6:04pm: Both teams have announced the trade via press release.
5:20pm: The Braves have been one of the most active teams of the offseason thus far, and that continued on Thursday as the team reportedly struck a deal to acquire veteran lefty Jaime Garcia from the Cardinals in exchange for minor league infielder Luke Dykstra and young right-handers John Gant and Chris Ellis.
[Related: Updated St. Louis Cardinals Depth Chart and Atlanta Braves Depth Chart]
Garcia, 30, has long been a steady member of the Cardinals’ rotation but struggled a bit in 2016, working to a career-worst 4.67 ERA with 7.9 K/9, 3.9 BB/9 and a very strong 56.7 percent ground-ball rate in 171 2/3 innings. He’s controllable only through the 2017 season, as the Cardinals exercised his $12MM option at season’s end. Despite the fact that St. Louis picked up that option, though, trading Garcia has long seemed like a highly plausible outcome. The Cards already have Carlos Martinez, Adam Wainwright, Mike Leake and Alex Reyes in the fold in addition to right-handers Michael Wacha and Lance Lynn returning from injuries.
As for the Braves, Garcia will be the third veteran arm they’ve added to their rotation already this winter. He’ll join fellow newcomers Bartolo Colon and R.A. Dickey in the Braves’ rotation behind right-handers Julio Teheran and Mike Foltynewicz. Like Colon and Dickey, Garcia is a one-year commitment that can function as a reasonable stopgap to upper-level arms in the Braves system like Sean Newcomb while also give young righties Aaron Blair and Matt Wisler, who have struggled in the Majors, additional time to develop in Triple-A.
Despite Garcia’s 2016 struggles, he’ll bring to the Braves a career 3.57 ERA with 7.3 K/9, 2.6 BB/9 and a 56.5 percent ground-ball rate in 896 innings as a Major Leaguer. Shoulder injuries have limited him throughout his career, and he missed time with a groin strain as well in 2016, but he’s averaged 151 innings in 2015-16 and made a total of 50 starts in that time.
While the Braves have been connected to Chris Sale and other front-of-the-rotation names in trade chatter, the addition of Garcia lessens the chances of that hope becoming a reality for Atlanta fans, though it doesn’t eliminate the possibility. Both Mark Bowman of MLB.com and Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports note (Twitter links) that the Braves still intend to pursue front-line starters. The rotation certainly looks full at the moment, but it’s possible that as a young right-hander with a fair bit of MLB experience under his belt, Foltynewicz himself could be added to a trade package to help bring in a significant upgrade (though that’s merely speculation).
Each of Ellis (No. 17), Gant (No. 21) and Dykstra (No. 29) appeared on MLB.com’s midseason list of the Braves’ Top 30 prospects. Ellis, who turned 24 in September, was acquired with Newcomb in last year’s Andrelton Simmons trade. The former third-rounder posted a strong 2.75 ERA in 78 innings at the Double-A level this year, averaging 7.0 strikeouts against 4.0 walks per nine innings before moving up to the Triple-A level. He struggled in 67 2/3 innings with Triple-A Gwinnett, though, working to a 6.52 ERA. He did register an improved 8.6 K/9 mark, though he also averaged 6.9 walks per nine innings there as well. MLB.com’s report on Ellis notes that he has the size, strength and repertoire to become a No. 4 starter with three average to above-average offerings but slightly below-average command.
Gant, also 24, was acquired from the Mets in the 2015 Kelly Johnson/Juan Uribe trade and made his MLB debut last year, totaling 50 innings with a 4.86 ERA. Gant logged 49 strikeouts against 21 walks with a 42.1 percent ground-ball rate. He also worked to a 4.18 ERA with better than a strikeout per inning in 56 Triple-A innings. Jonathan Mayo and Jim Callis of MLB.com call Gant’s fastball, changeup and curveball each an average offering but also note that he has a tremendous feel for pitching. Nonetheless, they peg his ceiling as a back-end starter, albeit one that could conceivably join the Cardinals’ staff immediately out of Spring Training if necessary.
Dykstra, the son of former Mets/Phillies outfielder Lenny Dykstra, is a 21-year-old middle infielder that the Braves plucked with their seventh-round pick back in 2014. He went through his second stint in the Class-A South Atlantic League in 2016, hitting .304/.332/.363 with no homers and seven stolen bases in 81 games. Callis and Mayo call him a fringe defender with an average arm and note the he hasn’t shown any power to this point in his career, but his hit tool draws strong marks — and that skill is reflected in his career .300/.335/.385 batting line through parts of three minor league seasons.
