A few notes on the free-agent market as a quiet night in baseball draws to a close…
- Both the Phillies and White Sox are looking at Mike Moustakas as a fallback option in the event that Manny Machado signs elsewhere, writes Jon Morosi of MLB.com. The 30-year-old Moustakas is a fairly logical fallback option for either club should it miss out on Machado, though Moustakas is a less concrete upgrade over either club’s top incumbent options. Morosi notes that the Phils will likely try to trade Maikel Franco in the event that either Machado or Moustakas signs in Philadelphia, and presumably the ChiSox would shift Yolmer Sanchez into a utility role should it land either free-agent target. Morosi lists the Padres as a potential landing spot for Moustakas as well, though with a preexisting logjam of corner options in San Diego, that fit seems more difficult to envision without some additional roster shuffling by general manager A.J. Preller.
- The Mets are among the teams to “have talks regarding Brian Dozier lately,” tweets Jon Heyman of Fancred, though there’s no indication that the Mets plan to make a serious pursuit of Dozier. Both the Nationals and Rockies have been linked to Dozier over the past couple of weeks, and Heyman notes that the market for the longtime Twins slugger is beginning to pick up a bit of steam. Regarding the link between the Mets and Dozier, it’s worth pointing out that Mike Puma of the New York Post reported just yesterday that the Mets don’t have much more money to spend this offseason, although they’ve spent very little since GM Brodie Van Wagenen publicly stated that they “still have some real money to spend.”
- Mariners general manager Jerry Dipoto was clear about his plan to make some further additions on the free agent market following the signing of Yusei Kikuchi, writes Greg Johns of MLB.com. “We’re likely to sign both Major and Minor League contracts,” said Dipoto. “I’d be shocked if we don’t sign at least one Major League reliever. And I’d be surprised — heavily surprised — if we didn’t sign one middle-of-the-field type stabilizer in the infield to provide protection and allow J.P. Crawford to transition at the appropriate pace.” There’s still a slew of free-agent relievers remaining on the open market (MLBTR Free Agent Tracker link), and free agent shortstops are also in fairly abundant supply. Freddy Galvis, Jose Iglesias, Adeiny Hechavarria and Alcides Escobar are among the available infielders with strong defensive reputations.
Moose is underrated. Not a bad fallback option.
Yup
He was worth 0.6 more WAR than Evan Longoria and had 100 more AB. Not exactly that great of a player.
Half the year he was playing with the Royals dumpster fire tho
WAR doesn’t factor in how your team does. Moose is just a league average 3B. Nothing wrong with being the #15 3B in baseball. It’s just not all that exciting and it’s what Moose is. There’s really no potential for more at this point. What you see is what you get.
I’d say he has played in some fairly large parks in his career (Kauffman & Miller) hitting in a place like Philly could play up the best dimension of his game, power. I love Moose as a KC fan and his clubhouse presence will be a huge plus to any team who nets him as well. Maybe not an impact player but a solid 3B on most teams
Moustakas has a career .307 OBP. His defense is nothing special. He’s basically Chase Headley except replace Headley’s walks with homers. Moustakas was worth about 2.5 wins last season, which was basically what Headley did every year of his career. I don’t see teams lining up for Headley (he appears to be retired) and I can’t quite understand why they’re lining up for Moustakas. He’s a league-average player.
Being league average means he’s an improvement over half of the 3B in the league.
Exactly. People say average like it’s a bad thing, but you’re better than about half the league at your position.
I don’t pretend to be a WAR expert, but if he’s a 2.5 WAR player, isn’t he by definition better than league average? That’s the whole point of WAR, to contextualize a players performance?
The original post didn’t say Moose was the next Brooks Robinson, it said he’s an underrated player.
I still think Moose would have hit 50+ if Kaufman had a short porch in right like Yankees Stadium does.
WAR stands for Wins Above Replacement, referring to a “replacement-level” player ie: a utility/bench player. These players are not league-average players. The stat you want to look for to compare Moustakas to league average is WAA (wins above average). His 2018 WAA…0.4.
Career WAA…0.0
So for his career he’s exactly league average cumulatively.
WAR = Wins Above Replacement. The replacement assumed in this formula is a minor leaguer. Essentially, if you call up a AAA journeyman player.
Opinions differ on how to classify position players, but here’s my take.
0.0-0.9 WAR = Scrub who’s hurting the team’s performance.
1.0-1.9 WAR = Below average, but playable if necessary.
2.0-2.9 WAR = Average-ish player (Moustakas is lower side here)
3.0-3.9 WAR = Significant asset, but not quite All Star.
4.0-4.9 WAR = All Star Level performer.
5.0-5.9 WAR = Possibly the best player on the team.
6.0-6.9 WAR = Potentially in the MVP conversation.
