The Braves had some talks with the Rockies about Nolan Arenado before the star third baseman was dealt to the Cardinals, The Athletic’s Ken Rosenthal reports (subscription required). Rosenthal also sheds some light on one of last offseason’s more intriguing rumors, the talks between the Rockies and Cubs about a trade involving both Arenado and Kris Bryant. Jason Heyward was also part of the negotiations at one point as the Cubs looked for payroll offset for Arenado’s contract, though the Rockies weren’t interested in adding any money beyond the 2021 season (which marks the end of Bryant’s current contract and when Arenado could have exercised his opt-out clause).
As Rosenthal notes, the Cubs could end up looking back on those talks as “a what-might-have-been” given that they’ll now be facing Arenado on a regular basis in the NL Central. From Colorado’s perspective, such a trade might not have been a clear win if a Rockies-bound Bryant had suffered a similar run of injuries that hampered him in the actual 2020 season, but it still might have drawn better reviews than their trade package from St. Louis. “Rival executives remain baffled by the deal,” Rosenthal writes, as the Rox rather inexplicably worked themselves into an unsalvageable situation with their best player.
More from the NL West…
- Also from Rosenthal, the Diamondbacks have been receiving some interest in Eduardo Escobar but the team doesn’t appear to much interest at the moment. If a trade happens at all, it might not happen until closer to the trade deadline if the Snakes aren’t in contention, since Arizona would want to give Escobar a chance to rebuild some proper trade value. Escobar struggled to a .212/.270/.335 slash line over 222 plate appearances last season, a major step down from his very solid performance in 2018-19. Signed to a three-year extension in October 2018, Escobar is also scheduled to hit free agency next winter, so he has all the more incentive for a bounce-back year.
- Brandon Belt underwent heel surgery in October, and the Giants didn’t give any specific timeline as to when the first baseman could be back in action. President of baseball operations Farhan Zaidi shed a bit more light on the subject when talking to reporters (including Alex Pavlovic of NBC Sports Bay Area) this week, saying Belt was “not a certainty” and only “a possibility” to play on Opening Day. On the plus side, Zaidi said the team has been pleased by Belt’s rehab thus far, and more will be known once they get a look at Belt during Spring Training. Belt is coming off a huge year for San Francisco, though the team should be able to make do in the event of a relatively brief absence for Belt, due to the number of players on the roster with first base experience — Wilmer Flores, Austin Slater, Darin Ruf, regular catcher Buster Posey, and new addition Tommy La Stella.
As an angel fan, im even embarrassed for the cubs
Mike Trout being in the playoffs one time is what’s embarrassing. You should save your embarrassment for your own team.
Nice comeback
True.
Fire!
There’s always 2021 in the AL West.
I was commiserating, but while we’re here, at least we have an ownership group thats trying. I dont like Arte, but I appreciate the effort. The ricketts believe their fans are idiots. I genuinely hope yall find happiness.
What do you mean by effort? Spending? The cubs outspent the Angels from 2016-2020.
You were not commiserating, you were taking a shot at the Cubs and their fans. Chicago has been much more successful this century, and overall. I’m embarrassed for you–good call on those bloated salaries that did not even bring you an alcs appearance.
The cubs have been running top tier payrolls since they started contending again. Its only this year that they’ve taken any significant cuts, and even right now without any other additions they’re at around 155 million. They were consistently in the luxury tax or knocking on the door until 2021. With the uncertainty surrounding their core players, the 1.1 billion dollar renovations at Wrigley and in the surrounding area that the Rickett’s financed themselves AND had to pay the city of Chicago (as opposed to most other teams, including the cross town white sox who essentially get the city to help offset their construction fees), and what appears to be a generational free agent class in 2022, waiting to spend the lion’s share of their budget when there is more clarity seems like a better idea than just blindly throwing money around when there are 4-5 teams clearly better than they are in their own league.
BOOM
The Halos need a few arms. Send him to the Mets and we’ll give you Peterson, 2 of the 3 we got from Toronto and we’ll throw in Dom Smith.
