Major League Baseball has instituted a lifetime ban on former Braves general manager John Coppolella, according to an announcement from commissioner Rob Manfred. The heavy punishment comes as the league moves to punish his former organization for amateur signing infractions during his tenure as GM. Coppolella had already resigned from the Atlanta organization.
Beyond the lifetime ban for Coppolella, the Commissioner’s Office has banned former Braves international scouting director Gordon Blakeley for one year, and commissioner Rob Manfred has also indicated that other members of the Braves’ international scouting staff will be disciplined. Here’s the full statement from Manfred:
My office has completed a thorough investigation into violations of Major League Rules by the Atlanta Braves. The Braves cooperated throughout the investigation, which was conducted by MLB’s Department of Investigations. The senior Baseball Operations officials responsible for the misconduct are no longer employed by the Braves. I am confident that Terry McGuirk, John Schuerholz, Alex Anthopoulos and their staffs have and will put in place procedures to ensure that this type of conduct never occurs again and which will allow the Club to emerge from this difficult period as the strong and respected franchise that it has always been.
The investigation established that the Braves circumvented international signing rules from 2015 through 2017. During the 2015-16 international signing period, the Braves signed five players subject to the Club’s signing bonus pool to contracts containing signing bonuses lower than the bonuses the Club had agreed to provide the players. The Club provided the additional bonus money to those players by inflating the signing bonus to another player who was exempt from their signing pool because he qualified as a ’foreign professional’ under MLB rules. Consistent with the rules, the Braves could have signed all of the 2015-16 players for the full, actual signing bonus amounts. Had the Club signed the five players to contracts containing their actual bonuses, however, the Braves would have exceeded their signing bonus pool by more than five percent and would have been, under MLB rules, restricted from signing any players during the next two signing periods for contracts with bonuses greater than $300,000.
As a result of the 2015-16 circumvention, the Braves were able to sign nine high-value players during the 2016-17 signing period who would have been unavailable to them had the Club accurately accounted for its signings during the 2015-16 signing period. These players were Juan Contreras, Yefri del Rosario, Abrahan Gutierrez, Kevin Maitan, Juan Carlos Negret, Yenci Peña, Yunior Severino, Livan Soto and Guillermo Zuniga. In addition, the Braves entered into additional ’package’ agreements in 2016 and 2017 in which they signed Brandol Mezquita, Angel Rojas and Antonio Sucre for reduced amounts, and provided additional money to those players’ agents by signing other players affiliated with their agents to contracts with inflated bonuses. In order to remedy these violations, I am releasing these players from their contracts with the Braves and declaring them free agents eligible to sign with any other Club. The procedures governing the players’ release and the signing process will be communicated to MLB Clubs under separate cover.
The investigation also determined that the Braves: (i) agreed to sign six players to inflated signing bonuses pursuant to an agreement with prospect Robert Puason’s agent in exchange for a commitment that Puason would sign with the Club in the 2019-20 signing period; and (ii) offered prospect Ji-Hwan Bae extra-contractual compensation. In order to remedy these violations, I am prohibiting the Club from signing Robert Puason when he becomes eligible to sign, and disapproving the contract between Bae and the Braves, which has not yet become effective.
While the remedies discussed above will deprive the Braves of the benefits of their circumvention, I believe that additional sanctions are warranted to penalize the Club for the violations committed by its employees. Accordingly, the Braves will be prohibited from signing any international player for more than $10,000 during the 2019-20 signing period, which is the first signing period in which the Braves are not subject to any signing restrictions under our rules; and the Braves’ international signing bonus pool for the 2020-21 signing period will be reduced by 50 percent.
The investigation also determined that the Braves offered impermissible benefits, which were never provided, to a player they selected in the First-Year Player Draft in an attempt to convince him to sign for a lower bonus. As a penalty for the Club’s attempted circumvention involving a draft selection, the Braves will forfeit their third-round selection in the 2018 First-Year Player Draft.
With respect to individual discipline, former Braves General Manager John Coppolella will be placed on the permanently ineligible list, effective immediately. Former Braves Special Assistant Gordon Blakeley will be suspended for a period of one year, effective immediately, and may not perform services for any MLB Club during his suspension. I intend to discipline other Braves’ International Baseball Operations employees who participated in the misconduct after the completion of our internal procedures. My staff will speak to the Players Association and officials in the Dominican Republic regarding appropriate consequences for the representatives of the players who intentionally participated in schemes to circumvent our rules, none of whom are certified by the Players Association.
