The Phillies put an end to the lengthiest, most high-profile free agent pursuit in MLB history today when they agreed to terms with Bryce Harper on a 13-year contract worth a record $330MM, And while there have been suggestions that the Phils could look into Dallas Keuchel and/or Craig Kimbrel once their pursuit of the market’s top two position players (Harper and Manny Machado) had wrapped up one way or another, Todd Zolecki of MLB.com tweets that it’s “unlikely” the Phils would sign either unless one pitcher’s asking price suddenly dropped to a short-term deal. MLB Network’s Jon Heyman offers similar thinking, tweeting that while the Phils “may” look into the market’s top remaining free agents, the organization’s “initial thought” would be short-term.
It’s been a quiet offseason in terms of rumors surrounding both pitchers. Keuchel and Kimbrel have different agents but both entered free agency reportedly hoping to score contracts of $100MM or more; that initial asking price may have turned off some suitors entirely, as there’s been little in the way of teams reported to have interest in the duo. That certainly doesn’t mean that the two haven’t had any interest, but the fact that they’re unsigned with just hours until the calendar flips to March also (obviously) suggests that their current asking price isn’t generating much in the way of bites from potential suitors. Unsurprisingly, both are still in search of multi-year deals, per Mark Feinsand of MLB.com.
Either pitcher would be an obvious fit for the Phillies, though after adding Harper, Andrew McCutchen, David Robertson, J.T. Realmuto and Jean Segura already this winter, it doesn’t seem as though GM Matt Klentak, president Andy MacPhail and owner John Middleton are prepared to pay top-of-the-market prices. Still, the Phillies are presently relying on a trio of unproven starters — Nick Pivetta, Zach Eflin, Vince Velasquez — behind ace Aaron Nola and veteran Jake Arrieta. Velasquez has long been tabbed as a potential reliever in the end anyhow, and bringing Keuchel aboard could push him to that role while adding a durable, dependable arm to the mix.
In the bullpen, the Phillies are looking at Robertson and sophomore Seranthony Dominguez as a formidable one-two punch at the back end of games. A rebound from Hector Neris and/or better health from veterans Pat Neshek and Tommy Hunter would give Philadelphia an even deeper collection of ’pen arms, but even with that potentially strong quintet, Kimbrel would push everyone down a peg and give manager Gabe Kapler a cavalcade of impressive arms. (It should be noted, too, that there’s at least a bit of early concern surrounding Hunter’s right arm.)
Even after adding Harper on his record-setting deal, the Phillies’ 2019 payroll projects at just north of $163MM. Their luxury-tax ledger is a bit more crowded at a projected $191.1MM at present (per Roster Resource’s Jason Martinez), so adding either Kimbrel or Keuchel would likely put the Phils over the $206MM barrier (barring the trade of another player on a guaranteed contract).
If they are going for it. They should snag a starter
Mets fan here.
Good signing but not a great signing for the Phillies. Overpaid for price per year and way too many years.
A singing this big and this bold has to result ion a World Series appearance within two years and a WS win within four years.
With the lack of talent on the team everywhere else, this will be very difficult to accomplish. The Phillies had a nice start last year but were terrible in August and September even with the weird and unsuccessful trades they made..
Outside of Nola, Starters are needed. Also needed are infielders who can hit and get on base. M Franco is decent but the infield is really weak.
The bullpen is adequate but flawed.
You might get .300 40 HR and 110 RBI out of Harper but who else will produce.
Good signing in that Harper stayed in the East. Good luck!
They picked up the best catcher in baseball. He’ll produce.
Jean Segura and Rhys Hoskins do simultaneous eyebrow raise.
So, you are wrong win just about everything you wrote…
1- Lack of talent??? So, you haven’t bothered to look at the 25 man as it sits today.
2-Infielders are needed? Franco, Segura, Hernandez, and Hoskins. Two of them are all stars.
3- Bullpen is adequate but flawed? Might be one of the very best in baseball.
Not much of a Phillies or Mets fan here. You are way off man. The Phillies lineup has a high ceiling. Your Mets are the ones with the lineup hanging on a couple of aging power-light veterans to create an intimidating middle of the order.
Jean Segura is a perennial .300 hitter and one of the ten best base runners in the game. In front of Harper, Realmuto, and Hoskins he could very easily score 100+ runs.
