At least one leg of the Mookie Betts marathon trade has fallen through. The Dodgers and Angels will not complete their previously agreed upon deal, per The Athletic’s Ken Rosenthal. The nails of the deal would have sent Joc Pederson , Ross Stripling and prospect Andy Pages to the Angels in exchange for Luis Rengifo.
Angels owner Arte Moreno was reportedly unhappy with the delay of the original deal, but it’s unclear if that’s the driving factor in the breakdown of this deal. Per MLB Network’s Jon Heyman, the terms of the original deal were dependent upon the original Betts trade. The final iteration of the deal that landed Betts in Los Angeles made this subsequent trade “unnecessary.” It’s entirely unclear at this time if the Dodgers or Angels are putting the kibosh on the deal at this stage, per Rosenthal.
It doesn’t make a lot of intuitive sense that the newest iteration of the Betts trade would make the Pederson leg moot. The new trade actually sends an additional outfielder to the Dodgers (Luke Raley from Minnesota), as well as an additional pitcher in Brusdar Graterol who could fill much the same role that Stripling has in years past. They are also sending money to Minnesota, which would presumably encourage the egress of player payroll in the form of Pederson and/or Stripling. With Betts, Cody Bellinger, and some collection of A.J. Pollock, Chris Taylor, Matt Beaty and Enrique Hernandez on hand to man the outfield (before dipping into their depth in Triple-A), Pederson certainly represents a moveable piece.
He should be an attractive trade chip at that, given his affordable $7.75MM expiring contract this season and ~127 wRC+ over the past two seasons. The Dodgers shouldn’t struggle to find a trade partner for Stripling either, should they reengage on that front. Stripling is owed just $2.1MM this season and he’s controllable for another two beyond. The Dodgers have been able to somewhat protect the 30-year-old because of their depth, but he has nonetheless put up solid numbers: 3.51 ERA/3.60 FIP across 387 innings over the past four seasons with an All-Star appearance to his credit. It certainly makes sense for somebody to give Stripling the opportunity to start full-time, should the Dodgers look to move him again.
Lolz Rag Sox strike again!
The cardinals should try to acquire Joc. We need a LH power bat, especially with the NL DH coming soon.
Would love to see Joc on the A’s as well. We need another lefty masher in the lineup. Outfield is crowded as is though.
Piscotty to Boston, Joc to Oakland, Chavis to LAD fits all sides
Red Sox laugh and hang up
No thanks says Boston.
you think they will trade chavis?
It should be Strike 2 and You’re out for that ridiculous trade proposal.
Chavis? LOL? Are you serious? Dodgers have zero interest or need for him
Everyone is laughing at Boston, trade an mvp for no one, good trade
GMs live in a small world. From now on, they’ll understand exactly how Boston does business.
TLDR
nope just laughing at you
You think a new GM who pulled this is going to be respected? I guess you also think the Red Sox are not going to be punished for cheating.
Literally everyone is laughing at Boston right now. They trade a top 5 player in the league for what?
Joc comes home to the Bay Area!
@nine Then why didn;t you go after Kole Cahoun? It is not a huge difference between the two.
I hope you’re joking
What does that mean acronym guru?
Yeah those 35 homers are a real burden for a team to carry. Idiot!
That deal sucks for Boston.
One year of Betts, with the possibility of resigning him after one year for at least 5 years of control for 2 very good young players is a bad move? Clearly you do not know how to run a baseball team.
He’s a platoon player. The A’s aren’t paying $8 m for one of those and as you rightly point out, we’re stacked in the outfield and I don’t actually see this move as an upgrade.
No you’re wrong. The Red Sox got a case of brand new baseballs in the deal. Baseballs can be mighty expensive nowadays.
I find it amusing that you think that the Cardinals front office is going to do something.
What exactly should they do? There’s no moves to make.
are you 13 years old or have you been a baseball fanatic for 13 years?
Why does everyone seem to think that GMs are posturing for the coming NL DH? That’s not close. It would be foolish to plan on it now.
Dumb comment to start.
Joc is a FA after the season. So what’s the point of acquiring him for 2020?
That would be awesome if the Cardinals got him!!
I’m he’s a free agent after the year and the dh is two years away
There goes any chance of the Angels making the playoffs.
Why, because they didn’t land Stripling, a back of the rotation starter. The Angels didn’t want Pederson. They are probably better off without him.
The Angels “didn’t want Pederson”? I would love to hear about your insider that said that. Can you tell us other things about the Angels that hasn’t made the news cycle yet? I’m riveted..
Right, the Angels want a left-handed platoon outfielder who is going to block Adell? That’s not what they need.
Five million is not chump change, but that would have been the difference between Calhoun and Pederson, They didn’t want Pederson, they wanted Stripling.
Last I checked there will be no DH in the NL in 2020. So trading for a guy with only 2020 left on his contract makes zero sense in regards to a “DH”, that may or may not be coming to the NL at some point in the future.
You do realize Joc is on a one year contract and there is no DH this year?
Renigfro should’ve never been let go by the Rays.
Renigfro Will be the Angels next shortstop probably next year he has all the tools to be a good little player The Cleavland Indians wanted iRenigfro in a trade with the Angels Why do you think the Dodgers wanted him they recognize talent
@StlSwifty that’s a ridiculous statement. Joc only has 1 year of control and the DH at the earliest wouldn’t show up in the NL until 2 years from now, if at all.
This is exactly what I have been hoping for. Pederson is a perfect platoon fit for O’Neal or Thomas. He hit all 36 hrs last year against right handed pitchers and the Cardinals said before the offseason they were looking for a left handed outfield bat.
so you are blaming the Sox for a trade between the dodgers and angels not happening now? come this is now ridiculous
so you are blaming the Sox for a trade between the dodgers and angels not happening now? come on this is now ridiculous
hi kooldud. i like red sox but neever hurd of rag sox. lol jus joshin u. all surius tho i think joc petersen is a good plaer. i like him lot. he has strong arm and strong hed on his sholders. i like him becus also he look like one of those player thet give bak to peeple like tony lerussa and thos dogs he give bak to.
A team like the Pirates should jump on this deal.
Frazier for Joc, Stripling & Int money.
Why would the Pirates want Joc? To make a run on the Reds and fourth in the division?
This guys never knows what he is talking about, Jim.
Why would LAD want Frazier? He’s got nowhere to play.
Why did they want Rengifo?
Rengifo is a a solid utility prospect with total control over.
Rengifo fills multiple roles when a player is injured or needs a day off. He switch hits. He can pinch run. He sprays the ball from line to line. In short, he exactly what you need when you’re a team like the Dodgers and are pretty set on your position players.
it was a Soft salary cap issue. Rengifo is an underrated prospect though with gap power and speed with ability to play ss and 2nd. He was 21 in the big leagues.
Don’t you mean run at the Cubs for 4th?
reds
cards
brewers
cubs
not sure if you have seen the reds team
Absolutely they should
The pirates are headed for a rebuild so that would do them little to no good.
Don’t you have to be good before you rebuild?
Joc is a free agent at the end of the season, why would a rebuilding club (or as they put it, “building”) trade for a rental piece?
To flip him at the deadline for prospects
@tomh Joc won’t be worth nearly as much at the deadline as he is now.
1. He will only have two months of control as opposed to a full season.
2. The acquiring team won’t be able to QO him.
No team would QO Joc. He’s making 7.75M this year, and the QO tag will be close to 19M next year. So, he’d take it from any team who offered it. I don’t think he’s a 19-20M/year player. You only QO a guy who you think is going to leave and you get the draft pick comp, or a guy who may/may not leave but is worth that much. He’s not that player.
No one is giving a platoon player a QO.
@giantsphan12 and Koamalu even if we don’t count the QO, there is still the issue of him losing 2/3 of his remaining club control.
We have a second baseman in Gavin Lux and SS in Corey Seager so I have no idea where Frazier would play! Plus I don’t know willing Dodgers would be to trade with Pirates!
Why? I get that the fit is odd but why wouldn’t they want to work with the Pirates?
KermitJagger the Pirates don’t have any players the Dodgers need!
Guys cut it with the pirates takes, nobody cares about them and they’re in no place to make any moves
Yes, WWoS has spoken. All pirates talk is now forsaken.
“unentirely unclear”
That means entirely clear, right?
My head hurts.
Whoops, looks like that got corrected. Thanks.
Angels found out Pederson is pregnant. Those medicals are TOUGH!!!
Lol
Lmao
LMFAO
that’s too bad. The angels would have been much improved with this deal.
