The Dodgers are “aggressively pursuing” Alexei Ramirez in trade talks, reports Bob Nightengale of USA Today (via Twitter). The veteran Ramirez, owed $10MM in 2015 with a 2016 option for the same amount, is known to be available in trades, though the White Sox haven’t been said to be shopping him.
The Dodgers could potentially lose shortstop Hanley Ramirez to free agency, and their pursuit of Ramirez in trades could signal that they aren’t confident in their ability to retain him or simply don’t want to commit to him at shortstop any longer due to his defensive deficiencies. Letting him walk and sign elsewhere would, of course, net the Dodgers a compensatory draft pick in 2015.
Cuban infielders Alex Guerrero and Erisbel Arruebarrena were both signed to large contracts within the past year (four years, $28MM and five years, $25MM, respectively) and would seem to present in-house options at short. However, each of those players was signed by the previous front office. New president of baseball operations Andrew Friedman, GM Farhan Zaidi and VP Josh Byrnes may not be as bullish on that duo as the previous regime. This is purely speculation on my behalf, but it’s possible, even, that one of those two names could be up for discussion in trade talks.
The White Sox could also use starting pitching, some bullpen help and a left-handed bat, although it seems like quite the stretch to connect either of the left-handed hitting outfielders L.A. would like to move — Andre Ethier and Carl Crawford — to this particular rumor. Ethier is owed a staggering $56MM over the next three seasons, while Crawford is owed $62.25MM over the same term.
Brian Wilson and Crawford and cash for Ramirez
Ha. How about Brian Wilson, Carl Crawford and a lot of cash for the mixture of spare change and crumbs that can be found under my couch cushions?
Oh my….even paying 100% of those 2 contracts makes this a poor deal for the White Sox…and I’m a Dodgers fan.
How about John Danks for Puig?
only if they throw in kershaw to even the deal.
Let’s not pretend those are the same deals, Mike.
No but they are both beyond terrible trades, Bobby.
Replace Wilson with say Zach Lee or Chris Reed and make that cash half of what Crawford has left and that becomes much better. Still not there yet, but Crawford at about 10 mill a year is a good and valuable player. Then you look at Lee (down and terrible year, but still very young and was just playing on the moon in ALB) or Reed (very good year in AA, only struggled once he went to ALB) and they are MLB ready options at SP.
That said, Crawford>Danks and Puig>>>Alexei.
Throw in Urias, and Kershaw. Add Seager too
No, man….Jordan Danks.
LOL
You give up young players if you want him. If the Sox want old vets, they’ll just keep Alexei
Maybe Ethier/Kemp, lots of cash, and a prospect or Chris Anderson/Zach Lee and Tom Windle/Chris Reed
I’m not sure why Kemp gets lumped in with the awful Ethier contract and the slightly less awful Crawford contract. If you want to say Ethier/Crawford, cash, and a couple prospects, sure. Better the prospects, the less $$$ the Dodgers send.
Kemp would require less money and prospects, no one wants Crawford, Ethier if most of his contract is covered and comes with a good prospect
Kemp>Crawford>Ethier Crawford’s contract is awful, but when healthy, he’s a 3+ WAR player still. Can’t say the same for Ethier.
Kemp would be way too much imho. He still has huge value and dodgers would be sacrificing an important RHH bat. Do agree that if ethier they’d have to eat much of contract and toss in a prospect. Wouldn’t be surprised, as this post notes, if one of Arruebarrena or Guerrero would go in trade like this too.
See really the two names that make sense as far as the White Sox go are Kemp and Joc Pederson.
And I would want one of the Cuban infielders as a replacement
but do those names make sense for the dodgers!? Neh. I also question why the sox would want kemps salary!? Uh pass.
Ethier or Crawford + 50% salary relief would be a starting point. 2 or 3 prospects will be going as well, I’d hope for 3 of lower value vs 1 or 2 of higher value.
Maybe WSox check in on Hanley and if they like him (his contract demands), moving Alexei will be easier for them to swallow.
Taking on Danks would help to offset some of that salary that would be headed to the White Sox. Not sure what the package would look like for Ramirez and Danks . .
Ethier and $20-25M for Alexei.
Alexei >>>>> Ethier, and you’re suggesting the Dodgers only pay a portion of Ethier’s salary in addition to acquiring the better player??
As a Dodgers fan, I implore you to not listen to him. Most of us know that is awful.
Alexei is not that much better than Ethier, please. Having Andre at $10M per year is a very solid deal. He is a GG caliber RF and a left handed hitter, and allowing him more AB will give him a chance to shine again. He had one bad year and that was last year.