The ramifications are significant for the Braves, whose capacity for amateur talent acquisition over the next several years will be hammered. Both Maitan and Gutierrez were ranked among the Braves’ top 30 prospects at MLB.com, with Maitan having ranked fifth overall and Gutierrez ranking 30th. The forfeiture of those prospects will mean that more than $10MM worth of amateur bonuses have now been squandered, and the Braves will also feel that pain of MLB’s sanctions in next year’s amateur draft and through the 2021 season on the international market.
The role that former president of baseball operations John Hart did or didn’t play in these infractions remains unclear, but Hart, who was given a reduced role in the front office upon the hiring of new GM Alex Anthopoulos, announced his resignation from the organization last week. A split between the two sides seemed largely inevitable; either Hart played a knowing role in the most significant circumvention of MLB’s international amateur free agency system to date, or he exhibited a stunning level of negligence in allowing these infractions to be committed without his knowledge. Neither of those scenarios seems excusable.
The Braves have also issued a statement on the matter:
Today, Major League Baseball informed the Atlanta Braves organization of sanctions being levied as a result of their investigation. As MLB stated, the Braves cooperated fully throughout this investigation and we understand and accept the decision regarding the penalties that have been handed down. As we expressed last week, our organization has not lived up to the standard our fans expect from us and that we expect from ourselves. For that, we apologize. We are instituting the changes necessary to prevent this from ever happening again and remain excited about the future of Braves baseball. We do not plan to comment further on this matter.
That the Braves won’t comment further on the matter runs somewhat contrary to comments made by Braves CEO Terry McGuirk last month. Speaking with Tim Tucker of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, McGuirk stated: “I don’t think there will be any questions (unanswered) when we are able to discuss it.”
Meanwhile, Blakeley has also issued a statement on his year-long suspension (via Ken Rosenthal of The Athletic, on Facebook):
I am obviously very disappointed in the Commissioner’s decision regarding my suspension, particularly given my 32 years of untarnished service to the game. That said, I am in the digesting the Commissioner’s findings and considering all of my options going forward. I take responsibility for my actions in this situation; however, I always acted under the direction of my superiors.
wow
Coppy got copped
I’m wondering if there was a unspoken moratorium on major trades or FA signings until this was announced. If so, let the transactions run like diarrhea now.
With losing draft picks, having to forfeit 12 prospects contracts and other punishment for the Braves, imagine what would happen to a MLB team under Manfred if an executive committed a crime and went to federal prison?!?!… oh wait they’d just lose 1 2nd rounder, a competitive balance pick, and 2 million dollars. #Thatsall
There is a quite a difference between an employee using his former boss’ password to access a database while he was a low level employee and the top executive implementing a system designed solely to cheat.
Perhaps a better analogy would be to imagine what would happen if the league found out a team physician was providing PEDs to every player in an organization and helping them hide it?
Advantage: Vedder
What if I said that actually occured, and a team had been complicit in the 3rd party distribution of peds to their own players
Do tell if you have inside information. Enquiring minds want to know.
During the 90s I was briefly affiliated with an mlb team. Once, during batting practice, I overheard one front office exec speaking to another about a player that was taking bp. Exec 1: “What do they have have him on now?” Exec 2: names a substance I believe was a steroid and not hgh…I believe it was Stanizol.
It was said so casually, that I can only infere it was a common occurrence. I do know players in that era were encouraged to bulk up as a general trend. It also was common knowledge and occasionally spoken about by players. By the time of the ped scandal broke it had been going on for years.
The player spoken about by the execs actually isn’t one that I’ve heard much suspicion about. He was a good guy. That was the era….and it was before the Bonds and Sosa homer race. Maybe that one situation was an outlier…but I’d have to doubt it. Organizations will look into a players personal background, so you know they are keeping abreast of changes to personal physique. It’s their job to be ahead of the game, and knowledge is key.
For baseball to say….”oh, we had no idea” just isn’t even a good lie. What do THEY have hom on now? Who’s they? It shows an awareness that a 3rd party exists.
Its like a college basketball coach claiming innocence when he turns a blind eye to a booster payment to a player.
Bare in mind….these weren’t evil guys in baseball….some arrogant jerks in the bunch, but if the public had complete knowledge of the scale of use during that era…and that even some good guys used…it’d change perception even further. My best personal estimate is that roughly 30% used. Lots of money and dreams at stake
Thanks. I would imagine that something like this may be going on to a lesser extent with an undetectable PED. Not saying a club is directly involved, but I would think they could have knowledge of it.