JT Realmuto was the best hitting catcher in baseball with next to No One around him, and will look outstanding hitting in front of or behind Harper. Rhys Hoskins is a great #5 bat at a .245/.355/.500 split with 35+ HR and 2B pop.
Cesar Hernandez had a bit of a down year last year but his OBP over the last 3 years is a very solid .366 and he’ll likely hit at the back end of the order. McCutchen is on the back end of his career but he still gets on base at a .365 clip, packs pop, and runs the bases well.
Maikel Franco is one of their weaker hitters and he still has an atttactive ceiling. Nick Pivetta is primed to turn the corner into at least a great #3. And their bullpen has a collection of solid arms that could certainly see them through the end of the season.
Let’s not get too out of hand Hernandez and Franco are meh… but yeah Phillies have top 3 lineup in NL
They didn’t overpay at all on an annual basis. I agree that 13 years is too many.
Okay I’m not sure that a guy who roots for the team still paying Bobby Bonilla gets to criticize any other teams signings until they’re done paying BobbyBo. Which for the record doesn’t happen until 2035 – when Bonilla will be 72 years old. In that light paying Harper through age 39 doesnt sound so bad now does it?
grab em both and win the division
They’ll finish in 3rd again!
They might. This division is fantastic.
Hard to say fantastic when you have the Marlins. Plus, no team expected to win more than in the low 90s.
I’d call it good, and very competitive.
LOL, Yeah, you keep praying for that 3rd place finish GIMP…hahahahahaha
dimitrios in la
Grabbing both doesn’t guarantee much.
If possible both on 3-4 year deals give them legit odds to win one World Series is next 4 years with what they’ve done in one offseason
You laugh out loud like the fool you are because you know it to be true. I know this because you have only laughed and didn’t provide an argument for why you believe that’s a laughable prediction.
You fool (x
Don’t need more than an LOL. You really think the Phillies current team is going to win them a chip in the next 4 years? Ok. Prove it. On paper it’s not looking good…
this analysis is coming from a giants fan. to win a world series you need 2 stud playoff pitchers. nola is 1. arrieta can be 2 but they may need to hit their way to win in games nola doesnt pitch. you need a GREAT bullpen (top 5) and phillies probably dont have that. you need a solid manager and im not sure phillies really have that either. you need timely hitting and luck and with this lineup its kind of tough to predict that because not many of them have much playoff experience. i think they are a near lock to make final 5 every year but i dont see them getting past divisional round against a more formidable opponent. imagine them up against a dodgers team with kershaw and buehrle or the nats with scherze and strasburg/corbin. what about if any NL playoff team adds degrom or syndeergaard, that would trump the phillies as well. keuchel wont put phillies over the top but one of those mets pitchers definitely would
I remember the last time the Phillies went all the way no one expected us to do it. Everyone talked about the Cubs, Brewers, and Dodgers. Considering your name you may still be salty.
Are you kidding Dodgethis, or are you just upset that your team came close and couldn’t finish the deal? Right now the Phillies are the FAVORITE to win the NL at 4-1 ahead of your Dodgers who are 4.5 to 1 and the Phils are 8-1 to win the World Series only behind the Red Sox, Yankees and Astros, and you’re acting like they have no chance to win one in the next four years.
Oh and by the way, he wasn’t even saying the current team, he was saying if they sign Keuchel and Kimbrel, but I guess you can’t read.
The short bus must be fun
Philliephan his team can’t deliver. 6-14 in the World Series, and three consecutive NLCS losses to the Phillies and many more to come. Last championship 30, yes 30 years ago. Its the almost Dodgers. LOSERS
94yankees, You should know, your it’s favorite window licker.
@PhilliePhan Dunno where you’re getting your odds, maybe local? Vegas Insider has MLB 2019 futures listed and as of 12pm PST Mar. 1, 2019, NL Pennant 2019 odds had Dodgers at 4:1, Phil’s at 4.5:1, Cubs, Cards, Nats follow.
World Series 2019 odds show Yankees 6:1, Red Sox & Astros 7:1, Dodgers 8:1, Phils & Cubs 10:1.
That’s what one Vegas site has.
Lines are going to vary from place to place, however even at 10-1 my point still stands. The guy was an idiot for thinking the Phils can’t win a World Series in the next 3-4 years. I would say the same thing if he said this about the Cubs who are also 10–1.
That’s completely valid right there. I’d love it.
Philadelphia used a play right out of the Dodgers play book. And that play has gone nowhere. If we can’t win a W/S. Let’s buy one.