The guy has a career .850 OPS compared to Alexei’s .718.
Yikes….. It’s an .821 career OPS and he hasn’t been GG caliber in RF since, well ever. If Ethier were a free agent this winter, he’s probably be looking at a 2 year $10 million TOTAL at best.
Ethier was less than 1 WAR with not even league average offense and poor defense by both BBRef and Fangraphs. Alexei is a premium defender at an important defensive position with similar offense as Ethier. The two are nowhere close in value.
Doubt White Sox would take the deal even if they gave $40m along with Ethier. Ethier has no value.
“The guy has a career .850 OPS compared to Alexei’s .718.”
Different ballparks, different positions, different leagues. And Ethier is not even close to being GG caliber. I won’t argue his bat is better but it’s much harder to find a good hitting SS than it is to find a good hitting RFer.
Ethier has a slightly higher career WAR (20.6 to Alexei’s 19.9) but he’s played in over 200 more games so WAR/season (or per 162) favors Alexei.
Ethier has been on the decline for some time now. He was never really a good defender, hardly a gold glove and is mostly a liability anymore with the glove. The Blue Jays are probably a better match with Buehrle.
It’s not as though Ethier plays in Boston, Dodger Stadium is pretty neutral. He’s definitely not that all-star player anymore, though. I do, however, believe he could be a .275/.340/.420 hitter again, which has some value in today’s game.
For reference, as our 5th outfielder, Ethier hit .261/.362/.412 from June 28th on this season in 138 PA.
I’m a little bummed that there is no room for Andre in LA, because I do believe he will hit next season, but it will be with another team.
As far as Alexei vs Ethier, Alexei definitely has more value at the current time than Ethier, at least double the value.
John Danks + cash is a reasonable equivalent to Ethier (5th starter v. aging platoon hitter). Alexei and Ethier don’t belong in the same conversation.
“Alexei and Ethier don’t belong in the same conversation.”
Tell Bestlakersfan, not me.
Uh, no.
Either and $20-$25 mill for leury Garcia maybe.
Allow me to squash any of these Crawford / Ethier dumps on the White Sox. The White Sox are NO WAY interested in either player. Why would they trade a veteren producer for a veteren non-producer earning more money!?! Chicago is in excelerated rebuild mode and value young controllable players that play into the future of this franchise.
Exactly…now John Danks swap with one of these outfielders would make sense. But that’s now what we’re talking about here. We’re talking about a very good SS signed for a very fair deal for 2 more years.
dodgers would have 0 interst in danks. Check their starting rotation and Danks overall performance the last 3 years as the reasons why.
Chicago is not in rebuild mode…. They are trying to compete while Abreu, Sale and Quintana are still cheap and in their prime.
yes they are, the White sox are not contenders yet. They play in a much improved division in baseball.
Tigers
Royals
Indians
are all ahead of them.
Obviously, but after a few adds, and the continued development of their current roster, they’re not as far behind as you’d believe.
yeah they are. but they’re probably not in complete tear down mode.
What’s amazing is that all three of them are signed to incredibly team-friendly deals
Alex Guerrero would be an interesting target for the White Sox. They need a 2B and Guerrero has put up solid numbers in AAA.
He also is expensive and bites teammates.
Guerrero didn’t bite anyone, he got his ear bitten off by Miguel Olivo!
No he bit Olivo IIRC.
You recall incorrectly.
You’re right, I thought it was the other way around.
they have a 2B putting up solid numbers in AAA in micah johnson. i don’t think guerrero makes sense.
His .684 OPS in AAA doesn’t exactly make him an MLB lock.
not a lock but worth a try. alexei is expendable because of MIF depth. i could be wrong, but i doubt they’re looking for a 28 y/o 2B w/ 13 MLB at bats in return for alexei.
Obviously it would not be a 1 for 1.
The dude was playing injured all year, he’s considered the 2nd best 2nd base prospect in the game by many. I’d rather have Micah.
Alex Guerrero has a clause in his contract that allows him to opt out if traded to another team at the end of the season. I think he also needs to give permission to be sent down after the 2014 season. Something that would bring down his value in potential deals. Ned’s brilliant idea to give the opt out while probably still offering the most money.
Didn’t know that… there goes his trade value
Lets get this straight overagressive WS fans
you aren’t landing Pederson,Seager,or Urias
So you arent willing to give up probably fair value for a very good SS. But your willing to dump terrible contracts for one.
Thats a top 15 prospect, for a average SS that had one career year in the Majors.
I Can see Guerrero+Lee type deal, but nothing of that.
See your first statement let’s me know you have no idea who Alexei is and how good he is.
