The upcoming free agent shortstop market has been talked about for awhile now, and we’re still a few months off from seeing how the whole thing plays out. Perhaps the most coveted of the soon-to-be available shortstops is the Astros’ Carlos Correa. One potential match for Correa’s services will be the Tigers, tweets MLB Network’s Jon Heyman.
The Tigers are an up-and-coming team with plenty of financial flexibility, and it’s certainly interesting to think about Correa once again teaming up with his former skipper A.J. Hinch. As hard as it is to imagine Correa leaving Houston, they do have prospect Jeremy Pena waiting in the wings, making an exit at least feasible. The Tigers, meanwhile, have one of the most open shortstop situations in the game, with incumbent Niko Goodrum easily able to shift into a super-utility role.
Angels’ closer Raisel Iglesias figures to be another in-demand free agent this winter. His priority, however, is re-signing with the Angels, writes Jeff Fletcher of the Orange-County Register. Iglesias made the most of his first season with the Angels, tossing 69 innings in 64 appearances with a 2.61 ERA/2.87 FIP. He has notched 34 saves, a mark that will look attractive to contenders this offseason.
In terms of rotations arms, there are few with the upside of the Red Sox’ Eduardo Rodriguez. Rodriguez and the Red Sox spoke about a possible extension earlier in the year, but there wasn’t much progress made and the two sides ultimately decided to table talks until the offseason, per Alex Speier of the Boston Globe. After complications from COVID-19 cost Rodriguez all of 2020, he has returned to his usual stable workload, making 31 starts for the playoff hopefuls.
Rodriguez hasn’t quite pitched to his pre-2020 level, though his 4.77 ERA may be a touch inflated. A 3.33 FIP suggests the 28-year-old hasn’t lost a step. He’s tossed 156 2/3 innings with an above-average 27.4 percent strikeout rate, 7.0 percent walk rate, 44.2 percent groundball rate, all numbers that will look good on Rodriguez’s free agent resume this winter.
Nico Goodrum will not be on the Tigers roster next year, at 7.5 million he will be far too expensive to keep. Either he is released, most probable or hopefully traded.
You are correct that he will not be on the roster next year, but I’m not sure where you got $7.5 million.
He will be non-tendered and probably sign a minor-league deal elsewhere to compete for a utility job.
Niko only made 2.1 this year. You think it’s gonna sky rocket like that through arbitration?
At this point, DO YOU REALLY THIN AL AVILA HAS WHAT IT TAKES TO MAKE THAT TRADE???
I DOUBT HE COULD SELL FIREWOOD TO AN ESKIMO!
AND I like Al. But this be is getting me upset. Why make ILLICH spend money on bs?????
Nonsense. Avila has nothing to do with Niko not having any real value in a trade market.
Americans bought TENS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS WORTH OF PET ROCKS.
It’s a skill.
I honestly cannot wait to see all the “heavy hitters” strike out in FA because random teams like the Tigers and Rangers are going to spend huge this year.
Tigers aren’t a random team lol. They are one of the biggest markets in the country, with one of the most appealing teams for a FA
Well, they’re random in that until recently no one expected them to be players in the market
Players? When the Tigers put up a winning team they will break the 3 million ticket sales. The fan base is deep.
Thus, players. What word would you prefer?
As good as Correa is I would rather spend the $30+ MM he’ll most likely demand on bullpen and starting rotation. Along with JV’s $33 MM coming off the books, this team can really fill some holes. Jeremy Pena seems to be a good prospect and even if he fails, Pedro Leon is there too. Bergman at SS isn’t a good idea specially with his weak hammy.
The Astros have no shortage of prospects that will step up.
Disagree but respect your opinion
Thank you sir, you are a gentleman and a scholar.
Disagree with which part because that alters if I agree with you
I think he disagrees with my auto-corrected spelling of Bregman.
anyone from astros are not reliable all-stars since the lot of them don’t have trash bins to hit on when they hit.
So wrong, Jeff. So dumb and so wrong.
If that was true, Jeff, the Blue Jays wouldn’t have signed Springer.
Will Correa really want to babysit the Tigers through the last 1-2 years of their rebuild though? I think he’d prefer a team already in win now mode. Maybe I’m wrong since most of this year’s playoff teams aren’t in immediate need of a frontline shortstop.
If he signs with the Tigers, they’ll be in the playoffs within two years. No babysitting required.
For someone like Correa, if he’s not immediately in the hunt for another title, he’s babysitting, and he’ll be in a Machado-esque babysitter role until the Tigers can guarantee they can win.
Maybe the Tigers will snag a WC in 2023 or 2024, but I don’t see them surpassing the White Sox in the immediate future. There’s still too many good teams in the West and East that have actually proven themselves to pencil the Tigers in for a playoff spot in the next few years
Would it make more sense.to hire guys you can trade for top prospects?