ESPN’s Mark Saxon first reported that Garcia had been traded to the Braves. FanRag’s Jon Heyman reported (on Twitter) that three prospects were going to St. Louis in exchange. Joel Sherman of the New York Post reported that Dykstra and Ellis were in the deal (Twitter link). SB Nation’s Chris Cotillo reported Gant was the third piece (Twitter link).
Photo courtesy of USA Today Sports Images.
yes
that was quicker than I expected and now send those for an outfielder
No
Braves keep churning away
Interesting as a cardinal fan
Really pushing to be competitive in that new park. Not sure the three starters they have gotten are going to do that.
No, but better than watching the rookies and they will get the seasoning they need
Thanks for the memories Jaime. Good luck in Atlanta.
A pitcher under 40?
BOOOO!
…This one made me LOL
Haha
The Braves arent leaving every many innings for their 12 thousand young arms
I think that’s the point
Coppy is serious when he said he wants the young arms to earn their spot in the rotation. However, all the guys they acquired: Colon, Dickey, Garcia have movable contracts to a contender, if they pitched well, and a young pitcher like Newcombe, Fried, Sims, Soroka has proven their ready.
I think Swanson’s promotion (Aybar traded to DET days prior) proves that the most important thing to Coppy right now is the development of the young guys, then the present-day success of the team. Glad he feels he can be successful with both simultaneously. I can barely chew gum and fart at the same time.
Braves do well with pitchers from St. Louis
The reverse can also be said, namely Adam Wainwright (as well as Marquis and King from that same trade).
Especially when they send them to AZ.
Woah. Depending on the prospects of course, but this doesn’t seem like a great move for the Braves. I liked the Colon and Dickey signings for depth and to take some of the innings pressure off the young guys, but Garcia is a wildly inconsistent pitcher with constant injury concern.
12 mil one year deal with a bad year last year. Whatever prospects they give up they will get better ones during a mid season trade unless an injury happens. Decent risk for what this year is
A guy with a 4.49FIP and 1 year of control is worth #17 #21 #29 prospects on a team that isn’t going to compete this year??
Okay Braves…..
Pssp…he has a career FIP of 3.56 with no year more than 3.82 before last year. They obviously are the girl that likes the projects thinking they can fix him. IF he shows a turn-around look for him to be traded at the Deadline unless ATL is competing.
While I can agree that they probably gave up 1 too many prospects and that the Braves have a deep farm system, let’s not act like they gave up three superstars. Just because they rank well in the Braves system doesn’t mean the Braves may actually have much faith in them.
Absolutely. But still three prospects with 0 service time is a lot to give for a 30 year old pitcher coming off worst career year and with 1 year of service time. They’re banking on him returning to form and getting more prospects in return come July. Seems like an unnecessary gamble for a rebuilding team.
The goal isnt to rebuild for 12 years. They have put two years of bad teams on the field and are hoping to field at least a competitive team this season
As someone else stated below, it makes sense for them to trade some prospects that they aren’t that high on purely because there won’t be enough space for everyone. Granted it doesn’t hurt to wait and see which prospects develop and which don’t, you’re also limiting some prospects’ development if you’re keeping them in the minors because there are other young players ahead of them. Better to get something, even an uninspiring option like Garcia, for them now instead of waiting 3 plus years and having to lose them for nothing.
Gant has had opportunities in the majors this year, it did not go very well. Ellis was a throw-in with Newcomb in exchange for Simmons. Ellis was apparently lit up at AAA Gwinnett this year. At best, Ellis and Gant will end up as a #4/5 starter, but more than likely they’re going to be moved to the pen. Dykstra barely made the Top 30 list, only added depth at the minor level.
Meanwhile, Garcia sports a sub-2 ERA when he stays ahead in counts and keeps runners off base. Braves are likely hoping they can right whatever went wrong in 2016 and he’ll produce a 2015-type year. If not, likely will trade him at the deadline. This solves the LHP drought for the Braves though for little cost.
depending on the return this is a good move for the Braves i believe.
Garcia had by far the worst season of his career in 2016, if he can turn it around and have an ERA around 3.5-3.6 with a lower FIP, he could be a great candidate to trade at the deadline if one of young guns is ready. Coppy was adamant about making them earn a spot and not become entitled, and he’s certainly doing that.