He’s average offensively due to his lack of plate discipline, but above average with the glove, making him a slightly above average SS overall. Two years of that isn’t getting a team a top-15 overall prospect. Maybe Pederson is included if the White Sox take on some of Ethier or Crawford’s deal, but not a straight up sway.
Alexei is not worth either Seager or Urias, and I probably wouldn’t even give up Joc for him because I feel like he could be used for someone better. If it was Joc and Lee or Reed for Alexei and a good reliever I might feel better about it.
You should maybe browse the market to see what SS’s are available.
Past 2 years WAR:
1. desmond, 2. peralta, 3. simmons, 4. hardy, 5. RAMIREZ
you must pay to get good players. ramirez is a good player.
bahahaha, what!?! One career year!?!
2008 2nd place to Longoria for Rookie of the Year
2010 Silver Slugger Award Winner
2010 Gold Glove Finalist
2014 Silver Slugger Award Winner
exactly. but technically he has no say on what happens.
How about a left handed bat (Ethier) with salary relief kicked in to make him only a $7 mill/yr player? He still hits right-handers well and Sox need a left-handed hitter. Dodgers could probably also throw in a starter prospect, too.
I think if you guys would take John Danks then I would be interested in Crawford or Ethier.
Okay, how about Ethier for Danks, with the Dodgers eating like 20% of Ethier’s cotnract? Straight up.
thats a fair deal.
Get the GMs on the phone, then. Let’s do this!
I would take it
who needs the gm’s when we have this site!
I think an Ethier plus some money for Danks swap would make a lot of sense.
Watch it happen now lol. Dodgers could use another pitcher at the backend of the rotation And get rid of an OFer in a very crowded OF whereas the White Sox improve their offense at least and get some power.
What you said is fair. Ethier and cash for Danks.
Yes they are. Those are just prospects. That’s what it would take, or it ain’t happening.
They wouldn’t sell the farm for David Price or Lester but they’ll give up one of their top 3 for Alexei Ramirez? I don’t see it happening. Sweeney, Schebler and high upside arms like Lee, and Anderson are more likely targets. Ramirez isn’t one of the top 25 best prospects in the MLB when this Dodger team needs young cost controlled talent on the major league roster, especially in Gonzalez and Kemp’s later years.
giving one prospect is not “selling the farm”. and im sure kershaw/greinke will appreciate someone actually fielding their position up the middle.
Except you trade away their best defensive CF in the whole organization to get Ramirez who might not be much of an upgrade over Arruebarrena. The drop off from Joc to CC/Ethier defensively is greater than the drop off from Ramirez to Arruebarrena. Why mortgage the future for a marginal increase? Doesn’t sound like Zaidi?
Defensively, I doubt there’s a drop off at all from Ramirez to Arruebarrena, and it’s not like Ramirez is that good with the bat. The Dodgers are definitely NOT gonna give up any of their top 3 prospects for 1-2 year(s) of a slightly above average SS.
I wouldn’t count on that. With 2 affordable years remaining on his contract Ramirez is extremely valuable. Pederson, Seager and Urias are highly regarded prospect but they are still prospects. I think you are really underestimating the value of affordable established major league talent.
if he was slightly younger, and had more stats to backup the career year I would say yes. Not every established major leauge player nets a top prospect.
Also in the offseason trade value is less then it is at the deadline, so if this was July I could see your point. But with options available in the FA market, and a few other trade options possible im going to say no for now.
Good then the White Sox dont have to trade him it’s that simple. No one is pressuring Rick Hahn to get rid of him. It’s going to take a very appealing package for him to get traded.
He’s been 3+ fWAR four of the last five years. Last year wasn’t a “career year” at all.
look at his slugging pct in 2013 .380, and his obp at .313. As far as this season it was career in terms of power.
As far as swinging the bat for contact his WAR has been solid at 2.5.
His F-war has been very solid though.
age is still a issue too.
That makes him split even. Two hits him, and two hits for him.
I think he is worth two top 100 prospects(more of so in the 50-100 range), or 1 top 100, and a established major leauger.
Also lets remember his last 5 years of games played starting with 2014
’14- 158
’13- 158
’12- 158
’11- 158
’10- 156
That counts for something in trade discussions when you know you are getting a player you can count on to play 150+ games in a season.
Ramirez is 32-33 years old and still has plenty left in the tank. How many SS are good for 15 homers, a .270+ average, above average defense and under a reasonable contract for 2 more years? That is worth a quality prospect anyday
slow down he has only hit 6 hrs in 2013, and 9 in 2012.
Don’t shout out consistency yet
Quality yes, not top 25 in all of baseball.
