Chris Sale’s name figures to dominate headlines in the coming days as baseball’s Winter Meetings pick up steam. We’ll track all of today’s updates on his market in this post…
- The White Sox continue to put a high price on Sale’s services, and teams in the hunt for the lefty tell ESPN.com’s Jayson Stark (Twitter link) that they don’t expect a deal to be completed at the Winter Meetings.
- Some in the White Sox organization feel Sale will eventually break down with injuries, ESPN’s Buster Olney reports (subscription required), which could be part of the reason why rival executives and evaluators feel the Sox are more ardently pursuing a deal now than they were at the July trade deadline. Questions about Sale’s mechanics have plagued the lefty even since before he was drafted, though he has been generally healthy throughout his big league career.
Earlier updates
- The Nationals are stepping up their efforts to acquire Sale from the White Sox, tweets FanRag’s Jon Heyman. The Nats and White Sox are meeting this afternoon to discuss Sale according to Heyman, who also notes that the Red Sox and other teams are also still in the mix for Sale. Washington reportedly believes it has the prospects to add both Sale and Andrew McCutchen in a trade, though doing so would obviously come with a lofty asking price that would require GM Mike Rizzo to part with a significant portion of his farm system (and likely some MLB-ready talent as well). Trea Turner is reportedly off limits in trade talks, though the Nats have plenty of other young talent to entice other clubs.
- Joel Sherman of the New York Post tweeted this morning that rival execs get the sense that the Nationals and Astros are the most aggressive teams on the Sale market, and the Braves are in the picture as well. As is the case with the Nats and Turner, the Astros (Alex Bregman) and Braves (Dansby Swanson) each have a young core player whom they effectively deem to be untouchable in trade talks, even for someone of Sale’s caliber.
It’s gonna take more than they are interested in giving up.
I think they already have an idea of what it will take. I have a feeling this is more talks to delve deeper into it and try to get something done. They definitely have the pieces to do it without Turner.
If the Sox want position player prospects who do the Nats have to headline a trade? Robles in A ball and 19 years old isn’t cutting it.
They don’t have the position players to headline, but they could headline with Giolito and Robles, #3 prospect and #10. Could also use a #37 Lopez or someone like Kieboom or Difo.
Exactly that is why Turner will be included if they land Sale. They aren’t trading pitching for pitching.
Nats will need Turner to be the face of the franchise in about two years.
I hope to god the Astros can get sale without Bregman and Springer. With that being said, if the nats can actually get Sale and McCutchen, that would be very interesting.
I don’t think Sale will like the Astros throwback uniform.
Lol
If he hates Astros throwbacks not sure which one he wouldn’t cut up. Astros rainbow throwbacks are sweet
I don’t see an Astros package that does not include Bregman working. The Astros have a decent farm system, but the drop off after Bregman is steep and much further from a sure thing
Of course the drop off from Bregman is steep, he was the top prospect before he was called up. The drop off from Swanson to a guy like Albies is steep. The drop off from turner to Robles is steep. But these teams aren’t gonna subtract from their major league every day roster to upgrade pitching.
The white sox are going to have to ultimately settle for what they can get. Or let him start 2017 in a sox uni and pray something doesn’t happen.
Pray something doesn’t happen? That’s just silly talk. Anything can happen to anyone. All the fans of these teams that need pitching, and have not been in a world series lately need to get a grip. I know the talk is that the White Sox HAVE to trade Sale, but I’d like them to keep him if they can’t get their price.
As far as the Nats, if Turner isn’t included in a trade for Sale, then Rendon should be his replacement. Braves? No Swanson? then Inciarte. Astros? No Bregman, then Springer, no Springer, then Bregman. Otherwise, go trade for Archer or Gray.
Or sign Jason Hammel.
No, it’s not silly talk. Did you even read the article? It’s a legitimate concern. It can happen to anyone at anytime. Look at the 2016 Mets rotation for all the evidence you need.
They sit on him and something happens, yes, he loses a ton of value.
They seem also proactive in moving him for a team that doesn’t need to move him.
Go ahead, let them keep him. Acting like you are gonna get those guys you named then a chunk of the top of those farms is a pipe dream.
They should be more than excited to get a group like AJ Reed, Kyle Tucker, Colin McHugh, Forrest Whitley, David Paulino, and Derek Fisher. 3 top 100 prospects, plus Reed (top 25-30 prospect worthy) plus mchugh who they could flip for a couple nice prospects.
Robles may be ranked tenth, but look at him and Tucker, compare scouting reports, results, etc, and tell me the 10 vs 40th prospect “rankings” actually mean a thing.
Moving Bregman or springer from the lineup for the sake of improving the rotation is silly. Why subtract from one area of your game to add in another?
For the record, springer has a higher war than sale does each of the last two seasons, and springer didn’t even play 110 games last year. So… Yeah….
Let the bidding war commence
I really hope that Boston isn’t really in the mix at the prices it appears to take to get Sale.
Why would anyone care about Boston s farm? They buy every young talent they can sign and draft exceedingly well. Plus they can fill any hole through free agency if needed. Sell prospects and get studs. Win. That’s what money can buy.
Looks like it’ll be a bidding war. If he’s traded, one of those teams will cave and have to give up the Trea Turners of the world
I don’t see that happening. Swanson, Bregman, and Turner have just about as much value as Sale alone plus younger and more control with cheaper price.
C’mon now. Prospects are suspects. You are getting a known commodity here.
All three reached the bigs and played at a really high level. There is every indication that all three will continue to succeed.
Not sure that calling these 3 prospects is entirely accurate based on their play this year. From the Nats perspective if they do trade for McCutchen then Turner will likely move from CF to SS (his “natural” position). so it isn’t just a matter of being untouchable because they like his upside.
See Gordon Beckham….
Exactly, look up Gordon Beckham’s rookie season..
I don’t understand your point. Beckham wasn’t even a top 100 prospect in 2008 before his rookie year in 2009?
Go look at the top 100 list from 2008 or even 2009. Your top 10 includes guys like Evan Longoria, David Price, Clayton Kershaw, and David Price. Beckham wasn’t even on the list.
Beckham was still in college in 2008. Got drafted 8th overall and was suppose to be the next big thing after we won AP AL rookie of the year in 09. Every team wanted him from the White Sox and now he’s a utility infielder for the Braves
If you’re worried about the prospects list, Chris Sale wasn’t on the top 100 list either the year after he got draft. Mainly because he was already in the big leagues but not the point
@goplen05
Beckham was 20th in BA’s top 100 in 2009:
http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/prospects/rankings/top-100-prospects/2009/267698.html
I went and looked just liked you asked us to lol.
@SouthSideFan3
Beckham is actually a free agent, but he was traded from the Braves late in the season to the San Francisco Giants (although it was too later for him to be play off eligible. Of course your point is still valid even if you missed out on the last part.
