The Giants were among the teams that engaged the Mariners earlier in the offseason in trade talks regrading Luis Castillo, reports Susan Slusser of the San Francisco Chronicle. The clubs obviously did not line up on a deal and Castillo is expected to open the year in Seattle’s rotation.
Seattle entertained offers on the veteran righty as a means to potentially adding lineup help and creating payroll space which they could reinvest in the offense. The Mariners seemingly never gave much consideration to moving any of their younger top four starters: George Kirby, Logan Gilbert, Bryce Miller or Bryan Woo. Castillo is in a different spot, as he’s entering his age-32 season and on a significant contract. He’ll make $22.75MM annually for the next three years, while the deal also includes a vesting option for the ’28 campaign.
It’s not a bad contract. Castillo remains a very good starter. He turned in a 3.64 ERA with an above-average 24.3% strikeout percentage over 175 1/3 innings last year. It was his sixth consecutive sub-4.00 ERA showing. He has topped 150 innings in each of the last six full seasons. Castillo has had better than average strikeout rates throughout his career. His fastball still sits in the 95-96 MPH range. His salaries are expensive but in line with what comparable or slightly lesser pitchers like Nathan Eovaldi, Sean Manaea and Yusei Kikuchi landed on three-year terms as free agents.
At the same time, the Mariners were looking both to offload the money and command upper-level hitting talent in return. They seemingly stuck to a high asking price, which aligns with president of baseball operations Jerry Dipoto’s repeated assertions that the front office was reluctant to subtract from the rotation.
Slusser writes that the Giants have unsurprisingly been unwilling to entertain including top first base prospect Bryce Eldridge in a trade. That’s not to say that the Mariners were necessarily insistent on including Eldridge in a Castillo deal, but the Giants are otherwise light on impact controllable hitting talent. The 20-year-old first baseman is the only San Francisco prospect to crack Baseball America’s Top 100 this offseason.
Tyler Fitzgerald and Heliot Ramos are coming off impressive seasons, but they’re each ticketed for everyday playing time in San Francisco. Both players have elevated strikeout rates that could have been a concern for Seattle. Marco Luciano’s prospect status has fallen thanks to defensive questions and strikeout concerns of his own. Luis Matos and Casey Schmitt probably project as depth pieces. While the Mariners presumably had varying levels of interest in some of those players, it’s understandable that the sides apparently couldn’t line up on value.
The Giants would up making a big move on the free agent front, signing Justin Verlander to a $15MM deal. The future Hall of Famer slots behind Logan Webb and alongside Robbie Ray in Bob Melvin’s staff. Jordan Hicks seems ticketed for the fourth starter role, with Kyle Harrison probably grabbing the final rotation spot. Hayden Birdsong, Landen Roupp, Keaton Winn and Mason Black are among the other options on the 40-man roster.
The M’s were coming from a position of weakness regarding Castillo.
First, he has no trade rights until next year. He’s not going to accept a trade to a state with close to the highest state income tax levels. 2nd, this is a salary dump. Castillo is a good pitcher, yes. But you can’t demand top level hitting when you’re getting a player at market value.
The trading love affair between Seattle and SF is over now that Farhan is gone; Trader Jerry has shed tears already. When Seattle finds the extra money for another bat they’ll be OK; so ironic, the Seattle area is rife with money but the Mariners cry poor. I live in the greater Seattle area, lots of money here (I’m a Giant fan). Trader Jerry, why do you lie to your fans?
It will be sad day in Seattle when Sacramento finishes higher in the standings this year then M’s. Very real possibility.
Sacramento is not going anywhere with that shambles of a rotation. Seattle is going to be fine and will look to add more hitting at the deadline, if any is available. With the #1 farm system we have plenty of chips to trade. Yeah I know it’s fun & trendy to make fun of the Mariners but they are going to be right there at the end.
I recently got a call from Patrick, my Mariners STH rep…… I told him to use my name and account # and let Mr Stanton know that I’m tired of “being right there” at the end of the season! My tickets go up every year while benefits and satisfaction goes down! Stanton needs to spend to have a winning team, or sell them to someone who will! I’m tired of playing just 162 games every year. Let’s be winners!
In the past 23 years the Mariners have qualified for the playoffs as a wildcard ONE TIME!
Yup. That doesn’t mean it has to be the same way going forward. It would help if ownership pitched in a few more dollars. Both Texas and Houston are around $230 mill payrolls and Seattle at $155 mill. One game back from missing playoffs in ’23 and ’24.
Thanks for the reminder it’s not like we don’t get reminded at every turn. Our last 2 owners have been in it for the money. They know how much they can spends and get the money in return that they want for the year.