Avila is selling KoolAid.
Correa will sign with whoever pays him the most
Next year the tigers infield if they were to sign Correa would include Candelario (having an underrated season), Schoop and Torkelson, outfield of Riley Greene, Grossman, and Baddoo/Hill. Rotation of Mize, Skubal, Manning, maybe Verlander, and probably Wentz at some point. Maybe not the flashiest team but not a rebuilding team either.
Torkelson and Greene will rake. The rotation is still a work in slow progress.
As a Tiger fan, I’d love it if Correa signs with the Tigers. But not holding my breath. There will be plenty of competition for him and he will have his choice of landing spots. And he has said repeatedly he would love to stay in Houston, just was not going to negotiate during the season. If I am a betting man, He stays in Houston, followed by the Yankees then the Tigers.
The Astros don’t want to give him a 10 year contract, so he is gone. Only chance he comes back is if he doesn’t get offers
He’s got the ring he wants the $$$. Tigers have it. AJ wants him.
The Angels definitely need a Short Stop. I would prefer Correa, but it will probably Wind up being Story that they sign. Yes I know the Angels need 2 front line starters. Resign Iglesias and edit lease two more bulb in arms as well. They also need to address the inability to hit left handed pitching. If they could sign Correa that would help address that. Also it would weaken the Astros.
We tried that with the Hamilton and the rangers and it didn’t pan out too well. Resign Simmons cheap, QO to Iglesias, sign Rodriguez, sign Max and Ray, trade Walsh to the Rays for Baz, trade Marsh for Max Meyer.
Lmao dream on. Simmons is meh, no thanks. Iglesias won’t take QO, probably signs 3-4yr deal. Rodriguez I agree. Max AND Ray not happening, MAYBE one but I doubt that. Keep Walsh at 1B, keep Marsh.
They definitely need to resign Iglesias, and add 2 QUALITY STARTERS and a solid SS.
Haha that would be wild. Just increasing payroll 50+ mil free and easy!
Sadly that’s what it’ll probably take to make them contenders and they only have a 2-3 year window with Trout Rendon and Ohtani
Trade Walsh? Then who plays first base next season? Besides that, other than Marquez with the Rockies, every pitcher that the Reys trade, ERA goes up up at least 2 runs a game as soon as they trade him. Simmons is always hurt. It’s funny everyone always brings up Hamilton. They tend to forget he finished third in AL MVP voting the season before he played for the Angels. People also like to ignore, Torri Hunter, Bartolo Colon, Vlad, Orlando Cabrera, were all Free agents signed by the Angels, who all had good numbers with the Angels.
Taking a sip of favorite beverage. Did you say resign *Andrelton* Simmons??
Baz is replacing Glasnow so Rays won’t part with him. Marlins would want far more than Marsh.
hell no. he was good during trash bin hitting. since then he probably found a way to cheat another way
I don’t think they’ll sign any of the big name shortstops unless the music stops and there is no one sign one or two that get left out. I can see them trading for Mondesi from Kansas City, who plan on moving to Bobby Witt next season.
I would have to believe the Brewers rotation will be something of a Burnes, Woodruff, Peralta, Ashby, and Lauer type. So could the Brewers do a trade of Small, File,JBJ, Cain and Bettinger for a Brandon Marsh and couple lottery picks. That could give Milwaukee an outfield of Yellich, Taylor, Marsh, and Dahl( if he can go workout in Arizona to get back to all star offensive status over the winter. That would also give both teams some flexibility, Milwaukee could go get a really good bat in free agency or try to lock up some of there young players. I know let the critics begin but it’s a win win for both teams. Small and File would fill 2 spots in rotation for the Angel’s along with Cobb and Bundy too. Get over it people ilike talking baseball and trade scenarios.
Nobody is trading fof JBJ. If the Angels hope to contend and have enough money to spendyou don’t trade a guy who has six years of control for another clubs leftovers. Marsh has shown enough to get a shot of starting in the OF in 2022. Ho Adell will compete with Upton for the other OF position. I wouldn’t mind seeing Story at SS. Add a seventh and eighth innings guys to the pen that would solidify the pen.
The biggest if is how to attract TOR type starters which will make or break the Angels chances of contending. The Angelswill have to get extremely lucky to contend against the four tough teams in the East and Houston, Seattle and possibly Oakland. Detroit may also be a contender next season. The Angels are overdue for some good breaks.
The Angels will most likely have to trade either Marsh or Adell to land a top of the rotation stud, and then they will look to sign Scherzer. They need to be creative and spend. Upton will be DFA’d.
The only concern is Eduardo Rodriguez medicals from his bout with myocardiatis from covid. So far, so good thankfully for him.