Trade definitely would’ve helped the angels it’s the way the cookie crumble’s
I only like this trade idea so that they kick Houston down the road
Trade seems to good to be true for the Angels. Not a fan of the infielder that the Dodgers would get in a return.
yeah that’s probably why the dodger want him so badly because he sucks
I don’t see it as much of a improvement. Pederson is about the same as Calhoun. Pederson is more of an insurance place if Adell isn’t ready. Adell did not do so well in AAA but did amazing on Team USA and almost hit 400. The upside on Adell is much greater than Calhoun/Pederson. He is only 20 years old, so Pederson would be nice. as a “just in case”. The primary need for the Angels was pitching. Stripling is a good pitcher, but he is not a great pitcher. The trade would be nice but I don’t see it catapulting us over the Astros. The trade would be a mild improvement Verlander and Greinke are far superior to Stripling. We can compete for the wild card with the team we currently have. Other teams anticipated to compete for the wild card have questions as well.
Stripling would have been the only Angels starter with an ERA under 4. Get real.
Stripling is a loss. I would have loved to have him. But he would have also been the oldest pitcher on the Angels’ team and he’s never thrown more than 122 innings.
If Stripling would have been the difference, then the Angels must be very very close.
Except Ohtani, Teheran, and Canning. I like Stripling, but there is a reason he has never had more than 21 starts.
Pederson is about 1.2 WAR better than what we got from Kole the past 2 seasons. Kole is 32 years old. He is not going to maintain even that level in 2020. Pederson will be in his age 28 season in 2020. He shouldn’t decline.
Adell is a stud and he will be up at some time this season. Trading for Pederson would have made it possible for Jo to be the short side of the platoon when he first came up so that he could ease into the job. I’m ok with him doing the same thing with Goodwin. Would have still liked Pederson better than Goodwin. Stripling would have been a good 5th-6th starter.
No we are not going to overtake the Astros for 1st place. The trade would have given us just a few more wins and made us a solid contender for the WC instead of having just an outside chance. . .
i really dont get how this ever would ha happened. surely someone else would have had to have gone to LAD in this deal anyway.
It was a salary dump, lessens the over crowded outfield and the Angels also offered 2 other prospects at the time, Rengifo has quality MLB start time because of the injuries the Angels has last year.
This sucks.
Sounds like Moreno got a little butt hurt. It was contingent on Betts trade
*Bett hurt
Looks like Arte pulled the plug on this deal
You have no idea what happened. But Moreno is a man of integrity and he does get steamed when people break their word. He always has. It’s better than signing wife beaters and PED users. And of course he’s a lot better than what’s going on with the Astros and Red Sox.
Someone forgot how the angels are employing drug dealers as clubhouse attendants.
Didn’t forget. You think Moreno know about that? Had Moreno known, Skaggs would be alive.
The biggest difference between Moreno and other owners is there are owners that know they have people handing out pain killers.
Selective history is fun, huh ?
If you think Moreno know about that? I wish he did, if he had known, Skaggs would still be alive. He’s as responsible for that as Steinbrenner is for Domingo German.
However the Red Sox and Astros owners knew exactly what was going on in their clubhouse. And the Twins are aware they are signing PED users.
“Skaggs would still be alive.”
That’s pretty rough dude. Skaggs would have found his fix one way or another. You’re absolutely right that it never should have come from within, but blaming the org for his death is unfair.
Moreno would have done something about it. I was not the least bit happy how Moreno treated Hamilton, but Moreno doesn’t tolerate that stuff. If Moreno knew Skaggs was on opioids he would not have sat on his hands.
Moreno likes to win, but it’s not everything. He wont sell his soul.
Frazier is horrible and there is no need for him
Which Frazier? Adam? You might not need him but he is certainly not horrible.
So add in another prospect like Edwin Rios or Christian Santana or an intriguing prospect to the Angels so the deal gets completed.
Marlins and Orioles should jump in to acquire Pederson and Stripling as potential players to swap at trade deadline.
Neither team needs to be trading prospects for a rental like Pederson just to potentially flip for equal or lesser prospects in 5 months, unless one or both have monster years to substantially increase their trade value.
Pederson’s value can only go down, really, as a rental. Either he plays well and gets a similar return to whatever is given up for him or he doesn’t play well and nobody wants him.
Do you not understand the concept of a rebuild? The Orioles goal this season is to go 59-103, get a top 3 pick in the draft, not spend a lot of money doing it, and get a look at young players along the way. The Orioles are in no way planning on trading young players to the Dodgers for Pederson knowing that he’ll be worth less in july than he is right now. Pederson would enter into a crowded outfield with the team already planning on giving lots of playing time to Santander and Hays, and hopefully Diaz halfway through the season. It’s just not at all a feasible idea.
“Pederson and Stripling” love how you just blabber on about Joc. Great reading skills bud.
Dodgers are literally giving away both; you get something for pennies on the dollar and make 80 cents profit, still made a profit. Don’t know what market will be like come july but a rebuilding team taking on Joc with the intent of trading him in the event an injury or it’s a seller’s market happen is a worthwhile risk; walking away with 3 years of Stripling is icing on the cake.
Lmao. Joc isn’t going to prevent them from losing games. And he’s a 1 year rental.
They’re already giving up too much for Rengifo, unless the Angels were sending more players back.
They were sending 2 other prospects.
they were, two prospects.
Dodgers: “we no longer have a need for this trade.”
Angels: “OK throw in another prospect and you have a deal.”
Solid logic here junior.
The first statement by the Dodgers is illogical from the start. Are they employing the new six outfielder shift ?
Dodgers before- Betts and half of prices contract…..we need to move Joc to clear some $$$ and we have too many OFs.
Dodgers after- Betts and half of prices contract…..oh no we don’t need to trade joc and clear $$$ and we don’t have too many OFs.
Yeah makes sense. Really using the old noggin man.
plus they got an outfielder from Minny
Cleveland, Baltimore or Bluejays should be calling
Yup!
Cleveland already has something like 87 outfielders on the 40. No more, please.
They have 8 outfielders plus Bauers who is the back up at first.The surplus is that four of them are very capable centerfielders.Several teams need centerfielders so one of them is likely to be moved.
Indians have always liked Pederson and he would fit well as a platoon bat in right field.
Until Domingo Santana is signed,Pederson is a possibility and maybe still would be after that anyway.
Poor halos
I’m sure Joc is happy. Didn’t want to leave LA for Anaheim. That would be tough to get used to. Totally different people, climate, mannerisms, etc… nobody can compete with that damn mouse and his meddling sidekicks.
So, Joc wasn’t itching to go?
i laughed
Climate?? Where do think Anaheim is you rube?0
Oof, I think the joke that went over your head crashed straight into me, because that one hurt to see.
ouch… you are not bright
Check the batteries in your sarcasm meter, old ranger.
You won’t see Peterson in a dodger uniform this year
Wrong he said that he was excited to be able to play with Pujols who’s a good friend of his.
This trade made sense or the Dodgers other than dumping money IMO and I wasn’t happy about it at all so I’m glad it falls through. Sure the Dodgers will be looking to make another trade though.
Id be my bottom dollar Arte told them along with his public tirade that there was some dumb deadline or the deal was off. Fuming.
damn it, I wish I wasnt right.
Dodgers were getting hosed in this deal. Wise of them to back off.
Angels backed off not the Dodgers
They were definitely getting hosed.
Moreno’s ego is going to get in the way of the Angels improving they’re team. lol!
I wonder what got in the way of your spelling ability.
Joke answer: 3rd grade.
Real answer: Mixing up “they’re” and “their” isn’t a spelling error.
Grammar police everyone, be on your best behavior here!
When you insult a team’s owner, it’s probably wise to not make grammatical errors.
Moreno’s ego? Moreno actually expects people to keep their word.
Josh Hamilton. That’s the reply.
For better or for worse, Hamilton broke his word and Arte showed his disappointment.
I guess he had a problem with a player snorting cocaine at a strip show. His ex-wife had a problem with it as well.
“I guess he had a problem with a player snorting cocaine at a strip show. His ex-wife had a problem with it as well.”
Seems perfectly reasonable behaviour to me – what’s he supposed to snort? Pepper? Paint stripper?
Some of these owners seem awfully gnarly, and decent individuals like Luhnow, AJ Pointynose (you wouldn’t share a wrap with him) Hinch, Cora & Beltran are all out of the game as a result.
What next? Criticism of St Pete Rose?
What’s he support to snort? Is that suppose to be funny?
Don’t hire a recovering drug addict if you don’t want to take a chance on a relapse.
Don’t hire a recovering drug addict if you are going to discard him if he falls off the wagon.
I didn’t like the way Moreno treated Hamilton. But it’s who he is. He expects people to conduct themselves with a level of integrity.
I wish there was some balance, but I much prefer someone like him rather than someone who wins at all cost.
