JUNE 23: Civale has been diagnosed with a sprained right middle finger, Mandy Bell of MLB.com was among those to relay. He’ll be shut down from throwing for the next week or two and isn’t expected to return to the field for four-to-five weeks.
JUNE 22: Indians right-hander Aaron Civale left last night’s start with an injury to his right middle finger, and it seems it’ll keep him out of action for a while. Manager Terry Francona told reporters (including Zack Meisel of the Athletic) Civale will meet with a hand specialist tomorrow. The club will know more specifics about his condition then, but Francona added they’re “prepared that he’s going to miss some time.”
An extended absence for Civale is a tough blow to a Cleveland staff already without Shane Bieber and Zach Plesac. Civale has tossed an MLB-leading 97 2/3 innings this year and been quite effective. The 26-year-old has a 3.32 ERA/4.31 SIERA. Civale doesn’t miss many bats (19.8% strikeout rate) but he also rarely hands out free passes (6.0% walk percentage) and does a decent job of keeping the ball on the ground (45.3% grounder rate).
At 40-30, Cleveland has stayed in close contention in both the American League Central and Wild Card races. That’s largely been on the strength of that top half of the rotation, though. Bieber, Plesac and Civale have all been better than average at keeping runs off the board, but there’s been little in the way of reliability behind that now-injured trio. Cal Quantrill has been good when called upon but worked mostly out of the bullpen this year. The rest of Cleveland’s depth starters (Triston McKenzie, Sam Hentges, Logan Allen, Jean Mejia and Eli Morgan) have struggled.
It remains to be seen if the Indians can weather this series of injuries to their top pitchers and stay in contention. In addition to their now-exclusively unproven group of starters, the Cleveland lineup has been below-average all season. To their credit, Indians relievers have been quite good, helping them to a 12-7 record in one-run ballgames. They’ll need continued excellence from the bullpen (and perhaps some unexpected contributions from their young starters and/or the bottom of the order) to stick with the White Sox, who lead the division by two games.
I’ll just guess he fractured his middle finger and may return in September, I guess near the same amount of time Framber Valdez missed.
Where are you seeing this?
He said he’s guessing.
After seeing it happen, and the close up that followed, I’m betting on it being some sort of ligament/tendon injury. He was purposely squeezing the baseball after it happened, which is why I’m thinking it’s most likely that.
Yeah. It looked to be a trigger finger type injury, which probably requires surgery. So, at a minimum, he’s looking at a similar timetable to Plesac.
American League pitcher batting in a National League park. My guess is he may have injured it swinging (foul ball) in the top of the 5th. Might have caught a stinger in the hand/finger and tried to pitch through it. Just guessing….
No.. bad guess..
Bad guess based on what?
If I’m cleveland I’m taking a flier on fixing Shelby Miller, despite other teams not being able to do so. In addition I would contact Scott Kazmir and Bartolo and any other grizzled vet available to fill some innings. There isn’t really anything to lose at this point beyond the roster spot
Sounds great but you can’t take short term fliers on long term projects. Also, they’re probably stuck with picking what’s left from their 40 man roster as these guys are too hurt to pitch but not hurt long enough to go to the 60 day DL and free up a spot. Signing somebody not on that 40 requires exposing a player they probably don’t want to risk losing.
I agree, but at this point we need to throw some vets out there just to fill innings to avoid bullpen arms falling off. The roster spot and loss of a player would certainly be an issue though as you said
Agreed. They already have an issue this off season with several players who need to be placed on the 40 man or they could potentially lose them. It shows how successful their international signings and trades have been over the last few years. My guess is they run out the youngsters, see what they have- even though Francona never plays rookies. If they fade, they need to start packaging young players so they can get something from those who need the protection.
Why would they do that? I thought Cleveland had enough starting pitching depth replace him in house?
At least that’s what Indians fans said when they traded Clevinger, Kluber and Bauer…
If you’re gonna try to troll, do a better job. Injuries have decimated the rotation not a lack of depth. Due to covid and the lack of a minor league season the depth you mention has inning concerns or has missed out on a season of experience and development or both. Not to mention Clevinger, kluber, and Carrasco are all injured currently and Bauer is overpaid.