Yes health is concern, but it looks like he finally turned the corner mid-season. I hope Red Sox sign him, he could turn into a good #2, without having to overpay,
mwrhermo – Signing an injury prone pitcher is asking for trouble. Also, signing a pitcher with the following stats as a #2 SP is asking for even more trouble!!
6 yrs with BOS pitched in 158 games 153 starts and 0 complete game
ERA – 4.17!!!! WHIP – 1.315!!!! ERA+ 110 for a #2 SP?
By comparison your #1 SP is Sale
11 yrs 7 in CWS 4 BOS 92 Starts with BOS 2 CG (2 less years in BOS than E-ROD)
ERA – 3.02 (1.15 less than E-ROD) WHIP – 1.040 (0.275 less than E-ROD) ERA+ 150
That’s such a HUGE step down from your #1 to your #2 that E-Rod’s numbers are much more comparable to a SP #4 or #5 and he’s a health risk!!
I say don’t touch E-Rod unless he takes $5M or less and put performance clauses in his contract that give BOS an opt out if he starts less than 25 games in a season.
Quick comparisons to put E-Rod into perspective
John Means pitches for BAL and will be year 1 arbitration player in 2022:
4 yrs in BAL 67 games 62 starts 1 complete game
ERA – 3.70 WHIP = 1.068 ERA+ 126
He’s a heck of a lot closer to a SP #2 than E-Rod.
Another example – Carlos Rodon pitches for CWS making $3M in 2021 FA 2022
7 years with CWS 37 games 35 Starts 2 complete games
ERA 3.79 WHIP 1.295 ERA+ 110
Better numbers than E-ROD making $5M less than E-ROD and is 29 in 2022 like E-Rod.
There are better choices available and even with Rodon’s better numbers he’s still not a #2 SP to fall in behind Sale. Right now, Eovaldi is the #2 SP and based on what we saw in 2021, both Pivetta and Houck look better than E-Rod and their numbers are better.
The Red Sox need a Lefty #SP but clearly it’s not E-ROD.
Means is a #1 caliber starter, he leads MLB in WHIP and if he had even just a mediocre bullpen his ERA would be in the 2’s.
And he’s pitching today against the Jays!!
FPG – I told you the Rays own the Yankees. 7 = 2 in the 4th!!!
BOS just needs to do it’s job!. Cora is such a putz at managing pitchers that they are most likely to lose if he pulls Houck the first time he gets in trouble. Using Eovaldi in relief would be a mistake. He needs to pitch on Monday for them to have a chance against NYY, SEA or TOR.
The good news is it could be a 3 way tie for WC2 if the Yankees lose all three and TOR and SEA win today and tomorrow!! hahaha
KD – Internet outage today so can’t write as much as usual. But I admit I failed to think of one thing, Rays benefit from a 3-way or 4-way tie. They want their ALDS opponent to have the hardest possible path. That means Yankees fighting for WC spot. Works for me!
I think Means beats Jays today.
Didn’t start off well with mean and the Jays…
FPG – Means will be tough on the Jay but at some point Vlad Jr. will break out of his slump and if it happens today, Means goes down. Vlad Jr. is killing two of my fantasy teams in the last week!!
If BOS wins the last two they are golden. It will be NY in BOS. I think both SEA and TOR will split and NY gets swept.
FPG – I just checked scores and Vlad homered and they are up by 3 in the second inning!
KD – This is why I don’t like to make predictions!!! I will take responsibility for jinxing Means.
So …. Cora pulls Houck after FIVE PERFECT INNINGS despite throwing only 53 PITCHES!!!
As Eck just said, “It could come back and blow up in your face”.
This ridiculous decision by Cora could be monumental depending on what happens over the next 4 innings. Wow, just wow.
FPG – Did Cora pull Houck after 5 innings with a perfect game and only 53 pitches thrown? I don’t have access to the game so I’m confused why he came out. Did he get hurt? Or was it Cora being Cora?
FPG = hahahaha you posted the same thing at the same time!!
FPG – Cora’s no dummy when he pulled Houck he had a plan. hahahaha
He brought in Richards whose been struggling then he followed him up with Brasier who has sucked since he joined the Red Sox. Now he’s got two more innings to cover with people far more likely to give up base runners than Houck.
What did I tell you? Cora could screw this up if he pulls Houck too early. The man is clueless when it comes to pitching and hitting and managing and pretty much anything related to baseball other than how to mumble to reporters and have them think something he said made sense!
FPG – Just figured it out. Cora hit for the pitcher then someone told him the pitcher had to come out!!! Incompetent it’s the best word to describe Cora other than cheater.
FPG – Spot on that the move would backfire. WAS ties the game in the 8th and BOS was lucky to get out of the inning with only 1 run scored. Ottavino gives up a double, two walks and a sac fly. The line-out would have put the Red Sox behind. Bullet dodged but we’ll never no if Houck had a no-no in him today. That’s a shame.!!!!
