Nearly four months after trading Andrew Benintendi to the Royals as part of a three-team swap also involving the Mets, the Red Sox announced that they’ve acquired outfielder Freddy Valdez from the Mets and right-handers Grant Gambrell and Luis De La Rosa from the Royals as players to be named later, officially completing the trade. The Red Sox acquired outfielder Franchy Cordero (from the Royals) and minor league righty Josh Winckowski (from the Mets) at the time of the trade, which also sent outfielder Khalil Lee from Kansas City to New York.
The 19-year-old Valdez has yet to progress to A-ball after splitting the 2019 season between the Rookie-level Dominican Summer League and Gulf Coast League. The Mets signed him for a $1.4MM bonus as a 16-year-old out of the Dominican Republic back in 2018. In his lone season of pro ball, he hit .274/.367/.448 with an 18 percent strikeout rate and an 11.4 percent walk rate.
Valdez is generally regarded as one of the Mets’ top 20 prospects, ranking 13th at The Athletic, 14th at MLB.com, 17th at Baseball America and 18th at FanGraphs. FanGraphs’ Eric Longenhagen calls Valdez an “absolute behemoth of a corner outfield prospect” with “thunderous” power, likening him to Indians slugger Franmil Reyes. The Athletic’s Keith Law writes that Valdez has “huge” power with above-average speed and a plus arm, though many scouting reports on Valdez raise questions about his hit tool and his defensive future.
Obviously, given Valdez’s age and the fact that he’s yet to even take a single at-bat in A-ball, he’s years from factoring into the Red Sox’ big league plans. On some levels, there figure to be comparisons to another player the Red Sox received in this trade: Franchy Cordero. Valdez, by all accounts, is a physical specimen at a young age with a tantalizing set of loud tools but has a ways to go before scouts will be sold that those tools can translate at the Major League level. As far as lower-level lottery tickets go, he’s the type that comes with considerable upside but also a fair bit of risk.
Gambrell, 23, is the more highly regarded of the two players coming over from the Royals and also much nearer to the big leagues. Kansas City’s third-round pick out of Oregon State in 2019, Gambrell has tossed 22 2/3 innings of 4.37 ERA ball in Class-A Advanced to begin the season, recording a 19.8 percent strikeout rate, 7.6 percent walk rate and 50 percent ground-ball rate in that time. Longenhagen ranked him 21st among K.C. prospects, noting that Gambrell used the off-time in 2020 to get into better shape and reported to camp in 2021 with a “totally different body” and improved velocity.
De La Rosa is even more of a lottery ticket than Valdez. Still just 18 years old, he signed as a 16-year-old in 2018 and carved up the Dominican Summer League a year later, tossing 38 2/3 innings with a 2.33 ERA, a ridiculous 52-to-7 K/BB ratio and a strong 48.9 percent grounder rate. Despite that exceptional short-season debut, De La Rosa isn’t ranked among the Royals’ best prospects, although he could certainly generate some further recognition if he can back up that dominant 2019 showing at a more advanced level.
The Athletic’s Chad Jennings first reported that the Red Sox would acquire Valdez from the Mets (Twitter link). Julian McWilliams of the Boston Globe reported (via Twitter) that Gambrell and De La Rosa were also headed to the Sox.
so if this was supposed to be the best of the PTBNL…
Time will tell.
Regardless of how it pans out, the Mets prospect was supposed to be the best player they were getting back
This is a Tampa type move that I fully applaud. Not all deals work out but if any of these players develop, the cost once they do would obviously be a lot more. Just keep adding young guys who other teams spent the money signing. The fact that Valdez was universally considered in the Mets’ top 20 says everything to me given his age and lack of pro ball experience. Who really thinks Benny would have turned it on in Boston this year? The fans as they came back would have buried him after his brutal April. I’m glad for AB but I also would not take back the trade.
I didn’t think he was washed up, but it had to be done per their plan. They’re restocking the minors, getting more guys with years of control and staying under the lux tax. I like Benny, but he’s replaceable. Mookie is not, but not a long term investment that is wise. He’s already having back issues. Not a good sign. Good guys though, fun to watch them both.