Time for Seattle to get an owner that wants to win over making a dollar. Time to get an owner that realizes it is better to make it to the WS and even lose than play 162 games. I of course would love to win the WS the first time we go but going is a win in itself. Love to be like my childhood NL team and go to as many as the Big Red Machine went to in the 70s.
Fans have no say in how ownership runs the team. We can show our displeasure of ownership by staying away from the park and not watch. We have fans that don’t follow it close enough they take the kids for giveaways. That makes owners think what they are doing is fine. The owners have no clue what is going on way below their office windows. They can’t tell you what a dozen ages or loaf of bread costs. They haven’t bought it in years. You shouldn’t make fun of Ms fans because you could be here one day.
@proton We can whine and cry and gnash our teeth about the ownership group all the live long day. I think everyone here at MLTBR has gotten the point about how frustrated the fanbase is at the moment. But there are rays of sunshine here in Seattle (okay not this weekend) and positive aspects we should feel jovial about: Top 5 Rotation in baseball, #1 Farm System (Keith Law, B.R.), a superstar on the cusp, Top 3 Catcher, etc. I mean, just saying, it’s not completely dismal. There are fanbases suffering more than we are, with a lot less things to feel positive about. So it’s not the end of the world, yet.
The Mariner’s aren’t going to be ‘fine.’ Their offense hasn’t improved since last year.
That’s a lot of pessimism towards a team with an outstanding starting staff. They’ll keep you in most games. The Ms will go as far as their offense takes them. Pitching will be solid and keep them out of long slumps.
That “outstanding” starting staff is a product of the ballpark. They have good pitching. The ballpark is also why the hitting always fails to reach expectations. Fans in Colorado understand the reality for their team. Why can’t Seattle fans understand their reality?
If absolutely none of them get hurt. They very well might have worse luck in that department this season.
The M’s have money. They just don’t want to spend it
You may think it as salary dump, but I beg to differ. Good luck landing a pitcher of Castillo’s quality for that contract. It ain’t happening. Trading for a pitcher that would be number one or two in your rotation, has value. Maybe not as much as the mariners would like but valuable indeed and in no way were the mariners in a position of weakness. They hold the cards. Seriously, who or what package of who is so great that would make the giants position one of strength?
The Giants, like most clubs, overestimate the value of their prospects and their own ability to develop them properly. Castillo is a proven starting pitcher at the major league level. Let’s all check back in a couple years on the “value” of Bryce Eldridge.
That might be the most “sour grapes” comment ever.
Don’t worry Jeff, you’ve still got the ghost of Mitch Haniger to keep you company this year.
The Giants have tight pants. Female attendance is up.
Why is Seattle trying to trade Castillo? Because he’s over hyped and will likely decline more each season. Still a good pitcher and in SF, he’d likely do ok given the park. Seattle though treats him like he’s still in his prime on his last contract where there was good value. He’s a 3 or 4 being paid like a 2. Also, on a side note, he can’t be compared with Eovaldi who has proven himself in October when it counts most.
Reports were that Seattle was listening to offers on Luis Castillo, not that the Mariners were trying to trade Castillo.
FWIW in three postseason starts Castillo has a 1.82 ERA in 19.2 innings with 19 strikeouts and one walk.
On most teams Castillo would be a #2 still. He happens to be surrounded by a great young staff. And he’s clearly better and less injury-prone than Eovaldi.
When was Castillo in the playoffs? I can’t remember Seattle doing anything. Eovaldi was again a key pitcher for Texas. As for being a #2, I just don’t see it outside of playing half his games in a bigger park. As for listening vs offering, such is spin. I call about one and they say no but I’ll listen if you want another. Boston for one wanted a youngster like Woo and when told Castillo could be available, they said ok if we also unload Yoshida. Something like that is more of what happened from what I read
That’s exactly the point that some fans are missing. Huge difference between listening and shopping.
Seattle can demand whatever they want. They have to be persuaded to do something they don’t want to do.
Another mistake is thinking it would have been a pure salary dump. They would have needed another starter and it’s not like they could have addressed the infield holes much differently. They were never going to get Bregman or Adames for third or second.
Things might change at the deadline or next offseason (and probably will), but the rotation this offseason was a case of ‘If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it’.
The Giants have tight pants? I figured that’s why we got those “City-Wide” uniforms last year *ugh* the all-time ugliest metro-sexual uniforms ever! Maybe the female crowd appreciate them……
Robbie Ray is tight pants
Calling Robbie Ray’s pants tight is a stretch. They might as well be painted on.
Castillo was a Giant prospect. Traded to Brewers for McGehee.
Terrible underestimation.
The trade was between the Marlins and the Giants. Castillo was the lottery ticket who pitched ok for the Green Jackets. Kendry Flores was who the Marlins targeted. Good for Castillo for maximizing his opportunities when he was later traded to the Reds.