I think we always need to be skeptical. Baseball doesn’t have a great reputation. When the steroid scandal broke I was a little surprised it didnt get uglier. With a little bit of retrospect…I have to conclude that many involved in the game at the time wanted to remain in the game for the forseeable future. And we have to bare in mind….while peds were a major scandal, they weren’t on the level of a true crime against society….murder wasnt being covered up. It was the times. Some really good people were involved. I wasn’t around for the cocaine scandal of the 70s and 80s…but Id imagine some good people used cocaine. We have to be careful not to totally vilify people for poor long-term judgement.
I believe down the road as people in the game age…we’ll hear more about the depth of the ped use. Its a little similar to how Mantles constant drunkenness was hushed…now its casual fodder. It wont matter as much in the future.
@ kyleschwarbersmom…..Keep in mind that testing is very different now than pre-Biogenesis. Ironically, Tony Bosch was one of the best things to happen to baseball. MLB had ask MLBPA for several years to allow for better testing, at or at least near, WADA testing but they refused until Biogenesis.
Pre Biogen testing was based on a 4:1 T:E ratio (testosterone to epitestosterone). Certain agents (including the use of HGH hid the actual levels). Post Biogen testing is much different.
MLB has for years always used one lab the World Anti-Doping Agency certified laboratory known as Laboratoire de Controle du Dopage (INRS – Institut Armand-Frappier) in Montreal, but they could only test as the JDA allowed. Now the JDA allows for “biological passports” (aka Longitudinal Profile Program0 and IRMS testing.
A biological passport is the baseline for a players testosterone level. The Montreal lab has those levels on file and any deviation is considered a failed test and triggers an IRMS (Isotope Ratio Mass Spectrometry) test. The IRMS can detect the biological marker of any PED months and months after use. There is no more “cycle” and timing to allow a roid to clear the system. IRMS negates that.
Players samples are also pulled randomly for IRMS testing throughout the year in addition to the 3 mandatory urine samples and 4800 random samples during the season. There are also 350 random off-season tests. HGH testing has a different schedule as it requires a blood sample. The urines tests are for “Performance Enhancing Substances, DHEA, Diuretics and Masking Agents.”
Pardon the pun, but it is a whole new ballgame. Link to the JDA
mlbplayers.com/pdf9/5450924.pdf
Thanks!
I love the hard science information…helps me couple it to the general knowledge of the game Ive experienced.
Due to some physical problems I am left with a lot of free time to read. I find things like that interesting. No only the science but the JDA and CBA themselves. I have read each several times which should scare the bejesus outta me because it’s not normal.
Am I the only one thinking?
“Hart got of easy”
Coppy’s banned for life, and Hart (his supervisor who claims he didn’t know) departs before his contract expired, probably to resurface again sometime in the near-future.
Hart should have gotten at least a 1 year ban.
His subordinate got a lifetime ban !
Actually John Hart was retired. His job with MLB network allowed him to work whenever he wanted to and play golf the rest of the time. He turned down a number of team’s offers before Atlanta made him an offer he couldn’t refuse: a big salary and bigger title with max authority and min responsibility. His main task was to take the heat for the rebuild. I doubt he had any interest in looking into young latin prospects who wouldn’t play for the Braves until years after he would be gone.
Then again that is all speculation. I don’t believe for one second he was totally clueless on the whole scheme.
Hart’s semi-retirement does not matter. And, yes, when he joined the Braves when he left the MLBN there was all sorts of talk that it was in an advisory capacity. However, shortly thereafter he was officially named Pres of Baseball Operations.
I like Hart as a TV personality, too. But he was absolutely entrenched in the organization (and not “semi-retired”) that he would be deserving of a year-long suspension if he was complicit.
My guess is that his resignation has to do with being embarrassed because he was negligent, not complicit. It was going on under his nose and he didn’t realize it.
Wow! The MLB isnt pulling any punches
Finally, MLB laying down the GAUNTLET. Well done, Mr. Commissioner. Cheating won’t be tolerated!
No union to haggle with dealing with non players.
Why don’t you ask MLB how many July 2 signings for 18 & 19 have already agreed to a bonus? And then ask, why MLB communicated with clubs asking them to make sure those players would be @ the MLB workout ? Joke!!!!!
Whenever the mlb office acts in this way…it really only makes me believe they are acting to end a much larger situation within the game.
A little more went on here than early commitments
It’s a shame that they don’t reach out to the other teams that have done this and drop the hammer too.
It’s also a shame that Atlanta isn’t a market like Boston that can skirt this.
They would literally drop the hammer on every team as packaging is well known occurrence, the Braves just went crazy with it over a short time. As long as there is desirable international prospects, namely ones attached to Buscons, this practice will never die.