Nobody in baseball should be more embarrassed than the cub organization!
For what?
Zing !!!!
Mike Trout is overhyped. Allot easier to perform when you are on a last place team every year
@Immthomas Oh great, another jealous Mike Trout hater. No, being a team that is in last place does not make it easier for a baseball player to perform better, that is just a purely ignorant assertion. You’re just probably mad because your team doesnt have one of the greatest players of all time on there roster. And before you try to say otherwise, this is coming from a lifelong A’s fan. Sit down.
Imagine being a snarky Angels fan lol
Bec as use 2002 is so much more recent than 2016?
@bkbk Looks like everyone’s against you here bud. You can step off your soapbox now.
Bryant + Heyward for Arenado would have incredible for the Cubs, but Cubs would have had to add like 6 prospects…
Actually, that would make too much sense. The Cubs could have just grabbed 2-3 guys off the street, called them “prospects” and the Rockies would have taken that deal for Arenado. That’s what the Cardinals did.
Getting out from heywards deal would have been nice.
Yea, not many big deals like that are viewed as terrible deals right from the start, but most everyone was knocking that deal, considering he got superstar money, when really he’s only a superstar defender.
I was on board with the Chatwood signing. I was wrong.
I was against the Darvish signing. I would say I wasn’t right or wrong on it.
I was against the Kimbrel signing. I was right.
I was against the Heyward signing. I was right.
Going forward, I hope they keep only Rizzo and Hendricks for fan appeal, and sell off everyone else to rebuild. Biggest mistake I hope they don’t make: giving Baez a high-price deal. The dude is a shortstop version of Alfonso Soriano. Power, no walks, lots of Ks.
Obviously they need to consult you before making any deals.
You were wrong about darvish
EXACTLY!!!
Posey to first and Bart behind the dish seems like it makes sense if Belt is unable to start the year.
Posey at first makes no sense whatsoever. Posey’s bat is not first base material. Even if he hits aagin, his value is at catcher, and the Giants—as mentioned in the post—have much better alternatives at first base. PS- Joey Bart is not ready.
Yep, @Pete hit the nail on the head. He’s exactly right (IMO).
Bart isnt far off, though…he hit the ball HARD in his brief time last summer. It doesnt show on paper…but the son of a gun put bat to wood. He had those type of knocks that draw your attention. He’s going to be back quick and he’ll hit.
Dock_Elvis:
Bart is at least a year away. He played 22 games at AA, and zero games at AAA. And catchers need more time in development than any other position. Being an effective catcher takes way more than hitting the ball hard.
really? The Bart I saw looked lost at the plate, flailing at pitches out of the zone…
The Bart you saw in the majors in 2020, yup. The Bart that was at Richmond, San Jose and Georgia Tech just needs a couple years to be ready for the best.
A year off may help Posey’s bat. But I still agree, his value is mostly as a catcher. Give Bart two more years in the minors and Bart will hit for good average and power by 2024.
how does a year changing diapers help Posey’s bat?
Nego:
Actually that makes zero sense. Posey is vastly more valuable catching, and Bart needs to be developing at AAA. Posey catching and anyone of the listed potential fill-ins make much more sense.
Would have liked to see arenado on Braves would have made them arguably the best offense in league. Now he will waste away on the lowly cards
Braves are obviously legit but Cards probably more likely to make the playoffs just because of weak division. Obviously they’ll probably both make playoffs but hard to see how anyone is going to “waste away” or how they’re “lowly”.
No one likes the cardinals
Miggy4perez….awwwee…did the cardinals hurt your feelings
If all it takes is making the playoffs with no chance of winning by all means. Braves have a great fan base and adding a legit piece in arenado for relatively nothing fills a need Braves have had since chipper jones left. Braves were so close to beating the dodgers with that offense, except they don’t want to spend.
And that offense is returning with more experience and improved/healthy rotation that should be better than 23rd in MLB. Always easier when your rookies don’t have to start your most important games, but they’re better for it.
@Tatsumaki Can’t really count the Cardinals out if they get to the playoffs. Both times in 06 and 11 they were far from the best team and won it all.