He didn’t even have a career year. Look at his statistics, he’s incredibly durable and always bring something to the table.
Then you aren’t getting Ramirez
And the Sox aren’t taking Ethier, Wilson, or 3rd tier prospects.
So where does that leave us.
That leaves lefty OF Scott Schebler, switch hitting middle infielder/CF Darnell Sweeney, and a stable of young arms like SP Chris Anderson, Tom Windle, Zach Lee, Chris Reed, Jharel Cotton and Jose De Leon. I’m sure Chicago would love a power/speed guy like Schebler and a power pitcher who was un-hittable at the end of the year like De Leon or Cotton.
Do the White Sox have a backup SS option? Seems to me this is a “lots of teams are desperate for a SS, let’s see if we can fleece one of them” move by them. Doubt they move Alexei to the Dodgers for anything less than Pederson.
How about Dodgers send Ethier to White Sox, eat half his salary and include a pitching prospect like Zach Lee?
White Sox have Carlos Sanchez, Marcus Semien and Leury Garcia who can all play SS this next season. Tim Anderson is probably 2 years away from being ready for full time work.
Semien won’t play SS ever again unless it’s an emergency role. He’s a butcher with the glove.
That’s not the question, he can play SS. Played it all the way through the minors.
And Adam Dunn can pitch, he did it last year out of the bullpen. What’s your point, he never graded out as a good SS in the minors? Gordon Beckham was 10 times the SS that Semien ever was while in college and he’s rarely played the position in the Majors. Semien will not play SS. Run prevention is key to winning games, and Semien makes too many errors at SS.
Not to mention Lowrie is a free agent, and after the year he had should come at a very affordable price
Playing two rookies up the middle would be unwise.
They view Tim Anderson very highly.
Tim Anderson isnt ready yet but we have some guys who can play it in the mean time.
This is correct. There is no reason to move a proven commodity that has surplus value on the contract for anything but shiny youth. Dodger salary dumps won’t get it done, it’ll be a Pederson or nothing.
Crawford, Guerrero or Arruebarrena, prospect (Not Pederson, Seager, or Urias) and cash for Ramirez and Danks
I could also see
Crawford/Either+Sweeney+Guerrero+Lee
for Ramirez,and Danks.
Sweeney gives them a option at short, and had a nice year in AA, and has nice speed
How about Ethier (Dodgers eat 50% of contract), Sweeney and Lee for Ramirez?
Zach Lee has had one good year. He really regressed last season, he may be nothing more than a RP.
Sweeney, on the other hand, looked really good last year. And Ethier still can hit righties very well and can play all 3 OF spots. Lee still has some promise. Not a bad haul for Ramirez, IMO.
Well he did play in triple a last season and no dodger pitcher has ever done well there as far as I remember.
that could work.
And the Dodgers take Danks’ contract.
I don’t think the Dodgers would trade for both Ramirez and Danks’ contract in a deal just for Ethier. Its either bad contract for bad contract (Ethier/Danks) or the Dodgers deal Ethier and give up a couple prospects for Ramirez, while eating part of Ethier’s salary.
how aggressive? joc pederson aggressive??
Ramirez is a fine player, not the kind of player that gets you a top 10 prospect. None of Pederson, Seager, or Urias would be involved.
Wishful thinking on my part. Realistically, i see a guy like tom windle and maybe another piece or two being discussed here
The Sox could only be interested if they get a top prospect, but I can’t see it happening. I believe they asked the Cardinals for Carlos Martinez in a Ramirez trade two years ago.
Probably not Schebler or Reed either. Maybe Lee and another piece?
agreed
Then who should the Dodgers give up? Gotta give up talent to get talent. For the past 3 years, Alexei has an 8.3 WAR. The only Dodgers with a higher WAR in that span are Puig, the likely departed Hanley, and Juan Uribe.
Pederson, Urias or Seager would not be in the mix. Anyone else is probably in the discussion, for Ramirez.
Alexie is a huge piece of this rising Sox team. And under manageable dollars. At a position that is weak across the league and FA. Why trade him unless you can get cream of the crop?
Ramirez is going to be in serious decline by the time this Sox team is ready to be good. I think they’d be wise to sell high with him coming off two good seasons even if it doesn’t include a top 10 prospect. Stick with the plan
Sure there new front office guys but the owners are still the same from when those Cubans were sign. If they want him so bad I wonder who they will be willing to trade for him. I’m guessing a Of and one or two of our minors leaguer pitcher or maybe they use the OF/1B we just traded for. Will be interesting to see what the trade will be like if it happens. I highly doubt Pederson will be in the trade talks if they are trying to they some of the OF I think they have plans to use Pederson next season
If the Dodgers would not throw in any of their top 3 prospects for Price what makes you think they would do it for Ramirez?
