Aug. 14: Major League Baseball has formally announced that the Cardinals will return to play in a doubleheader against the White Sox tomorrow. The league has also announced seven newly scheduled doubleheaders between now and season’s end: three against the Cubs (Aug. 17, Aug. 19, Sept. 5), two against the Pirates (Aug. 27, Sept. 18) and one apiece against the Twins (Sept. 8) and Tigers (date TBD).
Joel Sherman of the New York Post tweets that if the Cardinals are able to play the currently allotted games without any additional stoppages, they’d come in at 58 games through the scheduled end of season. If those final two unresolved games would be a determining factor in postseason eligibility, the Cards could play an additional game or two on Sept. 28 (the Monday after the season’s currently scheduled conclusion).
Aug. 13: The Cardinals have been out of action since July 29 because of a coronavirus outbreak, but they announced that they’ll return to the field this Saturday with a doubleheader against the White Sox. That will be the first of three doubleheaders in the coming days for the Cardinals, who will also play twin bills on Monday and Wednesday against the Cubs, Derrick Goold of the St. Louis Post-Dispatch reports.
Having played a mere five games this season (some teams have already reached 20), St. Louis is in the unfortunate position of scrambling to complete a 60-game schedule by Sept. 27. The league’s hopeful the Cardinals will at least be able to approach a 60-game slate, Ken Rosenthal of The Athletic relays. Of course, if the Cards play fewer than 60 but are in line for a playoff spot based on winning percentage, MLB could have a difficult decision on its hands in terms of how to map out the National League postseason bracket.
Although it’s a relief that the Cardinals are finally on the cusp of a return, they’re far from out of the woods when it comes to the coronavirus. Another staffer of theirs tested positive Thursday, Buster Olney of ESPN tweets. Furthermore, the team had to place left-hander Austin Gomber on the COVID-19 injured list because he’s “possibly at risk,” per Goold. Fortunately, though, Gomber has not tested positive to this point.
Help me out here people…… There’s literally been dozens of players (many of which have already played this season) DFA’d since baseball lifted the moratorium on transactions.
Why couldn’t they have signed many of these players to field a team like Miami did along with supplementing the MLB ready players from Springfield like Carlson & Schrock & do the necessary roster moves to remove the ill players & allowing them to recover while playing said “B” team and at the same time, retaining integrity of the schedule?
Cost money. Forces them to free up 40man spots or the 60 pool spots. Also, the Cardinals are trying to compete, so it is in their interest to wait until their team is healthier to win games than to roll out with a crappier team. Marlins aren’t trying to be competitive.
Players are removed from the pool when placed on the Covid IL. The Marlins are 8-4. Whatever pre conceived notion you have about a desire to be competitive is irrevelant.
The Marlins spent some money making their team better this offseason as well. The fact that the Marlins could play but the Cards couldn’t is an absolute joke.
That’s pretty much what I’m saying & I’m surprised Manfred didn’t step in & force the issue but I guess it’s almost irrelevant now. But at the same time, I don’t think what I questioned was outrageous but again, a nonissue come Saturday.
A) the cardinals are cheap
B) manfred has no backbone
B
They are not removed from the 40 man roster though
At some point when you’re not willing to make a move to compete, shouldn’t have those games become forfeits? Miami made those moves, for some reason the Cardinals were given different standards than the marlins.
The Marlins now have owners and a team of Front Office Administrators who actually love the game of Baseball!!! The Cardinals have owners and President of Baseball Operations (John Mozeliak) who love Money, Not the historic Cardinals Baseball Franchise.
Therefore the Cardinals Owners and John Mozeliak—- haven’t, aren’t and won’t —- make any effort or spend any money to play the healthy players they currently have and isolate the sick, to put a team on the field every day. They could put a healthy team on the field every day if the owners and Pres. of Baseball Op would!! So even though I’m a die hard Cardinals Organization fan—- Yes, if the Cardinals administration does not make an effort to place healthy players on the field for a scheduled game—- the Cardinals or any other team, should be charged with a forfeit of that game or games. Only fair.
