ESPN scribe Jeff Passan floated a very interesting tidbit in his latest column Wednesday: There’s a belief among rival executives that the Red Sox, Indians and Cubs will at least be willing to listen to trade offers for their franchise players during the upcoming winter. That means any of Boston’s Mookie Betts, Cleveland’s Francisco Lindor or Chicago’s Kris Bryant could change hands once the offseason rolls around. It’s far from a guarantee anyone from the group will wind up on the move, but the idea that they might should make hot stove season all the more interesting.
The only member of the trio with fewer than two years of team control remaining is Betts, who will enter his final season of arbitration eligibility over the winter. The 26-year-old right fielder is just a season removed from earning AL MVP honors, which helped him land a historic $20MM payday to avoid arbitration last winter. The 2019 version of Betts hasn’t been as stellar as the MVP-winning player, but that’s not a knock on his performance this season so much as a compliment to what he did a year ago, when he amassed an eyebrow-raising 10.4 fWAR. Betts is up to 4.8 in that category this year, having slashed a strong .282/.384/.494 with 21 home runs and 13 stolen bases across 622 plate appearances.
Just a year from winning their latest World Series title, why would the Red Sox possibly move Betts? They’re unlikely to make the playoffs this year, though a trip back to the postseason in 2020 hardly looks out of the question. However, Betts has indicated on multiple occasions that he’d like to test free agency after next season, when he could reel in one of the all-time richest contracts in the sport. For the Red Sox, trading Betts a year before a potential journey to the open market would help the club replenish its farm system to some degree. The Red Sox only came in 22nd place in Baseball America’s most recent talent rankings.
The Indians, on the other hand, boast the game’s 10th-best system, though they’re incapable of spending to the extent the Red Sox can. That means Lindor is quite likely to end up elsewhere in the coming years. Mr. Smile will be a free agent after 2021, but it would behoove the Indians to get something for him prior to then. In the meantime, the 25-year-old Lindor is sure to collect a notable raise over his current $10.55MM salary when he reaches arbitration for the penultimate time during the offseason. Lindor perhaps hasn’t been quite as great as he was in 2018, a career-high 7.6-fWAR campaign, but his 4.3 mark and .300/.353/.532 line with 24 homers and 19 steals through 522 PA are mighty impressive nonetheless. Needless to say, teams will line up for the elite shortstop if small-market Cleveland goes with the agonizing decision to make him available in the coming months.
And then there’s Bryant, yet another former MVP. The Boras client joins Lindor as another all-world performer who’s slated for his second-last trip through arbitration in a few months. Bryant, 27, is well on his way to another raise (he’s currently on a $12.9MM salary), having batted .282/.379/.521 and smashed 29 dingers over 552 trips to the plate. Whether the Cubs would truly consider parting with Bryant is up in the air, but they are amid their second somewhat disappointing season (albeit one that looks as if it will culminate in yet another playoff berth), and waving goodbye to the third baseman/outfielder would go a long way toward aiding them in bolstering their system. It’s definitely a below-average group, according to BA, which places it 29th in baseball.
We’re still a couple months from the offseason rearing its head, but if anyone from this trio hits the block, it should make for an incredibly interesting winter of rumors. Do you expect any of them to actually change teams after the season?
(Poll link for app users)
the poll does not include “none of the above,” which is my answer.
The “none of the above” is not answering the poll.
that’s not a very good sample then. you cant properly see how many people believe such.
Lol, exactly. That’s like saying “choose red or blue” and only putting one option on the poll. Sherlock’s in need of Watson on that opinion.
Poll is “will any of these three be traded?” A very logical answer is no which isnt included, terrible poll.
There should be an option of “No”
Indians seem content letting good players go. Recently examples Brantley/Bauer. They might as well just do a fire sale and start over. I’d be disappointed as a Cleveland fan.
Fire sale? Start over? They have enough talent that only a little re-tooling would be necessary. Heck, look what they’ve done this year even after all the major injuries. They currently qualify for the post season. You act like they suck or something.
“Indians seem content letting good players go”
And?
Don’t mind the trolls…
They didn’t let Bauer go. They got talent and prospects for him
Betts to the Cards!!!!!!!
Plus – Scherzer to the As!!