There is no doubt in my mind if he knew about Skaggs, Skaggs would still be alive.
I mean, why else would Pujols be penciled into the lineup regularly
I mean, why else would Pujols be penciled into the lineup regularly
Billy job is in danger next year
LMAO. No. Billy has done a great job considering what he was handed by diPoto.
If the Angels don’t get a wild card spot in 2020 Jerry should be worried.
Jerry is worried. Worried that the Mariners will suck even worse than they did last year.
Since he took over for the 2016 season, Billy has rebuilt an empty farm system and a team saddled with older players and dead or over priced contracts like Hamilton, Wilson, Weaver, Aybar, and Smith and turned it into one of the younger teams in the AL filled with promising players built around a core of Trout and Rendon. Maybe if they don’t contend in 2021 he will worry, but right now Billy has no worries about his job.
Oof. Brain fart. Meant to say Billy. But you were fully aware of that.
Also fully aware that Billy has nothing to worry about after 2020. Maybe after 2021 if they don’t contend then. Arte is a smart man and he realizes that the Astros, Yankees, and Twins will win their divisions and that most tams don’t go from 72 wins to 100 wins over night. Billy will be back in 2021.
Well no one is expecting them to win 100 games or beat the Astros. But if they don’t at least come close to a wild card spot I wouldn’t be so sure. They can only waste so much of Mike Trout’s prime.
Billy job is in danger next year
Obligatory lolAngels
So how many Championships have the A’s won this century? lolA’s.
Feel bad for Joc, he prolly would have liked to play with Pujols
At the same time, can’t imagine the Dodgers have Pollock, Taylor, Kike, Joc, Betts and Bellinger all by opening day
Luxury tax or Arte Moreno throwing a fit, there’s just not enough ABs to go around
Rays should trade Margot, Renfroe for him.
Because that’s just what the Dodgers need is more outfielders lol.
We have too many outfielders so let’s trade away one for two ?
Joc and Pollock platooning in left alongside Bellinger and Mookie? And a stellar infield, solid starters and a strenghened bullpen? Sign me up!
is that the liquor talking? way she goes i guess
Shout to the TPB references.
Yes sounds like another Division winner, playoff loser
Keep Joc and get someone to take Pollocks contract and give up a prospect
Rangers should be all over Pollock and send back a SP on their 40, like Brock Burke or Taylor Hearn.
No one wants Pollock and his overpriced contract.
Gidez1 no one wants Pollock injured to much and overpriced contract!
No one wants Price injured too much and overpriced contract!
Oh, wait.
Red Sox messed everything up
Sox have peed in the Dodgers cereal all weekend.
Maybe the cards swoop in and get joc?
Why in the world would we ever help StL???
If it’s a trade where the Dodgers get something in return that they want it’s not really helping st. Louis as it is helping themselves, which is why you make trades in the first place. Why would they not trade with st. Louis?
Think about it more
AGAVE what would Cardinals give Dodgers for Pederson! I don’t see anyone Cardinals have that Dodgers want!
Dodgers were willing to send both Pederson and Stripling plus a prospect to the Angels for Rengifo and 2 low level prospects.
The Dodger’s need to clear payroll and Pederson and Stripling was $10 million off the books for 2020.
What exactly do you think the Cardinals would have to give up?
I’d actually like to see the Indians try to acquire him, he would give a power bat in outfield
Why am I not shocked. Arte is the Nancy Pelosi of baseball: drunk 94.7% of the time, empowered, arrogant, rich and clueless at their job.
Well, Angels were a much better team with Joc and Stripling. Not so much now.
3rd place.
Arte is the poop in our cereal. The Angels will never sniff a WS title with this clown running the show.
I guess the Wilpons are Trump. From Queens and couldn’t manage a tee-ball team.
Zing!
dont forget theyre both broke and pathetic too
Really?
Arte just bought the land and owns the stadium, team and has a huge television contract, so no he’s not broke.
Trump and the wilpons
Trump fixed the economy and lowered unemployment but don’t let facts fetching the way of Liberal propaganda.
Economy and unemployment were fixed in 2010 by Obama. Paying farmers billions though was done by Trump. Man you Trumpers don’t even understand facts. But that’s why you voted for somebody who hates people who weren’t born rich.
Make MLBTR politics-free again !
The economy was hot when he got it. Now it’s being strong along by the fasting rising national debt in history. SAD!
@steven juris wasnt fixed by obama actually put us in a bigger definite hole once he took office That we had to climb out of. He also caused us “the middle class“ to pay highest taxes since clinton administration and receive less benefits for The mandatory “obamacare” we all had to pay for. Again the hole obama climbed out of just pushed us to where were before he was in office.
factcheck.org/2019/07/trumps-numbers-july-2019-upd…
lmfao
Clinton enacted a law that caused the banking crisis. Why don’t more people know that?
LMAO. Only people that are doing better today is the 1%. Glad I’m in it.
The rest of the economy is tanking. More people have had to take 2nd jobs than at any point except after Bush tanked the economy in 2008. Full time job growth is non-existent. Real wages are stagnant. The people that are doing better today are people like me that don’t have to have a job.
Farms are going bankrupt at a record pace. Great for me since my partners and I buy distressed farms at pennies on the dollar, but it has been caused 100% by Trump’s tariffs.
Manufacturing jobs are being lost at a record pace. $1 trillion dollar deficit means that taxes on someone has to go up to cover it, but my taxes have gone down so that means you will be the one paying more. Thank you! Social Security and Medicare are taken out of your paycheck every week and will continue to be, but your benefits are going to be reduced to pay for my tax cut. I thank you again.
Please, keep on voting for Trump and the GOP in the Senate. They have increased my wealth by 20% in 3 years and my kids will pay nothing to inherit my money. That my increase in wealth comes out of your pocket is all good by me. It’s even better that so many that are voting for them are not even aware that you are paying to make me richer.
There is the truth for you @thetruth. Keep on fighting to make me richer. I appreciate it.
Now back to baseball.
Beep! Beep! Make way! Badass coming through!
*Arte is the Trump of baseball. There, fixed it.
Negative, the country is doing good and shows promise for the future. The angels, not so much. There, fixed it.
You must be a white man over 55. And an idiot.
Soo racism against white people promoted by Dems is OK right?
6. culture!
6 EASILY GOOGLED FACTS
1. White people are officially projected to become minorities thanks to Democrat laws.
2. People of color are 90% of the world’s population & have 100+ countries where they’re the majority. They don’t promote diversity as they see it as majority replacement.
3. All races were once enslaved by other races, including White people by Asians & Muslims. No White person in America today owned a slave & no Black person in America today has been one.
4. Native Americans had no actual countries, but had slavery, genocide & even cannibalism.
5. Most media companies are owned by 50+ year old Liberal billionaires who profit from you voting Democrat.
6. Communists killed 100 million people in concentration camps.
You don’t know what racism is. Take a freshman college class someday.
The Germans weren’t Communists dippy. They were right wing fascists just like you.
thetruth… FOXNews blather does not fit on this thread.
TLDR
Take a college class with a MAGA hat on. You’ll find out what bigotry is about.
please stop, liberals can’t handle facts.
The 1% is doing well. Glad I am in it. The peons, that is you, are not. More people have 2nd jobs than at any time since Bush crashed the economy in 2008. Full time job growth is non-existent. Real wages are stagnant. The only people that are doing well are those that don’t rely on a job for their income. Farmers are going bankrupt at a record pace. My partners and I have purchased more than 1 million acres of prime farmland in the past 2 years. its glorious for investors. Terrible for farmers. Manufacturing jobs are falling at a record pace. .Now we are taking away your social security and medicare to pay for my tax breaks. I love it. You will pay through the nose. I thank you for voting for Trump.
Angels are doing fantastic. We added 14 wins in 3 players, are getting Ohtani back, and we jettisoned 5-6 losses from the pitching staff. We are close to contending for a WC after a 72 win last season.
Pederson and Stripling would have been nice additions, but they are not the end all be all. A 6th starter and a platoon RF.
Bush didn’t crash the economy, Clinton crashed the economy. How do people not know this?
It blows my mind that people still don’t understand what happened.
Bush did. I thank him. He passed the deregulation that allowed the derivatives that crashed the economy. Because of him, my partners and I were able to purchase more than 300 properties at bargain basement prices. Now because of Trump we are buying farms at pennies on the dollar. The GOP is good for people like me. PLEASE keep voting for them and paying my taxes for me. I appreciate it more than you know. .
And that was caused by Clinton.
The deregulation that allowed derivatives all happened under Bush. If you don;t know what they are, go learn.
Nope Trump is a great President slandered by Liberals who want to push their racist white guilt agenda.
Why dont you and the rest of your circle jerking boomers go back to facebook to spew your politics and leave this board for baseball.
