive pitcher in decline that is overpaid in Kershaw. They certainly don’t need two of them unless the Sox eat more than half of that lousy contract.
I know the point you were trying to make(that he’s declining) but putting Kershaw in prices class after kershaw just put up 178 innings of 3.03 era….seems just a tad misleading don’t you think?
Agreed. Price is in deeper decline and older than Kershaw. You wouldn’t find any teams willing to pay >$30mm for either but if both teams had to dump salary you’d have to eat a lot more of Price’s contract than Kershaw’s. But the common theme is both were exceptional pitcher, in decline (stats, velocity, stuff, etc.) and both overpaid.
@Dodger2015
FWIW…fangraphs projects 1 war to be worth 9m.
Applying that standard to kershaw and the 3.6bWAR he put up last yr…comes out to 32.4m of value.
Kershaw was paid 31m last year.
I know he’s declined some but I don’t think he quite qualifies as overpaid…yet.
Velocity is down and coming off one of his worst season in his career.
———————————————————–
If it helps, Price was one of the best pitchers in BB in the first half last year. I have no idea how bad the injury is, but his arm is fine. His K/9 was the best of his career, and his K/W was his best in 3 years, and above his career line.
Lots of hoping for the Dodgers too who have WEAKENED their roster that wasn’t good enough to win a WS as it was. Price would be just fine as an NL #4 SP during the regular season. In the post season you move him to the BP and he is a weapon. Somehow you seem to think the Sox are going to give you Mookie for some SCRUB. Hey we got our MULPTIPLE WS titles. What do the Dodgers have ?? Pay up or MOVE ON !!
“Pay up or MOVE ON!!!”
That goes both ways. The Red Sox can get stuck with their high taxes and go through this again next year.
How weakened are they? After Ryu, who picked the perfect season to be relatively healthy and maybe David Freese, they aren’t losing much. Still have Buehler, Bellinger, Muncy, Pederson (until he is traded) Seager (one year farther from TJ surgery) and three very young and impressive arms who all should get 150 + innings. Mookie would be a nice get, but it isn’t like they need him to win the NL West. They could do nothing more and still win the NL West. If the price for Mookie is prohitibitve, then they wait until the deadline and make a move. If anything the playoffs are a crapshoot, the “88 Dodgers prove that.
Too funny. Weakened? Yeah losing Ryu makes an impact but they have an extremely deep team and can swing a trade easily to strengthen the team. The Dodgers don’t need a #4 pitcher. They have lots of guys who can easily step into a #3 or 4 and possibly a 2. They’ll go out and get a big bat and/or top of rotation guy. No need to rush right now.
Yeah, weakened. Of course it is. Does depth win championships, or just divisions? This should be a rhetorical question to anyone who’s been paying attention. Nobody on the roster today is going to step into the 2-3 slot in the rotation. Not this year. Anyone who thinks otherwise needs to name that player. Not so easy, is it?
As for Price, I don’t see the need or the value. The Dodgers already have that guy in Maeda. The only purpose I see in flipping Maeda for Price is we know Maeda isn’t happy with being shuffled to the bullpen every September. Not a real good reason to make that change but maybe it happens as part of a package involving Betts.
What Championships? The Dodgers have no rings.
Agree on the adding price part.
I know we’ve talked about this before but won’t Kershaw be just fine as the number 2 during the regular season? Even after his “down” year of 178 innings of 3.03 ball?
Seems like there’s no need for anyone to step into that role until playoffs(which we both agree is all that matters).
May is already pretty built up after throwing 140 innings last year. Seems easy to see him bumping that number to the 175 inning range if there’s no injury.
Urias on the other hand did only throw 80innings last year. What’s great is that our depth should allow us to manage his innings. I’d expect him to put up 120 innings next yr and still be fresh for the playoffs.
As for the playoffs themselves…lots of time between now and then to add if needed but both May and Urias have the stuff to step into that role in the playoffs if they were required to do so…though I do think someone will be added to fill that role when that time comes…
Urias can be a #3, probably not a #2 next year but upside to be #2. Let’s hope he makes progress this year. He has the stuff needs more experience and polish. May and Gonsolin can top out as a #3 this year. More like a #4/5 though. Point is depth will get you to the playoffs and with a trade before or mid-season the Dodgers will be right up there as one of the favorites. Although the Yankees are looking really good right now. Playoffs are a crapshoot so you never know. But yeah, in the playoffs you need more quality and less depth. I’m sure Friedman knows this but he’s just being careful in not burning the farm system his group resurrected.
You’ve named the right names but I think you are being somewhat too optimistic on where they can fit into the rotation this year. I believe they will continue to be very careful with Urias so he’s a long shot to even remain in the rotation IMO. May has tons of potential but he’s got only something like 30 innings of major league work under his belt. It’s difficult seeing him stay in the rotation for an entire season let alone catapult to the top of the rotation. Likewise with Gonsolin. My point is you shouldn’t wait to fix issues you know exist now and can’t really address internally. The midseason options aren’t necessarily going to be better or cheaper. Fewer teams are sellers and more are buyers at the deadline without the August waiver trades.
@itsgood2btheking I’m afraid that Kershaw will continue to decline. I think right now he’s a #3, and in the playoffs who knows what you get from him. The stuff is just not as good. Unless he reinvents himself like a Sabathia or has a Verlander transformation the trend likely continues down for him. We may not need a true #2 until the playoffs but that will put pressure on the Dodgers and make the NL West tighter unless guys like Gonsolin, May and Urias can step up. The depth is still outstanding but can’t assume that all these prospects continue to trend up. May get some that trend down. Caleb Ferguson showed promise his first year and took a big step back his second year. We can’t rely on guys like Maeda and Stripling to be nothing more than a #5 at this point or bullpen help. I don’t think that this deal gets done without Price as Friedman will use it to bargain down the ask for Betts. That said, there is no way that Friedman takes Price’s contract in full. It will have to be reduced. Maybe by a third or a half.
@bluesky
That’s a pretty fair and reasonable analysis…including the part about me being “somewhat too optimistic” lol.
Overall, the Dodgers are in a real good spot. They have a ton of options and flexibility but they definitely need to fill some holes in the roster when talking about the playoffs and I think wed all prefer that they fill those holes now as opposed to later.