What makes you think the White Sox would trade Alexei to the Dodgers then?
Ramirez price in prospects is/ should be lower than Price is all I’m saying.
I dont think anyone is arguing that but he wont be cheap. The market is not kind to teams who need a SS. Especially one under contract for 2 more years.
Meanwhile, on the North Side…
new front office may value those guys differently
You could be right about a lot of the guys but I think they like Pederson reason why they want to trade a OFer or two
True, but the way I see it is……….. they are hoping to trade an OF to clear the way for Joc. Ramirez would be a stop gap until Seager is ready and they are very high on Urias. So I dont see them being traded unless it is for Hamels or Price.
agreed. i don’t see them being traded at all. but from a sox perspective and pederson being kind of a perfect fit in their outfield, it doesn’t hurt to ask.
Dodgers won’t trade any of their top 3 because they need some young cost controlled players to be on the major league team when Gonzalez, Kemp, and Crawford decline, I imagine that will be sooner than later.
Yes, Seager (SS/3B), Urias (SP) and Pederson (OF) all profile as potential replacements. Although Pederson is probably the guy most available.
Regarding decline, AGon & CC are in decline, but I could easily see that decline being gradual. AGon has actually gotten some power back as his shoulder has healed. Kemp, on the other hand, probably has a couple more very good years before decline. He was just getting healthy the 2nd half of last year and it showed.
But reality is in a couple years AGon and CC’s contracts will be issues, for sure.
I know everybody’s talking about Crawford and Ethier, but don’t rule out Kemp being involved in trade talks either. He was a distraction and will continue to be. They’d have to eat an awful lot of the Crawfor/Ethier contracts and/or take on John Danks’ contract to get a deal done involving them.
Ramirez and Danks (20+28.5=$48.5M) for Crawford ($62.25), 2 prospects (ranked between 5-15), and $20M cash( which would balance the salaries plus 10% in the Chicago’s favor). The math makes Crawford a $14M/yr player which is less than Danks would be making for each of the next 2 years; overall around $10M in savings the each of the next 2 seasons.
You are missing one big factor, Ramirez is worth more than his contract! Crawford isn’t worth half his contract.
Joc, a top pitching prospect, and one of the Cuban infielders for Alexei?
Thats a bit much. Joc + lower level prospects would get it done.
Trading Joc Pederson for Alexei Ramirez would be a monumental mistake for LA. I don’t see that happening.
no trade is going happen then
You think it’s Joc Pederson or no trade!? That’s a hard line there!
Dodger wouldn’t even trade lee on his good season I doubt they trade Pederson for anything unless then a top of the line major league player
Maybe they think a more than adequate SS helps them get to and win the World Series. That is kind of worth a lot. Dodgers have thrown all this money at pitching and everything else and still can’t get to the World Series, perhaps they believe an above average SS gets them there.
Not seeing how Alexei Ramirez puts the Dodgers over the top.
I’d rather have Jed Lowrie. He’s younger, won’t cost prospects and has a better eye.
Yeah, I don’t know if he would but he would make the Dodgers defense up the middle exponentially better. That might be worth more to the Dodgers as they are currently constructed than Hanley’s bat.
I doubt one happens but the possibility is there. But only for a package that makes it feasible to move on without him.
As a White Sox fan, I’m really hoping for this outcome, even though I know it will never happen.
Kyle Jensen OF/1B with a pitcher like lee and maybe another piece would that work?
As a sox fan I wouldn’t accept that offer at all
Guys that teams pick up for scraps have no trade value.
I would trade Joc and Urias plus others to the Sox, but only for Sale
The Sox would trade Sale, but only for Kershaw+200 MM
The reigning NL MVP and Cy Young winner……Maybe for Sale, Quintana, Ramirez and Abreu
Wow ok that’s just plain ridiculous
I’d rather have Sale for his cheaper contract
Thumbs down…
Seriously do you read what you type?
Sale is going no where and will likely be a Cy Young Winner, and if not for that DL stint early in the season likely would have been this season, or at least real close.
Is Kershaw great? Absolutely, better hope he never gets hurt with that contract though. Dodgers are not getting Sale for prospects regardless of who they are. Never mind the performance and potential for greater things, but his deal is too team friendly. Quintana is likely going nowhere either so rest your sphincter on those guys. How bout John Danks for… whatever.
Did you read what I typed? I was talking about Kershaw for those guys, not prospects. And it was a joke, we would not trade Kershaw. He is a 3 time Cy Young winner. Not maybe or likely depending on health.