2021 pecking order is Dodgers, Padres, Braves and Cardinals in that order. Mets and Nats fighting for wild card spots.
The Cardinals are not more likely to make the playoffs than Atlanta. Atlanta is in the playoffs period. They’re about the third or 4th best team in baseball, and the ones ahead of them are not in the NL East.
Just hope the Braves don’t have to face the Cardinals in the playoffs…odds are not great for the Braves with that match up
@Cards81: This.
3rd or 4rth best team with questionable starting pitching. They’ll probably get in but I don’t trust the Braves as a strong team.
Castrovince at MLB.com rated the Braves rotation as sixth best in baseball. Most rotations have question marks.
Nailed it.
lol probably would have still been a better return than what they ultimately got. Giving him away is too kind an assessment.
Everyone seems mystified by the Arenado deal, but why would a team be willing to give up more than the Cards did? If Arenado plays well for them, he’ll likely opt out after one year. No one wants to give up a huge haul for one year of anyone. More importantly, if he plays less well, he sticks around and his massive salary becomes an albatross around the neck of the franchise. Colorado had the same problem and just needed a way to get out from under it. They were able to shed &160+MM in salary obligations and picked up five mediocre prospects in the process. I still think they could look a lot smarter than the Cards in 2-3 years. In addition, it’s not like Colorado’s willingness to deal Arenado was a secret. If any other team had been willing to offer more, wouldn’t the Rockies have taken it instead of the Cardinal’s offer? Everyone seems to think they should have gotten more, but that feels like an irrational line of reasoning to me. It was a crap contract, both for the Rockies and for whoever took him. Colorado’s mistake was structuring the extension the way they did, not this year’s move to jettison him.
The Rockies are not an intelligently run organization. You heard it from me first. I am a glorious male with keen insight and a sixth sense for truths that others cannot see. I leap from life to life, striving to put right what once went wrong, and hoping each time that my next leap will be the leap home…
The trade gave him an extra season on his current contract. That’s a ton of incentive not to opt out.
Arenado has said he doesn’t plan to opt out…not saying that if the cardinals suck he won’t opt out…but considering that the contract is already maxed out IMO and that the cardinals not being contenders is really unlikely…I think this is a guaranteed contract at this point…the cardinals top 5 prospects will be MLB ready in the next two years and the cardinals have a ton of money coming off the books in the next two years…the Cardinals will be fine
If Arenado trends downward, he will certainly not opt out. The Cardinals may still be fine, but not as fine as they would have been with their $25MM per year back.
You’re asking the wrong question. It’s not that anyone is shocked the Cardinals paid so little. Everyone is shocked the Rockies excepted so little. My guess on why the Braves didn’t go through with the deal is finances. They had already spent on Morton and Smyly while the Cardinals had spent very little.
Also, I really don’t see Arenado opting out even if he has a 300/400/550 slash line at the end of the season. We really don’t know how much healthier the market is going to be next offseason. It would be quite a risk walking away from $30+ million a year.
ATL has been connected to Arenado for over a year – and considering Arenado’s desire to leave COL hasn’t changed, only building – I can’t imagine ATL spending $26M on 2 1-year contracts affected their ability to take on that deal. The amount STL is assuming is essentially Freeman’s extension, if you believe that Goldy’s STL extension provides a blueprint for Freeman’s extension. That being said, while AA has done well enough to be able to afford both, I can’t imagine he’d want to assume the type of risk that he has not shown since arriving in ATL. I can imagine that will change when things have gotten “more normal,” but who knows?
Remember when the Nats came back from a 19-31 start to win the WS
Nope
Pepperidge Farm remembers…
In the long run, I’ll likely be happier that the Braves didn’t get NA. Massive contract alone would have crippled the Braves a decent amount and he just doesn’t hit the same away as he did at Co. so there are legitimate concern if his performance will maintain. (I personally think he will be good).
Heel surgery is really, really bad news for Belt and Giants fans. Cespedes, Tulowitzki, Matt Duffy … you never know how things will work out, but guys just don’t seem to bounce back well from heel surgery.