Must be why every living ex-President hates Trump.
Hahaha love it
i love Trump and his cabal of criminals in the Senate. They are stealing your money and giving it to me and you don’t even realize it. It’s wonderful.
Koamalu
Either you are a sick person or you are a socialist playing the game “What would a capitalist say?”
Either way, you are a sick person.
I am a very wealthy man who got that way because lots and lots of very stupid people voted against their own self interest for the past 2 decades.
I am also very healthy. Especially for a man my age and I am about to turn 67.. Probably even for a man your age. Still run 3 miles a day ahd teach camps for high school age pitchers.
That you don’t LIKE the truth I just laid on you, doesn’t make it not the truth. There is never anything sick about the truth.
If you don’t want that to be the truth anymore, change the way you vote. I will be ok either way now that we have had nearly 20 years of the way things have been.
Scratching my head as to why someone feels the need to brag about how much of a baller they allegedly are to a bunch of people they don’t know on a baseball forum. We get it outinleftfield.
You mean he’s spitting image of that moron Trump!!! Fuck Trump!!!
Lol wow, what an educated comment
Yes Dr_Doom14, but typical.
que?
Trump is your dad
Arte has integrity, few politicians do.
The Angels are better off without Pederson. Stripling would have helped the Angels, but he’s still a back of the rotation starter who has never thrown more than a 122 innings and he would have been the oldest starter in the Angels’ rotation. He is far from a make or break player.
Why am I not surprised. Arte is the Nancy Pelosi of baseball: drunk 94.7% of the time, empowered, arrogant, rich and inept at their job.
Well, The Angels were a much better team with Joc and Stripling. Not so much anymore.
3rd place.
Arte is the poop in our cereal. The Angels will never sniff a WS title with this clown running the show.
Careful, Adolf Orange was clearly on drugs during the SOTU. Try dialating your pupils like that with multiple lights shining directly in them.
politicalflare.com/2019/08/trumps-pupils-are-often…
why do you Liberal’s want to inject your politics into everything ?
Look who he’s responding to. Typical trumptard I see, with the whole “screw reading” thing. Jesus man, it’s one message prior, ha.
They’re sad sad little pumpkins, that Maddow dude lied to them
Cry me a river. Waaaaaa someone made a negative reference towards Pelosii, waaaaaaaaaa!!
Stop acting hard online because you’re a weak loser in real life. Trump hurt your feelings?
6. culture!
6 EASILY GOOGLED FACTS
1. White people are officially projected to become minorities thanks to Democrat laws.
2. People of color are 90% of the world’s population & have 100+ countries where they’re the majority. They don’t promote diversity as they see it as majority replacement.
3. All races were once enslaved by other races, including White people by Asians & Muslims. No White person in America today owned a slave & no Black person in America today has been one.
4. Native Americans had no actual countries, but had slavery, genocide & even cannibalism.
5. Most media companies are owned by 50+ year old Liberal billionaires who profit from you voting Democrat.
6. Communists killed 100 million people in concentration camps.
Facts
Holy baseball you all!!!! How about leaving the politics off this site? As baseball fans, we here all have AT LEAST ONE THING IN COMMON- a love of our game. Can’t we leave it at that and leave the vitriol and political nastiness to everywhere else? Come on!!!!
I really love stupid people like you. Keep it up. I love that you are willingly giving me your money. It’s so cool.
Cool story, bro
Go take a bong hit and fantasize about Bernie Sanders while eating hot pockets in you moms basement
Did your grandson write this comment for you
It’s funny watching handicap kids fight.
Anyone who denies this has never tried it. It’s pretty obvious what he’s on.
cyyoung24,
What’re you on?
Surely not reality.
Takes one to know one. He is definitely on what I’m on.
Nervous Nancy was shaking and talking to herself during the SOTU. Of course that’s normal behavior for her.
6. culture!
6 EASILY GOOGLED FACTS
1. White people are officially projected to become minorities thanks to Democrat laws.
2. People of color are 90% of the world’s population & have 100+ countries where they’re the majority. They don’t promote diversity as they see it as majority replacement.
3. All races were once enslaved by other races, including White people by Asians & Muslims. No White person in America today owned a slave & no Black person in America today has been one.
4. Native Americans had no actual countries, but had slavery, genocide & even cannibalism.
5. Most media companies are owned by 50+ year old Liberal billionaires who profit from you voting Democrat.
6. Communists killed 100 million people in concentration camps.
These people are Russian bots! Nobody respond to these clowns!
Please stop.. I don’t think people are coming to MLBTR to hear your political tirades. Give it a rest or take it to Breitbart.
Maybe if more people clicked on the Flag button for these posts the moderators (assuming they still exist here) would delete these crud blooms.
Makes me chuckle LAD bench/bullpen/AAA depth are rotation and Starters with other teams
it makes me burst out laughing which bellows into a sorrowful cry
It is funny that all that depth that could be starters on other teams hasnt won them a world series. You can stockpile as much talent as you want and it still doesnt gaurantee you a title. Not sure why the Dodgers depth possibly being starters on other teams is funny. A weird comment.
They win one in 17 if the Astros are cheating scumbags though.
They win one in 2017 if they win the games at home. Stop whining.
Pretty sure if Yanks advanced, NYY wins the series. Yanks got hot in the playoffs.
Pretty sure if the Yankees don’t get blown out 7-1 and 4-0 in games 6-7 then they win. The Astros PITCHING stopped the Yankees.
Also 100% sure the Yankees were also cheating in 2017 since Beltran brought the system to the Astros from the Yankees. Stop the whining.
Not whining. Beltran got traded to the stros after the trash can plan and the system of stealing signs were already in place. As you pointed out, yanks got blown out. Who’s the say the stros didn’t see the pitches coming their way.
Love these guys trying to talk smack knowing damn well both the teams to beat them in the World Series were cheating. Lmfao good point buddy
Red Sox spanked the Dodgers at Dodger Stadium. They were just better. Stop whining.
Come on guys, stick to baseball.
The Dodgers have to move Joc now for club house culture reasons. After ditching someone, trust can’t ever be revived.
Joc is Bryce Harper light so it shouldn’t be too hard to find someone willing to give up a stud or two for his services. He feels like a fit on the Indians. Maybe send Carrasco back.
lol
Indians are supposed to send an established starting pitcher under a reasonable long-term contract for a one=year rental of a platoon player?
Why would Cleveland trade a pitcher that they control for 4 years for a rental platoon outfielder? Besides Carrasco is a major part in the Cleveland locker room.
Kluber was a major part of their locker room. So was EE. So was Kenny Lofton.
The Indians are aiming to win a wild card spot in a historically weak central while operating on a shoe string budget. Major capital shares left their ownership group so they have to cut salary more. They are super confident they can turn decent pitching prospects into aces. Carassco is expendable.
Joc is the most underrated player in baseball today. Last year had a better OPS than big names like Harper, Betts, and Bryant.
The Indians would send Carassco out for Joc and a good pitching prospect.
Cleveland is not trading four years of a solid, affordable starting pitcher for one year of a platoon outfielder. No smart team would ever do that and Cleveland’s front office is very smart.
They also DO NOT need to cut any more salary.
Awwe jeez I don’t know guys maybe because Cookie is 33 years old and is owed 47 million bucks. And he just defeated….. I don’t need to say what.
The RS just determined Price’s next 3 years were worth 48 million bucks. There isn’t a whole lot of surplus value on Carrasco. The Dodgers would have to chuck in a couple prospects but they wouldn’t be huge prospects.
And as far as CLE cutting salary, well, they can never cut enough.
Wtf. Turner went to twitter to stand up for Joc. Lmfao You people making up storylines are hilarious
Pederson is a platoon OF who is a FA at the end of the season. The Dodgers were willing to send him and Stripling plus a prospect for Rengifo, a guy who will be in AAA this season and two low level prospects.
The Dodgers are not getting much if anything back for Pederson.
Angels didn’t need 1 year of Joc in a crowded outfield mix. Adell/Goodwin in right with Marsh on the way. Stripling would have been a nice addition but we already have plenty of durability issues with the starting rotation.
Joc and Stripling put the Angels in contention for a WC spot and if everyone overachieves, possibly the division which Houston losing cole and being managed by Dusty Baker.
Your new manager will see to it that Pujols mans center field and Trout will see time at short. Ohtani will be left in game after throwing 120 pitches and end up disabled. Joe will blame this on bullpens failures. Angels will be lucky to finish with 81 wins.
Stripling would have been nice… but he’s never thrown over 122 innings and he would have been the oldest starting pitcher on their team. Hardly a difference maker.
The Angels did not need or want Pederson.