I just don’t get why Nationals are after Sale. You have two aces in Max and Strasburg. You have two solid pitchers in Roark and Ross. You have one serviceable guy in Gio. Giolito and Lopez, etc can be back up. Bench, lineup, and relief have needs.
Because the Nationals know they only have 3 years to win the World Series because reportedly the Nats are already preparing to move on from Bryce Harper after 2018. The preparing to move on from him because he’s reportedly asking for a 10 year, 400 million dollar deal
If the want Sale though they’re going to have to give up Turner because everyone is offering basically same prospect package and no reason for the White Sox to trade Sale unless the other teams give them a reason to
Given Sale’s contract and numbers, WS have every right to ask for the biggest package. They should start with buyer’s number 1 prospect/young ML ready player with lots of control and go from there. Turner is that guy for Nationals which is why I want Nationals to stay away from Sale. Wish we could trade for Eaton but I think he will cost a similar package (if not more) given the control remaining on that team friendly contract and his numbers.
They have already said they wouldn’t trade Turner. He is too valuable to them as as either a SS or CF.
Who knows, maybe they changed their stance. But I think that if they came in saying Turner is untouchable and thought they could do it without him, it says something that they are still talking. I think it points more towards them being able to work something out without his inclusion.
They have every right to ask, but zero reasons to not take the best offer.
They have every reason to not take the best offer if they don’t find the best offer to be satisfactory at this time.
Sox are smart to go for the jugular in this market. They’re at a fork in the road and see the bull market for pitchers. They’re selling high.
As an Astros fan, I wish we’d leave the Sale sweepstakes to the Nats and Red Sox, but that’s the nature of the game. Owners/GM’s flinch as they get closer to the title and the sense of urgency becomes greater.
Nationals won division last year despite Harper not playing to his standard. Nationals did not win division in 2015 despite his MVP year. In short, Nationals have been and will be more than Bryce Harper. I have always believed Rizzo’s motto to contend every year. That seems more reasonable than betting the farm for one player who does not add enough wins.
winning the division is one thing, winning the world series is another
Nats have two more seasons with Harper to try and win it all before he goes bye bye, it’s now or never…time to load up
I don’t believe that.
Nationals can contend and win WS without Harper also.
Harper is about to enter a make or break season. If he wants $400 million , he needs to have two more MVP caliber seasons. At this point, Machado is the bigger prize in that class.
Maybe because they know they can’t count on Strasburg to even make it all the way to the playoffs… They’d feel much better going into the season/playoffs with him as their #3 I would imagine. Then they don’t have to count on him, and IF he can make it to the playoffs fully healthy, they’d have an absolutely devestating playoff rotation with the best 1-3 in baseball IMO.
If that was their thinking, they would not have signed him to such a huge extension.
Or they’re trying to hedge their bet to be safe. If Strasburg gets hurt, they’ll still contend. If he stays healthy, they’ll be in excellent shape. Plans change when someone like Chris Sale becomes available at his age and skill level with that contract. It doesn’t happen very often for a reason.
Completely agree with this. You could even say a 1-2-3-4 because it would be Scherzer, Sale, Strasburg, Roark, and maybe even 5 if they don’t have to give up Ross. I think the fact that Strasburg has missed all of their playoff series is what is making them think of getting Sale. If he is healthy, amazing 1-3. If not, going into the playoffs with Scherzer and Sale is awesome too.
He has not. Team shut him down once (2012) and he was there in 2014. He missed only 2016. No doubt he is injury prone and Sale would be a great acquisition but it does not have solve their multiple issues at other positions, SS/CF (depending where TT plays if he is still with the team), relief, bench.
As a Braves fan, I can honestly say I don’t mind the Gnats winning this contest. We need a true ace and they cost in either money or prospects but I don’t want the Braves to pay the steep price this season. We are getting better by the day but we need a more complete team to truly compete and giving up every day guys like Ender or a possible future solid guy in Folty is not worth it yet. Better to line the time lines up, serious WS contending team and then get the ace via trade/free agency/ or home grown.
I agree, let Nat’s get both Cutch and Dale and limit what they have been building. They will lose Harper soon anyways. Wouldn’t mind seeing Archer in the rotation, but regardless will be a great week.
Sale, sorry.
I agree, let the Nationals ‘win’ the bidding for Sale and McCutchen.
what I don’t get is what these teams think they are going to give up for Sale if it isn’t there #1 prospect? We are talking about a top 5 pitcher in the game with a very team friendly contract showing no signs of decline – in fact he’s getting better learning to pitch than throw.
He has not, in fact, been getting better.
Those teams are loaded with prospects their #2 prospects are better than most teams #1 prospect and they know it. The red sox 2nd prospect is moncada, the Nats it’s giolito, albies with the Braves if they don’t get him it’s not like they’re in a bad position they’re loaded with young talent they believe one player isn’t worth 2 or 3 of those guys evidently.
Actually the number one prospect in Baseball is Moncada so he is their number one.
Some have said benintendi because of their play at the major league level. You definitely prefer the plug and play aspect of benintendi over moncada. Either way the talent is flush in those organizations if they value someone as to much they can and still give up premo talent for sale it doesn’t have to be their #1.
Benintendi is technically no longer a prospect or listed with them.
I wonder if Rizzo will cave and give up Robles. Giolito, Robles, Lopez, Kieboom, and a couple of smaller pieces. A couple of Taylor, Voth, Cole,
Then send Fedde and and one or two to KC for Davis.
Jerry Reinsdorf on trading Sale:
“You have to have four prospects who can’t possibly miss to get one,” White Sox chairman I’ve seen so many players over the years who were going to be phenoms, they were going to be future Hall of Famers, and we don’t even remember what their names are anymore. That’s why when you’re trading a player of stature you’ve got to get multiple can’t-miss prospects back. That’s why it makes it tough to trade a player of great stature.”
So yes anyone trading for him it is going to hurt big time. They aren’t giving him away for A ball players and fringe prospects. It will be pre arbitration players or upper minors players with huge ceilings.
What about getting a third team involved to help with the prospects? Otherwise going after McCutchen AND Sale likely pulls the nationals farm system dry and likely depletes them of major league talent as well.
The thing is, if they get Sale, they can go all out for a year and a half. If all else fails, you go into the deadline with trade chips like Harper, Scherzer, Sale, Murphy, maybe Strasburg, and others. You can easily replenish the farm system to make up for what is done now.
Even at that point, you could do a partial sell off. Pay and extend Harper and then sell off Scherzer, Murphy, and Sale and a few others. You would still have a foundation of Harper, Turner, Rendon, Strasburg, and some others. Not a bad starting point for building the next team.
Yeah, teams are going to be lining up for a 34 year old Scherzer who is due about a gazillion dollars in backloaded salary.
Murph is only signed for 2018, so they couldn’t sell him off, he’d be a FA.