KD – People don’t realize just because decisions happen to work out, it doesn’t mean it’s the right decision.
Two absolutely bizarre decisions by Cora:
1) Bringing in Davis to pitch to Soto with the bases loaded. Davis hadn’t pitched at all since Sept 21, and hadn’t pitched the five days prior to that. He has been horrible all season. Soto just barely missed a Grand Salami to dead center field. Needless to say, Davis quickly gave up two runs in the bottom of the 9th.
2) Bringing in Arroyo to pinch hit. The guy has a grand total of 4 PA’s since August 26, and a total of ONE HIT since July 17th.
What the heck is wrong with Cora?
FPG – Vazquez delivers a triple to take the lead and Shaw drives him in for a 2 run lead in the 9th. JD’s walk started things off then he got pulled for a runner so if they had not scored JD and Schwarber would have been out of the game in the 10th!!! Brilliant move by Cora taking out two of his top hitters. Good thing Vazquez saved his sorry butt.
It’s not over but it’s looking much better thanks to Vazquez.
Win with NY loss means WC1 is now BOS!! One day left with 2 or 3 teams tied a game back. SEA must win to keep pace with NY and TOR.
KD – That’s one heck of a broadcast delay you’re on! It says 9 minutes ago you posted, but the game ended like a half hour ago!
Yes it was about time Vazquez came through with a big hit. Of course it helps the Nats BP is horrendous, they even walked Davis on 4 pitches … how bad is that?
Cora is like a kid and his players are like a dish of candy given to him. He consumes them right away instead of making them last longer and saving some for later.
Why hasn’t he been playing Arroyo? I think that’s a sign that his good friend will be playing the position starting Tuesday, which means Dugie in CF.
It’s looking like a Cole/Eovaldi matchup on Tuesday. For the love of God I hope Cora does the right thing by having Plawecki catch that game.
FPG – TB wins Sunday so it comes down to can TOR (Vlad turned his ankle and got pulled on Saturday) and SEA (too hot to cool off) both catch the Yanks. I think it will be lots of fun if they do!!!!
3 way tie breaker goes to TOR so game one is SEA at NY then the winner goes to TOR to see who plays BOS I think..
NY or SEA would play 5 days in a row if they win the Wild Card game.
MON – SEA at NY
TUE = (SEA/NY) at TOR
WED – (SEA/NY/TOR) at BOS
THUR – WC winner at TB
FRI – WC winner at TB
A disadvantage for BOS if they play TB. A bigger disadvantage if TOR plays TB and a huge disadvantage if NY or SEA play TB under this scenario!!! Pitching will be fried by the time they face TB.
Yanks Taillon needs to beat TB Wacha.
BAL/TOR is Zimmerman vs Ryu
SEA/LAA is Anderson vs Detmer
IF SEA fails then NYY at TOR on Monday assuming TB does it job and beats the Yanks one more time.
Weren’t you saying Rodriguez should have been dumped back in July? Would’ve have been a huge mistake, right now don’t you think?
Lumping every single inning a pitcher has ever pitched, to project a his future, seems naive. Also, I don’t waste my time with ERA. It can be very deceptive. Next you’re going to throw out wins and losses as your point. How about these numbers:
2017: ERA+ 108
2018: ERA+ 116
2019: ERA+ 128, 6th place in CY balloting
2020: Derailed due to injury/covid
I see a player who was definitely becoming a #2, but was derailed by injury. Now they have the opportunity to retain him on the cheap. You see a guy you’d have cut in July.
Denny, ERod derailed by illness not injury. Big difference.
dennyd – The ERA+ are slightly above league average except in 2019 and that was the year he got all kinds of run support and won 19 games. That was his career year and he had an ERA of 3.81!! His WHIP was even more embarrassing at 1.31.
How many years of being a journeyman #4 or #5 SP being paid too much do you have to see to convince you? This is his SIXTH season of mediocrity.
By month here are his numbers. Recognize when you sign a guy you don’t get to pick the best months to pitch him. He plays the whole year and INCONSISTENCY is his trademark!!
2021 – ERA 4.77 WHIP 1.398 HORRIBLE NUMBERS for a #2 Bad for a #5
APR – ERA 3.52 WHIP 0.087 TOO BAD HE COULDN’T KEEP IT UP!!
MAY – ERA 7.28 WHIP 1.888 HORRIBLE
JUN – ERA 6.23 WHIP 1.346 VERY BAD
JUL – ERA 4.71 WHIP 1.429 VERY BAD AGAIN
AUG – ERA 3.33 WHIP 1.296 Good ERA bad WHIP
SEP – ERA 3.30 WHIP 1.433 Again, Good ERA and bad WHIP
In total these are NOT the stats of a #2 SP. They are miserable.