Imagine
Scherzer
Fiers
Luzardo
Puk
Montas
(As 2019 World Series)
I don’t imagine the A’s would be able to get that done without having to give up 2 or 3 of their top 10 prospects. It’d be very weird sending Luzardo and Neuse BACK to Washington for Scherzer.
How does a team like the A’s pay for Max? Baseball needs to fix the system so reams can sign their own (Lindor with Cleveland) or make decisions on an equal playing field. Fans deserve it. Answer has always been a cap with both a floor and a ceiling but the MLBPA thinks of their superstars first believing those salaries bring up the rest, The last few years has shown change can occur and more is needed. I still believe in addition to the above, allow free agency earlier but reward teams with an exemption of the ceiling cap when they re-sign their own free agent for contracts of five or more years. At year five, only 50% counts against the otherwise hard ceiling. Other 50% comes from the pool small revenue clubs currently get and forces them to spend that money on payroll. Imagine what Lindor would get from Cleveland in such a situation. Win for the player, the team and their fans. Cleveland would be able to compete with the big market clubs, etc. May need some tweaking but the foundation is there.
So, similar to the NBA…
Perhaps but the NBA to my knowledge sets the limit on max contracts in years and dollars. My rough draft of a suggestion would not. Only the percentage is set for the existing team rule, Likely needs improving as I haven’t fully thought it out. Do you allow mid season acquisitions count? Imagine the biffing for Betts this July if the team that gets him would gain that benefit. While it would allow Boston to keep him, it also could greatly increase the return on a trade if for example he decided on where he wanted to be traded.
I don’t understand these kind of statements. It’s not necessarily a money thing. The Rays have one of the lowest payrolls but beat out teams with higher payrolls. They do have a Gm that can drop the money but his team performs so there’s really no need to. So in short, baseball is a mystery on who is going to out perform who. Some players can have stellar performances when they were estimated opposite. Some players it’s the vice versa. It’s not a finance thing, it’s more chance.
If you truly believe that big market teams like the Red Sox, Yankees and Dodgers don’t hold massive advantages over a team like the A’s, you need to go back to school.
The biggest advantage is the big market club’s ability to absorb an expensive injury or mistake. That though likely plays into their willingness to risk big money on questionable signings.
He was naming that as their 5- man rotation I believe. And that is still a horrible rotation when Fiers is your number 2
Mike Fiers has pitched like a #1 or #2 for most of the season, have you even been paying attention? 2.47 ERA in his last 127 innings.
shades of AJ Cole
If they win the WS this year, why trade for Max?
Who would the Cards have to get that deal done?
I was wondering the same thing.
You’re forgetting Manaea in that rotation.
Lindor GIANTS
Giants absolutely don’t have what it takes to get that done. lol
:)
Bart and Ramos get Cleveland on the phone easily.
If the Indians are interested in a rebuild, sure, but neither Ramos or Bart are close enough to being major league ready for the Indians to seriously consider it. With how the Indians have operated for a long time they have to be getting guys back that are within a year or two to the majors.
Ramos hit well in Single A but hasn’t hit nearly as well in Double A to this point, and Bart has spent a lot of time on the IL this year. He’ll need a strong showing defensively at the AFL.
Friendly reminder than MLB teams value prospects differently than MLB Pipeline, Baseball America, Baseball Prospectus and Fangraphs. Ramos and Bart could be top 100 prospects but if a team is looking to be competitive they’ll look for players that are closer to the show than highest ceiling available within a system, and even that will vary significantly from team to team, determined by system strength at a position.
Don’t take MLB prospect rankings all that seriously.
None of them will be traded this off-season.
Betts is GONE.
Teams pretty much listen to every offer on every player they have. 99.9% of the time talks go nowhere. Then there is that 0.1% time….. Some team offers a deal that makes you almost fall out of your chair. Ya never know!
THOR FOR KRIS
Lol
Betts to the Braves would be nice. But this isn’t MLB the Show so will have to settle in for another year of Ender and Nick
“But this isn’t MLB the Show ”
When Ted Turner owned the Braves it was.
Turner was great i always thought and did funny things. remember 1 time when bob Hoerner was sqawking about his salary and how much he wanted that Turner said to the media “he’d get that much when his cute curls straightened out”. hoerner had really curly hair back then and reminds me of how Logan Morrison was in his early marlin days.. Complaining fairly often and Turner was a guy who let his feelings known publicly.. A kind of nicer version of Charles O’Finley, only he did try always thought to put decent teams together, they just ended up awful in the end.
