Angels right-hander Austin Warren will require Tommy John surgery, reports Sam Blum of The Athletic.
Warren, 27, was placed on the injured list in late April due to right elbow inflammation. About a week later, it was reported that he would be shut down from throwing for about four to six weeks, but it didn’t seem like surgery was on the table at that time. Unfortunately, further testing must have revealed the issue was more serious than initially thought and he will now have to go under the knife, following Jose Quijada as the second Angel to require TJS this week.
A sixth-round pick in the 2018 draft, Warren made his way up to the big leagues in 2021. He posted a 3.47 ERA in 36 1/3 innings over that season and 2022, striking out just 18.8% of batters faced but with a solid 6.5% walk rate and 45.9% ground ball rate. He was designated for assignment in January but cleared waivers, sticking with the organization and getting re-selected in April this year.
Warren will now miss the remainder of the season and likely the first half of 2024 as well. If there’s one small silver lining in this awful news for Warren, it’s that it happened after he was called up to the big leagues. That means he will collect a big league salary and service time while spending the rest of the year on the injured list, which would not have been the case if he suffered the injury prior to rejoining the 40-man roster.
Angels keeping the TJ docs in business
Another Angel RP bites the dust. This team is solid and will go as far as the bullpen allows.
Every MLB Pitcher that has TJS owes Tommy John $$$$$$.
Ouch. Angels bullpen issues getting worse.
More proof you don’t follow the Angels. . Silseth and Devinski have been recently added and both have a positive WPA and have pitched very well. Quijada and Warren both had negative WPA.
Silseth had a .90 ERA in the PCL as a starter. The bullpen issues are clearing up.
Quijada was solid last year and didn’t give up a run in his first 4 innings this season. It was in the 2 outings that preceded his injury that he got rocked. But I agree that Silseth has looked good so far.
He was erratic last year. He’s not my favorite RP because you never knew when he’d do a Mitch Wild Thing Williams.
Because he doesn’t command the strike zone, but does strike people out, opinions of his effectiveness vary.
I’d much rather have Silseth than either one of them. As far as Devenski? too soon to tell. But I’m glad he was out there instead of Quijada the last two appearances.
OOOOOO. WPA in a handful of appearances and 9 IP. Give me an f’ing break WPA starts to be a viable stat at 150 IP. About 3 YEARS for a reliever. At least learn what the stats mean before trying to use them
Silseth’s .000 BABIP, 11.8% SO rate, 17% BB rate,and 4.36 FIP indicate he WILL regress towards the mean. A 300 point increase in the BABIP against him and his inability to miss bats as evidenced by that incredibly low K/9 will make that ERA look ugly in a few more appearances.
Losing a guy that has a 3.55 ERA over 32 appearances hurts and any fan with even a modicum of common sense realizes that. If nothing else it hurts depth.
So please go away. When a Padres fan knows more about the team you are a fan of than you do, it really makes all Angels fans look bad.
Ohh ERA in a handful of appearances is so helpful. Sarcasm. The Angels pen has blown seven games where they had the clear advantage. Nothing I know of tell that story better than WPA.
But you don’t know this because you know about, but you keep on embarrassing yourself.
ERA for a guy is a very misleading stat.
32 appearances vs 3. Let’s see, which one has even a SHOT at being a true measure of their ability?
Warren didn’t blow 7 leads. He blew none this season. He pitched in 2 games. One he came in for the 9th in a game the Angels were already behind and he gave up no runs in his 1 IP. In the 2nd game he came in with the Angels behind, struck out 1 to end the end the 6th inning, then the Angels scored 3 in the top of the next inning to take the lead by 2 and he gave up 1 run on a solo home run to Bobby Witt in the bottom of the 7th.
WPA tells NO story in 5 IP. Nothing. At. All. That you are STILL trying to use it when the minimum is 150 IP to give you ANY indication of performance is asinine at best.
Silseth has come into a blow out game, and then two middle relief appearances with no high leverage at bats. He has one of the lowest SO rates and highest BB rates in baseball and his FIP and BABIP point to serious regression coming. That you don’t get that and are trying to use a stat that takes 150 IP to have any type of accuracy is astounding.
You keep on showing how little you know about baseball but are apparently too ignorant to be embarrassed by your complete lack of knowledge of the game.
