The Reds have considered a run at Indians shortstop Amed Rosario as an alternative to spending on the free-agent market, reports Mike Puma of the New York Post (Twitter link). MLB Network’s Jon Heyman hears the same, tweeting that while Cincinnati has maintained interest in Didi Gregorius, he might prove too expensive an option.
Cincinnati has rampantly slashed payroll this winter, non-tendering Archie Bradley and Curt Casali despite modest arbitration projections and dumping Raisel Iglesias’ $9.125MM salary in a deal with the Angels. General manager Nick Krall has spoken of reallocating those resources, but to this point the club has yet to put that money back into the roster. Acquiring Rosario, who is owed just $2.4MM after avoiding arbitration earlier in the winter, would represent the team’s only addition to the payroll this offseason.
Puma reported last night that the Indians were receiving trade interest in Rosario, which likely caught some fans off guard given that Rosario was one of the pieces Cleveland received from the Mets in their Francisco Lindor/Carlos Carrasco blockbuster. However, Cleveland has also been slashing payroll this winter — and doing so on an even more extreme level. The Indians also acquired another MLB-ready option at shortstop in Andres Gimenez, who at this point is more highly regarded than Rosario.
It stands to reason that Cleveland could simply have acquired Rosario with an open mind — exploring the trade market for him but also content to carry him into the season. If he were to be flipped to another club, whatever players come back to Cleveland in return could in many ways be considered an extension of the franchise’s return for Lindor and Carrasco.
Still just 25 years old, Rosario was once regarded as one of MLB’s best overall prospects, but he’s yet to display much of that potential in the big leagues. He had a roughly league-average year at the plate in 2019 when he hit .287/.323/.432 with 15 homers and 19 steals, but his offense cratered in 2020. Overall, he’s a .268/.302/.403 hitter (89 wRC+) in more than 1500 big league plate appearances. Rosario was at one point considered an eventual plus defender, but to this point in his career he’s been 21 outs below average, per Statcast’s OAA mark, and has turned in a Defensive Runs Saved mark of -35 in 3306 innings.
Rosario is still young and controlled all the way through the 2023 season, so perhaps the Reds or another interested party believe they can help him tap into the ability that at one point led to Rosario ranking as a consensus top 10 prospect in all of baseball.
Welcome home, Sir Didi–
I wouldn’t be so sure. Phillies really looking for a 1 year deal. I could see them pivoting to a 2b like Wong, and moving Segura to SS.
Scott Lauber of the Philadelphia Inquirer reported that the Phillies prefer not to play Segura at short.
I agree with that decision. But if Didi doesn’t want 1 year, they may need to get creative.
Which would mean Didi had better get creative if he wants to be a starting SS in 2021. A one-year deal at $10 million-plus is better than no deal at all.
to be fair, two years is all that he needs to avoid the 2022 SS logjam.
Can the Phils brass get creative in unloading Jean Segura and his 4 million dollar salary for Rosario or Story or (insert name here)?
I really had high hopes for Jean when he got here, it just hasn’t worked out…that 2016 season seems, like, forever ago. Kingery can handle 2b and CJ Chatham has 2b chops…
Story would rake at CBP…if only for a year
I’m also more than content with DiDi for 1 year
Segura is real solid, even though he has underperformed a bit. If the Phillies want to compete, I don’t know if trading Segura is the answer, but if they can do something real creative and make a splash then sure. Why not? I will say that Kingery’s arm has been a bit of a disappointment, but he has the glove to handle 2B.
Segura makes way more than $4 million.
Yea, I meant 14…..must’ve missed the “1”…..I blame my inability to use my phone NOT as a phone
The Phillies might be interested as well. Although, I will like to see Didi returning to Philadelphia.
@Francys01 definitely agree.
Y’all better hope Didi comes back. Phili’s done a great job being patient this offseason, but it’s time to get it done. Didi is a great fit in that Phili lineup and y’all need all those pieces to compete.
Technically the Reds took on some arbitration payroll with Noe Rodriguez from the Angels in the Raisel Iglesias deal. Otherwise they’ve only added players at league minimum.