C, both?
Are we being serious right now? MANFRED is the one who determines if the games are postponed or not based on feedback from the medical professionals. Not the Cardinals. They have zero say on if games are played or not.
A and B
Nothing about this season is “historic baseball”. This entire season is a joke and will go down in the record books with multiple asterisks next to it.
I understand what you are saying but if we are going to play then everyone needs to play by the same set of rules. It shouldn’t matter who was projected to win this or that prior to the season. These circumstances are different than anything before and it’s not fair for one team to put a team together while another team completely shuts down. The commissioner should have done something about this already.
They paused the Cardinals season because positive tests keep coming back. In Miami’s case, their positive tests came in very fast, then they stopped. The Cardinals could not control it so Manfred paused their schedule longer than Miami’s for this reason and not because they don’t have enough healthy players. When they restart this Saturday, none of the players who tested positive in this recent outbreak will be back. They are still out and will need to not only test negative in two consecutive days but they also need to be cleared by doctors as well. MLB will err on the side of caution here, so most will be out through the end of August between recovering from COVID and ramp up times. They’ll need to dip into their 60 man quite a bit to field a team.
Actually multiple players have a chance to not miss time at all. Both DeJong and Molina have been listed in MLB’s return protocols. If they tested negative yesterday and today they could play Saturday
Amen to that!!!
Great point,but everything else is so relaxed this year,but the 40 man is rigid? Should have allowed a flex 40 man and given Covid stricken teams unlimited call up from their camps.
Dave Frost, I fully agree! Allowing flexibility with the 40-man roster would help teams deal with COVID impacted players and keep a competitive team on the field. No reason to lose a player to waivers just to cover a week or two.
The biggest reason is probably the legal/financial side of how players get paid based on their roster status. It’s probably a drop in the bucket, but adds up with all the other lost revenue.
But my theory is also that the Dodgers are to blame. Everyone complained so much about how they took advantage of the 10 day IL to stash pitchers when it changed from 15 days, so I think they were trying to avoid situations where players are “sent down” to their hotel for a couple days and effectively diluted the purpose of the alternate training site. Which appears to have changed in purpose once reality hit anyhow.
Cardinals aren’t a competitive team and won’t be at all in 2020.
Hmmm I don’t know… maybe because the virus can lay dormant for up 10+ days. So for your theory to work the Cardinals would’ve had to replace their entire 28 man roster and entire coaching staff to be sure they didn’t infect another team. Does that seem doable really?
The virus seemed pretty widespread throughout the organization. Some sort of gross incompetence or general disregard for Covid protocols, they didn’t even follow up with people that had close contact with their infected employees notifying them they might have been exposed. Maybe they thought the virus was a media conspiracy?
Money and roster rules. I would be in favor of MLB loosening up said rules in order to allow these teams to get some of those DFA’d guys in and get playing.
Because of incubation periods. It’s not like these players have been in self isolation, they have in contact with infected players, therefor they have to wait until the incubation period has passed and then get tested to insure that they are not sick.
The only way what you suggested would make sense is if they swapped rosters, the entire current active roster would have to go on hiatus, flip flopping with the other players from the 60 man pool. Of course those players would be without the “travel team” or whatever they are calling it. The four players or so that travel with the team just incase.
I wouldn’t be against that however, there are other things to keep in mind, the bus/plane/lockerroom etc would all need disinfected in accordance with whatever protocol they are using and the team would be without their coaching staff since they would have to be separated from the players as well.
I think it would be a better option than canceling what? 16 games or whatever but there are a lot of moving parts and being that the MLB owners and PA did not agree to these measures from the beginning it would have been impossible to implement now.
that’s a shame. Gomber was a closer candidate with Kim moving to the rotation
Not a very good one. Gomber is a long/middle reliever.
So far from the truth.