I’d like to think Dodger fans are all on the same page when it comes to fixing roster issues now rather than later, but every time the Dodgers pursue a free agent and come up empty, somebody pipes up here to say that it was just as well. They need a starter who can pitch that first or second game in a playoff series and they don’t have it, or any realistic options for finding one internally. So unless management thinking is the Dodgers maybe won’t look like playoff candidates in July (which I doubt) then the question is not whether they pay, only when they pay, and how they pay. In the offseason you can pay with cash. After that you can only pay with prospects. If you wanted to see them get better without hurting the prospect pipeline you wanted them to spend the money. Not everyone sees that though.
Betts doesn’t like Boston and doesn’t want to sign an extension. Trading him now is the best move.
Sorry, but the Dodgers do have rings. Just haven’t won anything lately.
Betts will cost less on talent than Lindor. A Lindor trade would probably require Lux as the headline of a package where as Betts probably won’t. May, Ruiz, and Pederson may get it done.
Gonsolin, Ruiz, White, Pederson.
Never, ever happen. IT IS FOR One year!
It is for 8-10 WAR. It is for 4+ wins more than the Dodgers had in 2019. its for adding an elite hitter to the lineup with Bellinger. It is for a WS ring.
But if the Dodgers don’t want a ring they can keep all their precious prospects. I don’t think the Red Sox would mind that at all. Trading Betts is a PR nightmare and they are going to have to be blow away to even start discussing it. If they don’t get blown away they keep him. No problem.
How much surplus value do you think Betts is worth? What dollar value are you putting on 1 WAR to come up with your valuation?
Wow, the Red Sox FO sure has a huge presence here this evening!
Fangraphs places the value. We know the salary.
I am an Angels fan, not Red Sox. I do listen to what is going on. Apparently you don’t.
Ha-ha. Sure. Your certainty makes you right.
Your lack of knowledge makes you wrong.
Reading your comments makes me think you know all of this, but for those that don’t here is a quick breakdown of a potential deal. FG has Betts projected for 6.5 WAR. If you think that’s too low, his 3 year average is around 7.5 WAR. If you value 1 WAR at $10 million, that puts his surplus value about $45-$50 million. FG also has prospect valuations. A 50 grade position prospect has $31mm in value and a 50 grade pitching prospect has $23 million in value. That makes the value of a Betts trade more like Gray and Downs. That would be 2 prospects in the 50-100 range.
If you look back at the return the Orioles got for Machado at the 2018 deadline, the Dodgers gave up a back end top 100 prospect and 2 prospects in the 25-30 range of the Dodgers team rankings. At the time the Dodgers had a huge need for Machado after losing their stud SS for the season and locked in a tight playoff race at the time of the trade and they still didn’t over pay.
One last thing to consider is that Friedman and Bloom worked together for years in Tampa Bay. They will have a similar way they value prospects, contracts and trade value. I can’t imagine a trade involving Lux, May or Ruiz as all 3 are 60 grade prospects and look to be an be over pay. If a trade were to happen, my guess would be something like Betts, Price and $30-$35 million for Gray, Downs, Sheffield and a throw-in.
@Koamalu (who suspiciously sounds a lot like Pads Fans), since you seem to be on a mission to prove that you and only you are right, there are a few things you are conveniently leaving out that need to be taken into account with any Betts trade.
1. The market for outfielders. There just isn’t much demand this offeason. Teams were much more apt to spend on frontline starting pitching.
2. Betts’ salary. Obviously he’s worth more than $30m on a one-year deal but him making that much money certainly has some effect on his trade value. A lot of teams can’t afford or aren’t interested in spending that much on one player no matter how good he is and a smaller pool of bidders does not help the Red Sox.
3. There’s not a GM in the game that doesn’t know that Chaim Bloom is under an ownership mandate to get under the luxury tax. That naturally has a negative effect on his leverage.
4. You bring up the Cubs’ trade for Aroldis Chapman. That was an extreme example of a team that hadn’t won a championship in 108 years making a trade that everyone knew was an overpay when their window was wide open in order to put an end to that drought. If they hadn’t won it that year that trade would have gone down as one of the worst trades of this decade, like the Shelby Miller and James Shields trades. And even now, it’s not self-evident that the Cubs would have lost the World Series without Chapman.
All the best.
@Koamalu since you seem to be on a mission to prove that you and only you are right, there are a few things you are conveniently leaving out that need to be taken into account with any Betts trade.
1. The market for outfielders. There just isn’t much demand this offeason. Teams were much more apt to spend on frontline starting pitching.
2. Betts’ salary. Obviously he’s worth more than $30m on a one-year deal but him making that much money certainly has some effect on his trade value. A lot of teams can’t afford or aren’t interested in spending that much on one player no matter how good he is and a smaller pool of bidders does not help the Red Sox.
3. There’s not a GM in the game that doesn’t know that Chaim Bloom is under an ownership mandate to get under the luxury tax. That naturally has a negative effect on his leverage.
4. You bring up the Cubs’ trade for Aroldis Chapman. That was an extreme example of a team that hadn’t won a championship in 108 years making a trade that everyone knew was an overpay when their window was wide open in order to put an end to that drought. If they hadn’t won it that year that trade would have gone down as one of the worst trades of this decade, like the Shelby Miller and James Shields trades. And even now, it’s not self-evident that the Cubs would have lost the World Series without Chapman.
All the best.
Good thinking ryan and jim. Not a lot to add except that some of the valuations being placed on Betts to justify the Dodgers having to hand over the keys to the farm for one year of him are insane. That isn’t going to happen and not especially if Price and his under water contract is part of the deal. I could see the Dodgers sending Pederson, Maeda, and a couple of quality prospects not named Lux or May (many to choose from) to take Betts and Price. The Red Sox wipe $100M or so off their books, and Dodgers get some of the salary offset they’d need to avoid the CBT themselves. I could also see Taylor being included. Boston always has the option of waiting until July but that’s a risk.
You lost me when you said 1 WAR was worth $1oMM. Never heard it valued so high. In fact, most people I read question if $8MM is too high.Obviously your comment is going to be biased towards Betts. Stopped reading.
@BlueSkyLA Red Sox would have no interest in Pederson if they trade Betts. Negative interest even. If they wanted a one-year-rental outfielder they’d just keep the one they have.
Negative interest? That you will have to explain.