Mookie has been replaced and so far the deal is a win-win. LA won last year if you believe the season should count and MB was a key component. That said, he was not resigning, if he nonetheless did, Boston would have been hamstrung financially due to taxes. Forget the prospects. I’d rather have JDM, AV and money in my pocket going forward than Mookie and Price. That’s how impressed I’ve been with AV. I also don’t see a loss in RF with Renfroe out there. You put JBJ back in center, Verdugo in left and Renfroe in right and the defense might be even better than 2018. Outside of that amazing catch in 18, AB was nothing special in left.
He’s boom or bust to an extent
When Yordan Alvarez was traded to Houston, the dodgers traded him NOT mainly because he was a future DH, but many scouts were unsure how his in game power would translate. They’re about the same age, especially you factor in the lost 2020 year
You don’t have to be great at a lot in this game to be a potentially valuable guy if you got 40 home run power and can take a walk
Never heard of him. What are his biggest hits?
You could actually read up on him here before mouthing off.
mlb.com/prospects/mets/freddy-valdez-682639
That would require effort.
And the ability to read.
Looks like a nice move by Chaim.
17 years old, looks pretty decent in rookie ball. Sorry to see him go.
19 years old, but still very raw…
It is interesting that lee is ranked as the Mets 7th prospect and Valdez is listed as 14. The Red Sox must see something in him. Weirdly enough, he seems to have a similar hit tool as Franchy.
He’s only 17, that’s why he’s ranked lower. As he moves up in the minors, he’ll move up in the prospect rankings.
He was 17 during his first season in 2019. He’s 19 now
Oh right. I forgot that he had a whole year wiped out.
Scott got rolled for this one by Chaim Bloom. He knew Zack Scott had an infatuation with Lee and look at the bounty he yield. Absolutely no reason to even get involved in that deal. But bloom called up Scott and took advantage of his former coworker. Fire this clown already. And Rojas and trade all the dead weight before it’s too late. Salvage the season.
I agree it seems like a terrible trade for the Mets
Way too early to evaluate this trade or Rojas as a manager. So far, Rojas has passed with flying colors. It makes one wonder the true motives of the anti-Rojas crowd.
Lee’s already made the Majors, so so far he’s been a better MLB player then Winckowski/Valdez. obviously that may not stay that way, but there is a reason neither was a top-tier prospect when dealt.
Yea Lee already made the majors batting .056 1-18 with 13 Ks. So your right Mets got better end of that deal. Valdez is 19 years old and hasn’t made it yet. So I guess that qualifies as a bust in your book. Good golly.
clearly you didnt read my whole comment. Lee has a significantly higher chance to have any impact in the Majors then Valdez does.
How do you know that?
because he’s already played in the Majors, which means he’s 100% played in the Majors. someone who hasnt played in A-ball yet, ballyhooed or not, doesnt have a large change of making the majors.
Khalil Lee: -0.4 WAR, -54 OPS+
There’s a good argument that you’re better off without that player on your team.
Not seen, that can remember any of the 3 Boston got today, but have seen Winkowski pitch several games for Portland this year. other than his 6/4 start, where he gave up 4ER, he’s looked pretty good. Will he end up in the BP eventually, like he did during ST with Boston? Possibly, but he’s looked pretty decent going 5-6 innings so far this year and that De La rosa is a real wild card am looking forward to seeing in Ft myers.
Bottom line is the Mets right or wrong felt Lee could contribute now or next year more than who they gave up. With new ownership, they’re in win now mode. Simple as that. Reminds me in some way of the Heathcliff Slocum trade with Seattle where Boston got back unknowns named Tek and Lowe. Imagine if this trade works out as well for Boston…
He never said “making the majors”. Changing words to fit your argument is tacky. He said make an “impact”, meaning being a decent player.
Valdez probably has a less than 50% chance of even making the majors considering he’s a mid tier prospect with defensive concerns. The bat will have to carry him. As for Lee, SSS. Give him time.