7.0+ WAR = Legitimate MVP candidate
So in this scenario, Bryce Harper is worth roughly 7 wins over a minor league replacement? If the entire team is hurt and replaced by AAA players, you are telling me that, if you take every injured player’s WAR and add them up that the team would win roughly 15 games less? This is the problem with the game today, too many stats and and not enough common sense. Depth, preparation, effort, mental toughness and experience win games, not stats. If an MVP candidate is only worth 7 games, why spend 25 million a year on him if you can get 25 guys worth 3 games each? Hell, if minor leaguers can win 60 games, then 25 guys with a plus 3 WAR can win 135! Stupid stat created by agents.
That’s not how math works in any way, shape or form; there are literally dozens of articles you can find online that explain precisely why a 7or 8 win player is more valuable than three 3-win players, in large part because rosters are limited and nearly no relief pitcher ever pitches enough to be anything close to a three-win player, nor does any bench player rarely reach that mark. Teams have to dole out at-bats to a finite number of players, so of course they’d love to have one of those guys provide 10 wins in value because it means they can spend less somewhere else.
And WAR wasn’t “created by agents.” It’s evolved over the decades, mostly by baseball analysts, most of whom now work in the game and most of whom work in the front offices of the most successful teams in the game – Red Sox, Oakland, Tampa Bay, Milwaukee, Dodgers, Cubs, Houston, Yankees….you get the picture. Those teams have been studying advance analytics for a long time, have built out their analytics department ahead of a lot of other teams, and are reaping the benefits.
Teams aren’t using WAR in their internal evaluations – it’s a metric for public consumption, mostly, as a way to assign value to players. And, for example, just look at the AL in 2018. Who would you say were the three best players in the AL? If you said Mookie Betts, Mike Trout and Matt Chapman, you’d be right. And guess who the top-3 players in WAR were last season in the AL? Well, oit’s Betts, Trout and Chapman. Imagine that! A metric that measures what we can also observe by watching the game. That’s a good thing.
The following players had a WAR of 2.8 to 3.0 in 2018:
Tyler Anderson DJ LeMahieu Eduardo Rodriguez Anibal Sanchez Jake Arrieta Tanner Roark Juan Soto James Paxton Buster Posey Masahiro Tanaka Nicholas Castellanos Gleyber Torres Nelson Cruz Khris Davis Marcell Ozuna Michael Conforto Mike Fiers Manny Machado Max Kepler Willson Contreras Stephen Piscotty Sean Manaea Brett Gardner Shin-Soo Choo.
If the worst player on your team is one of the above, you just might win 130+ games. The Mariners and Yankees teams that won 116 and 115 games had many players with a WAR of less than 2.
Who is “lining up for Moustakas”? This article says there are 2 teams that might look into him if they fail to get the player they actually want. I wouldn’t call that lining up for the guy…
Yes, and many more players with War over 2. Relievers and bench players rarely reach 2 WAR, because they don’t play enough to get there. I know math is hard.
If you took a AAA team and had them play a MLB schedule, the assumption for WAR is the AAA team would win about 43 games as I recall.
For example, the Angels won 80 games last year. Their team generated a total of 35 fWAR. 35 WAR + 43 Wins (AAA team playing MLB teams) = 78 wins. Pretty close to the formula.
You can only play 9 guys at a time and your roster is composed of, generally, 9 starting position players and 5 starting pitchers. Those 13 players need to generate the majority of a team’s WAR (in the area of 2.5-3.0 WAR each), and a team making the playoffs will probably need 40+WAR on a season, even if they have some luck on their side. If you have a single player who generates 7.0 WAR, that’s extremely valuable.
Side note, anybody expecting Bryce Harper to be a perennial 7WAR player is nuts in my opinion.
I agree with davidc. Relievers and bench players rarely play enough to earn a WAR of 2.0. But if the part time players did get to 2.0, batting 0.500 with OPS of 1.800, or a reliever has an ERA of 0.60 with 18 Ks per 9 innings, or similar, that team could win 130 games. If your worst reliever is Craig Kimbrel and your worst bench player is Aaron Judge … well you get the point. I agree it isn’t realistic, just theoretical.
My girlfriend’s WAR is infinity.
I’m gonna need a bigger boat.
That’s misleading the 2001 Ms team also had 14 players with WAR higher than 2.0. Including a ridiculous 8.8 WAR from Bret Boone and 7.7 from Ichiro. Even our utility player (M Mclemore) had 3.5 WAR. What a season!
Yeah … a league average player with a couple of World Series on his resume.
Math is hard? I guess that explains your reliance on WAR. It’s a pseudo-stat and a statistical abomination.
From the looks of it, 2019 might be his year. He’ll get at least 2 offers which means possibly bumping up years and dollars
This part of Morosi’s article, is why I’m buying it:
“It’s easy for the Phillies and White Sox to remain in touch with Moustakas, since his agent — Boras also represents Harper, which both have interest.”