You’re right Mac. If they wanted Joc, they would have just picked up the option on Calhoun or tried to re-sign him. Calhoun and Joc are about the same. The only reason the Angels were interested was because of Stripling.
You’re buying into the hype. Joc is better and more proven than Goodwin, Adell and Marsh put together
@ Dr_Doom
You know as much about MLB as you do the state of America today.
but Samuel, he may know more about the Justice League than both of us combined.
Dr. Doom is Marvel, Justice League is DC.
I’m not buying into any hype. He’s for real. As real as a lot of other youngsters. Jimenez, Acuna, Judge, Alonzo….. Guess what, THEY ALL STARTED AS PROSPECTS!!!!!!! The Angels outfield and offense will be fine. Their pitching is better than people think too.
It’s clear you haven’t seen him try to hit a lefthander.
Pederson? Yeah, he can’t hit LHP to save his life.
If Adel is not better than a platoon RF, then scouts and all of baseball are clueless.
He swings big and misses big Adell and Marsh will be better per average hitters.
Are you sure it was Arty’s fault? Or maybe because this damn trade took so many days, another team came in with a better deal… Bet he goes to the Cardinals.. Do you know what, we don’t want the Dodgers trash anyway… They played us, but that’s fine we can just sign Joc next year if we really want him, They both probably would’ve sucked anyway.
4th place finish in the West!
Ok
Send Joc to ATL!!
and play him where?
RF with Acuna in CF and Inciarte to the bench. Seriously though, Joc and Stripling would seriously set ATL up in a big way.
Any guesses on what happens to Pederson now? He’s effectively out of a job in LA after the Betts trade, and the Dodgers lose all leverage now. They can’t keep him and they can’t get fair value for him, so where does that leave both player and team?
Oakland? Cinci? Braves? White Sox?
Yeah the WS need a lefty platoon with the left handed Mazara.
The Rangers could use him.
Rangers don’t need another lefty.
He’d be a great fit in Oakland.
I see him in Texas or Oakland.
Looking at the Dodgers depth/excess now, would it be a surprise to see them try to make another run at Lindor?
Could you imagine
No. Indians are not trading Lindor for the unusable pieces the Dodgers have left, dream on!
Not really talking about “unusable” pieces. Could literally do a 5 or 6 for 1 deal with a combination of win-now and prospect pieces that give Cleveland a better chance to win this year. Not saying it will be Lindor, but they are going to have to do something with their roster. There is such a thing as “depth” and then there is “too many good players for too few spots.” They have the pieces to do something big. Maybe Lindor, maybe Bryant, maybe someone that no one is currently thinking about? But something else is coming, has to.
lol the Giants would probably trade Gonsolin in a package for Lindor in a heartbeat. Seager or Lux would also have to go to Cleveland to make room in the crowded IF.
AllRiseForTheJudge! Gonsolin plays for the Dodgers not the Giants ! Dodgers are not trading Lux !
No it wouldnt at all- It would have to be a 3 team deal with Seager to Cincy though to start-
Think if they could only send out Ruiz and Gonsolin and have cincy cover the rest they would be up to that
Indians have stood strong all offseason with their ask of Gavin Lux as part of a Lindor deal. I don’t see that changing as spring training approaches.
Not enough. Any trade for Lindor starts with Lux.
Lindor >>> Seager so a definite upgrade. The Dodgers send Lux and several other top prospects to the Indians for Lindor?
I can see that happening if the Dodgers can figure out someone to take Pederson, Stripling and another contract to offset the cost of Lindor. Too bad the Angels decided to not trade for those two.
The Indians would not take lame duck contracts like Pederson, so that is out.
It could happen.
Seager: .294/.362/.491/.853
Lindor: .288/.347/.493/.840
Maybe not so definite after all. Maybe a downgrade, actually. So let’s sell the farm for that. Good plan.
You really think that defense doesn’t matter? OK. At least we know you are not very smart. We can ignore you completely now.
17.8 WAR vs 28.6 WAR. Lindor every day and twice on Sunday.
What a sweetheart. I’m sure you’re great fun at parties.
Yes, defense matters, but defensive metrics are a mess and WAR is basically BS. I’ve been saying for awhile that Lindor makes sense if Seager moves to 3B and Turner to 1B. Otherwise it’s more of a sideways than up move and not worth giving up the farm.
No one ever called me sweetheart before. When you are caught being a hepa you try to say the stats are wrong.
When all the stats agree, they are correct. All the defensive metrics and Statcast agree. The eye test agrees. Lindor is better and not by just a little bit. Stop being so hūpō and just admit that Lindor is better.
Send Pages to the Tigers for Boyd
Will the Angels ever be relevant again?
Will the Dodgers win a World Series this century? The Angels have.
But no one cares about the Angels.
No one cares about the Angels. Do you enjoy that little burble you live in?
Do you enjoy living in the 909? Hemet misses you!
Is 909 an Orange Country area Code?
Arte must be a genius. He draws 3 million every year and signed a 3 billion dollar tv contract for a team that no one cares about.
He’s a bay area kid. Trade him to the Giants. We have enough lefties, he shouldn’t be a problem.
The Giants don’t have anyone the Dodgers want.
Jon Miller?
I hope they keep Joc. I hated that they were trading him in the first place.
I agree, then reopen negotiations with Puig and sign him
dodgerfan not going to happen! Dodgers don’t need Puig! Have to many outfielders as it is! Plus Puig is hothead and immature! Love! the outfield of platoon in left field! Bellinger in Center and Betts in Right
Why would the Giants give up prospects for a one-year rental in a year they’re not likely to contend?
Giants are not bailing Dodgers out of Pederson’s contract.
This was kinda a lopsided deal in the angels favor… not sure why he would end it at all. Team got instantly better and barely gave up anything … idk … just me maybe
There were other players from the Angels going to LA, they just were never reported.
It was all about the luxury tax, nothing else.
Rengifo plus 2 prospects and luxury tax relief. So your wrong.
Because the Dodgers wanted to get under the Threshold. The Angels didn’t want Pederson, they wanted Stripling.
Why would we not want a guy that is better than Goodwin?
To the Yankees for Gardner and Frazier
Yes Dodgers need to subtract one from a crowded outfielder and add 2 more. That’s idiotic. I rather see a package of Judge and prospects for Bellinger. Bellinger plays RF and IB while Stanton plays his natural position.
Joc,Stripling, Ruiz, Gonsolin for Mike Cleavinger n top 10 prospect
Dodgers and Indians would make some sense.. Dodgers get Mike Clevinger.. Indians acquire position players Joc Pederson as a one year rental and Keibert Ruiz covers both the current and future needs of for position players. The deal must include either both of Tony Gonsolin & Josiah Gray or Dustin May..
Clevinger is a beast.. without this 3/4 player return.. hard pass..
Walker21 – Not a chance of that happening. There is no chance of getting 3 years of Clevinger without Lux or May as part of a deal. Cleveland’s front office is very sharp. They will not make a quality for quantity trade.
Indians counter with Gavin Lux, Will Smith, and Dustin May, for Jake Bauers, Sandy Leon, and the Dodgers choice of any prospect in their farm system not ranked in their top 30.
Sure Gavin lux will Smith Dustin May for Clevinger Lindor and Beiber
Walker21 – you are drunk. Clevinger, Lindor, and Bieber are proven stars. What has Lux, May and Smith done? Talk about placing an unreasonable value on prospects. .
It was an obvious joke since Samuel wants to get our top 2 prospects plus young Catcher for bottom of 40 man roster players. Maybe I should use sarcasm font next time.
After your first bad proposal it was hard to see the sarcasm.
Dodgers send Joc Stripling and prospect for Whit Merrifield. Whit is signed for 3 more years cheap. Dodgers could get a WS title. kC would have to have a high prospect since Joc is a free agent next year. Which team balks? If anyone it would be KC
Would love to have whit on our team but where’s he gonna play? Unless we were able to unload pollack or trade lux, both of which aren’t happening, there’s no where to put Whit.
your top 10 prospect is going in the wrong direction
Possible ATL outfield Ozuna, Acuna, Pederson has a nice ring to it, pun intended!
I’d be more excited about getting Stripling. He’d be ideal as a 5th starter.
it’s a dream, lol, but let’s get ’em both!
The Angels owner is an idiot. Russ & Joc greatly improve the team, so you had to wait a few more days to complete the deal. As long as you’re getting and giving the same players, what’s the reason to squash the deal ?
You are assuming the Angels are the ones killing the deal, I believe it is LA.
Arte squashed it after a deadline he put in place,because he didn’t want his players families in Limbo.
A platoon outfielder does not make the Angels better. A back of the rotation starter would have helped.