Hosmer for HOF
Apparently Nick Senzel is forbidden from playing a position that drafted him to play!
Senzel is much more valuable as a CFr for the Reds.
Senzel can’t stay off the disabled list. He is a non-participant for me until
He proves he can play 85% of a season
Senzel was drafted as a 3B, moved to 2B, then to CF. I don’t think the Reds ever played him at SS.
I think Senzel played ONE game at SS in ST a couple of years ago. Apparently, that was all the Reds needed to see. He is NOT a shortstop.
Initially I thought the Mets might trade Rosario for Gray. Reds could probably swing a Aquino for Rosario trade. Would benefit both teams.
No way Reds would have done Rosie for Sonny straight up.
Probably if it meant Mets eating all Gray’s remaining salary.
A whole 10 mil a year for a bonafide #2 starter. How generous of them.
No fan base values their unproven major leaguers and prospects more than mets fans
Oof, Rosario-Aquino.. I think that would be a major overpay for the Tribe. I think the Reds would have to add a piece
If they did the piece would likely be org filler. Rosario is very close to this is what he is status.
I’m betting he is closer to 2019 than the other years, meaning he’ll reach more if his potential… I see why many might not though
I think 2019 isn’t out of the question, but 2019 also wasn’t that great a year when you factor in his below average glove work. Remember the Mets were considering moving him to CF and/or using him in a utility role.
Reds already weak defensively in the IF going with a mediocre SS not really the best choice unless his bat can carry the glove. Rosario’s really doesn’t even when its been at his best.
Agreed , as a Reds fan , Aquino has a hole in his swing. At best he’s a .250 hitter. When he makes contact it’s fun to watch though
CLE takes that deal in a heartbeat. Their screaming need is OF period. A major league ready OF gets it done with no other prospects needed I would think.
You make it sound like Cincy is doing them a favor, and doesn’t need a SS..
CLE is retooling and isn’t playoff caliber (IMO), where Cincy’s window is now.
Cincy has a much greater need at SS than CLE at OF. With that being said, I’d prefer to try Rosario in the OF before trading for Aquino.. especially if it’s a 1 for 1 trade
Both teams feel like they are 50% in and 50% out. The Indians could use an outfield power bat, so I think a trade with a Rosario for Aquino swap could work for both teams. They fill a hole while not spending too much and without losing an everyday player.
Aquino for Rosario feels right. Rosario is at moment a weaker fielding Galvis. High k, low average, some pop some speed. Aquino has more control, but has been living off that first month of his in the majors. Outside of that he’s been mediocre at best, but perhaps that is just a playing time issue.
I find it highly laughable that anyone thinks that Rosario would be anything but a throw in for any player of any true value like Gray.
I would prefer a pivot to Baltimore and make a package around Rosario for Santander. If Baltimore is trying defer arbitration salary, Cleveland may find the only team not cheaper than them
Would love Santander in Cleveland
I’d like to think CLE would jump on that deal without hesitation
Rosario+ for Santander would be cash neutral and the Orioles just signed Galvis. The Indians, OTOH, could’ve had Santander had they kept him protected in the rule 5 a few years back!
Rosario could play second or third, Baltimore still has holes in the infield and more outfielders to try at the big leagues. We know Santander was a rule 5 guy. Hard to believe anyone would pouch a guy from high A and keep him on the roster the whole year…aided by a trip to the injured reserve. Still would love to have him back
I called this at the end of the 2020 season. I was sure the Reds would swing the deal with the Mets. But, when he was traded to the Indians, I knew he wouldn’t stick around. Not an exciting move by the Reds but, very predictable.
I really do like the Rosario for Aquino trade idea. As a Reds fan, there are shortstops that I would much rather have, like Story or Correa, but Rosario is a fine shortstop, and we don’t really need Aquino anyway, and Cleveland does, so it should work out. Or maybe Cleveland could flip Aquino then to Seattle for pitching help. So here’s a trade idea that I just came up with…
Reds get: SS Amed Rosario
Indians get: RHP Erik Swanson, PTBNL (from SEA), cash (from CIN)
Mariners get: OF Aristides Aquino
If you are trading for Story or Correa just sign Didi. Correa can’t stay on the field at all, and Story is a Coors product. Both would just be a one year stop gap. Rather have the prospect talent that both would cost and either Didi or some meh filler. Rosario would be ok, but I believe he’s far closer to meh then above average.
