The latest out of the AL East…
- Former Mets GM Omar Minaya was offered a scouting position with the Blue Jays, tweets SI's Jon Heyman. Minaya is weighing other options. Bob Elliott of the Toronto Sun first reported Toronto's interest in Minaya, citing the Padres as another suitor. Elliott notes that the Jays already employ three former GMs in Jim Beattie, Ed Lynch, and Chuck LaMar. In October, Minaya interviewed for the Angels' GM job.
- The Jays are "pushing hard for a closer," one GM tells Elliott. Elliott reported a few days ago that the Blue Jays were shocked by the asking prices, however.
- No matter what they say publicly, Yankees people are telling friends to expect an eventual big splash with a pitcher, tweets Danny Knobler of CBS Sports. I don't think that'd shock anyone, but there's not much out there currently.
- The Red Sox weren't surprised Jonathan Papelbon priced himself out of their range, writes WEEI's Alex Speier. The Sox are not looking to make a quick strike in the closer market to replace him.
Good cuz’ the Jays need more scouts.
“Blue Jays, Oliver Perez Agree To Four-Year, $44MM Contract.”
Not even worth it lol
Since when does a scout have any say in free agents?
Any Red Sox fan please enlighten me. Why would the Sox be in a rush to add a closer? I know Bard kind of melted down in September but he seems like an ideal choice if someone like Ryan Madson can really command 4 years $40 million.
They arent……A) they have Bard, b) If they are not comfortable with Bard being the closer yet, the market is flush with good quality closers that they can get one just as good as Papelbon for a lower price.
and C) Heath Bell has said he isn’t really open to leaving the West coast. So expect Seattle, San Diego, Angels and Rockies to be in the hunt.
The Sox are not as good without Papelbon no two ways about it.
Not a Red Sox fan and not seen Bard pitch a whole lot and not much at all in September but to me he seems like a natural fit. That being said I think the new Red Sox front office will go after Bell.
Reliever/closers are way too volatile to commit too much on years and cash. Let Bard do his thing and see what other cheap pieces can be picked up on the market.
I completely agree with your first sentence and honestly I’m surprised more GM’s don’t realize this.
Relief pitchers are more important in todays game, it is all about pitching. The problem is picking the right ones. Last year Jenks and Wheeler hurt the Sox and Bard in Sept.
Relief pitchers being more important doesn’t take away the fact that most if not all relievers/closers are volatile creatures. Did I say relievers and closers are useless? Your statement regarding the state of Red Sox relievers is in line with what I said about relief pitcher volatility.
Why don’t you go ahead and pay Madson $20M a year for 6 years and see what happens?
Not a bad idea, Minaya was always had a good eye for talent, it was the other aspects of being a GM he failed at.
AA building an army.
Jays office has like what 5 ex GMs? Tony LcCava was also offered Orioles GM position so…
I guess that’s a good thing if you like to know that your staff isn’t good enough to do anything besides their current position.
Where are you ‘Dislike’ button?!?!
I’m not saying because they are former GM’s that it makes it a bad front office. But, there is a reason they are FORMER GM’s. I’m just saying having that many former GM’s, to me, doesn’t automatically make a staff impressive.
** I know it’s not allowed to say anything anti-Blue Jay on here.
But obviously they were good enough to move up the organizational ladder up to GM, proving that they were once seen as very good “underlings”, and were seen as good enough to be a GM for someone.
and now they’re not. So it’s really an invalid point that they have 5 FORMER GM’s. All it means is they had the chance and failed.
I’m not challenging the fact that they’re FORMER GM’s. I’m saying that they showed enough competency to get the GM job in the first place, and now they’re being returned to the position at which they showed above average competency.
I’m assuming that the people in charge of hiring GM’s know it takes a different set of skills to be a GM than a talent evaluator. I don’t think Minaya being a good scout had much to do with him getting a GM job. So to my original point, having former GM’s on your staff means nothing besides you have guys that know how to get fired.
Edit: I am not saying these guys aren’t good at what they do. Just the fact that them being former GM’s does not mean they are good at what they do.
i agree being a gm takes a different skill set, but gm’s are often hired because they have strong background in a particular area like player development or scouting. if you take a guy like that and put him back in his original position, chances are he will do a good job no?
I would say that has more to do with you put him in a position where you feel he has succeeded before than it has to do with him once being called a GM.
well sure, but it cant hurt. especially since he probably has a good rapport with AA from their time with the expos.
So what do you suppose got Minaya (in this case) or other former GM’s on the Jays squad hired?