Joc to the Yankees for Gardner and Frazier
Dodgers would have 0 interest in this nonsense. You think there’s playing time for Gardner or Frazier in LA? If you do, you’d be the only one who thought that!
Dodgers have too many outfielders now, one of the reasons they are/were looking to deal Joc. So you propose they take back a 36 year old OF and a 25 or 26 year old OF with shoddy defense? Makes perfect sense!
Moreno is an idiot. He should keep to Freeway signs and leave the baseball decisions to the professionals.
But he traded for Dylan Bundy!!
0-4 against the angels!
Angels were clearly trying to take advantage of LA. I think los angeles dodgers are just brilliant. They got much more than they thought they would in the Boston Minnesota deals. Quit while you’re ahead plus Pederson hits the crap out of right-handers and can be used quite a bit! I think winning his arb hearing makes retaining him much more feasible and if the right offer comes their way, a trade may still happen. I think there would be more value keeping him! When he gets hot he becomes unstoppable! They know what they have.
They also gave up much more than they thought they would to get Betts and Price.
Pederson has no place to play. Pollock will play if healthy. Betts will play. Bellinger will play. Kiki and Taylor will also be consigned to the OF most of the time. So where does Pederson play?
No, the Dodgers will still have to trade Pederson and now they have no leverage. They will get less than Rengifo for him.
I wonder if Pederson’s brother is very disappointed. I remember he was a huge Albert Pujols fan.
Who cares about his brother, totally irrelevant
True, I wouldn’t want to interrupt the endless, over the top vitriol and speculation upon speculation..
Seven of Nine, is that you?
Pujols is still a huge contributor in terms of both time and money to the Champ Pederson Foundation and he contributes time and money to other organizations that support Down’s Syndrome. His daughter has Down’s Syndrome and the Pujols Family Foundation does so much for Down’s Syndrome.
This is irritating.
I’m so surprised that nobody mentioned what is really going on! arte saw bloom put the kibosh on a deal, and possibly upgrade his haul in doing so. arte has notes written all over the chalkboard in his office about how this went down, now he’s gonna try it. he’s trying to become a better negotiator by doing exactly as others do.
Hello, Andrew. It’s Arte Moreno. (spits) Sorry, I had a hair on my tongue. But, of course, you should know; you put it there. I know what you said about me, Friedman. I know you bad-mouthed me to the execs at Boston; put the kibosh on my deal. Now I’m gonna put the kibosh on you. You know I’ve kiboshed before, and I will kibosh again.
Laughed so hard I had to change my diaper!
*Hank Hill voice* Dangot Red Sox!
I’m glad it fell through, 5 years of regnifo is too much for an expensive platoon rental of and an oft injured swimgman reliever. Angels need a real pitcher. I say go after Jon Gray of the rockies.
Jon Gray, who was on the IL five times last year? Stripling would be a 4 or even a 3 on many teams, and I don’t recall him having anywhere near enough IL stints to be called “oft-injured.” He’s a swingman for the Dodgers because he’s one of 8 or 9 capable starters they have.
Maybe Gray needs to get out of the Denver air, but Stripling is a very solid starter buried on the depth chart on a very deep team.
Stripling has never made more than 21 starts for a reason. He doesn’t have the ability to stay healthy. 10 trips to the DL/IL in 4 years is oft injured. He would have slotted in as the swingman for the Angels too.
The Angels will go to spring training with the mediocre staff they currently have. Watch.
Ohtani, Nothing personal, but I care a lot more about how many innings this staff will throw than someone’s opinion of the staff.
If you tell me the Angels projected first six starters will throw more innings than the A’s (for example) projected fix six starters, then I predict the Angels will win more games than the A’s.
For the Angels, as for many teams, their staff is dependent on health. The talent is there.
Mediocre means average. I will take that after being the worst starting staff in baseball last season. With one of the best offenses in baseball we will win many more games with a mediocre staff than we did with an absolutely horrible staff last season.
Personally I think the rotation will be above average and the stats back it up. Ohtani will put up Ace numbers in his 20-25 starts. Teheran is a solid number 2 with an ERA under 4 every year. Canning was better than league average in his rookie season and should improve. IF, and I know it’s a big if, Heaney is healthy he is above average. Bundy is an innings eater in the #5 hole and should improve some just from moving from the AL East to the AL West. Sandoval is the #6 and should improve off a promising rookie season.
Having Maddon and Callaway coaching this staff will be a huge upgrade for us.
All in all I am happy with where our pitching staff is. Would I have liked Cole at the top of it? Yes, but since Arte ponied up an 8 year offer with an AAV of $36 million I am not too upset that we didn’t get him.
As it is we have about $20 million to spend and there is still the whole season ahead of us. Nothing saying we can’t go after a starter if we are well above .500 come the ASB.
JBJ to the Angels now?
Gaylos
&*%@ you!
****IF**** it’s true that arte pulled the deal, angel fans should be furious. That was great value and would’ve helped us tremendously, so if arte let his meaningless pride get in the way of that… just a damn shame man. Disgusting
you don’t know the reason. hold your judgement!
Arte is the Jerry Jones of MLB … he needs to keep his cards closer to his chest and shut his mouth about player acquisitions. This scenario reminds me of the Adrian Beltre fiasco. Hope the Angels don’t wind up with another Vernon Wells knee jerk reaction all over again again. And this deal wasn’t about Pederson …. it was about Stripling.
Arte does keep it close to the chest! He was probably pissed off the news of the Joc trade got out before being finalized. When is the last time you knew of an Angels move before it was finalized? Clearly Boston and the Dodgers have never been able to keep “source” reports under wraps for ANY of their dealings. That’s not Arte’s way. I feel sorry for Joc. Not only does he know know the Dodgers were unloading him, but also had to listen to the Dodgers play to the fact he’s strictly a platoon player and only deserved 7mil.
Only the LAD had info about both the Joc/Strip trade & the Betts trade; that’s how you KNOW the LAD leaked.
In other news, there’s a story on palindromes at 12:21.
where are the angel haters for backing out of the deal? or dodgers? as much hate as people gave the Sox for doing due diligence on their deal, now a team has totally backed out of a previously agreed upon deal, where are the haters?
there are plenty, cheaters fan!
can you say the word “contingent”? The deal was contingent on things that didn’t happen.
Pederson + Stripling to New York would be a good move for Cashman. Pederson could immediately take over left field so that Stanton spends most of his time at DH, and Stripling becomes the 5th starter. I doubt this happens due to Yankee payroll, but its a thought
And what are the Yankees trading away?
Dodger are equal or better at every position than the Yankees except maybe bullpen. If you want to give up Ottavino and Chad Green, it could possibly work.
the most likely reason why this proposed trade was rejected is that the dodgers wanted to get more prospect(s) from the angels.
Dodgers woke up and realized they were being screwed.
dodgers now have an unhappy player without a position to play.
There should be a grievance filed against the RS. Yes, we have a deal, no we don’t. Players/families prepare for change, oh no change… Jeez. RS idiots.
Ah no the media reported a deal there was never a deal any players that listen to anything until they are contacted by their team telling them they have e been traded that’s on them. Good job Bloom sticking to your guns and not listening to to guys like david722 that are clueless.
They had the medical reports and still went through with the original trade you ass, then they back tracked. Get some f’n thinking skills. Jeez. Get an informed opinion for once.
Is this supposed to be satire?
Teams don’t get medical reports until AFTER a trade is initiated. So Red Sox had not seen any medical reports. Once they saw the medicals they said no way.
What an asinine comment. They did NOT have his medicals (and aren’t allowed to even see his medicals under HIPPA laws) until they deal is agreed to in principle. If Betts wasn’t involved in this deal, no one would have even known about this in the first place, but since reporters were all over this they jumped the gun before medical Information was reviewed. Trades get agreed too and cancelled / revised in every major sport over medical concerns. You hear it all the time in the NFL where a player fails his physical and trade is revoked. Boston did nothing at all that would merit a grievance.
You guys are disgusting – Cheating, reneging pieces of trash-
Tell us more Dorothy about this great club of yours please
Does Arte always stick his nose into everything? He never lets his GM’s and front office people do their job! STOP MEDDLING…!
00!00
My guess is the change of heart is related to the Dodgers winning over Pederson in arbitration.
No
STL makes sense for many reasons. He is rather inexpensive LH power bat that we need. Probably wouldnt cost much to get him?
I don’t think LA wants to trade Joc to a potential NL playoff team. If he’s dealt anywhere, it’s most likely to an AL team or a rebuilding NL team who does not pose a playoff threat but is willing to give up good value and negotiate an extension with Joc as part of the deal.
Angels, find a way to make this deal work. Rengifo solves 2 things, more flexibility and Adell transition, and pitching.
