Jazz Chisholm Jr. stands as one of the top position players available in what could be a relatively light market for bats. Trade chatter regarding Chisholm has picked up over the past week. The Marlins only added fuel by moving him back to second base over the weekend, seemingly an effort to demonstrate his defensive versatility for potential trade partners with two weeks until the deadline.
A middle infielder by trade, Chisholm moved to center field in 2023 in deference to Luis Arraez. Defensive metrics have been mixed on Chisholm’s outfield performance. Defensive Runs Saved has him as a well below-average center fielder, while Statcast has him as a neutral to solid outfielder. Both metrics were fonder of his early work at second base than they’ve been on his center field defense.
Even a couple weeks of reps back at second base could raise teams’ confidence that Chisholm could play there down the stretch. The New York Post’s Jon Heyman wrote last week that the Yankees have considered Chisholm, presumably as an infield fit. Bob Nightengale of USA Today reported yesterday that the Royals — a team openly seeking a player who can bounce between the infield and outfield — have shown interest in Chisholm. Nightengale suggests the Mariners, another club that hasn’t made any secret of its desire to upgrade the offense, is also in the mix.
While there should be a broad range of teams interested in a player with Chisholm’s defensive flexibility, Nightengale indicates the Phillies are not showing much interest in their division rival. (The Athletic’s Jim Bowden had loosely linked Chisholm, among various other players, to Philadelphia last week.) The Phils are set in the middle infield with Trea Turner and Bryson Stott. They’re looking for outfield help, although that could take the form of a right-handed platoon bat rather than an everyday player.
Chisholm, a left-handed hitter, wouldn’t address Philadelphia’s desire for more balance in the outfield. He’d be a clear offensive improvement as an everyday center fielder on Johan Rojas. Rojas is a gifted defender, though, and the Phils might not feel that Chisholm’s a marked enough overall upgrade to beat the offers put forth by other teams that are more desperate for hitting.
The 26-year-old Chisholm is having a second straight solid but not incredible season. He goes into the All-Star Break with a roughly average .249/.321/.407 slash line. Chisholm has hit 12 homers and stolen 18 bases (although he’s been thrown out eight times). That’s similar to last year’s .250/.304/.457 showing. An average hitter with the ability to cover multiple up-the-middle positions is certainly a valuable player, yet Chisholm hasn’t developed into the franchise building block he seemed during an All-Star first half in 2022.
Injuries have been a factor. Most notably, a stress fracture in Chisholm’s back cut short that potential breakout year in ’22. Toe and oblique issues limited him to 97 games a year ago. He has avoided the injured list thus far in 2024. The injury history has kept him from accumulating the kind of counting stats that’d result in significant arbitration earnings. Chisholm is playing on a very affordable $2.625MM salary and won’t reach free agency until the 2026-27 offseason.
“Latest on Jazz Chisholm’s market”
*crickets*…
If nominative determinism was really true, Chisholm would be playing basketball in Salt Lake City.
Not with a last name like “Chisholm” that sounds an awful lot like…
The last name he belongs in mouths of the leadership circle of the Mormon church.
The first name belongs in New Orleans.
Sorry for being dense—I’m not tracking your comment about the Mormon church?
Maybe a Clive Scott Chisholm reference
This comment is extremely disrespectful.
“Two people said it before me”…So you’re an anti religious bigot who doesn’t even stand behind his own words is what you’re saying, right Deadball?
Deadball Bik
Homophobia noted
Adios
Sounds like you’re anti-anti-religion. Your bigotry knows no bounds!
Also Deadball was just clarifying for people that lack reading comprehension.
That’s not homophobia. And you associating it with homosexuality actually is showing your homophobia.
Miami trying to create a market that does not exist
I can hear Krukie now over some decisions Chisolm makes in the field “what in the world?” Krukie has such a way of showing bewilderment. Phils get Chisolm and it’ll become commonplace.
Latest on Chisolm or Phillies? Slow day
While clicks matter, the reality is that this guy is a medium-grade hot-dog that will do some good things for a team at times, and cost them at others. While he may grade out as a slight positive, he’s inconstant and unreliable.
The Marlins are following the White Sox in doing a total rebuild. But these constant articles on Jazz are reaching and irritating.