Gomez Toth:
Depends on what the issue was. Achilles tendon issues? yes that’s bad. But I think Belt’s problem was bone spurs, which are less of a problem.
exactly, with 2021 being the last year of his contract, we may have seen the last of this Brandon…
The Cubs (and their fans) are suckers. lol
The white Sox (and their fans) have been enjoying a 12 year rebuild in a division that was probably the worst in baseball for 10 of those years. There some suckers in Chicago but it’s not the cubs. Lol
Hahaha, ok sucker! Keep selling out that dump in Wriggleyville and paying for Da Mark-EE network. I’m sure the Cubs will continue to spend all that money on a scrub roster to make a one-and-done wildcard (yeah right).
Just think of the roster you COULD’VE had for $155MM. The Cubs had a chance to trade for Yellich, but they didn’t wanna part with ADDISON FREAKING RUSSELL, and SCHWARBER. LOLOL. Justin Verlander WANTED TP BE A CUB, and you clowns said no because why? LOLOL. Now Arenado? Meanwhile, the Cubs spend their top prospects on absolute sCrUBs and one-year rent-a-wrecks. SUCKERS.
I see I hit a nerve. Lol Just be happy the white Sox might win a division title in the next 3 years.
They could have won one last year. The Cubs practically laid down for the Sox in the last game of the season.
And by the way if you pay for cable in the Chicago market, you are paying for both NBC Sports Chicago and Marquee, even if you don’t care to watch the games.
This is just another comment where ChiSoxCity picks some crap out of his brain with no sense of time or context.
Why are Cubs fans SOOOOO gullible. You completely ignored the point about the Cubs screwing up every opportunity to improve their roster by the numbers, despite record breaking revenues for many years. SUCKERS.
What trade talks about Yelich between the Cubs and Marlins? Verlander to the Cubs never got far because Avila was looking for a Sale type return and he had to settle for the Astros at literally the last minute. Arenado would have cost Cubs prospects along with KB because his value hadn’t tanked like it did over 2020 since he didn’t hit well.
All those players you listed together would blow right thru the luxury tax threshold. All teams that have gone over it including the Yankees, Dodgers, and Red Sox have made a concerted effort to get back under it. It’s all part of the owners’ scheme to suppress player payroll because they use it as a de facto salary cap.
Bart will not be up this year unless injury to Posey and even then he would be a back up.
Congrats for Cardinals , Bauer on Dodgers so Dodgers will dominate during Arenado’s career with cards . Smart Cubs saved money it’s Dodgers for next 10 years
Arenado wasn’t the Rockies best player anymore (that was Story or possibly Marquez). I wish him the best, but I have a feeling the Cards are gonna be regretting this in about two years at most. That’s their window. Because it’s flyover territory and the Rox only played West division teams last season, not a whole lot of reporters or executives saw them. Nolan looked terrible. He was hurt but not enough to affect his defense. He looked like a declining offensive player to me.
Riley+Inciarte+Daysbel Hernandez for Bryant. Who says no?
Braves
Nolan had a No Trade clause. He was only going to a contender, so that eliminates most of the league. The Rox were not sending him to the Dodgers or Padres, so that narrows the field even more.
If the Rockies had received a better offer that included Nolan’s approval, I’m guessing they would have taken it. Would love to know what other teams were offering.
Braves & Yankees come to mind as the only other teams Nolan might consider who had an opening at 3B and $ to do a deal.
Hey chisoxcity, how’s that Fernando Tatis trade working out? Also at least players wanted to be a cub. Don’t hear anyone saying they want to be a chisox unless they are way overpaid as like Grandad and Liam Hendricks are. Good luck with Tony LaBOOZA!
I don’t know. How’s that Eloy Jimenez/Dylan Cease for Quintana trade working out for the Cubs? Oh, wait…
Who the heck is asking to be a Cub now? Nobody, that’s who. Bryant can’t wait to get out of there. Good thing for you, the White Sox are poised yo dominate the league for atleast the next five years. Nuff talk. ChiSoxCity out!
