Domingo Santana has been drawing some attention as the trade deadline approaches, and MLB Network’s Jon Heyman (Twitter link) reports that the Rays and Indians are two of the teams showing some interest in the Mariners outfielder.
Santana has rebounded from a down year in 2018 to hit .273/.342/.475 over 446 plate appearances for the Mariners, and he recorded his 20th homer of the season in today’s 3-2 win over the Tigers. Despite the impressive 120 wRC+, however, Santana has also struck out a league-high 135 times, and is a significant defensive liability as a corner outfielder.
The lack of glovework is particularly ill-suited to a Tampa Bay team that prioritizes defensive versatility, particularly since Tommy Pham and Austin Meadows have been so productive as the regular corner outfielders. That said, the Rays may simply be willing to overlook Santana’s defensive shortcomings in the name of getting some extra pop in their lineup, which is middle-of-the-pack is most offensive categories leaguewide. Santana and Meadows could more or less split the right field and DH duties, with prospect Nate Lowe perhaps returning to the minors until rosters expand in September. It isn’t a perfect fit, on paper, though Mariners GM Jerry Dipoto and Rays GM Erik Neander have been such frequent trading partners that it isn’t a shock to see Tampa linked to any potentially-available Seattle player.
The Indians also aren’t strangers to trading with the Mariners, as they joined with the Rays for last December’s three-team that saw Carlos Santana go to Cleveland and Edwin Encarnacion to Seattle. As with the Rays, Santana would give the Tribe’s offense a shot in the arm, especially since Cleveland is still looking for some consistent production from its outfield. Rookie Oscar Mercado has solidified center field, and Tyler Naquin and Jordan Luplow have both hit well in limited action, though adding Santana as an outfielder/DH would certainly help matters. Of particular note, Santana’s right-handed bat would greatly help a lineup that hasn’t done much damage against lefty pitching this season.
Santana’s struggles with the Brewers last year led to his modest $1.95MM 2019 salary in his first year of arbitration, so even though he’ll undoubtedly get a big raise this winter, he won’t earn enough to break the bank for the low-payroll Rays or Indians. Since Santana has two-plus remaining years of control, of course, Seattle will be looking for a quality return in any trade.
Kiermaier, Meadows, Garcia, and Pham. They will not put him in the outfield. He will DH if traded to Tampa
Indians are going to be buyers but will they pay for a player like Santana w/ the Dolan family pulling the cord on the deals, but see lots of changes coming to the Indians in the next couple of days! Some good and bad
Bauer/Seager to Rays,Leake,Santana,Haniger to Indians,Chang,Arroyo and so on Prospect from Rays to Mariners?
As a Mariners fan I’d love to see Seager moved butbutd not gonna happen. I could see a deal built around Domingo Santana and Chung though.
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I know we M’s fans and the brass would all absolutely love to clear away Seager, but at the cost of both Haniger and Santana? When there are zero immediate options to replace their production? I seriously doubt they pull the trigger on that.
Haniger won’t move this season, probably out indefinitely. If he’s an all star next season he’ll move, but I doubt it.
The Rays already traded Arroyo to Cleveland and acquired Sogard from Toronto.
There is no room for Seager even if he was good and his contract was movable, so scratch that idea as well.
A young arm or infielder for Santana might make sense, and maybe Leake moves with some salary eaten, but Haniger isn’t likely going anywhere since there’s no timeline for his return.
Why do people keep thinking Mike Lewke needs to move with salary? For an above average innings eating pitcher to earn 5mil this year and 11mil next year who’s pitched extremely well the second half, that’s not a bad price tag at all. To be honest, if the Mariners ate more of the contract they should get a huge return.
You’re forgetting about the 18 million dollar option for 2021 with a 5m buyout. Covering that buyout along with the dough from St. Louis is probably what would need to happen.
Indians would never ever ever take on Seager’s contract even if it was paid down. They basically already have Seager in Jason Kipnis whose contract (thank God) expires after this season.
Kipnis will be let go before the end of the year, because he is not worth the money they are paying him! I see freeman playing second in the long run, but maybe a promotion for Nolan Jones won’t shock me with the Indians looking for bats, because he is crushing it down in the minor leagues
Jones was just called up to AA. We won’t see him this year in Cleveland. Kipnis will finish the season as an Indian.