They have very little commitments that are monitary compared to other teams. They have a lot of above average players that are home grown. Nola, Hoskins, Herrera, Franco, and Hernandez. Then ones that they traded for, Segura, Realmuto. Eickhoff.
I don’t think they are done yet, but they have made some good moves.
Phillies won a World Series with a similar type approach. I’m giving them the nod for the NL Pennant this year.
Herrera isn’t “home grown”. He was a Rule 5 pick from the Rangers.
The Dodgers could have done it if Kershaw didn’t have about a 4.00 postseason ERA, they had a good bullpen that didn’t choke, and their manager didn’t keep making stupid decisions.
Astros would be interested in Kuechel if he were to consider a shorter term deal. I assume 3 years is considered “short term”, right?
The Astros are not going to resign Keuchel.
If he will take 3/42-45 they will. I don’t see his market paying much more than that or offering more than maybe 4 years either. I still predict the Braves at 4/65, but he could just as easily end up back in Houston if it’s only 3 years.
I would like to see Craig Kimbrel with the Phillies. But, they should sign a starting pitcher to strengthen their rotation and I am not saying to go and sign Keuchel. Probably, another starting pitcher like Edwin Jackson or any other pitcher who can contribute.
I definitely agree with you.
Agreed, Gio one year $5 million
Even Gio might be a good fit.
Boras screwed Keuchel when Boras devoted all attention toward helping Bryce. Now I like Keuchel for a Red, Twin or Angel, maybe 3/66, 4/75, or 5/80.
I could see him in Cincinnati or Minnesota, but not at those AAVs. He and Boras overplayed their hand, no one is paying him that much per year.
@astrosfan4life – did you copy/paste the last sentence from last weeks bryce harper thread? because I think many said that same thing about him
I think the Twins make the most sense of those 3 teams, but I agree with Astro that it will be for less money. Probably 3 years.
Normally, I’d say the Twins are an extreme long shot, but considering how they’ve shown a willingness to sign players, then cut them in favor of the next shiny object under Falvey and Levine, anything is possible.
The biggest problem is Kimbrel isn’t dumpster diving so the Twins would be completely out of their element.
Yeah, you think Boras is the only guy working at the Boras Corp? You think teams didn’t know Dallas Keuchel was out there? No one wants him at his inital asking price. Plain and simple.
The Philly’s inked Papalbon from the Bosox, n how did that turn out? I wish Kimberly the best, he’s a good guy, n I wish he’d stay in Boston, but that can’t be this yr. They needed Eovaldi more.
Pap was actually pretty solid for Philly, but the Phillies were on the downward spiral for those years.
Philadelphia just spent its money on one guy. May want to check the bargain barn for worn out ball players.
give it a rest……jealousy isn’t becoming..Phillies have tons of cash
I think both Pivetta and Eflin take a step forward – I say either Keuchel or wait until trade deadline – see what the young guys do – Gio is toast
Edwin….no, absolutely not this 13-team, once-Redbird retread!
Keuchel, well, if the Phils are really ready to go all in as paying BH till he’s 39 seems to say, hell yeah!
I think it’s interesting (and certainly okay by me) that BH stays in the NL East. I foresee myself making a daily comparison of Goldie’s and Harper’s exploits. Go Cards!!!
Phillies won’t get neither one of them. Their price is to high.
That’s a double negative. They won’t get either is what you meant. It’s probably true as well.
I think the Phillies package Nick Williams and a couple prospects and pry Kluber, Carrasco or Bauer from the Tribe..
Well, the Tribe could use an outfielder, for sure. However, IIRC Carrasco likes Cleveland and agreed to a team friendly deal so they would keep him, and Bauer/Kluber would cost Williams, and probably 3 of the Phillies top 5 – 10 prospects. Maybe more.
I agree, but once you’ve burned through $330,000,000 on one guy, may as well push your chips to the center of the table…
Yes 330 million but only 25 million per year 10 million less per year than Miguel Cabrera. Offer Keuchel & Kimbrel 3 years 60 million & bam, World Series Contention all 3 years!
2019 Phillies look like 2015 Padres. If they sign Keuchel, then the resemblance grows stronger because Keuchel is so similar to young Shields.
They look nothing like that Padres team that cobbled together Matt Kemp, Craig Kimbrel, Justin Upton, and James shields while unloading all their prospects. The Phillies got better talent and gave up less in prospect capital. They also won’t reverse course in a year.