Ironic, isn’t it? Keeping Boras, after QO blunder, may end up working best in Moose’s favor this yr.
It’s the players blunder!
108 OPS+ last year, career 98 OPS+ and average defense. if anything he’s overrated
Looking at his career stats is kind of skewed because he struggled a ton his first few seasons. At this point he can be relied on for moderately above average offense and capable defense at third, and it definitely seems like he’ll be underpaid for it if last offseason is any indication.
Agreed. He’s a 2-3 win player that probably won’t cost a ton. His plate discipline could be better, but I think he’ll be a good deal for whoever gets him. He’s not a great player, but he’s still criminally underrated.
moose is a poor mans machado. his offense the past 2yrs should get a 2-4 deal at cheaper dollars…id sigh him if I was loaded with talent
Poor-ish.
Yes 100%,Moose and another player that has good pedigree are far more worth it then somebody with questionable work ethic and pedigree
I’d be perfectly satisfied with Moose as a backup plan for missing out on Harper or Machado. Would love to see DJ LeMahieu or Pollock added as part of a Plan B, too.
I rather see Pollock with the Phillies and I say you keep Franco and overpay for a SP. How about Dallas for 3 years 69 million.
Nice
I don’t mind that, I actually really like the idea of stupid aav overpays but with less years.
Phils need to stay away from Pollock; don’t need another R-handed bat in this lineup–unless it’s Machado–and Pollock’s too injury prone. I don’t see him as much of an upgrade over what the Phils currently have or what they can get via trade (I doubt they sign Harper).
If the Phils miss on Machado, just keep Franco and sign Keuchel. That way, they can trade a young, controllable arm with upside (Eflin or Velasquez) and a decent prospect or two for a quality OF (I like Mazara from the Rangers…he is gonna break out in a big way in 2019 or 2020, just needs that change of scenery)
how is Harper’s injury report?
I assume teams realize that AJ Pollock has played exactly one full season in his career, right?
Could be why he’s still out there, and few strong suitors.
Pollock is also a player whose skill-set doesn’t age well. Teams are figuring out that, with very few exceptions, players don’t learn plate discipline as they age. Pollock is a speed-dependent guy who doesn’t walk much. Players like that, historically, don’t age well. The most famous example of this, of course, is Carl Crawford, whose career cratered when he hit 30 – he never walked. Vince Coleman is a similar example, although he did draw a fair amount of walks early in his St. Louis career, but he was basically done at 30 also. Pollock is 31.
Is that really an overpay for Dallas? If he was willing to take 3 years, I think a lot of teams would be interested in that deal…
The Padres have a “logjam” at the corners? Maybe in the outfield, but surely not on the infield. As much as I was hoping/praying the Wil Myers experiment would work at 3rd, he can not be expected to play there again next season. The Padres do not have anyone close to the Majors who is a feasible option at 3rd, of course I am expecting Tatis will be able to hold down short for at least a while before sliding over to make room for Edwards.
I like your confidence in Edwards. Dude looks solid.
Edwards has a lot to be excited about but don’t rule out Potts.
What he did last year in High A/AA as a 19 year old was very impressive.
I’m high on Potts as well, but if Tatis does indeed have to move off of short, he will be heading to 3rd. I know all of these highly touted kids aren’t going to realize to their potential, but if even a 1/4 of them do, Preller and Co. are going to have some very tough decisions.
See you at 4:20.
Moustakas and average defense for 10-15M per year for Age 31-33/4? Versus the arbitration route at 5M this year and below average defense.
Rather spend money elsewhere for a major upgrade than a marginal one.
You’re overestimating the contract Moose will end up getting. He’ll get a lot less than that, and he’ll probably be a good value signing.
The Phillies have been overspending for FAs so I am expecting at least 3 year deal for top of the market range money. Its not my money but its just not a big enough upgrade, would rather see if Franco can improve his D.
Moose might get 2/20. More likely 2/16-18. Maybe with an option year.
Why is it that only the male moose has antlers?
You’d think the female would have the big rack.
“Age 31-33/4”?
Year-1 of his deal age-30. 4years carries through age 33
I think Moose’d be lucky to get more than 2 years lmao
Hell turn 31 towards the end of the year. But just looking at the Phillies signings it’s been more years and money than anticipated for guys.
Yep, on 9/11, roughly three weeks from completing his age-30 season.
Yea so they’ll prob offter him a 3 year deal with a 4th option and buyout, taking him through the age range I literally posted.
Or they’ll do the logical thing and give him a 1 year deal and try free agency again next year with Arenado.
I hope Moustakas gets a nice contract after getting shafted last year out of 12 million bucks. He’s a good player and deserved better
If by shafted you mean by Boras then yes he got shafted good
He turned down the $17 million then realized teams do as much research as his agent.
He didn’t get shafted, he made a poor decision.