Would be perfect fit for Rays
I may be in the minority but I don’t see why Tampa wants to displace Nate Lowe. I realize it’s a small sample size but he’s hit throughout the minors and has a .387 XWOBA that lags his .366 WOBA. He looks pretty legitimate. I’m not sure Santana is a significant enough of an upgrade to make a huge difference.
Mercado, Naquin, and Allen have been on fire as of late, and all play excellent defense. Look it up.
Luplow homered today. Daniel Johnson is raking at AAA.
Can’t see where he makes sense for Cleveland, especially with his SO rate and sorry defense.
Jake Bauers? DH looks wide open.
Bauers has been playing first while Carlos has been healing…..and he’s a natural there, except for that stupid throw today. He made some truly incredible digs on throws in the dirt during this KC series. That means Carlos and him can rotate between 1B and DH.
Domingo would be a full-time DH. Would mean sending Jake Bauers to Columbus. Jake really is a pretty good first-baseman (lousy throw today notwithstanding) but he needs time in AAA to work on his bat.
I would rather keep Bauers at the major league level and pass on Santana.
if the Indians are going to improve with a right handed bat has to be one that can field not dh everyday.
Hanniger is a trade I could get behind.
I also would have no issue trading making a deal with top prospects like Freeman or Mckinzie if it brings back the controlable infielder, outfielder, catcher controlable long term and major league ready like Ruiz or Lux .
Exactly who is this top prospect named “Freeman”?
Leave Tyler Freeman alone. This kid is destined for a future Tribe infield, and he can hit.
Why do people always want the Indians to trade the guys they draft and develop, and especially the top ones?
{chuckle} I was hoping he meant “Mike” because I ain’t dealing Tyler for a guy whose WAR is half of Luplow’s playing twice as much.
I almost replied Mike too.haha
How about at DH ??
Cleveland is the destination that makes the most sense for Santana or Castellanos since they’ll primarily DH.
Allen would get sent down since they need Bauers to back up first.
I would be surprised if Bauers stays and Allen goes. Even with his better power, Bauers has had difficulty maintaining a superior OPS to Allen, and Greg provides superior defense and base-running compared to Bauers. But you’re right, who handles first if Santana gets a day off, Freeman? So maybe Bauers does stay. Maybe we don’t want another Santana; Domingo has a smaller WAR in 442 plate appearances than Jordan Luplow does in less than 200. That’s how bad Domingo is with the glove.
The Mariners should keep him for now and wait and see how he’ll finish in 2019. They could try and deal him in the off season for a decent haul. Then again, he’s still young enough to stay in Seattle for their rebuild.
One big risk is that he reverts to 2018 form. Then, you’re stuck with a boat anchor and have nothing for it. This rebuild is probably going to take 3+ years, and the team already has a fulltime DH in Vogelbach. I think it’s time to cash him in if they can – Santana is not good enough to net a decent haul now or in the offseason.
I’ve been wondering why there’s been no discussion from teams of moving Domingo to 1B — whether by the M’s should they keep him or by the teams interested in him. The M’s most certainly should be interested in doing so; at least in the interim if White can pass AAA and then be ready for Dipoto’s proclaimed 2021 window. In my limited understanding, I could see similar interest in the Rays and maybe even the Indians as part of the reasoning in acquiring him.
I think if Santana cuts down on the strikeouts and improves his plate discipline, would the Mariners then keep him and try him at 1B? Could they shuffle Santana and Vogelbach between DH/1B and a fews starts in LF? The Mariners could move their players around the lineup just like the Dodgers do but if White comes up then Santana would probably be traded for a position in need.
Domingo has 1770 ABS and has never cut down on the K’s. I’m not saying it’s impossible but it’s highly unlikely at this point he’ll ever be able to do that. This is Domingo Santana. He walks a good deal, he strikes out way too much and he hits bombs. The scary thing with a guy like Santana is the margin for error. His profile as it is today is effective but if that K rate spikes any higher you have a Mike Zunino on your hands.
There’s always a possibility that he can improve his hitting. He’s still young enough to stay around for a rebuild but with Vogelbach at DH and a few outfielders coming through the farm system, Santana would be the odd man out.