I’d say a lot less than 50%. Your point? But if he shows as much talent as Lee has; I hope he doesn’t.
The point is, Valdez has a better chance to be an impact player. Negative WAR is a negative impact, hence of no value.
You can spin it anyway you want. Most GMs would rather have Valdez.
DarkSide83013 hours ago
because he’s already played in the Majors, which means he’s 100% played in the Majors. someone who hasnt played in A-ball yet, ballyhooed or not, doesnt have a large change of making the majors.
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Brock Holt has played in the majors, and Wander Franco has not. Does your hypothesis apply to them as well?
Oh and if you don’t know Valdez was a high ranked young international prospect.
Couple this with the horrible horrible deal given to Lindor before he even proved he could even handle NYC life and that is two significant strikes. But I have faith in Cohen to do the right thing and start over with a real GM instead of pecker boy and Chaim Blooms little lapdog.
there are dozens of those every year.
It’s part of Bloom’s goal of increasing the breadth of the Red Sox system. Fans are always looking for the next superstar, but managing a team requires increasing quantity that can also be used in trades down the line.
Hunter Renfroe, Franchy Cordero, Danny Santana and now Valdez. Chaim Bloom certainly has a specific type of player in mind for the corner outfield positions.
Boston has the strongest presence of any team in the D.R.. I’m sure they are very familiar with him.
Bloom is from the Tamp Bay/Friedman family tree. I would trust his instincts on earl;y evaluation of international prospects (and prospects in general). I thought he was an excellent hire at the time and haven’t seen anything to make me change my mind. He’s carrying forth with his long-range plans despite having to make an unpopular move out of the box.
Prospects Are Suspects…
Mets could have had one of the 3 Big Starting Arms The A’s had in the mid – 2000’s but wouldn’t part with LASTINGS MILLEDGE ….
i honestly think Lee was the best prospect and 2nd best player exchanged in the deal.
I don’t see what folks see in Lee. Looks like a solid 4th OFr, can play CF but I don’t see him as an everyday player.
Red Sox chose to bring the Mets in the deal, rather than keep Lee for themselves.
They probably agree with your assessment.
Gambrell’s the best player the Sox got imo
Agreed, Gambrell has the goods. Kind of sad he was involved.
So…the Royals are giving up, yet the Twins haven’t moved anyone yet to some of these other desperate teams….time to go Falvine.
misread…ignore….why’d it take so long to complete? anyway…my position on the Twins still stands…tear it down, or fire away
I would have rather kept Winckowski and Valdez.
Lee is as strikeout machine with very little upside in my opinion; the next Keon Broxton.
And I know I will get the rebuttal comments about being young, which makes this all fun, but 13 Ks in 18 AB with his minors strikeout rate near 40% isn’t going to change.
BOSOX Fans, what happened to Benintendi? Didn’t get to see him play a lot, but remember him being a good player for several years. Injuries?
He was a solid player in 2018, after which he went to the gym and bulked up to be a power hitter for 2019, which had the effect of crippling his hit tool. He slimmed down again for 2020 but didn’t recapture the hit. The strikeouts were off the hook and the baserunning, when he did get on base, was hallucinatory. He became a prime “change of scenery” candidate, hence the trade. The fact that Bloom got five players for him is nothing short of miraculous. I’m glad that Benintendi is hitting in KC (I think big outfield has something to do with that) because I wouldn’t want Bloom tarred with the idea that he only trades dead weight (Workman/Hembree to Phila.).
Workman/Hembree netted us Pivetta and Seabold. And Workman is now back with the Red Sox. Love the move by Bloom.
The hell, @MLBTR.
A couple dozen articles & narry a one on the Yanks? What is this? Some kind of equal treatment thing?
You guys know which side your bread is buttered on.
#LetsMakeNewYorkTradeRumorsGreatAgain
Oh.
Yeah.
Interesting prospects, etc, etc.
Admittedly, there hasn’t been anything interesting on NYY prospects lately or the past few years. I settle right now for #YankeesOffenseHasComeAliveSponsoreByMLBTR
Sox got taken on this one. Cordero stinks and these guys appear to be no more than AA material. Only hope is Winckowski.