I wouldn’t even mind them going after a lesser quality guy like Cobb or Duffy to maybe get them real cheap and possibly have the teams eat some cash. Both are on 3 more years I believe at 14 per. I like Duffy more as the 3.
I’d actually see if the orioles are interested in moving Bundy
Cobb-age 31-4.90 ERA, 1.41 WHIP, 1.4 HR/9, 2.5 BB/9, 6.0 K/9
Duffy- 30 – 4.88 ERA, 1.49 WHIP, 1.3 HR/9, 4.1 BB/9, 8.2 K/9
Bundy-26- 5.45 ERA, 1.41 WHIP, 2.1 HR/9, 2.8 BB/9, 9.6 K/9
Velasquez-26- 4.85 ERA, 1.34 WHIP, 1.0 HR/9, 3.6 BB/9, 9.9 K/9
I like Velasquez best out of the 4. Lowest era, whip, hr/9 and best k rate. Plus he showed improvement last year and the other 3 regressed.
You’re forgetting something very important when you posted all those numbers. Cobb and Bundy pitched in the ALE at Orioles park but I’ll forget about that for now. Velasquez made 30 starts and pitched 146 innings. That doesn’t cut it. His numbers were favorable but when you’re pitching 4 innings a start what is that worth? As bad as Cobb was in the first half he was getting much deeper in games. I’m not advocating the phils to go for either considering the cash owed to Cobb and the ineffectiveness of Bundy but Velasquez isn’t much of an option for the rotation.
Look more at them being bounce backs. Duffy and Cobb were pretty bad last year but we’re good the year before with pretty good seasons prior as well.
Bundy, I think, has the most potential.
My concern with all of them more is availability. They don’t pitch that many innings and have injury concerns.
VV has good stuff but he’s just so unreliable too. I actually, right now, like Pivetta as the 3rd guy.
I still think Velasquez has the most upside of any of those guys given his pure stuff and his age. I agree though he needs to be more consistent and get deeper into games if he wants to be a starter. I suspect if he gets the chance this season it will be his last unless he can prove he belongs in the rotation. Vince doesn’t play in a pitchers park either but AL East is more favorable for hitters than NL East so ya got me there.
I’ve been a velasquez fan since he came up in Houston but there were rumblings then that he wasn’t going to cut it as a starter. I’m fully on board with that now. I think he has the potential to be a dominant reliever though. Maybe even a mult-inning guy down there a la Chad Green. That’s extremely valuable if he can do that.
No chance a package built around Williams would land Kluber or Bauer. High strikeout, low walk, 15-20 HR guys are easily found every off-season. Cleveland would only trade one of those guys for a massive haul, and an average OF guy and “some prospects” wouldn’t get it done.
Not enough value, maybe Nick Williams could get Will Smith or Tony Watson from Giants.
My idea is Williams and Eflin for Bauer. Not sure if Cleveland would want to do it, but I think it makes sense for them.
Explain how that makes sense for the Indians. Williams does not make up even half of the difference between Bauer and Eflin. That trade would make the Indians worse not better. A trade should make both teams better. This one does not. Seriously, PhilliePhan, how does this make Cleveland better?
Fair point, I’m probably overvaluing my hometown players. Also, the Indians are in win now mode, so betting on 2 young players and giving up a sure thing is probably not the best idea. Right it off to my Harper adrenaline yesterday.
We all do that, but you also need to see the remaining FAs to realize that the Tribe could get a similar guy to Williams on the free market. The cost then would only be cash, not an elite (or near elite) starting pitcher.
I agree Astros. I’m actually more upset at myself for typing right it off instead of write it off. Geez I’m getting old.
MLBTR predicted 4 yrs and $82MM for Keuchel:
I suspect that if he would have been agreeable to that he would be signed already.
Reports had him asking for 5/125. He’s still a good pitcher and can probably eat some innings, but Boras probably overplayed his hand in this one.
But we’ll see – he just got harper 330MM.
Truthfully I don’t see a team giving him 4/82. I think a 3/60-65 is what he goes for unless he wants a shorter deal and try again. The more camp he misses the less inclined I’d be to give him the money. No one looked good in the first half who missed St last year. If I’m paying Keuchel 20MM a year I want him in camp right now.
“It should be noted, too, that”
Why can’t MLBTR writers just say “it should also be noted”? This is shoddy English.