Which makes me curious how the Braves investigation started and how much dirt they actually had on the Braves GM. Someone blew a whistle that MLB was forced to deal with. MLB does nothing until they are forced.
yikes
Whoa….
Tomahawk chopped his ass
SF has already agreed to a DR SS for July 18 for 2.6mil, your chop may be coming
Source?
Hopefully we get details on what he actually did. Other GM’s despised Coppy for being really pushy.
According to rumor even his co workers didn’t like him.
They gave him up! Rats!
Could have been the player from the amatuer draft that he welshed on the deal with. That tip could have led to an investigation that blew up in their face.
Read Rosenthal’s piece from this hour.
Rather detailed.
Quite frankly, the international issues were something already discovered by multiple other teams but due to delay the league couldn’t track down and penalize them. They only found out when they caught Boston pulling the same stunt as other teams (admitted by the contacts/agents of the players). This is Manfred stating .. ‘good grief, one would have thought penalizing Boston would have been enough to keep you idiots from trying this, but apparently not, so let’s up the ante a little bit’. Fortunately for the previous teams, nothing was illegal from a court system perspective, so you basically had a bunch of ‘local’ agents stating they make deals with other teams and MLB could not penalize past infractions.
Quite frankly, the punishment looks to be the same as Boston though I don’t think Boston lost players from the next period due to the ‘over the cap’ thing. Maybe Boston didn’t have that issue. I can’t remember. If they did and didn’t receive the same punishment then that is bad for baseball.
What’s worse for baseball is letting these kids become free agents allowed to be signed by any team without regards to the signing pool caps. This means the big market teams will almost certainly gobble up the better players. It doesn’t just hurt the Braves, it will basically hurt every team not in the top 6 or so in spending. Just a poor decision by Manfred there, but there might be rules preventing him from doing anything else.
To me, the penalties are just. I was concerned we would lose Waters because of the ‘joke’ comment made by ‘Coppy’ when asked if they thought they could sign Waters. That would have been ridiculous.
What it SHOULD spell out is .. the International signing nonsense is like the Wild West West. It’s time to invoke a draft.
EDIT – I am also just glad it wasn’t extended out further. It was impacting the Braves future and I am guessing Alex A was waiting on the punishment to come down so he could start moving. I do also wonder if Maitan will be hurt by the utterly stupid comment by the ‘unknown source’. For one, he may think the Braves truly said this and might not re-sign despite them being his favorite team and one year of growth. For another, it might diminish his value on the open market. I hate these ‘unknown source’ comments. I know the reason for unknown sources, but it’s honestly ridiculous in these days of rampant fabrication and click-baiting.
Good. What this moron did was inexcusable, and he was truly an idiot for believing he wouldn’t be caught. But, IMO, there’s NO way other high ups weren’t aware…*Cough, HART, Cough, SCHEURHOLZ*
^^^ @Scheurholz
I don’t buy that Hart didn’t know either. He just has friends in high places at MLB HQ.
MLB doesn’t have a history of integrity. This is actually very minor as far as what has gone on in the past. Front office personnel can sing the “we had NO idea he was on steroids” song all they like….but it’s garbage. And that’s a true story. I mean where to start…before that it was collusion in the 80s. Baseball isn’t run by saints all the time.
It isn’t played by saints either. Nor is it watched by saints.
No, but whether you or I are saints bares no effect on whether the business of the game or it’s on field integrity is damaged. MLB has a serious financial interest in policing itself to keep bad pr at bay. The Braves international scouting dept was colluding with an agent to provide players and had more in the pipeline. They also promised an under the table deal with a player in the amatuer draft
..and then welshed on the deal. Someone likely blew the whistle on this sort of “arrangement” and now MLB is acting to put an end to future flare ups….because Id say they are common most likely.
No….fans arent saints….but when they pay money for the product they need to generally believe its on the level. If not…it ends up being professional wrestling.
If you’re in management and tight with the Commissioner, denying such matters and evading scrutiny long enough can even get you fast-tracked into the Hall of Fame.
Just ask Tony La Russa.
Ask Tris Speaker and Ty Cobb who possibly threw games in the 20s…but Landis didnt want the bad publicity…both players were moved to different organizations. Baseball really wanted the public to believe that they cleaned the game up with the Black Sox scandal….but there’s evidence game fixing continued
There’s no “possibly” about it. They bet on games they played in and managed, as did Honus Wagner and lots and lots of players who weren’t stars, back when baseball paid little more than any other part-time job.