The trade can’t be fairly evaluated for several years. I’m guessing Sox will look good on this in 4 years.
The kid Valdez sounds like Franchy Cordero – no? Long shot. I still don’t like the trade.
Trade Evaluation –
Red Sox give away –
Benny (hits 3rd in the KC line-up with a 109 OPS+ after starting slowly.)
Red Sox receive –
Frenchy Cordero – Crap hitter and defensive liability
Grant Gambrell – 3 year college career unimpressive 3.47 ERA and 1.33 WHIP for Oregon State. In two seasons of minor league ball his ERA is 5.62 and a 1.51 WHIP. Potential for becoming a major league add for the Red Sox? Nearly zero.
Luis De La Rosa – 18 year old Dominican pitcher with next to no history. A complete unknown quantity. He started 11 games and pitched just 38.2 IP in the Dominican summer league. Wait and see is about all you can say about him.
Freddy Valdez – 19 year old Dominican outfielder who got 10 at bats at rookie ball so far. Again, like De La Rosa this kid is unknown. Less info than a high school player would have. No way to know what type of potential.
Josh Winckowski – 23 year old pitcher who in 2019 pitched at low and high 1 with an ERA of 2.69 and a WHIP of 1.20. At 21 that was an excellent year. In 2021 he’s been promoted to AA and has only thrown 27 IP with 1.33 ERA and 0.89 WHIP.
So they traded an inexpensive above league average OF loved by the fans for 5 guys.
Two young Dominican players who are unknown quantities, an unimpressive young pitcher who doesn’t look like he will make the majors without a complete change in his statistics, a crap outfielder in Frenchy and ONE guy with potential yet to be realized.
This is a travesty without Winckowski. With him, it simply looks like a bad trade which is fairly standard for Bloom. Could this turn into a great trade for Boston? Sure, if the two unknown youngsters become starters in a couple of years, Winckowski is a starter in a year and Frenchy figures out how to hit and field. Could this be a huge disaster? Sure if Benny gets better and becomes a perennial all-star and HOFer. Neither scenario seems likely so lets just leave it as a bad trade and that’s without considering the time value of players playing now versus later.
I really don’t understand this deal from the Royals side. Not only did they have to give (3) players to Boston, they also gave up a well thought of prospect in Lee to the Mets, all to get Benintendi? While Benintendi is having a good year so far, it sure feels like an overpay by KC. Both the Mets and Red Sox have to feel good about their returns in this deal.
I do wonder why De La Rosa hasn’t pitched at all this season. I know he’s still young and they got rid of Low A ball, but you would think he could make their A ball team at age 18. He must be in extended spring training.
It’s tough for the Royals to bring in marketable major league players with a decent track record. They will gladly give up a bunch of fringe-ish minor Leaguers for one of those. Especially a starting outfielder making just six million dollars a year.
as a Royals fan I love this trade. Cordero sucks and Lee has too many strikeouts. You people in Boston and New York think the world revolves around you. You got took. Right now and 4 years down the road. BTW don’t be surprised when Benny resigns with KC. He likes playing for a winner.
The Red Sox definitely didn’t get “took” lol… but at the same time there’s no reason to think that the Royals and Red Sox could both be winners in this trade. Benny was great at first for the Sox but it was time for him to get a change of scenery. And I’m glad he looks to be back on track with KC… but the Red Sox wound up with a ML wild card in Cordero and 4 legitimate minor leaguers. A former 3rd rd pick P, a highly touted 19 year old OF with serious pop, and an 18ish year old pitcher who by all accounts had shown to be incredibly advanced for his age (16) in his first taste of professional action. Not to mention they also got a guy who’s posting a sub 2.00 ERA in AAA. Even if only 1 of those prospects winds up working out or they wind up dealing one or more to acquire a ML piece at some point. The deal is still a win-win for Boston and KC… as for the Mets, well see about Khalil, they like him a lot apparently so maybe he will turn out to be a legitimate leadoff type hitter. He’ll have to make more contact though, but from the Red Sox perspective. This trade is a “win” in terms of the value they got back for an OF who needed a change of scenery anyway.