Teheran, Folty, Colon, Garcia, Dickey
Is there anyone more active than Coppy?
The fella out in Seattle.
The Astros are being really exciting
#analysis #hottake
What???? Yes please
I hope they sold low though. The splits from two years ago to last year are alarming
who are the prospects?
I wonder who the bravos sent to the Cards. Garcia is only for one year and 12 mil. Can’t be much
Solid move for the braves depending on the prospects given up, only problem is the continuous shoulder problems Garcia has. It’s the absolute worst problem to have as a pitcher as the smallest thing will put him on the shelf for a while
Figured this would happen, he’ll be a good fit for them.
Doubt he pitches a single inning in a braves uniform. He’s more valuable than any fa pitcher right now and I hope the cardinals didn’t realize that. If that’s the case the braves could flip him pretty easily.
I don’t see that happening.
not that valuable.
The cardinals definitely got everything they could for him. IMO
Sounds like the Cardinals just wanted to dump the salary. Gave him away for just prospects
There’s not much else they were going to get. Either some depth guys or cash. Garcia wasn’t going to net them any significant major league guys.
Jeez Jaime is the definition if injury prone. I hope they didnt give up anybody good for 1 year of him
cardinals are good with prospects but who did they get?
Hearing it’s Luke Dykstra and Chris Ellis
People might argue depth reasons, but this seems likely that the Braves plan to trade Wisler/Blair/Newcomb or some other combination.
Interesting. They traded Ellis and Gant. So unless they plan to unload, i’m questioning this trade from the Braves perspective.
Are you kidding? Ellis and Gant were #17 and #21 (MLB Pipeline), and had murky futures because of the depth. Like Povse, they’re a product of depth. ATL FO is hanging on to who they want, and it’s not these guys. None of them had legitimate futures in ATL if half of the arms mature at any rate.
No I’m not. Garcia is not anything special anymore. He is injury prone and provides small value for them for 2017. Gant and Ellis provide depth but also they are younger.
So again, unless they plan to make a big trade, this deal makes little sense.
That’s all they need, someone that buys the young guys time to mature not in the bigs, like Colon/Dickey. 1 year left on his contract….great. He had a career-worst season in ’16, but if healthy (which ATL believes he is by trading for him), he could have a good year that ATL could benefit from and possibly sell at the Deadline for more prospects, clearing space for an arm that is ready.
Something can make sense even if it doesn’t make sense to you.
welll… Gant and Ellis were both going to go down next season on prospect lists and Dykstra wasn’t even in the Talking Chop(the smartest and most sabr savvy Braves blog) top 34 community prospect ranking list. If Garcia has a decent first half he might return something better than any of those 3.
Garcia can still be a very good 3rd or 4th starter, he’s had a few down years due to injury and probably couldn’t really feel strong and confidant to go out and pitch. When you have injuries to your shoulder or elbow there is more of a mental hurdle to get over when back on the mound. But to your point he has not been healthy in his career and the shoulder is a really worrisome problem to have
bravos4evr while I really like Benjamin Chases’ hard work that he does for Talking Chop (and I agree that Dykstra shouldn’t had been in the top 34 but he was) I’m hesitant to go as far to call Talking Chop the smartest and most sabr savvy braves blog…but I will agree that it is a overall a good blog with several good writers.
Personally as insinuated in my first paragraph I’m not a big fan of Luke Dykstra. I’m not overly high on Chris Ellis either because I’m not convinced he can harness enough control to even be a replacement level pitcher in the majors (although I won’t deny he has swing and miss stuff). Without a doubt I was a big fan of Gant. I know he may have had at best a #4 ceiling, but I think Gant is the most sure of the three included to become a solid and perhaps long tenured major leaguer even if he will never develop into a star. With that said, I’m quite certain that Gant was not projected to get a lot of innings in Atlanta this season and I understand his inclusion in the deal (although I think the Braves paid alittle too much).
I can only hope that Garcia rebounds and has a healthy and productive season.
Oh by the way Chase had Dykstra as #31 in this years list:
tomahawktake.com/2016/10/21/atlanta-braves-top-100…
Gant has had opportunities in the majors this year, it did not go very well. Ellis was a throw-in with Newcomb in exchange for Simmons. Ellis was apparently lit up at AAA Gwinnett this year. At best, Ellis and Gant will end up as a #4/5 starter, but more than likely they’re going to be moved to the pen. Dykstra barely made the Top 30 list, only added depth at the minor level.