“Why” shouldn’t be capitalized, as it is not starting a sentence, nor is it a proper noun. This is shoddily written grammar trolling.
Its clearly starting the sentence as the quoted sentence is complete. Nice try.
No it’s not. There’s no punctation, idiot.
What’s sad is people thinking people care about punctuation on a baseball board.
an’ muts phans no grammer? yu no how mani muts phans cum to filly an’ speek in they’re silli new york akcents.
an dey alvaez axe us wheir to git the bestus cheezstake.
I think every contending team in need of pitching would be interested in Keuchel & Kimbrel if they took shorter term deals.
Both make sense for the Phillies but Kimbrel is probably more ideal because a deep bullpen can protect the back half of the rotation. Much to the kutch’s point, the Phillies best options for starting pitching is through the trade market. With Harper signed, they have a glut of outfielders including Nick Williams now their 4th outfielder, two of their last three first round picks are AA or AAA outfielders, and Dylan Cozens has had a fantastic spring so far and has cut down his swing and strikeouts. It makes sense to trade from their depth for a starter.
Nick williams can be the start of a package but I don’t know if there’s that #1-#2 starter (preferably left handed) on the trade market. It doesn’t seem the Cubs want to dump Lester, Quintana, or Hamels; the Indians with their other moves created flexibility to keep all 3 of their pitchers around. Teams like the Jays aren’t going to want to sell low on Sanchez or Stroman. It’ll take something creative for the Phillies to bring in a top of the rotation arm.
The Tribe are in a desperate way for OF, that’s why I see them as a viable dance partner…
Kutch, you have to be crazy to think that a fourth outfielder and prospects are going to get Kluber or Bauer. All during the off season it was stated that they would have to be overwhelmed to trade a pitcher. Does Nick Williams and prosepcts from a depleted system sound overwhelming? It does not to me.
It’s funny how homer-ish these people are over a 4th outfielder. Williams is a starter on maybe 5-7 teams in MLB. Cleveland would take no less than a PROVEN stud, or an elite level prospect for one of their elite or near-elite SPs.
I think Wiliams could start on 10 to 12 teams, but I basically agree with you, he is not a chip for Kluber or Bauer, at best a chip for a Will Smith or Tony Watson from Giants.
The one thing everyone seems to be overlooking, the Tribe WANTS to deal one of those three, in a salary dump….Williams would start right now, maybe get lucky with another prospect, and take a lot of $$$ off their books…
Kutch, the Tribe has already made a few trades over the summer. Those trades helped the Indians save the needed money. THEY DO NOT NEED to trade a pitcher anymore in a salary dump. They have stated a deal that they would only deal a pitcher if OVERWHELMED by the offer. It has also been widely reported that they are no longer likely to trade a pitcher. Williams and prospects is very underwhelming and does not help the Indians in any way.
You may be right, but I know the Tribe, and a salary dump wouldn’t surprise me….wonder if Harper took a lower AAV to enable the Phillies to make a run at Kris Bryant???
Kutch that’s just idiotic. Let’s pretend the Indians had to trade one of their slalaries because they were broke. It wouldn’t matter. They don’t need to salary dump either Kluber or Bauer because both of them are playing on severely under market deals. They have so much surplus value that they’ll receive multiple top prospects without eating a penny if that’s the route they want to go. Nick Williams isn’t going to fetch you anything. He’s a bat first corner outfielder who sucks defensively and has a terrible K/BB ratio. If you were to start a package with Nick Williams you’re going to get back a 4th or 5th starter on a ST contract. A Tanner Roark type. Live in reality for a second.
Kutch, you know the Tribe. That is a laugh. If you knew the Tribe you would have known about Carrasco’s team friendly deal and that he was not going to be traded. Stop being a know-it-all because you know little.
Jbig and hockey guy…I’m no know it all, I know that…..the Tribe were dangling their Big 3 earlier this off season, and now, here’s a team with a surplus of OF’s and maybe they’ll take a phone call and listen to an offer….just because Cookie signed a team friendly deal, doesn’t mean he won’t be dealt….that makes him an even more attractive piece to be dealt, like Odubel Herrera and Scott Kingery, who have team friendly contracts….one thing I do know, is you never know….