Back on track?
He has a career low OPS with 1/3+ of the year gone. Hahahahaha. That’s on track?
Agreed, an OPS+ of 107 is barely above average… no it’s not the horror show of last year, but it’s on par w the mediocrity of the prior year and a half before that
107 for a weak-fielding LF doesn’t cut it.
Ma4170 – Maybe you need some context before you retract your comments. Benny’s 107 is now 115 and rising in KC. His horror show happened during a rare pandemic and lasted 14 games and 52 at bats!!
Perspective – lets compare Benny’s start to some notable Red Sox players
Bogaerts 18 games in 2013 resulted in an OPS+ of 87 (that’s 4 more games than Benny played in 2020 when his was 27 and made him tradable.
2014 – Bogey’s first full year his OPS+ was 84
2015 – 107
2016 – 111
2017 – 95
2018 to 2021 135, 140, 131 and 147 (star level)
Benny’s 118, 103, 123 and 100 compares favorably to Bogey’s 87, 84, 107,111. Did you feel the same way about Bogey as you do Benny? Bogey two years later jumped to a star level and that could happen with Benny too.
I hope that reference helps you put Benny in context. Benny was better than Bogey for his first four season then had a 14 game bad season and got traded for not being good enough. It makes no sense.
Lets now compare to Devers.
2017 58 games and an OPS+ of 112 barely above league average
2018 121 games and an OPS+ of 94 below league average!!
2019 an OPS+ of 133 way above league average comparable to Bogey
2020 an OPS+ of 110 barely above league average in 57 games
So in comparing Devers and Benny we see Benny has a higher floor and Devers has a higher ceiling. When Devers struggled he was not traded despite being a huge defensive liability and Benny other than 14 games in 2020 has never been below league average and was better than Bogey during his first four season and not far behind Devers for his first four years and Devers is a huge defensive liability.
There was no reason to trade Benny. $6.6M for a 111 OPS+ player is not too high and like Bogey there is no way to see if after a specific amount of time Benny wouldn’t jump to a new level like Bogey did in year 6.
Also, just as a reminder look at my response to Dorothy who trashed Benny’s defense. The data shows that what Dorothy said is completely NOT TRUE. Benny was a good defensive outfielder and he made a very significant, difficult catch in a high pressure situation in the run to a ring. He is a clutch player with playoff experience.
Benny is a tier 2 outfielder and most teams can’t afford 3 tier one outfielders like Betts so he fit perfectly in the big picture. He was an above league average modestly paid corner outfielder. Giving that up to stick your hand in a bag and pick out teenagers who might some day be good is a travesty. Doug Jones was right in what he said about the trade and it should burn the Red Sox fans that ownership is so inept., The Red Sox got took.
Once again silly to say the Red Sox got took. There is no way you can evaluate this trade for years. Like I said earlier in 2021 no question that losing Benny made the team weaker but to try and evaluate this trade and say the Red Sox got took is ridiculous.
Bruin1012 – I completely understand your argument but being took is a perspective based on a point in time. As of now, they got took. In 10 years will that still be the case? I agree we don’t know but now we can put some probabilities to the chances that the result will be the same.
What are the odds that Benny doesn’t finish his career with at least a 111 OPS+? I’d say highly unlikely unless some major injury hits and he comes back after the injury and takes his above 111 OPS+ down below 111. His career is just starting and he’s done well. Most players get better after 4 years of slightly above league average play so there is no reason to think Benny won’t.
So, to reverse the current status of the deal one of the four players other than Cordero would need to radically improve. What are the odds that 2 teenage pitchers will end up being quality starters in 4 or 5 years? Not great. Could they? Yep. Likely? Nope.
Time will tell so your point is understood. The likelihood that Benny will produce less going forward than 4 virtual unknowns and Cordero is very low. You have a proven quality player on the one side of the scale and 4 unknowns and Cordero on the other side. Right now, Benny has the teeter tauter on the ground and the other side is as high as possible. Maybe over time the non-Benny side will begin to level the comparison but how many years from now and how do you discount the fact that it is so many years down the road?