Also I have not seen anybody even mention the possibility of Sale getting injured or seeing some decline. A lot of scouts were worried about his delivery and frame, now he’s thrown 1,000 innings in 5 years. Stranger things have happened then Sale getting injured after being worked this hard.
Getting both sale and McCutchen will probably lead the nationals to trade Turner in a deal for sale.
Although Cutch would be nice at the right price, I don’t think they need him. They need to get Sale and Wade Davis to complete their team. Then, just sign either Desmond or Fowler.
Why do they need Sale? They have Strasburg, Max, Roark, and Ross. Gio is a perfectly fine #5.
Because Strasburg hasn’t been able to stay healthy into the playoffs yet, which is when it matters. If they get him, they don’t need to rely as much on Strasburg. If he is healthy, you go in with a 1-2-3-4 of Scherzer, Sale, Strasburg, Roark. If not like last year, you go in with Scherzer and Roark, Not at all the same.
They don’t need to build a team to make it to the playoffs. They have that easily..They need to build a team to beat the Cubs with Arrieta, Lester, and Hendricks.
You can always add a starting pitcher at trade deadline for that. I wanted Nationals to trade for Hill last July. If they had, they probably go farther in playoffs than they did.
Deadline deals can be a crapshoot. You do not have control over who is available and what other suitors might exist.
Deadline prices can be steep as well, you can’t rely on that
Trading for Sale provides insurance in case another starter gets injured
Lets be honest and think about this logically.
Who do you think is going to blink first: The White Sox who do not need to trade Sale, and who is also probably the most valuable pitcher in the game( performance and contract)
Or the team trying to acquire him, bidding against other teams proposals trying to take advantage of their window of contention.
Sox will get their asking price if traded. No premium pitcher traded in the last several years has brought back an underwhelming package.
Sox fans need to be patient. There are no quality free agent options on the market for starting pitchers right now.
I get not wanting to part with your best young prospect, but you have to give quality to get quality. I think they have come down from their initial ask of 5 top prospects, and are willing to make a deal for 4 top prospects, but the headliner has to be elite
I have to disagree. You have the Nats saying they won’t trade Turner but can offer Giolito and Robles. Atlanta won’t give up Swanson, and they are still in a partial rebuild so they aren’t pressed to make a move. The Astros said they won’t trade Bregman and could look elsewhere.
In my mind, the Sox aren’t completely in the drivers seat. You have guys like Archer and Gray that are available that won’t cost any of those guys. If you wait until the deadline, you definitely aren’t getting any of those guys because they are all already in the majors and contributing daily for their respective teams.
He is worth a ton, for sure. But to say the Nats are going to suddenly give up Turner isn’t correct in my mind. They are desperate, but they are bidding mostly against themselves. Boston isn’t going to give up Moncada and Benintendi either, and most of these premium prospects from all teams will be in the majors this year.
What makes the sox trade Sale for Giolito and Robles as the main pieces? Giolito most likely won’t be half the pitcher Sale is now, and Robles is 19 in A ball. Those type of players fizzle out all the time.
It is hilarious that people think that Chris Sale isn’t worth a player who has played half an MLB season. He is possible the best pitcher outside Kershaw, but pitches in the AL and cost a third of the salary.
Also, you think the Sox have each team’s best and final offer. Things can change quite a bit if you think you are about to loose out on a player like Sale.
Sox are completely in the drivers seat. Worse case he plays the season in chicago. They will get elite prospects no matter when they trade him. Look at the Chapman and Miller trades.
Because it would restock a team with multiple high-end prospects? That’s why any team trades their valuable pieces. In Giolito, Robles, and Lopez you are getting two top 10 prospects and a top 50. And if you factor in that more pieces would be involved, that’s a huge haul. And it’s not necessarily that he isn’t worth Turner, he just means too much for the Nats. Plus, that have a lot of high end prospects outside of him.
And yes, they probably have an idea of what they would get as a final offer from a lot of teams. The Braves won’t give up Swanson, and he will be in the majors this year so he won’t suddenly be traded at the deadline. Same thing with Bregman. Maybe the Red Sox step in and offer one of Moncada or Benintendi, but they won’t offer both.
Yes, they can wait. Maybe they do. Also, worst case scenario is he gets hurt next year and his value drops significantly. That’s happened to a couple of teams in recent years.
They want MLB ready players not 19 year old A ball players who fizzle out left and right. And they are not trying to restock the minors with pitching. They have no problem developing pitching. They need positions players so the Nats without Turner have nothing to headline.
Then no deal time to move on but apparently the White Sox seem to think there is value there. A lot of talk between the two teams to not think there might be a deal and nats have already said they are not trading Trea Turner. Should be interesting to see but regardless I think that White Sox fans are going to be disappointed regardless of who they get.
I think you can make that claim when any face of the franchise superstar is traded, which is why it doesn’t happen that frequently. Especially when you’re talking about prospects that aren’t sure things, even if they are highly touted.
what makes you think giolito wont be a 2-3 win pitcher?
Sox fans need to stop being delusional. Turner and Bregman have both shown the ability to be at least average mlb players and are controlled for 6 years at cheap prices (yes Sale is being underpaid, but he will cost more for 3 years than those players will @ league minimum). There is a very good chance that over the course of their respective contracts that Trea Turner and Bregman both out produce sale, given that they would only need to produce about 1/2 of his value each year since they have twice as much control. Add on top of that, that you are expecting additional top prospects be added to any deal and it just doesn’t make sense for these teams to part with them.
If you remove someone like bregman or turner to trade for sale, you are dramatically reducing the actual benefit your team gets from adding sale because you are subtracting the production of those young players from your MLB lineup.
Sox fans are not delusional for having a justified high asking price for Sale
Premium talent carries a premium price tag
Multiple suitors drive up the price
It would be a different story if they had to deal Sale, but with three season of team control he is available for trade. If demands are not met then we keep him
Multiple suitors have all stated that they are not trading their young mlb talents that you seem to think they need in a package. It simply does not make sense for these teams to subtract from their MLB roster to acquire sale. It diminishes the actual benefit of adding a pitcher like him.
Since when do the White Sox have no problem developing pitching?
Between 2005-2013, they took a total of 27 pitchers within the first four rounds of the draft. Chris Sale is one of them. A few others became decent relievers (Addison Reed, Jake Petricka). And the other 24? Guys like Aaron Poreda, Kyle McCulloch, Lance Broadway, Nevin Griffith, Ricky Brooks, Matt Heidenreich, David Holmberg, Thomas Royse, etc.
And sure, young pitchers are hit and miss – but they didn’t do any better in the remainder of those drafts. In the past 10 drafts, only four other pitchers have had any type of success at the major league level, and three of them (Hector Santiago, Chris Devenski, and Daniel Hudson) were primarily for other teams. Nate Jones is the only one who’s contributed to Chicago.
Chris Sale is really the only pitcher they’ve drafted within the past decade that has actually developed. Jose Quintana, of course, is great, but then again, he only played nine minor league games for Chicago – the rest were with other teams, so it’s hard to claim they “developed” him.