Don’t worry. As soon as Braxton Garrett or Jesus Luzardo are healthy, they’ll get back to those articles again.
The market might be hot for Bellinger, Guerrero, or Rooker but I doubt many teams are clamoring for Chisholm. I’m pretty sure the Phils aren’t interested..
You need to check out Mariners blogs and media coverage, they mention him almost daily. The team probably has little interest, but the fans are desperate for any one with a semblance of a bat.
Only moronic Mariners fans want him. I’m praying we stay far way from Jazz.
Why would someone want Bellinger over Chisholm?
Again weird hate. It’s lame folks.
Because he’s a marginally better player.
All depends on the $ changing hands and what the buyer is looking for/willing to give up. I’d consider jazz to be the better deal considering $, but it’s not like he’s far and away the better player in this comparison. If a team is willing to take on $ in lieu of more prospects, they might prefer bellinger.
Why respond to inflammatory commentary with inflammatory questioning?
Bellinger is marginally better and has a nasty contract with a bunch of player options. Why would anyone prefer that to Chisholm and his 2 years of remaining arb after 2024?
The answer to that is in my original comment. Try reviewing again.
That’s the wrong question. The question is “Why would anyone want to trade for Chisholm?” He hasn’t done anything that special. Bellinger has put up MVP numbers in the past. There’s a history of elite performance. Chisholm doesn’t have that. He has a history of getting hurt and average performance when healthy.
Chisholm is a 3 win player. That’s not amazing but it’s certainly a guy worth playing. Better than Castellanos or Schwarber. Similar player to Marsh.
Marsh is a far better defensive outfielder than Chisholm. Castellonos has a much better track record than Chisholm does offensively & Schwarber’s power dwarfs Chisholm’s. Also, the Phillies don’t need another left handed bat in their outfield. They need a right handed bat. Rooker is a far better fit for them than Chisholm
Marsh is slightly better than Chisholm. Castellanos and Schwarber are 2 of the worst defensive players in baseball. Rocker is going to cost more to acquire than Chisholm would because of the extra control.
Blackpink in the area;
STOP RIGHT THERE!
Your post is the reason I’ve never embraced stats, and while I generally will use WAR nd fWAR as a sort of ballpark measurement, what you wrote makes no sense to me. Especially after watching so many Phillies games the past couple of years. (And I’ve seen Chisholm play.)
I don’t think any Phillies fan that has watched Chisholm, Castellanos, and Schwarber play, would come to the conclusion that Chisholm is the better player – insofar as helping his team win games. That’s simply a joke.
And as much as I like Marsh and appreciate his D, he is best used in a platoon role minimizing his exposure to LH pitchers. Heck, even Marsh would tell you to your face that he doesn’t mean as much to the Phillies success as Castellanos and Schwarber do.
This is not Rotisserie League. Winning teams have roles on them to fill. Very few position players are above average in the 5 tools. Someone that’s good in 3 or 4 is a find for a team. Players have to work off one another’s skill sets. That’s what the sustainable winning teams do.
Castellanos can’t play defense. And this year he can’t hit either. Been like that his whole career.
Schwarber was the worst defensive player in baseball last year. And he’s also been terrible his entire career.
Defense matters. You can’t have a team full of designated hitters if you do your defense will suffer for it.
Philly is a “winning team” because they have a ridiculous payroll. And even with it they still haven’t won squat.
See: current state of Mariner 2nd baseman
A boiled hot dog has a higher WRC+ than my mariners two baggers. That’s why someone would want Chisholm. Not because he’s great. Great isn’t the bar. Boiled hot dog is the bar.
Chisholm is a lefty bat. The Phillies need a righty bat. That rules Chisholm out right there. Also, Chisholm is a better 2nd baseman defensively than an outfielder & the Phillies have no need for an infielder. Chisholm would be a good fit in Kansas City, but not in Philadelphia
Read the article before it talks about Philly up the middle folks it says the Phillies ARENT showing interest. You’re literally just retyping the bullet points of the article lol
Bwáaaàaaaaaaaa
The marlins defense suffered greatly when Chisholm was in CF. He misplayed at least 3 plays ( 2 of which were costly resulting in runs where the ball should have been caught.