My assumption is the Red Sox are pushing the reset button, hoping to clear salary obligations and add some prospects to the pipeline. That might just come with taking a fill-in player, not expensive and short term who adds back some of the outfield depth they be losing by trading Betts. Somebody like Pederson. Or maybe Taylor.
Negative interest because he’d hurt their draft position and take away playing time from the younger outfielders they might want to give a shot to.
If they are pushing the reset button as you say there is no reason for them to go around trading for other teams’ rental players unless it’s someone they think they are buying low on and can flip for better prospects at the deadline. If they want a rental outfielder, why not just keep the elite one they already have in-house?
Last question first: because they don’t have any good reason to pay the salary of an elite outfielder when they’re in a reset season, assuming that is the case. I don’t get hurting their draft position. How’s that?
Anyhow Pederson is basically a glorified platoon player, but he’s death on RHP, and could be flipped midseason no matter whether they’ve bought high or low (thought the surplus contract estimators say his value is significant). But in fact since he’d be a part of much larger package the purchase price would be almost entirely theoretical.
If they don’t have any good reason to pay Betts in a reset season as you say they certainly don’t have any good reason to pay Pederson.
Pederson will make a team better in 2020 which means if the Red Sox acquire him, they won’t draft as high in 2021.
He could be flipped midseason but for less than he could be flipped for right now. So basically you expect the Red Sox to trade for a depreciating asset in advance of a year you say is a reset year. How does that make sense for them?
Because as part of the deal they are unloading Price’s underwater contract. The net would be around $100M, a solid and affordable starter, and a quality prospect, maybe two. Other than that, no reason. BTW I don’t see a reset as being the same as tanking. I doubt very much Boston is going that far.
Red Sox would want another prospect instead of Joc
Highly doubt the Dodgers would go for a trade like that. That’s ridiculous. Getting Betts for one year of control and no guarantee for an extension? That is the problem with this trade. It’s not ideal for the Red Sox and not ideal for the Dodgers. Highly doubt anything gets done. Dodgers are not going to overpay for one year of Betts.
The Dodgers probably have a far better chance at an extension with Betts than the Redsox. Not only in available funds but also the city itself – LA vs Boston.
Not really. Have you not been tracking Friedman and the Dodgers. He has not given out a $100mm plus contract yet as a Dodger. The notion that the Dodgers are big spenders is fiction. Initially the new ownership spent to keep fans happy but that was always deemed to be temporary with the longer-term goal of trimming payroll and staying below luxury tax while building up the farm system.
Boston is a better city but Betts clearly doesn’t like Boston.
How is it clear that he doesn’t like Boston?
How much did they give up for a Machado rental who is a fraction of the player Betts is.
Not much. The players that mattered. They gave up their #4, #27 and #28 prospects at that time. Diaz was 84th best prospect at that time. Dodgers unloaded Diaz at the right time. He hit a HR in the futures game and all of a sudden everyone wanted him and his stock went through the roof.
Machado was in the midst of a 6 WAR season and had a .963 OPS and 162 OPS+ when he was traded. Machado was playing on a 1/$16 million contract at the time. The Dodgers also had a glaring need for him after losing their stud SS for the season and locked in a tight playoff race at the time. They gave up a AA OF prospect ranked in the top 75-100 prospects, 2 players ranked in the 25-30 range of Dodger prospects and a couple of throw ins.
Last season, Betts was a 6.7 WAR player with a .915 OPS and 135 OPS+. He is going to be playing on a 1/$27-$28 million contract. If he ends up being moved, I think a lot of Red Sox fans here are going to be very disappointed with the return. If Price and his negative value is included, most will probably lose their minds at the return.
Oh, you’re letting inconvenient facts get in the way. Betts’ haul boosters won’t pay attention to those.
May will not be going anywhere, he is in starting rotation 2020.
As a Dodgers fan I would take that deal NOW
Why would the Red Sox want Pederson? He has as much club control as Betts.
If Arte Moreno was actually “all in” he’d trade for Price and Betts. I think taking on all price money + Marsh and Saurez/Sandoval gets the deal done.
Not to mention a Mookie, Trout, Rendon 1,2,3 would be the best 123 anyone’s ever seen
Rendon is highly overrated, a juiced ball contract year is making him way way overrated.
I hope you’re joking. Rendon hit over .300 with an over .900 OPS in the two years prior.
Andy – he’s not joking, he’s trolling. Just disregard and he will go away.
Noted
Batman: the best anyone has ever seen is a bit much – that wouldn’t even pass the Yankees history test, let alone every other potential lineup in history.
No expansion era team has ever had 23+ WAR from 3 position players, not even the Yankees.
Only the 1927-1931 Yankees had 3 position players that surpassed that.
Still don’t have half the pitching they need.
The Angels need an entire pitching staff.
I kind of feel like the ship has sailed on pitching for the Angels. They really needed to land one of Cole, Strasburg or Ryu. What’s left just isnt really going to move the needle much.
The trade options don’t look like they’re going to do much better. Names like Boyed, Price and Robbie Ray just don’t sound like tha pitchers you would want to hand the ball too when you really need the win.
What is the benefit of being a troll like you are?
You’re absolutely right Forest, well, unless you count Heaney, Ohtani, Canning, Teheran, Bundy, Barria, Sandoval, Suarez, and their entire bull pen. Then they have an entire pitching staff already.
Couldn’t agree more. Angels should be 110% in on Betts/Price.
The Angels didn’t really “need” Rendon, although I think it was a great signing for us. But we absolutely don’t need Betts. Pitching and a catcher, that’s what we need.
You’ll be saying the opposite when Rendon actually plays. Very overrated player.
Ummm, Rendon has already actually played and he’s awesome.
Listen Batman, Arte is not dealing for Price. And another thing since Arte has purchased Angel Staduim. You have until opening day to vacate the Bat Cave in CF. Or your Batmobile will be impounded and sold at a auction. And leave the cave as clean as it was when you moved in back in 1998. Or we bill Bruce Wayne for any clean up.
Signed
Billy Eppler
OMG! Angel fans are never satisfied.
Carl Crawford has to be part of the deal.
CINCINNATI
Just do it!
Betts and Lindor.
Be something!
Hahaha!