The Indians are trying to compete for years carrascos team friendly deal all but assures he’ll be there. Bauer is the financial problem for them as his salary will balloon in arb next year and then he’ll be gone. That’s the guy they’d probably move. Certainly not Carrasco. If you were to trade Kingery and Herrera you’d be doing so while their respective values are in the toilet. Thats just not enough. For the Indians to make that deal they need to get a guy who will either impact the major league team right now in a fairly big way. (Kingery and Herrera are huge question marks) or get top prospects back.
Kingery has very little value at this point in time. I don’t think the Phillies did him any favors playing him all over the diamond as he was transitioning to the big leagues. But he’s owed guaranteed money and he was terrible. Completely lost at the plate. I don’t see why the Phillies would sell him that low unless they’ve completely soured on him. It just wouldn’t make any sense.
The idea of Carrasco’s extension with the Indians was to KEEP him an Indian. That was Carrasco’s motivation to take the contract. There was an understanding that they would not trade him. His contract is a big advantage to a small market team and there would be no way they would trade him. A trade of Kluber or Bauer would need to include a stud outfielder. Williams, as you proposed, as well as Kingery and Herrera are not stud outfielders Why don’t you give up while you are behind.
Keuchel- 2 years 40 million with a vesting 3rd year player option that can push the deal to 60 million.
If that was acceptable he would have already signed. Almost every team would take him on that deal. He will get at least 4 years and probably is pushing to get 5 with a higher AAv then 20. More like 4/90
I don’t think there’s any chance Keuchel gets 90 million bucks at this point in time. There’s only a handful teams in on him. I think he either settles for less cash or takes a high AAV ST deal at this point
No way he gets that now. We’re too deep into ST. I’m guessing closer to 3/45 to 3/60. Probably should have taken whatever offers he had earlier in the off-season.
Maybe 2/45. JA Happ got himself 2/36 and Keuchel is at least a comp there. I can’t see his market cratering that low.
Philly has had a great off-season…but so has Washington and New York. Atlanta virtually stood pat outside of Donaldson and Markakis resigning….
Kuechel would really put Philly over the top in my opinion. After Nola, that rotation is average at best.
good ol’ Braves standing pat
How to stand pat and hopefully hang another division pennant with no hopes in the playoffs –your ATL Braves
How to make life exciting for your fans and show them you’re all in for them –your division opponents
We like being mediocre, beating up on bottom dwellers, and not being prepared when our rebuild hits its fruition earlier than anticipated. We don’t like to take gambles on older proven starters in case of injuries anymore and we don’t like to go for the throat when it’s within arm’s reach..
We say we have all this money coming off the books and spend it foolishly in areas of non-needs. We get our fan base all excited for an amazing offseason and spit in their faces while 3/5 of the rotation is now questionable and the 2 said reliable options left are jekly and Hyde pitchers which can’t ever be relied upon.
There’s always 2022.
As of right now.. this is how i see the NL EAST playing out…it wi be a struggle to win 90 in this division when 4 teams are going to be beating the piss out of each other…but here it goes….
1. Nationals 94-68
2. Mets 91-71
3. Phillies 88-74
4. Braves 84-78
5. Marlins 63-99
Those are the other post season contenders
Cincinnati will finish over .500 and i think that the D-Backs will be a surprise and also win 81-84 games
National league will be interesting…
American league…not so much…
Yankees…Red Sox…Indians…Astros are all playoff locks…the Rays are front runners for wild card #2…
Maybe the Twins can sneak in (sign Kuechel and i feel they jump the Rays..they had a quietly good off season imo) Angels have really tiny chance aling with Oakland who is due for a little regression. But the NL will be much more suspenseful..
No doubt about it
I agree with Nationals as front-runners but Soto and Robles have to play like Soto did last year, no guarantees. Corbin due to regress a little. Phillies likely to win 90 even with weak rotation. Nola is a # 1, Arrieta is a #2, rest are scrubs.
Dodgers get Seager back but Kershaw seems like a Hall of Famer near the end of his career.
Cubs still look good, sub Arrieta for Darvish last year and they might have been in WS. Cubs and Cardinals likely to make playoffs.
Brewers very good but right now, I count them, Atlanta and Rockies as good teams just missing the playoffs.
Division winners Washington, Chicago, LA; wildcards St. Louis and Philadelphia. All five teams will win 92 to 95 games each. Acuna will be MVP.