Meanwhile, Garcia sports a sub-2 ERA when he stays ahead in counts and keeps runners off base. Braves are likely hoping they can right whatever went wrong in 2016 and he’ll produce a 2015-type year. If not, likely will trade him at the deadline. This solves the LHP drought for the Braves though for little cost.
They might trade one of them but no more
Braves traded: John Gant, Chris Ellis, Luke dykstra
I seen luke an ellis i didnt see gant was in the deal too
Got Chris Ellis, john gant, and Luke dykstra. Nice haul
Lol for future part timer major leaguers at best gant aside there was little to no value from the other two
I don’t expect and hopefully there was nothing but a couple of fringe prospects were dealt in this trade. If Jaime underperforms then it won’t be much lost. If he does. Then he would be an excellent Left Handed Rotation balance to a previously all Right Handed rotation (Teheran, Foltynewicz, Colon, and Dickey). If Dickey, Colon, and Garcia do at least somewhat well and the team underperforms there could be some very nice trade pieces. If the team is to do well as a whole, then those 3 will more than likely have a huge hand in it.
If the three pitchers can replicate 2016.
R.A Dickey – 169.2
Bartolo Colon – 191.2
Jaime Garcia – 171.2
So roughly 530 Innings added goes a long way towards at least getting us through the 2017, and by then the Calvary should have arrived in 2018. The experience alone for guys like Foltynewicz who have a ton of talent is invaluable. So maybe at least Jaime and the other guys can provide good serviceable innings while they are here and if things go south. Trade then and keep adding to our farm system.
Looks like the other piece of the Kelly Johnson trade Part I is gone to The Cardinals. – John Gant. I had really high hopes for him coming into the season, but he just didn’t have the same vigor for 2016 as he did to finish off 2015. Chris Ellis is a bit of an enigma, great at AA Mississippi, but got raked over the coals at AAA, and Dykstra doesn’t have many tools that are average, but he does have a knack for hitting. Could one day flourish into a Justin Turner type as a bench player and then starter because of his hit tool. However, if Jaime can give us 150+ IP of solid pitching for this year or either becomes valuable enough to trade at the deadline. We will be able to regain the prospects we traded and then some to boot.
GREAT trade for Cardinals. Surprised they got anything for him.
How are these prospects? Anyone worth having Braves fans?
Dykstra could be an interesting bench bat, Gant will be a long reliever, and Ellis could be interesting with more development. He faltered at AAA last year, though put up nice numbers before in Mississippi.
Gant has a good arm, funky delivery, will at least be bullpen option. Ellis has the most upside of the bunch. Dykstra is utility type option not much upside
Chris ellis an gant an very good prospects im not too sure about luke
The worst team in MLB just got rid of them, wouldn’t expect much 😀
What do the Twins have to do with this?
Opinions.
upside is a bench bat a 5th starter and a swingman, floors? none of them stick in MLB.
As a Braves fan I ask the same of injury-prone, aging Garcia.
The #STLCards receive pitcher John Gant, IF Luke Dykstra and pitcher Chris Ellis from #Braves.
It seems like a lot from the braves side, I like Gant, I think he is just one of those that would not have received a chance while in a Braves uniform. I predict he will be a valuable 7-8 inning pitcher
That seems like a lot but at the same time it doesn’t seem like a lot for Garcia. I like the trade because he will be pitching for a FA contract next year and if he pitches well we can flip him at the deadline for more than we gave up if not in quantity than for quality because I don’t think any of the guys going back to St Louis were in the long term plans.
Looks like the rotation is set now with Julo, Folty, Dickey, Garcia & Colon with Collmeyer the swing man/long reliever. Gives Wisler and Blair time at AAA to develop and out of the 3 additions whoever pitches the best should be traded with Newcomb replacing him to finish out the year. With Wisler & Blair to follow if the other 2 are moved.
Now it looks like the winter meetings will be used to figure out the catching situation. Now that Cadtro is off the board I would like to see Alex Avila as a lefty platoon partner but you never know. Coppy could have a deal setting up as we speak to acquire a young catcher. Would still love to see Reece McGuire and I think a deal involving Vizzy could make that happen.
Interesting haul. Next question for the Cardinals is CF.
I like this move and the Colon-Dickey signings as long as a big acquisition is coming. Otherwise the Braves are collecting a bunch of run-of-the-mill guys on the way to another losing season.