Since the Dodgers think Lux is the 2nd coming of Joe DiMaggio maybe they should just play him. If you want someone like Betts or Lindor, you know players who actually have been all stars at the MLB level, perhaps you should part with your PCL stud for them. Don’t get me wrong, Lux looks like a really good prospect, but for Betts and Lindor are both superstars. Maybe try to work out a conditional player based on resigning one of them.
Lux was on their playoff roster and the Dodgers left off good talent to do that.
Dodgers do not need any of them until late July. That is the problem of both Red Sox and Indians and why they can’t play big boy here. Those two teams are more needy than the Dodgers.
The Dodgers will not get Lindor at the deadline as the Indians will be in the playoff hunt for 2020.
3 teams in AL central Chicago, Minn and Cleveland . I see Cleveland in third.
Minnesota lacks starting pitching and Chicago has a lot of ground to make up. Cleveland is still the favorite.
Imagine being a red sux fan and thinking you’re going to get lux for one year of mookie
They want pitching not Lux who has proven nothing.
Yeah imagine expecting an unproven prospect for a top 5 player in his contract year.
@thetruth lmfao “contract year”, frame it however you want buddy boy, no GM is giving up 6 years of a top 10 prospect in the game for 1 year of mookie. Lux is not some random “unproven prospect” you clown. Keep slurping the clam chowdah
Really? How many MVPs has Lux won? Surely if he isn’t unproven he must have been an all-star already. Oh wait, the guy has done nothing. Betts has been elite. Before you call people clowns maybe your team should actually win a championship. I bet you are bitter because the Red Sox embarrassed your team.
Red Sox would be doing cartwheels if they got Lux for Mookie.
And if they miss Mookie so much next offseason, they can bring him back.
The Red Sox will not get Lux or May for Betts. It’s funny, Cubs fans say that is the price for Bryant, Indians fans say that is the price for Lindor. They, and you Sox fans, all have plenty of reasons why your guy is more than worth it. None of those trades are happening. And A few things are for sure: the Dodgers are going to be 1 of the top 3 favorites to win the World Series every year for the next 3-5 years, Lux, May and Verdugo will be essential parts of their team, and Bryant, Lindor and Betts will all have moved on and their teams will have gotten nothing of value for them.
That’s why the Dodgers will never win anything. Betts and Price could finally put you over the top to win the World Series, but you rather keep a prospect. Hate to break it to ypu, but most prospects don’t live up to the hype. Based on Dodger fans logic we should have kept Moncada who was rated #1 prospect at the time and not got Sale, which helped bring us a title. Let the Dodgers keep their prospects and continue to lose in the playoffs.
Dodgers will continue to make playoffs the next 10 years. Sox not so much. I like our chances.
Everybody want’s out prospects, but we never trade them away. Every year the teams fans say the same thing, Everybody wanted Bellinger, Buehler, Seager, & Verdugo, and this year its Lux & May. We haven’t traded them before, and we won’t do it this year.
If we were including them, a deal would have already been done. Its not gonna happen.
?Why give much for rental of Betts? Just sign him in free agency in October of this year. Betts can only go to a big market team Dodgers, Yankees, Cubs, and Boston.
Angels, also.
So the Angels can aford 130 mil for 4 players??? I don’t see that happening.
Over your head. Re-read Larry’s comment. We’re talking about teams that could sign Betts next offseason.
Actually it’s over your head, he’s saying the angels would have $130 mil tied up in four players. Which they absolutely do not have the money to do. Lol saying the angels could sign betta shows how little you understand how this all works.
No
Maybe it is just better to accept for the Red Sox that no GM will take on Price’s contract unless the Red Sox take on $20MM of it or more. As a matter of fact, including Mookie Betts might motivate a team to pay around $10MM or maybe even $15MM of it.
I don’t see any team paying $60MM for Betts and Price and get stuck with Price and his contract for the years to come. Sounds like wishful thinking.
So what would be the point if the Sox pay 20 of Prices contract? It’s not getting them the salary relief they need or are looking for, so it wouldn’t make sence
Depends on what year of Price’s contract they pay. If they can be free and clear of it in 2020, and make one or two smaller moves, they can dip under the lux tax and reset it. That’s what they want.
The important part is not salary relief, its salary relief that is counted towards the CBT. If they include money in a trade that sends Price to another team they still get the full $31 million coming off the books for luxury tax purposes.
Don’t quite understand what you are saying. The Red Sox can probably move Price as a pure salary dump if the paid the contract down to 3/60. Bloom is playing the long game someone will get desperate and pay for Price.
not likely unless the Angles, they are the .only team that that dumb. I dought that they have 20 million left in their budget. If Boston paid Price salary down to 3 /60 and added Bettis the only team I think would do that is Dodgers. Boston would need to take back about 12 million in salary both teams would be under 210 million cap.
A young pitcher going back to the Sox?
Are they willing to pay half of Price’s remaining $?
If the Dodgers think highly of both young pitchers then I think they should just hold on to them.
That the plan Dodgers keep all their young pitchers,
If there’s any truth to Boston only wanting one of May/Gonsolin and no Lux, for a Mookie/Price combination..the Dodgers need to lock it in NOW.
That’s still a lot for the Dodgers if they are going to swallow ALL $96MM of Price’s contract. After all they would only be getting 1 year of Betts and they’d still have to pay him $28MM for it…
Wow, the media’s really hellbent on a seeing the Dodgers make a disastrous trade for a rental player. Lindor, Bryant, and now Betts are all due to get something north of $250MM in free agency soon. I doubt they have any interest in retaining these guys beyond their current contracts.
Because the Dodgers goal is to win a World Series so if a rental player does that its worth it. Their clock is NOW
Definitely. Kershaw is starting to decline. They lost Ryu and Hill and Maeda’s 32 now and probably a reliever. Jansen is a shadow of his former self. Who knows what Urias is anymore. They have a fine starting 8 and loads of position player depth, much of which is young, but they only have enough pitching to compete for a WS now, and not a whole lot longer..
Seam kinda a depressing look but in real life dodgers feature a rotation that has buehler, may, gonsolin, urias (who is still really good and young) maeda (still good especially for back end) and other intriguing arms coming up. On to the lineup one that features mvp bellinger, all star corey seager, max muncy and justin turner who all boost strong career stats on offense. They also feature a top 10 farm with depth at every position including catcher (hard to come by) Again no one in the division poses a threat. Pair all that with a payroll thats heading down near the the bottom of the league and you have a well managed team primed for runs to a world series for years to come.