Chris Sale is ours and you will never have him. In all seriousness, arguing about what the Dodgers would have to give for Alexei is probably one of the dumber things anyone can do today. The White Sox and their fans value Alexei, other fans look at his stats and think, “Meh.” No one will ever agree but Hahn isn’t moving Alexei for salary dumpage or anything less than an over pay, because we are a better team the next two years with him.
Arguing about trades is what we do here on mlbtraderumors!
Yeah, I know but it rare to see realistic people argue about trades.
Your right, everybody values their teams players way higher than they should and most trade proposals involve their team fleecing the other, but it is fun none the less.
My 2 cents for what it’s worth. With Alexei potentially being the best shortstop “available” given his age and contract as well multiple teams looking to be in contention looking for a shortstop such as the Yankees, Mets, Dodgers, and potentially the Mariners it’s simple supply and demand. 4 buyers, one item for sell, the highest bid is going to win, each team will need to pay a high value to get him.
As far as the Dodgers are concerned, they have an outfield surplus which they are trying to clear up. They could clear it up by trading J.P. and others, they could clear it up by trading Kemp, Crawford, Either and prospects. The point is there are to many outfielders that have to be cleared, realistically the Dodgers need to move two outfielders.
The White Sox have been saying they want a right-handed starting pitcher with power. So, I doubt if they will settle for any of the Dodgers’ outfielders unless they are thrown in as a bonus.
We’ll throw in Crawford and Ethier as a bonus! Haha.
Well if the Dodgers eat about 3/4 of their salary and maybe.
A right handed Pitcher with power?
Ramirez and Frank Montas for Pederson and Ethier. Montas adds surplus value to the transaction. Dodgers unload 2 of their surplus outfielders. Sox assume remainder of Ethier contract.
Why the heck would the White Sox do this?
Two left handed bats, fill LF and DH holes, Ethier can play all three outfield spots.
This is probably the most reasonable proposal I’ve seen up to this point.
Maybe Ethier, Kyle Jensen, Lee, and cash for Danks and Ramirez? The cash would equal out Ethier’s contract with Danks’, and I believe that Ethier is more valuable to the White Sox than Danks is and Danks is more valuable to the Dodgers than Ethier. Maybe add another prospect on the Dodgers’ side.
Oh come on. Kyle Jensen is a non-prospect. Kind of like Wilkins with the White Sox. The Marlins just sold him to the Dodgers. He has a value of 0. Zach Lee, if that is to whom you are referring, is a marginal pitching prospect. Ethier, at best, is a platoon hitter, who at best washes with Danks. So a non prospect and a marginal prospect for Ramirez? Ridiculous.
I do not see the Sox taking on a large contract of an aging veteran, or they would have likely thrown a pile of money at VMART.
Sox need a right handed pitcher, but do you want to trade Ramirez for that? I do not think you are going to get a real good pitcher for him, and likely would be getting position prospects that may be near major league readiness, or low A ball pitchers. Maybe you see if they have a closer in their system that looks good. But again for Ramirez I do not think you are going to get primo prospects from the Dodgers.. I guess we will see how good Hahn is.
Everyones opinion on the Dodgers from the outside is that Kemp, Crawford and Ethier are all under performing players on horrible contracts so the Dodger should trade away the one player who could be worth more than his contract (Joc Pederson). LA needs Joc more than any OF not named Puig, they need his cost controlled contract to keep payroll reasonable and they need him because he’s their best defensive CF in the entire organization. What happens in 2-3 years when Kemp, Gonzalez and Crawford decline even more and Uribe is gone? LA can’t afford to trade any of the top prospects. Friedman won’t mortgage the future for a stop gap, considering they have a SS who smashed through A+ & AA as a 20 year old.
Well apparently the kid is not that good or the Dodgers would not be ‘aggressively’ going after Ramirez would they? SS can hit all they want, but you better have a guy there that can field as well, or you will lose a lot of games. I’m not saying Alexei is worth anything near a top prospect, but the White Sox are not likely to take a teams dump off of salary in exchange for him. Now, if the Dodgers eat a ton of Crawford’s contract.. maybe Crawford for Ramirez.
He is one of the top prospects in baseball but he is still young. Ramirez would just hold down the fort until Seager is ready.
I’m not someone who thinks LA is going to get Ramirez for peanuts like Ethier or Crawford. I just don’t think LA is going to sell it’s only potential replacements for it’s already aging roster. They have plenty of young high upside arms and two players who make a lot of sense for Chicago (Schebler and Sweeney).