Chisholm was so bad the manager took him out of CF.
It’s obvious you are hellbent in trying to persuade fans in here that teams need to trade for him.
Why would the Phillies want Rooker in the outfield? He’s as bad or worse than Schwarber and Castellanos in the field, and strikes out as much as they do
“Chisholm is a 3 win player:…That’s laughable bro. A guy in his fifth season of play, who’s accumulated 6.9 career W.A.R, is most certainly NOT a “3 win player”. At best Jazz Chisholm is a player who’ll give you almost nothing some years and about 1-2 W.A.R in his better, healthy years. A 1-2 W.A.R, injury prone player is certainly nothing to get excited about.
5th year of his career? He barely played in 2020. 2024 isn’t over yet. Yes he’s had some injury problems but he’s been healthy all of 2024. And most people believe he would have a higher WAR if he was playing 2b not center.
He’s not an amazing player or superstar. He’s a good player with an injury history who is right in his prime and cheap.
Lot of old white people spreading weird hate about Jazz Chisholm. Sure would be interested as to why. I could understand why you don’t care. But to take the time to share hateful thoughts about him I don’t get it.
I don’t know about hate, but he was certainly overhyped for a few years. He hasn’t performed up to that hype, but you wouldn’t know that from the way he acts.
So he hasn’t lived up to the hype that others created for him?
Again I don’t get it. Why do you care so much?
Blackpink in the area;
I’m an “old white person” and you can take your ageism and racism and shove it.
–
I’ve seen Chisholm. What I wrote above I stay with until he changes things….
He’s a medium-grade hot-dog that will do some good things for a team at times, and cost them at others. He doesn’t exhibit much in the way of Baseball IQ, consistency, reliability…let alone leadership.
Can he play in the major leagues? Sure. Will he have a good year now and then. Very possibly. But you want stats:
Offensive: .246 / .308 / .441 after 5 years. Has speed, but seldom steals and doesn’t change many games with it. He plays a below average ML CF; is OK at 2B but won’t win any Gold Gloves.
26 years-old. Maybe if he gets to a quality organization they can get something better out of him.
And if he didn’t have hype this guy would be Nick Madrigal – a white guy – and people dumped on him a thousand times worse here then they are on Jazz.
Chisholm is a better player than Schwarber or Castellanos. Nick Madrigal is a nobody and no people never talk about him on here. They just ignore him like everyone else does because he’s Nick freaking Madrigal.
Like I said weird hate. You ignore the truth just to hate on a guy for no reason at all.
— I’m an “old white person” and you can take your ageism and racism and shove it. —
Think that poster was also targeting me Samuel and i wasn’t just attacking Chisolm. Watch a bunch of marlins games, they are one of my favorite teams and can say he seems to have many memory lapses in the field, makes often base running judgements and flat out often times appears to be out for personal numbers, rather than a team 1st approach.
This season it has become more apparent, maybe with the team being so lousy, but nevertheless? he seems to be ignoring advancing runners, like any attempt at hitting the ball to the r/side with runners on 2nd etc.
Much of this may go away if he got onto a contender, it did in spurts like last year off and on, but there were always periods where he would act like he didn’t care.
That’s not a… Claim, but from that of a fan who calls it like i see it over and over, regardless.
I don’t know anything about Chisholm, but TA’s track record leaves something to be desired.
is
“That’s not a… Claim, but from that of a fan who calls it like i see it over and over, regardless.”
That’s a claim
@Blackpink in the area
I’m not a white person. I am also a Marlins fan. And I will say that Jazz is not as condusive to winning as Shwarber is. When people use WAR the way you have here, it always makes me ask the question…Are you trying to say that Jazz is better than those players or that WAR is a very flawed stat? After all, anyone with common sense can see in game play that Jazz is invconsistent. He has a lot of tools, but his maturity has hindered him in his game. It’s not something that just white people are saying. Again, I’m not white and day the same thing…and, as a Marlins fan, I watch Jazz every game.
Considering that you made it a race thing about Jazz is sad considering thathis flaws are a clear observation. And you did this previously when a lot of us were pointing Kim Ng’s flaws as a GM for her entire tenure, when you tried to make it about her gender. You need a different trolling effort. Now go back to insinuating that your team will acquire players in demand from teams for garbage trade chips from your team.