Yes. They win lots of regular season games.
May, Gonsolin, White, Gray and a boatload of great prospects say otherwise.
The Dodgers have the prospect capital and financial resources to pull off pretty much any move they want. Just depends on where they decide to draw the line in the sand.
Pederson would be an obvious piece to send back, although not a headliner. His swing would work well in Fenway and NY.
Red Sox would see Pederson as a negative in a Betts trade. They are both rentals.
Dodgers aren’t going to trade May for one year of Betts either. Especially if they take on Price too. If they take Price then Pollock will probably be in the deal.
Then the Dodgers would have to eat most of Pollock’s deal because the Sox are only dealing to shed payroll. That’s the whole reason. Otherwise they’d keep everyone.
Pollock’s avg salary is $12M- Price’s is $31M. Plus if you take Betts his is $27.7M. That’s $46M in savings….
Regardless, Boston is not looking for a $12MM/yr obligation at the back end of this deal. Try half that. Or less.
“To this end, the Dodgers have continued to explore the possibility of acquiring Mookie Betts from the Red Sox…”
“As game-changing as the idea of a Betts trade may be, the Sox aren’t actively trying to deal him…”
Tomorrow I’m gonna make an offer on a house that’s not for sale.
What it says is the Red Sox don’t want to admit they’re shopping Betts because 1) so far their overblown expectations have resulted in nada and 2) there’s more leverage in saying they aren’t shopping for a buyer, assuming anyone buys it.
Dodgers certainly are a logical fit to hash a deal out.
They certainly tick all the boxes. I can’t help but feel they’ll get taken. They’ll wind up a year from with $64MM owed on Price and having given away some other talent (May?), and Betts gone.
Or resigning betts and trading seager for more assets. Dodgers have a lot of options and they can most certainly afford to keep betts in the fold another decade if they so choose.
And that will cost a king’s ransom. Alternatively, if they don’t elect/manage to sign Betts, then they’ll be faced with the situation I described: no Betts, no May/Gonsolin, and $64MM owed to Price. Ugh.
Probably a WS title though. And guess what, that’s the only thing that they should care about.
In what world is that going to happen. Sorry to break it to you but the Dodgers won’t take Price unless the Sox eat a chunk of that contract and it reduces the ask for Betts. You’ll get something comparable to what the Os got for Machado. Betts a better player than Machado but when you throw in a terrible Price contract even after shaving it you get a Machado type of return.
Betts and Price? Wouldn’t give more than a bucket of used balls.
Dodgers are about to get Arenado, Betts and Lindor arent they?
The worst part is they totally could get all three easily and
somehow massively improve their roster from last season.
SS Lindor
LF Bellinger
RF Betts
3B Arenado
1B Muncy
2B Turner
C Smith
CF Pollock
Bench: Pederson, Verdugo, Barnes, Hernandez, Taylor
The Dodgers have so many chips, they could go this route if they want to, but I think they’re saving SS for Lux, who not only kinda looks like Trout but also puts up numbers kinda like him? Idk I could see the Dodgers blowing off some prospect overspill soon.
How many wins would you peg this team for ?
115-130
What’s the rotation and pen look like after acquiring those three by only trading Seager lol. I don’t think this is possible but fun to look at.
I was assuming the same pitching staff with the proposed lineup.
It’s kind of fun watching Dodger and Red Sox fans dis any possible trade that isn’t an utter steal for their side. This whole thing may very well come down to the Red Sox’s real motivations (we really don’t know what they are). If they can package Price with Mookie, they get rid of $60M this year, drop well below the CBT, and be free of Price’s two oldest years (and $64M). Throw in a couple of decent prospects, and that’s a win. If their goal is to win a WS this year, than a salary dump doesn’t make sense.
Spot on… and definitely no WS aspirations this season.
How do you figure? It’s still a top 5 offense in baseball… get the pitchers to pitch their weight (they didn’t last year) and they’re absolutely in the conversation.
The luxury tax is kind of dumb. I like the idea of trying to encourage the smaller market teams to spend with opponents money but dropping a pick ten spots while lowering IBM is too much.
The Dodgers, Yankees, Boston, Chicago should all be at the threshold of $250,000,000 every year. Coming up with something else is needed. Get rid of draft pick and IBM penalties, change the structure on going over. Tokyo, Seoul, Beijing, Taipei/Taiwan, Paris, London, Rome, and Berlin will change the game to a world game closer to soccer. Each one of those cities would also easily support a $250,000,000 a year franchise. They’ll all draw 3-3.5 million a year also.
Every team in the majors makes over the cap 210 million a year in profit, so the real problem is increasing the floor so all teams try to win. 130 floor seems like a good place to start.
Betts and Price for Lux and May? Sounds great.
Dodgers say no. After 1 year of Betts, nothing but huge regrets.
Actually he specifically says the Sox are NOT asking about Lux. Probably why Friedman hasn’t hung up yet.
Once again….. you really believe any this…… Off season click bait because they have nothing.
That is hilarious. Maybe you think Colletti is still around but Friedman is smarter than that.
If the Dodgers didn’t jump on giving up that little for Betts and Price then Friedman should be fired.
Comical. Price’s contract alone should significantly weaken what Boston gets for Betts unless they significantly eat a lot of that contract. There is no market for Price right now with that terrible contract. 34-year old pitcher with injuries, declining velocity and coming off one of his worst seasons in his career. Without eating salary you’re essentially saying that one-year of Betts is worth more than Lux and May combined which is flat our ludicrous. No sane GM would pull the trigger on that. I wouldn’t deal Lux straight up for one year of Betts.
Merosi just makes up stuff and speculates nonsense.
And you fools continue to debate a non story.
If the Dodgers felt any pressure to dramatically upgrade their roster they would just sign Donaldson. They could have easily traded for Kluber if they wanted bu could still swing a trade for Lester or Quintana without giving away any of their best prospects.
This article appears to be a plant designed either to gin up interest in Mookie Betts or pressure the Indians to cut the price on Lindor.
Right. It’s all part of MLBTR’s agenda to bring down the Dodgers. That’s why Tim started this site in first place. It was working ok until now.
Or – crazy thought – the Dodgers aren’t getting Donaldson because they won’t go 4 years and aren’t getting Lindor because they won’t give up Lux. And they will take Price because it will significantly reduce the cost of Betts.