It appears the Braves sent Chris Ellis, Luke Dyksta, and possibly another mid-level prospect like John Gant to Cards. Ellis
That’s a steal for St. Louis
Excellent deal for the Cards. Ellis and Gant are interesting arms. Don’t know much about Dykstra. But getting two projectable arms for a guy that had zero chance to start for us? Massive win
Interesting. I actually like Gant, I didn’t expect to get a prospect I liked for Garcia.
Sad for Gant that he’s going to another team he’s so far down the depth chart to start. I really think he could be a solid #4-#5 if he gets a chance.
Garcia is not worth 3 top 30 prospects… even if they are expendable and low ceiling.
Garcia will play more in a few months than any of them ever will, combined. Not that I’m that big on Garcia, but I don’t think Coppy was big on any of these guys, and he’s taking a chance on someone that could pay off.
Garcia is worth more than these 3 prospects. Dyksta was 29 and surely would have fallen out of the top30. The 2 pitching prospects are duplicates of several others in the Braves system. Garcia is only 30 and has a career 3.57 ERA in 8 MLB seasons.
None of those guys are in Braves current top 30 i belive and to st Louis fans saying steal trade made me remember when they where saying steal for j hey .
Besides the Braves are the ones that traded for the player with 1 year if control this time….
The trades aren’t anything alike. But Garcia was out of the rotation so they took the best offer for him. Hopefully he finds some success in Atlanta.
I for one like the trade from both sides. Seems like the type of risks the Braves have been willing to take and the 12 million isn’t much this season. I would think the Braves could have given less than what they did, but if both sides are happy, all’s good.
Yep. I wasn’t implying I thought it was a bad trade for the Braves. They have plenty of depth that they weren’t counting on any if these guys.
For the Cards: it was 1 year of Garcia with at least 5 guys ahead of him on the depth chart and 2 others ready. So moving him for either depth or other pieces to move was a fine decision.
I do think Gant could be a sleeper, though. He has solid stuff. Hopefully the Cardinals trade him somewhere he could get a chance to start.
Uhm, all 3 are in the braves top 30.
They were in the mid-season top 30, before the newly drafted players surely forced out Dyksta, and 2nd half performance dropped the other 2
@jonathan250 all three of those were in MLB’s Braves top 30 list.
Ellis #17
Gant #21
Dykstra #29
It’s funny, before it was reported what was coming to Atlanta, Steve wrote down “upper level starters Chris Ellis and Sean Newcomb are on their way” he obviously had to change it.
As a cards fan. I’m happy. Garcia gave us plenty of good years and the idea to pick up his option to get some specs appears to be a good one.
None of the specs are world burners. But they are good
They are “good”. Best of luck.
Too young.
nothing too exciting there from either teams perspective. Could see Ellis end up being in the Cards bullpen in the future.
Gant will likely see time in the Cardinals bullpen in 2017.
I like this trade for the cardinals. Luke dykstra and John Gant have great pedigree. Both of their fathers were excellent major leaguers. The only thing I worry about is Lenny Dykstras questionable character rubbing off on Luke. Ron Gant had a very solid career. If Jon is anything like his father this will be a very lopsided trade imo.
Somebody better tell Ron to get a paternity test cause his son John is WHITE !!!!
Never ceases to amaze me how crazy some comments on here are.
Ron did have his suspicions understandably.
^^^^^this guy is funny
LMAO!!! John Gant is white, Im pretty sure there is no relation to Ron Gant.
Tony Gwynn Jr had a good pedigree too.
And Eric Young Jr. was never as good as his dad.
Low Hanging Fruit for Garcia. Come on Cardinals—surely these aren’t the impact players that Mozeliak promised for 2017??????
Agree- could we not have gotten Inciarte?
No way, not for one year of Garcia. Guy just won a gold glove and can play any of position, is also young a controllable. That would have been an awful trade for the braves
Show me where he promised “impact players”. The only problem is your unrealistic expectations.
Garcia is low hanging fruit…
How can Mo get something for nothing?
No team in the league expected the Cards to keep Garcia all winter long. His optionwas picked up for a deal like this. He was never gonna start with C-Mart, Lynn, Wainwright, Reyes, Leake in front of him, Wacha is a better bounce back candidate and is probably the 6th starter. Now the team has Gant, Weaver, nd hopefully a healthy Marco Gonzalez in reserve to cover injuries.
Plus, Chris Ellis could end up being a steal. Dude has serious swing and miss stuff. His control has been suspect, but the minor league staff has been doing a really good job over the last decade with developing young pitching.