Yes, there is a very long shot chance this works out for Boston but it’s highly unlikely based on the stature of the players involved..
That’s all I meant by the Red Sox were took. As of now, that’s a true statement and is likely to remain a true statement but there is no certainty that it will.
Ok Einstein
Highway robbery by the Red Sox.,
Andrew Benintendi is one of the most over rated players in MLB.
AB is an average player not worth all these players
Beni is playing a lot better than Franchy, and it only cost the Royals Franchy, Kahlil Lee (which seems to have a ceiling not extremely different than AB), and a couple of unspectacular lottery tickets. I can’t complain as a Royals fan, but Boston faired decently in regards to what they got from the Mets.
To me he’s very similar to Alex Gordon. If he’s healthy he’s a solid above average player but not a star. I often think of Paul O’Neill. Will have his moments. Doesn’t hurt you on either side of the ball.
IMO, Benny is showing you he is who he was ’17-’19 when healthy. If he keeps it up he’ll have no problem getting a good contract at in ’23 when he’ll be all of 28
Assessing the trade now is kind of pointless. I believe the Red Sox are none the worse for letting Benintendi go. They also got value from him while he was there when it mattered in 2018. How these players they got back perform is a wait and see. They have played well in spite of Franchy Cordero’s struggles which allows them to take the pressure off and let him develop in a lower risk environment, the minor leagues. They have seen something in him and they are pretty good at that. We will see how it plays out. If he comes back up and is productive, that helps the team.
All of what you say in this paragraph is true, a relief after some of the high winds above. My concern with Franchy is that he has a very good line for his whole minor league career, and he seems to be replicating it right away in Worcester. In other words, he might be a true Quad-A player, one who can never bring his solid minor league game to the majors. That would be a shame, but I am for trying to get him past that. And a thought on Freddy Valdez–he sounds a lot like Danny Diaz, right down to signing for similar bonuses (Diaz $1.5 mil, Valdez $1.4). The prospect luster has come off Diaz. It may be the Sox are trying that phenotype again (this time w/o paying over a million) in the hopes of unleashing a future “Franimal.”
I’m willing to be patient because the team is doing well. With all his injuries I think Franchy needs some time to develop. Apparently he can hit minor league pitching in his sleep. The jury’s out, we’ll have to see.
Danny Diaz makes me think of Denny Dias which makes me think of playing “Song For My Father” at my jazz gig last night and introducing it as “a little Steely Dan”.
I have a short attention span.
Meanwhile, back at the Tiger ranch….BigAl Avila is think about getting out of bed…… and Little Chris has done an all-nighter, watching hockey reruns……
It’s true!
Hockey pucks do have more fun!
Get rid of players a year or two too soon than a year or two too late. I know this concept in years past has been foreign in Boston but this is how Chaim Bloom ran Tampa and kept them competitive. Boston dealt AB from a spot that had been a strength (wouldn’t say that’s the case now but corner outfielders aren’t too hard to get). You traded away one guy who pretty much already seen his upside which is an average MLB outfielder, you got a couple prospects whose upside is greater than that. Red Sox fans are just used to management buying players in free agency this is how you develop a farm system. Tampa has the best farm system in baseball year in and year out and that keeps them relevant. Imagine not having to trade home grown talent because you can pay them arbitration. That is a luxury Chaim Bloom did not have in Tampa.
No Red Sox fan should be defending Dombrowski, he went all in on 2018 and left us with a depleted farm system and financial instability. There is absolutely no excuse for the 2nd wealthiest team in baseball to essentially say we can’t afford one of the best players in baseball (Betts). Dombrowski created an unsustainable monster that burned bright and burned out quickly.
BS! Stop whining and crying and scapegoating Dombrowski. Dave Dombrowski did what ownership hired him to do: Build an immediate winnner at all costs and not hold out financially or with prospects etc…Red Sox have “blown out” and forced many top quality GMs to leave both voluntarily and involuntarily.