Its all good. The Dodgers can continue to be also rans. No rings for Friedman.
Nothing guaranteed about a ring with Betts. But there’d be huge regrets if they didn’t win. HUGE.
For Betts alone. I could see a deal of Gonsolin, Jeter Downs and Pederson. For Price and Betts, tough call. Not sure if the Dodgers go as high as Keibert Ruiz here, despite the rise of Will Smith.
Gonna need Seager and why does everyone think we want Pederson lol. Seager and arms will do just fine.
Nobody thinks the Sox want Pederson. He’s just a take-back to grease the deal, a financial offset for the taker of the big money. Why would the Sox want Seager? Where does he play? Arms, yes. Another SS, no.
Someone gets it!!
Second… obviously
Except if you trade Mookie that makes Peraza an everyday outfielder and you have Chavis, Hernandez, and/or Lin covering first and second. Hate to break it to you but that sounds like a nightmare to me. Seager adds a good bat to the right side and you plug Chavis at first. Then losing Mookie doesn’t hurt so much. But realistically, a Mookie + Price trade to LAD is never going to happen.
Not even in the neighborhood for Betts. He will net a return that is more than the Yankees got for Chapman.
Start with Verdugo. Then add a pitcher that is a top 100 prospect. Then add a guy like Gonsolin. Then add another prospect. Then and only then do the Red Sox not hang up the phone immediately.
Probably no one will get a Chapman return since it’s been made such a big deal of. Who wants to be on the wrong side of the Chapman deal? No one. Trout is the only player who could get a Chapman deal.
Making a blockbuster trade with the Dodgers has to be near impossible. As many people who own them, you’d have to convince too many people to approve a trade, and piss off the other half.
It happened before. And the Dodgers would certainly be going for it in 2020 by adding both Price + Betts to the team.
There has to be a middle ground for the two teams…….just a matter of what that is. If Price is involved or not, how much money the Dodgers take on if he is involved, lots of moving parts.
For me, Betts is in his last year and if he is hell bent on testing FA, the Dodgers can’t offer high level prospects in return, otherwise wait until FA for him yourself. If the Dodgers take on most of Price’s money, again you cant offer high level prospects.
So bottom line, unless Betts agrees to an extension at time of trade, I think the Dodgers walk away and wait. If he does agree to an extension, you have to look at giving up Gonsolin, Downs, Gray, maybe Ruiz and Pederson. Me personally, I try and offer Stripling instead of Gonsolin or Gray and see if the Red Sox bite.
Now if Price is included and the Dodgers are taking on 50% or more of the money, my deal goes down to Stripling, Downs, Ruiz, Pederson, Peters.
I’m into this comment but send Seager instead of Joc. Downgrade one of the others too if needed.
The Red Sox need to get real. Taking on all of Price’s salary is a pretty fair deal to get Betts. Maybe a low end prospect but nothing more if they are also taking 100% salary.
Not happening. But we’ll wait till you call us. We can stand Pat but you need Betts and a pitcher. Hope to hear from you soon. Bye.
Actually you can’t if you want to get under the tax line. Unless you want to pay the high taxes AND go through this again next year. You’re behind the eight ball. Don’t pretend you’re not.
The tax discussion is so blown out of proportion. Sox have money coming off the books in the next 2-3 years if they can find a partner for price and Jackie this offseason they can keep Betts easily. Or wait until next year and prices contract is more manageable for another team to take on. The Sox hands are far from tied, they’re not gonna get ripped off just to get under the tax.
zalex
Can’t reset the rate without ducking under and there are other implications as well. Draft picks, I believe. Maybe others, too. This is why the NYY ducked under a couple of years ago. High taxes, draft picks, etc. Can’t be avoided. You can pretend it’s nothing but it’s not. There’s a reason clubs like the NYY feel absolutely compelled to do it, whether they outright admit it or not.
You don’t attach Price to Mookie, end of story. You’re biased bc you’re a yankee fan and you want to see the Sox get ripped off.
They can’t wait until next year as he will be a 10/5 player and can’t be traded without his consent.
Dodgers have 8 starting pitchers and Dodgers will win NL west with or without Betts and Price. The Dodgers have a projected war of 51 which is tops in ML as is. Dodgers want, doesn’t need trade Boston needs.
You’re right its not happening but nobody’s gonna call. Sox can’t trade Betts because they can’t sell a fair deal to their fans. Betts plays in Boston next season then walks for compensation draft pick. Sox stuck paying Price for 3 more years because he’s impossible to trade.
Who’s us? U work for the team now? And why would I call u, I’m not even a fan of the Dodgers. The Red Sox may be able to be patient but I doubt they will get a better offer. So if they really want to get under the tax this is probably the best choice.
This is assuming there’s actually an offer on the table worth considering for one of the best players in baseball
For one year.
Smh take your trash opinion to some Yankees news
I think it’s fair too. Just send of couple prospects over and call it a deal.
Most teams know that trades are a good method of upgrading you team. More teams have been successful in upgrading their teams by trades than through free agency lately. This is even more true with contenders, they usually don’t draft near the top, and most free agents are an overpay.
Dodgers are one of the best drafting teams in baseball.
I’m not a Price fan, but he is still a good pitcher. I guarantee if he went to the Dodgers he would be even better since he would have no pressure and would be pitching in a pitcher’s ball park. One year of injury doesn’t make him injury prone. I mean look at Ryu just got and he is injured all the time. Starters are getting paid so much that Price is a relative bargain. Dodgers fans think all their prospects are Mike Trout. I’ll tell Dodger fans a secret, hoarding prospects won’t win you a title. If the Sox kept Moncada who was rated higher than any of your prospects, we don’t win the World Series. If trading a top prospect for year of Betts and he helps deliver a championship, it’s worth it all day long.
Are the Dodgers the new Yankees for the media? According to the media, the Dodgers have been in hot pursuit of: Stephen Strasburg, Gerrit Cole, Anthony Rendon, Josh Donaldson, Mookie Betts, Nolan Arenado, and many others. Yes, the Dodgers have a massive payroll, but they can’t sign every top tier FA, despite the media’s wishes.
If the Dodgers are doing their “due diligence,” they aren’t the only club to be doing so. Why aren’t we hearing about the others?