Really smart getting Colon, Dickey and Garcia all on 1-year deals, if they are good then they can be flipped for prospects at the deadline. If not, oh well they can just cut them.
Eh… not sure how colon or dickey would be the guys your looking to trade for to make a playoff push, maybe if you desperately need a 4th starter. But my guess is that teams would look elsewhere first, teams know that they can just wait till the offseason if they don’t retire, Garcia is interesting though if he pitches well, I could see him netting at least a teams top 10 or more depending on how well he pitches
How is waiting til the offseason helping a playoff push? If they are pitching well and Atl is out of it playin on an expiring contract. Those are exactly where teams look when making a trade for a push.
The beginning of my post stated that those are not the type of pitchers you look to add for a playoff push as they are not real difference makers, nor would either of them be likely to be in a postseason rotation as teams usually go with a 3 man rotation. Not the guys you get to help win a World Series as they would probably be relievers if they make the roster
So if you want to fill out the back of your rotation wait till free agency, when’s the last time a real playoff contender traded for someone like RA at the deadline to push their team over the edge
Unless Garcia pitches out of his mind, I don’t see a team trading a top 10 prospect for him. Also, while I do partially agree that most playoff teams aren’t going to trade for Colon/Dickey as their final piece, a team with rotation injuries or uninspiring 4/5 options could swing a deal for one of them to eat some innings. You’re right that they wouldn’t be much other than a reliever in the postseason, but I think Colon has sneaky trade value. If he continues pitching like he has the past two years, I could definitely see a team trading for him to be their 4th starter in the regular season/postseason. The Indians had Ryan Merrill as their 4th starter during the postseason (due in large part to injuries), I’m sure they would’ve gladly thrown Colon out there over him.
Agreed but had the series been 2-2 instead of 3-1 there’s probably a good chance someone other than Merrill was pitching I think the same would go for colon but I doubt there would be any interest in dickey
I hate this trade for the Cards. Mo could’ve got more. Couldn’t we get one good prospect instead of 3 eh’s? I guarantee the Braves move him at the deadline for more than they gave up.
Yea because injury prone middle relievers are in such demand right now…
I hate this trade for the Cardinals not bc of the return, but bc I think ppl have written Jamie off to early. Last year was his first healthy season in the last few. He wasn’t physically ready for an entire season. He’ll be much more of the first half Jamie than the second half Jamie. He wore out. This year his stamina will be greater and I see much better things from him.
It’s just as likely that he gets hurt again as it is for him bouncing back to produce a solid performance over a full season work load.
I need punctuation to truly understand that statement. If he stays healthy, it’s entire possible he doesn’t, the Cards will have gotten the short end of this trade.
If you’re argument for why the Cards might’ve undersold on Garcia is “he wasn’t physically ready for an entire season”, then that means he’s not taking care of his body and/or properly working out and getting into shape. If he pitched well in the second half of the season as opposed to the first half (implying it took him some time to find a groove), you’re argument would make sense. If he’s wearing down though, that means he’s not properly staying in shape.
Not true at all. I’m not sure to exactly what extent his shoulder problems are but I’ve have labrum surgery and continued shoulder problems as a pitcher. The shoulder takes a long time to properly heal regardless of the injury because its uses it’s own blood source and not from the rest of the body to go along with the fact that it is one of the most complicated parts of the human body The shoulder also loses the most strength and stability the fastest and is the hardest/ takes the longest time to get it back. I’m guessing he had some sort of tendinitis in the bicep, labrum or rotator cuff with cause inflammation and fraying of the tendon and takes longer than most expect to fully heal. There is a very good possibility that his shoulder just isn’t strong enough yet from what ever problems if was having to pitch a full season regardless of how he says he feels. I think it’s more likely that the cards didn’t want to be the ones paying him if he breaks down again or doesn’t regain his previous form
Didn’t mean to give a doctor lesson, just felt like I may have gone through some of the same problems he’s had
Yes I agree, the Braves have 7 prospects in MLB’s top 100 list and Garcia for 1 of these players makes more sense for The Cards. Or Garcia could of been added as a sweetener to a bigger trade.
There is no way that Garcia brings back a top 100 prospect. You are way overvaluing him. Of course a top 100 prospect makes sense for the Cards, but this isn’t a video game where you can force trades, it does actually take two teams to agree on a trade.
The reincarnation of David Eckstein.