Who’s trolling? According to Indians fans when they traded those guys they had enough rotation depth to withstand anything, including injuries and inning concerns.
Also, they didn’t know Clevinger, Kluber and Carrasco would get injured when they traded them and Bauer certainly wasn’t overpaid last year.
You’re right, they’re foolish for trying to work within a budget and dealing from depth. Having the depth to be able to deal a 1-3 pitcher and everybody slide up one spot in the pecking order while getting key pieces to put elsewhere is one thing, they should have known they’d blow through so many starters they’re looking at AA guys that haven’t pitched in 2 years and trying to piece together 9 innings. What they’re experiencing right now is so common it should have been easy to predict.
“You’re right, they’re foolish for trying to work within a budget and dealing from depth.”
1. If they have to trade for another starter now then clearly they didn’t have depth.
2. This is detrimental to “working within a budget” because now they are going to have to pay through the nose for a replacement at the deadline.
“Having the depth to be able to deal a 1-3 pitcher and everybody slide up one spot in the pecking order while getting key pieces to put elsewhere is one thing…”
Clearly they don’t have the depth to do that.
“… they should have known they’d blow through so many starters they’re looking at AA guys that haven’t pitched in 2 years and trying to piece together 9 innings.”
When you are constantly trading away your best SP’s, then yeah, that is a possible outcome. If the Indians were rebuilding then it would be an acceptable outcome but when they are trying to contend that is not a risk they should take. They need to add to the team they got, not subtract from it. They already wasted Lindor and Kluber’s best years. They gonna do the same to Bieber now?
They had the depth to trade a starter because they balanced costs and roster limitations with options etc. NOBODY has the depth to sustain losing the entire starting rotation and doing so means they do not have to pay through the nose because no team can sustain the losses they have and still be buyers. But we’re all so glad you have a crystal ball to know what nobody anywhere could envision. Your work is done here, time to run along and troll somewhere else.
They don’t have the depth or the team Polish. Remove exposed you, badly. Re-read what he wrote. He’s right. Accept it.
Thanks, means so much coming from one troll vouching for another. And he’s right, they should’ve never traded any starters, they should’ve kept Kluber, Carrasco and Clevinger, all hurt now BTW, and ponied up the money they didn’t have to pay them and then dig deeper to pay Bauer. And then they didn’t trade them they’ve have AA kids all playing the field and filling the other spots that are currently filled by those brought back by the trades. And by not trading any starters the guys like Bieber, Plesac and others would never gotten the chance to step up. If you guys were disappointed Tribe fans would be one thing, but you have no purpose here other than to troll. Move along.
@Polish Hammer like I said. They are now talking about adding a starter. So no. They affirmatively did NOT have the depth to trade a starter. They could really use one of the guys they traded right now. A lot more than they could use whoever they they in return.
While not trading Bauer wouldn’t have helped them this year cuz he was a FA, they didn’t know that Kluber, Clevinger and Carrasco would get hurt after they traded them. So can YOU let me borrow YOUR crystal ball that told me those guys would get hurt?
Injuries to the incumbent starters would have opened the door for Plesac, Bieber and whoever else to get the chance to start if they hadn’t traded those other guys. They were never going to be blocked completely in the Indians rotation.
How do you not understand trading Kluber, Clevinger and Carrasco because they could no longer afford them and it gave them a chance to fill out the various holes in the organization and allowed them to advance the pitchers they had in the season? They will never have the funding to go all in and spend like the big boys, so trying to remain competitive while in a market their size is extremely difficult. They’ve done a damn good good of remaining competitive. Nobody could foresee them being decimated like this. Keep living in hindsight with the would’ve could’ve should’ve or just trolling while the true Tribe fans get it.
I’ve not seen them discuss adding a pitcher. I’ve seen the media discuss it and fans like us, but not team officials.
You state they could really use one of the pitchers that were traded except all but Bauer were injured, so how exactly would they help? You’re basically speaking out of both sides of your mouth.