What R U talking about? With the 150 inning vesting option in 2027 the Mariners are on the hook for another $91M through 2028 which is his age 36 season! There is ZERO surplus value based on the money owed on his deal. Jerry should have taken whatever the Giants were offering just to unload this money so it could be spent on the offense
To be precise: 2028 will be Luis Castillo’s age 35 season and the veteran right-hander will continue to carry surplus value if he tosses 150 innings in 2027.
Bryce is the best prospect they’ve had since Christian arroyo you watch your tongue
Yes let’s check back at the end of this year to see his numbers alone!! Kid hit everywhere at 19/20 still being 20 this year!! Even at a career average of .270-280 20-30 homers would put him in line with Will Clark/ Jack Clark numbers which I’d take happily over a $22.5 million dollar 32 year old pitcher especially with the young crop of pitchers on the way
But would you take a .220-.230, 15-20 HRs over a 12-15 game winner? Those numbers you posted would be excellent for most established 1B, and you expect them from a 21 yr old rookie, rushed thru the minors! Vaughn, Torkelson, Gorman, Walker and Baty are recent examples of why corner IFs should not be rushed. They usually have one major tool, and hitting gets messed up when rushed.
Yeah, he might not live up to expectations, but I’d rather they keep him and risk that happening than see another Beltran/Wheeler type of situation.
Eldridge may fizzle. But Zack Wherler for Beltran sure didn’t work out. Or Bryan Reynolds for Andrew McCutchen. Let’s see what Eldridge has.
All those trades took guts. They couldn’t have been made without having won a recent World Series, which SF did and you know that.
If Beltran doesn’t get hurt after that trade there could’ve been 4 rings; he went on to have a great career. The Mc trade? So far, the Bucs don’t have any hardware since that deal. And it’s always about the hardware.
Dude, are you orange and black attack or an Eeyore? There’s no in between.
I forgot how many times Luis Castillo has been traded in his career (5 times, if you count the two trades between the Padres and Marlins where he was sent back to Miami due to a failed physical). And it all started by the Giants trading him to Miami for Casey McGehee.
Casey MehGehee. I had forgotten about this trade. Been quite awhile ago. Giants definitely lost on this trade.
Seattle would be nuts to not unload his contract
The contract has some surplus value. He’s being paid below market value. Why would they be nuts to keep it? Ownership’s unwillingness to spend doesn’t make his contract bad.
The money is needed to upgrade the offense because ownership is too cheap to spend some real dollars!
Due to the ballpark, any offence received will disappoint.
Ok…
Castillo to the Mets for some of their expendable bats could have benefited both. Minimal cost difference over Mantas and 10x the track record.
Agreed. I’m shocked that the Mets are going into the season with the rotation they currently have. The desperately need someone like Castillo or Cease.
Saving $8M to go from Castillo to Scherzer/Verlander doesn’t give them enough cash to upgrade the lineup more than the rotation falls off, unless they got MLB pieces in the trade.
T-Mobile Park enhances the raw stats of Seattle pitchers and suppresses the raw stats of Seattle hitters.
Seattle’s league- and park-adjusted team OPS+ and ERA+ over the past three seasons (with American League rank):
2024: 103 OPS+ (6th), 106 ERA+ (7th)
2023: 108 OPS+ (4th), 106 ERA+ (7th)
2022: 106 OPS+ (4th), 104 ERA+ (6th)
People always talk about those in isolation. Amazed by the incredible pitching and shocked by the lackluster hitting. Amazed when Sewald shows up and becomes elite, devastated when Teoscar can’t hit in Seattle. I wish everyone understood this like you do.
There is a long list of Seattle acquiring offensive players that have moved to Seattle and fizzled. Been happening forever.
Castillo had a 101 ERA+ last despite that attractive 3.64 ERA. He was average, and other teams see that.
Even pitchers who’ve been below average more times than not are getting paid big money right now. Castillo being average is still an upgrade to most rotations and at a price Tage that’s in line with what worse arms have been getting this offseason.
Who cares? Stories of The Giants were interested in this player or that are a dime a dozen. The trade or signing never seems to occur.
lol they should’ve just kept him in the first place. Wheeler too haha
Wheeler was injured how long when he was a Met?
I showed interest in Alix Earle. She said no
Believe it or not, the smartest thing that the Mariners have done all winter is hold onto their pitching like their lives depend on it. The rotation is the main reason they’re even considered contenders. Trading a good pitcher for a good bat is a lateral move at best with downside risk because hitters foame out the minute they set foot in Seattle, and the rotation depth gets thinner.
Hey Giant fans. Stumbled across a Melvin chat by Brodie Brazil yesterday. Top notch viewing/listening. Thoughtful ?’s covering all the topics at hand.
th Jints sent the wrong twin to the Reds!