I am jealous, John Hart and Company are making some good moves.
I would have loved to seen Jaime Garcia in an Oriole uniform.
Way to go Cards. $12 million off the books. Now go get Greinke.
They put the 12 million on, on purpose when they picked up his option
Yes thats obvious.
No chance
1 game wild card game comes down to Cards & Braves. 18 game winner Jaime Garcia gets the ball. Would the Cards be kickin themselves in the ass for picking up that $12 million option just to trade him.
Well….then the Braves could have signed him and they got nothing in return….
He wasn’t starting in St. Louis. So they shopped him and took the best offer. It’s a pretty minor trade
If in 2020 they face off in a 1 game playoff and Gant comes in and pitches 2 shutout innings propelling the Cardinals to a victory would the Braves be kicking themselves for trading him for 1 year of Garcia?
LOL we won’t be in a wild card game in 2020 we will win the division
Curious how the rotation will look now?
Teheran
Dickey
Colon
Fotly
Garcia
?
Teheran
Colon
Garcia
Folty
Dickey
Or
Gray
Teheran
Colon
Garcia
Dickey
Cards got quantity, not much quality, tho, like others have said, Gant’s kind of appealing……But Garcia (a) is hurt all the time, (b) isn’t that good when he’s healthy and (c) expensive and (d) is reputed to be a bit of a pill. Getting anything for him is a plus.
Turns out picking up the option wasn’t a bad idea at all, uh? Cardinals seldom do dumb things.
Garcia not good when he’s healthy is most definitely false. Last year was the only year you could remotely consider “not good”
If he’s healthy, he’ll most likely be a solid #3
Since he became a MLB starter in 2010, Garcia (including his miserable last season) is a 3.50 pitcher, better than Arrieta and Dickey
He can dominate, he can implode, and he gets hurt.
What Garcia is is a solid low strike zone, late movement pitcher who can lose it fast, as well his health.
I always felt it was a 50/50 chance when watching him. Either he’s gonna go 7 innings 1 run, or give up 6 in 3.1.
good comments, but also need to add, Garcia lost his rotation spot too. With Martinez, Lynn, Wainwright and Reyes all better than him, and the team is committed to Leake longer so Garcia had zero chance to start this year if everyone was healthy and even in the case of an injury would have had to hold off Wacha to be the 6th starter
Wonder if chip carey will mess his name up too. Its Jaime with a “J” not a “y”
Ellis and Gant are nothing special. Just bodies. Best case for the Braves is that Garcia pitches lights out and they move him at the deadline and replace him with Newcomb in the rotation.
The fact that people, mainly Cards fans, think they could’ve gotten more for Garcia is laughable. Garcia is nothing more than a low end 4/high end 5 pitcher in a rotation. He’s old and is a free agent at the end of the year. They weren’t getting a superstar or quality major league player in return unless they sent more to the Braves. This trade, for the most part, is a salary dump. Since the Cardinals are not eating any money, there is no incentive for the Braves (or any team) to send back a good haul. The fact that the Cardinals got three prospects is surprising to me.
>>>”The fact that the Cardinals got three prospects is surprising to me.”
That’s because you’re probably undervaluing Garcia, just as some Cardinals fans are overvaluing him and expecting a larger haul.
Garcia, when he’s on, is a legit No. 2-3 starter, as recently as 2015, when he returned in May and pretty much became the best pitcher in the Cardinals’ rotation (10-6 in 20 starts, 129.1 innings, 2.43 ERA, 97 SO to 30 BB). His problem is health and consistency: he’s had three seasons of surgeries–twice to his shoulder and having the same surgery that finally ended Chris Carpenter’s career–and even though he was healthy last year and still had a handful of great games (like his 13 SO, 1-hit shutout of the Brewers), he clearly fatigued as the season went on and wound up having some starts skipped. .
He’s not that workhouse guy to give you 200 innings, or be your ace, but even if he bounces back partially to the pitcher he was, that will definitely provide value to a team that needs starting pitching, especially in a FA market thin on quality pitching. His injury history and struggles last season obviously lowered his trade value, but it didn’t erase it.
I agree with what you said, except one thing… Garcia is at his best a solid 3, never a 2. I am a Cardinals fan and watched him his entire career.
I’m a lifelong Cardinals fan, and I watched him, too. I disagree strongly with the idea of “never”. He was last year, and he was before in 2011 and 2010. Then he pitched injured, which essentially caused him to lose two seasons.