1. You aren’t old. You are barely middle age
2. You called black people colored. So, you are obviously projecting your racist beliefs
3. Many white guys have had “weird hate”here. Donaldson, Harper,Castellanos. I didn’t see you calling them “old and black”
And you have been muted Steve. I don’t owe you my attention. Peace out.
He sucks white or black. Flash in the pan. Philles don’t want him because he won’t fit. Send him to the white Sox
My post referred you to specific defensive misplays he had against Houston. 2 in CF that 90% of mlb CF would have caught. It was pathetic .. it was like he didn’t care if he caught it or not. He doesn’t belong in CF. That’s the reason why the marlins are attempting to trade him. They won’t get anything of value.
You had to bring race into something because you are defending a guy who is a mediocre player no matter what color he is. But you had to do it.
“Old white people”…..How many times have you made these type of racist posts, Blackpink?…I’ve counted at least 5 or 6 times your posts mostly center on the race or skin color of people. You no doubt are one of the many racist white liberals that think they speak for people of color. The only reason racists like you aren’t called out by the media is that you’re members of America’s protected class, coddled and entitled by Hollywood, Silicon Valley and the Mainstream media.
Liberal? Where did that come from????
I don’t speak for Jazz Chisholm. I speak for myself and I am tired of reading weird comments by the people on this site pretending they aren’t racist comments when they clearly are.
Why are people like yourself trying so hard to convince the world Jazz Chisholm isn’t any good? Why???
“Hard to convince the world Jazz Chisholm isn’t any good”…I hope I live to see the day when liberal racists like you aren’t protected and coddled by Silicon Valley, Hollywood and the Main Stream Media.
I am not a liberal you weirdo. I don’t do politics all I can say about that is both sides suck. When you pick a side you are already wrong.
Why did you bend the truth in talking about Chisholms stats?
This topic is littered with it. Don’t go with the pretend shock, please.
FDR had a great quote, you really should remember it when get urself in too deep.
If you can’t stand the heat? Stay out of the kitchen.
How do you know who’s old and or white ? Curious ?
I can’t tell ?
Is there a video chat I’m missing here ?
The people making thinly veiled racist comments about Jazz Chisholm and Tim Anderson are old and white. I dont need video footage to know that.
And btw I am also old and white.
you are so right! Career .246/.308 hitter! He’s a super duper star, and if you don’t agree, well….you are horrid! And Anderson is even better! in 234 ABs, 0 HR’s 9 RBI’s .214/.237!!!! He’s ready to lead any team to the W.S!!!!
Who said he’s a superstar???? Who said that?????
He’s a good player on a bad team. The kind of guy that gets traded.
Like I said weird hate.
people making thinly veiled racist comments about Tim Anderson are old and white. I dont need video footage to know that.
===========================
FWIW, that’s as racist a comment as I’ve ever heard in here. It assumes that all negative comments about black players have to be racist.
JB
“It assumes that all negative comments about black players have to be racist.”
Sigh
Nope
It says “people making thinly veiled racist comments about Tim Anderson are old and white”
People’s ability to understand what they read is so bad
The comments about Anderson and Chisholm are weird. Their behavior would be totally normal in the NFL or NBA.
Here’s the thing; this is Major League Baseball not the NFL or the NBA.
It is. And if you are wondering why blacks don’t want to play baseball anymore you shouldn’t have to. It’s stuff like this.
Again if you don’t like him ignore him. I find that’s the best way to deal with people who crave attention. But stop going out of your way to make weird comments about him.
Bruh…like half the league isn’t even white. It’s comprised mainly of minorities that are even more oppressed in this country than the ones you are defending. What are you even talking about?
The two sports with the least sportsmanship in them (WNBA is becoming a close 3rd) if thats why they don’t want to play baseball then more power to them
“people making thinly veiled racist comments about Tim Anderson are old and white”
===========================
This doesn’t move the racism needle for me. It assumes that all negative comments about black players are thinly veiled racist comments made by old white people.
Changing the words around slightly doesn’t change the fact that your remarks are completely racist. It is okay to think the Willie Mays is the greatest ever AND to not like TA.