If the Reds were going to go one year stop gap, Simmons would have been perfect for what he signed for.
There’s no such thing as a “Coors product.” Complete myth. Rockies hitters when moved to other teams hit just fine. Often better.
Such as? Story is awful on the road, so was Tulo. I’m sure there were some that evened out and were solid with other teams, but I can’t think of any that left Coors and went to be better with other teams.
What isn’t a myth at all, but fact is that Story has avg 1.048 OPS at Coors and only .774 everywhere else the last two years
His weak arguement will be djm, who went from one hitters park to another…lol but your largely correct most players fall off 15/25 percent in production once they move home fields.
Indians don’t need pitching help.. they need ML level OF’ers.. including the Mariners isn’t needed…
Totally agree to the point that this winter will be an overall failure if they don’t come away with at least one major league ready OF.
Aquino was a one month wonder. The Indians have no need for Swanson.
My sources are telling me the deal will be Ahmed Rosario and Bradley Zimmer for Nick Senzel
Don’t know why the Reds would make that trade. They’d be selling low on Senzel.
The question is why, but we know the answer because he is inexpensive. LOL
Rosario will be the bad penny that keeps surfacing everywhere.
Rangers could use Aquino, especially if they trade Gallo at some point, Perhaps Calhoun, Tejeda, for Aquino and PTBNL. Lowe DH Guzman 1B and Aquino 4th OF until Gallo decision is made or LF if for some reason Dahl doesn’t work out.
So you are saying that the Rangers would trade Willie Calhoun and Anderson Tejeda for Aristides Aquino and a PTBNL? Heck, as a Reds fan, I would make that deal every day of the week, man, that is a lot of value for Aquino.
Calhoun already probably as good as Aquino. Tejeda really similar to Garcia with Reds, rushed because of COVID, likely would have spent 2020 in high A or AA if not for that.
I likely take that if I’m the Reds considering the PTBNL likely would not be anyone of importance, but it really wouldn’t fill the SS black hole they have now.
I think Rosario to the Phillies is a good match. They need a SS, they need to conserve money for other needs, and I don’t expect that Rosario will break the bank in terms of prospects. Cleveland likely always expecting to flip him.
I don’t like the idea of Cleveland trading Rosario just for his development’s sake. Moving around that much as a young player would really give you a lot to work on (in your personal life) right before the season. Cleveland should instead trade Ramirez for a haul, but noooo…
What do you think about a Ranger trade for Aquino as there are no real in house options to replace Gallo if traded at some point or Dahl if injury bug bites again.
I don’t think it’d happen. I think we might re-sign Santana right about now, but that’s it. He can play outfield and 3B, so it fills all our needs, and we wouldn’t have to give up anything in a trade. I also think that Aquino needs all the playing time he can get rn, and he wouldn’t get that here. We have Calhoun, Guzman, and Lowe all filling up that DH spot.
Aquinos numbers overall better than Calhoun or Santana and he can actually play in OF. Middle of the line up 22-26 of Jung, Lowe, Huff Aquino perhaps Dahl if he still around looks pretty good. As for as AB goes, Dahl has a heavy injury history, and Santana not part of Ranger’s future. The cost would likely not be much perhaps Tejeda or Apostel. Tejeda not a future starter and Apostel blocked at 1b and 3b for years to come, so he is expendable as is Tejeda.
The only reason Aquino’s numbers are better than Calhoun’s is because Calhoun broke his jaw pre-2020 and had an entire year of mentally debilitating play. He’ll be back with a vengeance in 21′, and I have no problem sticking him at DH.
We will be getting plenty of OF’s via Leclerc and Gallo trades at the deadline, and tbh I don’t see the point of trading for Aquino when you have a stopgap in Santana. I know he’s not a part of the future, but he’ll be the bridge to another young OF’er.