August and September were the only months of 6 that had a decent ERA but he still lacked control so his WHIP was exceptionally high
His statistics don’t support a #2, #3 and are borderline #4 SP and he wants #2 or #3 money so tell him to take a hike and see if anyone else is stupid enough to over-pay him. If they do, great for him.
$5M supports his stats just like Perez. Unfortunately their numbers are closer than anyone would guess.
Good point FPG. I’d rather take chances investing in a pitcher who has recovered from illness, over a pitcher with a possible nagging injury.
KD17 Again you keep lumping his numbers from when he was a rookie, to drown out the clearly improving stats from 2017 on.
As far as April, May, June. I feel he was clearly still recovering. And thats the reason he’ll come on the cheap to some team this winter.
But hey, General Manage KD17, you wouldve smoked the guy from your team for ZERO in return back in July. Real Sharp.
dennyd – I recommended he be non-tendered due to his illness, the austerity program and he had one year left to free agency.
If you think E-Rod had trade value in July you are crazy. He was just a #5 SP having a bad year at that point. If money could have been saved it would have happened in December last year. Think of the 20 other guys Bloom could have brought in for that $8.3M salary paid a pitcher who sucked in 2021!! Aren’t you supposed to be a big Red Sox fan? Wasting money isn’t the Bloom way. You should be agreeing with me that the $8.3M could have been used in better ways.
Next year Sale and Eovaldi are locked in for $48M and Houck and Pivetta will up that to $50M. Why sign a guy like E=Rod to be your #5 for way too much money when guys like Rodon will be on the market for comparable money? Or maybe go after a bigger name since there should be close to $60M available under the cap?
Personally, I’d go after Scherzer for $30M a year for 2 with an option on the 3rd year. That would assure fans of a playoff spot in the near future not the distant future like Bloom is working towards.
Thanks for thinking I’m really sharp. I always enjoy compliments!!
Smoking the guy from the team for his value is really sharp. I agree.
Clearly you didn’t see him turning it around back in July. Yet he’s done just that. And you’re still way too long on words, and short on facts, now as back then. So if you were completely wrong about him back then, why would anyone believe you now.
Final word. His last healthy season (2019), he finished 6th in AL Cy Young voting. Clearly many people believed he was a #2 back then. No reason he can’t regain that form, and maybe even play better. With the illness question marks, this off-season, his price tag would be reasonable. Since you don’t agree, I feel even better about this option.
Thanks denny, we finally agree on something :O)
dennyd – I’m sorry were the numbers not convincing? Normal people read the crap numbers he’s put up and say “hey those are crap numbers” only you and possibly JB would take facts and skew them to say something completely different than what most people would understand.
E-Rod is mediocre now, he was horrendous in the early part of they year and his career is mediocre. #5 SP at best especially with Sale, Eovaldi, Houck and Pivetta ahead of him.
dennyd = I’m confused by your reference to his rookie numbers. Which years do you consider his numbers to be his rookie numbers?
Age 22 2015 – ERA 3.85 WHIP 1.290 ERA+ 112 Decent start to career
Age 23 2016 = ERA 4.71 WHIP 1.299 ERA+ 95 Soph yr slump
Age 24 2017 – ERA 4.19 WHIP 1.282 ERA+ 109 Slump continues
Age 25 2018 – ERA 3.82 WHIP 1.265 ERA+ 116 Upward but still average
Age 26 2019 – ERA 3.81 WHIP 1.328 ERA+ 128
Need to note that his ERA stayed the same from yeat to year his WHIP got much worse but his ERA+ went up? Confusing? The other pitchers got worse during 2019 while he slightly dropped but the effect was to raise his ERA+ number. Also, ANY WHIP over 1.3 is terrible. ANY WHIP around 1.25 is league average. That’s what makes him mediocre. Without all the run support he’d be Perez!!!
Age 27 2020 – OUT due to COVID and RELATED HEART PROBLEM
Age 28 2021 – ERA 4.77 WHiP 1.398 ERA+ 99
So basically he started off not terrible as a Rookie. He had a two year sophomore slump. Then he had a league average year. Then he had another league average year with lots of run support and pitching so bad that he got votes for the Cy Young!! How pathetic is that.
Now at 28 he’s recovering from a heart problem and should have taken the year off but didn’t so he could make $8.3M for having a crap year.
Now you are saying he should be signed because this one really, really small segment of his career was good so he’ll make for a great #2 SP!!! Seriously?
NO WAY. He is a dime a dozen pitcher so anything over $5M is way too much. You can find that ERA and WHIP just about anywhere. Like I said it resembles Perez and most consider him substandard as a starter.
Too many memories of him winning with great run support and not enough looking at the numbers to see how bad he ACTUALLY is.