Lets hope the Mets sneak in and trade for Ramirez
Joc Pederson is the cost-controlled high upside LH bat the Sox desire. Ramirez may be the best *available* SS, but Ramirez alone is not going to get it done for the Dodgers. From the Sox perspective, if Pederson is not part of the deal you don’t make the trade. If you are the Dodgers, if Pederson is part of the deal you probably don’t make the trade.
I don’t think anything gets done.
Pretty logical thought process here. Sox are not dying to move Ramirez unless they get great value in return. I wouldn’t accept anything less than Joc
Interesting that the White Sox don’t have a decent SS in their system to replace Alexei yet sure seem to want to unload him. Beware buyer…..
Well they do in Tim Anderson. He isnt ready yet.
We don’t want to unload him…In fact Rick Hahn said he would have to overwhelmed to trade him
They’ve been saying for a year and a half that they don’t want to unload him, I don’t think there’s a clearer sign that they want to unload him than that.
well wouldnt alexei be gone if we wanna move him for any thing RH wants to be blow away with a deal or we just keep him
No they do not want to. He is getting attention and Hahn has said that he will listen. Tim Anderson Is at least a year away and this is no secret. His 10 million dollar 2015 and controllable 2016 are why Alexei is being asked about and us not having a replacement add up to why we would need to have an “aggressive” partner as the title of the story relates to the Dodgers position currently.
The Sox have been fielding offers from the Mets and Yankees as well as other teams throughout the last number of years. Since no trade has gone down, obviously they aren’t in any rush to move him, unless the right offer comes around.
Also, maybe you should talk about your own teams needs and what their systems include.
The Sox top SS prospect played just as well if not better than Seager in the AFL.
I can see a three team trade. Seattle sends Saunders and Chris Taylor to Chicago, Ramirez to LA, and Kemp to Seattle. Fills every teams needs. Probably need other smaller pieces, but that would be the main part
Ehhh return isn’t enough to get the Sox to move Ramirez. He has alot more trade value than that due to position scarcity.
I agree, but that why I said other pieces. I’m sure some pitching would have to be involved somewhere. That’s just a starting point
I would never trade Kemp straight up for Ramirez. His bat is too valuable
Alexei and Danks for Ethier and Ryu
Sox want no part of Ethier, he has little if any trade value
And the Sox are looking to move Dank’s contract. If there was a better offer out there, Rick Hahn would have taken it by now.
We need more starters, not less.
Swapping Danks for Ryu is an upgrade, and Hahn is going to sign someone thru FA this winter
Danks is an upgrade over Ryu?
No, the Sox upgrade with Ryu
Danks for Ethier is a wash for me. Basically it would be Alexei for Ryu. I don’t think the Dodgers do that. Like I said they need to add to their rotation not subtract.
Dodgers are trying to add pitching, not get rid of it.
LOL
If LA has to essentially pay someone to take Ethier or Crawford then keep them. Over the past year+, exactly how many games were all four of these outfielders healthy? Etheir/VanSlyke make a nice bench platoon with pop. And offer Hanley a two-year contract for about $44 mil. His bat is needed and you have plenty of defense-first shortstops already available for late innings. Then Hanley can go DH for someone else in a couple of years. Get another starter, fortify the bullpen and grab another NL West title.
If you feel the need to move someone, move Pederson in a package for a quality (#2 level) starter. Sell high, not low.
Ethier and Crawford you might have to do that, but Matt Kemp might collect a pretty decent batch of talent. He really bounced back last season, playing in 150 games and putting up some very good offensive numbers.
Kemp is the more valuable commodity; however, I think his value is greatest for the team he already plays for, especially with the impending departure of Hanley’s bat.
I can understand that. Out of the 3, Eithier is the one who holds the least amount of value to the Dodgers. Carl Crawford can at least still play the speed game and swipe his share of bags. He took 23 of them in 2/3 of a season.
To play the role of captain obvious, the Dodgers clearly have no intention of retaining Hanley Ramirez. I wonder how much money he’s going to get, considering his health in recent years and the fact that he’ll be on the wrong side of 30 for the remainder of whatever contract he signs.
Who am I kidding. Somebody will give him a 10 year deal. I wouldn’t hate if my team signed him to a 5-year, $100 million deal though. It’s a little excessive on the AAV but at least you don’t have the late 30’s albatross.
How about Alexei Ramirez and Francellis Montas for Joc Pederson? Dodgers get a plus starting shortstop which they need as well as a high upside arm in Montas. Some believe that Montas is a major league ready bullpen piece due to a fastball that has hit as high as 102 if the Dodges decide he is not a starter. The White Sox get a cost controlled left handed hitting outfielder with 20/20 potential.