The idea that people have to love TA or else they are racist is patently absurd.
The comments about Anderson and Chisholm are weird. Their behavior would be totally normal in the NFL or NBA.
==============================
Complete nonsense. There are black players in the NBA that I think are complete punks, and black guys that I think are great.
TA has gotten a lot of bad press, just like Pham. OTOH, fans love Dom Smith. There are reasons why.
And if you are wondering why blacks don’t want to play baseball anymore you shouldn’t have to. It’s stuff like this.
============================
More nonsense. More black athletes gravitate towards FB and B-ball because it is more logical to gravitate to FB and B-ball. Do you seriously think Kyler Murray chose FB because he was afraid of a comment on MLB-R? He chose it because he knew he’d be starting QB in his rookie season, while in BB, there was no guarantee he’d ever be a player.
Not all negative comments about black players. Comments about 2 specific black players. Ones that didn’t conform to what white people think is good behavior.
It’s the ole “I’m not racist I just don’t like the way most black players act”. That’s what’s going on here.
Why do all these people care so much about Chisholm?????
Chemo
Can you please give me a ranking of which minorities are most/least repressed in the US. Thank you
JB
“It assumes that all negative comments about black players are thinly veiled racist comments made by old white people.”
Nope
Try reading the actual words they typed. They do nothing of the sort.
“The idea that people have to love TA or else they are racist is patently absurd”
It is! And you appear to be the only one here thinking it
Bpina
Some people seem to think that the only way a comment can be racist is if it is explicitly racist.
Subtlety is lost on most people
Yeah Beisbol. I am from St Louis we got a lot of old white conservative fans. When we had Carlos Martinez and he died his hair blue half the fan base lost their minds. I say this because Chisholm has also died his hair blue. They say they aren’t racist but they don’t like certain behavior that always comes from people of color. So that’s racist whether they want to admit it or not.
One of the reasons the Cardinals like Jordan Walker so much is he’s a black guy who behaves like a white guy. Teams need to create an environment where all people feel welcome from all walks of life. I don’t think my team does that very well and I don’t think a lot of teams in baseball do it very well.
@JoeBrady
True. The NFL and the NBA are instant gratification. If you are drafted you are probably playing immediately. In MLB it takes years to get to a big pay day if at all as far more players never make it to the big leagues than do
Hispanics, Asians, Indians, Whites, African Americans
Comments about 2 specific black players.
=======================
So fans don’t like 2 black players out of maybe 57? And that is supposed to be proof of racism?
It isn;t possible that there are reasons to dislike these 2 players? Or do you think ALL black players are above reproach?>
he’s a black guy who behaves like a white guy.
=======================
Holy Crap! Are we at the uncle Tom level yet? I’m curious, is there are outline for acting like a white guy, you know, rules and all?
I’m serious. I’m from The Bronx, and my crew and I weren’t exactly model citizens. I’m curious what qualifies as ‘white behavior’.
The NFL and the NBA are instant gratification.
======================
Sure. The SJWs make everything about race. The reasons blacks gravitate towards FB and B-ball are simple logic that even little kids understand.
You are a simpleton and a rumpkin.
No one mentioned anything about Chisholm’s rdve. You’re the racist dude. I went back and checked every comment sad no one mentioned his color. You did. You’re wrong bringing race into something that simply wasn’t there .
Voigt
Do you think someone has to explicitly mention color for something to be racist?
Black Pink
Has
Who cares if you are old and white. I sure don’t. I could care less if Chisholm is black .
Ad I’ve stated Chisholm is not a CF and not sure why the marlins gave him there . I’m
An Astro fan i was glad he misplaced three balls in CF. It helped us win. Noticed the next game Chisholm
Wasn’t in CF.
People mention that he acts like a hotdog I saw it first hand. After he hit a HR in the game he had to show off with his hotdog antics.
It was classless .
So you show your racism by calling out old white prople. I take offense. Just because we say a player is mediocre is not showing hate. You apparently have a hate complex.
Get over it.
The Astros cheated. That’s classless fella.
Good gosh.