No team needs to worry about his plate discipline (he has an average-ish 9.3% BB-rate). I don’t think they even need to worry about him cutting down his Ks, really, as the grand total of his offense is not only fine, but already above average for a COF/1B/DH bat. It’s only his inability to run down and catch a flyball that’s a concern.
So, it’s just like you say re: White and the example of the Dodgers position rotations. Mr. Glove-first-1B is still a year-plus away from arriving (let alone being a potential offensive contributor) and it’s not like Dipoto’s M’s have shied away from position flexibility, so it’s just… surprising to me that I haven’t heard anything from the PR-fed broadcast guys about it even being a possibility. Could he have a Cano-like, behind-the-scenes stance of “I dun wannabe a 1B because I dun wanna”?
I think Castellanos would be cheaper and more effective.
Probably right,but Seattle isn’t a divisional foe.
And Detroit really shouldn’t care about trading a rental to Cleveland. The Tigers are the worst team in baseball.
The Indians might not want to deal prospects to the Tigers and have to face them in the future.
I’d be pumped if they got domingo. Indians outfield has been great as of late. But, the schedule gets a lot tougher in the next month. Don’t know if they’ll keep it up. Be nice to have a legit power bat going forward.
A legit power bat who strikes out way too much and can’t play defense?
No thanks.
Yeah, I think I’ll pass on a second Santana in Cleveland too.
K’s are not inherently bad for a hitter and Santana has quite clearly shown that his high K rate translates into the ability to hit the ball with authority consistently well. The difference in value between him and Javy Baez is defense and defense alone. Santana is a perfect candidate for a position change (straight to DH or at least worth a try at 1B).
Well, Baez also slugs .100 points higher and plays a premium position.
Baez would have the same knocks if he were a RF who sucked at defense. But he isn’t. Defense is a skill and one that Baez is very good at. Baez’s K’s are what keeps him from being a top 5 player in the game. i don’t think that’s a strong argument for why K’s aren’t that bad. I think that’s more of an argument for why Javy Baez isn’t a complete superstar.
You would be correct to say that it is *ALSO* an argument why Baez isn’t a complete superstar. That doesn’t even remotely come close negating the following:
Player A hits at 18% above league average and Player B hits at 17% above league average. Both of them are average-ish baserunners (while one grades about 2.5 runs better than the other, that is well within normal distributions). However Player A is a horrible COF and Player B is an above average SS. As such, the two have almost identical offensive value, but wildly different defensive value. Thus, “the difference in value between [Player A] and [Player B] is defense and defense alone” is a completely accurate statement.
Just because you can say that hypothetical ‘Player C’ would be better than either of the two if that player had the defensive value of Player B, but also didn’t strike out ~30% of the time doesn’t negate that the real offensive value — the all-but equal offensive value — contributed by Players A and B.
Santana’s profile: fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=10348&posi…
Baez’s profile: fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=12979&posi…
Make special note that
– Baez is a 3.6 W player while Santana is a 0.6 player
– Baez has ~+10 defensive value while Santana is ~-20 — a difference of 30 Runs
– The R:W ratio is approximately 10:1 — ie the 3-W difference between the two is attributed entirely to their defensive differences.
I get what you’re saying. You’re not wrong. Santana and Baez have the potential for wild swings in performance also with that approach. Baez will always be fine with that because he’s an elite defensive SS. But if Santana starts K’ing at a slightly higher clip or those balls he hits hard do not fall he’s 2018 Domingo or at his worst, Mike Zunino.
Rays probably like him because his potential output would seemingly outproduce his cost for a few more seasons. M’s have a good shot at cashing in on his bounce back year no matter what – keeping him or dealing him. Solid offseason pickup. Mariners are headed in the right direction.
Cleveland bound
No.
Well, they have interest and you don’t work in the FO. So it’s a distinct possibility he will be in Cleveland. I’m not a huge Santana guy myself but evidently your FO may be.
Could be posturing (by either team) and driving the price up on others in the market.
I doubt that. Cleveland’s OF has a track record that started about 5 minutes ago and Jake Bauer’s doesn’t hit well enough for a 1B. Especially when you have a 2B who swings a wet noodle. I’m sure there is interest in him and other corner/DH types.
Naquin, Luplow and Mercado have each been more valuable than Santana.