We don’t need Aquino, and we definatley aren’t trading Tejeda or Apostel for him.
It sounds like the Indians are cooking up something..
Jon Heyman claimed the Indians had several irons in the fire..
In order to engage other teams.. the Indians need to be able to offer both a shortstop and a 3B & be willing to swap out starting pitching.. With Rosario & Ramirez.. the permutations of a three team deal could be real and coming soon..
Reds and Indians make a lot of deals together.. too
As inexpensive as Ramirez is, I doubt Cleveland would trade him for anything short of a king’s random.
Cleveland would be thrilled if the ransom, king’s or otherwise, included at least one ML OF’er and another prospect level OF’er. The Indians outfield was embarrassing last year…and are in desparate need of an infusion of talent… if not for 2021.. but for 2022 and beyond..
You mean 2023 or 2024 and beyond. Trading Ramirez and starting pitching from the current team would eliminate the Indians for the next 2-3 years at least. What a waste of Cleveland’s starting pitching that they currently have in my opinion.
No.. I don’t mean 2023/24.. I mean competing in the second half of 2021 and moreso in 2022 and beyond WHILE THE INDIANS PITCHING STAFF IS INTACT… There are six to nine more SP’s coming in the Indians system that will be brought along IF they aren’t traded away.. That’s what the Indians front office means when they say..thread the needle..
The waste is having a pitching staff that is as good as the indians have and not have anyone that can hit the ball/score runs.. This is why a deal with Rosario could be in the offing.. very soon..
Trading Rosario, fine. Reread your comment above: “AND BE WILLING TO SWAP OUT STARTING PITCHING.” Trading Ramirez and Plesac, like you tout here and on several other sites, for the returns you want, takes the Indians out for 2021 and 2022 for sure. . By the time your return is ready, the Indians will have to be moving Bieber and the rebuild would continue on. Your moves would also block several strong future pieces from the Indian farm system. I am very glad that Chris Antonetti and Mike Chernoff are running the Indians and not you.
Exactly right, HJ, gson is completely off-track on the Tribe and its approach.to remaining competitive. You simply cannot deal Ramirez and remain in touch with the playoffs.
Other than thinning the abundant starting depth by dealing Carassco (necessitated, evidently by Lindor’s pedestrian last two years and absurd contract this year) there isn’t a single thing the Tribe has done this year that doesn’t represent a sound baseball move for both now and in the future.
Just stop with the “trading Jose Ramirez” garbage. It ain’t happening.
Just stop with the “trading Jose Ramirez” garbage. It ain’t happening.
Why not? Perhaps I missed someone, but don’t all Indian players gt traded before their contact expires?
Cap & Crunch
If the Indians are out of the race at the deadline I think its 70%+ Jose is dealt
If they are in sub 10%
Before the season starts probably sub 10% as well unless they are just blown away
For the record I think they are very much alive in the Central today- They need a little luck but if Mercado and Zimmer step up, Franmil mashes and they get a good lefty platoon for Luplow I think they can do damage w that staff and upside pen
~ Atl and LAD I think would be the 2 big hitters if he was made avail but there would certainly be 10-15 teams calling
If you can’t tell the difference between Lindor and Ramirez, I can’t help you.
Lindor wouldn’t have been dealt had he been performing at the superstar level he’s being paid for rather than the crappy .190 BA wRISP over the last 200 games. By the time we did deal him, most in the industry knew he wasn’t worth what he was going to be paid. I hope he plays out the season refusing an extension, hits .258 again, and heads into free agency with a dozen other shortstops. Not that I’m bitter or anything that he hasn’t had three big hits since game 2 of the 2017 ALDS!
Indians are cooking up 3rd place.
I am sure he hasn’t bought a house in cleveland yet and they haven’t started changing his mechanics. He will be just fine.
**waves tiny Reds flag**
who amongst us has not considered Amed Rosario, and all the implications that carries?
Rosario is the starting short stop for a team who will go into the season looking to compete in the AL Central. No way they trade him for a completely unproven piece in Aquino. Rosario is for sure at a low point in value, but no where near that low!