There aren’t too many clubs who will even consider trading for a Betts rental. Boston wants too much AND he costs $28MM minimum. Add Price to that mix, at $32MMx3, and even fewer teams are in play. It’s basically the Dodgers. Because the NYY won’t be at the table. So it’s the LAD. By default of finances and rivalry.
Other teams are in on other talks, but the LAD are pretty much the only plausible team in on this talk.
the Dodgers are teasing us again.
Dodgers going to bail to Sox our again
Dodgers are interested in everyone , every year , do nothing and then find a Max Muncy. Somehow they pull it out.
Yeah. They win a lot if regular seasonn games.
Price to LAD makes sense, especially with Ryu and Hill gone.
Mookie for Seager, May/Urias/Gonsolin, and 1-2 middle of the pack prospect arms and I’m in. Or Seager and two of: May, Urias, Gonsolin.
HUGE overpay for an expensive 1 year rental. Remember, the market for this rental is like one team, seeing as the NYY are out of it. It’s pretty much the LAD or no one. I mean, who else is in the market for a $28-$30MM OF??? And if the Bosox don’t make this deal, they can pay their high taxes AND go through this again next year. The Dodgers have leverage here.
Not an overpay at all Seager, May, and 1-2 of their depth prospects is a fair deal for the second best outfielder in baseball. You’re forgetting that the Dodgers want to win a World Series now and they can afford to give up those 4 to do it.
The Red Sox can enjoy their taxes and fourth round pick.
And the four WS titles in the past 20 years. Tough decade to be a NY fan Lolol
Dodgers can have Price, Betts, and all of the salary that goes with it if they give us Red Sox a couple of good prospects.
I truly wonder how many WS titles the Dodgers have lost over the last few years with their insistence not to deal any of their top minor league prospects other than Calhoun? My Gawd, they can buy any free agent they want with a proven ML track record instead of hoping their next prospect turns into a perineal All Star. Since Friedman has taken over as Dodgers GM LA has spent well over a billion dollars in payroll, not to mention having the most expensive front office in all of baseball, and still no WS ring. Wow, Gavin Lux had better bring more to the team than Lindor could in 2020.
Friedman and Bloom used to work together in Tampa, right? Maybe discussions have indeed been held.
A Betts/Price combo isn’t going to return much, certainly not equal to what their 2020 production is worth. And the Sox still view themselves as a contender. Can’t see it unless Boston gets a couple of real prospects back. Again, they WANT to get under the “cap”; they don’t HAVE to get under the cap. If Bloom fails to get under, Henry/Warner won’t be happy. But if the cost of getting under is 80 wins, Bloom will be back in Tampa faster than you can say Jonny Gomes.
The Sox have survived 80 wins many times. Their fans are loyal to the bone. And I doubt they’d drop to 80 wins.
Tennessee needs a MLB club ASAP
Assuming the Dodgers really want to add a veteran pitcher and Betts I would expect something more along the lines of Price/Betts and $24 million for Verdugo/White/Gonsolin. I don’t see May or Lux being in the equation. The question is can the Sox stomach not getting May or Lux in the deal, though I would expect they would prefer May.
If the ask is for LAD to take on all of Price’s contract plus the $28 million for (one year of) Betts, then I don’t see much by way of prospects going to BOS. But this is all speculation.
Betts for Verdugo + Ruiz
Betts/Price for Pollock + Ruiz
Betts/Price + cash for Pollock + Ruiz + Gonsolin
The most realistic trade scenario I have heard is the Red Sox sending Betts, Price and $45 million to the Dodgers for Verdugo, May, Gonsolin, and Sheffield.
Betts will will without a doubt get the Red sox a better return than what the Yankees received for a 2 month rental of Chapman.
Paying down half of Price’s contract will make him an attractive piece. For about the same money they paid Hill the past 3 seasons the Dodgers would be getting nearly the same performance (Price 3.82 FIP/122 ERA+, Hill 3.89 FIP/122 ERA+) and 40 more innings.
The Red Sox really don’t care how much money they spend, just how much applies to the CBT and it you trade a player plus cash all the AAV of his contract is removed from the CBT payroll.
I dought LA would include Verdugo, mainly because LA would be weaker in the outfield. Taking 2 outfielders off there major league roster would make without enough outfielders.
la
You repeatedly spam the Chapman trade. After the big deal made over that trade for years it’s never going to happen again unless it’s Trout. Nobody wants to be on the wrong side of the Chapman trade.
This might turn out to be a huge 3 team trade if you add in Lindor, Clevinger, Arenado with Price and Betts
Every Dodger top 15 minor leaguers will be in on it and perhaps 3-5, 25 man roster spots.
I hope the Dodgers get these 5 guys. .If the Sox get Maeda and some good young talent they can use to find a few arms they will need off other Maj. League rosters to be competitive I’d be happy.
What a slog through the comments. Here are the basics: Price has to go with Betts so that the deal makes the most sense for BOS, esp. since the options for moving salary are closing down. Dodgers have to keep Lux and May, or else the deal becomes unattractive to them. These are the points of departure. Therefore, any deal that looks something like Betts, Price, and a few million/yr for Pederson, Verdugo, Gray, and an AA pitching and catching prospect should do it.
That might just do it as long as the Red Sox are sending over at least $30 million.
Pederson is $8-9 million towards the CBT. He could fill a spot for the Red Sox at 1B. Verdugo takes over in RF. Gray is at least a year away, but certainly looked solid through 3 levels last season. Sheffield and Wong are low level prospects that both played in AA last season.
I dought LA would include Verdugo, mainly because LA would be weaker in the outfield. Taking 2 outfielders off there major league roster would make without enough outfielders.
la
No Verdugo or Gray Boston just needs to pay the penalty or take a lot less.
Friedman and company leaking more rumors to make seem like they are trying. I truly dislike this group we have running the show.
Is it worth obtaining Lindor or Bettes?? I mean for what other clubs would have to give up talent wis from their own club?? For example, how many starting pitchers and players would have to go from a team to get one of these players?? Sure, It make you stronger at his position. Where does it make you weaker?? Too many places?? Like the Cardinals fro Lindor??? What would Cleveland ask from the Cards?? Of course Flahnery, but that won’t happen. So Dakota Hudson, Gant, Paul DeJong, Calhoun and Lane Thomas. Does adding Lindor help or hurt. Same with Mookie Bettes for the same players, less DeJong and add O’Neal. That equals more offense but just adds more holes to fill.
