Derrick Goold of the St. Louis Post-Dispatch tackled questions from a number of fans earlier today and addressed a wide number of topics pertaining to the team’s offseason. First and foremost, Goold reports that he’s heard “more and more… how the Cardinals see trade opportunities as their preference” in their search for a center fielder. Specifically, he mentions Charlie Blackmon and Adam Eaton as speculative possibilities, though it personally strikes me unlikely that the Sox would deal Eaton. Blackmon has been an oft-rumored trade candidate over the past few seasons and will be again this winter with a projected arbitration salary of $9MM and a surplus of left-handed outfield bats in Colorado (Blackmon, David Dahl, Carlos Gonzalez, Gerardo Parra). Regarding Dexter Fowler, Goold notes that the Cardinals typically shy away from committing lengthy free-agent contracts to players on the wrong side of 30, downplaying the team’s potential interest.
More from Goold’s Cardinals rundown…
- Goold characterizes a significant investment into a starting pitcher as unlikely, noting that last winter’s pursuit of David Price was considered by the team to be a “special situation.” That type of opportunity isn’t present on this year’s free-agent market, though he does note that the Cardinals would consider Chris Sale a similarly “special” situation if he were to be made available on the trade market. That’s far from a guarantee, of course, as the White Sox could opt to take aim at contending once again in 2017.
- The Cardinals will be without left-hander Zach Duke for all of the 2017 season due to his recent Tommy John surgery, and Goold rattles off a number of internal replacements without making mention of the team potentially pursuing outside help. Among the candidates are Tyler Lyons, Marco Gonzales and “sleeper picks” Corey Littrell and Ryan Sherriff, each of whom is currently pitching in the Arizona Fall League.
- St. Louis will pursue other options early in the offseason as opposed to exploring a reunion with Brandon Moss, per Goold. If the team is unable to acquire a center field upgrade and Moss lingers on the free-agent market, a fallback would be signing Moss to play left field and keeping Randal Grichuk in center field.
- Despite a midseason demotion to Triple-A Memphis for Kolten Wong, the St. Louis front office remains “bullish” on the 26-year-old and would like to see him get a prolonged look at second base in 2017. According to Goold, there’s long been a separation between the front office and the manager when it comes to dividing playing time, but there was an agreement in place late in the season that Mike Matheny would give Grichuk an extended look in center field down the stretch. Wong could be the beneficiary of that same extended stint despite his disappointing April and May in 2016. For what it’s worth, Wong did hit .251/.341/.401 in 217 plate appearances following his recall from Triple-A.
Would Reyes need to be included in a trade for Blackmon do you think? That might be a bit steep, but I doubt Colorado would accept a trade without him in it.
Blackmon is a nice player, but Reyes is a TORP. Only a Sale deal would include Reyes… I don’t see that happening anytime soon.
No chance the Cardinals would add Reyes in a deal with Colorado.
Not a chance.
To those saying no way: I agree Cards wouldn’t do it, but Rox probably would ask for and might well insist on that type of asset. Blackmon was outstanding last year.
He wasn’t good enough to get a future ace especially with his numbers away from Coors.
Blackmon batted 313/363/563 on the road this year, so he’s not simply a Coors Field product. Reyes’s upside is off-the-charts, so I don’t see St. Louis parting with him, but I also don’t see Colorado moving Blackmon for Weaver/Rosenthal or something
You are a complete fool if you don’t think they’d accept a similar trade for Blackmon. Adams (they need a 1B) and Hudson with his pure stuff (sinking fastball perfect for Coors and a nasty cutter/slider) would get this deal done. Blackmon is beyond peak player age at 31. Yes he had a career year but looking at his career peripherals, he warrants nothing more than Hudson/Adams. Blimey idiots if you think Reyes goes anywhere other than for a Sale/Eaton-esque package.
Here’s a tip for all you amateur GM’s out there: When you’re proposing a trade in which Team A gives up a really good player in his prime on an arbitration contract, and Team B gives up a couple guys they’re sorta trying to get rid of anyway to make room for other, better players, you’re probably on the wrong track.
Extra points if Team B is the one your root for!
So you’re a professional GM? What team are you with?
Seamaholic makes an excellent point.
None of us are “GM’s”……but if you understand baseball……and you understand “What’s Required To Make A Deal”…….then you know that his point is valid.
“The Best Deals Are Ones That Satisfy BOTH Team’s Needs……and involve an equitable exchange”.