He didn’t even make a poor decision then. He turned down a reported 3/45 from the Halos who pivoted to Cozart. I bet both sides wish they would’ve taken that one now.
That rumor turned out to be false. The offer was never there
Agreed
sims;
What’s $10 or $12 million here or there?
Moose: .251/.315/.459
Franco: .270/.314/.467
Just throwing that out there.
Moustakas makes little sense to the Phillies unless they plan on flipping Franco for pitching.
Franco’s WAR over the past 2 seasons is 0.0 Zero. He literally has no greater value than calling up your AAA 3B.
His slash line over that time period was .247/.295/.434/.729 with a 91 OPS+
Moustakas had a 2.5 WAR last season and 4.3 WAR over the past 2 seasons.
His slash line over that time frame was .262/.315/.489/.804 with a 113 OPS+
There is no question who is the better player.
Their 162 game averages are almost identical
@YourDadddy
Stop arguing with everyone because it’s clear that no one takes what you say seriously. You’re getting nothing but down clicks bro. Move on. You know nothing about baseball. Wrigleywannabe sees what everyone else sees. If Moustakas was SOO MUCH better than Franco, why has no one given him a long term contract???
@wrigleywannabe
Great statistical point. The only difference between Franco & Moustakas is that the latter has a better glove but his offensive output isn’t prolific enough to displace Franco.
I’m honestly tired of waiting for Franco to be the player I hoped he would. Ship him out, I watch 150 Phillies games a year and he only ever disappoints.
jleve618 – I wish more teams gave up on their players early. I mean that seriously. I watched the Mariners give Justin Smoak WAY too many opportunities. We punted production at first base for a year or two too many in the hopes of him breaking out. He did break out. Once. In Toronto. Good for them, but I wish we didn’t stay in that abusive relationship as long as we did. Franco may be the same for the Phillies.
Hey Danny, what about the rest of the articles thst said the mets had no money to spend?
Lol
You sound like a Royals fan back when Moose was young and overhyped and hit about .205.
ds;
That strategy would come back to bite you from time to time.
Example: NYY leaving Quintana off the 40-man, years ago.
Soon-to-be example: CWS trading SS prospect Fernando Tatis Jr. for
James friggin’ Shields for Chrissakes.
But as they say, hindsight is 20/20.
TBF, Tatis hadn’t even played a professional game when the White Sox traded him. As a Padres fan, I’m glad they have him, but that was luck on San Diego’s part, along with the advantage of having a GM with a background in scouting.
They are virtually identical players at this stage. The difference is that Franco is 26 and still has a ton of upside. Moose does not.
I don’t know why this is getting down voted. While yes, their stat lines are incredibly similar, Moose played most of that time at a pitcher’s park and Franco played in a band box. By wRC+, which is park and league adjusted:
Moustakas the last three years – 111, 115, 105
Franco the last three years – 92, 76, 105
If you want to weigh last year the heaviest, and you should, then yeah, they’re a wash offensively. But you shouldn’t ignore everything else. And looking at their recent track records, Moose has been significantly better.
wow…last season stats justifies a career trend.
how many times Franco saw a demotion?
He has never been demoted during the course of an MLB season.
I’m very curious as to the Mets interest in Brian Dozier. He’s been a 2B most of his career and the Mets have Cano at 2B. Maybe they feel that Dozier could handle 1B??? Don’t get me wrong, if the Mets add Dozier to their lineup, that lineup becomes more formidable.
1. Nimmo(LF)
2. Dozier(1B)
3. Cano(2B)
4. Ramos(C)
5. Conforto(RF)
6. Frazier/McNeil/Davis(3B)
7. Rosario(SS)
8. Lagares/Broxton(CF)
Not a bad lineup at all. Maybe Rosario shows more plate discipline in Spring Training and can become a great #2 hitter. That way Dozier moves down to maybe the cleanup spot and then Ramos can hit 6th behind Conforto. Either way, the Mets offense would have many options.
I believe the Mets would use Cano at first and the better fielding Dozier at 2nd. Your points regarding the lineup construction are very good.
Either way, it’s exciting to see the Mets attached to an established hitter like Dozier. Thank you for the complement regarding possible lineup construction.
In order for a lineup to become more formidable, it has to be formidable in the first place, lol.
Wilson Ramos hitting 4th, yeah that’s scaring the bejesus ot of baseball.
The Mets know that Cano should really be at 1B now. DH if that was available in the NL, but since it isn’t, 1B.
BTW, your GM has already said that Cano will bat 4th.
@YourDaddy
Brodie Van Wagenen NEVER said that. You find that article and attach it. Cano is batting 3rd, no doubt about it.
No worries about this deal happening. Wagon Wheel’s ATM card no longer works so his funds are limited to the cash in his pocket.
Whether Cano bats 3rd or 4th doesn’t matter as there’s no big bat behind him to protect. So he will get a steady diet of pitches down and away in key counts and turn over more ground balls (or double plays with men in base).