So does he tell the Dodgers to stick it and tell his agent to trade him
Trade Joc, Ross and a mid-level prospect to Seattle for Kyle Seager. Platoon him and Turner to maximize both (injury history and eighty/lefty splits). Bonus for Corey as well.
Dodgers are looking for salary relief. Seager makes more than both players combined and has a clause that if he’s traded his $16M? option automatically vests. Less than zero chance of this happening.
I believe in Friedman’s Magic. He could make it work- maybe Jedi mind trick them into taking Pollock instead
Gotta love the Jedi Mind trick rebuttal
Then the Tigers will trade them Zimmerman and eat his entire salary for one half year of Joc Pederson who they can flip at the trade deadline for a prospect. Makes sense to me!
To the Jays: Joc and Stripling
To the Dodgers: Kevan Smith (ss) and Anthony Alford (of)
This would put the Jays into contention for a wildcard spot in my opinion and give the Dodgers some financial relief they were trying to get with the Angels.
Tigers could use him and at 7m is cheap. They can afford it with Zimmerman coming off the books next year & they need a LH power hitting OF.
The dissolution of this deal makes no sense. And why did the Red Sox get blamed for this deal falling apart by some of the comments. I missed that point.
I blame Gremlins.
Damned gremlins. Not them again.
I think the deal fell apart because of the money they’re sending over with Maeda now, as well as Pederson losing arbitration. Remember that, as originally structured, the Dodgers would have barely gotten under the luxury tax. Now, Pederson and Stripling aren’t enough to get them under.
Pederson losing arbitration means the Dodgers are nowhere near the second tax bracket of the penalty. That means there is less of a need to trade him. Hence, they’re not doing this anymore.
You could very easily be right. If they can’t get under the Threshold, why make the deal. They could have come back to Moreno and asked for something else. That’s not Moreno’s style, when he makes an agreement, he makes an agreement.
Good points. While the Dodgers have no issue paying the CBT tax, especially as first year offenders, I believe Friedman was trying to get under the threshold again so they could make a serious run at Betts in 2021 and only have to pay first year tax amounts. After 2021, a lot of salary comes off their books so they could possibly reset again in 2022 with Betts locked up on a long term deal. While Friedman usually shies away from long term contracts, Betts is the type of player you go all in on, especially if he has an MVP type of season this year.
This makes no sense. You are trying to subtract by adding. Pederson losing his arbitration hearing lowers the Dodgers payroll from what it would have been had he won it, not the other way around, assuming he stays. More importantly, however much he’s being paid this year is zeroed out in the Dodgers payroll if he is traded, so in the end the arbitration number makes no difference whatsoever to the CBT calculation if he’s traded. The actual impact of him losing the hearing is it makes him more attractive in trade. The only scenario I can imagine for why this deal broke down is the Dodgers asked for more in return when Pederson became less expensive, and Moreno said no.
He is referring to the $10M the Dodgers sent the Twins in the Maeda deal. You are talking about Pederson. Two different things. The team that pays the cash considerations takes a cap hit., so the Dodgers take a $10M cap hit in the Maeda deal.
He also specifically referred to Pederson and his arbitration loss. We’ll see how this adds up in the end but the point is the payroll number for CBT purposes is additive. If they trade Pederson his impact on that number is zero, no matter how much he is being paid by another team. The only impact of Pederson losing the arbitration hearing is he becomes that much more marketable. My guess for the reason why the deal with the Angels fell through is Friedman tried to use the arbitration win to extract a better return for him from the Angels.
Back of the envelope calculation: Before these trades the Dodgers were approximately $35M under the CBT. Betts and Price add $44M, putting them $9M over. They reduced payroll by roughly $2M in the Maeda trade so that drops the overage to $7M, including Pederson of course. Trading Pederson alone gets them right on the nose, and trading Stripling drops them a hair under.
The Dodgers sent ten million to the Twins.
But if Stripling and Pederson put the Dodgers over the cap, they should trade them.
I know, but for CBT purposes I believe Maeda’s pay was projected at around $12M, so they netted a gain of around $2M by trading him. The purpose of trading Pederson and Stripling was to put them right on the bubble or a bit below.
According to this site the Dodgers are over by $13.4 million. This assumes Pedro Baez gets an estimated $3.3 million. If this is accurate, trading Pederson and Stripling does not get you under. Thought I read that they were willing to go over this year. If they do want to stay under they would need to trade Pollock. Maybe they try to trade Pollock and stay under and re-evaluate during the season if they need to go over to acquire in trade deadline.
spotrac.com/mlb/los-angeles-dodgers/payroll/
Sounds about right. If they deal Stripling and Pederson they are very close to the bubble. Kasten did say they were willing to pay the CBT this year, and I hope it’s true, but I’m not going to believe it until I see it. I don’t see Pollock going anywhere. Fans like to be down on him but that’s overplayed, and I see management sticking by that signing whether the fans like it or not.
If we are really trying to win it this year who’s going to be more productive in LF.? One year of mostly Pollock or one year platoon of Joc/CT3 or Kike? Joc’s OPS the last two seasons over 850 plate appearances against RHP is 0.920 and 0.893. Not a lot of corner OFs in MLB have that type of production. Pollock has averaged about 0.800 OPS over the last three seasons, in greater than 1,200 plate appearances. His OPS last three years are 0.795, 0.800 and 0.801. You know what you’re going to get, very average OPS production. If you believe that Betts is a one year rental like I do you keep Joc and you deal Pollock. The latter will be harder to deal but there are some teams still desperate for an OF. You’d have to package him with a prospect or two.
@BlueSkies Seems like You kind of get it now. The original posted that because the $10M sent the Twins that they would be unable to get below the luxury tax. The initial trade indicated that no money was being sent, so they Dodger would not be on the hook for any of it. They can trade Joc and Maeda and be below the $208M Even if you trade the $9M owed to both Joc and Maeda, they are still over. This is all the poster said and you said it doesnt make sense, but it made sense to most.
We do not know the complete details why the trade fell apart, but the Dodgers may have tried to include something else to get below the line. It really does not benefit the Dodgers to trade Joc and Stripling and still be over. It seems to me that the Dodgers would be better off with Joc in left field than Pollock and keep Stripling in case Price gets hurt again. We can forget this team already lost Ryu and Maeda. You have to be a little worried with Price, Urias, and Wood. They have May and Gonsolin, but they are still young and unproven at the major league level. If they can get below the line by adding someone else to the trade, I think they do it. If they can’t get below the line, I believe it defeats the purpose.
It’s very possible the Red Sox and the Twins gummed things up. These two teams are not known for their integrity. It wouldn’t surprise me at all.
An $8 million platoon OF is not much more marketable than a $10 million platoon OF. Neither are going to net the Dodgers much.
You can’t just say a platoon is not worth much just because he’s a platoon. He’s been a 0.900 OPS platoon against RHP. He’s also the right side of the platoon as a left-handed batter. Go find someone else like that with over 850 plate appearances the last 2 years. You won’t find many. That is super efficient. If you pair him with a productive RH bat platoon you can recreate a superstar player with two cheaper players. At this rate the Dodgers should just keep him. I’m sure that being a year out of free agency is depressing his value so just keep him.
No, that isn’t what the poster said, and as I pointed out, it may yet be that the Dodgers can come in under the CBT by moving those other two. It will be close either way. Which is what I said… so, I got it all along. Getting close matters because it’s a flat tax (for one) and (for another) they can make moves in Spring Training and until July that clear further payroll. It’s the end of the season when the tax is calculated, not now. The Dodgers will have to move, option, or release two players within the next few days, because their roster is a now at 42. Their options are driven by that reality.
I realize we don’t know why the deal fell apart, and we may never know for sure. I have my theory, and you are entitled to yours.
I’ll clarify what I meant:
In the original deals, there was no mention of cash being sent out to the Twins for Maeda. When the (obviously one sided) Joc trade was announced, it was referred to by the people reporting it as a salary dump, designed to get under the tax. When Striplin was revealed later, the math made more sense: as the deals would have left them barely under the CBT.
In the restructured deal with cash being sent out, it’s not the case, and I would speculate this is the reason the deal is off.
They would need to clear like 14m to get under now. Strip/Joc doesnt do that. Joc/Joe Kelly would, but Kelly and Joc are both good players and it’s hard to see the team dumping both for close to nothing. They could also try trading Pollock but good luck trying to find a taker. Actually the interesting route would be Turner as they have other 3B/1B options.
The part about Pederson’s arb case is to say that if he had won, they would be close to the second bracket of penalties. So there might still be a need to trade him if they were so concerned. He didnt win, so right now they’re pretty firmly in between over the first line but not the second, his salary doesn’t do enough to change that either way. Hence, there’s no value in salary dumping him. Apologies if this was unclear/muddied my first time posting.