Former GM’s that built tremendous farm systems, are the top talent evaluators in major league baseball are assets to a front office. No one is asking them to make trades, sign free agents, or anything else. The front office was built with an eye to future talent around the world. An army of scouts will then check every player and see what they have. Teams that go with one GM, an assistant, plus a few scouts are the teams ranked 25 – 30 in talent in the minor leagues. Teams ranked 1 – 4 have an army of talent evaluators, so draft day nets the best players, not the guys that they have to hear about from other teams. Having four former GM’s is also a benefit when it comes to signing the army of prospects, because they will know the true value of the player, without giving them ten times what they are worth.
Okay? Obviously a team doesn’t hire a guy to a position without feeling he can do the job. Just because a guy got a chance at a GM and failed doesn’t make him any better than any other teams talent evaluators that hasn’t failed as a GM.
Front Office National Champions Pawwwl
What do they do all day? Omar is a fourth for bridge
I’m pretty sure the Orioles would have offered the GM job to half the people hear if it had gotten that bad…
So do the Mets and they will finish last next year.
Article got cut off –
“Minaya is weighing other options – specifically, an offer from the Rangers for an ‘Executive Lead Towel and Gatorade Manager’. Earlier, the position of ‘Vice President of Peanut and Cracker Jack Oversight and Distribution’ was extended from an unnamed Los Angeles ballclub, but talks broke down when Minaya and the organization couldn’t reach an agreement on the number of Dodger Dogs he would receive as compensation.”
But seriously, with the way he tanked the Mets I can’t believe any team would even consider him for a position where “talent evaluation” comes into play. Good for him, I guess.
Because it’s the mighty JAYS! They do no wrong, duh.
I hope the Yankees go for Buehrle and Darvish. Buehrle can be a perfect Number 2 for Sabathia while Darvish’s upside is intriguing. If they somehow manage to also move Burnett and acquire Danks in a trade that doesn’t hurt much their farm system, their rotation would be among the top 3 of MLB for next year:
C.C.
Buehrle
Nova
Danks
Darvish
Not even close to top 3 in the mlb
Phillies, Giants (maybe), Rays… Who else would be better? I admit that I forgot about the Rays in my first post, but I don’t see anyone else being better in rotation than the Yanks with my hypothetical rotation. Maybe the Nats, Sox, Tigers, Rangers and Angels could come close, depending on what moves they make, and the Brewers might be close to that group, but I don’t think any of those could be superior.
I suppose if you are a Yanks fan and put up with the current rotation this season than we can’t fault you for losing perspective and thinking that your hypothetical rotation would be top 3 in MLB… in reality though that is laughable and wouldn’t even be in top 3 conversation by anyone outside New York.
First of all, how can you even judge Darvish if you haven’t even seen him pitch in the majors? For all we know he could be a frontline starter. CC is CC and Nova could very well be able to repeat his fine 2011. Better than that potential rotation??? Clear-cut better than that??? Giants, Phillies, Rays, and perhaps the Braves.
I’d also take the Angels, cardinals, A’s, Mariners, Brewers,
Mariners are Felix and Safeco, and the A’s rotation have to show they can remain healthy, otherwise you will have to pray to whatever god you have for Moscoso’s uncanny luck to keep going. Brewers… maybe equal, but not better (to that hypothetical I posted, they are better than what the Yankees fielded last year).
a good rotation will almost always bee top heavy
Angels- Haren, Weaver
Brewers- Marcum, Grienke, Gallarod
San Fran-lincecum, cain, bumgardner
TB-Price, Shield, Hellboy
Mariners- Felix, pineda
all those rotations are better because they have legit #2 options that are pretty close to a #1 option..
The rotation you listed above is an ace (cc) 1 possible #2 (nova) 2 #3/4’s in beurhle, danks and 1 question mark. Its still not close.
Darvish is a question mark that could be at least as good as Buehrle/Danks as his floor and has ace-level ceiling. Danks himself as a lot of room to improve and Yankee Stadium favors lefties. That depth is something the Angels lack, and, though I have to admit that I didn’t see him as much as I saw Nova this year, I don’t think Michael Pineda is much better than Ivan Nova. As a matter of fact, I’ve read that he profiles very similar to Chris Volstad and that his numbers have been helped by Safeco. So, no, I don’t think neither Angels nor Mariners would have better rotations than that.
Cardinals -Wainwright is back
Yeah, but Lohse and Westbrook are wildcards and probably not better than Nova and whatever Darvish might be able to give (if he comes).
Angels and A’s are still better.
As I’ve said, A’s need to show health. If Dallas Braden and Brett Anderson keep pitching just little over 200 innings combined, they won’t make enough impact. Angels have Weaver, who is a monster, and Haren, a nice number two in any team. But they need to clarify the fourth and fifth spot and as always there’s the matter of Ervin “roll of the dice” Santana and how inconsistent his performance is year to year: he could be better than Haren next year, or he could be worst than Burnett. With him, you never know.