Mariners could really use Chisholm and Tanner Scott. How many low cost prospects would it take? (No major league pitchers are available)
With tanner included the marlins would want one of the top 100 prospects in baseball, the marlins would want Lazaro Montes or felin Celesten but the mariners would probably rather give Tyler locklear or Logan Evans
I’d give up Montes, Hancock, Evans, and either Cole or Prospects are prospects.
LOL. Fortunately for Mariner fans you’re not running the team. Montes has established himself as one of the best prospects in the league and he isn’t going anywhere, at least not for Jazz. Mariners need offense, which isn’t Jazz’s calling card. I could see him traded to a team that needs to improve its defense or is in need of a LHB, but the media hype for his market is overblown. He has a league average bat with moderate splits (which means he hits RHP and LHP about the same and doesn’t offer a platoon advantage). He would make a lot of teams better, but the Mariners aren’t the best landing spot for him.
Agreed
The mariners SHOULDNT trade Montes but if they try to trade with the marlins or white Sox (teams that won’t contend for years) they will want the extremely young prospect and not the 22 years old+ prospects
I would have to think Jerry could get around and swing some deals without trading laz or celesten
You’re not the brightest crayon in the box, are you? Cole isn’t going anywhere and Montes should be untouchable. He’s just going to continue climbing prospect lists.
Chisholm and Scott for Ford. That’s about right. Marlins need a catcher really bad.
Done. Helps both sides.
Hell noooo!!! Ford has unicorn potential. I’m not trading a C with 40 stolen base potential for a .250 hitting 2nd baseman. Hard no. People who keep saying “trade ford” are the same people 10 years from now that’ll say “I can’t believe they had Ford at one point”. I trade Cal Raliegh when fords ready. He’s a Boras client he’s not signing an extension until he hits FA
Like seriously I know it’s just “potential” but it’s buster posey/joe mauer potential. Need way more than Jazz to move that.
Ford has an OPS in the 740s at AA. That’s not some amazing talent. Raleigh is under team control through 2027 you can figure that out later if Raleigh doesn’t sign. Chisholm is a terrific fit for the Mariners he can play center and give Julio some rest from playing such a physically demanding position and also play 2b which is a weakness for the team. Lefty bat also good fit. Polanco and Urias are as good as gone and he would help fill the holes left by those guys as well as help the outfield.
Posey or Mauer?
Good lord dude. It’s comments like this that make me want to root against your team. Sometimes you gotta play to win now not 5 years from now. Mariners have never won a darn thing I admire your patience but get real.
LOL. A catcher stealing 40 bags is a catcher spending a lot of time on IL.
You keep wanting to put Chisholm in CF where he is below avg. Seattle has Julio Rodriquez who could run circles around Chisholm ,
Actually wouldn’t see him
In Seattle . I would live to see another 3 misplays again when the mariners play Houston.
Plus acting like a hotdog won’t hit in well in CF . They ready have Julio.
You keep talking about 1 game you saw Chisholm play as if that’s his entire career. Like I said he can play 2b and center both and both are team needs. The Mariners just picked up Victor Robles to play center who’s better Chisholm or Robles? You tell me.
Blackpink, a 740s ops at aa at 21 (a bit on the young side for the level) combined with his other tools is a pretty good showing for ford’s development. There’s some defimite hyperbole about fords ceiling here, but imo he’s the kind of prospect you gotta at least think twice about dealing.
Sure you can think twice but the Mariners are the same team that last year was right in the thick of the playoff race they decided to sell and missed the playoffs by 1 game. Same team that has never won a championship in the entire history of the franchise.
Ford
Robles
For
Chisholm
Scott
Mack
I like that deal for both teams.
Trade cal????? He’s arguably the best defensive catcher and he’s young and cheap and has strong offensive potential and is a team leader
He better sign an extension
And Jazz Chisholm doesn’t fix this offense. It’s historically bad one move doesn’t make a dent. Is jazz better than who we have sure. Does he immediately and alone make us WS contenders. Absolutely not. Why send young talent out to maybe win a game in a wild card series? That’s not patience that’s an honest understanding of where your team is at.
You just listed every reason TO trade him when Ford is ready. Huge value in the return Again Boras clients hit free agency. He’s going to test his value and the Mariners aren’t going to win a bidding war. He changes his agent I’ll change my tune but you also just listed every reason he should hit free agency.