In both the Clevinger trade and Bauer trade pitchers came back to Cleveland, one of which is currently in the rotation (Cal Quantrill) and two others have injury concerns (Scott Moss and Logan Allen).
You state that the team had no way of knowing that the pitchers they traded away would be injured. While they may not have been able to give an exact date of injury, it’s not difficult to conclude that aging pitchers with high workloads and/or violent biomechanics are at a higher risk of injury. Plus there is predictive injury modeling available and from what I remember seeing both Clevinger and Kluber were towards to top of the list for injury risk.
@Polish Hammer How do YOU not understand that they absolutely COULD afford Kluber, Clevinger and Carrasco, that keeping them would not have stopped them from advancing the other pitchers they have and that they will now have to pay even MORE to replace them????
“They will never have the funding to go all in and spend like the big boys…”
They might not have to go ALL in. But contenders don’t trade away their core players in the middle of playoff push. And when they try to it doesn’t work. With their scouting and development being among the best in MLB, the Indians seem to me like a team that would be contending for World Series titles year in and year out if they were only willing to keep their team together.
“Keep living in hindsight with the would’ve could’ve should’ve or just trolling while the true Tribe fans get it.”
And YOU keep living in the hindsight of Clevinger, Kluber and Carrasco getting injured 🙂
“You state they could really use one of the pitchers that were traded except all but Bauer were injured, so how exactly would they help?”
Nice try. They didn’t know those guys would get injured when they traded them. And if they did then the other teams’ GM’s probably have a legitimate case to have those trades nixed or renegotiated.
“In both the Clevinger trade and Bauer trade pitchers came back to Cleveland, one of which is currently in the rotation (Cal Quantrill) and two others have injury concerns (Scott Moss and Logan Allen).”
None of those guys are anywhere near as good as a (healthy) Mike Clevinger or Trevor Bauer.
All teams analyze injury risk and the players undergo extensive physical exams prior to a trade is finalized especially when a player is higher risk like those you mentioned. In these cases the acquiring teams acknowledged the risk and accepted there may be injury which there was.
At no point did I claim Quantrill et al are as good as Bauer or Clevinger. However, Bauer would no longer be on the team this year due to free agency and Clevinger is currently injured
@Burgeezy you are right that they would have lost Bauer last offseason anyway, but it’s not like they couldn’t have used a(nother) Cy Young winner last year. And can I borrow your crystal ball since you clearly knew that Mike Clevinger would get injured?
Look at his biomechanics and workload, it’s not difficult to predict.
This entire thread has been about the current pitching situation and now because you have nothing else to argue you’ve moved the goal post in the conversation to include last season. Your arguments are weak and circular
Thank you great seer of the future. How are my future great-grandchildren doing?
You have none. You are a eunuch
Lol sure buddy
More to the point. The Indians’ “depth” is overstated and truly well-run organizations don’t trade core players in the middle of their windows. You have to go all the way back to 2004 to find just one example of that actually working.
You’re definitely trolling…. And on top of that do you see how much depth they truly have? They have a few guys that are having off years so they had to be sent down (happens to the best of em) along with multiple injury’s to the starting rotation. Not 1 guy that was here opening day is available to pitch. Because of a year of seasoning being took from developing pitchers it’s taking awhile to get them fully extended (totally understandable) so they can get up to a regular pitch count. They literally have 4-5 new pitchers as the starting rotation and look how well they have done! Once the ORIGINAL 3 injured starters come back we’ll have no problem having a full 5 man rotation. Loving Eli Morgan, he seems to have great stuff. You realize the point of trading “a GrEaT StArTiNg pItChEr” in the last year of arbitration / contract is to get even more depth and a solid arm for years to come, right? Okay troll, hopefully you had your listening ears on today so you could pick up on some reality….. And on top of that, please show me exactly where Cleveland fans where saying “we have so much depth even “iNjUrIeS AnD InNiNg cOnCeRnS CoUlDn’T StOp uS” tf
@IndianRye no, it’s not trolling to express an opinion you happen to disagree with buttercup. And they have no depth. Hence then having to turn to a bunch of unproven guys in the event of injury.