Yep felt really good to be able to go out and grab guys like Maddux, McGriff, Galaragga, Neagle, Pendleton etc
Now we are stuck with the Markakis’ of the world
Lindor to Houston for Correa, and Kyle Tucker
Correa is injury prone. How about Whitley, instead?
Replacing a guy that’s injury prone with a prospect that has some personality issues. Not sure ’bout that one.
Whit is a wild card now. I agree it’d have to start with Correa and Tucker
Betts being traded is about as likely as dying to a falling vending machine.
You better start buying your Snickers at 7-11 then. That machine is going to fall this winter.
The most depressing part? The fact that we’re already talking about the off season…
It’s less about being cheap and more about having spent too much on other guys, in the Cub and Sox cases. They’re 2 of the highest payrolls as it is
Might as well just ask which owner is the cheapest? All 3 are cornerstone guys and should likely never be traded.
The Red Sox Cornerstone guys play on the left side of the infield. The MVP right fielder who wants a Max salary is gone.
Betts should be a cornerstone guy w Bogaerts. Devers and Benintendi. Thats an awesome homegrown 4. Betts at this point is the most accomplished of the 4.
Not for the price that Betts will be asking in FA. I just don’t think $300+ mill is good for any team. Nor has Betts shown the consistency to command that kind of money. And Bogaerts is arguably as, or more accomplished than Betts, he has two rings.
I love Bogey and he was a big part of both rings but cmon. Betts has an MVP, batting title, GGs, more all star appearances, etc. He is clearly more accomplished. While Betts did have a down 2017, he had monster years in 2016 & 2018 and while this year feels down from last year it is still high level. I can agree that the contracts are too much and too long but I think we have a better chance of him contributing through more of the contract than Sale or Price or a lot of other guys.
I could realistically see bot Betts and Lindor on the move. Betts because after this disaster of a season they have a perfect opportunity to retool and rebuild the farm without too many losing seasons. Dolan put the Lindor writing on the wall this past offseason.
With the right counter moves they could still theoretically compete even without Betts as long as Sale bounces back and Bogaerts doesn’t Regress too much.
Sale is done. As is Price.
Betts for MLB-ready talent looks good on paper, but that package would have to be so great it would be laughable how much talent is moving.
I hope they trade Mookie. I am sick to death of him talking about FA any chance he has. At least the Redsox developed great position players(X man, Raffy), n if they do it well they could bring some pitching bk for Mookie. I hate to see him leave Boston, but that’s what’s gonna happen.
I agree. I think part of Betts’ slow start was comparing himself to Trout, and dreaming about the money he would make in free agency. He is no Trout and never will be.
Lindor Yanks
does lindor have a BEARD or facial hair?
he has the kind of beard to where no one notices it until they go to the Yankees and then their face just looks wrong
Jason Giambi LOL
all three play for big market teams (boston & chicago) or medium size market (cleveland).
the only way chicago trades bryant is if they decide to refill their farm that has tumbleweeds
because it WILL need refilled very soon, plus most of their rotation is over 30 years old, too.
i will FOFLOL if cardinals win the NL central, though i’d personally prefer brewers winning it,
If I’m Dave Dombrowski I’m offering Betts 8/250mi with 2 vesting options that could bring it up to 10/300mil.(Manny Machado’s money) If he turns it down I’m trading him for 3 solid prospects and a shut down reliever.
Betts is way better then Machado
Do you have a better comparable for a Betts contract?
I can see Betts being traded for three top 100 prospects, plus two other players. Would imagine 4 of the five players solid pitchers. Sox aren’t too far away from competing at a high level in the postseason imo. They need pitching and more pitching… not sure what contender is capable of making that trade, but Betts in Boston for another year seems like a waste.
Sox have traded prospects and spent big dollars on pitching already. Either they are good and you bounce back next year or you dont. Trading Betts is throwing in another year when you could easily bcompetbe elite if Sale, Price, Eovaldi show up.
I don’t have faith that those three guys can have a complete, healthy season. You shouldn’t have any reasonable expectation that they can either. Bullpen is a dumpster fire and Betts will test free agency, may as well trade him.