Current Odds to win the National League
The Phillies might have been better off spending the annual $$ they sent to Harper to get. Keuchel and kimbrel. Bryce has been in the NL east all of his career on teams with much better pitching then what philly currently has and yet they never even got out of the divisional round…
Did they really though? Outside the rotation the Nats didn’t have greatness. The bullpen was always unreliable, they had Rendon but a tail end Wertb, inconsistent Zimmerman and a bunch of oft injured guys mixed in. Murphy was good for a little but it never seemed they had an offense that clicked altogether or were healthy all at the same time.
So this isn’t another Harper thread so I’ll try to keep it from becoming one, but let’s be honest, does anyone think that if the bats really wanted him back they would let an additional 30 mil stand in the way when your already talking about 300? That should say everything anyone needs to know about Harper.
As for the original topic, Phillies are incomplete; I see them as 3rd in division unless they seriously get some pitching help. Injuries to rivals can obvi factor into but assuming health I still have them as 3…
the phillies had one of the top rotation in the league last and improve the bullpen big time this year, our pitching is better then people think
It was a lot of deferred money which Harper didn’t want, supposedly. With deferring that money they probably weren’t interested in going a dime more because of that.
I also feel they think cheaper Soto, Robles, and Eaton could get close to the same production off of dollars. This isn’t a terrible thought.
I too also think the Phillies are incomplete but I think the lineup is just as good as anything he had in Washington and the BP is better than anything he had in Washington. The rotation is the only thing worse.
Better in year 1 yes, but Harper will still be good in five years and the two pitchers will not.
They should offer Keuchel & Kimbrel 3 years 60 million each & see if they bite because they would be in contention all 3 years & 60 million is nothing to sneeze at!
I think if either was willing to take that kind of deal, they’d already be signed.
Get Gio and Kimbrel and call it an offseason. Trade for Bumgarner at the deadline.
Meanwhile, the Braves have injured arms, bottom 10 rotation, and an expensive third baseman who is relearning how to run and slide.
Must be great!
division repeats lol !
Acuna will be MVP but yes Braves need two more starters. Braves need Keuchel do not need Kimbrel.
I think Keuchel may make the most sense in Atlanta.
Yes; yes indeed.
Acuna can also be a bust and a perfect example of prospects being overrated until proven otherwise aka Jason Heyward.
It’s a testament to his dedication that Adams is still at his keyboard tracking MLB amidst all this great local hockey action tonight.
Go get Dallas
What makes Philadelphia think that they are going to win a W/S now. That’s all I have been reading. Don’t count your chickens until they hatch. Wait until September before you toot your horn.
4-1 to win the NL right now. Slightly better odds than your Dodgers. GET EXCITED!!!!!
If somehow the Phillies ended up with one or both and the braves don’t get either (or even worse, do nothing to improve that bullpen)…. I will lose my freaking mind
The Braves have been really quiet this winter.
ummm every winter
I lost mine and had to go to radio I guess.
You don’t win games in the hot stove league.
Having been through this in the past with other Philadelphia ownerships, I both sympathize and agree with you Bravesfan. They could use both Keuchel and Kimbrel and if the ownership doesn’t get at least one of them they should be lambasted. Even more so because the prices have got to drop on these two.
But, on the bright side, the Braves organization is doing wonderful things in the real estate market with the Baseball money,lol
Glad the Yankees stayed away!!
RyÅn W Krol
The photo used makes me wonder why he hasn’t had Tommy John Surgery. The common denominator in mechanics for TJ pitchers is that arm angle not being upright by the time foot contact is made when delivering the pitch.
The upside down W right? Dude throws absolute gas and always has so it is pretty surprising.
I believe you mean an “M”…
What is this “M” you speak of?
It seems to make a lot of sense for them to offer a high one or two year contract to one of them at this point. This year Harper is making $10mm towards the payroll, so that’s a lot of wiggle room left for this season before his higher salary kicks in next year. So it would seem the Phillies put themselves in a good position for that kind of one year deal. Not saying either of these pitchers are interested in a one year deal, I’m just saying it could make sense given the way Harpers deal was structured
Meanwhile the Braves offseason summed up in one picture:
“How would you like your burger?”
“Plain and well done, I work for liberty media so I’m cheap and boring.”
Pretty much every angel fan is pulling for the Phillies to snag both or at least one for a deal of 3 or more years.. in fact theres already a thought that they’re already out on Trout
In what world does this mean the Phillies are “out in Trout”??? That’s just laughable. Where are you getting this nonsense?
Uh.. NO. Their contractual commitments are now $85M in 2020 with the Harper signing.