BTW, how many fingers do you have on one hand? 32 is WAY more than a handful. But then, its you saying it, so we understand.
You think Warren was effective this year in his two games.
Even when you look it up you don’t know how to read data. You’re so stupid.
Yes that one win where he came in with two outs and a man on first and got out of the inning. The the Angels scored two runs, and he gave one of the runs back was such a thing of beauty.
Man you’re and idiot.
Keep shouting your troll nonsense.
A couple things about Ben Joyce. The first thing is he has great stuff, but whatever he throws, he doesn’t always know where it is going.
The other thing is he doesn’t pitch in back to back games. He has done once since high school and that was in college.
The bullpen is constantly shorthanded since they go 4-5 innings night in and night out. Part of it due to it is early in the season and the starters are not going deep and the other reason is just the starters have been inconsistent. Adding a guy that doesn’t pitch in back to back days will only add to the stress on the bullpen. It is bad enough the team is currently carrying 9 starters on the 26 man roster.
Maybe later in the season when Joyce is getting out AA hitters consistently and the starters are going 6-7 innings a night, you can afford to add a guy like Joyce, but not now.
I’m waiting for Joyce to be called up.
I really want to see that 104-105 FB of his. Some batters may not since he has been wild in the minors this season. Joyce has not pitched since the 28th. Is he hurt too?
Of course you want him up here. He’s not close to ready. Not with that control
Ryne Duren 2.0.
I read he would purposely throw a fastball at the back stop when a batter was walking up to HP. That and wear those Coke bottle glasses.
Why we gotta be aggresive, bruh? Chillll. Obviously sucks to lose depth, but it is what it is. There’s other guys out there.
Man, another Angel getting Tommy John surgery?
The last two years Warren has been really bad. I’d rather have him in AAA then on the IL, but this won’t hurt the team. Quijada has already been replaced by a better RP.
Warren has a LOWER ERA and FIP than Silseth. So if Warren has been bad, what does that say about your boy Silseth?
go ahead and speak about needing 150 ip for stats to look viable, and yet use a sample size of one month to further your narrative.
Who pitches 150 innings anymore? Kinda difficult when you are limited to 5 innings a start and end up needing Tommy John Surgery like half the pitchers now.
Its over 3 seasons for Warren and 2 for Silseth, not FIVE IP this season for Silseth. At least pull your head out before trying to comment.
It was a bit of sarcasm. Didn’t think you’d get dramatic with it. Sorry.
There you go with ERA. And not only that, The ERA of a starter who who was the first player up from the 21 draft vs a 27 year old RP.
More proof you know nothing about the Angels. Or baseball in general for that matter.
Warrens ERA over the last two years is over 5.5. But it’s 16 innings so only an idiot cares. Enter Pads Fan.
So Warrens ERA IS lower than Silseths. Thanks for admitting I was right.
Silseth has 5 IP this season, so only an idiot cares about his WPA.
Time to rid myself of stupid in my feed.
Ghost of Tommy John strikes again.
He’s still around. Gotta be close to 80 now.
That sucks. I’ve interviewed Austin. Great kid who has worked super hard to get here.
Does this mean Ky Bush or Sam Bachman get the call? I think it’s still too early for Joyce… right?
Joyce, like Adell, can’t control the strike zone. Neither is ready until they can
Not controlling the strike zone is good. Hitters won’t dig in with a 105 mph fast ball coming in.
“Effectively wild” can be a benefit.
I heard he’s at 102 in AA. I don’t know for a fact, but that’s what I remember pod casters saying.
But I don’t want to bring up a guy who can’t throw strikes.
Warren was already on the shelf so this development isn’t even going to necessitate a roster move. Bush is hurt and hasn’t pitched this year. Joyce and the 2021 draftees that were good last year are all having command issues. Can’t be effectively wild in the bigs if you’re walking 15-20% of batters faced in AA like those guys are
TJS: A growth business.
How many is that this week?
I’ve got a tyler oneill and a jordan hicks you can have. How about an adell and lower level 25 to 30 prospect going back
At least he got back onto the 40 in time
I blame the pitch clock. Guys are having to rush their delivery and it screws with their mechanics.
Maybe, but I think it’s a stretch to blame it for Warren or Quijada.
The pitch clock has been in the minor leagues. It wasn’t much of an adjustment for Warren. And Quijada injury was more likely caused by missing spring training and working in the WBC than this.