Don’t mistake me saying we should trade cal as me not liking the guy I do but when the writing is on the wall take a moment to read it.
They didn’t pick up Robles to play center please introduce yourself to one Julio Rodriguez. Robles is a platoon reclamation project who can run and play some defense. I’ll answer your question Chisholm is better. Now answer this one. Who costs more to acquire? The answer is the same and as my pappy used to say “the juice ain’t worth the squeeze”
The Mariners have what 1 playoff appearance in the last 20 plus years?
Winning a wild card game would be quite an accomplishment for them.
They picked up Robles to help in center. He’s a center fielder. And like I said Chisholm can also play 2b which is also a need. Chisholm is a terrific fit for the Mariners. Not sure why you don’t understand that.
I honestly don’t understand why you’re being pilloried here. Does no M’s fan remember prospects like first-rounders/can’t -miss catchers Clement, Zunino, and Jesus “El Tortuga II” Montero? All guys who mashed in the minors. Just like Ford. Just like Mack. In fact, I don’t need Mack. I’d rather save Robles and do another trade with TB that nets Paredes and Arozarena. The M’s have got to get into the playoffs this year and not waste another year with a WS-worthy starting five.
Flag yourself
Please no.
Remember when they inexplicably put him on the cover of MLB The Show before he did anything to deserve it? That was so weird.
You mad bro?
Meh, no worse than Javy Baez…
To be fair to the guy I don’t want to trade for he was an All Star before they put him on the cover of show. Before you say it was the Covid shortened season you’re right but it was for anyone else they put on the cover as well. Flashy smile All Star nod I can’t think of why not to put him on a game cover when they did.
The Royals are working on a deal for him
He’s a mariner! Good as gold. Chase headlining the trade
Chase,Montes
Who is Chase? And Laz isn’t going anywhere.
If you mean Clase and not the non-existent Chase, I’m in.
You’re in on packaging Montes with Clase? Hard pass. Montes’ value is only going to go up. He should be untouchable. His numbers are ridiculous.
He’s another strikeout machine. The Mariners don’t have a good track record with homegrown hitters on eliminating the inning deflating K. So yeah, they can have two prospects for two major leaguers.
Looking at the Royals team needs I don’t think he’s a good fit for them. Both Isbel and Massey, their centerfielder and 2b, are left handed hitters. What the Royals need is a corner outfielder. Someone who can hit.
Don’t the Mariners need someone who can hit too?
Wrong rumpkin
This simple, 2 word reply is becoming a classic on this topic.
Why are the defensive metrics so often against each other? It seems to me almost as simple as looking at where the player starts and where they end up and if they have to make a throw, how likely were they to record an out based on the runners speed on the play. We will never be able to measure things like sun being a factor probably and I doubt most metrics account for the type of hop the ball takes but still. It is also hard to know if the defensive positioning was from coaches or the players observation (a la Andruw Jones). But having one metric say Eddie Rosario should qualify for a gold glove while others think he is not good…it seems we should be past that. I know these are just public metrics. Any ideas?
I don’t know how to improve on defensive stats, but I share your concerns. Do exceptional defenders get all the credit they deserve for making exceptional plays look easy? Do average defenders get too much credit for making routine plays look exceptional? Should players get rewarded/dinged for their placement in the field? Should players not get dinged for playing it safe and letting a catchable ball drop in front of them? Should players get dinged for trying and failing to make an exceptional play, particularly late in the game when the game is on the line and where just playing it safe results in a loss? There are so many factors to consider in judging defense.
He’s an average player who hot dogs like he’s a super star.
On my team? A big no thank you!
We talking about verdugo or chisholm?
Don’t criticize Verdugo or you will be accused of being an old, white guy.
Or a RS fan.
Doogie just plays with 100% emotions on his sleeve and has 0 intentions of hiding anything.
The way he showed it all vs Boston? Same was he played vs LAD when he was with the Sox and when he walks as a FA this year? he’ll do the same thing with whoever he signs with against NY.
nothing personal, it’s who he is. he plays the game VERY hard and gives it his all. nothing lazy regarding Doogie, why he’s a fan favorite, despite mostly middling numbers. he hustles the minute he crosses the yellow line and doesn’t stop until the last out and can’t say that about all players Joe.
he plays the game VERY hard
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Not all the time. When he first got to Boston, I was hoping they’d extend him. By the time he left, I was glad to see him go.