Honus Wagner played well before the Black Sox Scandal, and Ty Cobb earned a salary that was well beyond the average worker of the day. I only say possibly, because Im not aware of actual proof. The info on the 1919 world series actually came about due to an investigation into ANOTHER series fix involving the Cubs. I won’t say baseball is fixed in this sense now…but perhaps “guided” to promote advantageous results for the league.
How on Earth would JS have any knowledge of this?
Why wouldn’t he?
Possibly he’s a quasi-retired figurehead. Grancparents dont always know what the kids are up to.
Yeah but their kids aren’t typically running a Multi million organization
What did he do????????
He read the article!
Well the article wasn’t there when I made the comment.
Manfred took Cappolella out to the cornfield and whacked him. He had it coming.
Joe Pesci in Casino whacked or Joe Pesci in Goodfellas whacked?
Cornfield was Casino.
Or more of a George Michaels kinda whacked?
Haha
Yeah, wire him to the same car battery that powers George’s Sports Machine!!
Damn…..just DAMN
Would love to read an itemized list of infractions. Seems really, really aggressive based on what we currently know. I mean, Preller has a laundry list of dirt and is still a GM. There has to be something over the top that hasn’t been leaked.
Imagine working your whole life toward something and then getting permanently banned from it in your thirties. Like where do you go from there?
Seasonal worker at Walmart
Or seasonal at dollar tree
You walk around, looking like a butch gym teacher…and sign millions of autographs. Eventually, you make appearances as hilarious post season commentator.
Gotta love Rosey
lmao
Why he’s suing the Braves
Ha, gonna be hard to convince a judge to award damages to him after this.
Find a new path in life. There are obstacles in every life and either you overcome them or they stop you. He has enough intelligence and probably enough money to do just about whatever he wants in life.
Yeah but would you hire him? Coppy will forever be labeled as someone with no integrity.
book deal. exec for nfl or mls. mlb rules dont cross over.
Meh, people change careers all the time. Sucks when its not by choice but he bought this farm on his own.
Fox Sports, sitting between Pete Rose and Alex Rodriguez?
“Fox Sports, sitting between Pete Rose and Alex Rodriguez?” all the while humming “Stuck in the middle with you”
Did n0t see that one coming. Quite the message.
What did he even do
The hammer of justice crushes you.
rob manfred is not one to mess with. best commissioner in sports today.
Best commish? Tell that to the Nats, who will be mired in the MASN mess for years until Manfred stops ignoring the Orioles’ stalling tactics on the payment of their sizable obligations. Selig washed his hands of the MASN issue while modeling for his statue, and Manfred evidently has sent it to the Round File.
Or MLB’s favoritism towards the Giants over the A’s or Cardinals and their annual competitive balance pick or the red Sox receiving zero punishment for Apple-Watchgate, etc, etc, etc.
lol @ Red Sox. Did you really think there’d be a punishment? Wouldn’t have been no matter which team it was.
Im an A’s fan….the commissioners office is in no way independent. It’s just the head of ownership now. There’s no way MLB will rescind their ancient franchise regions…and not in a way that hurts the Giants cash cow in the bay area. Its an easy case for them to make….its already on the books. Personally, I feel Oakland is the best market going forward anyway…its not loaded with the corporate sponsors like San Jose would have been….but its quickly become a bit like Brooklyn….SF proper isnt affordable. A’s very wisely market their “green collar” niche. I dont think going head to head with the Giants really works.
Well said.
The reason the punishment was light for the Sox was that it would have been at least as much for the Yanks. In 2016 the Yanks were caught using the dugout phone to steal signs. The matter was turned over to Torre who never issued any punishment. When the Apple watch came up the Sox complained about a YES Network camera that served no purpose other than being aimed at Farrell and the coaches — footage that never aired. With the Yanks having two violations one proven and one to be investigated Torre made sure both teams got light fines and the matter was closed. This was done to protect the Yanks.
Go get ‘em, Manfred!
manfred went hard. my goodness
Yeah, they cheated. And got caught.
MLB dropping that ban hammer.
UPDATE (4:25 EST)
MLB announces that it is contracting the Atlanta Braves franchise, effective immediately, and sentencing former GM John Coppolella to death by firing squad. More to come.
As punishment to the Atlanta Braves franchise, it is being relocated to Tampa Bay.
Boom funny
Wow that’s harsh. The behavior must have been very fragrant and not just a misstep or two.
It sure did smell 😉
Flagrant? Or did you mean Fragrant?
Flagrant, auto correct.