That’s what happens when you half bake the cake.
It’s amazing how many moronic fans participate in these threads. The Mets have plenty of protection for Cano. Go troll another team.
Who Danny? Sorry that my dose
of reality soured your whet dream. There is no big bat that can bat forth successfully, short of Mr Sore Foot who won’t be back until after the ASG and is bound to have a few hammy and quad injuries in the summer heat.
I hope that you’ve pissed away lots of money on Mets tickets for the current year. The only noise that this franchise will make is from the planes landing nearby at LaGuardia and flying low above Chitifield.
Well said Mike!
BVW is probably looking for lineup flexibility like the Dodgers had. The problem is that no one can play SS other than Rosario. McNeill is apparently going to play some corner OF as well. I think they could spend the money on a more useful piece than dozier at this point though. Honestly I’m not sold on Broxton/Lagares in CF. They’ll play D but I expect nothing with the bat. But I guess that’s okay if they get production from the other 7 slots. I’d also take a look at an additional reliever. That’d help alleviate some of the pressures on the current BP guys and perhaps free them up to use an opener for the 5th slot. I don’t have a lot of confidence in Jason Vargas at this point in time.
Even though I would like to see the Mets sign a true backup SS like a Jose Iglesias or Freddy Galvis but I believe the Mets are going to use McNeil as the backup SS. McNeil played 33 gms at SS in 2016 & 3 gms last year at AAA.
I agree with you @jbigz12, the Mets should not only solidify the bullpen but they should try to sign Adam Ottavino. I stated on another thread yesterday that the Mets should try to sign Ottavino to a 2 yr deal with an high AAV. I think a 2 yr, $26 million with a 3rd yr Team Option valued at $14 million that comes with a $2 million buyout could get it done. So, the contract would actually be worth 2 yrs & $28 million if the Mets declined the option. I think Ottavino would jump at that.
Also, the Mets have been shopping d’Arnaud even after dealing Plawecki and I’m fine with that. I would like to see the Mets try to trade d’Arnaud to the Ray’s for Colin Poche & another low-level prospect. Poche is the Ray’s #24 ranked prospect and could be given a shot at spring training at being a lefty out of the Mets bullpen. The Mets could easily replace both d’Arnaud & Plawecki by signing Martin Maldonado to backup Ramos. That would be a phenomenal catching tandem. Ramos is probably going to catch only 110 gms, so Maldonado can catch the other 52 gms.
These are the kind of moves I would love to see Brodie Van Wagenen do.
Hey Danny—these peel off trades by Wagon Wheel only bring a return of petty cash.
Unless you want to refill his ATM card, your lofty ideas will never be realized.
Get real before you buy your season tickets. This is just another typical Mets team—showing fans a few new toys in hopes of sucking the money out of their wallets to buy seats.
Make no mistake that history will repeat.
Where do you play Dozier once Alonso comes up?
I don’t see this move happening…I’d rather see the Mets spend on the pen (Justin Wilson) and a true backup SS with positional flexibility
Moose is underrated. Hes got a gold glove quality also. Anyone who has watched him on a regular basis would know.
Before the Mets traded for JD Davis, I thought that Moustakas would have been a great fit for the Mets. He’s incredibly underrated.
Moustakas is a symptom of baseball getting smarter; it’s a bummer for him because even ten years ago he would have gotten a huge contract after hitting 65 homers or whatever over two years, but this is an era in which a league leader in HRs was released just two years ago and basically never played again. Homers aren’t anything special anymore because even guys like Jurickson Profar are hitting 20 homers a a year now. Take away the homers and he’s an average defensive third baseman who doesn’t walk and doesn’t run well. It’s just not a terribly desirable profile; as I mentioned earlier, he’s not much better than Chase Headley, a player who was released by one of the worst teams in baseball in 2018.
JD Davis, lol.
That’s what the new york mutts have come to
Mike Moustakas is not a Gold Glove worthy third baseman. The last season that he displayed enough defense to warrant consideration was back in 2012, his second year with the Royals and his first full one. He has earned the nickname “Moose” for good reason and it’s not because of quickness which is a nice trait to have as an elite defensive player at the hot corner.
Or he earned the nickname “Moose” because, you know, it’s the first syllable of his last name…
OK, should have wrote he has “lived up” to his nickname instead of “earned” it, although he has been a big dude his entire life if you have seen any of his pics as an amatuer and professional. I don’t believe his little league coach would have tagged that nickname on him if he more resembled Pee Wee Herman or Pee Wee Reese. Additionally, Moose is a variation of his last name, not the first syllable which is Mou (mu). Fortunately for him nobody chants “moo” when he comes to bat.
I’ll stand by my first and primary reason of my comment reply. Moustakas is not a Gold Glove caliber third baseman and much of that has to do with his 6-0, 225lb body. That thick and less than muscular frame has also hindered his chances of landing a better offer as a free agent the last two offseasons and it’s not getting anymore athletic looking as he ages. (royalsreview.com/2018/4/7/17207266/rivals-blame-sl….