Nothing burger
Baseball players are like the stock market. Buy low Sell high. Trout, Harper, Machado, etc all got big contracts with no rings. Not even a playoff slot. Tampa and Oakland both made the playoffs with payrolls near the bottom in the MLB. And l can hear someone saying they never won it all. The trick is to buy hungry talented low cost players and resupply often and as available always pruning for the best available talent. Giving a player big bucks is probably the worst move an owner can make. Pride is definitely not a stronger emotion than greed. So if anyone wants Mookie make an offer for his 2020 season and don’t complain if he is a FA after 2020 or that his WAR drops off after he gets the big bucks.
The Sox Need to get another Western Team in the Mix: The Padres must have some talent in the Upper Minor Leagues…
How about Price and Betts and JBJ– to the Friars for Tommy Pham, Anderson Espinoza, Logan Allen and we take on Myers or Hosmers contract. The Sox sweetin it a bit by adding Cassas, their #1 MinLB player.
Espinoza has had two TJS. Very few overcome that.
Allen was traded last year.
Past that, you want to trade Betts, Price, and Casas for Pham & Hosmer? Not happening, but it would qualify as the worst trade of all time.
He is a Padres fan just trying to get a dead contract of Myers involved. Padres have so many bad contracts and bad players.
I would take Myers in a swap of bad contracts, assuming we get paid off with better prospects. But I wouldn’t even trade Price for Myers contract, let alone have Betts in the deal. And Hosmer is all but untradeable.
@ madmc no!
Why are so many people arguing over something that isn’t even news? This story has been regurgitated 3 or 4 times now…. The Dodgers FO isn’t going to do ANY of this. Not Lindor, not Betts, not Price, not Clevinger… Because of their surplus outfield you “might” see them trad Pederson for an old, washed up arm. Can we move on to real news now? Please?
Not really buying the surplus. Here are some of the issues. Is Verdugo healthy? Can you rely on him for a full 2020 season? I’m sure they have buyer’s remorse right now on Pollock. He’s strictly a RH platoon now and you cannot rely on him for defense at CF. Pederson could be a trade option but he produced very well last year and doesn’t seem like you’re going to get much value for him given what he can give you this year. No point in trading him. If you get Betts, you plug him at RF and move Bellinger to CF which is the best position for him to utilize his athleticism. Keep Joc at LF and maybe platoon him with Pollock or deal Pollock, maybe you ship him to Boston if Boston is going to include Price.
Yup. If the LA fans wanted to make a point that they aren’t giving up a king’s ransom for one year of Betts, that makes sense.
If their point is that the LAD don’t want Betts, then the fans aren’t thinking clearly. I’m a huge fan of a robust farm. But at some point, it almost always makes sense to trade some of the farm for a chance at a ring.
Because people that read these articles have nothing better to do with their life and actually think they are the Head of Baseball Operations of each team.
Vicarious experience baby.
That’s the short answer.
The long answer is that life sucks when there is no baseball being played and it beats going crazy waiting for opening day.
LOL
Or it could be Russian, Iranian or North Korean interference in our baseball OPINE market trying to influence the outcome of the World Series and the Free Agent market driving up ticket prices and making our country less able to defend itself due to the added cost of baseball spending and the diversion of precious economic resources?
But that’s just a hypothetical OPINE on my part even though I don’t actually believe it.
Morosi opines that the Red Sox would want one of the Dodgers’ top young pitchers (i.e. Dustin May or Tony Gonsolin)
———————————————————-
I hate when writers do this. There is no May OR Gonsolin.
Those two are not even close to being substitutes for each other. Had he stayed in the minors, May might be a top-10. Gonsolin is unranked. May is 22.119; Gonsolin is 25.237.
If the RS get lucky, we get May, but probably not. Gonsolin is decent throw-in to work out of the BP.
Trade Rumors is ONE HUGE OPINE for everyone and their mother.
If Morosi wants to be a moron it’s his OPINE.
Perhaps we should create an MLB Trade Rumors OPINE RANKING CONTEST?
See if each OPINE came true?
Of course we’d probably have an OPINE on that topic as well.
An OPINE on offering an OPINE.
LOL
We should rank them.
Past that, the writers should try to be more professional. Betts is some of the worst reporting I’ve ever seen.
Shank from Boston thinks Betts is only a very good player. Some of the writers think that we won’t even get an offer because Betts only has one year left, ignoring the fact that stars get traded every July with two months left.
Other writers think we are getting May + Ruiz + ?. These guys (not all) write for a living, and have no clue as to what Betts is worth.
Gonsolin is the #6 ranked prospect in the Dodgers organization. May is #2.
I hope the LAD agree. IMO, Gonsolin is not nearly as good as May.
Remains to be seen of course but perhaps that’s why May is #2 and Gonsolin is #6. In any case the point was, it is incorrect to say that Gonsolin is unranked.
When I refer to ‘ranked’, it is as a prospect, not a team ranking. All of a team’s prospects are ranked, and most will never make the pros.
IRT to Gonsolin, he was a 9th rounder, never in the top-100, and was still in the minors at age 25. He has some talent, but he was a 3 BB/9 in the minors. I’d rate him as a decent BP arm.
May, OTOH, looks like a beast.
Which is why the Sox want May NOT Gonsolin in any deal for Mookie
maybe you can get Lindor from Cleveland for Gonsolin
Or as the opener when Bloom dumps Price for salary relief
I wonder if LA would consider moving Muncy… he’d be a nice fit for Boston.
Oh sure–Muncey for Betts straight up right?
The Dodgers could probably use another SP. We keep hearing about the Cubs shedding payroll by listening on Bryant, but how about Jon Lester? Could the Dodgers get him?
David Price WOULD help the Sox. I truly think he’s in for a good year as his first half proved and the surgery corrected. If the Sox traded Price and Betts I believe the Dodgers would use this home court advantage to sign Betts long term. Chavez Ravine is incredibly enticing especially with a huge contract. That said, I’d be disappointed if it was only Lux and Joc in return unless entire salary was eaten. Oh, and David Price in the national league is good for 14-16 wins, especially with that offense and pitching in the 3 spot. Use your head man.
With the breaking news that the Red Sox have continued to cheat after being caught previously, will they get hammered and be more apt to move Betts now?
Joc is going to the angles