Read Rosenthal’s piece.
Yes, it wasn’t just slipping players some extra cash. It was an entire system of doing business and colluding with an agent. Was also done within the amatuer draft. That’s not a rogue scout at work. It’s a department framework.
Well now hopefully they crack down on EVERY team that’s been doing the same thing as the Braves.
Doubtful. They probably hope the heavy penalty on the Braves GM takes care of it. More investigations and more bans leads to more bad press. They’ll scapegoat the Braves and hope it works. Its also possible he was banned to avoid a future lawsuit when no one would hire him. MLB is covering for the teams.
Sadly, you are prob right!
SEEYA
Go get ’em Coppy……..get ’em more Tea at table 6.
Holy crap.
All the makings of a great gangster-underdog-baseball-international movie!
This Thursday at 8, on Lifetime.
Heavy, heavy punishment. But very welcome, IMO.
Concerning to hear that ATL tried to circumvent the rules in the first-year-draft also – I hadn’t considered the possibility that their mis-steps went beyond International Free Agency.
Cop-Blocked.
🙂
They are cutting loose 12 players?
Yikes.
Where’s the guy saying the braves are getting punished for being the good guys and not cheating?
didn’t you read? He just got a lifetime ban from MLB
I’m more interested in where the guys the Braves lost are going to sign, especially Maitan. His agent is going to be very busy at the Winter Meetings.
Proof it’s much worse than the hacking fiasco.
I knew “Coppy” would go down. Called it from the beginning.
Dude! I think everybody knew
Yikes! Lifetime ban. Guess that takes care of his HOF chances.
Is there any appeal you can make for a lifetime ban or is that it?
No formal appeal for non-union employees.
I’m guessing this is also MLB sending a message to the other 29 scouting depts. Braves might have just been the ones caught red handed.
Future years signing restrictions (2019 – 2021) seem overly harsh for the Braves. Disciplining those involved and making free agents of those players who would not have otherwise signed with Braves should have been enough.
I would argue to the contrary, the rules about the way a team operates is dictated by MLB and the CBA, it is the teams responsibility to insure that their employees operate under the provisions put forth by MLB, the CBA and of course their employer, the team. Simply undoing the wrong would not be a punishment, allowing the kids to keep the money is nothing to an MLB team so that’s hardly a punishment and Coppolella losing his job is a personal punishment, once you remove all the noise, at this point the only thing the Braves have lost is 1 3rd round draft pick and the ability to sign international players for a couple years, seems light considering that the infractions were sever enough to cost a man his life work.
I thought the 3rd round pick loss was light as well. Of course thats a gem in the woods pick….but most teams get a decent relief arm about there. The fact that they were caught committing a violation in the actual amateur draft should have cost them their #1. Id have gone #1 in 2018, #2 in 2019, and #3 in 2020. The punishments always need to try and stop violations cold.
Mlb is sending a message much the same way Landis sent a message by banning the Black Sox.
Stick with me here. Let’s say that “Coppy” is so crushed by the news of his lifetime ban that he has a heart attack and his heart stops beating for a period of time. Is this considered “death”? What if he’s able to be successfully revived by paramedics? Does his “lifetime ban” end since he already died? Asking for a friend.
That is so wrong and yet so thought provoking.
Very Socrates of you, SD
The Brad Paisley song “Harvey Bodine” made me think of this.
“Coppy” still has options!
It’s only applicable if you accept the misnomer “life time ban”. It’s actually “permanently ineligible” Permanent is usually longer. I can say that because I was in a situation you described…dead on the OR table twice.
Did you have an out-of-body experience or see the light at the end of the tunnel?
Glad you made it back to impart your knowledge.
Thanks, but I do miss the polar bears 😉
Just a guess but I would think he would have to be declared dead, and have a death certificate. Now, what if he simply changes his name, the new name hasn’t been banned. Not that anyone would be stupid enough to hire him after this.
Buck Weaver is STILL banned from baseball years after his death for only knowing the 1919 series wasnt on the level…..something most insiders atleast were suspicious of, or in the case of Comiskey hunting down the league president…outright knew.
Much like the case of Shoeless Joe Jackson of the same Sox scandal. Except he didn’t take a dime
and had a very good series !
I believe Shoeless Joe twice had meetings with Comiskey and was refused. Comiskey tried to bury the scandal….and it surfaced a year later.
Weaver was banned for knowledge and not informing the club. Im not sure if he was in a meeting…but he didnt know any more than Ray Schalk or Kid Gleason.