Yeah he was like 5th in line. He wasn’t going to be the closer
If they don’t have the wins they don’t get in
% will never be a factor
except they are a good team and have a good chance of a top two spot in that division
not really, you only wish that was true. Cardinals are 2 and 3 .400 4.5 game behind Cubs. Cubs have the same number of losses as Cardinals with 11 more wins. Stick a fork in the Cardinal they are done.
This is incredibly stupid, moreso as the top two teams in each division make the postseason and only the Cubs are above .500 in the central.
Even though MLB failed to adopt one, a lot of people still live inside a bubble and haven’t fully re-calibrated to all the changes yet. Just wait until they hear about Universal DH!
“Major League Baseball will work to adjust their schedule, understanding that the calendar may run out before the scheduled games are complete. At that point, the commissioner’s office has said that winning percentage will be used to determine playoff berths.” https://www.stltoday.com/sports/baseball/professional/birdland/commissioner-manfred-once-outbreak-halts-cardinals-can-still-be-a-credible-competitor-without-complete-season/article_7a1bdecd-2af2-54b2-932e-0f1435259117.html
So if the Cards play just four more games and win them all, that puts them at 6 and 3 or .667. That would be enough to get them into the playoffs. Makes sense to me if I drink enough beer
Cardinals are under .500 what makes you think they can win 4 in a row. LOL you are drunk or dreaming.
@larry48
1) The Cards are only 1 game under .500, quit acting like they’re 20 games under .500.
2) Stick a fork in the Cards, they’re done? You do realize 8 teams make it to the playoffs in each league this year. Yeah, they’re still in it. You’d be a fool to count them out already.
This season is one for the ages… but not in a good way.
This year in general is a year we will never forget, no matter how hard we try to forget.
“The league’s hopeful the Cardinals will at least be able to approach a 60-game slate, Ken Rosenthal of The Athletic relays. Of course, if the Cards play fewer than 60 but are in line for a playoff spot based on winning percentage, MLB could have a difficult decision on its hands in terms of how to map out the National League postseason bracket.”
Yeah, why not make up rules on the fly about who makes the playoffs or not.
Did they not anticipate any of this and have this already determined before the season as a well run league interested in fairness would? If not, why?
They figured the virus would go away when the weather got hot and it would all work out.
Yeah, look how good things are going in the nation.
Ah, so they were aspirational. Well, then, I guess their complete lack of planning is no big deal.
Sure, they got everything under control lol. Now they’re taking out automatic sorting machines from post offices. You can’t make this all up.
Let’s play 3?
Coaches pitch, 7 run mercy rule.
4 inning triple headers. Starting pitchers still need to throw 5 innings to get credited with a decision…
What are we even doing at this point?
Are they building a dome over Busch Stadium?
If it rains, will they be playing 3 inning quadruple headers?
Let’s celebrate the restart at the casino!!!
This season was a tainted before it started. Any pennant is tainted. Any World Series Champ is tainted. No matter how many games any team plays it doesn’t matter compared to previous years. All this angst about the Cardinals is just so much trash can banging. Watch the games but don’t think this season amounts to a hill of beans
Still more valid than the Red Sox/Astros wins.
exactly. tainted is the wrong word to use here.
Including the Papi/Manny years.
Each team is still playing the same amount of games, still have to win. In comparison to other years, yes it’s different. But it doesn’t make it tainted. It’s not like the team that wins is filled with steroid-induced players or sign-stealing mechanisms.
Why couldn’t they play a regular weekend series starting Friday? Was it because there are fewer combined innings in a 2 x 7 inning double-header on Saturday compared to 2 x 9 innings on Fri/Sat?
The medical experts determined that Saturday is the best time for the Cardinals to restart. This wasn’t Manfred’s decision. He’s actually being smart for once and listening to the real experts. First time for everything!
Rob Manfred is a broken tool, yes. But Tony Clark is a nozzle in search of a faucet. Major League Baseball as we’ve known it for the past 52 years is about to take a strange turn. I hope it doesn’t crash.
it wolnt. we keep being doom and gloom, but in reality there will always be a large enough following to keep MLB as a top 3 sport. and for what it’s worth, this is one year. dont expect anything from this year to come back next year, or even in 2021 as a result of this year’s changes.