“You realize the point of trading “a GrEaT StArTiNg pItChEr” in the last year of arbitration / contract is to get even more depth and a solid arm for years to come, right?”
You are thinking like a rebuilding team. The Indians are not a rebuilding team. They need to add to the team they got, not subtract from it. A championship is worth 200x more than “more depth and a solid arm for years to come.” This is why the Dodgers aren’t trading Corey Seager. Why the Astros aren’t trading Zack Greinke. Why the Cubs aren’t trading Kris Bryant. Etc. Don’t you think those teams could get even better returns for those players? By your logic, they need to ship them out NOW, potential postseason run notwithstanding.
“And on top of that, please show me exactly where Cleveland fans where saying “we have so much depth even “iNjUrIeS AnD InNiNg cOnCeRnS CoUlDn’T StOp uS” tf”
Go look at the thread about them trading Clevinger buttercup.
Now that I have educated you, try to post smarter comments and not be so egotistical. Have a nice night!
Buttercup? How did you know my wife’s nickname for me? Anyways … Yeah you’re comments definitely weren’t education worthy. How do you expect to educate someone when you constantly think you’re right? No give only take I see, what a shame. You named the dodgers, cubs and Astros who are a hell of a lot bigger market wise so again think before you comment. They can sign a big contract for every damn position, the indians learned quickly that as a small-mid market team you have to give AND take. Look how long they have been competitive, do you not understand that it’s because they trade a single big named guy and get 5 players back in return usually. That’s how management of a small market dynasty works and that’s how the behind the scenes works also, something you CLEARLY know nothing about lmao just sad that you think you are correct while almost every single person disagreed and the only account that agreed with you had your writing style, so nice try hahaha so are you really saying unproven guys aren’t depth? Lmao that’s the DEFINITION of depth! Not every single player has major league service time wtf they are STILL depth. Lil one you’re literally making me facepalm at the ignorance of your comments. If you trade 1 player that’s a pitcher and get 4 players in return, 2 pitchers a SS and a LF, you literally just ADDED DEPTH to P, SS and LF. How do you not understand that lmao I looked, NOT ONE PERSON said Cleveland had depth tO tAkE cArE Of iNjUrIeS aNd iNnInG CoNcErNs lmao do you see how much you’re making me laugh? Aren’t you embarrassed…. alright lil man my wife just got home and wants to go upstairs to bed, oddly enough she said “babygirl I love you so much buttercup” and I know what that means ;p
I expect to educate you because you clearly don’t know a thing about baseball. What does it matter if the Dodgers, Cubs and Astros have bigger market shares? If you trade a core player, you have to sign someone as good or better to replace them or your team will slip in the standings. The Indians were never going to get anyone as good as Clevinger, Kluber, Bauer or Carrasco for less $ in free agency when they traded them. So they had even MORE of a reason to hold onto their core than those other teams did.
The Indians have been on the fringes of contention for a while now, but the only year they’ve even come close to a title was 2016 (which not surprisingly was the year they actually bought at the deadline rather than selling off core pieces). If you’d rather barely sneak into the playoffs most years only to get bounced in the first round than that’s one thing. But for more teams, the goal is a championship.
No. Unproven guys are not depth. When you are in win-now mode like the Indians you can’t afford to wait on those guys to figure it out in the majors. You need guys who you know can get it done. That you don’t see that is honestly pretty embarrassing.
No one on this page believes your story about being married.
I hope you enjoyed this lil’ education session that I have given you. I hope you also realize the importance of keeping the guys who are the reason your team is even within striking distance of the playoffs in the first place. You haven’t given me much reason to, but I still have faith in you buttercup. Now go out there and make some smarter comments.