Jonathan India was the 5th pick in 2018. He hasn’t lived up to the hype, but is blocked in cincy where he may be able to play 2nd or 3rd (trade pending) for Indians. He’d be a good headliner return.
and maybe a flame thrower like Kuhnel
That’ll give Indians 3 more pieces to consider next season and fix the ss hole in cincy.
I doubt the reds would do India for Rosario straight up let alone adding a couple of other pieces.
This. But also The Indians have already shifted their number one prospect Nolan Jones from 3B to 1B for a better path to the Major League roster as it seems Ramirez isn’t going anywhere. Aquino with a pair of minor leaguers makes sense. Indians get an OF or DH who if they can get him back to when he first came up can crush the ball. I think Tribe fans would enjoy watching Aquino and Reyes crushing baseballs
Nolan Jones is working in the OF….Cleveland (as always) has a plan to compete. They will trade Rosario for an OF or sign a cheap one. Everyone thinks they will be awful. They will be fine….trust in the front office
I think India’s status has declined some.
India did well last year at the alternate site. Can’t see the Reds trading him. He is the future at second or third base.
Bot, you truly aren’t a Reds (or an MLB) fan anymore. India, Aquino, and Kuhnel for Rosario? Like alc said, the Reds wouldn’t do India for Rosario straight up.
And Rosario IS NOT the starting SS for the Indians this year. That would be Andres Gimenez.
Thanks for playing though.
Y’all gotta stop including Aquino as a centerpiece on trades. the guy might be able to rebound, but looks like a clear one year wonder
Naaa…what he needs is regular AB’s and a manager with half a clue…
I agree, I’m not impressed. If I’m CLE, I look elsewhere before Aquino. Including, trying Rosario out in the OF..
Santander and Frazier makes more sense IF they’re looking to trade, IMO
Maybe, Reddick, Villar, Pillar, Duvall, Goodwin, Mazara if they go FA
After more than 400 MLB games, Rosario still doesn’t look comfortable at shortstop. His instincts are poor. Bad defense can cancel out good pitching, which is supposed to be the Reds’ strength. Rosario also has a career WAR of just 2.3. He gives away at-bats, hardly ever walks, and is a disturbingly bad baserunner for a player with his speed. He needs to stop trying to steal bases, which is what happened in 2020 as he was thrown out in his one attempt. The only “value” he brings to the table is that he doesn’t make much money. I was surprised Cleveland took him in the trade with the Mets.
I’m sure this is true of some other organizations but the Mets have a history of over hyping their prospects. When I think back to Alex Escobar, F-Mart, Lastings Milledge, the common theme is impressive raw tools that never fully developed. I believe Rosario is in this mold but who knows? Maybe the Mets have been lacking in minor league instruction and another organization can unlock Rosario’s potential.
meckert, that could be. It’s as if some players are left to figure it out for themselves. Rosario is maddening to watch. On defense, he has a knack for momentarily hesitating or shifting his body the wrong way on balls hit toward him. Then Gimenez comes along and is the polar opposite. Two players in the same organization. It seems instinctive in both cases.
Lastings Milledge??? Hahahaha! As a former minor league grinder….that’s a blast from the past. He threw me out tagging from third.
I love people arguing with me on here, its great when Im right, it should happen more often haha
Gimenez is the Indians SS in 2021. Rosario is trade bait.
Pretty clear to anyone who has seen the two guys play. The Indians are about pitching and defense.
“Gimenez is the Indians SS in 2021. Rosario is trade bait.”
This is the right decision.
Jonathan Villar might be cheaper..since he only costs FA money. Should be gettable on a 1 yr deal.
Or play Kingery there and let him be for one year .
Didi wants multiple years.. Phils should offer 2/29. Both would avoid next year’s monster market at short .
Gregorius has about a 5% chance of landing in CIN. Phillies ARE his market at this point. Rosario is right up the Reds’ alley in terms of salary and years of control.
Being a Mets fan, I’ve watched Rosario play quite a bit and wouldn’t be surprised if he winds up as an above-average every day player. With that said, I’ve seen people mention Cleveland getting Aquino or Gray back in exchange for Rosario, which seems like a huge overpay by Cincy.