Rodon looks like he could be good, but he was also the third overall pick, so he should be. And he hasn’t developed nearly as fast as other pitching prospects in the 2015 Top 100 (Noah Syndergaard, Jon Gray, Julio Urias, Steve Matz, Jameson Taillon, Aaron Sanchez).
“Rodon looks like he could be good, but he was also the third overall pick, so he should be.”
Can’t you say that about basically all of the Cubs young position players? Nearly every one that was a big contributor was a top 10 pick. They should be good. Yet they are constantly touted as being great at developing positional talent. That’s how it works. Talent outweighs coaching/development 99% of the time, and it’s a lot easier to “develop” these talented players.
Also, you’re listing players that have had significantly more time to develop so far. Syndergaard was drafted in 2010. Gray was drafted in 2013. Matz was drafted in 2009. Taillon was drafted in 2010. Sanchez was also drafted in 2010. Rodon was drafted in 2014. To claim that these other guys have developed faster (outside of Urias who is a freak) is ridiculous. Give Rodon another 4 years like the rest of those guys have had, and then you can compare them.
In addition to that, is it really THAT hard to claim that the Sox developed Jose Quintana? He was pretty mediocre in the Yankees system and never made it above A ball in his 5 years before the Sox grabbed him as a minor-league free agent. They put him straight in AA, and he looked good enough to get a call up after only 9 games. He’s been a mainstay in the rotation ever since. I don’t think it’s a stretch to say they figured something out with him. Maybe he figured it out all by himself? Nobody knows. But all signs point towards someone in the White Sox system figuring something out with him. Either that, or the Yankees were really bad at evaluating there own talent considering he was in their system for so long.
If that were true, would all these teams be hanging up the phones due to their exorbitant asking price?
The sox need to trade sale now just as much as teams need his services in 2017. One injury and sale loses 80% of his value.
Don’t believe everything you read.
Yeah, but the White Sox don’t have to trade Sale to the highest bidder. Unless, that bid is exactly what they are asking for. They are just as likely to be happy with going into the season with a rotation of Sale, Q, and Carlos Rodon with Carson Fulmer waiting in the wings.
And they can continue to be awful. Have fun with that.
You are missing the point — Sox do have to move Sales before Spring Training because he hates Ken Williams so much that he was poisoning the clubhouse.
No they do not have to trade him. Doesn’t matter if he hates Williams, he has a contract for three more years.
So much stupidity in such a small post.
Nats should put Harper in play… Talk to the Yankees about Sanchez and Betances.
No. First, they could get a lot more if they offered him. Second, they need him to compete this year. They won’t trade their MVP candidate while trying to push for the World Series.
Rick Hahn just needs to tell teams what he wants for Sale and not settle for anything other then that. He needs to realize that he’s the pretty girl that everyone wants to date, not the other way around.
Be patient, let other teams get involved in a bidding war that drives up the price.
That’s what I’m saying. As Hawk would say “Sit back, relax and” wait for Mike Rizzo to wake up one morning loving the idea of Scherzer, Sale, and Strasburg in a 7 game series against the Cubs.
If the nats truly feel like they are going to compete next year then they need to give up something to get something. I am sorry but a package build around Giolito and Robles 19 yr old in Adv A may have my attention for Quintana but not for Sale. They need some MLB talent coming back in return and by MLB talent I am not talking about Michael Taylor and his .228/..281/..363 slash line. It starts with Turner. If the Nats say no then there is no deal. I completely see the Nats not wanting to give up Turner and I see why the Sox wouldn’t trade without him involved. I doubt a deal happens.. Nats still have quite a bit of work to trump the Cubs. They have about a two year window to have the chance to go all in and I think they should do it. They lost their closer to the Giants, Harper is demanding a 400mil extension, and they are not willing to give up to get which is key.. The Nats have a good team but by no means great. Holding on to Trea Turner will let the Nats make the playoffs as either the NL East champs or WC. They will get bounced again and watch Harper walk, Stras health diminish, and a missed opportunity to go all in and win a World Series.
Nationals need to decide if standing pat gives them the best shot to win now, or if they should go all in and trade for Sale
It all just depends on the price I suppose. If it does require Turner, I think they pass along with everyone else. I think he is too important to their team now as someone can who can play SS and CF along with batting lead-off. I think they instead look for a bat at that point and get one of Chapman, Jansen, or Davis.
As a Sox fan I totally get not wanting to part with Trea Turner, but I have a tough time seeing how Sale gets dealt without a marquee headliner coming back to them
Shelby Miller returned Inciarte, Swanson and Blair…and Miller is nowhere near as good as Sale.
Chapman got the Yankess Gleyber Torres plus more
A Miller got the Yankees Frazier and Sheffield plus two more pieces
The market has been set very high, do not expect Chicago to settle for less when they do not have to trade him.
I don’t think you can compare any trade to the one for Shelby Miller. That was deemed a loss for the DBacks as soon as it went through, and was already considered one of the worst trades. No team will make a trade like that again, so that is not a value.
What about Chapman and Miller trades recently? Both netted top prospects
Sale is worth WAY more than a Chapman rental or two seasons of Miller
Gleyber torres is 19 and in advanced A. Weren’t you (or some other sox fan) just complaining earlier about not wanting 19 year old prospects like that because they fizzle out?
@ Steven,
the biggest thing about the Chapman and the Miller trades is both the Cubs and the Indians were all but guaranteed a playoff spot when they dealt for those two relievers. They KNEW like 99.99999% that they’d be in the playoffs and felt strongly that Chapman and Miller were the type of specifically talented players that would put them over the top (which they did for the most part). That is why both Cleveland and Chicago paid such insanely high cost in terms of talent for the two relievers.
It isn’t the first time that a team paid an ultra high price for the piece (s) that they felt would send them over the top during the middle of the season.
Same could be said of the nationals if they acquire sale. they have an excellent chance of making the playoffs.
I won’t deny that Steven, but it is much easier to know for sure around the midpoint of the season, than it is before the winter meetings are even over.
Besides Turner and Giolito, what other players should go to White Sox for Sale?
I don’t think it happens with Turner. I think it starts with Giolito and Robles and includes a lot of other pieces from there.
And who are these other pieces that are going to peak the Sox interest? I honestly don’t think Robles interest them much at all. Way too far away.
Drew Pomeranz brought back a player like Robles (Anderson Espinoza)
So there is no way I am Robles and Giolito is enough to headline
Fedde, Voth, Cole, Kieboom, Difo, maybe even Ross. The Nats have a great farm system. 4 guys in the top 100 plus some fringe ones with a lot of potential.
If you were the White Sox, would you accept a Giolito/Robles based offer?
I would not
Thats heavy on pitching. What difference making hitters do you have? None without Tuner.