Ohhhhh the troll doesn’t believe I’m married how sad, I’m so hurt by the troll’s thoughts on a strangers marriage lmao come on lil one, you think that’s supposed to hurt me? Haha my marriage has nothing to do with you so you can keep trying to talk about it or move tf on 🙂 it’s still depth anyway you look at it, just because you say otherwise doesn’t make it true when literally every single one of us knows it’s depth. So you have fun thinking you look cool or something, when we all know you aren’t. Hasn’t mommy called you up from your troll themed basement yet? Anyway…. Yes, I would rather “sNeAk iNtO tHe PlAyoFfS eVeRy yEaR” then be Texas or Minnesota. Sign the big players and be let down? Or sign the little guys and be amazed when they come through, see the difference? Baseball is a sport, you want amazing moments to occur, so since you don’t understand that or the definition of depth, you clearly know nothing about baseball. It’s sad that you try to have a life on a sports form and still get called out on it lmao go watch a 90s movie with Jim Carrey and his one word catch phrase describes you hahaha and sorry about that, my comments can’t become “SmaRtEr” lmao terrible usage of sentence structure but I’ll let that pass because I’m sure your mommy hasn’t paid her electric bill during the pandemic. You’re in my prayers. Hopefully they trade every big player we ever get in their last year of arbitration so we can continue to be contenders for another 30 years. If they don’t wanna buy at the trade deadline, why don’t you send them 10m so they will? A baseball team owner is out to make money, don’t you understand anything about owning a business? It’s not to make you feel special lmao it’s to get by on the minimum so they can MAKE the MOST money. Business 101 lmao and I already explained what those teams had to do with it *facepalm ready lil buddy? Are you sure? Okay I’ll speak slowly…. They. Are. Bigger. Market. Teams. So. They. Usually. Sell. More. In. Tickets. And. So. Forth. So. they. Can. Dish. Out. More. Money. To. Big. Name. Players. Hopefully that educated you, but in reality I’m sure you didn’t understand one thing huh lil one? Lmao dang it, there she is again screaming buttercup! Doesn’t she understand I’m a big girl that runs out of breath!!!!! ;P
Holy run-on Batman!
Ok, let’s just go over the highlights…
You’re the troll. No one believes your stories about being married or cares. The Indians might have depth but certainly not MAJOR LEAGUE DEPTH and certainly not enough to make up for the core players they trade away. If you are okay with barely squeaking into the playoffs most years only to get bounced in the first round then I guess that is your choice, I guess. That type of thinking is why the Indians have the longest active championship drought. You are right that a baseball team’s owner’s job isn’t to make me, you or anyone else feel special. It is to WIN A CHAMPIONSHIP. And you simply aren’t going to do that by trading away your core players, the reason you are even within striking distance of the playoffs in the first place, in the middle of your window. It doesn’t matter if those other teams have more money. No team, rich, poor or otherwise, can get away with trading their core players in the middle of their window. If anything, teams like the Dodgers can MORE easily afford to trade their stars in the middle of their window than the Indians because they can afford to sign equal or better replacements in FA while the Indians can’t.
It’s probably a waste of time for me to give you these education sessions but maybe there is hope for you yet. Have a nice night!
Batman has nothing to do with this so I have no idea why you think he’s going to save you *facepalm. When you’re wrong, you’re wrong. Batman can’t save you from that lil one. I love that you think I’ve said 1 “sToRy” about my wife lmao so on top of not knowing what depth is, you don’t know how to read? You gotta get your stuff together lady, not one thing has been said about her. I mentioned her once because you said the nickname she calls me, but the only one that keeps bringing her up is YOU lmao so whenever you’re done talking about it, it’ll go away. And best believe you care or you would have stfu about her already hahaha
Rookie ball-AAA is DEPTH I’m not going to keep telling you that. You might not wanna CALL UP a rookie ball player but you COULD at ANY MOMENT, lil one you need to understand that *face freaking palm.
It’s NOT to win a championship are you serious? It’s LITERALLY to EARN the MOST MONEY possible! Just because you have a championship caliber team doesn’t mean 1. you’re going to earn the most money possible or 2. That you’re going to win the world series title. So if you can spend the least amount possible and squeak into the playoffs I guarantee you most people would go that route. If you’re team can “SNeAk” into the playoffs every year you’re doing something right, you know why? “BEcAuSe ThEy aRe iN ThE PlAyOfFs eVeRy yEaR” come on you gotta at least understand that right?