^^^Perfectly said.
Im glad they were able to get something for him. So long Jaime!
Over pay
Glad we got good prospects for Garcia. Good luck with the injuries Atlanta.
The only thing I don’t like about this trade is they are saying the braves may not be done in the SP market. I wouldn’t mind them being involved as a 3rd team to maybe get some young hitting, but none of the aces will be cheap.
Grant is a ok player. But Garcia is one year removed from being pretty valuable. I have seen some comments about age, the guy is 30 till June/July or something. He is in his prime years still. He is a lefty, if he bounces back this will be a major win for Atlanta.
Good upside for Atlanta, STL got something for an excess, decent move for both teams. In a market where Volquez got 22 million for a 5+ era and has a shaky track record, I’d say Atlanta did ok.
Glad he’s finally been traded. Now we can stop seeing these in the comments section (yes – these are all actual proposed trades in recent months):
Jamie Garcia for Bret Gardner, cash and prospects
Jamie Garcia for Ender Inciarte
Jamie Garcia (and a minor prospect or two) for Charlie Blackmon
Jamie Garcia (and a minor prospect or two) for Marcell Ozuna and prospects
Jamie Garcia for Robbie Ray
Jamie Garcia (Adams, Hudson, Littrel) for David Dahl
Now I guess we can focus on how Rosenthal, Pham, Peralta and Adams should be able to get Chris Sale.
HAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!! Thanks for the laugh
Cardinal fans really did think they were going to get an mlb ready stud for a Garcia package. From the comments there are a lot of different opinions so looks like a fair deal for both
Not me at least. Heck Im happy with any return
He’ll probably have a 2.4 era in the NL East
As a Braves fan I loved the Dickey and Colon signings, but I really don’t like this one. Garcia isn’t that good and stays hurt. I was honestly hoping we wouldn’t bring anyone else (SP wise) in unless they were a frontline guy at this point and if not that then just roll with one of Wisler/Blair/Newcomb/Jenkins in the 5 spot. Oh well though, I hope he proves me wrong and does well for us.
I was actually thinking they would put Collmenter in the 5 spot. I’m not huge on him and wasn’t all that excited about us re-signing him, but even less so if he’s taking up a spot in the pen. Could be shifted to the rotation in case of an injury though, but I think that’s where he should’ve been from the start
When Jaime’s good, he’s REALLY good. When he’s bad, he’s REALLY bad. Best of luck to him though
I don’t think there is a real great shot that Garcia completes a full season in decent form, but this is the kind of move a team in the braves position needs to make. If he sucks, oh well. If he’s good they can trade him (perhaps for non non pitcher(s)).
They aren’t gonna compete in 2017 and can afford to take some of these gambles.
Numerous words come to mind when I hear the name of Jaime Garcia. Phenomenal Stuff. Head Case. Mental Midget. Twitchy. Fidgety. Uncomfortable on the mound. Nasty Curve. Darting Fastball. Untapped Potential. Sky is the Limit, but Brain keeps him grounded, Atlanta fans, come June, you’ll have a clear understanding of what I’m talking about.
Yup.
The dude can go 7 innings, 1 run and just nasty, late breaking stuff inducing weak contact
And then the next night 3.1 with 6 runs and 3 HR’s
His home run rate has been climbing.
It could be an outlier
It could be a recent bad trend
It could be exhaustion
Either way, the Braves are likely to get a productive pitcher and he didn’t cost them much.
Absolute head case, so glad he is gone
A good trade for both teams. Cards get some depth for their bullpen, which they needed, while the Braves get a decent lefty when healthy. Both traded from their respective “depths.”
Dead on synopsis
Fellow Birds fans, if you were seriously expecting a top 100 prospect or MLB ready talent in return for Jamie, you’re being the definition of a homer.
1: Oft-injured.
2: Questionable mental fortitude.
3: Coming off career worst year.
4: One season of control.
My opinion of why most of us Cards fans are over-valuing him? When this dude is on, he is straight filthy. I’m not talking about numbers and metrics. I’m talking about watching your team play 120+ games a season and watching Jamie since he debuted. I’m talking about being pumped for his home starts and worried sick when he started on the road. I’m talking about watching Jamie look completely un-hittable and in control, followed by a 3 inning meltdown because a call didn’t go his way. Extreme highs or extreme lows. No in between. For what it’s worth, when he was at Busch and his stuff was working, he looked like the best lefty in baseball. Dominating.