Adams was a highly touted prospect…..but he hasn’t filled those shoes. He has little value in a trade (not that he couldn’t help a team…….he’s just not a “hot commodity” by any means)
I don’t see that. Reyes was electric (despite the control problems), and I imagine he’s probably off limits. That said, I don’t see any way that STL pulls something off for Blackmon because of that. Those proposals of Rosenthal+ for Blackmon were obviously ludicrous
Ludicrous? Combine his age, his career Stat line and his years of control to get a mean value in today’s game. I will tell you his current value ($38.5 MM) doesn’t warrant much more than Rosenthal/Adams.
That’s definitely ludicrous. Adams is a platoon first baseman who offers little on-base ability and poor baserunning and defense. One-trick power guys aren’t all that valuable. Rosenthal’s quite expensive in arbitration and coming off of an absolutely terrible year. Maybe that’s all the Cardinals are willing to give up, but Colorado should be able to top that offer elsewhere then, or retain him and make a run at a Wild Card
I don’t see the Cardinals trading Reyes from Blackmon (or anyone).
But I also don’t see the Rockies being inclined to move Blackmon for much else. Contrary to what some fans propose, they aren’t going to trade him for STL’s table scraps (Adams, Wong, Gyorko, Peralta, Pham, etc).
If Blackmon were to move, I think it starts with Piscotty or Grichuk, and also includes at least one top prospect (Bader, Weaver, Perez, Flaherty), plus one or two lesser ones. And a deal like this is probably just as unlikely as one with Reyes.
I find it difficult to imagine the Cards putting up an acceptable offer that doesn’t include Reyes. He has great potential, but Blackmon is already a very good player, he’s not being dealt for spare parts.
Not a chance
It’ll be interesting to see who Mo pursues, cuz a lot of times he gets someone who I don’t expect. Hopefully he doesn’t have to give up Reyes to get a quality CF, I could see Weaver being traded
Mozeliak idea of trading is like offering a weinie for a butcher shop! He is a ‘do nothing’ GM! Mo must GO!
New Law Era
This summer – yeah maybe Reyes could have been part of a deal for Blackmon. Now after he showed early success in bigs? No way – probably wouldn’t be included for anything less than Chris Sale. Even that is iffy.
It’s iffy to include him in a trade for Chris Sale?
Does weaver, wacha, Wong, bader, Sierra, flaherty approach Sale deal?
Nah, just not enough high-end talent in that package for Sale
I don’t see the Sox adding up the value from a package like that and deciding they are motivated to move Sale. He’ll require a premium asset and then some to move.
Think about what Cole Hamels commanded despite being less dominant and far more expensive.
Not even close
You also have to remember that the Cardinals best prospects are not necessarily top prospects to other teams they try dealing with
The Cardinals don’t have the big time prospects to pull off Sale. They have quality prospects, especially pitching and some lower level middle IF’s, that are appealing, but not the names to bring in Sale or other proven big time players. It was said if CHWS were going to trade Sale to Boston they would start with Bradley Jr. and Moncada or Devers and probably Eduardo Rodriguez too. The Cardinals couldn’t make a package close to that appealing.
I could see CHWS trading Eaton and I’d like to see the Cardinals get Robertson with him.
Not even close.
If the White Sox wanted Moncada, Bradley Jr., E-Rod, Devers, and Kopech from the Red Sox, what makes you think they wouldn’t want Reyes, Piscotty, Wacha, Bader, and Weaver from the Cardinals (by the way, that second group is still less valuable for the first one).
Even if they were willing to move their big pieces, they still probably couldn’t beat an offer Boston or Los Angeles could make.
Wait a minute……
There was an agreement that Grichuck would get an extended look down the stretch? What if the circumstances didn’t call for it?
Why wasn’t there an agreement to bench Moss in his horrific end to the season?
Sorry for the Rant
Matheny only really likes to play the guys he likes aka Moss. he should of been benched after the first 2 weeks of the horrible slump. Cardinals bring Moss back to play lf will show they dont want to spend money on the free agents that could help this team like Cespedes or Desmond. of course i bet Matheny would sit them if they hit like Moss. Look at Wong of he goes 0-10 we dont see him for 2 weeks, even when Wong was hitting he got benched after a week for no reason. MO & ownership need to step in and tell Matheny he needs to play. MO had to trade Craig & Jay so he couldn’t use them then signed Wong to a 5 year deal and Matheny still can’t get the hint!