Nope
Well that eloy/cease trade was for one of the scrubs you must have been talking about. That scrub came from your own team! Also I said “wanted” to be a cub. Wanted is past tense, not present! But oh yeah, most Sox fans can’t comprehend that. Bryant is from Vegas, never wanted to come to Chicago. You go play in the cold for 3 months out of the year( April, may, October) when you come from warmth year round. BTW, Eloy is just a DH, he’s atrocious in the outfield. Good luck beating the twins.
Exactly
Jesus! Heyward has 3 more years on his contract? That will be very difficult to move. Was thinking if the dodgers could take him to get Bryant/Baez but $23M for the next 3 years for Heyward is a lot.
I think the Cubs need to go get scooter gennett on the cheap!
Ok, I am going off topic here. If the Houston Texans have destroyed their relationship with Deshaun Watson, why couldn’t they work out a deal with Jacksonville? Houston would trade Watson, the Texan’s 1st round pick in both 2022 and 2023, all for Jacksonville’s 2021 number 1 overall pick, which would be Trevor Lawrence. Maybe Jacksonville would send back a couple of 4th round picks as well.
Why for Jacksonville? Trevor Lawrence looks great, but he is just an unproven prospect who had a superior offensive line to protect him in college compared to the defenses that he faced. Deshaun Watson is a known commodity. Add two first round picks and that package is superior to taking Lawrence as unproven eggs in a basket.
Why for Houston? If it is too late for them to make nice with Watson, the runner up deal is trading Watson to the Jets to get Justin Fields, Trey Lance or most likely Zach Wilson. I’d rather surrender the picks to Jacksonville on the chance that Lawrence is the generational talent than some scouts believe him to be.
Braves only wanted Arenado and $40 million. Rockies thought they were lowballing.
2 questions for Giants’ fans: 1) Belt’s contract expires at the end of the year. Do they even attempt to bring him back, or let him walk? He’d take the QO in a heartbeat which is why Zaidi probably wouldn’t extend it. 2) Buster Posey is set to make $22M in 2022, but SF can buy him out at $3M. What is the likeliest outcome there?
1) Belt could be back, especially since they don’t have any 1B prospects knocking at the door. But we’ll have to see if he can stay healthy and perform again this year.
2) SF will decline his option. The question is if they will then bring him back. We will have to see how the season goes, but as long as he is still a plus defender and solid hitter I’d be shocked if they didn’t bring him back, especially considering his open wishes to retire a Giant. I also wouldn’t count out a big Posey rebound—he’s a year further removed from his hip surgery, he was crushing the ball in Spring training, the new hitting coaches helped the other Giants vets find success, and he’s apparently in fantastic shape. Him hitting .290/.360 with 12 HRs would not shock me, and I think it’s more likely he ends up closer to those numbers than his 2019 numbers and the numbers expected by many counting on his continued regression.
Belt’s numbers in 2020 were career best. He was very hot in the second half, although still not much of the power the Giants always hoped for. With a bum heel, he’s got to return in 2021 and put up the same numbers otherwise, the Giants will probably let him walk.
WarrenSpahn:
You’re equating HRs with power. HRs are a major factor in power, but there’s more to it than just HRs. Belt has a career ISO of .190, so obviously he has power. Oracle is very punitive to LHHs in limiting HRs. Belt has 138 career HRs and 84 of those were hit on the road, as opposed to 54 at home. If Belt played in a less pitcher-friendly park, especially one that really tough on lefties, no one would be saying he lacks power.
Belt had 149 ABs. How is that a huge year? He has always had hot streaks then slumped badly as the season wore on. Belt is what he is.
Joe Ferguson:
“Belt is what he is.” Yes, what he is is underrated, especially from fans that don’t understand, or refuse to look at, stats. He has a career OPS+ of 122. That’s ranks him 20th among active players with a minimum of 3,000 PAs or 500 games.
That’s better than Machado (121), Arenado (120), Khris Davis (119), Ozuna (117), and Hosmer (108), to name a few.