If the Dodgers didn’t want to trade Pederson at the deadline, at the behest of Stan Kasten, for an arm that could’ve helped them win a pennant/World Series, why would they trade him now for a stop-gap SS who’s only keeping the seat warm until Corey Seager is ready?
Why do Dodger fans keep saying Seager is going to play SS? You all realize he’s going to be a 3Bman right? He’d be the biggest SS in the history of the MLB right now and he could still grow from here being only 20….
Personally, I think he does outgrow SS, but I also think the Dodgers plan on giving him a shot to play SS as long as possible. There has been no immediate plans to begin the conversion. His bat is what’s going to determine how quickly he gets called up, and if he’s still playing SS when he’s ready, I’m sure the Dodgers won’t be shifting him to 3B to learn on the fly.
Either way, that was only my secondary point. My first point of Kasten deciding to hold on to Pederson at the deadline is the prevailing reason as to why Pederson won’t be on the table for Alexei Ramirez this winter.
I wonder if a prospect combination like Scott Schebler and Chris Anderson would work. It’s hard to tell given Ramirez’s advanced age. The aforementioned duo might be a bit much unless the market for shortstops says otherwise (and, so far, it does).
Put together any package from any team desperate for a SS (NYY, LAD, BOS, OAK) and you find that given the market, it’s doubtful any one team can produce a fair offer. With LAD, you’re looking at Joc and maybe Kemp but Viciedo or either of the Danks brothers would have to be included. The Yankees farm system doesn’t have enough prospects near ready enough (Although Sanchez and Cave come to mind as potential) for the ChiSox to bite. Same story with OAK. BOS has Swihart, but it will take a LHH OF for the deal to get done. SEA may be a dark horse but again lack the advanced prospects/big league pieces to swing it. Very good chance Alexi stays put with Semien providing a utility role and Johnson hitting 8th playing at the keystone.
To fill other holes…. Ramirez just posted his best offensive season since 2011. why not sell high?
Ugh. I live in chicago and your view of this team is off base. They are re-building whether you choose to believe this reality is totally up to you.
If they were rebuilding Sale and Abreu would be on the block.
I live in Chicago. All indications are this team is going to add quite a bit to their payroll in the chance of winning quite a few more games next season. They are in basically the same stage as the Cubs right now.
I live in Chicago, too. And they are looking to contend ASAP, this season. Not only because Sale/Abreu and Quintana are cheap, but Abreu is 27. They need to accelerate the time table while he’s in his prime. Given that, I don’t think they’d trade Alexei unless it gives them the financial flexibility for two big moves.
The Sox are retooling. I wouldn’t call what they are doing rebuilding. They are making strategic moves to add youth to the roster, but still have stars on there and are trying to win.
Now you’re messing with me cuz that is just plain lunacy.
I would agree with that patrick but I don’t believe they realistically have world series aspirations for 2015. They just want to get back to playing winning ball.
No no..I didnt mean World Series. But I think they want to get closer to winning the division or the Wild Card spot for sure. Definitely possible to achieve that this winter.
I view contending as a legit shot at making and winning a world series. The white sox are not making moves that lend to this narrative. You don’t trade a major producing shortstop if you think you are knocking on the door of a title. They are re-building and they are trying to bring young future pieces to build a long term winner and future contender. Rome wasn’t built in one offseason.
Fair enough, but given the “Rome wasn’t built in one offseason,” you need to contend for a division before you can for a World Series. White Sox management wants to get a division/wild card in 2015, that’s the goal.
If they win a division next year after trading thier starting producing shortstop then Rick Hahn will win executive of the year because I think the Tigers and Royals will have plenty to say about that in 2015. I truly feel the bar should be at playing winning ball – reassess – then re-tool to win more the following year. Patience is a virtue.
And it should be the goal but you also have to make realistic moves to get there and this team has shifted from making big FA veteren splashes to get them “over the hump” to trading away veterens for young players of the future. This is where the team is right now and that is why they are entertianing offers for Alexei Ramirez. That’s my take on where they are at but yes winning a division / making the playoffs should be every teams goal in any given offseason
actually, that’s not really how they think of it. You get to playoffs and you have a shot at the WS — just look at the two wild card teams in it this year. Hahn’s on record saying he doesn’t believe in throwing seasons away. He’s got at least $50 m to spend, and if you look at the team’s track record, they’ve actually spent up to $130 m going “all in,” so he may even be allowed $70-80 m for the right group of guys.
The point is: trading Alexei comes down to whether it gets them closer to that 89 wins or so they need in 2015.
They cant have too much patience because time isnt on their side. So that’s not going to happen.
I totally don’t understand that statement. Time is not on their side!?! What do you mean.