Theo Epstein, Ben Cherrington, Dave Dombrowski.
The only surprise is that Chaim Bloom took the job in Boston considering that Red Sox Ownership has made the Red Sox Front Office a “revolving door” with very high turnover.
Red Sox Ownership will abuse Chaim Bloom also like they have burned so many others in their Front Office.
Bloom will also move on to another team in 3-4 years….
Sam Kennedy and John Henry created the problems, not Dombrowski. Dombrowski did what he was hired to do and very successfully.
Well your right to an extent, ownership hired Dombrowski and they most definitely signed off on the Price/Sale contracts.
SportsFanooo – Finally a baseball guy who knows the game. I applaud your answer. Ownership is and will continue to be the problem. Bloom was Lee Harvey Oswald executing Mookie’s stay in Boston. There will be no loyalty especially if credit starts going to Bloom like it did Theo, Cherrington and DD. Ownership doesn’t like people stealing their spotlight.
This deal may or may not turn out great. But the strategy and mindset that created it will pay off for the Sox big time in the years ahead.
Bosox20135 hours ago
There is absolutely no excuse for the 2nd wealthiest team in baseball to essentially say we can’t afford one of the best players in baseball (Betts).
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It’s not a matter of affording Betts, as much as a matter of how to best spent $210M. Betts & Price have combined for 5.8 bWAR while Verdugo has a 3.2. WAR. The difference of 2.6 WAR is not worth the $46M that LAD pays those two.
JB – WAR is a contrived number that is based on historical results. You talk about it as if it’s a commodity. There is no logic in your argument.
Baseball players are paid then the WAR values come after the fact. Past WAR doesn’t translate into future WAR so there is no point talking salaries and using WAR to support the argument. The day a contract is signed the past WAR values can be evaluated and used to create the contract but there is so much more that goes into signing a player that you are selling the process short with your argument.
With perfect knowledge would come perfect contracts. Perfect knowledge doesn’t exist so perfect contracts don’t exist. Are some players over-paid? Yes Are some players under-paid? Yes. Is a Betts in the hand worth more than a Verdugo in the bush? YES. Price and Betts were elite players when they signed their contracts. Verdugo being less expensive doesn’t mean he’s more valuable because he costs less, it means the Red Sox have less talent for less money and got the fourth pick in the draft because of it.
They are off to a great start in 2021 not because Verdugo is cheaper than Mookie, they are off to a great start because the nucleus of the 2018 World Championship team is performing in a similar way to the way they performed in 2018. The complimentary pieces like Verdugo have played a small part but if the Red Sox lose JD, Bogey or Devers for any significant time the hope is over, end of story. The rest of the team lacks the necessary talent to win and it has been Bloom’s job to replace the lost talent and he’s failed miserably..
The Mookie deal will always be one of the worst deals in the history of baseball.
Richards, Whitlock, Renfroe, Sawamura, Ottavino so far have been good to very good additions.
Kike and Marwin have been the only additions that really haven’t been good at least offensively but they do bring quite a bit of defensive versatility I wouldn’t say good off season signings so far but not disasters either they do bring something to the table.
Oh and while it wasn’t this year but getting Pivetta looks pretty damn good as well so please enlighten me on how what Bloom has done is failing miserably.
Also no the Betts trade will not go down as one of the worst in the history. In fact, if you look at it from a purely business standpoint then the Red Sox lost one year of a superstar and added 5 years of a very solid above average player in Verdugo that isn’t even arb yet and another very good prospect in Downs. Let’s also look at it from a 2021 perspective let’s just say the Red Sox sign Mookie to 30 million dollar contract then do they sign Richards do they take on the salary for Ottavino do they sign Sawamura probably not. There is a cost for signing someone to big long term contract I’m not saying I wouldn’t of loved to see Mookie in a Sox uniform for his entire career I would have I’m just saying it isn’t as easy as Mookie is better Verdugo and Downs. I’m not going to argue that Mookie wanted out of Boston because we don’t know for sure but I do no for sure he said he was going to test free agency and that he was going to be extremely expensive that we knew for sure and armed with that knowledge he was traded for a very solid return hardly anywhere close to the worse trade in history. End of story.