Would I like to get the top pitching prospect in the game along with a top OF prospect and several other pieces? Yes, yes I would. you can use your other pieces to get a bat or flip those pitchers elsewhere. You’re talking about 2 of the top prospects in baseball as a STARTING point. That’s in line with Benintendi and Moncada from the Red Sox, except they would never give you both.
I do not consider Giolito to be the best pitching prospect in the game, especially after his ugly mlb performance
If Giolito was truly the game’s best pitchign prospect then Washington would be more unwilling to trade him than Turner…the fact that Giolito seems very much to be on the table should tell you something
Buyer beware
That is not even close to being in line with Benintendi and Moncada. Both are much more sure things than Robles or Giolito. Also, they are position players which the Sox covet much more than pitching.
Why? Turner is either their SS or CF and is also their lead-off hitter. He has more value to them right now. With Giolito, he is blocked by Scherzer, Strasburg, Roark, Gio, and Ross, which makes him expendable. It has nothing to do with talent, just current needs.
How are they more of a sure thing? Plus, Moncada is owed like $60M. If he fails, not only does the prospect fail but you owe him a ton of money. Benintendi is also young. None of them are a sure thing at all. My point is, the Sox aren’t going to offer both.
The majority of <Moncada's contract was paid as a signing bonus. The rest of his contract is relatively small
So what were you saying about not taking a sale/Robles based deal?
It’s understandable that teams want to keep their number one position prospects. I mean just ask us White Sox fans how the great Gordon Beckham became for us. Oh oops… Maybe we should keep Chris Sale after all.
If the package is not stellar, I say we keep Sale
The Nationals are going to try hard to sell a Giolito + Robles package, but I don’t see the White Sox biting. That may get you a #2 starting pitcher, but not an ace
Again, Gordon Beckham is a terrible comparison, and doesn’t mean anything at all. Turner was the #11 prospect in baseball in 2015 before going into the majors. Beckham wasn’t even top 100.
Yah, you don’t know what you’re talking about. Gordon Beckham was a very highly regarded prospect coming out of college and got drafted 8th overall. In his 3 years in college, he put up OPS’s of .838, .969, and 1.323 as a shortstop. Baseball America had him at #20 pre-2009, and Baseball Prospectus had him at #28. After only about 60 minor league games in 08 and 09, he moved up to the majors and OPS’ed .808. If he was prospect eligible going into the next year, I have no doubt in my mind he would’ve been easily in the top 20. He was a legit talent despite what you may think.
For reference, Turner was ranked in the 60’s out of the draft. He didn’t jump up until after a year in the minors.
Alright, I was wrong about that one. I must have been looking at the wrong list. I remember he was highly touted, but all you had to say was he #20. I didn’t see him on the list for 2015.
Either way, my point was more that Turner is important to them now. Controllable and fills their need at SS or CF and lead-off spot.
We will see what happens, probably sooner rather than later.
Yeah, it takes players like that to get a Chris Sale.
I guess it just depends on how much money the Nats have to spend too. If they have money to go sign a Fowler and Desmond or something, maybe they include him. But, they still need a closer too.
Yes it does. Because Beckham was top 10 draft, unlike Turner, who came up and had a very successful rookie season in the big leagues, and every team that the White Sox dealt with wanted Beckham in return. Sound comparable to any prospects we’re dealing with? But again if you’re the top prospect list predicts success what happened with Chris Sale? Because he wasn’t on the list after he got drafted either
Again, I’m not really saying he isn’t worth someone like Turner in different circumstances. I more just think that they can pull it off without including him, and if the Sox insisted on him, they would walk away (as Rizzo said they would do). The fact that they are talking today after Rizzo said he was completely off-limits leads me to believe they made traction on a deal without him and are going deeper into it.
And I’m not saying that a top 100 list predicts everything. Of course there are exceptions and it isn’t reliable. But usually your top 10 is a safer bet.
Let’s be fair here. Turner was the 13th overall pick. It’s not like he was some back of the first round pick or a later round scrub out of college. Still, with that being said, he wasn’t as highly regarded as Beckham out of college and didn’t have the immediate success that Beckham did.
The question is at best Turner turns out to be what… a faster Chase Utley with less power? Is Chase Utley projection, at best, worth Chris Sale as the center piece of a deal?
What? Chase Utley? Turner is a SS or CF with speed. Maybe less power, but more steals and other things beneficial in a lead-off spot. And Chase Utley was good. Not sure what you are getting at. You are talking about Chase Utley projection as if that’s bad.
Yea, I’d take prime Chase Utley in a heartbeat.
Chase Utley put up a career 63 fWAR and had a peak with 5 years above 7. Chris Sale has never topped 6.2. So if you think that Turner is going to put up Chase Utley like numbers, then no, you would most certainly not trade him.
Yep. I’m not really sure what point he was trying to make with that point. Utley was a beast in his prime and through most of his career.
I saw him listed as a 2b on some site. So who does Chris Sale project as? Randy Johnson? Would you trade Chase Utley for Randy Johnson? is Trea Turner going to be as good as Lindor? Russell? Point being it takes a highly touted prospect to get a proven commodity. Both teams have to win here.
I’ll do one better. Would you trade Kershaw for Utley? Thats the talent you are getting with Sale.
Umm…I think you are cherry picking with that one. But I would say it depends on when you are talking about. Utley’s prime vs. Kershaw? No. Utley put up a WARs of 7, 8.8, and 8 in his prime. Kershaw’s highest is 7.9. It really depends on what your needs are.
I like pitching and being worth almost 8 WAR as a pitcher is nuts. But to compare the two is weird.
Do you even bother looking at stats? Chris Sale simply isn’t Clayton Kershaw he isn’t Randy Johnson either.
Chris Sale is also pitching in the American League. Throw him in the National League, and I’d be willing to bet he’ll be as close to Kershaw stat-wise as anyone.
He never said Chris Sale is Randy Johnson. He said that could be his projection. Turner simply isn’t Chase Utley either. He could project to be him going forward.
Also, if you bothered to look at the stats, you’d know that Chris Sale’s first 5 seasons as a starter were actually pretty significantly better than Randy Johnson’s… I’m not saying he’ll become what Randy Johnson became, but it’s certainly not out of the question for someone with that talent.
I did look at the stats – Sale is better.
Sale can’t be projected to be randy johnson…look at pitcher aging curves. Unless you expect Chris Sale to take some monumental steps forward and defy the traditional aging curves (like RJ), then the comparison is simply stupid. You can say look at their first 5 seasons all you want, it is meaningless, unless you expect a very, very unlikely step forward from chris sale, like that of Randy Johnson. And guess what, no team is going to value chris sale with that sort of assumption, so again, it is stupid to say that he projects as randy johnson or compare him to clayton kershaw.
Additionally, you do realize there are a myriad of league adjusted stats that prove you are incorrect, yes?
Chris Sale is better than Clayton kershaw and randy johnson? Look harder.