Every year the A’s have an awesome rotation but the lack of offense and their ballpark dimensions keep them from contending in the AL. If you look at the rotation ERA from last year, the A’s rank 3rd in the AL. Although their rotation staff has a hard time staying healthy, you have to admit their starters are amazing; they rank above the yanks, the rangers and the mariners. Every team will have their share of injuries with their pitching staff, but the A’s have been leading the ERA category for quite a long time.
ERA is easily influenced by park dimensions. The A’s have a park that compares with Safeco and Petco, so it’s normal that they are ERA leaders. Yankee Stadium is up there with the Rangers Ballpark in Arlington and Coors Field as parks that favor hitters. And yes, Dallas Braden and Brett Anderson are amazing, but when their injuries mean that Guillermo Moscoso and Rich Harden are taking the ball every 5 days, which in turn means that the bullpen will be taking more innings… they don’t look so bright. That’s why the combined 101.1 innings of Braden and Anderson were worth just 0.1 less WAR than A.J. Burnett (who pitched 89 more innings but is regarded one of the worst pitchers of the season) and a whole 1.1 WAR less than Derek Lowe, who pitched 85.2 more innings, but to an ERA of 5.05. And being worse than Derek Lowe doesn’t make you an ace (specially because nowadays Lowe is a fourth or fifth starter). And sorry, but if it was pure potential all that counted, Mark Prior would be the second best pitcher that the Yankees have and Stephen Strasburg would’ve won the NL Cy Young this year. As long as both Braden and Anderson don’t show that they are capable of logging around 200 innings on a regular basis, neither will be considered an ace.
You must have one hell of a fantasy team.
You must have a hell of a lack of grasp for the concept of relevance.
Actually I have a firm grasp of relevance as well as reality, something that judging by your sabermetric drivel you don’t possess.
You are choosing THIS forum to criticize sabermetrics? Godspeed mate.
Oakland A’s? Atlanta Braves? Nats will always be in the cellar if they keep offering ridiculous contracts (Jayson Werth).
I didn’t list the Nats because they still have to make at least a couple of moves (and Strasburg will probably be restricted). Braves need to establish first what will be their actual rotation, depth is good, but can be gone without giving results (see the catching situation of the Rangers a few years ago). And as I said before, the A’s rotation needs lots of health before it’s considered elite.
The Yanks were third in the AL last year, on paper in the winter as we saw last year with the Phillies and Sox means little.
you are dreaming – noboby is taking Burnett – Danks will cost the farm. resolve to the fact of Freddie and Colon for another year.
To get Danks the Sox will start with Gardner
I agree Burnett isn’t going anywhere he is owed 32 million for the next two years, but the Yanks will resign Freddie and pick up another solid pitcher either Darvish, Beurhle, or someone in a trade. That’s all they need to win next year, the line up is set.
Danks won’t cost Gardner. He will be sold somewhat low because he will be a FA in a year. His value could rocket because of the market, but he won’t cost a farm. And yeah, Burnett sucks, but his FIP and xFIP weren’t as bad has his ERA suggested, and he still eats innings. But I thought he only had a year left, so… you win that one xD
This is one the silliest Yankee fan dreaming posts I have ever seen. The Yanks are now going to get THREE starters this off-season AND get someone to take Burnett off their hands? ooooook
I admit that finding someone to take Burnett is somewhat hopeful, but less than a month ago everyone was telling Braves’ fans the same about Lowe (still, I didn’t remember that Burnett has two years left when I wrote the comment, so I admit my mistake on that). However, getting two or three pitchers out of the FA market isn’t impossible for the Yankees, or have you forgotten 2008? Nobody expected them to get Sabathia, Burnett and Teixeira… yet here we are.
toronto prepare to turn latino
if they’re good I don’t care if they’re aliens
The Jays biggest problem is their pitching ranked 24th out of 30 teams last year. AA traded away alot of pitching, but getting rid of Wells he can do no wrong, yet. By losing pitching their record was worse last year than the year before. AA needs to get some impact pitching that he will not find in his farm system.