Rosario’s value is greater than Aquino’s… according to several evaluation sites. Gray is vastly more valuable than Rosario..
The Aquino for Rosario fit is pretty good.. too…if the two teams are actually discussing a deal..
I checked out Baseball Trade Values and was surprised that they have Rosario ahead of Aquino. Although Aquino probably isn’t the player he was in 2019. I’m interested to see how Rosario’s career plays out.
As we saw with Realmuto and are starting to see with Bauer the markets for certain players are seemingly one horse races. The Phillies need a SS and Didi needs a team. Phillies should offer 2/30, Didi still plays decent defense and probably hits 30 HR’s in a full season there and the second year keeps him out of the SS free-for-all thats coming next winter
Ok, Steve, you have our attention. Continue with the thought.
No thanks. I still can’t get over the fact that I let Iglesias go and traded for galvis, my bad.
Nick Senzel is on his way to Cleveland!
Shane Bieber on his way to Cincy!
Oh wake up.
I think it would be smart for the Indians to trade Rosario. Gimenez looks like the better shortstop, and Cesar Hernandez would be the better choice as second base (assuming the deal gets finalized). With the shortstops in the system, I don’t think the Indians would need Rosario. With his upside, he could be a great low-cost option for someone.
Rosario is just toolsey but doesn’t have a distinguished tool among them. NEVER walks, horrible OBP, is fast but not elite fast. Can’t steal and has really no instincts. Mets didn’t hype him he was rated overall #2 prospect in baseball. He will never be good.
The Indians will soon face a very big roster crunch with a bunch of highly thought of MIF prospects all hitting Rule Five at the same time. They have to trade several MIFs soon. They dont need prospects.
In spite of trading four SPs in the last eighteen months, they don’t need pitching. What they obviously need is power hitting outfield help and/or a real 1B.
Aquino is a one month wonder, a non prospect who came up and had a career in a month. Good for him, but he has very little, if any, value. At most, he is a throw in in any decent size trade….certainly not close to enough for Rosario.
If you look at what Cleveland needs and what Cincinnati has, begin with Winker, a left hand corner bat.
Rosario is a weak glove, weak OBP, ok average, ok pop, ok speed SS. He doesn’t really do anything great. His best year he was deemed around league average and the Mets were looking to move him to another position or to the bench as a utility player.
I agree that he has move value then Aquino who absolutely was a one month wonder, though he did have a good year in AAA as well that year and at least was somewhat well regarded in Reds system in years prior.
Winker though, while I think he’s a platoon DH, offers more then Rosario. He gets on base a ton and has good power.
If the cost is Winker I rather just get VIllar on the cheap.
BEGIN with Winker? Yeah right. Just like the other suggestion that the Reds should trade Gray for Rosario.
Winker is way > Rosario.
That’s just laughable. No way you get Winker for Rosario. Arguably the Reds best pure hitter at this point, for a SS that as everyone on here pointed out has major flaws in his game, and has likely become exactly what he is going to be…go back to sleep.
“Roughly league average year… .287 BA…”
I’ve seen other posts where it will describe a .262 average as if it was qualifying for the triple crown.
Not only that but they gloss over low averages (Gardner’s .223 2020) like it’s barely worth mentioning, then turn around talk about so-and-so’s “dreadful” .271 performance.
Is Amed Rosario on the block? I thought cleveland had him pegged as lindor’s replacement?
If Cleveland is actually trying to flip, Mets should try to get him back.
Assuming they don’t get Bryant or someone else to play 3b, you have Rosario serving as a back up SS splitting 2b with McNeil while McNeil splits 3b with Davis.
Great flexibility and depth.
If the mets felt that strongly about him they wouldn’t have included him in the trade.
I can see the reds doing anything. Most incompetent team in baseball.
As a Reds fan I agree with this statement
Nick Senzel, Jonathon India , and Tejay Antone for Trevor Story. No source, just gut. My first post. Years of reading. Thx.
First post I’ve seen where I would consider moving Senzel.