Agreed, The dude will hit a bomb when you need it. It may not always be the go ahead bomb but when you need the team fired up, it’s kind of his thing.
Why would it take reshuffling by the Padres to make room for Moose? All of their OF other than Myers have options. Send one to the minors. Send two to the minors. Unless they are better than Moose and Myers, there doesn’t seem to be a problem.
You can’t keeo guys down in the minors who are good enough to play. Makes no sense to have 6 major league quality outfielders when you could deal them for something you could actually use.
Analytically speaking, I’m a big fan of Dozier on a short contract. He’ll come cheaply since he’s coming off a bad year, but there isn’t really much about his offensive profile that’s changed since his peak.
He’s striking out and walking at almost the exact same rates, and actually made more hard contact than he did in the past. The difference was a low BABIP and a low HR/FB ratio; with a little positive regression, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect him to have a bit of a bounce back.
I am not sure why the Mets would be interested in Dozier. I can’t see the logic. Presumably, their current set up is:
1b – McNeil or Alonso
2b – Cano
Ss – Rosario
3b – Frazier or Davis
Where is the fit?
McNeil or alonso aren’t proven commodities. Alonso will almost assuredly start in AAA. It’s a tough fit for me because no one is a SS aside from Rosario. If he goes down or struggles you’re not going to play any of those guys there which limits your lineup flexibility. Unless they see Dozier as being SS capable every once in awhile. But considering the way the metrics have been going for dozier at 2nd I’d say that’s not something to bank on.
Maybe of Brodie Van Wagenen signs Dozier, he uses Alonso as a major trade chip to plug other holes.
Maybe an extreme out of the box scenario could see the Mets package Alonso with Todd Frazier & Juan Lagares to shed salary, that way the Mets could go all in on Bryce Harper without raising the budget my much. Frazier & Lagares are making a combined $19 million in ’19. Shedding those contracts would go a long way.
And so which stupid team that is flush with extra cash would waste their resources in those players.
There are better blogs for fantasy teams where your posts would make more sense.
Why not throw Vargas and Cespedes into the trade and the metsies can get Harper and Machado?
Lol, look how desperate Danny boy is getting!
There are so many available and cost effective RP for the Mariners to sign, especially considering their current bullpen makeup.
Boxberger, Strickland, Diekman, Avilan, Gearrin, etc.
They all make too much sense.
Throwinched10- there’s also a few minor leaguers that should be promoted from their farm system. Matt Festa, Nick Rumbelow, Art Warren, Gerson Bautista even Wyatt Mills is close to promotion.
I don’t see Mike Moustakas as a fit at 3B if the White Sox strike out on Manny Machado.
First off, there is no guarantee that Machado would play the hot corner in 2019 if he signed with the White Sox. For all the talk about the White Sox acquiring this friend and that relative to entice Machado, their biggest advantage to landing him outside of money would be to simply let him play his preferred position of SS. Tim Anderson is amenable to a position change which would open up his spot for Machado. The Phillies and Yankees each want Machado to play 3B. The White Sox may let Machado have his choice of playing SS or 3B.
Secondly, the White Sox have been seriously discussing a position change for Yoan Moncada in order to clear out 2B for Nick Madrigal who could debut as soon as 2020. Madrigal not only will provide the White Sox with a much needed high BA, low SS bat atop their future lineup but also possesses Gold Glove potential at 2B. The most likely landing spot for Moncada is 3B, the position he actually made his MLB debut at with the Red Sox back in September of 2016. If Machado does sign with the White Sox there’s a good chance that Moncada would be their third baseman anyway. If he doesn’t, it’s almost a certainty that Moncada will begin playing 3B in 2019 regardless.
It makes more sense for the White Sox to expedite a move of Moncada to 3B in 2019 rather than wait until 2020. Last season’s primary third baseman Yolmer Sanchez is a fine defensive second baseman and his bat also profiles better there. He might also be a better choice as a double play partner with Machado at SS in 2019, Either way, Sanchez would be the placeholder at 2B until Madrigal is ready for prime time, after which he could revert to his ideal role as the White Sox top utility infielder.
All of these options would seem to leave Moustakas out of the White Sox plans regardless of what transpires with Machado this offseason.
Unless Moose moves to 1B/DH in 2020.
Why would the White Sox sign Moustakas as a 1B/DH? The already have a nice combo their with right-handed hitting slugger Jose Abreu and recently acquired Machado brother-in-law Yonder Alonso for 2019 and possibly beyond if they work out a contract extension with the former.
God knows the White Sox could use another left-handed power bat in their lineup and technically Moustakas could fit the bill at 3B in 2019. But frankly, I don’t want this team straying too far from their primary objective which is to utilize the 2019 season as a positive step in continuing to develop and promote their younger players and prospects into a perennial contender for 2020 and beyond.