“Confused about his rookie numbers”
Why are you getting so easily confused? Let me know where you lose me.
-This article is talking about Rodriguez getting a possible extension for 2022. As in his future.
– I site a progressively improving Rodriguez from 2017, 2018, 2019. Before the tires come off due to illness/Covid.
– You give his ERA for his entire career. That career ERA number assigns just as much weight to the first inning he’s pitched in April 2015 as the innings he pitched last week. I don’t care if he won the CY Young as a rookie. It was 7 years ago, and has little relevance to what he will do in 2022.
Anytime you’re evaluating the future of a player and someone includes stats from 7 YEARS AGO, in their argument. They either A) Want to lump a bunch of crappy numbers into the argument (which I believe this is the case) or B) Don’t have a clue what they’re talking about.
Players grow and develop from Age 22 to 29. If you were an Advisor sitting in the room with MLB GM, and were discussing whether to sign a player to an extension, and threw out his “Career ERA” as one of your determining factors, you’d be laughed out of the room.
Still Confused?
dennyd – It’s clear now. You didn’t read the numbers I have posted. His rookie year was better than years 2 and 3 and other than a mediocre 2019 with tons of run support he’s never been anything but a #5 SP.
Look at his numbers. I posted them. They don’t lie. A guy with a 1.30 WHIP isn’t a #2 SP on a good team. A guy who can’t keep his ERA below 4.00 isn’t a #2 SP on a good team. He can’t do either!!!
Why do you like the guy? His numbers are mediocre at best. Wouldn’t it be better to have SPs with good numbers on the staff? Houck looks like a monster going forward and Pivetta may have turned a corner this year and could be an outstanding #4 SP. Wouldn’t it be good to get a guy for the same price as E-Rod that slots in higher in the rotation? E=Rod makes for a decent long reliever or #5 SP but those guys make less than $5M a year. E-Rod wants way more than that. He’s getting $8.3 for the numbers he put up this year. Bad #5 numbers.
I guess we can agree to disagree. I was not impressed with his second half. It was as inconsistent as his career. He can have moments of greatness that can’t be sustained and he can have many moments of failure that destroy his numbers and take away any chance of winning the game. If you like that type of volatility great. I don’t. I like consistency.
Look at the staff. Houck and Pivetta had a bad game here and there but overall there numbers show progress. E-Rod’s numbers when good still look league average at best but his price tag won’t be league average.
If E-Rod is willing to long relieve for $3M I say keep him. Otherwise, find someone with consistency in performance and a career ERA under 4.00 and a Career WHIP under 1.25 with a price tag under $10M and hopefully he is lefty to off-set Eovaldi, Houck and Pivetta.
Clearly you didn’t read my “I don’t care if he won the CY Young as a rookie”. Who’s not reading who?
Clearly you didn’t read my “I don’t care if he won the CY Young as a rookie”. Who’s not reading who?
I’m an analyst, I look for ‘trends’. Rodriguez was trending up before Covid. And is showing a trend up this season. He probably was still weak early on.
To give example (a bit off topic) Disney Stock is ‘buy’ ‘buy’ ‘buy’ from all the analysts. I think its a dangerous investment. Its been trending down since March. But if you look at the historical charts it looks fantastic.
A bit off topic: Im an analyst, I look for trends.
Disney Stock trending down since March 2021. Most websites LOVE this stock and recommend ‘buy’. They keep siting Covid for hurting the company. But Covid is already built-into the current price. If you look at Disney Stock historically it is doing great. But, I look at the most recent high/low and see where its going. And right now its going into the crapper.
A bit off topic: Im an analyst, I look for trends.
Disney Stock trending down since March 2021. Most websites LOVE this stock and recommend ‘buy’. They keep siting Covid for hurting the company. But Covid is already built-into the current price. If you look at Disney Stock historically it is doing great. But, I look at the most recent high/low and see where its going right now. And right now it’s going into the crapper. (SP500 YTD +17.8%, Disney YTD -1.6%)
Don’t get me wrong, Disney could turn around, and do fine, but I wouldn’t invest in it. Rodriguez is opposite situation. He had his issues, but improving numbers this year tell a story of a player who could be much better in the future.
dennyd – As for the insults about what would happen if a career ERA was ever mentioned in a GM meeting, you are talking out of your hind quarters. A player is evaluated on both what he’s done lately (which in this case is terrible) and what they have done as a trend over the years. GMs evaluate the growth pattern of the individual just like I did.
He started well then had two sophomore slumps then slightly improved and had a 5th year when he got huge run support to win 19 games with a bad ERA and WHIP. Then he got COVID and a severe heart condition that wasn’t handled properly by him or the Red Sox (doctors stated he should not have ANY activity for 6 months yet 4 months later he was starting a throwing program). So he rushed back and failed miserably in his most recent season so looking back over the 7 years (6 years of stats) he may have peaked in 2019 thanks to great run support.