I’m not claiming he’ll take those monumental steps. Simply stating that it’s not out of the question for someone with that kind of talent and the track record he has put together. You’re right, nobody will value him like a prime Randy Johnson because that’d be stupid, and nobody will value Trea Turner like a prime Chase Utley because that’d be stupid. You’re trading a relatively unknown quantity for a known quantity. If a team believes they are a Chris Sale away from winning the World Series, they’ll pull the trigger. If not, they won’t. It’s really that simple.
Also, this “myriad of league adjusted stats” is far from perfect. Despite that, they still say Chris Sale is one of the top pitchers in the league. Again, I did not say that he’d be as good as Kershaw if he goes to the National League. I said he’d be as close to him stat-wise as anyone else in the league. Over the last 5 years, the only players ahead of him on ERA- are Cueto (by 3) and deGrom (by 1). The only players ahead of him on FIP- are Syndergaard (by 5) and Harvey (by 2). The only players ahead of him on xFIP= are Syndergaard, Carrasco, and Strasburg (all within 5).
Please tell me how it’s a stretch to say his numbers would be as close to Kershaw’s as anybodies if he goes to the NL. Syndergaard is the only other player alive (Jose Fernandez) that’s inside the top 5 in all of those. Seems pretty convincing to me, unless you have some other stats in your myriad that prove otherwise.
And NO, I do not think Chris Sale is better than Kershaw or Johnson like the other guy.
Jesus, no wonder Chicago isn’t able to move sale. The fan base is all but convinced he’s randy Johnson or kershaw, or somehow better.
Two straight year of a 3.34 or worse era. Neither of the last two years has he been in the top 8 in terms of ERA in the American League, much less the majors.
Excellent pitcher? Yes. Ace? Yes. Worth a blank check worth of prospects? Hardly.
Yes, because ERA is the be all end all for pitchers. Top 8, huh? Quite the arbitrary number as he was #9 last year and #10 the year before. I also like how we are only using the last 2 years because it fits our argument the best, seeing as he was #2 in the AL 3 years ago with a 2.17 ERA, #7 the year prior at 3.07, and #4 his first year as a starter at 3.06.
Lets also overlook the mediocre fielders behind him and the park he plays in. Despite finishing outside of the “top 8” in ERA last year, he finished #3 in FIP. He was #1 in 2015, #3 in 2014, #5 in 2013, and #5 in 2012.
Nobody outside of that 1 guy thinks he’s better than Kershaw.
Put Sale in the NL with an actual defense behind him and look out.
Take a look at Sale and Max’s numbers when they were both in the AL Central for years… with Sale being in hitters park. Sale’s are better across the board.
Then look at what Max has done in the NL. Then factor in you get 3 years of Sale a little more than the price of Max for a season.
Bottom line for a team like the Nats you’re going to have a serious shot to win right now for the next few years… then Harper may be gone, Max is into mid thirties, Werth’s deal becomes an albatross. You know you got a shot to win it now, 4 years from now, not so much.
For all the bullpen success in the post season, they Cubs won the world series cause Cleveland, LA & SF were a starter short and had to max guys on short rest and that’s who they have to beat.
Now if you’re answer to making sure you’re not an arm short is Chris Sale for 3 years at 39mil… you’d have to take a very very serious look at that.
I really hope the Red Sox make a deal 4 Sale..A pitcher like that don’t come around 4 trade much.Sale could put them over the edge to win the WS..
AL pennant favorites next three years and will still keep Moncada.
White sox and nationals is very tough trade without Turner and I don’t see it being done without him. Sox are focused on position players and nationals don’t have that without Turner. They are looking for a position player headliner who is MLB ready. The only player the Nationals have who meets this need is Turner. Robles is way too far off to meet this need. Sorry Nats fan but you need to pick one. Still think Boston can put together better package same with Astros.
Gordon Beckham was the #20 prospect in baseball in February 2009.
Turner is tradeable for an elite arm like Sale. If the Nationals don’t contend they can always flip Sale or Harper down the line to replenish prospects…or try to extend Sale?
I believe Boston will put a great package together to get Sale.
I really hope not unless the price comes down.
I can see them giving up three prospects for him that’s it.
The White Sox wanted JBJ and Moncada at the trade deadline are you OK with trading JBJ, Moncada and Erod because that is what it is going to take. They want major league ready talent it appears that seems like a lot to me. I’m sure the White Sox fans are going to say not enough but my guess is the Red Sox offered that deal to the White Sox it would be a done deal. I would not do that would you BoSox4life?
I don’t think the Red Sox keep Moncada if they trade for Sale they will demand him most likely.
I can guarantee you the White Sox are not trading Sale for three guys. Stud pitchers get traded for that at the trade deadline in July. Sale has 3 more years left on his deal. If they don’t get what they want, they will wait. The Cubs had to give up their top prospect for a couple of months of Chapman.
Depends on the three guys.
I hope the Braves wise and up and realize the need for a sp like Sale, prospects are great to have but not everyone of them pan out. So anytime you can add a proven arm over a prospect I’d take advantage of having a deep prospect system.
I do not get these teams worrying about over paying in prospects. The vast majority of them do not turn out. Chris Sale is a one of a kind talent, on a team friendly deal. It is very likely that no matter who the Sox get they are going to loose this trade.
I much rather the Sox keep him, open up the wallet and sign a fowler or Encarnación and maybe a bullpen arm or two. To me that would be truly going for it. The Sox have fed their fans a line of BS that they were going for it the last two years. But, their payrolls were pretty average at $115 million.
I find it disrespectful to the fans to trade a talent like Sale with three years left on the deal, and several other high end players. If you cannot even compete with players like Abreu, Sale, Quintatna, Eaton, Anderson, Rodon, Robertson, and Frazier you should be fired because you are truly terrible at your job. And I am not even saying win the division but at least be relevant in September and in the wild card chase.
The Front office ineptitude is unreal.
How many other teams would trade a Sale with his great contract with 3 years left on it.
Reinsdorf cannot get rid of the team soon enough.
The problem with going for it is that the Sox have too many needs to address. We have questions marks at CF, 2B, DH, C, bullpen
That is too many holes to fill in one offseason
Second base is fine with lawrie and saladino. Weiters, Fowler, and a bull pen piece or two should make this team able to at minimum compete for a wild card spot.
I would be very nervous to sign a 30 year old Wieters to a big contract. I think it would be a big mistake
Fowler is a quality player, but what is the pricetag? We are not one or two moves away
I think the Sox are a couple pieces away from competing for the Wild card. And then Once they are in I like their chances with the pitching they have.
Which team in the Central this season looks unbeatable? Twins no, Tigers no, Royals: half their team is in the last year of their deals.
Indians are the only team
It’s really too bad the Sox front office has made so many mistakes in previous years. Guys like Sale, Quintana, Eaton, Anderson and Rodon are a great core to build around. Would be very curious to see how a new manager handles things with them on the roster. If Sale is moved, I’m afraid of the Sox front office messing that up too.