So you are saying we have to give up bc our commits to the SPs has screwed us. Like I said, that is the only thing trading Mookie can mean, other than that, dumb move.
Bullpen has been a shiny dumpster for about a month.
Bullpen has been asked to cover for the rotation all year and they arent built for that. Even the Yanks bullpen would wear down behind the effort of this rotation.
Yeah, I was going to say the problem isn’t the bullpen, it’s the person utilizing the bullpen, Cora just doesn’t seem to do a good job of managing it in my opinion of course
Dude wtf? The Red Sox ain’t the Angels. People get a grip!
No they “ain’t”, very astute observation.
Trout-being wasted on the Angels. Betts is far from being wasted on the Red Sox.
My original comment was specifically for the 2020 season… my original suggestion was to improve the Sox arms with upper tier pitching that they don’t have in the minors. Trading Betts is a good way to accomplish that. I completely missed the insinuation that you were comparing Trout to Betts. I think Betts is great, but he’s no Trout. You shouldn’t make that comparison again and Trout is being wasted in LA.
a waste? how is that? that is mich better said about JBJ.
Im good w JBJ at the right price. You now know you get a gold glove and a hitter that has flashes but cant be consistent. Not everyone has to be a superstar, just be what you are paid to be.
No one is going to trade half that for the right to pay Betts ~$25M next year and then watch him enter free agency. He won’t be traded because his short term contract/team rights will make it nearly impossible for the Red Sox and any team to agree on his actual value. The Red Sox are also one of only a handful of teams that can let a guy enter free agency without it really hurting their chances of resigning him.
Other: Christian Yelich. The Brewers have no farm system, and questionable big league talent beyond Yelich and Hader.
it’s not dombrowski’s MO to do something for the farm system. i don’t see mookie moving.
Probably the best argument I’ve heard against it.
I’m a Red Sox fan and I think the Sox should trade Betts this off-season. He’s a terrific player but he isn’t on the level of say Mike Trout (despite having a season – last year – that garnered him MVP rights over Trout) but he is going to get paid like Trout and I don’t think the Sox are going to be the ones to pay him — nor do I really want them to if he’s going to want 10 years an $300+M. I just don’t think he’s going to be a good investment for that long and that much — which leads me to the conclusion that they should deal him now (this off-season) while they still can, and get a solid haul in return. If he were like Bogaerts or something and changed his mind and wanted to stick around at a decent rate — I’d love for them to sign him long term for 5-7 years and $25-$30m/season but I don’t think that’ll get it done – and I think no matter what they offer he’ll test FA and probably get a megadeal elsewhere. So yeah, I’m fine with them trading him now and getting something good in return.
Trade Betts honestly is the best idea rebuild the farm
I can honestly see the Red Sox being pig-headed enough to hold onto Betts believing he will re-sign with them which would be a terrible idea. Trade him this winter and get a great package in return or at least next summer as a rental and get a couple of prospedts.
I could see Bryant being traded for young pitching. Cubs rotation is getting a tad long in the tooth.
Betts or Lindor? Doubt either gets moved. And if one does get moved, that Allied Van Lines truck better be packed to its roof with top level prospects. There’s more at play here than just the numbers when it comes to these two. Both are big time fan favorites, and everyone knows you don’t p*ss off your customers.
Looking for a big name who might get traded? How about Corey Seager (LA)? Readily replaceable with Gavin Lux. Also, time for the Reds to move on from Joey Votto. He could still have some value to a contender despite 2019 being a down year for him.
I would trade a lot of players to see Bryant on the Yanks
As long as one of those players is gleybar torress
As a Sox fan, I said give him a key every opportunity to sign a humongous deal, if he balks at the offer (8 years 220 million or so) trade him in the offseason…surely he is worth quite a bit trade wise, even for only a year
If the Sox dump JBJ like I first demanded that they do 5 years ago and make Mookie a CF, then I’d allow them to throw a dump truck of money at him.
Barring that, I too am listening to trade offers.
The Red Sox are over the lux tax line again this year and it looks like next year is the time to reset the lux tax. If JDM opts out then there is less of a chance of Betts being traded but if JDM doesn’t opt out there is almost no way they can go under the Lux Tax next year without trading Betts. The Red Sox are going to have a formidable offense even without Betts and there 2020 fortunes are going to ride on the pitching staff. If the pitching bounces back strong then the Sox will compete whether or not they have Betts. I think Boston should trade Betts I’m skeptical how he is going to age.