I’m all for signing a generational 26-year old talent like Machado and/or Harper to a long term contract to become the face(s) of this franchise for the next ten years. Signing Moustakas at the expense of developing Moncada as their future core third baseman would deviate from that primary goal.
The White Sox have two years of control with lefty hitting 1B/DH Yonder Alonso, his $8MM guaranteed salary in 2019 along with a $9MM team option for 2020 that comes with a $1MM buyout. Depending on what transpires with a Jose Abreu contract extension as well as a Manny Machado signing they look to be covered at 1B/DH for at least the short term which is fine considering that they have three recent 1st and 2nd round college picks who might be ready in a couple of seasons. That would include left-handed hitting 1B Gavin Sheets, along with lefty C Zack Collins who may have to play 1B with his defensive shortcomings, along with right-handed hitting 3B Jake Burger who also may need to play 1B after suffering two torn achilles tendon injuries last season. Burger was never given good grades with his defense coming out of college and these injuries could make it less likely he would stick at the hot corner. All these players do come with some legitimate upside as hitters so having them as 1B/DH options come 2020 or 2021 is a very real possibility.
I didn’t think my 6 words and a year would invoke a double long response, but if there’s a 1B/DH in the pipeline it could have been mentioned the first time around.
What I pointed out should have been obvious with the possibility Jose Abreu leaves after 2019. That would mean Alonso at 1B/DH and another player. Hence, Moose.
Also obvious; if the White Sox acquired Machado, Moose is a moot point.
Nothing against Moose, I wish him only the best. Just an expensive choice, considering the in-house options.
If he puts together a decent ‘19 season, he can then dictate where he winds up.
Wait, …
On second thought, the world doesn’t need another dictator referred to as ‘Moose’.
Even with Machado or Harper there is no scenerio where the White Sox contend against the Yankees, Red Sox or Astros in the next two years.. Maybe I’m giving WS management too much credit but if I had to guess I would say that they are bidding up the market and hoping that the Yankees (or the Cubs for that matter) make another really stupid move that will cost whoever signs Machado or Harper for years to come…
Say what you want about the WS ownership, but Jerry R is not stupid. He has to remember what a catastrophe the two Adams (Dunn and LaRoche) from the Nationals were.. NL left handed power hitters who had no position that they can play adequately. coming to the AL. and then being paid way too much makes no sense..
Paying Machado all that money and having to put him at SS when the WS have Anderson who is on the verge of being the best combination of hitting and defense at SS in the AL reeks of panic that empty ball parks engender.
Stay the course for one more year and see what you get from. Jimenez,, Robert, Madrigal, Collins and Burger. It would be really silly to have Moncada, Anderson and Burger all fighting for ab’s and playing third because Machado is guaranted the ss position.
People said the same thing about the Atlanta Braves in the NL East, and the Nationals before that. The White Sox have enough elite prospects to contend, sooner than many people think or are prepared for.
The Nats and Braves both had loaded farm systems with elite talent (Acuna, Albies, Harper, Strasburg, Rendon, etc.) so their break outs weren’t really all that unexpected. The White Sox aren’t quite at the level those two were, though that should not dissuade them from going after Macharper.
You do realize that Moncada was the #1 prospect in all of baseball, right? Ahead of both Acuna and Albies… Kopech was a borderline top 10 prospect in all of baseball last year. Giolito and Lopez were top 30 guys. Eloy is currently a top 3 prospect in all of baseball. Cease, Robert, and Madrigal are all top 50 prospects with elite (at worst) skillsets.
They have as much elite talent as any system. If anything, their biggest flaw compared to other elite systems is their depth, and even that’s a bit of a stretch, as they’ve added a TON of quality depth over the last 2 years.
Implying that Bryce Harper would become the next Adam Dunn or Adam LaRoche on a future White Sox team is ludicrous. To also suggest that the White Sox are simply in on Harper and Machado to drive up the market price for the Cubs and Yankees is even more absurd.
I have no interest in Machado playing SS for the White Sox. Tim Anderson is quickly turning into an excellent defensive SS, and the left side of the infield would be borderline elite (defensively) if Machado played 3B. Once Madrigal starts forcing his way up the ladder, then start shuffling players around. If you want to mess around here or there, that’s fine with me, but I wouldn’t be making permanent changes until you have to.
And I agree about Moose. Hard pass unless it’s in addition to Harper.
Don’t sell Machado short as a potential elite defensive SS. He erased his -1.2 dWAR with the Orioles to begin the 2018 season by posting a positive 1.2 dWAR with the Dodgers down the stretch.
I agree that Tim Anderson has shown significant improvement defensively as a SS, particularly during the second half of last season which earned him a 1.0 dWAR metric for the entirety of 2018. But this has been a gradual improvement over the course of 3 seasons, something that Machado has already shown in just a couple of months.