Exactly since 2012 I do not think a front office has done less with this amount off talent. I saw an article that since 2012 the Sox have had over 30 players suit up for them and then never make another major league appearance again. So basically those 30 players plus should have never of even been on a major league roster.
I am not a White Sox fan but I would like to know why they have underachieved for their talent level. Is their coaching that bad? They seem to have a team that, on paper, should be very competitive and scary in the playoffs what gives?
I would have to say yes, Robin Ventura was THAT bad. Awful coach that only had a job for so long because of Jerry’s loyalty (only got the job because of it too). Which is one of the many, many reasons why it was hilarious when the national media was calling him out for not being loyal following the whole Laroche debacle.
JB Shuck being a -1.8 WAR
James Shields being -1.9 WAR
Navarro -0.6 WAR
All of those things really killed the White Sox, along with bad coaching
Exactly. And why were these players on the team? The front office is horrible. They finally got rid of john Danks and his horrible contract, and then some how get an even worse player.
You do know teams could include certain players (like Turner, Swanson, Bregman, etc…) if the Sox would add more on their end than just for Sale. Frazier, Robertson, Cabrera, Eaton Jones, even a Carson Fulmer/Spencer Adams could entice a team to add one of their blue chip prospects in the deal.
In the end I believe it’s going to take a 3 way deal to satisfy Chicago in trading Chris Sale.
Eaton and Jones have a significant amount of value on their own and are far more than throw ins
Frazier, Roberston, Cabrera are certainly trade chips, but I’m not sure any of them except Robertson might fit into what the Nats need
With 5 years of cheap control and what looks like a pretty solid transition to RF, Eaton is ~ as valuable a player as sale.
You do realize how valuable Eaton, Jones, Fulmer, Adams, and Frazier are? Cabrera and Robertson are the only ones that I could see as sweeteners. Sale should have enough value on his own to bring back those players. Teams are way over valuing their prospects. Sale is probably the most valuable pitcher in baseball the next three years when considering his contract. So it is laughable that any team has untouchable prospects for a player like that.
It isn’t laughable simply because they aren’t typical prospects in that they are in the minors. Turner, Bregman, and Swanson all figure to be big pieces for their teams this year, which is why they are deemed untouchable. Giving them away takes away from the ML roster, which you then have to replace elsewhere too.
I saw Turner is projected for somewhere around 3.3 WAR this year, which you would then have to replace to get a 5 WAR pitcher in Sale. That’s why they are untouchable but anyone outside of them is fine in the minors.
So let me get this straight, you thing a team is going to be able to trade for the most valuable pitcher in the game without disrupting their major league roster in any way?
Sale is virtually a lock for a 5 WAR season, turner on the other hand has played half a season. I bet more times than not, the projections turn out not very accurate for players like Turner with hardly any MLB experience to base those projections off of.
What about Trea Turner’s projection do you think will be “not very accurate”?
And if you don’t think he’s going to be that kind of player, why are you so insistent that he be included in a trade? Your bias is showing.
Yeah, you aren’t valuing prospects at all. We just disagree. Fact is, if something goes through, we will know then. Until then, neither of us is in the meeting or has any say in the process, so we are just speculating. And in doing so, we disagree. I do like debating, but we won’t know anything until later.
My point is simply that if they require Turner, talks would likely end. The fact that they haven’t leads me to believe they intrigued the Sox without him. But, we shall see.
I am saying that it is possible that he doesn’t turn out to be a good to great player? I am insistent on him because he is the Nationals only potentially difference making positions player that is MLB ready.
No Bias at all. The Sox are the ones taking the bigger gamble . Not sure what is hard to get. Sale has established his baseline in the MLB, Turner has not.
Every team trading a veteran for younger players is taking the bigger gamble. That doesn’t mean you just get to ask for an exorbitant amount of value from the other team. They will simply say no and walk away because the potential gains just don’t out weigh the potential losses even when you factor in the probability of each outcome.
Turner is the starting point than you keep adding 2 or 3 more prospects.
“They will simply say no and walk away because the potential gains just don’t out weigh the potential losses even when you factor in the probability of each outcome.”
That is very team and situation-dependent. We’ve seen players bring in huge hauls in the past when the acquiring team believes they are one piece away from potentially winning it all.
If I am Hahn, I sit in the meeting and listen to what the Nationals have to say regarding Sale.
But, I would not be overly impressed with a Giolito and Robles package
You speak about value and then just completely ignore the potential value of those “prospects” vs the potential value of sale.
Never undervalue proven mlb talent. Prospect are just that…prospects
Most will never make an impact at the mlb level, few will ever become elite over a multi year period
As good as Turner looked, he is far from an untouchable player. If The tables were turned I would certainly be willing to deal Turner in a package for Sale and then try very hard to land Fowler to play center field
That is a team that could certainly win the world series.
You never watched Turner play then.
It’s not that Sale is more valuable than another player, it’s how much do the other teams need a starting pitcher vs keeping that other player. For the Nats, Turner would be twice more valuable to them than Sale. Sale would replace the Nats’ 5th starter in Joe Ross/Gio Gonzalez. Without Turner, the Nats are left without a center fielder or shortstop (cannot have another year of full-time Espinosa).
Unless the Whitesox get absolutely blown away I don’t see the motivation or incentive to trade Sale now. A dominant young and inexpensive pitcher with time left on a reasonable contract. They don’t have to trade him now and can probably get more come mid season. I think the White Sox expect a kings ransom for Sale and I can’t blame them one bit. Teams want him way more than the White Sox need to trade him.
A team isn’t going to trade a young contributing mlb player at the deadline. Like now, it makes no sense for those teams to subtract from their current mlb teams to add sale because it offsets a lot of the benefit of acquiring him.
We have also seen that pitchers get hurt and their value can plummet. Look at the A’s and Sonny Gray and SD and Tyson Ross. There is obviously no real way to predict injuries, but pitchers get hurt far more often than position players and the possibility of injury is something the white sox need to factor in to their decision of whether to hold onto sale or cash in now.
Agree. As much as the tires will get turned in the meetings, I don’t see the asking price getting met and don’t see the Sox coming down from that price. With his contract, I see the Sox having 3-5 opportunities to trade him between the next 2 off-seasons and 3 mid-season marks with the asking price diminishing at each opportunity. The real push for the Sox to trade now would be they’re basically wasting Sale’s prime during what will be rebuilding years, if that’s the approach they take depending on takers for the other big contracts they have. So why not trade him now, so they can develop the prospects they get in return? This is the pro/con question Hahn and Williams will need to figure out.
I would trade any 3 prospects they asked for….Sale would make a BIG difference in the AL East,I am a big believer in pitching wins WS.
So you’d trade Mookie for Sale?