So to use your framework for evaluation, recent history is bad. His trend starts well 7 years ago but trends down then up slightly then he misses a year and his most recent year is bad. Going on recent history Bloom should have non-tendered him as I mentioned and saved $8.3M and used that money to get a more reliable starter. Unfortunately, Bloom doesn’t have that skill set, he got Richards for $1.7M more!!
You believe as a GM you’d want this guy? Don’t become a GM. You’d be worse than Bloom and I can’t think of a greater insult!!
dennyd – Your view of an upward trend is a stretch to me.
2015 – ERA 3.85 WHIP 1.290 ERA+ 112
Good start but irrelevant to you.
2016 = ERA 4.71 WHIP 1.299 ERA+ 95
Significant downward trend in ERA WHIP not good
2017 – ERA 4.19 WHIP 1.282 ERA+ 109 Slump continues
A repeat of 2016 – bad ERA and bad WHIP
2018 – ERA 3.82 WHIP 1.265 ERA+ 116 Upward but still average
Numbers slightly better than his rookie season.
Does slight growth over four season really suggest an upward trend?
2019 – ERA 3.81 WHIP 1.328 ERA+ 128 (note negative WHIP trend)
Again, still plateauing by the numbers but you called it an upward trend. Don’t be fooled by any Cy Young vote. Pitching had a very bad year and he was one of them. The data is flat year to year.
2020 – OUT DUE TO COVID and HEART PROBLEM
2021 – ERA 4.77 WHiP 1.398 ERA+ 99
Trend? This is a huge downward trend and his worst season!!
AND it’s his most recent season so your argument supports my conclusions about E-Rod.
Let me guess as an analyst you do what JB does. You cherry pick data so it supports your argument. In the last 30 days his trend is up?
Is that what you are arguing should be the basis of extending the contract of a guy who is NOT trending up by year, is not good in any specific year including his career year in 2019 and who may have further issues since COVID is NOT going away any time soon?
I have an MBA in finance so I understand what you are saying about Disney but the example doesn’t apply to E-Rod’s career. You can’t isolate a month and conclude his trend is upward long-term. E-Rod is not a high performing Disney stock, he’s a mediocre stock that has never shown signs of climbing to greater heights, his stock has moments of brilliance followed by weeks and months of mediocrity.
Disney was a bad comparison but I get what you were suggesting, it simply doesn’t apply to E-Rod.
dennyd
KD17 Again you keep lumping his numbers from when he was a rookie, to drown out the clearly improving stats from 2017 on.
==================================
For predictive purposes, I don’t think analysts go back more than three years ago. Outside of maybe recurring injuries, what a player did four years ago has little impact on what he will do next year.
From 2018-2021, at a cut-off of 450 IPs, ERod’s ERA is #32 in BB. FIP is #14, and xFIP is #24. Outside of possible heart problems, I see almost no reason to be concerned about him.
No AJ Hinch/Correa trash can banging comments?
Nope because he won’t be on the astros anymore. All is forgiven then.
He replicated without them
And so did all of the stars, but those “jokes” have persisted.
E-Rod is my favorite free agent right up there with Castellanos this off-season. If the Rangers could snag both of them along with some additional pieces I’d be really happy. Not gonna set myself up for failure like I did with my Rendon hopes a few years ago.
I just really don’t see how Houston can let him go. He’s their leader and still has years of prime left. However signing him might mean not resigning Tucker/Yordan when their time comes. I don’t envy Houston’s decision.
The Astros don’t believe in long contracts. Correa will 100% want a long contract. He is gone
Have you seen Altuve’s contract? The old ownership fet that way, not Crane.
Altuve average over 144 games
Three batting tittles
Two times over 100 runs scored
Two times over 30hr
Gold glover (2015)
MVP (2017)
Stolen base leader twice
Correa has never done the above and being older, you don’t expect better productivity or a healthier player. Just doesn’t make sense, and WAR and his defense is overrated. Only the local newspaper would say something different based on Correa agent own metrics, studies and online comments to create unreal demand.
Both were active in the trash can scandal.
Arte will overpay for a flashy name SS (Correa?, Story? Baez?) and spend less on starting pitcher(s). It’s a LOCK! Angel fans have seen this movie before…
Probably lose Iglesias too.
I agree tool. Moreno will believe that the 21 pitchers we drafted this year and those already on hand will be enough to build a pitching staff from. He will pretend to be “in” on a couple of front end starters with lowball offfers to appease the fans. Then he will sign a few arms who are hoping for a bounceback to their once mediocre careers and pay too much for a SS who sits out most of 2022 with a pre-existing injury..
The only hope is he lets Minasian build a pitching staff like he is known to have done in Atlanta. The past decade of winters suggests that my first scenario is what we can expect.