The problem with you is the fact you think you can educate some random woman on a sports form lmao you spew ignorance, so what you need to do is go into a live physical “EdUcAtIon sEsSiOn” aka elementary school (I’m sure they’ll accept you immediately) to get a understanding of how life works. Money is the most important thing…. to a fan, it’s a chance of a championship. Which oddly enough the Indians offer to their fan base. Probably couldn’t tell that over the whining in your head tho, so I’ll let that pass. Oh and, the dodgers only broke their drought because of the pandemic shortened season. What about the Cubs lady? It was more then 100 years and they had how many HOF players, big named players and big contract players? You’re welcome.
Ohhhhhh how scary that you called me a troll lmao idc if you think I’m one or not, I know I’M not and YOU are. That’s all that matters haha
Dang it lil one, I heard my nickname buttercup again, so I’ll definitely have a goodnight! Thank you so much for understanding why I can’t always be on here 🙂
IndianRye, what you’ve just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent comment were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this thread is now dumber for having read it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
Listen sweetie, please STOP commenting. It’s getting on my nerves lmao I’m not gonna read your last comment or any other one you write again on this thread. Can you not move on from things? I’m sure it says something about my wife again or that “DePtH AiN’T ReAl” lmao so like I said before I’m not going to keep explaining it to you. You have a wonderful night and learn to get off your knees. Buttercup is out, I’ve had a lonnnnnnngggggggg night again, do you not understand that lady?
It’s game over when the other player bows out buttercup.
Indians still aren’t going to win anything until they learn to add to the core rather than subtracting. It’s a real shame too because they are up there with the Dodgers in developing young talent. At least on the pitching side. A team like that SHOULD be a title contender.
What Indians fans said that? Not real ones. This isn’t a recent thing. This is how Cleveland does it. They buy out arbitration, if they can, and trade them when they can’t afford them anymore. In the mean time, they develop more pitching. Not a single intelligent fan would say they had enough pitching to watch the reigning Cy Young winner and 2 proven starters go down for an extended period at the same time. No one. You’re trying to imply that Cleveland’s pitching was never very good, which simply isn’t true. If that wasn’t your implication, you’re just trying to troll. Pick one or the other, because you’re not good at either.
“What Indians fans said that?”
“You’re trying to imply that Cleveland’s pitching was never very good, which simply isn’t true.”
No. I am saying that their “depth” was overrated. That they didn’t have enough depth to sell off their best SP’s and still contend. And that they aren’t retroactively redeemed because Kluber, Clevinger and Carrasco got hurt because they didn’t know they would get hurt when they traded them.
Gtf- Cleveland’s pitching is good for the AL Central. Not in the East or West. Indians franchise showing no urgency or desire to win. Whole lot of hope and bad competition.
If they played in the East or West they’d be accused of beating up on their weak teams like Baltimore and Texas. They build their team to win their division and get to the playoffs.
Teams should be buying up the low cost flyers by the arm load. Flesh out your minor league rosters and protect your young, legitimate prospects. Not much downside to minor league deals. If you find yourself with a surplus of arms, somebody will pay for them. Proactive front offices have a chance to turn this crazy season into a win for their organizations, but they have to drop conventional wisdom and think outside the box.
Problem is loading up on these guys and taking innings or ABs away from the real prospects that need the full development experience on the way up.
They do. A big problem is that a lot of those guys are young and are hurt (or both). Injuries have forced a few youngsters to be called up now rather than July/august.
Curly Was The Smart Stooge
Since it was his middle finger that was damaged, give us the Byrd………Paul Byrd, he’s only 50. He’s in that Bartolo age group. Stranger things have happened.
It’s odd to me that the White Sox’ offense, expected to be their strength this year, has been decimated by injuries, while the Indians’ rotation, their expected strength, has also gotten hit the hardest. The AL Central is a war of attrition. At least fans of both teams can be glad that Minnesota is a dumpster fire.
This, combined with a brutal July schedule, may be the end of a nice storyline for this season. CWS should have a ten game lead by the end of July.
Love your online name.