Mookie is not a prospect I think he means any three prospects such as Moncada, Devers, Kopech etc.
Lol what? How did you take that out of his comment?
Nats view Turner as equal to Betts (not saying he is but how the Nats view him), which is why I made the comment. Betts is the most equivalent player to Turner on the Sox roster. If you think it would be preposterous to trade Betts for Sale, than Nats think equally to Turner.
Mookie Betts has played in 355 major league games and been great. He’s a known commodity now – he was 2nd in AL MVP voting last year. If anyone views Turner as an Equal to Betts, they have bigger issues to worry about.
lol I’m sorry but Turner is not equal to Betts.
I think a better comp would be Nintedo for Turner offensively at least.
That’s what I was thinking too. Mookie just makes no sense at all.
Again, you guys are Red Sox fans. That’s how you view Betts. The Nats view Turner equally valuable to their team as the Sox view Betts.
I am not a Red Sox fan, and that’s ridiculous if true.
I’m pretty sure Priggs isn’t a Red Sox fan I am and I think a better comp is Nintendo not Betts.
Well the Sox think Sale is Greg Maddox lol it doesn’t mean he is
Benintendi isn’t a comparable. Turner’s numbers in half a season of his rookie year pans out to 116 runs, 28 HRs, 88 RBIs, and 72 SBs over a full year (he also slashed .342/.370/.567). Benintendi’s limited time pans out to 102 runs, 12 HRs, 89 RBIs, and 6 SBs. Turner can play anywhere on the field except pitcher and catcher. Benintendi is a corner outfielder.
Much better comp than Betts. Let’s give a both a full year Benentendi was better in the minors and moved faster oh and by the way he is a center fielder just happens to be in left because JBJ is in Center. If JBJ is traded he would become the center fielder right away.
I would give them Erod, Moncada, what ever other prospects they need..Plus I try to get Abrue as well..
Abreu would solve there problems at 1b and do as well..
Sale along with Abreu would be a huge package. I would think Benintendi and Moncada would both have to be in on that deal.
Mookie is no longer a prospect. But something is gonna happen soon with Sale.
I wouldn’t count on it.
I would not part with Benintendi at all, I would think the Soxs will try to put a great package for both if they have a shot 4 Abreu as well.
They could make it work without Benintendi if they use JBJ instead. 100% sure it won’t be an all prospect package if they try to get Sale AND Abreu, and we know that the White Sox love JBJ.
The White Sox love JBJ and Moncada that is what they would ask for Sale plus probably Erod which is fine because if Sale comes then they can get rid of one of their other lefties. It just doesn’t seem that DD is interested in doing that trade though. That is three players that are controllable longer and are already contributing or are the best prospect in baseball. That is a steep price to pay but maybe Sale is worth it.
There is know way on Earth the Sox are Trading Sale and Abreu for a package with Bentinneti and Mocada ……….. Come on man
And the beat goes on…then again, I have always loved the hot stove and all the rumors!
I have a feeling this guy won’t be traded until the trade deadline when people are more desperate.
I think so too !
Chris Sale, Eaton, Abreu, Robertson to the Jays
Stroman, Pillar, Foley, Alford, Ureña, Tellez, McGuire, Ramirez, Zeuch, Hollon and Smoak to the White Sox
Seriously?
Tim Anderson is the Sox SS going forward, are they going to play Turner in the OF if they get him? surely they are targeting positions of need, and don’t want to have to season someone in the minors to get them up to speed in their new position…they have needs at 2B, 3B, C and corner OF right
CF or 2B. People overrate how hard it is to move positions, especially for a SS moving to 2B. The only “difficult” thing to learn is turning double plays from a different angle. I’m sure he’d be just fine learning on the fly.
still if im the white sox im chasing Robles, Giolito ahead of Turner.
It might make since if Robles wasn’t so far away from the majors. But as it stands, Turner makes a lot more sense for them.
Almost no doubt Turner plays CF on white sox. Sox want to keep Eaton in RF very badly.
I’m disgusted, but hardly shocked that the ESPN machine is promoting the idea that Sale is an injury risk. It helps their boys in Boston run down the price of Sale so maybe Boston can pick him up for peanuts. First of all…..EVERY pitcher is an injury risk. So is every position player but you don’t hear ESPN saying the White Sox should be careful because Moncada could pull up lame tomorrow.
The Sale thing is gettin beaten like a dead horse. The White Sox need to move on if teams only want to offer scraps. Pick up a decent defensive catcher, a center fielder who can catch and throw and try to get a wild card. If they fall flat try again at the deadline.
Sale is junk!
That’s cute.
Turner>Mookie
Nice Troll
What would it take to get Carlos Rodon?
See, as i said, Coppy was just teasing the fans again. He is no different from Wren. Talk but no action. Just trade Julio Teheran if you plan on losing for the next 5 years!
I’m as big of a Oriole homer as all the White Sox fans on this post but no way Sale is worth Turner or Lucas Giolitio and Robles plus. Sale is a great pitcher probably Top 3 in AL but Archer is slightly less comparable but will cost signifcantly less. Same amount of K’s, slightly higher ERA.
If Archer costs significantly less than Sale, then someone in the Rays front office will be fired.
Sale is worth his weight in gold. A dominant, young, controllable and inexpensive pitcher in his prime that continues to put up All Star numbers on a lousy team. If the Nationals want to win now he is worth whatever the White Sox want for him. Pitchers like Sale especially considering his contract are like unicorns. Position players, even the young up and coming all stars are no doubt valuable but don’t tell me Turner is worth anywhere near Sale. Can you imagine Sale in the Natonal League with a solid hitting line up behind him. Cy Young potential for sure. What an insane pitching rotation that would be. Definitely surpasses the Mets assuming their entire young rotation is healthy come opening day. Which is assuming a lot.
I would start negotiating with the Cubs and scare the hell out of other teams. Who would be able to stop the Cubs with the addition of Sale?
If Sale is ready to break down, you would think the White Sox would make their best deal, and move on.
I’m curious on what Robertson is worth solo. Would adding him to Sale deal add Turner to Nats offer?
Red Sox are lurkers here.
How was Chicago so stubbornly stupid with taking trade request, turning down way better offers!!
Then you end up gettting a better package for Eaton then Sale!!
Your Management may look like geniuses, but they just stumbled on a brain dead nationals Management!
Anybody wanna make a bet on go fund me or how ever you can keep adding $20 buck a week or a month, till one side taps out!!
I will bet the Stros top pitching prospect, and hitter which is Martes/Tucker plus the other two prospects y’all got vs either one of Whitley or Paulino that was offered, plus fishe who is MLB ready!! Will have a better 2017 then what y’all got in return for Chris Sale!!
Anybody want to make that bet, I will hand out all the info needed, and please no keyboard warriors or kids that don’t even have a bank account not need to reply!!
Get the free kik app, that you can communicate off here, then once your ready say BET, and I will send the info needed to reach me.