I think Shoeless Joe takes the punishment though because he did take the money. His offensive record doesn’t really matter….I don’t like that…but he took money to throw series.
However, I dont feel the Sox were anywhere near the only players tossing games in that era.
I thought I read that Joe did go to the meetings
and then decided not to take the money
In AA We Trust !!!! Time to get the off-season started now. Glad it’s over & time to move on no time for crying there is no crying in baseball.
Def need a bat now with the pick in this years draft.
Peter Gammons has been talking about how “dirty” the whole latin america scene has been for years. I can remember lots of stuff going all the way back to A Rod and Beltre being hidden away by agents. The best part is that these 15 yr olds get to keep the $$.
I’d much rather they keep it than the cheaters. No reason to screw up their future any more than Atlanta did
How did Atlanta screw up their future? The way I see it they will all be signed by other clubs in short order and paid a second time.
Only Angelina Jolie would be cruel enough to take these young players’ money back.
LMAO A Rod was hidden away by agents at his private Christian school? So only the Seattle Mariners would be able to find him to select him 1st overall in ’93?
And no one is 15 years old. What are you a flat earther? Nothing you say makes sense.
If this was the NFL, the Braves would sue in Federal Court and try to get Manfred fired!!
The owners essentially did this to Fay Vincent, and ever since there hss been no independent arbiter of the game who even pretends to act in the “best interest of baseball”. Players and ownership are represented, but how about the fans. The game had priced so many out, and quite a few pr scandals have been whitewashed over. Stadiums built with taxpayer fleecing while schools and roads crumble. Whenever the health of the game is mentioned, it always seems to be the team values and player salaries.
Thanks for putting us even further behind in the rebuild John and John. At this point, I wish Liberty Media would bow out and sell the team to an individual who actually cares about the sport instead of just a corporation who likes profits. We need an individual who cares and wants to help to actually be a winning franchise again
Red Sox did exactly the same thing and nobody got banned
So is he “Pete Rose” banned for life? Or is it “Steve Howe” banned for life?
“So is he “Pete Rose” banned for life? Or is it “Steve Howe” banned for life?” and both justified. We don’t know if Coppy “dated” teenagers like Pete though.
Or allegedly trafficked drugs into the Cincinanti area to pay off gamblimg debts.
Wow, I really butchered my post. It should have read… “So is he “Pete Rose” banned for life? Or is it “Steve Howe” banned for life?” Pete Rose banned and both justified. We don’t know if Coppy “dated” teenagers like Pete though.
Addendum: “Or allegedly trafficked drugs into the Cincinanti area to pay off gamblimg debts.” ……or threatened with harm to him and his family by NY mob bookies.
Wonder why old Pete just took his ban? Lol
It’s long and boring but I wish those who say Pete only bet a little and never as a player etc would just read the Dowd Report.
There’s so much there in the Dowd Report….and implied elsewhere…that its easy to get the impression that baseball went with the gambling on the game ban to hush the situation. I guess there’s a lot of heresay and legend to it…but old Pete doesn’t appear to have been a nice human being during his career. Some things that are bad even for the typical arrested development athlete.
Pete Rose was also a major Speed Freak and was the main money guy in a major cocaine distribution ring. It’s all in the DOWD Report!
What I read as well. I wouldnt fault a guy for taking greenies in that era…pretty common and mild. But cocaine to pay off gambling debts. Im not sure if people know who dealt in cocaine and gambling back then..but it wasnt the Cub Scouts.
I read that report also
and if all these Rose hero worshippers would read it too, they would find out Rose is a total scum bag!
I’d say the braces are out of the running for Otani lol
lol braces lol
Surprisingly it was a good explanation released by MLB. It hurts the Braves but doesn’t destroy them or their team or farm so punishment was pretty fitting.
Thats what happens when you set rates below the market rates. I bet pretty much every team has engaged in similar behavior. Red Sox and Braves got caught.
Its stupid risky simply because some other teams will question below market signings and the agents and players can be made to talk with the carrot and the stick when its investigated as no matter what happens they keep the money
I’m not so shocked about the players, or even the pick but the banning for life… amazing. So much I clearly don’t know. Must have been an epic POS!
Savage
How many r of real value? Maitan? And who else?
Wow time has changed… A little different matter One has to wonder why former ex big leaguers Bonds, McGuire, Canseco, et al weren’t banned over steroids used… And those were bigger issues than amateur drafting…
They werent banned substances while they played. If we’re banning ped users from the 80s on….gonna be hard to have an era at all
“They werent banned substances while they played.” Actually they were banned in June 1991, but MLBPA under Donald Fehr would not agree to testing claiming “invasion of privacy” until congress forced the issue.