Cardinals shouldn’t trade for an outfielder, go out and sign Cespedes or Desmond since they said Moss could be back if they cant find a trade for a cf which keeps Grichuk in CF. Ok then sign a lf if you can’t get a cf it stills makes the team better and Grichuk will get better in cf, Cardinals have the money to spend look at the TV deal thats about ready to kick in. Wong would be fine if Matheny would just let him play. Bullpen will be fine no need for the Cardinals to go out and find a lefty of the price is way to high for a trade or signing someone.
Cespedes and Desmond will both have QA attached to them. Do you really want to give up that kind of money and the 19th pick for either of them? I sure don’t. The team needs more contact, athleticism, and defense. While I’ll agree those players are fit the athleticism, but they sure don’t the contact and Desmond has always been streaky and Cepedes is a head case.
Cespedes is a head case? What brings you to that conclusion? I’ve never heard anything along those lines. He didn’t get along with some coaches in Boston if that is what you are referring to, but I haven’t heard enough on that to pin it on him, and I also don’t think it’s fair to have 2 months out of his career define him especially when I’ve heard glowing things about him in other clubhouses.
Have you not watched him? Gets lost at times , makes too many bonehead plays in the outfield
An additional option is moving Carpenter or Peralta to LF
1B – Adams
2B – Wong
SS – Diaz
3B – Carpenter
LF – Peralta
CF – Grichuk
RF – Piscotty
OF – Pham
IF – Gyroko
This is the cost effective move.
But I still like the idea of Moss being brought back and adding some depth in the infield/outfield.
Or see what it would take to land Blackmon and Moss and have depth everywhere (would appear to fit under budget).
The point of seeking a CF is to improve the defense by moving Grichuk to LF. Moving Peralta or Carpenter to LF has the opposite effect.
But cards won’t bother with players with a QO
I’ve always been the optimist about the Cardinals going into the winter trades and Free Agency competition. That is until the last 3-4 years. Mo will build things up as to all of the additions the club needs to make a World Series run. Generally he’s right. But …..He never comes up with that game breaker like player. He always gets out bid, and out maneuvered in trades!!! Each year, after he has failed in his attempt to land a quality player this has been his standard answer; “we’ve decided to pursue the low hanging fruit and fill from within!” That will work fine for one year. But look how the Cards have fared since 2012. Each year they finished lower in the play-off race with that Theory. This year their out completely and the star minor league players have had to be called up too early. Thus, no matter what they say, the Cards farm system gets weaker and weaker and the Cardinals become a mediocre talented team, with no strong players to trade, other than the ones it would hurt the future of the club. If Moz is anything like the hype the front office says he is, let’s see it this winter. But I bet it’s the same old story at the end——his favorite—what no one else wants is what we’ll get again—–LOW HANGING FRUIT!!!!!!
your so full of it…. the low hanging fruit comment is like 10 years old and some in the fan base have never let it go… get over it. every team goes thru cycles… uk it’s pretty hard to top an WS title.. so in essence there is only one way to go..
I hope you are right and I’m wrong!! We will see. Let’s get back together and discuss the moves when Spring Training starts. It should be an interesting conversation, one way or the other. At least we both have one thing
In common, we want the best for the Cardinals.
MO sucks! NoBalls Mozeliak!
I personally think the Cardinals should make a big trade with the Rays and acquire Kevin Kiermaier and maybe even Matt Duffy I think they both would fit perfectly. They would probably have to throw in like a Luke weaver and even give them a Peralta or Adams.
Is this post sarcastic? Weaver + peralta/Adams doesn’t even get a conversation started for KK, let alone KK + Duffy.
There’s no way that’s nearly enough. Peralta and Adams’ value have both decreased, and you’re talking about trading for a gold glove CF, you gotta throw in more quality players
Weaver and Adams as the main trade mark for Blackmon and a lefty reliever to replace Zach Duke. Adams would crank in that Denver air (and they need a 1b) and Weaver has no place to play for the Cards this year (at best, he’s a NO. 6 rotation guy), though he’s young and talented.
Weaver, Adams, and another decent prospect should get Blackmon. They have been shoping hi and if they want to trade him, this offseason is the best time to do it after the year he had. And to all the people who want to disagree remember Blackmon isnt Mike Trout.