I may be off but I think they can be fine. Money coming off according to Sporttrac, Porcello $20.6M, Moreland $6.5M, Pearce $6.25M, Sandoval $18.4M, Nunez $5M, Thornburg $1.75M. That alone is upper $50M without JD opting out. Sale’s figure goes up about $10M. Can you really see any reason anyone gets a huge arbitration bump after 2019 performances? Lets say it is $20M. That is approaching $30M less which puts them under or around the lowest level of lux tax I brlieve. The only holes they have can be filled at 1B by Chavis-Travis-Dalbec, 2B Chavis-Holt-Hernandez, 5th starter Wright-Johnson-Houck-Hernandez-? (cant be worse than what we saw this year). I’d totally be fine w that for next year. If Sale, Price, Eovaldi are back they are a playoff team at least. If those 3 aren’t then it’ll be 2019 over again. No reason to trade Mookie and give up the chance that the rotation will bounce back in 2020.
Sale and Xander are going to eat up 23 million of the 50 million coming off the books plus increases in arbitration I believe either JDM needs to opt out or they trade Mookie to reset the tax.
On Sporttrac Xanders figure went up this year, thats why I didnt include him. Maybe they are wrong. I hope JD does opt out, that in my mind was ideal scenario the day he signed it w those opt outs. Got 2 great seasons from him at a pretty fair price, let someone else add money and years from here forward.
Xander was 12 this year 20 next year and Sale was 15 this year and 30 next year.
Betts will show his cards and sign an extension. However, I am a bit concerned that he doesn’t care enough about winning to actually do that. So I have no idea. ♂️
Lindor and Hand to the Cubs for Caratini, Russell, Schwarber, and whatever to balance.
Why would the Indians want the Cubs’ backups? This proposal is one of the worst that I have seen on here.
maybe you should stick to hockey then. Caratini is a blocked starting catcher, Schwarber is a 40hr DH, and Russell is every bit the defender at short that Lindor is.
Add to that, Cleveland is cheap, and this move without anything added gives them more team control for less money spent while still Fielding productive players with upside.
This is why I added the “whatever to balance” portion. To me, that represents Aramis Ademan and a B+ pitching prospect or two.
Cleveland has a starting catcher that they are happy with. They already have a 40 hr DH in Franmil Reyes and Russell is not the type of player that the Cleveland organization would employ. So your main pieces of your offer are a catcher and a DH that the Indians do not need and a domestic violence violator. Yea, I am impressed with that offer. Even a hockey fan would see that your offering your spare pieces for a superstar and a closer. Also this offer does not help team control as Russell and Schwarber, like Lindor and Hand, only have two years of control beyond this season.
Your offer may make sense for the Cubs, But it does not make any sense for the Indians. Cleveland may be cheap, as you put it, but they are not stupid. They are a well operated small market team that would quickly hang up on this offer.
Really, look in the mirror, jmocubfan8, and tell me that the Indians could not get a better offer IF they made Lindor available. They could probably get 28 better offers than this one.
Also, jmo, your comment about “stick to hockey, is not very creative. I hear it every time I comment against someone’s ludicrous trade proposal.
Jmocubfan8, there is a website called Baseball Trade Values that give uses various bits of information to assign a player a number value. For your trade above here are their values.
Cubs – Caratini – 9.7, Russell 2, Schwarber 34.9, and Ademan 13.6 for a Trade Valuye of 60.2.
Indians – Lindor 80.6 and Hand 24.4 for a total of 105. So this site also agrees with me and the others that commented that your trade is not equal in value. As a matter of fact we can add Hoerner, the Cubs top prospect (24.7) and that still would not be equal value (84.9),
This should show you that your trade was not well thought out.
Jimocubs I wanted to say more then this but if you don’t see how one sided this trade is then I can’t help you. I will give you a chance to make up for this you said and whatever else to make up for the difference what do you think that is because what you have proposed is not even close. So what else?
That’s not a good offer. If the Cubs offered those players it would get the deal done only if those were the add ins to go along with the Cubs best minor league prospect. Hoerner or Alzolay or someone like that. Still though SS isn’t a Cubs spot of need anyway. Guess they could move Baez back to 2nd though.