Really, if you are referring to Marcum, he was the number four starter. Tallet was useless and is gone. Marcum won 12 games in 2010, 13 games for Milwaukee in 2011, and was blown off the mound in the playoffs. Alvarez is a potential ace, scouts refer to him as King Felix 2.0. Huge improvement over Marcum. Romero can beat any pitcher in the majors. Morrow has ace potential and he now has two years starting experience under his belt. Just stating facts, but Halladay at the same time had a 10.35 ERA after his second year, was sent to single A to reinvent himself and only became the best pitcher in the majors. Cecil had an off year, where he lost his velocity in the first half, found it, and was effective the rest of the season. He won 15 games in 2010, beat the AL east with an 11 – 3 record and if he rebounds to his 2010 form, that is four aces in the rotation. We then come to McGowan, who has battled injury the last few years, but before he was hurt, he was projected to be even better than Roy Halladay in talent. Another potential ace. That isn’t including guys like Hutchison, Sanchez, McGuire, Molina, Syndergaart, Nicolino, that also project to be #1 starters on any rotation in baseball. If you want to comment, please make sure you know what you are talking about first, or you will get called on it.
somebody’s had a little too much kool-aid today…
first off, marcum was our number 2 pretty much every year he was here and the number 1 after halladay left. the guy can pitch, regardless of his hiccup in the postseason this year.
romero = good no. 2
morrow = unknown, the guy is a major league pitcher, but as to how good he will be remains to be seen
cecil = 4-5 starter at this point, and he probably gets pushed out eventually
alvarez looks good, but the king felix comparison is completely bonkers. he hasnt proven anything yet.
mcgowan was supposed to be better than halladay?? dude, i’m not even sure its possible to be better than halladay.
and re: the prospects, the jays will be ecstatic if they get one ace out of those guys. they all look really good, so its no slight against them, its just… aces are so rare. i highly doubt the jays have found some crazy formula to make them start growing on trees.
all that said, i am confident that the jays will be fine for pitching in the future. the fact that they lost a couple more games this year is immaterial. there is less roster uncertainty this offseason, so we probably wont have to go through the nix-rivera-jojo experience again. unlike last year, there are enough major league or major league ready arms to put together a good rotation without splurging on wilson or darvish. from romero, morrow, cecil, alvarez, mcgowan, drabek, and possibly molina or hutchinson there is enough talent to keep you competitive for the season, and theres always litsch and villanueva who are more than capable of filling in for a couple weeks if need be.
I agree with what you say for the most part…. I have to disagree with a couple things however.
Romero… Good No. 1… the guy was pretty unstoppable last season and I’d be happy to have him as my ace on any team.
Definition of an “ace” is the best pitcher on your staff.
So, aces are not rare. Every team has one.
While it is true that every team has an ace, I think ice_hawk1002 was merely pointing out the fact that they’re only a handful of teams who have a true ace(s): New York Yankees with Sabathia, Detroit Tigers with Verlander, Seattle with King Felix, Philadelphia with Halladay Lee and Hamels, etc. However, I just wanted to point out that not all aces are #1 on their respectful teams. Take a look at the yankees when they had Chien-Ming Wang as their #1. I’m 99% sure that Andy Pettite was their ace while Wang was just merely their #1 starter.
Look, I’m a Jays fan, but this is ridiculous. Most scouts will say that McGuire is a solid #3 with a high probability. As for the other guys, here is how the BA Handbook describes a #1 starter: two plus pitches, an average third pitch, plus-plus command, and plus makeup. You can’t tell me that you think all 5 of the pitchers you named project to have all of that stuff. And any scout that’s comping Alvarez to Felix Hernandez is pretty darn racist. Romero could not beat any pitcher in the league, or he would’ve received more than a couple CYA votes. And really, quoting wins to further your Cecil argument? Couldn’t do any better than that?
Y que te importa?
Yankees to make a big splash with “not much out there.” Sounds like a trade to me. Brackman, Montero + to Seattle for Felix. Calling it.
Brackman is a free agent. And why the heck would Seattle trade Felix for anything like that package?
Have a clue!
While you’re at it, trade Nunez to the Giants for Lincecum…
Throw in Pena to make it fair!
Brackman? LOL Oh yeah that’s that big stud Killer B that is now looking for a job. I’m sure he’s good enough to bring back one of the top 5 pitchers in baseball.
since Brackman isn’t even a Yankee any longer, your comment is fantasy. lol. Oh, didn’t you read that where Brackman was released. Whoops. lol.
Let me guess, the Z means you’re asleep and dreaming. Right?
Obviously I didn’t read the Brackman “news.”
Blah, blah, blah; troll, troll, troll.
I swear the former GM’s are like trophies for GM AA to collect- like a necklace of ears or something. He especially likes the GM’s that he formerly worked for.
As long as Ricciardi doesn’t come back, he can bring in the Dalai Lama for all I care.
Toronto needs to get some pitching!
I think AA knows what the Jays need. No need to say the same thing on every jays thread.
As a bonus AA could also ask Minaya for advice on free agents. Then do the exact opposite.
To the guys poo-pooing the ex-GMs, I can only say:
‘Tis better to be a has-been than a might-have been by far
For a might-have-been has NEVER been,
But a Has was once an ARE
Cool story bro.