RHP for DAYS. Need to get a lefty in there at least one that isn’t 2 years at least away from the Majors (JoJ0). https://www.rosterresource.com/mlb-philadelphia-phillies/
Tab Keuchel or trade for a lefty like MadBum or Robbie Ray.
Looks like drafting all of those outfielders in the 1st round was necessary?
Nick Williams and Roman Quinn mid-season for MadBum. Maybe.
Maybe if his ERA is mid to high 4’s. Anything in the 3’s to low 4’s and they could still get a top 50 prospect, even if only based on historical value.
Good point, I am thinking era will be about 4.00, so maybe Williams or Quinn and add in Moniak.
If you want to give up 2 top prospects for Bumgarner, the Giants will listen. They don’t want to trade Bumgarner. The Giants have always wanted to put a competitive team on the field and develop players at the same time. The Giants don’t rebuild.
At the deadline, I think the Giants will do whatever MadBum wants. He is an icon. If he wants to play for a contender, they will be happy to nab a couple players. But they are also happy to let him play out the season. I typically root for the Cubs and Dodgers, but if I was vote for the most impressive post season player over the past 50 years, it would be MadBum not Mariano or Jeter. who would be the runners up.
Have to think the desire for a short term deal is to have the flexibility to make a run at Trout if he reaches free agency.
The 2019 Wentz, Trout, and Harper hunting trip is already under works. No tampering.
Sign them both to two year deals, wait until all the prospects are fully ready and then when their contracts are up, sign trout. Easy plan that will not fail
Failed logic. You know every publication on Earth will have Trout in pinstripes or bean town, haha.
Keuchel would slot in their 3 spot in the rotation quite nicely.
And Kimbrel-Robertson-Dominguez would keep alot of leads after the 7th secure.
That funny moment when the Phillies don’t want to fix the middle of the bullpen and only want a proven closer or a Cy Young winning starting pitcher on short contracts but give Harper 13 years LOL
They have more bullpen arms then slots.Kimbrel is the only bullpen addition they should even consider at this point.
With all the injuries, the Braves have to get Keuchel, no? Anthopoulos has to keep a solid rotation if Atlanta is compete for the division crown again.
Modest signings of Keuchel and Gio could be the difference for the Braves of first versus third.
They still won’t be able to beat the Braves.
Is all the stupid money gone?
Just my opinion but I can’t/don’t see either Keuchel or Kimbrel getting any more than a 3 yr deal. Probably no more than $20M AAV for Keuchel and $17M AAV for Kimbrel. We’ll see but the longer they go unsigned the worse it is for them especially Keuchel.
When you give someone a 13 year contract. Isn’t a 5 year deal a short-term deal in comparison?
Phillies upgraded seriously at catcher. Right field they are paying WAY too much for, but may work out for the short term. Cutch cost WAY too much and probably will make the Phillies regret that signing, but who knows. I look for the race to be between the Nats, Phillies, and Braves. The Phillies pitching is their biggest question mark. Same for the Braves. Hitter wise I think the 3 teams are about the same, maybe a slight edge to the Phills. Mets and Nats about equal on pitching as long as they stay healthy. Can’t wait to see how the division plays out through the season! Go Braves!
Phils need another starter. Forget about Kimbrel. The division depends upon which team stays healthiest. Phils have a good shot to win this division, lesser chance to win the NL. Let’s see who they add along the way.
Would Philadelphia be a good fit for Marcus Stroman?
Keuchel yes. Move Vasquez to the pen. Kimbrel no. He’s on the down side.
Nice job by MLBTR to get rid of the down votes..They held no value..
Now, the Phillies need to move one or two outfielders..Nick Williams seems the most likely to be at least one of them..If the Phils are looking to get something of value back, Nick cannot be the top of the trade piece..they must add others depending on what they are looking for.
Right now, they have 4 left handed outfielder with Harper, Goofy, Williams, and Cozens..I would not be surprised to see Two of them gone..I would have guessed Goofy, but Quinn is hurt again..sad he can’t stay on the field, because he has so much talent.
Phillies should bring back Madson.
Respectfully, Dodgers fans everywhere will start a gofundme to help the Phillies sign Madson, so long as they get a guarantee that Madson will be on your post-season roster. He was just awful in the 2018 post-season. I give Roberts a B- as a manager and had he stopped using Madson sooner he would have been a B+
Keuchel w/ Boras will cost too much