Well there seems to be an inordinate amount so far…like 4 this week alone.
Horse sheet. The pitch clock has nothing to do with the amount of TJ surgeries. What do you blame for all the other TJ surgeries in years past???? Pitchers trying for max velocity with every pitch has more to do with it.
CH – You are reading something I didn’t say. I’ll try to explain. I didn’t say that all TJ surgeries are the result of the newly instituted pitch clock.. What I did say was that there seems to be an inordinate number of TJ injuries this season after just a little more than a month of play, which has to be attributed to something. I believe there were four announced this week alone. Making a pitcher rush his delivery can screw with his mechanics and could possibly contribute to injury. I have zero expertise, as I’m sure is the same with you. I suggest it because it’s the only variable that has changed for pitchers that could explain it.
“Pitchers trying for max velocity with every pitch has more to do with it.”
Pitchers trying for max velocity with every pitch is nothing new. And, if I’m not mistaken, elbow injuries are more attributed to throwing curveballs than fastballs. So max velocity has little or nothing to do with elbow injuries resulting in TJ surgery.
Pitchers trying for max velocity with every pitch is nothing new.. That’s why the numbers have climbed over the years, There has not been a huge increase of TJ surgery this year over years past.
Agreed. Throwing the ball 95+ is unhealthy for anyone.. TJS could happen at any given moment. Some bodies can just take the abuse better than others.
I can’t believe someone is comparing Silseth to Warren. Silseth has already helped the Angels win 2 games.
Warren has pitched two games. Came in twice with two outs. One time he allowed two inherited runners to score, which virtually gave the Angels no chance of winning the game, the other he allowed 1 run in and 1/3 inning.
Man, non Angel fans are stupid for coming on this board and pretending they know something.
How about those Angels!
Yeah baby!!!! With Loup on the DL, this pen is taking shape.
Barria 2.21
Estévez 1.08
Man, WHAT a bullpen!
LOOK at those ERAs!
I don’t care about ERA nearly as much as WPA. Does an RP give his team a better chance to win or a worse chance?
If you are allowing inherited runners to score, then you are giving them a worse chance, but your ERA is zero. If you pitch around errors, you are giving your team a better chance, if you don’t, your ERA is zero, but the team has less of a chance.
If Barria caves after the Rendon error, his ERA is zero, but he gives the team no shot to win.
WPA is a stupid stat to judge relief pitchers. It is heavily influenced by unearned runs. The Angels lead baseball in unearned runs. It is hard to blame a RP for something they have no control over. Those that do are just backwards thinkers. It must be the reason no one that knows what they are talking about uses WPA for pitchers.
It’s just common sense. If you give a team 4 outs instead 3 the chances and base runner or an extra base, the chances of scoring go up dramatically. Also, if the first batter reaches base, the team has about a 38-40% chance of scoring that inning.
You haven’t been right about anything else, so that makes me feel better about the stat.
Let’s see.
This offseason, you said the Angel’s bullpen has no talent and will be the worst bullpen in the league. Your basis was they were last on projections. I explained to you the Angels will be much better if the team scores runs like expected. Let’s see, the Angels are 7th in run scores, and first in bullpen fwar. I know it’s early, but huge advantage me.
You complained about the Estevez signing. You said he isn’t able to strike out anyone. Like most posters, We dog piled you and said he will be much better outside of Colorado. There has been countless articles about the science of how Coors limits movement and 30 years of data of good pitchers becoming bad in Colorado. Again, it’s early, but huge advantage me and everyone else.
You said you have a source that said Arte Moreno doesn’t like to spend money. Yet in the past two years, he sighed Iglesias, Tepera, Loup, Bradley, Moore, and Estevez. This seems like a lot of money spent on the bullpen, even if you take away Iglesias. I think you need a new source because it doesnt seem to pass a basic fact check.
Yes, I said Detmers would be good and I have been wrong thus far, but the season is still young. I still believe he is better than he has showing. At least, I can admit when I am wrong.
However, I’ve been doing this a long time, though no where near as much I used to in a former life. I still get things wrong sometimes, but I am not wrong about WPA being used for relievers. Relievers can only get outs. WPA numbers can be enhanced by offensive numbers or defensive numbers. These are things beyond the relief pitcher’s control.
Every stat has value. When some clown says a stat is “stupid” they are the stupid one.