Would love Correa to the Cardinals and get rid of DeJong!
FPG – The Red Sox line-up is still seeing the worthless Hernandez batting first not Schwarber. Yep, he started the game with a ground out to the pitcher. I think he could have done that better from the 9th spot in the order. Cora’s biased line-up makes it harder for the players to rally beyond the stupidity and win.
Schwarber just doubled so the 3-5 hitters are up but with an out due to Cora’s stupidity. Adding the out at the start of the game and then hurting late inning rallies with a slug like Kiki batting before the big guns makes no sense. Bat him before leadoff man Schwarber, in other words, NINTH!!! Helps the first inning and the late inning rallies start one batter sooner!!
Bogey just walked!! Let’s see if leading off Kiki costs them a run. Devers grounds into a double play so end of inning rather than a man on third with 2 outs and JD up!!! Proof once more that Cora’s batting order doesn’t work to maximize runs.
KD – Don’t worry about 2B, as Dalbec has been working out there.
Can you imagine an infield with Schwarber at 1B, Dalbec at 2B, Xander at SS and Devers at 3B??
And some people worry about the outfield defense? LOL
Holy Toledo!
WHAT ARE YOU PEOPLE THINKING??????
AL AVILA S/B ON THE PHONE RIGHT NOW, TRADING HINCH, CANDELARIO AND FULMER FOR ABRAMS AND HASSELL!!!!!
SORRY AL. THIS TIGER FAN IS GETTING VERY UPSET WITH THE INEPTNESS.
Sell CANDELARIO as protection for the long term investments SD has in 3rd and 1st base. Protects the top $ investment. Candy can play everyday, good 3rd base, passable 1st base.
Add in a couple of pitcher like FULMER because he is on a LOW DOLLAR TRAJECTORY.
Cisernos was our best reliever.
Offer to take on the MEYERS’ contract.
WE GET A HUGE TOP PROSPECT PACKAGE BACK!!!
COME ON AL!!!!!
In Spain, theycall it SENE.
In Israel, beyxxxxxx edit
In Cuba, huevos, pelotas, cajones
Here in America we merely ask you to groxxxxxx a pair. Edit
This is another opportunity. Talk to Hinch!
Let him know, you want him to be our guy- a ten year contract. Talk to him about the NYY Chapman trade. Tell him we want him.back like the Jackson5.
But if he wants a GREAT TEAM, we need to trade him first.
You should get ABRAMS and HASSELL without even including Hinch…just for taking on the MEYERS’CONTRACT.
My apologies Al. This Tiger fan is in a REAL pissy mood today. And Hinch can go to…..
It’s a secret.
Bet you a nickel Goodrum will be gone in 22.
I remember people on this site saying Lindor was better than Correa. Funny how Correa has had a better season.
SS, Power hitting Outfielder and a couple of FA starting pitchers the Tigers will definitely be 10-15 games better
Riley Greene could be that OF you seek. 2022 AL ROY.
.285, 25 HR, 100 RBI
I also want the Tigers to bring back Max Scherzer. Verlander is a sentimental favorite, but Scherzer is the guy who will anchor the young Tiger staff.
Scherzer, Mize, Skubal, Manning and Alexander. I think Alexander is the 2nd best current Tiger starter behind Mize. Tigers could bring Peralta back. Wentz should be able to go next season. Faedo could be ready to contribute in ’22. We know Boyd and Turnbull will not be around til ’23.
CONGRATULATIONS TIGER TEAM ON A GREAT SEASON.
YOU GUYS DID GREAT!
Despite ownership and management’s best effort to ruin a storied franchise – YOU THE PLAYERS kept fans interested.
YOU, THE PLAYERS, DESERVE ALL THE CREDIT!
CONGRATULATIONS!
Give Correa his $300 million/10 yr deal.
Sign Max Scherzer….3 years…$90 million.
Give Verlander a 1 yr. $12 million with a ’23 option at $15 million ($3 million club option).
Tigers will be in the palyoffs next year. Tigers may be realistic WS contenders in’23.
In ’23 Greene and Torkelson are every day players. Miggy’s last year….wouldn’t it be nice to go out a WS Champion before he’s a 1st ballot HOF’er?
Do it!
Zero chance of Nikko Goodrum coming back. Paredes will be the SS 3b & 2b back up. Tigers must sign one of the top 5 available free agents or they will once again have a huge hole which creates issues for their pitchers. They only have 45 million committed with 32 million to Miggy. No excuses.
Top 5 SS Free Agents
I suggest targeting LUCIANO.
Detroit need Staring Pitcher and Relief.
Raisel Iglesia, Graveman, Diego Castillo , Fulmer, Soto, Cisnero
Robbie Ray and other Veteran Pitcher for the minimum.
Jose Iglesia Back Good defense