Let’s also not forget that Machado played SS regularly for the first time as a big leaguer last season. He was drafted as a SS but switched to 3B in deference to veteran SS J.J. Hardy when he made his big league debut in 2012 at age 19. Machado had brief stretches at SS in 2015 and 2016 when Hardy was hurt but this past season was his first real opportunity to play SS exclusively in spring training and throughout an entire season.
It should also be pointed out that Machado is only one year older than Tim Anderson who is 25 and will turn 26 in June. If signing Machado comes down to him playing his desired position of SS over 3B then the White Sox ought to accommodate his wishes. Once he’s board, the White Sox will always have the option of shifting back to 3B if he becomes a defensive liability there.
Bottom line: The White Sox need Machado and/or Bryce Harper not only as generational talents but also to give them some much needed star power as they morph into perennial contenders in the next couple of seasons. It’s a matter of not just bringing on elite talent but also one of marketing in a city where they have been labeled the red-headed stepchild to the Cubs over the past decade. They are also breaking away from the North Side team with their cable partnership following the upcoming season. The White Sox could use a boost in star power as the Cubs embark on their own exclusive network beginning in 2020.
Moose to the Angels – let him come home to SoCal
So Pujols won’t be the slowest runner on the team? He couldn’t beat Jose Molina in a race to first.
His bat is average, his defense is average, he can’t take a walk—but my guess is he wants money way above average.
Pass.
He could beat Molina to 1st if he dropped the piano.
I think Moose will definitely get a three year deal from Milwaukee if Shaw or Erceg gets traded to SF for Madbum because Shaw may eventually end up at first because Aguilar isnt guaranteed, he struggled in second half and in winter ball
Belt and Posey should be the rotation at 1B. Why grab another? Trade doesn’t make sense for San Fran.
If it’s a choice between Moose and Franco in Philly, allocate your spending elsewhere. Moose will not be a difference maker.
White Sox on the other hand can use Moustakas.
Considering all the good defensive SS still on the market, I continue to lose enthusiasm for the Tigers signing the weak defense of Jordy Mercer.
I’m so tired of this Moustakis replacing Franco talk. Why the Phils want to give up on a 26 year old player with room to grow for a 30 year old with basically the same attributes, leaving his prime, and pay more for him, escapes me. I don’t even want to see Franco go if they somehow land Machado. This is irritating, really irritating….
I agree 1000%. I’m a Mets fan and even I know it would be stupid for my division rival to trade away a 26 y/o player with loads of upside for a 30 y/o that plays the same position and provides identical offensive numbers.
That’s the kind of move only one team makes, the Mutts, lol.
No money left to spend, hysterical!
Keep Franco. Trade at deadline if hot.
It could be argued that this is a much better plan for both teams than a long term Manny deal.
People are misjudging Moustakas which is understandable. When looking at career numbers, they are heavily skewed because of his first 3 season before under going a swing changed that drastically improved his hard contact %, which he has maintained and increased over the last 4. And last year he had a down season. His HR/FB% was the lowest it has been since 2014 despite having the best hard contact% and fly ball% in his career. He got incredibly unlucky in the power department and that would greatly improve all aspects of his slash line. His expected OPS should have been .120 higher than it actually was. His defense was also ranked the lowest it had been in his career.
Now, if you want to say, he is trending in the wrong direction, then maybe you can formulate an argument, however his improved contact numbers across the board signify otherwise. Now he is not going to be great in OBP due to his average walk rate and fly ball proficiency, but he has shown he is much closer to the ~120 wRC+ than his 105 last year and his 98 career.
In no world is a 30 year old Moustakas an upgrade over a 26 year old Franco.
He’s most certainly an upgrade defensively :2018 UzR: Franco: -5.0; Moustakas: 1.0.
Moustakas is exactly the type of nonexistent OBP player the White Sox DO NOT need.
If he’s just a placeholder signed to a one year contract, it won’t matter. Stop overreacting.
I’d be very happy if the Phils signed Moustakas and then traded Franco to the Mets. The guy gets no respect in Philly. Phil’s are right there. Add one legit starter that can pitch into the 7th and 2 dependable bullpen arms and a manager that won’t warm them up 5 days a week, and they walk to the post season.
Walk to the post season? That would be a first!
Management seems constantly down on Franco..To me, he didn’t suck at all last year..
Franco to the Mets.
MLB At Bat is saying that Harper is close to going back to the Nats, and that Manny most likely goes to the Phillies within the next week..
Yet, John Middleton and his Stupid Money are meeting with Harper and Boras this Saturday..
I love rumors..Constantly changing…
BTW, what do fans chant at an Iron Pigs game?
Fans of the Lansing Lugnuts chant,
“Let’s go nuts! Let’s go nuts!”
no clue…just love the angry piggy