So what’s the point trying to communicate with that person?
A lot of smart people think Detmers will be good, I’m in good company. Right now Detmers reminds me of early Lackey.
That what my source said, and since Rex Hudler waived at my source as I was sitting in VIP seats in KC, and since my source got me a private tour with Bob Kendrick of the Negro League Baseball Museum I believe my source.
The fact that Perry did get him to spend money on RPs says good things about Perry. Just bad things about his ability to spend money on the right BP guy.
My source also got me seats ten rows behind home plate at the All+Star game and has been on MLB network a few times and is mentioned by the hosts occasionally.
That’s a very cool story and I can imagine a memory that won’t be forgotten.
We don’t agree on much, but since you said something nice about Perry and met the Wonder Dog., maybe you’re not such a bad guy.
You seem to punk a lot of commenters on here, halo. You should stop.
However, having spent lots of time in KC, and catching both the Royals and the NLBM myself… I’m glad you got to do the same. Great museum!
Hope you caught some good barbecue while you were in town!
I punk a lot of comments? I punk trolls, but Google isn’t a troll, But when someone writes a stat I like WPA is a stupid stat, then I must be stupid for liking it. I’m not plunking him, he’s plunking me. Just like when he said I don’t watch the games, that’s plunking me.
Do you think that is furthering the conversation?
But I’ll try furthering the conversation here.
Davidson has pitched well all year. He has a positive WPA. But because he gets lit up in a mop up role he now stinks? It’s why I prefer WPA for relief pitchers. When people get lit up matters. How many runs someone allows after an error matters. How many inherited runs a pitcher allows matters. For RPs, ERA doesn’t capture that as well as WPA.
Further the conversation, then I won’t punk you.
Google, I didn’t meet Hudler, he just waived. I met Tommy Lasorda when I was with this guy. Tommy Lasorda was kind of an ass. Bob Kendrick is a great guy.
Anyway, for RPs, I like WPA more than ERA because of what happened to Davidson last night. He got lit up in a mop up role. If you just look at ERA, it will take him a month to be a useful reliever again. But according to WPA, he’s just fine. It doesn’t hurt the team if an RP gets lit up in a mop up role, but it kills his ERA. That doesn’t seem representative to me.
I guess it’s a matter of perspective. I understand the win probability was low. The Angels had a 3.6% chance of winning when Tucker Davidson came into the game. Rather he pitched poorly or great, it just doesn’t matter in terms of WPA. Davidson probably wouldn’t have been in the game if the Angels had a better chance.
If we look at the before. Barria was effective. He pitched 4 innings. He gave 0 walks, 3 hits in those 4 innings. There was one error by a bad throw by Rendon, that lead to a single unearned run. His impact on the outcome turned out to be meaningful, since the Angels did comeback and win the game. The win probability only changed 2.6% or .0026 WPA. If the Angels offense showed up while he was pitching, his outs would have been more meaningful. For me, he pitched well. I can’t blame him for the error or lack of run support.
Estevez pitched one inning and win probability went up 31.1% or 0.311 WPA.
If you ask me which stat line I rather have, I would say Barria’s was better that night. Estevez will never put up a stat line like that.
I rather a stat indicate how a pitcher performed and not be affected so variables beyond the pitchers control, like offense and defense. In the past 2 games, Barria pitched well and Davisdson pitched extremely poorly and WPA just doesn’t represent that.
I
I wish there was a perfect stat, there isn’t. I’m a big a big of “proof is in the pudding” stats. Which means if I can reconcile a stat with what I believe to be true, I’m more likely to believe it, but i also have to fight confirmation bias.
When Wantz was allowing 9 pf 12 inherited runners to score and had a sub one ERA. ERA didn’t tell me the story. Twice Moore has left the game with a runner on first, and twice, Herget allowed those runs to score.
I’m looking for something that tells a more complete story, and when bullpen pitchers pitch so few innings, ERA, for me, doesn’t tell enough of the story.
I’m willing to try to learn from you. I’m in my 60s and am constantly learning about this game. But if you fire a shot across my bow, I’m going to load my cannons and fire back.
Real Q, are Angel fans the most unhinged fans in baseball. The torture of “Free Trout and Ohtani” has turned a group of adults into Heath Ledgers Joker. On Twitter its even better. IM being dead serious, is this the most abused and affected base in baseball?