So, 16 days in left August by the time they start then 27 days in September means 55 games in 43 days. I’ll bet the farm that won’t happen.
The Cardinals will go to a casino again within 43 days.
With your mom
Larry, you need to find something better to do.
You really dont like the cards, how did they hurt you soooo much. I feel bad. Is a former cardinal your illegitimate father or something?
> MLB could have a difficult decision on its hands in terms of how to map out the National League postseason bracket.
Not really. MLB can just adapt the batting champ rules: To qualify for that, a player must have 3.1 PA per number of games in the season (in a normal season, 3.1 PA x 162 = 502 PA). If the top batter in the league falls short in PAs — say, by 10 — recalculate the average by counting the shortfall as outs.
So set the playoff qualifying standard at, just for example, 90% of the full schedule (0.9 G x 60 G = 54 G). If a team falls short.of 54 games, for the purpose of the playoffs, recalculate the winning percentage by counting the games below the standard as losses.
So if the Cards play only 50 games, with a record of 30-20 (.600 WP), for the purpose of playoff seeding, recalculate at 30-24 (.555 WP). If they play only 40 games, with a record of 24-16 (.600 WP), recalculate as 24-30 (.444 WP).
So you’re saying there will be no more outbreaks on the Cardinal’s squad, or others? I guess you’re not a Project Manager, or you are the worst Project Manager on earth. You better believe a team losing out on a playoff spot by a percentage point because they played 60 and other team did not will become problematic.
Good point. Hopefully they can figure out a way to finish this. They probably aren’t going to be able to play 60 this season.
MLB should treat it just like in the past. When the season is over and if either team would make a difference they play after the season is over. That how some teams have played less than 162 games in the past.
Yup. Not hard.
@larry48
Fine, except what happens if the Cards still have 8 to 10 games to play, and they need to play those games? That’s an awful lot of games to make up without seriously affecting the playoff schedule.
Well it’s an idea, but theoretically it punishes the teams who had games canceled too, right? Both teams would get losses? I’m actually not opposed to it though and am glad you are thinking up ideas. We definitely need more of those in times like these.
This is so stupid on so many fronts. I don’t care about the toll and inconvenience to the Cardinals because this is self inflicted. I do care about it for their competition who now has has to accommodate them for their lack of respect and stupidity.
The Cardinals should have been forced to use their taxi squad players and played the games as scheduled. Now all the teams they face have to make modifications for all these doubleheader’s that could have been avoided.
I really don’t understand what the point of the taxi squads is.
Problem is that MLB is still requiring teams to follow normal roster rules. That should pretty much go out the window if they have an outbreak on the main team. Quarantine the main team and force them to pull up their taxi squad regardless of 40 man status and play games until the main roster is deemed healthy enough to return to competition.
But I suspect the MLBPA would want full MLB prorated pay for the taxi squad and MLB service time, which is why this is not happening.
Has anyone looked at the composition of the alternate site teams? I wonder if they’d even be able to field a full team. I’m not really aware if there are rules on x number of pitchers, position players, catchers, etc. Would be interesting, but that might be part of why that is not feasible.
You’re right, the Cardinals totally chose to have a coronavirus outbreak. Such a good strategic move. Eye roll.
No kidding. How much of this is just pure luck? How many players have broken “protocol “ and were just lucky enough not to have enough aerosols land on them? Come on people, stop thinking your team is a f”omg saint squad or some crap.
Are the cardinals players worth more value in trades now that they have COVID antibodies?
These are the questions the media doesn’t have the huevos to ask.
I know you are joking, but I thought about this from a fantasy perspective. They probably are less valuable unless you are in a daily league. Even though the Cardinals will be playing almost every day, each player is going to have fewer potential at bats due to the number of two 7 inning games in a double header (14 inning potential) versus if those had been regular 9 inning games (18 inning potential). That could be 1-2 at bats lost each game.