Thanks for the correction. I believe they were illegal Federally around 1988. How they can remain legal in a sport but against the law is beyond me. You’d think the law would supercede the games rules. But without testing….it’d take an arrest.
Actually Faye Vincent issued the memorandum in June 91 because of the Controlled Substances Act of 1990. In the memo he mentioned all drugs listed and specifically roids. He asked Fehr not long after to help institute testing and was basically laughed at. Selig “re-issued” the memo in the late 90’s and there was again laughter.
Yup…that was the game.
Was the DHEA
and Andro that McGuire was using illegal at that time too? I can’t remember for sure.
DHEA was added to the JDA just a few years ago. Andro is a steroid hormone precursor was not on the Controlled Substance Act until around 2004.
Ok! Thanks! I couldn’t remember all the dates for sure.
You can still buy DHEA legally. McGuire openly displayed a bottle of Andro (legal at the time) in his locker as a cover story for the illegal PEDs he was injecting.
My bad, I should have been more specific with my wording. DHEA is still legal but is banned by MLB (it was added in 2014) Section 2D page 13 JDA
mlbplayers.com/pdf9/5450924.pdf
One player trying to manipulate the game versus the front office of a team conspiring to manipulate the game. It all comes down to how someone wants to morally equivocate.
It’s not really down to a moral issue…not even that deep. The Braves violated league rules. Economics and union also involved when comparing a player to front office personnel as well. Worst case scenario of a player being banned for life now due to ped..would be a team rep exposing the player to them unbeknownst to the player as a means for breaking an unwanted contract.
I believe it takes gross misconduct to get a life ban….details perhaps the public never even hears.
Time for a world draft with an absolute bonus slot. All funds are handled by an mlb approved accounting firm…let them write the checks
Dang, Coppy got Pete Rose’d.
Maitan will get a 15 million dollar contract.
“”Maitan will get a 15 million dollar contract.” Not quite, he will still be considered a IFA and teams can only spend so pool money.
Generally, those players will be subject to the already-extant rules and limitations in the international arena. But Passan tweets that teams will be allowed to use currently available international funds or draw from their 2018-19 pool to sign these players (but may not utilize both).”
Nope. He’s still subject to the bonus pools. Most of hear guys will probably try to pounce on the $6 million or so that the two out of the Yanks/Rangers/Twins have burning a hole in their pockets when they don’t get Ohtani. Maitan‘ stock is supposedly down, so he would have been in line for less this time around than last time even if he waited for next year’s July 2 signing period to open. They’ll all still be ahead though because they get to keep the Braves’ money and then go see what extra they can tack on.
The more MLB does to screw kids out of getting fair market value for their services, the greater the financial incentive there is for every team to bend, evade, and break the rules. And the union rolled over and let them do it because these kids — and American kids subject to the draft, and minor leaguers working for years at sun-minimum wages — aren’t union members, so screw ‘em.
If a billion dollar corporation wants to cheat by paying a kid a little extra instead of by bilking taxpayers for publicly funded stadiums, that’s fine with me. Too bad the Braves have made an art form out of both.
This stings a bit but the Braves will be okay. A bit harsh, a bit of overkill. They are the poster – child of misconduct now.
This ban doesn’t take much guts. It’s tantamount to kicking a man while he’s down. How about banning Peter Angelos for sticking it to the Nats and MLB with his MASN deal, then welching on it to top it off?
So true ! … but careful, outinleftfield will write that you are “whining” about it.
Evidently he thinks it’s ok to welsh on an agreement and use Nixon-like stonewall tactics. (And it looks like Mighty Manfred is ok with it all.)
What part was welshing on the deal? Angelos permanently gave up half his territory in the deal. MLB and the Nats didn’t want to stick to the deal till its conclusion.
Biased Nats fan.. Disregard
It might be nice to completely disregard a statement that hurts your position.
Ignorance is Bliss
I remember a few years ago Buster Onley (I think) talked about some of the backroom deals. This was back when they had A and B draft pick compensation attached to arbitration offers. I remember the Red Sox had some guy (2B I think they got in a trade) who was a B that they offered arb to. Now the guy had a bad time and was not going to make much in FA. But he declined the offer so Boston was given a B pick. It was said that guys make agreements for some money to decline so the team could get a draft pick. So paying like 50k for a pick.
Damn You Coppolella,
I guess the Censor Police are Schureholtz fans, he should have been the first to be bounced out of the league
Wish you the best John. People make mistakes so they can get past them I suppose.