I’m not saying I wouldn’t of loved to see Mookie in a Sox uniform for his entire career I would have I’m just saying it isn’t as easy as Mookie is better Verdugo
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Of course Betts is better. But Betts + $30M is not better than Verdugo + $0.5M, and I don’t think it is remotely close. In our case, it is either:
Betts + Price
or
Verdugo, Richards, Perez, Sawamure, Ottavino, Kike, Gonzalez, Andriese & Renfroe.
Bruin1012 – Impact players. That’s the phrase I use when talking about Bloom’s shortcomings. Richards, Whitlock, Renfroe, Sawamura and Ottavino are complimentary players but not impact players. Pivetta as I mentioned so far is his only impact player.
The goofy argument used by so many fans who don’t understand winning and should follow the Dodgers and Yankees who couldn’t win until LA got Mookie is that $27M for Mookie for 1 year isn’t as good as a cheap Verdugo for 5 years. If you don’t win a ring under either scenario. it doesn’t matter. It’s a tie.. Sale’s injury kept Boston from competing in 2020 if Mookie and Price stayed. The dynamics of the team changed without out Mookie and Price but a shortened season is impossible to estimate under alternative scenarios. I don’t believe with Mookie Boston wins another ring and clearly with Verdugo they were a disaster.
It’s 2021 now and Verdugo once again won’t bring them a ring but Mookie has brought 2 teams rings in the last 3 years. Without Mookie in Boston LAD is far more likely to win yet another ring with Mookie than Boston is with Verdugo, Downs and Wong for 5 years. Heck, for 20 years!! Two of the players in the deal might not make the majors and Verdugo is a Tier 2 player and may never climb to Tier 1 to join Mookie as one of the elite in baseball.
If you aren’t winning, cheap is just less expensive not better. Considering the massive amounts of money the Owners made with Mookie in Boston the cheap route wasn’t necessary and is the worst decision since Ruth.
Do a cost benefit analysis of paying Mookie $450M of 12 years. Lets say it forces the team to compete two out of 3 years going forward so 8 of the 12 years they exceed the luxury tax. Do they make lots more money when they win rings? Yes. Will they make lots less money not winning with Verdugo? Yes. Do the fans deserve ownership that spends some of it’s profits to put a winning team on the field? Yes. By spending under the cap in 2021 are they doing that? Nope Do you hire a guy like Bloom if you are planning on winning soon? Nope because his plan takes forever to realize the ultimate goal of a ring.
I have as many rings as the brass in Tampa Bay.
Were Red Sox fans better off with DD and a competitive mindset that said winning is the goal each year? Yes. Is the ‘lets be sustainably good and not win’ approach something that should excite fans? Nope. There may be some that think like Dodger and Yankee fans and can be satisfied with finishing in the playoffs every year and not winning but Boston fans over the last 20 years have experienced winning across sports and have come to expect competitiveness by all their franchises.
I expect the Red Sox to take actions that support competitiveness and I haven’t seen any since they fired DD. It’s a loser organization right now, with loser beliefs. Pound your chest about a better farm system (which it is not) and sit home and watch the world series being played in a different town. I want Duck Boat parades not mediocrity and I want it rIght now!!, Bloom, Cora and the ownership group are nothing but mediocre participants in the chase for rings.
Just out of curiosity, where do you think you went wrong with your ’70 wins is a fantasy’ prediction?
Thank you
I like what the Sox have gotten back for Benintendi. The players from the Mets look to have promise. The young arms from the Royals also look promising. The future grades on De La Rosa are very juicy with his early rookie ball success back in ’19. Cordero still has a great chance of making an impact too. I wonder if his COVID delayed spring really stifled his rhythm once he returned, or it could just be that he needs to get his plate discipline under control. Either way, I think the Sox can get a lot of value out of him now or later. Very pleased things appear good even though I will miss Benny.
White Sox traded for James Shields and gave up Fernando Tatis Jr, you never know with prospects