You also have to figure that all the analytics say playing 14 innings produces diminishing results as players tire, so maybe the studs (do any Cardinals qualify as studs?) would only be scheduled to play one game and maybe pinch hit in the other? Possible advantages still for daily leagues, but roto seems like it would especially be impacted pretty significantly. However, pitchers are more likely to get complete games, so if you get bonuses for that, worth a look.
Of course the teams the Cardinals play in those doubleheaders will be penalized, too. It seems as if MLB could have canceled the missed games and let their opponents in the missed games play fewer than 60 — rather than forcing the opponents to wear out their pitching staffs as well.
Give the Cardinals a loss for all the missed games.
Cry me a river. Good god. Suck it up people. Everybody in baseball (and the world for that matter) signed up for an f’d up year. Get over it. Roll with the punches and deal with the outcome(s).
so? making more teams play less games makes the debate over win% qualification even worse. its not a big deal of only one or two teams qualifies by win%, but in a year where a single series can flip the script so much its a huge issue if several teams need to qualify by this manner. does it hurt? yes, but it hurts each of the teams involved (which is most of the central at this point) equally.
True dat
If you set the forfeit precedence then it must be applied to everyone equally. That’s means making the Marlins forfeit any of their re-make games. If both teams in the WS test positive they must both forfeit too. The Cardinals didn’t violate any rules so they really can’t do anything to them anyways.
The teams that had cancelled games did play fewer games. They are all going to get 60 or close. Read the update. The cards are going to play 58 or maybe even 60. I would think 55 games in 43 days would be more taxing than the rest playing 43 in 43. Even if double headers are 7 innings, the cards will be playing 14 innings or more every 3rd day for the rest of the season. You act like they got coviid on purpose as some kind of advantage. The idiocy on this comment section is real.
Pfizer has started on a stage 3 Covid19 vaccine, they are testing 30,000 individuals. I cannot help but wonder why don’t the NFL and MLB vaccinate their players. There have been no reports of any adverse effects of the vaccine. It seems to me that there is a lot of upsides and very little downside.
Ehh….jury is still out on this one I think. I’m not sure I would jump on a vaccine at this point honestly
1. There is a reason drugs have to complete the testing protocols before they can be officially approved. Still testing means it hasn’t been proven to be safe and effective yet. Hopefully the vaccine development continues to progress well for the sake of all humanity.
2. Isn’t that technically a performance enhancing drug?
From what I read the vaccine is not officially approved but reports are highly encouraging to its safety. The question is what is better for one’s health, getting Covid19 or the vaccination which could very well prevent the virus.
You have to give up on this notion a that vaccine is coming anytime soon. It’s not happening for a while.
Starting stage 3 doesn’t mean it’s safe, or effective.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6092479/
The primary source of trial failure has been and remains an inability to demonstrate efficacy. Hwang et al. [58] assessed 640 phase 3 trials with novel therapeutics and found that 54% failed in clinical development, with 57% of those failing due to inadequate efficacy. There are many reasons that potentially efficacious drugs can still fail to demonstrate efficacy, including a flawed study design, an inappropriate statistical endpoint, or simply having an underpowered clinical trial (i.e., sample size too small to reject the null hypothesis), which may result from patient dropouts and insufficient enrollment.
Agreed. I would add that it may be there, according to Russia, but doesn’t make it safe.
Just because they started phase 3 trials with 30K people doesn’t mean that it’s safe for mass vaccination yet. This phase is to widen the study on side effects, effectiveness, and long term safety to a wider array of people. Rushing a vaccine is never a good idea, I certainly won’t be standing in line for it when it’s released. I’ll give it a few months at least. I imagine NFL and MLB players do not want to be in test group.
It should be like in hockey. You get 2 pts for each win. The most points gets first. You shouldn’t get an advantage by playing fewer games.
Finally, get to playing already.