In the end, Dodgers win all deals as they still have Pederson on their deep roster and also get that top pitching prospect Graterol (who the Red Sox were supposed to receive) along with Betts and Price. Angels are still better off without Pederson in my opinion as he is a platoon OF/DH at best and is FA after season.. Was he really going to be an upgrade for Angels over incumbent Kole Calhoun as both hit for power and low average. Pederson is also not good defensively.
The Dodgers don’t want Pederson. The problem with the Dodgers is they are over the threshold and that’s a place they don’t want to be.
I love you guys with your “at best”
There are 30 teams times 3 OF per- Please name 90 Of’ers who hit 35 hrs in 450 abs
Fully agreed. Joc’s OPS against RHP the last two years 0.920 and 0.893, that’s in 850 plate appearances. That’s a pretty big sample size. Two concerns here. They don’t want to dump Pollock because they feel like they’re selling low and spent so much money on him. Typical stock market reaction of selling your winners too quickly and keeping your losers too long. Also maybe overly fixated on not getting anything when a player walks. In this case I’m fine with that. If you’re not getting much value keep Joc’s production for the year. That’s going to be a potent lineup with Joc platooning at LF.
Depends how hard up they are for trying to get under the CBT this year
It would be damn tough as is right now and that accounts for no incoming players at deadline
Pollock imo is unmovable at this point with/out attaching major prospects-They wont go that route so hes here for the next 2 years minimium-
Im damn curious to know what the other prospects from ANA were and how it all fell apart-I have no prob dealing Joc off this year and even Strip for REnigfro (who I like) and the “other” prospects but there will be a better market for both if sold individually imo- Wheather theres enough time and budget money from other teams is another question
Angels have a right to be steamed right now, im sure we will learn a lot more or see further transactions by this time next week on this matter
Who cares where they are in the luxury tax on Feb 9? It means nothing. They have plenty of time to find a Joc for prospects trade
I suppose 97% of the world doesnt common, of the other possible 3%, I assume many would be right in here 🙂
Having another pleasant day in your world huh?
Cheers
Calhoun is gone.
Angels and Dodgers could still work out a deal. Angels could still use Pederson and Joc isn’t really a necessity on the Dodgers.
Pedersen, Stripling and Ruiz to the Tigers for Boyd
My two most hated teams in baseball just screwed the Angels. The only thing I hate more is Arte.
No Moore Arte!
Don’t worry Roger Lodge will spend 3 whole shows defending Arte Morono.
Big loss for the Honks in Strippling
Stripling is a big loss, not Pederson. Come May, the Angels are going to be better off with Adel in RF. I don’t care if he doesn’t hit the floor running. The PCL is no place to develop hitters. Stick him RF, bat him 9th and let him develop. Let him play every day.
However, Stripling would be the oldest pitcher on the Angels staff and he’s never pitched more than 122 innings. He’s not a difference maker. I’d love to have him, but still….
Ok, so how does it make sense that the Dodgers just got literally another OF and another pitcher but they also want to, for now, keep Pederson and Stripling? Like how much depth is too much? Anyways, why did the Angels just not revise the deal like the Red Sox and Twins did? Do they now not want Pederson? I think the original deal was fine but who knows. Will those 2 get moved eventually or are they here to stay? Not that it matters to me but just trying to understand what’s going on…
It makes a ton of sense. Joc’s OPS against RHP the last two seasons are 0.920 and 0.893. They don’t have anyone else than can do that at LF. Platoon him with CT3 or Kike. Dump Pollock. Eat some of his contract and package him with a lower tier prospect for a team that needs OF depth. If Joc wants to walk after this season so be it. If we’re legitimately interested in making a WS run this year you want Joc’s production against RHP.
I didn’t mean it as a dig against Pederson. I was just wondering why did the Dodgers add another OF if they didn’t get a chance to get rid of Pederson in the first place. I mean of course Joc is better than Fraley now but why get Fraley and keep Pederson anyways? That’s actually not the Dodgers fault, just what were the Angels thinking idk. Oh well, it doesn’t bother me, because I’m a Phillies fan first and an MLB fan second. But, @mlbdodgerfan2015, thanks for the intellectual discussion! This is what I want to see more of, but alas comment sections don’t provide that.
And honestly, I made the comment just thinking why add 2 players in positions that were already full, regardless of whether these new additions will have any immediate short term impact. Especially when they could have traded away 2 players and then have these new guys replace the guys who they traded away.
Nutting should bite the bullet and buy prospects for Pollock and his contract and let the Dodgers keep Joc to use as a platoon in LF. The Pirates could trade the Dodgers Keone Kela for Pollock, Kiebert Ruiz,, Mitchell White and Andy Pages. The Pirates can use Pollock in CF having Reynolds taking some of the time. Mitchell is near MLB ready and Ruiz becomes the Pirates new franchise catcher w/ Pages as another upgrade to the farm. The Dodgers could use Kela as a 7th-8th inning piece to set up Jansen and clear the OF while getting rid of Pollocks contract..
Should Dodgers also add Cody Bellinger in that deal? Lol
please, please go far, far away with your political jibber-jabber. I log in here to get away from commentary like yours and I’m a registered Repub.. What sort of a-holes are you people? This is baseball, birdbrains. The National Pastime, BASEBALL!!!!!!
Nuts and bolts nuts and bolts. We got screwed
There’s no reason for the Angels to trade for Pederson when they let Kole leave. Similar players but Kole isn’t helpless against lefties. Angels outfield is going to get crowded anyway. There not going to trade Adell and they probably aren’t trading Walsh as Upton nears the end of his contract.
No offense to Joc Pederson, but the big loss for the Angels on this was not getting Ross Stripling. He’s not an ace by any means and comes with his share of health issues, but the Angels are in pretty desperate need of arms. If you think the limited innings of Ohtani along with Heaney, Bundy, Teheran and whoever else fills out their rotation is going to get Mike Trout to the playoffs feel free to pass that optimism my way.
After his TJ many years ago Stripling has had no serious health issues and he’s pitched well enough to make the All Star team. He’d be in the rotation full time on most other teams.
Moreno is a total ass. He just effed a deal that would have netted us a starting pitcher and a very talented young outfielder. Even without Pederson that is far more than Rengifo will ever bring.
Definitely disheartening news for Angel fans. Pederson would have been a a huge gain. He is a very good hitter and flashes streaks of greatness at times. I can’t wait to see the #’s he puts up the next 5 years. Rengifo gone wouldn’t have even been felt/noticed. Does everyone forget that Tommy LaStella was a break out All Star before his injury and Fletcher was just plain good! Can they not both handle 2nd base efficiently? Would anyone want Goodwin in right over Joc? How confident is everyone in Upton’s big comeback this year? Is Adel really on the verge of coming up? Man oh man…We could have used Joc big time..He can play 1st. We could have used Stripling. We could have used the slugger of a rookie they were going to send…All for RENGIFO….I’ve never been so deflated by a trade that never was..
there were supposed to be a couple of other prospects going to the Dodgers. My guess is that the quality of the other prospects were contingent on Joc’s salary arbitration results, and since he lost, and also because the Dodgers had to add extra prospects on the Red Sox deal, I’m gonna guess they tried to get more than the Angels wanted to give, specially after patiently waiting for so long.
I doubt they trade him in the NL. Phillies could use him and split time in CF and LF with McClutch. They would need to shed a few $$ though.
Rangers should trade for Pollock, 16-20MM and Strippling for Burke and Hearns or Hernandez.
Pollock in CF for 100 games and Gallo or Santana covering the other 62.
Strippling can be the long man in the bullpen or swing man when we need a starter.
Pollock, 15 million, and Stripling for Hearns, Hernandez, and Kiner-Falefa should do it if the Dodgers are just in for a salary dump.
Angels need pitching not more bats
Tbh I really want they Phillies to sign Pederson to have him play LF for them sorta like a 5/110 deal and trade McCutchen back to the Pirates for nothing
CBS reported at the same time the Deal to the Angles went through
I wonder what it would cost the Rangers to acquire Joc? They are in need of a CF who can put the ball in play. He is relatively young and seems healthy enough. He is another left hand hitter – something the Rangers have in abundance now.
It will cost the Rangers very little to obtain Pederson, the Dodgers don’t want him, but no one would put him in CF.
The Angels were prepared to return a top prospect for Pederson, and that was before he lost his arbitration hearing. The excess value in his contract is now greater than it was when the Dodgers and Angels struck the original deal. He’ll be traded and the Dodgers will get value back.
The Angels would have taken the contract of Pederson, but they didn’t want him. They wanted Stripland.
The Angels are better off with Adell playing RF every day. That likely happens at the end of April or early May.