If the Rockies really, really like Weaver then perhaps they’d move Blackmon on a deal centered around him. Weaver did show a lot last year despite not generally being a hyped prospect. Totally dependent upon COL’s view of him and what other orgs will give. Regardless, Adams isn’t moving the needle in such a trade. He’s a decent chip-in asset.
Adams is defiantly a chip-in as well as Trevor Rosenthal could be but I think the Cardinals are looking to give Rosie another shot next year. What not to like about Luke Weaker? Young pitcher with an amazing upside and proved he is big league ready. COL is looking for just that.
Why exactly is it that his upside is amazing?
Here’s what I think even tho both Peraltas and Adams Values have both decreased but Kevin K and Matt Duffy are not superstars so if the cards were to throw in let’s say Peralta Luke Weaver and some other prospect it might be enough plus Kevin K and Duffys values have also decreased over the year.
The Rays obviously like Duffy, since he was just acquired as the key piece in the Matt Moore deal. And they certainly seem to love Kiermaier, for good reason. He’s an average-ish hitter who is a phenomenal defender and baserunner. Both are cheap and controllable.
So, in considering a trade for those two assets … I think you need to look at it from the other org’s perspective. Why would they take the package you propose? Weaver is a nice pitching prospect, but they just gave up an affordable, established MLB starter to get Duffy. Peralta is old and expensive and just had a poor year. There’s just no real motivation here, right?
You do make a good point it would be a good deal in the Cards pov but not so much the Rays but knowing The Cardinals anything can happen
What would it take to get either yelich or ozuna from marlins? They need pitching badly
It would be harder to acquire yelich but Ozuna is duable
In a perfect Cardinal off-season
The Cardinals trade for a CF say Blackmon and they trade Matt Adams, Weaver/Gomber and two lesser prospects
Sign Justin Turner or Gurriel
Let Garcia and Moss Walk
Short leash on Wacha
Sign a reliever
Rotation Martinez Waino Reyes Lynn Leake
Lineup : Carp, Blackmon, Piscotty, Turner/Gurriel Grichuk, Diaz, Molina, Wong
But that’s in a perfect world and Mozeliak is the GM
In my opinion, Mo does a great job with his management.
A good offseason would be:
Acquiring Blackmon without overpaying. Hypothetical – Adams, Hudson and Littrel (wishful thinking would be to talk with Colorado about us picking up Garcia’s option and sweetening the deal with them for Dahl instead). Give Moss a QO and he REJECTS it.
Let Holliday walk.
Sign Melancon. (just lost Duke)
Sign Lourdes Gourriel.
Sign Martinez to a long-term friendly contract.
Oquendo work with the INF defensively.
Restructuring Diaz’ contract for longer-term.
Honestly, I’m going to throw this out there, sell high on Gyorko. Maybe part of a Longoria trade? Doubtful but wishful.
I like the Melancon idea.
Longo deal could possibly happen but they would want Adams and possibly Wacha in a deal.
Also rumor about Votto possibly being dealt to the Cardinals he can veto a trade but I would think he wants to go to a contending team. But that’s a very big long shot
Under Mike Matheney will the Cardinals ever have a regular starting line up? Will they ever have a regular batting order? Will the Cards ever have a regular starting pitching rotation? Will there ever be a regular relief core? And Will the Cardinals ever change a pitcher without a double switch??? This inconsistency would even throw off the players of a strong little league team.
matheny picked up larussa’s bad habits
2015 Matheny was on the top run of NL managers. 2016.. He tried to become “”I’m Tony LaRussa.. the smartest guy in the room” clone! He is definitely a MEDIOCRE manager at best!
Lollllll. Wacha and Adams and Peralta couldn’t bring back a bag of balls!! Wow some fans are such homers!
How about Wacha and Adams for Trout and Pujols? Go for it MO! True its not a footlong hotdog you’d b offering, but the butcher shop just might be available. ;-
What about Gardner. And maybe blier
Is Rick Horton still part of the broadcast team for the Cardinals? He is horrific! Loved his comment that Molina had “soft hands” playing first base one night! LOL
Stick it in your ear Rick! The BS must really be deep in the broadcast booth when you and Hrabosky are in there with McLaughlin.
2017 predictions cardinal nation? I know there is a lot of time before opening day, but do you think this team is playoff caliber , (with no SIGNIFICANT upgrades to the roster?
I am thinking maybe 85 wins (at best) and maybe sub .500 for the regular season, with the season meaning less right after Labor Day.
MO must GO!!