Hopefully that doesn’t make me an old, white racist.
We should probably point out that doogie is latino and not something else and thus we not be accused of u-know-what for the umptheenth time on this topic.
Are Latinos and blacks not lumped together irt racism charges? Maybe everyone should be issued a set of rules for guidance.
Speaking of Jazz. Verdugo may have hot dogged on the Dead Sox, but he really hasn’t with the Yankees.
Verdugo wasn’t a “hot dog” per se with the Sox he just had lengthy streaks of laziness that drove Cora (and i imagine many Sox fans) crazy
I wouldn’t have called it laziness as much as personality clash with some players and Cora in particular.
Can see myself why some would have issues with Cora. Doogie isn’t one who would “sit down and shutup” over a disagreement” and it of course was eaten up by the always rabid NE media.
And Cora is pretty good with players. If you can PO Cora, I have to assume that you are the problem.
Sincerely,
OWR
There simply isn’t a “end all, be all” defensive stat. Every stat has its flaws and is constantly tweaked or overhauled with new data. Defensive metrics need to be look at all together for context.
YanksPhan as a Mariner fan I agree 100%
BLACKPINK GETS OWNED:
1. You aren’t old. You are barely middle age
2. You called black people colored. So, you are obviously projecting your racist beliefs
3. Many white guys have had “weird hate”here. Donaldson, Harper,Castellanos. I didn’t see you calling them “old and black”
7 paragraphs and NOT ONE NEW PIECE OF INFORMATION about the latest on how the market is developing for him.
Nice bit of regurgitation Franco. You feed baby birds with that crap in your off hours?
No one is forcing you to read it
Nor is anyone forcing you to read what I wrote…..Riiiiiight?
I think Andy Ibanez is better suited in Seattle than Jazz Chisholm. I guess that Seattle and Tampa will make a trade by the deadline.
Paredes to play 3B wouldn’t be bad for the Mariners
“Defensive Runs Saved has him as a well below-average center fielder, while Statcast has him as a neutral to solid outfielder. ”
Another example of why all of these stats are idiotic. I go by my late dad’s formula. “How many errors has he made?”
Can’t make an error if you don’t get to the ball in the first place. See Nick Castellanos and his errorless streak
So true JRam! my all time favorite middle infielders for making few errors, because they only had step and a half range were 2b Danny Uggla and SS Derek jeter.. Smooth hands they may have both had (so few errors on balls they got to) because most balls just got by them both.
In truth, statistical analysis isn’t ideal for judging a baseball player’s ability and performance. Statistics are more effective evaluating one variable in a single process. Humans aren’t machines. Many factors can change and no condition is constant.. Evaluation requires human judgement
Chisholm moved to center field in 2023 in deference to Luis Arraez.
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Such a strange chain of events.
They signed Segura, but since they already had Chisholm at 2nd, they had to move Segura to 3rd, where he had almost no experience.
Then traded Lopez for Arraez, so they had to move Chisholm to CF.
Then they had to sign Cueto to replace Lopez.
But for some reason people think Kim Ng was shafted.
Quite the clown show……
Why is it hate when people disagree with your opinion of Chisholm? I think you have a hate complex toward old white people.
Voigt
“Why is it hate when people disagree with your opinion of Chisholm?”
It’s not.
There are respectful ways to disagree
There are also ways that show disrespect for a player based on more than their performance.
I also see a lot of the latter
Incredible athlete that might benefit from a change of scenery.
Good not great offensive CF. Will probably have career best in SBs this year, but for what he does… the Phil’s could just get a platoon bat for Marsh.
The Phillies are better off getting Kevin Kiermaier and use him as a 7th inning defensive replacement and a 4th outfielder. Neither Castellanos or Schwarber stay healthy long. Kiermaier fits Philadelphia’s needs over Chisholm.
I don’t care where he is traded as long as he gets 5 starts at 2b so I can move him there in my fantasy lineup. 2b has been a dry well this year!!!